Thanks. Certainly not a dealbreaker, but I was wondering. I've had to replace 3 "regular" (metal, telescoping) antennas on the outgoing car and would prefer not to have to worry about that again.
I am not too sure there is a correlation between US/Canadian assembly and quality problems. The Odyssey is pretty good quality wise and most of them were built in the same plant as the Pilots. I anticipate the Pilots will have lees and less complaints throughout this first build year. In fact, I think they have hashed out many so far. If they are anything like the previous Hondas or Toyotas, once there is fix, it is fixed.
I agree. I took delivery end of December and don't have many of the issues heard in this forum. My only two issues: - vibration in steering wheel at highway speeds of 70 + mph. - dings on the B-Pillar from seat belt retraction
>>what vehicle's use anything but the fake stuff these days? Only vehicle I know of that stil uses real wood is Jaguar. Was in a Mercedes the other day and it too had fake wood.<<
Actually, many makers are using Real Wood Veneers on trim pieces. In fact, MOST in the price range of the MDX either use the real thing or none at all- the only two choices that make sense IMO. As someone pointed out, there are varying degrees of the fake stuff. Some fake one's actually do look good. Honda uses a nice looking example in the new Accord.
To answer your question on who uses the Real thing: Several,not just Jaguar.. your Mercedes Example must have been in the ML but even that is real. The real ones I know of are.. Saab, BMW, Infinity (upgraded to the real thing in '01), some of the newer Caddys and Lincolns, Land Rover's, Range Rovers, Lexus and of course RR and Bently. My point is in the mid $30K range and up, using cheap or cheap looking materials should not be acceptable. The only higher price makes/ models using poor looking fake stuff these days are Acura, Caddy, Lincoln and Volvo that I've seen recently.
The Splintering in a Crash is NOT an issue. This is regulated of course, it's not used on the Wood Steering Wheels for this reason. What most people don't realize is that the actual Wood Veneer used is Paper Thin, Non-Splintering and bonded to a plastic piece for it's shape, it's use is for a Quality appearance more than anything.
Any chance of some styling updates on the 2004 Pilot?
I could not have been more disappointed with the incredibly bland styling of the 2003 Pilot. It's fine from the grille to the A pillar, but from there back, the stylists must have gone on vacation and told their assistants to just copy an old civic wagon.
I liked the look of the new Chevy Trailblazer, but after an overnight test drive, I had way too many complaints (front seats offer ZERO lateral support, wind noise, no driver right arm-rest, small fuel tank, quirky controls, downshifts required to climb modest hills). On top of that you have the usual concern on GM reliability.
The Pilot is everything that I am looking for, just not in a package that looks like a civic wagon on steroids.
Volvo, paragon of safety, switched from real to synth wood several years ago. Stated reason is that real wood more likely to cause injury in crash. My sense is that if youre in a crash bad enough to splinter the wood dash, you've got bigger problems...
Actually both Drew and Steve are correct, though for different reasons than stated.
As Drew mentioned, "real wood" is a paper-thin veneer. It is bonded to a plastic backing that is shaped for the complex curves of most dashboards. Tooling a real chunk of wood for use in an automobile would be hugely expensive and wasteful.
These veneer panels are then "plasticized". Not specifically for safety reasons, but because it needs to be protected from moisture. The interior of a car can get very hot. Mix that with the humidity in the air, and you get warped or puckered wood (yes, even a bonded veneer). So they slather on the glossy finish to seal it from the elements and protect it. Thwack a real wood panel with your fingernail and it may feel fake for this reason.
It's bascially the same with any quality furniture you might buy. Though, most home furnishings will never see the kind of heat extremes that a car's interior will provide. So the finish is much thinner.
There are MANY fine furniture makers that use NOTHING but SOLID oak, cherry, maple, mahogany, teak and other fine woods. To say otherwise is simply not truthful.
Many of these pieces are finished with NOTHING other than good quality natural WAX after being finely sanded, hand stained, and hand rubbed to an appropriate sheen. There is no reason to "plasticize" furniture, and makers of high end home furnishing DO NOT do so!
These SOLID wood pieces are crafted BETTER than antiques could ever hope to be made, because of the high level of precision that is possible with modern techniques {however the quality of LUMBER was better in past eras, as trees that grew to suitable size were more common).
The ENVIRONMENT that fine furniture faces is quite benign compared to that seen in an automotive interior. The temperature in homes and offices will not vary by more than a few degrees, humidity is controlled and motion is a non-issue.
Of course the dimensions of the structural surfaces of fine furniture are far to large for automotive interior trim. Rarely are board used that finish out to less than a true half-inch.
