ok, first off I'd just like to say that the Pontiac Solstice looks like a nice car. sleek look and innovative design. one fact still remains the same it is a GM. being a previous owner of not one but two GM cars, '97 Cavalier, and a'96 Sunfire, I have many mixed feelings on purchasing the Solstice. If I where to purchase the Solstice how is the reliability rating? I had several factory recalls on both previous GM cars owned. will I have to subject more of my useful studying time from my school work to get a safety belt recall done? Another issue that everyone seems to be stifling about is the price, if you are asking for a roadster, rwd, youth attractive car under $15k, what country are you actually living in? in todays' U.S. market you are lucky to find a reliable and attractive domestic car under $15k new. get real. although I do have some issues with the price as well, but my issues are with the option prices. for $25k you can pruchase a new Acura RSX Type-S fully loaded, which offers more horse power, higher reliablility rateing, and higher resale value. All I am saying is that GM better be on the ball this time, selling a reliable and well worth car. I am a current college student looking for a good deal, GM don't let me down again.
I too hope GM does a better job with this roadster......I would like to know the demographics they are targeting for the car......I would guess most who buy this car...will not be using it as their primary vehicle...but the 2nd or 3rd vehicle.....I dont think you can compare the Acura Coupe with the Solstice roadster....two different appeals to people......being late 40s.....I like the roadster for the "fun car" to cruise to the football games, the beach, the mountains..to a favorite B&B etc with the significant other, not as my primary mode of transportation....25k is low end for a "fun car" in my opinion.....my previous experience with GM has been good.....79 Forumla Firebird.....my youth car.....84 buick century..my young family car.....then all honda/nissan for while....followed by ford/chrysler..99 GT mustang.....my first middle age fun car.., and now back to GM with my 04 Mailbu Maxx......bottomline...lets just hope GM gets the reliability right and produces them at a rate to meet demand, maintaining quality control, and no dealer mark ups!.....
The several dealers I have spoken with didnt havent too many kind words about the Apprentice 1000 marketing....they all would have rather seen a full production and dealership allocations instead of the the hype of the special badging 1000....
Ten years is a long time for auto reliability rankings.
In fact, with the exception of drive trains, where Honda was number one and GM number two, GM actually bests Honda in the current JD Power reliability rankings.
The new GMs are proving to be very reliable. No reason the Solstice should not continue the trend.
You will not be able to drop the top in an Acura RSX. The fact you are considering resale value says volumes about the Acura as well. Roadster lovers never resell. I know people who have maintained their MG's and Triumphs for 30+ years. I also know some with the first year Miata. Resale value will only matter to their heirs when they die.
that ended with an 01 grand am that I would have gladly torched and NOT turned in on my insurance. I really like the looks of the Solstice and I'm a huge convertible fan (had 3 of those), but I'm still really wary of Pontiac quality and reliability!! I have not had much luck in getting car issues resolved with Pontiac and after owning 2 trouble-free cars (mitsu and mazda), I'm just not sure I'll take the chance on putting myself through the pontiac woes again. But, not to be completely negative, I love the looks of the car!!
Yesterday (5-26-05) at 2PM I saw a full car carrier of new Solstices traveling west through south central Pennsylvania! The only colors I noticed were red and black, the truck went by so fast. I called my local dealer and he had no idea where they would heading since they are not due out until Sept/Oct.
First, the dealer is using the vague parameters GM is giving them right now. If GM starts shipping before those dates, you can expect a call from the dealer.
Second, I'ld heard somewhere that GM was getting some production Solsti together for the press tests. I wonder if you saw them.
xkss: I predicted the same for the Cryco Xfire when they first came out. One poor fellow (who had just paid 5K over MSRP) bet me that it'd never happen. He still owes me a steak @ Ruth's Chris Steakhouse. Never heard from him again LOL !!
The better-looking Saturn Sky will have been out a few months, and hopefully learned from the Solstice growing pains (top problems, delayed launch, missed desirable Summer season).
Demand will be good, but AMD's and such will be gone, better option mixes available.
