Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Most popular vehicles
Popular New Cars
- New Acura MDX
- New Acura RDX
- New Audi Q5
- New BMW 3 Series
- New BMW X3
- New Buick Enclave
- New Cadillac Escalade
- New Chevrolet Equinox
- New Chrysler 300
- New Dodge Challenger
- New Ford Edge
- New Ford Escape
- New Ford Expedition
- New Ford Explorer
- New Ford F-150
- New Ford Focus
- New Ford Mustang
- New Honda Accord
- New Honda Civic
- New Honda CR-V
- New Honda Fit
- New Honda Odyssey
- New Honda Pilot
- New Hyundai Elantra
- New Hyundai Santa Fe
- New Hyundai Sonata
- New Hyundai Tucson
- New Jeep Compass
- New Jeep Grand Cherokee
- New Jeep Wrangler
- New Mazda 3
- New Mazda 6
- New Mazda CX-5
- New Nissan Altima
- New Nissan Maxima
- New Nissan Rogue
- New Porsche Cayenne
- New Ram 1500
- New Subaru Crosstrek
- New Subaru Forester
- New Subaru Impreza
- New Subaru Outback
- New Tesla Model S
- New Tesla Model X
- New Toyota 4Runner
- New Toyota Camry
- New Toyota Corolla
- New Toyota Highlander
- New Toyota Prius
- New Toyota RAV4
- New Toyota Sienna
- New Toyota Tacoma
- New Volkswagen Jetta
- New Volvo XC60
- New Volvo XC90
Popular Used Sedans
- Used BMW 5 Series
- Used Chevrolet Impala
- Used Chevrolet Malibu
- Used Chrysler 200
- Used Dodge Charger
- Used Ford Fusion
- Used Ford Taurus
- Used Honda Accord
- Used Honda Civic
- Used Hyundai Elantra
- Used Hyundai Sonata
- Used Tesla Model S
- Used Toyota Camry
- Used Toyota Corolla
- Used Volkswagen Jetta
Popular Used SUVs
- Used Acura MDX
- Used Acura RDX
- Used Ford Edge
- Used Ford Explorer
- Used Honda CR-V
- Used Honda Pilot
- Used Hyundai Santa Fe
- Used Jeep Compass
- Used Lincoln Navigator
- Used Mazda CX-5
- Used Nissan Rogue
- Used Subaru Crosstrek
- Used Subaru Forester
- Used Tesla Model X
- Used Volvo XC90
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
And the TMV thing, I know it varies by market and that the CR-V and Escape weren't equipped alike. I did add the options onto the Escape to make it similar. Anyway, it doesn't seem to matter, no one here is ready to dump their ride.
Nothing wrong with being in-tune to environmental issues. Seems like Ford is damned if they do, damned if they don't.
The new Mustang looks great to me. And I am definitely NOT a Mustang guy. Everyone can't have a PT Cruiser, or you're accused of following along. I like the fact that Ford is really trying with the Focus, it really is a decent car. I wouldn't buy one but, I think it hits it's mark.
Poor resale and poor quality plague all of the big3. Incentives won't help resale anytime soon. I think the first to make a huge leap in overall quality numbers will be GM. One of their top cars is basically a Corolla and the VUE is getting a Honda V6. I'm just waiting for the UAW to take credit for their increased reliability.
I would really like to like American cars. I did for awhile (I was seriously die hard big3 when my mom and dad were buying) but when I bought my own I opted for practicality. Maybe someday.
The new CRV looks like a much nicer vehicle than the one it replaced. I rode in a late '90s CRV, and it was like riding in a lunchbox. Small, buzzy, rickety. The only thing I dislike about the new CRV is the front fascia makes the vehicle resemble a dung beetle. A monotone paint job would dramatically improve its appearance, IMHO.
I think the quality/safety arguments are hilarious. Both vehicles are incredibly safe compared to most cars on the road today. Several months ago I had to do an emergency manuever in the Escape that I'm *positive* would have rolled a standard SUV. The responsiveness of the Escape easily bests most regular cars I've driven. The steering is actually bit sharper than my Maxima, if you can believe that!