Of course this is simply NOT POSSIBLE for automotive interior trim for reasons already cited, and I do agree that CHEAP looking PLOOD is a disgrace. However there is about as much in common with PLOOD and high quality furniture as there is between "Ol' Roy Dog Food" and Kobe Beef...
>>Volvo, paragon of safety, switched from real to synth wood several years ago. Stated reason is that real wood more likely to cause injury in crash<<
They might tell you that at the Dealer but that reasoning it Bogus. Trust me.. the way they use these veneers.. splintering is NOT an issue. We have one of the worldls largest suppliers of these wood veneers where I live. They supply virtually all the worlds Auto manufacturers for their wood needs.. That's how I've gotten a bit of an education on this.
>>There are MANY fine furniture makers that use NOTHING but SOLID oak, cherry, maple, mahogany, teak and other fine woods. To say otherwise is simply not truthful.<<
I don't believe anyone has made that kind of statement here. Of course Fine Furniture makers use Solid Woods. That's not the way to do it for Automotive use though. The veneer process that your responding to is used to provide Long life in Automotive Applications.
Again.. the bottom line is that the use of Authentic Wood Veneers is to provide a Quality Rich Appearance for a Class of Vehicle where we expect it. It's that simple. Volvo and Acura are using plastic to save money... It's that simple.. Audi, Saab, Infinity, BMW, Mercedes, Lexus... they all use materials expected in this price range.
Sorry to get everyone so far off into an unusual topic for the Honda Pilot Board.
A while ago someone complained about poor leather quality in Pilot (stretched, wrinkle after a few weeks.) Does anyone else experience this? I am trying to decide b/w leather and cloth for my EX order. Thanks.
I only have about 4K on my month old Pilot. I have to admit, I noticed the stretching and resulting Loose Leather on the seat bottom very quickly after use.
Right now, I'm not very concerned but I would like to hear from Longer Term owners on how this is over time. I'm kinda thinking that the summer heat might pull things back a little.
Yes, there is a problem with the leather seat bottoms appearing stretched after minimal use. This seems to be a common complaint for the owners with leather, if they notice it.
Several people have been successful with getting their dealer to fix the problem. Reports are usually that the dealer farms it out to an upholstery shop and they insert more foam. They don't actually do anything to leather because they say it's a problem with the OE foam.
As far as choosing leather over the clot, if stretched out leather seats are going to bug you every time you look at them, get the cloth. Some people just don't notice the leather problem until they read about it. I'm going to try to get mine fixed soon.
I did notice the problem without hearing from other owners but.. I'm not really sure it's a problem or not yet. The long term wear will tell the story in my opinion.
One thing I will say.. For me personally, I prefer the normal wear of Leather over the normal wear of Cloth. Normal aging and wear of Leather is not all the bad but with cloth it just results in a worn tired look.
I just read Edmunds latest Long Term update on the Pilot. Question: Are the guys conducting and writing these all "Blondes"? No offense to Blondes.. I'm one too.
They write about how they used the power outlets for hours to operate test equipment and then report about how the battery going dead was a "mystery"!
It's NO mystery! Give me a break. They drained the battery with the use of the test equipment. They didn't write anything about running the engine while using the power outlets.
Ironically... I read a Click & Clack column today that addressed a similar issue. In it, they warned against using the power outlets for extended periods without keeping the engine running.. The result will be a "mysterious" Dead Battery. LOL
I didn't read the test report....but how were they using the outlets if the car wasn't running? My outlets won't work unless the car is running...a pet peeve of mine and my phone.
My pilot is nearly a year old now, with 35K miles. I, too, noticed the leather wear early on, but then it stabilized. After a year, many miles and many hours, I find the leather to be in adequate shape compared to other vehicles of the same age. My passenger seat is rarely used, other than for my briefcase. The leather of both seats is comparable. Sure, there are wrinkles on the outside edge of the driver's seat, but I would not say that the structure is unfit. The key is regular cleaning and conditioning, just as any other leather seat.
My complaint with the outlets is that it won't charge my phone battery if the car is off. I can use the radio, etc. with the accessory position when waiting to pick up children and such without the engine on, but my complaint is that when I leave the car, the outlets won't work. My former vehicle would charge my phone battery during the night when the car was unattended and then I'd be ready to carry it with me during the day.
On the leather issue, after the drive home from the dealer, I noticed a definite sagging or stretching of the leather. But, it was only in the very initial days for me. Now it looks brand new and just like the passenger seat. Who knows why.....