To me GM already dropped the ball promising Summer release, then I something happened..... :confuse:
iluv: I think they were once only "Chris' Steakhouse". They are very expensive and I think mostly in the larger metro areas of the country (ex: Orlando) They were bought out some years back by "Ruth", ergo "Ruth's Chris Steakhouse". About the least expensive steak there runs about $30.00 !!
call me curious but I don't trust them. I would listen to their commercials in the Seattle area when I was living in Washington state and get turned off by them. They were annoying commercials, and...that name!
Come on Ruth, drop the "Chris" from the name, it's now your Steakhouse!
Who says names of products don't matter? And a lowball price of $30? Uuughh! :sick:
Well, that's the name and would you change the name of a busintess that draws a huge clientele at this late date??
She acquired a restaurant named Chris Steak House in New Orleans in the 1920s, I think, and there was some reason she couldn't completely change the name of it - zoning or something, and I think a fire was involved somewhere along the way, I've forgottten the whole story. It's been a huge success all over the country and one of the things I'd like to do in my lifetime is have someone who has no money cares whatsoever take me there for dinner. I can spend a lot in heartbeat if I'm not paying the bill. :P
She's not going to change the name, she died a few years ago. Anyway, I know you know the concept of why mess with success??
In any case, this has not one thing to do with the Solstice, now, does it.
> Soapy: This is exactly what Pontiac did with the Fiero. Dug into the parts bin for a > lump of a engine (Iron Duke, UGH !!) cobbled together the suspension etc. We all > know how THAT turned out don't we.
You're right, except that this is 20 years later.
Also in the 1980's we also had badge engineering, which has evolved into platform sharing, or "modular component" sharing. Many manufacturers use that technique quite successfully, so there's no reason that that should be a problem for GM / the Solstice.
My HOPE is that GM is being smarter with the Solstice, and testing that the "bin parts" actually work together, and have designed a production line that will produce the needed quality. I think that the biggest problem with the Fiero, (apart from the quality of the shared components - I *have* known the joy of the iron duke ) was that there was no money to "do it right". If the Solstice doesn't get sufficient funding to continuously improve, then I could see it being much like the Fiero.
soapy: All your points are truly valid. I hope the Solstice is a runaway success and they build a million of them.
Going back to the days of the Fiero it was said that it barely ever came to be as management at that time did not want to spend the money to develop it. Thus the parts bin cobbling with just what they had. Management was not keen on a "sports car" concept. The promoters within the company sold the Fiero, with tongue in cheek, to the top brass as a "commuter vehicle" and the dummies at the top bought the idea and so it was born.
Apparently, it is not in good form to talk negetively about a product in this discussion forum. I suppose that is a good policy. Pontiac pays a little more for advertising on this site than I do.
In the interest of mending fences, I would like to slightly ammend my previous post as follows....
I sure can't wait to be the first guy on my block to get one of these things! I'm going to my local Pontiac dealer now to order one right away so I can get one with a special serial number that is sure to make it a collector's item. At 25k loaded, I'm more than willing to pay full ticket if not more. Given Pontiac's outstanding reputation for quality and long term value, I'm sure it wont have any problems at all and will bring good trade in value when the time comes, just like all the other Pontiac cars have done in the past. Anyhow, I just wanted to congratulate all the other people out there with good car buying sense that are lining up to buy this thing and waiting with baited breath until this car ships. It's just plain foolish not to buy one of these things. Thank you for making my life worth living, Pontiac!
xkss: I predicted the same for the Cryco Xfire when they first came out. One poor fellow (who had just paid 5K over MSRP) bet me that it'd never happen. He still owes me a steak Ruth's Chris Steakhouse.
The 2006 Pontiac Solstice doesn't use a seven-year-old chassis like the Chrysler Crossfire.
The better-looking Saturn Sky will have been out a few months, and hopefully learned from the Solstice growing pains (top problems, delayed launch, missed desirable Summer season).
The Solstice has NOT been delayed. GM NEVER said exactly when the Solstice would go on sale until a month or so ago when they said the fall of 2004 would be the first sale.
I sure can't wait to be the first guy on my block to get one of these things! I'm going to my local Pontiac dealer now to order one right away so I can get one with a special serial number that is sure to make it a collector's item. At 25k loaded, I'm more than willing to pay full ticket if not more. Given Pontiac's outstanding reputation for quality and long term value, I'm sure it wont have any problems at all and will bring good trade in value when the time comes, just like all the other Pontiac cars have done in the past. Anyhow, I just wanted to congratulate all the other people out there with good car buying sense that are lining up to buy this thing and waiting with baited breath until this car ships. It's just plain foolish not to buy one of these things. Thank you for making my life worth living, Pontiac!