I should have posted this first, but we did actually get into an accident in the Escape. Wife was pulling out into traffic (with me in the passenger seat), and got into the middle turn lane about the same time as a Ford Expedition(!) was merging into it at a fair rate of speed. It absolutely clobbered the front passenger corner of the car, but everything held up very well. No airbags went off, which was appropriate. I had a headache and bruised chest from the seatbelt, but was otherwise fine. Repairs were ~$3600, which was a LOT less than I was expecting!
To put my 2c in on LATCH, I'm fairly certain the Escape has the rear middle attachments.
I agree. I don't like the looks of the new CR-V in general. However, I have seen one or two black copies that made me look twice. The way the black bumpers and other miscellaneous moldings blended in made it seem more attractive to me. A lot of other lines and creases I find unsightly were hidden by the dark color too.
"I think the best way to keep a business strong is to keep the people with the most at stake at the top. Those people would be the Ford family. Granted being public, it's not really their company any more but, it's their heritage and their legacy."
I'd also like to add that this is not the first time the company has been in trouble financially. It happened once or twice before while non-Ford's were at the helm. Guess who came to the rescue each and every time.
Why they keep making outsiders CEO's from time to time will always be a mystery though.
Actually, Henry himself was guilty of almost running the company into the ground back in the gold old days. He refused to update the Model T to compete with the other big boys and it almost killed the company. Luckily Edsel (his son) was there to knock some sense into him. Thus the Model A was born. And the people rejoiced.
Sorry if I bored all of you with my little history lesson.
Nor did my '01 CR-V. Or my '02 CR-V, for that matter. So, my 2 to your 1 means the V is *twice* as good as the Escape, right? ;->
The new CRV looks like a much nicer vehicle than the one it replaced. I rode in a late '90s CRV, and it was like riding in a lunchbox. Small, buzzy, rickety. The only thing I dislike about the new CRV is the front fascia makes the vehicle resemble a dung beetle. A monotone paint job would dramatically improve its appearance, IMHO.
The second generation V is definitely a nicer ride in all ways than the first generation (though I found my '01 to be underpowered but not rickety). And if you get it in black, there's your monotone paint job! :-) I have to say the Escape is nice looking. I don't like swoopy curvy SUVs, I like the utilitarian boxy look of the Escape and Explorer.
I think the quality/safety arguments are hilarious. Both vehicles are incredibly safe compared to most cars on the road today
I have to disagree with these based on the center rear position alone. Ford's lack of a shoulder belt in that position - the only way I'll let any of my loved ones ride in a car - is a serious flaw IMHO.
To put my 2c in on LATCH, I'm fairly certain the Escape has the rear middle attachments.
I finally looked it up myself on the Ford website, and it does not. Outboard only, like most vehicles (including the V). Though as pointed out earlier, Ford allows you to use those outside anchors for the center position as long as the carseat maker allows it as well.
Well, wave next time, and maybe I'll wave back. ;-)
The way the black bumpers and other miscellaneous moldings blended in made it seem more attractive to me. A lot of other lines and creases I find unsightly were hidden by the dark color too.
It *is* a little on the busy side in any color other than black. I loved the look of the first generation, but when I'm inside, I'm much happer with my '02.
Too bad people are such jerks.
But, the P5 is black. And I don't mind the walk : ) Man I love that car.
I really like the silver CR-V too. But after 9 years of silver we decided to let it go.
And remove a hand from the steering wheel? Talk about your safety concerns!
And remove a hand from the steering wheel? Talk about your safety concerns!
Oh, I'll pull over safely before I wave, and will expect you to do the same. :-D
I'd say if you have 3 kids + spouse, you've outgrown these vehicles.
Actually, I have a funny story about that. My wife's friend fell in love with our Escape, and bought one of her own. At the time, they had one toddler so that was fine; they would have one more child, and stop after that. The Escape would be a decent family vehicle for several years. However (and you see where this is going) when pregnant with the 2nd, they went to the doctor who informed them they were having twins. D'oh. Anyone want to buy a barely-1-YO Escape? They're now looking at minivans.