>>I didn't read the test report....but how were they using the outlets if the car wasn't running? My outlets won't work unless the car is running...a pet peeve of mine and my phone.<<
As bama mentioned, you have to have the ignition in the Accessory position to power the Outlets. This is a GOOD thing. A lot of people keep phone power cords plugged in all the time. If they were powered all the time, there would always be a Drain on the battery. On most new cars, that probably wouldn't drain the battery but if you park your car for a few days, it could be a problem.
rerenov8r - I think you misunderstood my post. When I wrote, "It's basically the same with any quality furniture...", I was talking about the need to seal the surface and protect the wood from the environment. I was not talking about the use of veneer over plastic.
"There is no reason to "plasticize" furniture, and makers of high end home furnishing DO NOT do so!"
I never wrote anything along those lines. In fact, I specifically stated that the finish on home furniture is thinner for the same reasons you posted. It does not see the same extremes that will occur inside a car.
BTW, I almost never use anything other than solid wood (veneer is no fun), and I never use wax as a finish (it doesn't last). Most of the time, the wood dictates which stain I will use and the stain dictates which finish goes over it. That's a matter of chemistry.
As for cars... I have no problem with the use of plood, so long as it looks like a real wood grain. Of course there are a few makes out there which match wood grains that most Americans have never seen. I've watched people point at real birdseye maple and proclaim, "Look at how fake that is. Real wood doesn't look like that." Woods like purpleheart really throw them for a loop. Therefore, I think the key to good wood simulation is picking one that looks realistic AND has a grain that is easily recognized.
Think mesquite with the holes filled in with black epoxy - it's the "de rigueur" look for today's woodworker. Now think of just the black epoxy. Now you have my dash :-)
Had my Pilot EX-L for about 7 months - love it! One thing I don't like: I set the rear A/C manual control to ON, then turn the car off. When I start it up again, the rear A/C control goes back to OFF! It is VERY ANNOYING having to push that button EVERY TIME I start the Pilot to give the rear passengers A/C control! It should remember the setting of that button and return to that setting when the car is restarted. That's the way the air recirculation button works - what's up with THAT???
I think I have used the rear control maybe one time. I just leave it off, the back still gets heat and ac....just the same temperature that the front of the car is being maintained at.(This is an EX) The back feature is nifty when the kids want to play with the button, but I generally just set it in the front and they deal with whatever I've decided the weather ought to be for the day.
The things that irritate me are the non lighted buttons on the steering wheel and the passenger front window that doesn't operate independantly of the lock for the back windows.
The Pilot Towing Thread is closed but here is my first experience. .......................................
Towing Report (Boat Towing) May 21 2003
I FINALLY had a chance to check out the towing performance of our Pilot.
2003 Pilot EX with Leather and DVD
Honda Tow package: Hitch, Harness, Trans cooler, PS Cooler.
200 lb. tongue weight .. 2-inch rear end drop with trailer attached.
16,000 miles on the odometer
3300 lbs. boat and trailer weight
20 foot boat
26 foot total trailer length
Tandem axles on boat trailer
1 Person load (driver = me)
0 passengers
Temp 60 degrees
Sunday night 5-18-03
Our towing vehicle for the past 7 years has been a 454 Suburban so this would be an eye opener! This gas pig would really rock through the mountains of California with any load!
I wired the trailer harness to a new 6-pin connector. I needed to use it because I have a reverse brake lockout on the surge brakes. I did NOT find where to break into a harness to get a wire to the Backup lights on the Pilot yet.
This was a minimum load test. We usually have at least 400 to 600 lbs. more towing weight with people and ski gear etc
My trip started from the northern San Fernando Valley (northern Los Angeles County) to Castaic Lake. Approx . a steady climbing 20 Miles.
Flatland was effortless and smooth almost like a non-towing Pilot. Upon entering the first ascending entrance ramp it felt pretty stable. Because the Pilot suspension is generally “soft”, I would have preferred to crank the tire pressure to the maximum rated cold on the Pilot but I did not have the time It definitely could have used more air. I did not take the easier “truck route” up the I-5. I just took the second right passenger lane and stayed considerably faster than the truck traffic at least 60 MPH going through some grades.
I always towed in 3rd gear I tested in 2nd but there seemed to be no need because if it needed to shift, it did.
The last part of the trip there was a real grind from the Lower Castaic Lake on Lake Hughes Road to the Upper Lake a 2 mile pull that takes you from the bottom of the dam to above-the-top of it. It is here that I put the pedal to the floor. The power was quite good but when the Pilot downshifted to 2nd there was quite a noise I can’t describe it. But I believe the Pilot went to 2nd and ALL Wheel drive at the same time and this added drivetrain involvement made more of a racket. But this little engine rocked and had plenty of power and kept my desired speed.