Few cars that cost under $30,000 today will be collector cars.
lol, me too. A window crank looks more sporty than those cheap plastic buttons imo. Electric windows are another thing to fail at some point and they weigh a little bit more. I wonder how many people will order their roadsters without A/C to save weight. The only reason I can think of for having A/C in a Solstice is defogging....
I have to weigh in on the Solstice vs. Sky, too. To my eyes, Solstice is much better-looking. I don't like the Sky's nose at all. Solstice has a classic aggressiveness and Sky looks more "video game" to me. Now if only GM will put a turbo or supercharger in the Solstice...
xkss: I'll take a seven year old MB chassis anytime over whatever the General dishes up for the Solstice. Let's face it the Solstice will not be in the same class with the Xfire nor was it intended to be. Solstice is a" Joe Doaks" car, which is OK, we need a more affordable two seater. I personally like the radical styling of the Xfire. But what do I know about styling. I was the "first (and only) kid on the block" to buy a Pacer. LOL !!
Hate to burst your bubble, but I can't have you misleading the people.
In case you missed the full-page priont ads, the TV commercials, and the website that clearly stated, in January/February of this year, that the Solstice would be available this Summer, maybe you saw "The Apprentice" that had D. Trump also relay the Summer message?
By Summer, they didn't mean September 19th either.
A convertible is as useful in the Fall as a Hummer is at a retirement home! If anything, it should've been a May/June release for best results.
Football season and Convertibles. Perfect together.
would agree the timing for a release of the solstice is lousy....Ford did a good job on holding off the new mustang convertible..till spring..but advertising it on the Super Bowl in Jan......one would think the marketing folks would have figured this out.......will wait patiently on mine...since not the primary car...this one is the fun car for my wife and I to cruise in...fall in the mountains and to football...spring and summer to the coast...........otherwise the roadster will not see much of winter here in Northern Virginia.....rather sit in the garage..but I will drive it off the dealers lot with the top down..regardless of when it gets here or how cold it is!!!!!!
Hate to burst your bubble, but I can't have you misleading the people.
In case you missed the full-page priont ads, the TV commercials, and the website that clearly stated, in January/February of this year, that the Solstice would be available this Summer, maybe you saw "The Apprentice" that had D. Trump also relay the Summer message?
GM site as well as another Solstice forum reported the first production runs began on 16 May, ......but still anticipating a Sept/Oct date to complete delivery of the first "1000" cars....Two dealers here in the northern va area have their second increment due in around mid Nov.....
You saw cars going to Detroit where the Engineers are driving the Captured test fleet vehicles. You can see them on the streets of Detroit. Used to catch any quality problems. Happens on all GM vehicles. Every new model year and every new model.
it was tounge in cheek, einstein. few cars under 30k will be collectors items.....few cars under 30k will wreck the finances of the people that buy them like this one will. just like the xfire. just like the p/t cruiser. just like the new beetle. etc. etc. pontiac wont even be making this 3 years from now.
So GM meant for the convertible to come out just when the nice weather ends?
No wonder they have to give "Employee Pricing"! :P
GM is not stupid, their just not very good.
Autoweek & Automotive News are reporting the car will not reach dealers in any quantity until Late September/Early October due to front fascia/convertible top fit problems.
I'm not a hyperlink expert, so I can't send the article here, but go to Autoweek.com and use their search, enter: pontiac solstice, and pull up the 4/25/05 article.
Even dealers who ordered THE FIRST 4 cars are not being promised a delivery date at all!
Welcome to GM! Don't act surprised :surprise:
I'm your host, Rod Serling. Taking only the first 1000 orders in advance for an exclusive one way trip into..... the GM Zone!
Drfill: What a laugh. Employee pricing EXCEPT those dealers that don't want to participate. Read the small print guys, "At participating dealers". Does that mean you will still have the same old hassle to get down to the best price ? Employee pricing, LOL ! It wont mean diddly squat.