FWIW, my Maxima has three rear shoulder-belts, and I don't really consider it that huge of a safety benefit. Hopefully the CRV's rear bench is a true bench, and not an uncomfortable hump like most cars' rear seats are nowadays.
re: the cladding, I cannot tell you how many potential dings/scratches have been saved due to this stuff. And that is just from my clumsiness with junk in the garage, who knows what parking lot rash would have added!
I think my main distaste for the CRV's fascia isn't so much the cladding itself, it's the two "extensions" that head north of the bumper along the front grille. This is what gives it the "dung beetle" appearance (just so you don't get the wrong idea, I'm not saying 'dung' in a derogatory fashion, more referring to the look of the bug). It just looks bizarre. I haven't seen a black "new style" CRV, but it does sound pretty sharp. The Escape Limiteds are monotone, and the look is much better, IMO.
The nastiest looking SUV in the CRV/Escape class has got to be the Sante Fe. It looks like a SUV out of a cartoon. The 2nd worst is the RAV4, which if there ever were a "Barbie SUV" that would be it. All it needs is pink paint and turqoise cladding, and you have the most effeminate vehicle ever produced.
I have a question about this. As I was driving to work today in our Civic I realized that the lap portion of the front seat belt is visibly attached directly to the frame. I would imagine the CR-V, as well as 99% of all vehicles, is the same way.
How can something that doesn't move at all to begin with get pretensioned? I understand how the pretension system in the shoulder belts work (both Escape and CR-V), but the belt pretensioner has me confused." - Baggs
I checked for a schematic of the design, but couldn't find one. The pretentioner is built into the buckle, not in the anchoring point. This is how the press kit describes it.
"Typically, a pre-tensioner has been used to pull the shoulder belt tightly in the event of a collision. On the 2002 CR-V, in addition to the shoulder belt pre-tensioner, Honda engineers added an inner buckle lap belt pre-tensioner for both front seats. Accordingly, in an accident, both the shoulder portion and the lap portion of the belt are pulled tightly, firmly securing the occupant in the seat."
Odie
But I really wanted to ask about your accident. Was the Expedition driver cited? My understanding is that the center lane is a "left turn lane" NOT a "merging lane" (although I must confess that I have resorted to that a couple times when traffic was never going to clear simultaneously in both directions).
Anyway, misuse of the center lane is a pet peeve of mine (and, yes, off-topic)
-james
LOL! True, though I *have* fit three carseats into my V. But I only have one child and that center belt is still crucial to me. The center is the safest position in the car, so that's where I want my daughter to sit. So there's gotta be a shoulder belt there. Case closed.
Also, even those of us with small families have friends and relatives who we'd like to ride safely in our cars on occasion.
FWIW, my Maxima has three rear shoulder-belts, and I don't really consider it that huge of a safety benefit.
Because you never need all three positions, or because you have no problem using a lap belt?
Hopefully the CRV's rear bench is a true bench, and not an uncomfortable hump like most cars' rear seats are nowadays.
Yes, it is a true bench seat. Though, since she'll be using a harnessed seat and/or belt positioning booster for many years, the comfort of the actual seat itself isn't really an issue. She'll probably *never* sit on the actual seat! :-)
The 2nd worst is the RAV4, which if there ever were a "Barbie SUV" that would be it. All it needs is pink paint and turqoise cladding, and you have the most effeminate vehicle ever produced.
Yes, I've always thought it looked like it was made by Mattell. :-P
I think the Element really should have rear sliders and no center post (B pillar? - never can remember). That'd be killer (or suicidal, lol).
Steve, Host
Whenever we talk sales volume, the point is always made that Ford has far more sales outlets than Honda. There is also the point that the Escape competes with the Tribute, which begets the notion that Mazda adds even more dealerships to the advantage that Ford already enjoys. I just found some numbers for the comparison. These are the number of US dealerships for each brand.
Ford - 4,477
Honda - 956
Mazda - 800
Based on sheer opportunities for purchase, the Escape should be selling about 4.7 units for every unit of the CR-V. If we combined Escape and Tribute sales, the rate grows to 5.5 units for every CR-V sold.