Q: Did the front end feel light? A: Lighter than I wanted but I felt that cranking up the tire pressure on BOTH the Pilot AND the trailer would have helped quite a bit.
So this, my first impression was quite good as I was originally quite apprehensive.
Next Time I will take it further north to Pyramid Lake. This is the route that Trailer Boats Magazine uses to test their tow vehicles!
Does anyone know if this unit has, or can accept an antenna so it can pick up local TV programming? I know some after-market units function in both capacities, but don't know about this one.
Really??? Is it possible? My kids would be thrilled. I figured a TV had parts that this didn't have that made it a TV and not a screen. If it possible, please tell me how!!!!
The video game inputs are for a composite video signal. You cannot simply hook an antenna into that input and have TV on your RES. You'll need a TV tuner, which the RES doesn't have.
If you had a stand alone tuner, either a bare bones TV tuner or a small VCR with a built in tuner, you can simply use the Video Out from the tuner to the Video In on the RES and have TV. Of course you'd want to find a 12 volt tuner so you can wire it into the Pilot's electrical system.
Now, show me satellite TV on the RES while you're driving and you'd have a lot people signing up for it. They've got satellite radio, so it shouldn't be too long before they get the TV part working. Just dreaming....
You would need some sort of receiver for televison signals and an antenna. Go to a local mobile electronics place and they should be able to hook you up.
Also I recall reading on some forum that a company was offering DirectTV service for cars. The receiver was around $2K. I wish I could remember where.
I looked at the KVH site and discovered that antenna is a monster. If I put that on my Ody I might as well paint the vehicle battleship gray and paint USS ROBR2 on the side of it!!
But I guarantee you'll see them on 'Slades by the end of the summer.
after reading up on all this, I really got the bug to make it into a rolling entertainment system. Hell, I'd end up actually letting my wife drive on our trips and I'll be in the back seat playing games. Only thing I'd have a tough time deciding is how many and which game systems I'd put in there.
I'm sure the satellite antenna is intended for RVs and the like. Not our little passenger vehicles.
Hell, I don't even want an antenna. Nothing on TV worth that much effort. Just the DVD is fine with me (and the games, of course).
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Check out the kvh site. The trailer they have shows it mounted on minivans and SUV's as well as RV's. IMHO - overkill but if you're independent and live in an RV it would be nice.
I've seen plenty of RV's with satellite TV using standard systems for a while now.
I can't view it here. my workplace is very restrictive. But I'll take your word for it. Sounds pretty ridiculous, but I guess to each his/her own.
I'm just thinking of the Tview screen and Blaupunkt DVD player from onlinecarstereo.com. Would cost probably around $500 (with cables and inverter) plus a good deal of my time to wire it all in. I've got plenty of gaming systems at home already. Seems pretty sweet. Plus it adds in MP3 CD capability.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I agree that the default back to Off is annoying but.. the most annoying Feature is in the Audio System with the DVD option.
Everytime you switch from Radio to CD or back.. the Rear Speakers Shut off. You have to Position the Center Control Knob to Rear and Turn them back on by selecting either CD or Radio.
On the DVD system it is kinda of a pain. If you just push and HOLD the rear power button the rear speakers will toggle on/off. Try it and I hope that is what your speaking off and it helps out. if any other questions...let me know...:)
I'm currently considering the Honda Pilot LX to replace my wife's aging minivan. I got couple of maintenance related questions about it:
- It seems the 3.5L has a timing belt instead of a chain. What is the recommended replacement interval? - Does the auto tranny has a drain plug? - Anybody has a link to an online manufacturer's recommended maintenance schedule?
Hoping to upgrade the sound system next week. Unfortunately I'll have to keep the Factory Head Unit and JL Audio does not make a Stealth Box to replace the Factory Sub Woofer yet.. but.. I'm expecting huge improvements anyway.
Test drove the Pilot EX w/o leather today. I've test driven a lot of SUV vehicles lately.
The Pilot EX was very quiet inside. Did not hear much engine, road, or wind noise. (The LX may be noisier because it does not have as much insulation as the EX.) It seemed to have enough engine power, did not have to strain. Steering and tracking was very good. Turning radius was outstanding. Brakes were excellent. Seats were firm yet comfortable and had a good posture.
Suspension was pretty good. I did feel the road bumps more than I would like to. I think softer tires could take care of 50% of that. If that's true, I would rate the ride quality as WELL above average, if not I would have to rate it still above average. (The Pilot I drove had firm riding Bridgestone tires. Goodyear are softer but they are very poor quality in that too many of them expand unevenly with speed and causes your vehicle to need constant steering corrections with any change in speed, up or down.)