Don't forget the NC MX-5 isn't coming out till September either! Too bad the whole U.S. is covered in 5 foot snow drifts come October. :confuse: Yes the release date isn't the best for the NE or Great Lake states, but it won't bother the southern U.S. The EOP orders are also starting to be pulled with a tentative start date of the week of July 18.
Please do not believe everything what the press says. It is also too soon to be "promising" cars to anyone except Engineering and they have theirs.
Again, there is "nice" weather in places you obviously do not live. The plant capacity will easily be filled keeping the southern and western states in cars over the winter.
Why should GM care when the car comes out? They have sold out. By the time the car starts to have some inventory it will be summer again. Sounds like, even if they did not plan it, they have it under control.
Now will the car be out of production in 3 years? Do not know. The 2 door market is awful small and a lot of manufactures like to dip their toe in it. If they keep the car exciting with upgrades (HP, special models, etc.) and not overprice it, they should be at least competitive.
Im confused or just missing your point here..how is the purchase of this car going to wreck the finances of the people who buy them????...and your comparison to the other three you mentioned..are you saying their owners are financially irresponsible for buying them....paying that high market incentive or that they will take a beating in a trade????
I personally dont purchase a car as an investment....its my transportation..or in this case..for the solstice...a third car to have fun with.....moneywise...Im paying cash up front for it when its delivered.......and yes...Im in no hurry for it...whether it gets here in Nov...or Mar 05 as it is not my primary means of transportation...
the P/T cruiser has its niche following.....just like that Honda Element box....people love or hate them......The solstice will be around for a while....and have a strong following Im predicting...only time will bear us both out....
it will sell well and be around in 10 years. The thing I'm curious about is how buyers like them in the long term. How well will they hold up?
Will their trannies fail in 10,000 miles? Will little or long pieces of trim fall off in 200 miles? Will people like the lighting gear on their dashes?
How long will we wait for a convertible Solstice? Questions like those I wonder.
As far as it's body design goes, the new Pontiac Solstice is an absloute knockout. A winner indeed.
I think the Saturn clone of the Solstice is a drop dead beautiful and one-ups the Solstice big time. I wonder if the demand for the Sky will be as high as the Solstice considering it is supposed to be up scale in appointments and several thousands more $ for their "base" model. I think they will be more plentiful in the beginning and some buyers will tire of waiting on their Solstice and jump to the Saturn Version.
I see no roll bar and the literature on the car does not indicate a roll bar. So when will there be a hardtop version. That should save a $1000 or so off the price and save your head. -Loren
No standard air conditioning? Sounds like it really is not under $20K. Have not owned a car without air since the '70's. Now don't laugh, that was an Old's Starfire. -Loren
the base model doesnt have A/C......with every option ordered, it is just at 25K plus tax etc....I beleive everyone is ordering it with air......and I would bet..it would be very hard to find one without A/C on a dealer lot next year.....waiting patiently here...not one of the 1000..but number three on a dealer with an allocation of 4 for the second increment deliver!....
I concur with y our assessment as well..I ventured back into GM in 04 with a new body style (Malibu Maxx) am and quite happy with it....16 months old and 25K on it....no problems...good fit and drives very well....another long design period for this car as well....but on a standard epilson chassis that is shared with the Pontiac G-6 and the Saab.....
I think the biggest answer on the Solstice is how long we will have to wait...to get them .....or in stock on the dealers lots.......Im betting late 04 early 05 at this point
Went to Saturn, look at some rather odd looking thing, the Ion, got back in car and left. They do not seem to have any product. I think Saturn is winding down, like Mitsubishi, which has a good looking Eclipse for 2006, yet dwindling number of dealerships, so I will pass there too. If the Sky is $25,000 as base, what will the average one sell for? The Solstice starts at $20, which is fine, if they throw in air conditioning and a roll bar. If not, would pass on that one too. Actually prefer a hardtop. Soft top is fun some times, but I have been there - done that, and it is not all to the good. Loren
this will be my third convertible....and none I have owned previously had a rollbar....you will not find a US car company that will put one as OEM..since not a NHTSA requirement..unless you are going to road race the coupe and the governing body will require one normally...I dont see a need for one.....previous two were a mustang convertible and a lebaron convertible......I would anticipate the Sky going for 27K average with the options from the dealer....
notice your comment on A/C not being standard...if you look around..it normally isnt standard on a base line model.....some will have it..but most you will pay for it is some option package or another.....