Just a little perspective.
Then there's the Taurus wagon which has almost as much cargo room as the Explorer but with added benefits like better fuel mileage that even icvci would like. Don't forget about the Focus wagon either. It matches up with these small utes very well, and sells reasonably well too (read, takes Escape sales away). To make things even more interesting, both can be had with traction control which almost eliminates the benefit of AWD/4WD and both cost much less when fully loaded.
There are more, but I think you get the picture.
I don't buy that the Taurus wagon, Ranger, or Focus wagon represent anything resembling direct competition. Are't you the one who thinks that the Forester doesn't belong in the mini-ute class? When we start stretching that far from the class, the comparison loses all meaning.
This logic of yours is flawed in many ways. I'll point out just 3, as I'm sure there are more.
a. Honda has dealerships in most large and midsized cities which means the vast majority of the population has equal or similar access to both Honda and Ford dealers. The fact that a person might have the choice of 4 Ford dealerships to buy and Escape from vs 1 Honda dealership to buy a CRV doesn't mean that person is going to buy 4 Escapes.
b. If Honda (or Ford) chose to, they could both increase production capacity if there was demand to do so. It is not the number of dealerships or production capacity holding back sales for either vehicle. Each is producing numbers of vehicles compatible to what the demand is.
c. Dealerships aren't there to sell just 1 model of a vehicle.
Ford does offer many more model of vehicles than Honda does. The combined sales of all of these models (not just SUVs) is well over double number of vehicles (all models) that Honda sells in the USA. Heck, in a given year there are about as many F-series trucks + Explorers sold than all Honda models combined.
The notion of yours that simply because Ford has more dealerships, they should automatically be selling more of a particular model vehicle than Honda is wrong.
Ford offers more vehicles than Honda.. Honda Accord, CRV, Element, Odyy, Civic, Pilot vs the Ford Taurus, F150/250/350, Superduties, Expedition, Excursion, Explorer, Escape, Focus, Sport Trac, Ranger, Windstar, Thunderbird... Did I miss any??
Been a while since I have been back here. I was just briefly reading through the 45 posts and noticed the "YOu only buy Ford because they are American" stigma popping up again. Well, yes. I will freely admit it. I have vowed never, ever to buy another vehicle not built here in the Great country we live in. Notice I said "built here in the country we live in. NOT Ford, or Chevy.. In fact I own an Accord made in Ohio. With unemployment running high, job losses at an all time high. We are all connected here folks.. I don't have a job.. eventually it will affect you...
Anyhoo... My Escape is wonderful, runs like the day I bought it..
Yes, I am the one who doesn't think the Forester belongs in the class. I'm not talking about direct competition within a class though. Competition, direct or not, on the same lot within the same brand is the name of the game here. The Taurus wagon, Focus wagon, Ranger (super cab), and Sport Trac can all serve the same purpose as the Escape and can be bought for less money in most cases. People will see this when they are on the lot. Some will change their minds about wanting that shiny new Escape.
For example, if someone goes to a Ford lot to buy a utility vehicle they may drive out in a Ranger simply because they can buy one right now for close to $10,000 less than a loaded Escape. When the monthly payment is cut in half people tend to settle for a little less.
One obvious reason the Taurus and Focus are direct competitors is that they are more efficient. Apparently that matters to a lot of people. Think about it. I'm sure you can come up with some more too.
Your Pilot example is kind of unique in a way. We can now see that the Pilot stole sales from the CR-V because it was introduced several years later. We don't know how much sales of the Explorer and Expedition hurt the Escape because they've been around longer. I can't think of any other manufacturer who released the bigger after the smaller either. For all we know Ford could be selling 500,000 Escape's right now if the Explorer ceased to exist.
crvgirl: You're actually right on both counts. The lack of a 3 pt belt in the middle rear isn't a big deal to me because it will probably never be used, and I do think a lap belt is sufficient for that seat. I feel a bigger safety concern is the lack of head support in a lot of rear seats. I don't know about the CRV, but the Escape does have actual head rests in the back. One item that confuses me is if your child is still in a seat, why is the full belt so important to you? You're only using the lap belt anyway, unless you're using LATCH.