The Pilot was easy to drive, almost car-like, but it still felt like I was driving a very large vehicle. (It is a large vehicle.)
For some reason, and I have driven a lot of SUVs, when I got the Pilot up to 60 mph it seemed like I was going 100mph from my eye perspective. It made me feel very uneasy. Probably just need to get use to it.
Overall, I would say its at the top of the list for the SUV market. I'm leaning toward a used RX300. If you like a large vehicle the new 2003 Expedition was almost as nice as the Pilot. Of course, you have the Ford reliability gamble and resale value won't be as high. The Sequoia was fun to drive but the suspension lets you feel every rock and road imperfection. It had the worst suspension of all the SUVs. Toyota quality is not as good as it use to be either. I read in So. Cal. you can find the Pilot EX, no leather, for at least $900 under MSRP with no dealer options. The Pilot "on the lot" had a $2995 dealer markup. They had 2 on the lot and one had just sold. As you know, most are sold before they are delivered. The ones on the lot cost more. (I read Corona Honda is competitive.)
Im a little confused on some of your comments about Ride Quality and the Feeling your doing 100mph at ony 60mph.
This is my Fourth Different SUV (Jeep, Durango, Montero full size and now the Pilot) and the Pilot beats those all by a long shot in ride comfort. At 60mph this SUV feels extremely quiet and smooth to me. I'm curious if most of your experience is more with Car Based SUVs like the Pilot for the Typical Truck Based SUV's.
I do have a few issues of concern on wether or not the Honda is going to be the Quality everyone claims you get from Honda though. I'm only in my first 5,000 miles so far and I have to admit.. I am a bit suspicious.
As far as Discounting goes... I got $1,000 under the Invoice on the sticker.
Does anybody know if the 2004 Pilot will get an upgraded NAV system? This is important for me, and there must be an insider out there somewhere that knows.
Remember that the 03 pilot has the exact same running gear as the 02 acura MDX. The difference this year is 20 HP (260 vs 240 via a low restriction exhaust) and stability control. Since most of the content is identical, I would expect at least similar quality. Also, these vehicles are assembled at the same plant. I am aware that the SUV is targeted at the American market though, but would not think that Honda would produce a product of significantly lesser quality just because a product will not be sold outside the US. On my 2003 Pilot, I cannot say that the quality is less than that of my wife's 96 civic, but I have only driven the Pilot for 2500 miles. I am going in for a TSB on "ticking" strut tower welds, but that also affects ALL 02 and 03 civics and several other honda and acura models. Other than that the only issue I have is the silver paint. The metallic content is non-uniform at certain angles and to my critical eye looks very average compared to other European silver cars. BMW and Mercedes can apply silver metallic paint to perfection. Why can't Honda?
Well, a bit of his comment might be attributed to inflation of the tires. When we got ours from the dealer, they had squeezed 45 psi into the tires. I took them down to the recommended 32. When I took it in for service, they pumped them up again. Can't figure out why they want me running around on overinflated tires, but whatever. I just deflate them when I leave each time.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Comments
- vibration in steering wheel at highway speeds of 70 + mph.
- dings on the B-Pillar from seat belt retraction
Steve, Host
not a plood fan
Actually, many makers are using Real Wood Veneers on trim pieces. In fact, MOST in the price range of the MDX either use the real thing or none at all- the only two choices that make sense IMO. As someone pointed out, there are varying degrees of the fake stuff. Some fake one's actually do look good. Honda uses a nice looking example in the new Accord.
To answer your question on who uses the Real thing: Several,not just Jaguar.. your Mercedes Example must have been in the ML but even that is real. The real ones I know of are.. Saab, BMW, Infinity (upgraded to the real thing in '01), some of the newer Caddys and Lincolns, Land Rover's, Range Rovers, Lexus and of course RR and Bently. My point is in the mid $30K range and up, using cheap or cheap looking materials should not be acceptable. The only higher price makes/ models using poor looking fake stuff these days are Acura, Caddy, Lincoln and Volvo that I've seen recently.
The Splintering in a Crash is NOT an issue. This is regulated of course, it's not used on the Wood Steering Wheels for this reason. What most people don't realize is that the actual Wood Veneer used is Paper Thin, Non-Splintering and bonded to a plastic piece for it's shape, it's use is for a Quality appearance more than anything.
I know way too much about this I'm thinking..LOL.