I love a convertible..in the spring and fall.....summer...well depends....but cant wait to drive with the top down again!!
I'm with you frnkrzzo, I can't wait to run down to the dealer and pay my $5000+ over sticker to get this car. I once again will be able to have a close relationship with the mechanic, the dealer, GM, and the State automotive board. These are things I've truly missed since buying Foreign cars. And on the educational side my word vocabulary will increase tremendously.
Comments
The several dealers I have spoken with didnt havent too many kind words about the Apprentice 1000 marketing....they all would have rather seen a full production and dealership allocations instead of the the hype of the special badging 1000....
In fact, with the exception of drive trains, where Honda was number one and GM number two, GM actually bests Honda in the current JD Power reliability rankings.
The new GMs are proving to be very reliable. No reason the Solstice should not continue the trend.
You will not be able to drop the top in an Acura RSX. The fact you are considering resale value says volumes about the Acura as well. Roadster lovers never resell. I know people who have maintained their MG's and Triumphs for 30+ years. I also know some with the first year Miata. Resale value will only matter to their heirs when they die.
Second, I'ld heard somewhere that GM was getting some production Solsti together for the press tests. I wonder if you saw them.
I'll quote you on that.
Regards, have a great holiday !!
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
Demand will be good, but AMD's and such will be gone, better option mixes available.
To me GM already dropped the ball promising Summer release, then I something happened..... :confuse:
DrFill
believer
Come on Ruth, drop the "Chris" from the name, it's now your Steakhouse!
Who says names of products don't matter? And a lowball price of $30? Uuughh! :sick:
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
She acquired a restaurant named Chris Steak House in New Orleans in the 1920s, I think, and there was some reason she couldn't completely change the name of it - zoning or something, and I think a fire was involved somewhere along the way, I've forgottten the whole story. It's been a huge success all over the country and one of the things I'd like to do in my lifetime is have someone who has no money cares whatsoever take me there for dinner. I can spend a lot in heartbeat if I'm not paying the bill. :P
She's not going to change the name, she died a few years ago. Anyway, I know you know the concept of why mess with success??
In any case, this has not one thing to do with the Solstice, now, does it.
> Soapy: This is exactly what Pontiac did with the Fiero. Dug into the parts bin for a
> lump of a engine (Iron Duke, UGH !!) cobbled together the suspension etc. We all
> know how THAT turned out don't we.
You're right, except that this is 20 years later.
Also in the 1980's we also had badge engineering, which has evolved into platform sharing, or "modular component" sharing. Many manufacturers use that technique quite successfully, so there's no reason that that should be a problem for GM / the Solstice.
My HOPE is that GM is being smarter with the Solstice, and testing that the "bin parts" actually work together, and have designed a production line that will produce the needed quality. I think that the biggest problem with the Fiero, (apart from the quality of the shared components - I *have* known the joy of the iron duke
Going back to the days of the Fiero it was said that it barely ever came to be as management at that time did not want to spend the money to develop it. Thus the parts bin cobbling with just what they had. Management was not keen on a "sports car" concept. The promoters within the company sold the Fiero, with tongue in cheek, to the top brass as a "commuter vehicle" and the dummies at the top bought the idea and so it was born.
hope you had a nice Memorial Day.
Believer
In the interest of mending fences, I would like to slightly ammend my previous post as follows....
I sure can't wait to be the first guy on my block to get one of these things! I'm going to my local Pontiac dealer now to order one right away so I can get one with a special serial number that is sure to make it a collector's item. At 25k loaded, I'm more than willing to pay full ticket if not more. Given Pontiac's outstanding reputation for quality and long term value, I'm sure it wont have any problems at all and will bring good trade in value when the time comes, just like all the other Pontiac cars have done in the past. Anyhow, I just wanted to congratulate all the other people out there with good car buying sense that are lining up to buy this thing and waiting with baited breath until this car ships. It's just plain foolish not to buy one of these things. Thank you for making my life worth living, Pontiac!
