Joe, How does the allocation work? Is it based on total annual volume through to customers so they are trying to move the last of the current units, or is it some specific time frame? Interested since I had difficulty getting info when I bought my Vette in '00 until I found some on the internet willing to explain that I got a specific allocation they had in the build que at the plant. Any additional input would be helpful for those looking at Vette's in the future.
I have developed a problem with shifting my 6-speed transmission. Sometimes when upshifting into 5th, I accidentally overshoot into Reverse causing gear grinding (it doesn't actually go into reverse). I had a 1991 Vette coupe with 6-speed, and there was a mechanical lockout to prevent such a thing. Several other persons have driven my car and had the same experience. My local Chevy dealer has road tested it twice and said the transmission is normal. I am sure it is not. Question: has anyone had similar experience? Is there a fix?
I'm going to buy my first corvette for the 40th B'day and I'm looking to make a smart decision and not jump. I'm looking for a 2003 convertible, can anyone pass along some info on their purchase or who is a good dealer to work with.
using CorvetteForum.com and couldn't be happier. Go to the C5 Buy/Sell forum and read it for a week or more. By then most of the supporting dealers should have updated their available new and used info and you should see some discussion of others who are using those sources. CorvetteActionCenter.com also seems to have some similar info and some dealers cover both sites as well. Given how difficult I found local dealers I can't tell you how nice it was to cut a deal after only 2 emails and get straight answers as well. The allocation thing is a much bigger deal than it seems when your experience is only with other vehicles. One salesman locally sold me a car, taking a deposit, but at the price the salesman gave me, his marketing manager wouldn't give him a factory allocation until they had all their showroom models in, so I waited 2 months with no factory slot in sight (some dealers only get 1 a month or less, some a lot more). Then I used the internet to get delivery in 3 months with a confirmed factory build week and estimate of delivery with a better price. Much easier if you want what they have in stock and right now there seems to be plenty in stock in some areas. Good Luck.
Alpine... too bad about your experience with the Corvette. Mine is the polar opposite. After 15 months and 15,000 miles, almost, it runs great, feels great and looks even better. Glad I didn't get the BSMs. I've also met some nice local and not so local Vette owners who have been very helpful about things beyond daily driving. I've tried one autocross and did respectable considering it was a single attempt. There is a lifestyle element if you want to go that route, which may be true of other cars but hard to see without 50 years of model history and what history. The Vette was not my dream car. As my neighbor who recently got an M3 said after we had both been in the other car a few times, his was a coupe/sedan and fit his needs, and mine was sportscar/coupe and was fun. But he still has a child seat to go in the back and ours is out of college, so it's time for fun.
I understand the fun factor. But when I drive a BMW it feels way more connected, precision, and alot more fun to drive, for me. It feels amazing. The Vette to me feels like I have to push the accelerator down further to make anything happen. Even then the poor thing sounds like the motor is working too hard and noisy relative to the MPH. So far I have a door rattle that is pretty loud right next to my left ear. I almost bent my hood trying to close it after checking oil. It felt like tinfoil and the springs were too tight and off balance. I think GM-Chevy is more concerned with putting these cars together at light speed with the cheapest stuff just to get them out and make a ton of money relying on the loyalty of Vette fans. I think Vette fans will buy the new Vette even if it was made of cardboard. The car looks great, but I don't think it will hold up in the long run, while trying to have fun with it. That's cool that you're happy with yours, to each his own, I just can't believe the lack of quality control with GM compared to the import cars costing the same amount. I guess I'm in love with the quality and precision from the imports, especially the feel of a BMW.
Well....now for some reason, your comments are sticking out at me....you have painted a picture of your Corvette that I have yet to EVER hear about from other Corvette owners.
The car is not perfect, and I'll be the first to admit that, but for all the problems and ailments you have, I find them a little hard to believe. I'm not saying you're a liar, but I'm finding it hard to believe that you are having all of these problems at once to the degree you state.
If your driver's side door is rattling to that degree....what did the dealer say when you brought it in to them for repair? You did bring it to the dealer, right?
Regarding closing the hood....how did you attempt to close it in order to receive the feeling that you almost bent the hood? If you push down on the corner of any hood, you're going to come close to bending it. (I won't even mention what happens to the hoods of the earlier generation Vipers.
You state: "The Vette to me feels like I have to push the accelerator down further to make anything happen. Even then the poor thing sounds like the motor is working too hard and noisy relative to the MPH". Have you brought the car in to the dealer to have them run a diagnostic check-up on it? In comparing the performance numbers of a Corvette to a BMW, it would stand to reason that you should be feeling something greater in terms of performance from the Vette than you would the BMW. In terms of sound, the Corvette is high performance sports car. The BMW is more a 4-seat luxo-cruiser meant to instill driving pleasure while wrapping the occupants in a cocoon of luxury and cushioning. Hence - the higher curb weight of a BMW over a Corvette.