scape2: I agree with supporting my country, and do buy "Made in USA" items when the competing item is close in price and the quality is there. I bought my Maxima knowing full well it is made in Japan with mostly Japanese components, only because that car has no domestic equivalent. The Cadillac CTS is the closest, but it is much more expensive(not anymore with the 04 Maxes, I'm talking about my 03), RWD, and underpowered. I've bought tons of American cars in the past, and I was tired of settling (which in turn caused me to trade cars every couple years, costing obscene amounts of money). I finally have the car I want, and while I wish it was produced by an American company, maybe once the big 3 start focusing on cars again they'll produce something that will light my fire.
The whole "who sells more" argument for CRV vs Escape is nonsense. I think both are great vehicles, but it's common sense the Escape would sell more. Aston Martin only sells a few hundred vehicles a year in the US, they must just be churning out crap.
On a completely unrelated note, I happen to think the Focus is a great car for the money. I've rented them a few times on business trips, and the handling is unbelieveable for an economy car. It nearly matches the '96 Jetta I had as far as being fun to drive.
I agree, your salesforce strength helps determine how well what you put out there will sell, that is UNLESS it is really crap (LOL) look at some of the stuff that has failed over at GM-- Aztec. GM is by far the biggest car company but they can't give those things away.
I do not realistically expect Ford to sell 4 times the number of CR-Vs. There are other market pressures that affect sales. However, that does not change the fact that Ford's dominance in retail outlets is a huge advantage. Take a look at how many Tributes are sold versus Escapes. Sable vs Taurus. Navajo vs Explorer Sport...
A while back someone posted a survey (I think it was you) which reported the top ten reasons why someone selected a particular vehicle. At the time, you claimed that Ford enjoyed about 7 of those 10. The number of dealerships is just another one of those advantages.
If the Escape is a better vehicle, Ford has greater sales resources, and the Escape shares a host of other advantages (incentives, domestic industry ties, etc.), why doesn't it crush the sales of the CR-V?
Hint: Only one of those three is in debate.
Way back in the beginning of this thread, you claimed that the CR-V would never outsell the Escape, specifically because the CR-V lacked a V6. The very next day, the CR-V surpassed the Escape's monthly sales total.
The sales debate is more about which of these vehicles is more appealing, or more popular. If all other things were equal, we'd expect the more appealing vehicle to sell more quantities (provided they are in the same class).
However, all things are not the same. Ford has clear advantages which should result in far greater sales. What we see here is the little guy taking on the big guy and earning pretty much the same market share. That's an impressive feat for a company as small as Honda.
Maybe I misunderstand what you mean by "sufficient." If you think a lapbelt is sufficient protection for any passenger, you are unfortunately mistaken. A lapbelt alone is only fit for installing a carseat. It's simply not safe for an adult or child to ride in a lapbelt alone. And yes, you're right, headrests are an issue as well. The CR-V has them in all seating positions. I don't know if the Escape does or not.
The middle belt is an issue for me because, while my daughter is in a harnessed seat now (installed with the seatbelt), at some point she will use a belt-positioning booster. A shoulder belt is required for that. The center rear is the safest position in the car, and I want to keep her there. And beyond that, we often carry other passengers in the car. If I only had a lapbelt in that seat, I wouldn't let anyone use it, so I would basically have a 4-seat vehicle. Why would I want the safest position in the car to be useless to anyone who isn't in a harnessed carseat?
You can read more about the dangers of lapbelts at http://www.cpsafety.com/articles/lapbelts.aspx . It's more geared toward child passengers, but the information is relevant for adults as well.
Escape: 36,058
CRV: 33,007
That's one nice thing about the CR-V - since the back seat is 60/40, when you install a carseat in the center, one passenger can sit on the 40 side (behind the driver) and have plenty of room. I sit there very comfortably even on loooooong (i.e., hundreds of miles) trips. An adult can sit on the other side for short trips, but it's pretty cramped. I've been able to put three seats back there as well (one Britax Roundabout and two Graco combination boosters). It's a bit of a squeeze, but it can be done.
