Subaru Baja

paisan

Optionally stored either up top or in the bed. For instance you could fit them in the bed with say a bike or some 2x4s.

-mike

rsholland

under the bed, in a storage compartment accessed from inside the bed, ala the storage compartment on the concept STX.

Bob

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Pickups & News & Views Message Boards

dcm61

Today's the day. Debut Day for the Baja Turbo this afternoon (scheduled for 1:25 pm EDT) at the NY autoshow.

DaveM

rsholland

and at 1:25 today I'll be a the dentist's office getting my teeth "detailed.," so I'll be late to the party.

Bob

dcm61

The party starts tomorrow at 12 noon. The Subaru Crew party, that is. :-)

paisan

Should be fun. Lots of SQC, I-club, and NASIOC people gonna be showing up at noon to the soobie booth!

-mike

rsholland

hopefully around noon. It may be closer to 1:00 if the traffic is bad or if we get a late start.

Bob

paisan

No problem, we'll be there. You guys have my cell # right?

-mike

rsholland

twrx

1. I think it is really good idea and should help the Baja. They can't really make it more truck like but they can make it sportier.
2. Bet the turbo will be exactly the same as the Forester XT. Why sell the 2.5 turbo with three different tunes?

TWRX

ateixeira

paisan: it ends in 6313, right? Mine ends in 2525, I think you already have it, if not e-mail me.

Can't wait to get there!

-juice

lark6

juice: I know you have my cell phone #. ;-)

Ed

dcm61

http://media.subaru.com/

Has Forester XT engine and special alloy wheels.

DaveM

ateixeira

My wife tested it for me, Ed! LOL

e-mailed you paisan.

Nice catch, Dave. So it's not the same engine that'll go in the Legacy. Prolly a good idea, it's a good utility powerplant, most likely.

-juice

lark6

So will Baja Turbos be monochromatic? The media photo shows an all-black one with some incredible orange peel on the bumper.

Ed

bat1161

Spotted my first Baja in NYC yesterday. It was silver, and appeared to have the soft bed cover. It was being driven by a little old white-haired lady, and had handicap plates. So much for that targeted demographics :-)

We were crawling along in traffic just off the VZ, so I didn't have an oppourtunity to ask her impression.

Mark

dcm61

Baja Turbo gets VTD! But the Forester XT doesn't?? Baja T also has 8.4 inches ground clearance. Tow capacity = 2400lbs. Don't see leather seats in the specs.

DaveM

ateixeira

Hey, that PDF had lots of good info!

* 235 lb-ft at just 3600 rpm
* AVCS and 11.6 psi of boost
* 3.9 final drive for 5 speed, 4.44 for auto
* Autos get VTD AWD!
* 8.4" clearance? Did they raise it?
* 91 octane required (rats!)
* 3605-3670 curb weight
* no EPA mpg yet

They say 3500 lbs without the turbo, so it's about 105-170 lbs added for that model. Not bad, I expected more, since it's still a 2.5l.

Yeah, I checked and they say 7.3" clearance for the non-turbo. I'm surprised it's more than an inch higher for the turbo, but that's good news I guess.

-juice

ateixeira

Yeah, I also saw that 2400 lbs tow rating. And the one pictured was monotone black, with some cool rims too.

I like it. If the Forester XT weren't coming, I'd consider one. If the price is lower than the Forester's, I still might.

-juice

dcm61

also at http://media.subaru.com/ in the Baja product info section.

Fuel requirement: 91 octane, minimum

EPA mileage: Pending

Trans: electronic direct control (we need to ask tomorrow what's up with "direct control")

DaveM

paisan

bout time.

-mike

ateixeira

I'm impressed. Shiftronic would make it about as complete as this generation is going to get.

-juice

dcm61

Baja T still has RWL tires. :-(

DaveM

ateixeira

Re-mount them facing in. $28 at Costco, problem solved.

-juice

dcm61

RWL's don't bother me but I know it "bothers" Bob.

Max boost 11.6 PSI. I guess that would be considered a medium pressure turbo?

"Drive by wire" throttle.