If you feel that the performance of your Corvette is inherent to all C5s rather than the possibility that just maybe, something might be wrong with *your* Corvette, then what were your thoughts after you test drove a Corvette prior to buying one?? Have you gone to a dealer and test driven other Corvettes to see how they compare to yours?
I'm sorry if I sound rude here, but in my own opinion, I think your harsh criticism of Corvettes is slightly flawed based upon what you have written above. By comparing the BMW to the Corvette, you are comparing apples to oranges. They are two completely different cars built for different purposes.
I also think a more apples to apples comparison would be with the BMW Z-8 two seater and C-5 variants such as Z06, Coupe, Convertible Corvettes. The M-3 is clearly a sports sedan and the C-5 is clearly a sports car.
I just bought a 1987 Corvette and I have no idea how to remove the targa top. Please somebody help me, the spring is approaching and I need to take my top off!!! Thanks
I e-mailed donnajean and suggested a website where you can order the owner's manual for this car for $20. Hopefully GM goes into detail about the top removal in that book.
Hope the top comes off without anything getting pinched ..... watch those fingers.
Release left and right front levers. Pull down on rear lever and reverse to reinstall. Lift out with two people unless you can stand outside and reach to the middle of the car and lift top with one arm and not lose control as you lift, not super easy to do.
Major point, there are many stories about those that did latch all three on reinstall and the top seems to come off due to air pressure about 50mph or so, they are all sad to hear, so be careful.
I once owned an 89'Vette. Here's how to remove your top. 1. Look in your armrest console, there should be a little ratchet wrench that has "Corvette" written on it. It is black, about 4" long and is held in place by a metal clip. 2. If it isn't there, call and ask the previous owner or search the internet for it, I have no idea where to get one at this moment. Ok, now if you have the wrench, 1. Make sure both door windows are down and the rear hatch is open. 2. Flip down your drivers side sun visor, then swing it to the left. You will now see the bolts that hold the top on. These bolts will stay in place after you loosen them, so don't try to take them out. There is one underneath each sun visor. Now there are 2 other bolts to unscrew, they are in the back corners of the top behind your head. Loosen and remove both, These COME OUT and can be placed in your console or pocket or whatever. 3. Lift the front of the top out first, then slide it out. 4. Open the rear hatch window and place the top inside WITH THE FLAT END FIRST, or in other words 180 degress from how it was sitting on the car. There are little sockets that the flat end slides in. Then, to lock it in place, pull back the spring lever right in front of you, and lock in the front socket in the center of the top. I hope this helps and wasn't too confusing, it's easier done than said :O), Good luck, ALP.
Glad I was lucky enough to get a C5. Don't know why in my mind I read that as a 97 instead of a C4 '87 but from the sounds of it, they simplified things a lot. Except for that nasty surprise when someone forgets to flip all three levers. Absolutely great day with light broken clouds and lots of sun for a local drive with the top out. Enjoy your Vette's and Go Raider's.
Ruking1, don't brag, we would all love to have a Z06. At least when we need a top .
Would any of you know of a rack-and-pinion steering upgrade for a C3? I have a perfectly stock-looking (sneaky grin) '73 with significant (but subtle) performance upgrades and the only mechanical system in the car that hasn't been restored, replaced, or tweaked is the steering. I've checked Eckler's, ZIP, Mid-America, etc. and come up empty.
Alpine is not a Corvette Guy (with apologies to the Corvette Ladies). Corvettes, and American cars in general, have not always been for everyone, which is perfectly proven by the sales success of the Honda Accord and the Toyota Camry. A lot of people simply have no tolerance for the occasional mis-aligned panel, or improperly-formed window seal, or that peculiar dashboard rattle that comes on between 35 and 41 mph. And you can preach all the history and racing legacy you want. It's just not their thing.
The difference between a light, nimble, high-revving, superbly crafted German road machine vs. a heavy, wide, snarling, mass-produced, modern-day muscle car just emphasizes how different things are for different folks.
My '73 is loud, poorly assembled, handles terribly (by today's standards), squeaks, rattles, leaks, and shakes. It's also blisteringly fast and wonderfully terrifying to drive. I absolutely love it!
While our Corvettes are still running strong decades from now, I wonder where all those Hondas and BMWs will be?
I am a "Corvette" guy. I'm also a "BMW guy", "Suzuki GSXR 1000 guy", "Ford 5.0 Mustang guy", and someday a "Lamborghini guy". I like all kinds of machines. Each one has it's ups and downs. I've owned several Vettes in the past and loved them all. I just thought that after spending 47k on the new C5, It would have a little more quality materials and workmanship for that much money. Don't get me wrong, I love the performance, handling, cargo space, stereo, and most of all the looks of the car. It definitely is the most bang for the buck. I was just a little frustrated at a few minor things that are really not a big deal and I came off sounding angry, sorry. I will keep the car and enjoy it on nice days. I'm dying to see what the C6 will look like. I hope it doesn't come off looking like the common jellybean shapes, or round edges with sharp flat wheel wells like some of the concept cars that all look the same. ALP :-)
The best starting point is either www.corvetteactioncenter.com or www.corvetteforum.com. Both sites have listings of dealers that advertise Corvettes for less than MSRP. Find a couple of dealers that are within reasonable distance of your location and contact them.