"If the Escape is a better vehicle, Ford has greater sales resources, and the Escape shares a host of other advantages (incentives, domestic industry ties, etc.), why doesn't it crush the sales of the CR-V?"
a. I claim the Escape and CRV nearly equal vehicles. That has always been my claim. Both are good..
b. You assertion of Fords 'greater sales resources' (than Honda) is not correct. As I stated before there is a Honda dealership in every city.. So everyone has an equal opportunity to buy a CRV or Escape..
c. sales incentives. First someone will claim that the CRV is the same price as the Escape and that the CRV has a higher resale value (which KBB disputes), then they'll claim the Escape is only selling because it's cheaper.. (which if true, means with the Escape you're getting closer to what you paid for it when you sell it).
My experience is that a person can get an equally equiped Escape for much less $$ than the CRV. I also do agree that this does help boost Fords sales numbers, as the Escape is a better value,(same vehilce as CRV for less money)
None of the above would support the notion that Ford Escape should be 'crushing' the CRV in sales..
Your other quote:
"Actually, sales per dealership is the way the industry measures success. It's kinda like the way retail stores measure profits per square foot."
is something I was not aware of.
However as I stated in my previous post, Ford overall sells many many more vehilces than Honda does, so there is enough demand for Ford products to support the extra dealerships. When you start talking about 'Escapes' specifically, it makes sense that most Ford dealerships will sell less Escapes than most Honda dealerships, because there are more Ford dealerships available to a single buyer than Honda.
For example: in an area there are 4 Ford dealerships and 1 Honda dealership that are all a resonable distance from each other, (less than 60 miles apart for example)
Ford dealership1 sells an Escape
Ford dealership2 sells an F150
Ford dealership3 sells an F150
Ford dealership4 sells an Explorer
Honda dealership sells a CRV.
In that area, Ford is selling the same number of Esscapes as Honda is CRV's. Yet all of the dealerships are getting similar sales numbers and are able to stay in business and have similar efficiency ratings (sales/dealership).
So in affect, Ford is 'crushing' Honda in terms of total vehicle sales, thus supporting the many dealerships.
I could have someone squeeze next to the infant seat when I had it in the middle, but the Britax Husky booster we got takes up one side and part of the middle.
I have an infant on the way and there is no way I would be able to get the infant carrier base in the spot directly next to the booster without them pressing on each other. They are just too big.
I think the notion of production numbers was brought up before too. Ford/Mazda don't produce many more (if any more at all) copies of the twins than Honda does of the CR-V. We found these numbers a long time ago and posted them here if anyone cares to search back for them.
Anyway, if Ford/Mazda did produce more they'd probably be offering $2000-$3000 rebates on them right now which would boost sales way past those of the CR-V. For some reason or another they've decided to keep this one at the level of the competition which makes it sort of unique for the brand.
The Liberty, the current sales champ, has a lot to do with the sales of these two as well. I would guess that a lot of current Liberty owners would be Escape owners had the Jeep never come to market. Simply because of the "buy American" thing. I doubt they'd turn to the Tracker or Sportage to keep the off-road ability of the Jeep.
The center seat is not ~exactly~ in the center. The left seat takes up 40% of the bench (as opposed to the 33% it would take if the seats were all of equal size). The center and right seat share the remaining 60%. So the center seat is shifted slighly to the right.
I could have someone squeeze next to the infant seat when I had it in the middle, but the Britax Husky booster we got takes up one side and part of the middle.
Yes, the Husky is more like a seat-and-a-half, isn't it? I know an adult could sit comfortably next to a center-installed infant seat, but probably not next to a center-installed Husky. I wonder if you could install it on the 40% side of the CR-V and still install an infant seat in the middle. Maybe you should go try this at a Honda dealership and report back to us - I'd love to know! ;->
Unfortunately, even though the Taurus is much more aerodynamic than the CR-V, EPA numbers are almost identical to the Taurus. And of course, according to the EPA, the CR-V has a cleaner burning engine.