Believer
The 2006 Pontiac Solstice doesn't use a seven-year-old chassis like the Chrysler Crossfire.
Here is an article about the new Solstice
New Pontiac sports car
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
The Solstice has NOT been delayed. GM NEVER said exactly when the Solstice would go on sale until a month or so ago when they said the fall of 2004 would be the first sale.
Few cars that cost under $30,000 today will be collector cars.
I have to weigh in on the Solstice vs. Sky, too. To my eyes, Solstice is much better-looking. I don't like the Sky's nose at all. Solstice has a classic aggressiveness and Sky looks more "video game" to me. Now if only GM will put a turbo or supercharger in the Solstice...
Believer
In case you missed the full-page priont ads, the TV commercials, and the website that clearly stated, in January/February of this year, that the Solstice would be available this Summer, maybe you saw "The Apprentice" that had D. Trump also relay the Summer message?
By Summer, they didn't mean September 19th either.
A convertible is as useful in the Fall as a Hummer is at a retirement home! If anything, it should've been a May/June release for best results.
Football season and Convertibles. Perfect together.
DrFill
In case you missed the full-page priont ads, the TV commercials, and the website that clearly stated, in January/February of this year, that the Solstice would be available this Summer, maybe you saw "The Apprentice" that had D. Trump also relay the Summer message?
Donald Trump doesn't handle GM's press releases.
It goes into production this summer.
check this link for the new Pontiac Solstice
2006 Pontiac
I'm not making a prediction, just a casual observation of that bold statement above.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
No wonder they have to give "Employee Pricing"! :P
GM is not stupid, their just not very good.
Autoweek & Automotive News are reporting the car will not reach dealers in any quantity until Late September/Early October due to front fascia/convertible top fit problems.
I'm not a hyperlink expert, so I can't send the article here, but go to Autoweek.com and use their search, enter: pontiac solstice, and pull up the 4/25/05 article.
Even dealers who ordered THE FIRST 4 cars are not being promised a delivery date at all!
Welcome to GM! Don't act surprised :surprise:
I'm your host, Rod Serling. Taking only the first 1000 orders in advance for an exclusive one way trip into..... the GM Zone!
DrFill
Believer
Again, there is "nice" weather in places you obviously do not live. The plant capacity will easily be filled keeping the southern and western states in cars over the winter.
Why should GM care when the car comes out? They have sold out. By the time the car starts to have some inventory it will be summer again. Sounds like, even if they did not plan it, they have it under control.
Now will the car be out of production in 3 years? Do not know. The 2 door market is awful small and a lot of manufactures like to dip their toe in it. If they keep the car exciting with upgrades (HP, special models, etc.) and not overprice it, they should be at least competitive.
I personally dont purchase a car as an investment....its my transportation..or in this case..for the solstice...a third car to have fun with.....moneywise...Im paying cash up front for it when its delivered.......and yes...Im in no hurry for it...whether it gets here in Nov...or Mar 05 as it is not my primary means of transportation...
the P/T cruiser has its niche following.....just like that Honda Element box....people love or hate them......The solstice will be around for a while....and have a strong following Im predicting...only time will bear us both out....
Will their trannies fail in 10,000 miles? Will little or long pieces of trim fall off in 200 miles? Will people like the lighting gear on their dashes?
How long will we wait for a convertible Solstice? Questions like those I wonder.
As far as it's body design goes, the new Pontiac Solstice is an absloute knockout. A winner indeed.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
Believer
So when will there be a hardtop version. That should save a $1000 or
so off the price and save your head.
-Loren
Have not owned a car without air since the '70's. Now don't laugh,
that was an Old's Starfire.
-Loren
I think the biggest answer on the Solstice is how long we will have to wait...to get them .....or in stock on the dealers lots.......Im betting late 04 early 05 at this point
These guys were so much better from a customer perspective than anyone else I've dealt with.
It is great to see they will be getting the beautiful Sky and the nifty Aura. They deserve the chance to move some desireable product for a change.
Loren
notice your comment on A/C not being standard...if you look around..it normally isnt standard on a base line model.....some will have it..but most you will pay for it is some option package or another.....
I love a convertible..in the spring and fall.....summer...well depends....but cant wait to drive with the top down again!!