Drew
I could not have been more disappointed with the incredibly bland styling of the 2003 Pilot. It's fine from the grille to the A pillar, but from there back, the stylists must have gone on vacation and told their assistants to just copy an old civic wagon.
I liked the look of the new Chevy Trailblazer, but after an overnight test drive, I had way too many complaints (front seats offer ZERO lateral support, wind noise, no driver right arm-rest, small fuel tank, quirky controls, downshifts required to climb modest hills). On top of that you have the usual concern on GM reliability.
The Pilot is everything that I am looking for, just not in a package that looks like a civic wagon on steroids.
I did shop a TR-6 last winter and they have a true wooden dash. Flat as a board in fact :-)
Steve, Host
As Drew mentioned, "real wood" is a paper-thin veneer. It is bonded to a plastic backing that is shaped for the complex curves of most dashboards. Tooling a real chunk of wood for use in an automobile would be hugely expensive and wasteful.
These veneer panels are then "plasticized". Not specifically for safety reasons, but because it needs to be protected from moisture. The interior of a car can get very hot. Mix that with the humidity in the air, and you get warped or puckered wood (yes, even a bonded veneer). So they slather on the glossy finish to seal it from the elements and protect it. Thwack a real wood panel with your fingernail and it may feel fake for this reason.
It's bascially the same with any quality furniture you might buy. Though, most home furnishings will never see the kind of heat extremes that a car's interior will provide. So the finish is much thinner.
Many of these pieces are finished with NOTHING other than good quality natural WAX after being finely sanded, hand stained, and hand rubbed to an appropriate sheen. There is no reason to "plasticize" furniture, and makers of high end home furnishing DO NOT do so!
These SOLID wood pieces are crafted BETTER than antiques could ever hope to be made, because of the high level of precision that is possible with modern techniques {however the quality of LUMBER was better in past eras, as trees that grew to suitable size were more common).
The ENVIRONMENT that fine furniture faces is quite benign compared to that seen in an automotive interior. The temperature in homes and offices will not vary by more than a few degrees, humidity is controlled and motion is a non-issue.
Of course the dimensions of the structural surfaces of fine furniture are far to large for automotive interior trim. Rarely are board used that finish out to less than a true half-inch.
Of course this is simply NOT POSSIBLE for automotive interior trim for reasons already cited, and I do agree that CHEAP looking PLOOD is a disgrace. However there is about as much in common with PLOOD and high quality furniture as there is between "Ol' Roy Dog Food" and Kobe Beef...
They might tell you that at the Dealer but that reasoning it Bogus. Trust me.. the way they use these veneers.. splintering is NOT an issue. We have one of the worldls largest suppliers of these wood veneers where I live. They supply virtually all the worlds Auto manufacturers for their wood needs.. That's how I've gotten a bit of an education on this.
>>There are MANY fine furniture makers that use NOTHING but SOLID oak, cherry, maple, mahogany, teak and other fine woods. To say otherwise is simply not truthful.<<
I don't believe anyone has made that kind of statement here. Of course Fine Furniture makers use Solid Woods. That's not the way to do it for Automotive use though. The veneer process that your responding to is used to provide Long life in Automotive Applications.
Again.. the bottom line is that the use of Authentic Wood Veneers is to provide a Quality Rich Appearance for a Class of Vehicle where we expect it. It's that simple. Volvo and Acura are using plastic to save money... It's that simple.. Audi, Saab, Infinity, BMW, Mercedes, Lexus... they all use materials expected in this price range.
Sorry to get everyone so far off into an unusual topic for the Honda Pilot Board.
Drew
Right now, I'm not very concerned but I would like to hear from Longer Term owners on how this is over time. I'm kinda thinking that the summer heat might pull things back a little.
Drew
Yes, there is a problem with the leather seat bottoms appearing stretched after minimal use. This seems to be a common complaint for the owners with leather, if they notice it.
Several people have been successful with getting their dealer to fix the problem. Reports are usually that the dealer farms it out to an upholstery shop and they insert more foam. They don't actually do anything to leather because they say it's a problem with the OE foam.
As far as choosing leather over the clot, if stretched out leather seats are going to bug you every time you look at them, get the cloth. Some people just don't notice the leather problem until they read about it. I'm going to try to get mine fixed soon.
-Pete
One thing I will say.. For me personally, I prefer the normal wear of Leather over the normal wear of Cloth. Normal aging and wear of Leather is not all the bad but with cloth it just results in a worn tired look.
Drew
They write about how they used the power outlets for hours to operate test equipment and then report about how the battery going dead was a "mystery"!
It's NO mystery! Give me a break. They drained the battery with the use of the test equipment. They didn't write anything about running the engine while using the power outlets.