DaveM

ateixeira

I wonder about the throttle, I usually hate those. Mercedes' was not at all linear.

Then again, ever since the Phase II intro neither has Subaru's throttle.

-juice

paisan

who cares about RWL, I'm gonna put some meaty AT tires on that thing I want to see one out in NC with us wheeling. I did all the trails last time in TOD (4-hi essentially) and have roughly the same power as the turbo 4! That will make a nice off-road vehicle :0

-mike

ateixeira

I wonder if the springs are the same. If so, just get springs from iSR and you're at 10.4" clearance for just $360! Now you're talking.

-juice

lark6

Ridiculous that Baja Turbo ATs have VTD and Forester XT ATs don't! The little square wagon should be as sporty as the faux pickup!

Ed

edit: Silly me, I know why - not enough Legacy GTs selling - use up remaining inventory!

ateixeira

I said the same thing under "suggestions".

-juice

dcm61

The Baja Turbo pics at autoweek (click on Baja S/C!) show black with dark grey cladding.

DaveM

bat1161

So, where do you think they will price the Turbo?

Mark

ateixeira

Yeah, I just noticed that from Autoweek's pictures. I like it better, though, there is only a slight contrast, it's kinda subtle.

http://www.autoweek.com/specials/2003_newyork/

They called it the "Baja S/C". Sorry guys, wrong name! It's a turbo, anyway.

-juice

rsholland

• 2.5 turbo and direct-control auto-tranny from Forester XT, as expected.

• Raised suspension: A welcome surprise!

• Hill-Holder clutch (which Forester XT has), MIA.

• No mention of leather interior. Good!

• Large black Baja on media site appears to be monotone, whereas the images found on the AutoWeek site shows a dark gray cladding. Could the all-black version be a "Premium Package?" If so, there's no mention of it on the PDFs or press release.

• Roof antenna—YUK! You can forget about putting anything long on the roof rack! I hope that's not OnStar. There's no mention of OnStar in any of the material presented.

• The image on the media site appears to have a bed cover. Is that the current soft cover? Or is it a (new) hard cover?

• Towing's the same. No word on payload.

• 6-disk CD being standard is new—and good.

• AWP appears to be MIA—bad.

Bob

paisan

It's onstar bob.

That's the same anetenna on the outbacks now. It's soft so it won't effect roof stuff.

-mike

rsholland

It's not the same antenna. The OnStar antenna is short and stubby, not like this one. If OnStar were part of the package, I'm sure Subaru would be promoting it.

Bob

dcm61

Confirmed it at the show. No OnStar, so that is the antenna.

DaveM

dcm61

in the mini Baja Turbo brochure that I picked up at the show today that AT equipped Baja Turbo's not only include VTD (which we already knew), but they also include SPORTSHIFT. The Baja Turbo is very nicely equipped and it looks MUCH better with the dark grey cladding. One odd thing was that the one at the show had heated (leather) seats but not the rest of the AWP package (heated mirrors & wiper deicer).

DaveM

rsholland

See my comments over in "Future Models," for specifics.

I bet the '04 Baja will take off in terms of sales. Every change/upgrade is for the better. Adding an available turbo, as well as the other upgrades, will do wonders for sales, I'm sure.

Bob

wwxman

Unless you buy the turbo, the only "major" change is the addition of 1.1" ground clearance -hardly noticable, and of little utility to the average driver. Perhaps the color scheme will help, but I'm more convinced than ever that the bad Baja rap by subie enthusiasts was pure crap. The beds no bigger; the pass through no larger. Stick in a turbo and add 1.1" clearance and now its a great car, please. Sure it also has the improved AWD system, but who was complaining about this before regarding the Baja?

subearu

The SVX concept car (what now is the Baja) was well received by the public and Subaru enthusiasts. It had some additional features that didn't make it to production though. One was a larger switchback. The other was a supercharged H4 engine. The original Baja lacked both of these. Subaru has at least corrected the engine with the addition of the turbo.