Plus, you get AWD with either the Escape or the CR-V.
Why would anyone buy a Taurus wagon? Seems Ford is asking itself the same question.
After re-reading your post you compared it to the Explorer, not the Escape. Sorry. The wagon does have 9 CU. FT. more max cargo area than the CR-V. And 16 more CU. FT. than the Escape. However, the Explorer has 7 CU. FT more than the Taurus. Not really much of a comparo. I would say they're (Explorer - Taurus) not cross-shopped any more than a S2000 and a Civic.
If added dealers don't equal added sales, why would Ford bother?
I just don't buy the "Ford has more dealerships, it should be selling 4x more Escapes" reasoning. The fact is.. Honda has dealerships in every major city and then some. In my mid-size town I have 7 Honda dealerships and 12 Ford dealerships all within about a 100 mile radius. Honda has every bit of the ability to sell to the masses just as Ford does. Another thing you must also take into account is, some Ford dealerships are more market oriented. For example: There is a Ford dealership in Sandy, Oregon. They are closer to the Cascade range and in a rural area. They carry more trucks like Rangers, F-series, Expeditions, Excursions, Superduties than lets say, Taurus or Focus or Escapes that are more for your city dwellers..
As far as pricing of the CRV and Escape. CRV just plain costs more than a like equipped Escape. And, you get more choices with the Escape in trim levels you want.
In todays paper they are asking almost $19,000 dollars for the Element!! Yeeeeouch!! Right beside it is an Escape V6 XLT 4WD for about $300 more.. Want proof? Give me your e-mail address and I will mail you the dealership, VIN#'s and a phone #.
Yes, most everyone has access to a single Honda dealer. But for every Honda dealer, there are four or five Ford dealers. That makes Fords more visible, more convenient, and provides more opportunities for sales. If you have a beef with the local Honda retailer, you may have to travel to find another. Not so with Ford.
I never questioned whether or not Ford was financially justified in having these dealers. Not sure why you bring it up?
How do you figure? It falls right in the middle of the two meaning it would be cross shopped with both. I even have a neighbor who traded in his 99 Explorer for a 2002 Taurus wagon just for the better fuel mileage.
AWD/4WD becomes a lot less appealing too when the one without it costs $10,000 less but has the same amount of space and saves you money at the pump.
The Taurus is a dog. The other cars in it's class eat it for an afternoon snack.
He sold his Explorer for a wagon? NICE! You mean he didn't need to tow everything AND drive over everything? It's cool when people re-think their needs.
My neighbor has a new CR-V. I should try it in his and see. I have my doubts though. My wife has an Expedition and there is not much room between the seats when they are next to each other, although they do fit.
I am not sure when they got so huge. Have to say, the kids seats look more comfy than the adult seats nowadays.
He's a plumber and has many other trucks at his disposal for that sort of thing. He did use the Explorer for towing several things though. Not on a daily basis, but still, he didn't really need it.
Interior and exterior appearance qualify as "needs" too. Not everyone is as fond of Japanese styling as others are.
Exactly. The left side is completely independent of the rest of the bench - it can recline, fold, and even move forward or backward on its own.
Have to say, the kids seats look more comfy than the adult seats nowadays.
Especially the Husky - it looks like a big plush recliner, doesn't it? :-)
I have to say, I just took the seat out of my wife's car to pick up some furniture and put it back in. I am not sure the latch system is any easier than the regular belt to install. I think the latch feels snugger without the tether attached but they seem equally snug once you ratchet up the tether.
Who is it that has the built-in seat now in their vans? That sounds like a pretty good idea, depending on the seat quality.
The new XC90 has one as well and it's pretty cool. My wife and I played with it at the car show. It (the whole section of the rear bench) slides forward so people in the front seat can interact with the child without having to remove their seat belt, and doubles as a booster seat when the kid gets older. Pretty slick if you ask me.
I think the Caratownandcountravan's have one as an option too. However, the one's I've seen in those vans looked pretty cheap.
Steve, Host