Ironically... I read a Click & Clack column today that addressed a similar issue. In it, they warned against using the power outlets for extended periods without keeping the engine running.. The result will be a "mysterious" Dead Battery. LOL
What a mystery
Drew
Steve, Host
On the leather issue, after the drive home from the dealer, I noticed a definite sagging or stretching of the leather. But, it was only in the very initial days for me. Now it looks brand new and just like the passenger seat. Who knows why.....
As bama mentioned, you have to have the ignition in the Accessory position to power the Outlets. This is a GOOD thing. A lot of people keep phone power cords plugged in all the time. If they were powered all the time, there would always be a Drain on the battery. On most new cars, that probably wouldn't drain the battery but if you park your car for a few days, it could be a problem.
Drew
Also, when is the 2004 model expected to be released?
"There is no reason to "plasticize" furniture, and makers of high end home furnishing DO NOT do so!"
I never wrote anything along those lines. In fact, I specifically stated that the finish on home furniture is thinner for the same reasons you posted. It does not see the same extremes that will occur inside a car.
BTW, I almost never use anything other than solid wood (veneer is no fun), and I never use wax as a finish (it doesn't last). Most of the time, the wood dictates which stain I will use and the stain dictates which finish goes over it. That's a matter of chemistry.
As for cars... I have no problem with the use of plood, so long as it looks like a real wood grain. Of course there are a few makes out there which match wood grains that most Americans have never seen. I've watched people point at real birdseye maple and proclaim, "Look at how fake that is. Real wood doesn't look like that." Woods like purpleheart really throw them for a loop. Therefore, I think the key to good wood simulation is picking one that looks realistic AND has a grain that is easily recognized.
Steve, Host
The things that irritate me are the non lighted buttons on the steering wheel and the passenger front window that doesn't operate independantly of the lock for the back windows.
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Towing Report (Boat Towing) May 21 2003
I FINALLY had a chance to check out the towing performance of our Pilot.
2003 Pilot EX with Leather and DVD
Honda Tow package: Hitch, Harness, Trans cooler, PS Cooler.
200 lb. tongue weight .. 2-inch rear end drop with trailer attached.
16,000 miles on the odometer
3300 lbs. boat and trailer weight
20 foot boat
26 foot total trailer length
Tandem axles on boat trailer
1 Person load (driver = me)
0 passengers
Temp 60 degrees
Sunday night 5-18-03
Our towing vehicle for the past 7 years has been a 454 Suburban so this would be an eye opener!
This gas pig would really rock through the mountains of California with any load!
I wired the trailer harness to a new 6-pin connector.
I needed to use it because I have a reverse brake lockout on the surge brakes.
I did NOT find where to break into a harness to get a wire to the Backup lights on the Pilot yet.
This was a minimum load test. We usually have at least 400 to 600 lbs. more towing weight with people and ski gear etc
My trip started from the northern San Fernando Valley (northern Los Angeles County) to Castaic Lake.
Approx . a steady climbing 20 Miles.
Flatland was effortless and smooth almost like a non-towing Pilot.
Upon entering the first ascending entrance ramp it felt pretty stable.
Because the Pilot suspension is generally “soft”, I would have preferred to crank the tire pressure to the maximum rated cold on the Pilot but I did not have the time It definitely could have used more air.
I did not take the easier “truck route” up the I-5. I just took the second right passenger lane and stayed considerably faster than the truck traffic at least 60 MPH going through some grades.
I always towed in 3rd gear I tested in 2nd but there seemed to be no need because if it needed to shift, it did.
The last part of the trip there was a real grind from the Lower Castaic Lake on Lake Hughes Road to the Upper Lake a 2 mile pull that takes you from the bottom of the dam to above-the-top of it.
It is here that I put the pedal to the floor.
The power was quite good but when the Pilot downshifted to 2nd there was quite a noise I can’t describe it. But I believe the Pilot went to 2nd and ALL Wheel drive at the same time and this added drivetrain involvement made more of a racket.
But this little engine rocked and had plenty of power and kept my desired speed.
Q: Did the front end feel light?
A: Lighter than I wanted but I felt that cranking up the tire pressure on BOTH the Pilot AND the trailer would have helped quite a bit.
So this, my first impression was quite good as I was originally quite apprehensive.
Next Time I will take it further north to Pyramid Lake. This is the route that Trailer Boats Magazine uses to test their tow vehicles!
Stay Tuned : - )))
Thanks.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
If you had a stand alone tuner, either a bare bones TV tuner or a small VCR with a built in tuner, you can simply use the Video Out from the tuner to the Video In on the RES and have TV. Of course you'd want to find a 12 volt tuner so you can wire it into the Pilot's electrical system.