-Brian

twrx

i think the turbo will help. You can't make it more truck like without a total redesign. So they made it a lot more fun. Hope it is true that it has leather and heated seats. Did not see that on PDF but all of those things with in dash CD moves it up scale enough for me. I think that was a problem with the original, it was upscale in some ways and cost cutting in others. (leather and power seat but no in dash changer or seat heaters?)Now they need to do a real stripper to get a model below $20k. Ditch the sunroof, alloy wheels, keyless and that should do it. Call that the Baja sport.

TWRX

rsholland

<< but I'm more convinced than ever that the bad Baja rap by subie enthusiasts was pure crap. The beds no bigger; the pass through no larger. Stick in a turbo and add 1.1" clearance and now its a great car, please. >>

I said these are improvements, and steps in the right direction. The Baja will now more likely appeal to a wider audience&#151;and it WILL sell more cars. Most people would think that's a good thing...

Bob

ateixeira

Actually, I beg to differ. See it in person, and the 1.1" just made it look beefier, somehow. I think I liked the colors better (black over gray, and dark gray over gray), too, so that influenced me, but I left with a far more positive opinion.

Also, getting in and out was easier. It is noticeably higher.

The brochure showed the two bed cover options.

A turbo with 235 lb-ft and Sport Shift plus VTD sounds might appealing to me. Big improvement from 166 lb-ft and the high initial prices that led to slow sales.

Sales have already picked up to about 1200 a month, right? I bet they hit 2000 with these improvements.

-juice

rsholland

SOA concentrated on visual appeal, as well as added power refinements. That's what I was hoping for this year. I don't expect to see any meaningful upgrades in payload, switchback enlargement, or towing until the next-generation model appears; and even then, they will probably be marginal improvements. But hey, these are all steps in the right direction.

Bottom line: If the response that was given to the new '04 Baja at the show is any indication, Subaru should sell a bunch this year. Virtually everyone I spoke to there liked what they saw.

Bob

ateixeira

The Subaru stand was crawling with people, and the Baja seemed to get as much attention as anything else on the floor. That's a good sign.

They picked a good location, right near one entrance.

-juice

wwxman

What are they? Now,if its a lockable hardtop, that would be important and a truly meaningful upgrade. Back to my point. Why will the extra 1.1" ground clearance make the Baja appeal to a wider audience? The CD changer, you could have upgraded to the 6-changer from day one. Beefier look? The Baja already looked "beefy" to most. (Perhaps the Black on dark gray influenced you.) Lots of attention? Let me tell you, my original silver is the hit of my parking deck -- with a large contingent of BMW/Porshe/Mercedes types. Let me say again, the Baja's poor sales were the direct result of a marketing fiasco -- targeting the wrong audience at the wrong price. Turbo? I doubt most people have in their mind buying a mini pickup for the turbo thrill. Most people will still buy the Baja for its car like qualities,utility and style -- these are largely unchanged. Where I do agree, the buzz and renewed advertising will get people into the showroom and will inevitably increase sales. Finally, just one more point about the extra ground clearance, its not something thats hard to acheive, even aftermarket. I would want to know the impact on rollover resitance and handling on hairpin turns. This could be another mistake on SOA's part. MOST people (not folks on these boards) buy subies because they do not want tradtional SUVS with high centers of gravity. The whole feel of the vehicle changes. 1.1" isn't all that much, but it WILL have some performance downside with little extra utility for most -- a typical car has 5-6" ground clearance. Finally, whtat is the cost going to be? If they stick with leather, I think your looking at the high 20's. They better change their advertising focus.

ateixeira

Like I said, it seems like almost nothing (1.1"?), but the effect is bigger than that. It looks beefier, less toy-like IMHO, plus it makes it easier to climb in and out. You don't sit down in it, you sort of slide into it.

People like high vantage points, too.

Some trucks have 12" of clearance stock, so it's still the most car-like. And now it has the engine to outrun every truck out there, so suddenly it's by far the sportiest crew cab out there, period.

The turbo is the ace in the hole, the one thing it has to stand out. People can still criticize its lack of utility, but the easy come-back is "have you driven one?"

Just my feeling on it.

-juice