Now, show me satellite TV on the RES while you're driving and you'd have a lot people signing up for it. They've got satellite radio, so it shouldn't be too long before they get the TV part working. Just dreaming....
Also I recall reading on some forum that a company was offering DirectTV service for cars. The receiver was around $2K. I wish I could remember where.
and here
http://www.kvh.com/tracvision/a5/index.asp
If you want to get even more complex, check this out. this is definitely on my list of "to dos":
http://www.acuramdx.org/forums/showthread.php?s=c614dc73030c47b78- da1b8c4ff49c507&threadid=5662&perpage=15&pagenumber=5
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
But I guarantee you'll see them on 'Slades by the end of the summer.
I'm sure the satellite antenna is intended for RVs and the like. Not our little passenger vehicles.
Hell, I don't even want an antenna. Nothing on TV worth that much effort. Just the DVD is fine with me (and the games, of course).
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I've seen plenty of RV's with satellite TV using standard systems for a while now.
I'm just thinking of the Tview screen and Blaupunkt DVD player from onlinecarstereo.com. Would cost probably around $500 (with cables and inverter) plus a good deal of my time to wire it all in. I've got plenty of gaming systems at home already. Seems pretty sweet. Plus it adds in MP3 CD capability.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Everytime you switch from Radio to CD or back.. the Rear Speakers Shut off. You have to Position the Center Control Knob to Rear and Turn them back on by selecting either CD or Radio.
How Stupid is that?
Drew
I'm currently considering the Honda Pilot LX to replace my wife's aging minivan. I got couple of maintenance related questions about it:
- It seems the 3.5L has a timing belt instead of a chain. What is the recommended replacement interval?
- Does the auto tranny has a drain plug?
- Anybody has a link to an online manufacturer's recommended maintenance schedule?
Thanks
Hoping to upgrade the sound system next week. Unfortunately I'll have to keep the Factory Head Unit and JL Audio does not make a Stealth Box to replace the Factory Sub Woofer yet.. but.. I'm expecting huge improvements anyway.
Drew
The Pilot EX was very quiet inside. Did not hear much engine, road, or wind noise. (The LX may be noisier because it does not have as much insulation as the EX.)
It seemed to have enough engine power, did not have to strain.
Steering and tracking was very good.
Turning radius was outstanding.
Brakes were excellent.
Seats were firm yet comfortable and had a good posture.
Suspension was pretty good. I did feel the road bumps more than I would like to. I think softer tires could take care of 50% of that. If that's true, I would rate the ride quality as WELL above average, if not I would have to rate it still above average. (The Pilot I drove had firm riding Bridgestone tires. Goodyear are softer but they are very poor quality in that too many of them expand unevenly with speed and causes your vehicle to need constant steering corrections with any change in speed, up or down.)
The Pilot was easy to drive, almost car-like, but it still felt like I was driving a very large vehicle. (It is a large vehicle.)
For some reason, and I have driven a lot of SUVs, when I got the Pilot up to 60 mph it seemed like I was going 100mph from my eye perspective. It made me feel very uneasy. Probably just need to get use to it.
Overall, I would say its at the top of the list for the SUV market.
I'm leaning toward a used RX300. If you like a large vehicle the new 2003 Expedition was almost as nice as the Pilot. Of course, you have the Ford reliability gamble and resale value won't be as high. The Sequoia was fun to drive but the suspension lets you feel every rock and road imperfection. It had the worst suspension of all the SUVs. Toyota quality is not as good as it use to be either.
I read in So. Cal. you can find the Pilot EX, no leather, for at least $900 under MSRP with no dealer options. The Pilot "on the lot" had a $2995 dealer markup. They had 2 on the lot and one had just sold. As you know, most are sold before they are delivered. The ones on the lot cost more. (I read Corona Honda is competitive.)
Hope this helps.
This is my Fourth Different SUV (Jeep, Durango, Montero full size and now the Pilot) and the Pilot beats those all by a long shot in ride comfort. At 60mph this SUV feels extremely quiet and smooth to me. I'm curious if most of your experience is more with Car Based SUVs like the Pilot for the Typical Truck Based SUV's.
I do have a few issues of concern on wether or not the Honda is going to be the Quality everyone claims you get from Honda though. I'm only in my first 5,000 miles so far and I have to admit.. I am a bit suspicious.
As far as Discounting goes... I got $1,000 under the Invoice on the sticker.
Good Luck
Drew
Thanks in advance!
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S