After you find a dealer that you are comfortable working with, you may have to wait for a produciton slot to get your car scheduled for production. Depeding on which options you want (such as 3.15 performance axle), you may have to wait quite a while for a production slot to become available. The 3.15 performance axle affects the Corporate Average Fuel Economy calculation, so GM puts the option on a very tigh allocation. I placed my order the last week of December, 2002 and only last week was confirmed for a February 17th build date (and I wanted the 3.15 performance rear axle....)
If you have the time, I would recommend adding the Museum Delivery option. I did it and it was a great experience and had a wonderful drive home to San Diego. If you do the Mueseum delivery then you can shop the whole country for your best deal. If you place your order soon, you might be able to pick it up during the C5 birthday bash celebration at the Museum. Lots of seminars and fun events. It is April 24 – 27.
I have a 2002 Conv. with 3,500 miles. Something is discharging the battery. If I don't start the care every week, the battery goes dead. I checked to make sure all lights turn off. Dealer says when they hooked it up all readings checked o.k. Has anyone has similar problems.
Howdy LeJomp, Your 2003 Corvette front to rear weight distribution is 51/49 per my wife's now 4 broken bathroom scales.
If you have a local Corvette Club meeting in your area that serves good pizza you should go (and invite your good buddy along). Best regards, JQ Public
Am looking at buying a 99 Coupe with approx 39k miles on it....have driven it a couple of days and have a few questions....
1) There is an annoying whine that seems to be electrical related...when the ignition is on (but not the engine) is is not there....when the engine is on it is quite obvious. Events such as the a/c kicking on or the turn signals are registered in the whine....at speed you can not hear it...only at idle....any ideas? It is not in the radio....perhaps a flow thru vent motor?
2) There seems to be a lot of play in the seat backs (power leather seats both sides)...is this normal?
3) How accurate is the tire pressure system?
4) The car has the performance handling package...how much does this effect the day in and day out ride?
It seems that your #'s one and two are candidates for a dealer's care or a shop that you trust. There is a certain amount of seat back play that is quite normal, due to the fact they had to allow for some seatback angle motion room, because of the tight and close fit of the seat when it is operated to the full rearward position. You may want to ask the dealer to look up any TSB's on your concern (technical service bulletin)
#3 The tire pressure sensor system is very accurate. Since my Z06 does not come with this option, I can not comment on the livability. My tire guys tell me that during tire change procedures that the presence of sensors is a REAL PITA. However, if you take measurements with three different "accurate" or digital air pressure instruments you will in all likelihood get three separate (but close) answers. The other thing that you may want to watch for is that while the manual calls for 30 psi cold, ambient temperature change of temperature of 10 degrees (plus or minus) causes app 1# of psi change. Taking pressure readings during or just after operating temperatures usually adds app 3 to 4 #'s of psi.
4. Chances are at 39k and if the previous owner/owners didnt beat the car to death that the Z-51 (performance package) is still very good. If you are a moderate driver, the shops estimate that the shocks usually go to 100k with not much effort. The ride as you can imagine is a little more tight and stiffer and compliant. Mine comes standard with the Z-51 and I would not get a Vette any other way.
The whine you may be hearing are the fuel pumps, but this was more of a problem on the '97s than it was on the 99. The seat rocking problem (if it truly is a rocking motion) is covered under a TSB:
After reading numerous car magazines' comparisons of the Z06 vs. Porsches, NSXs, M3s, etc. I have a question:
How does the cheapest car (Z06) with the largest engine (Z06), most horsepower and torque (Z06), best acceleration times (Z06), also get the best gas mileage??? Plus the Z06 does it with the old technology pushrod engine. (The others have twin turbos, 4 valves / cylinder, Dual OverHead Cam etc,)
I thought Porsche, Acura, BMW, etc were the technology leaders?
You have to like those apples,eh? (well, if you don't, at least I do)
Almost all of the above mentioned cars use old technology frame and body technology. The Z06 uses hydro formed steel and aluminum cross frames and steel frame weighs 400#'s and of course uses STP or a composite type of fiberglass. This is the weight side of the power to weight equation. As you can see the examples weigh anywhere from 300-600#'s more than the Z06 @3115 #'s.
The Z06 engine is very light and also well worked over from a technology point of view. It produces anywhere from 385-405 hp. It is also a beast when it is operated in its upper RPM range. So as you can probably see, you can add power or lose weight or add power AND lose weight. I would suspect that buyers of the other examples really don't care much about how a Z06 gets its edge. So consequently the OEM makes changes in what the target market wants. This car can cruise all day at 100 mph and get 25-27 mpg. Of course mileage improves as you travel at 65-75 mph. The car can put you 450 miles further away before you need gas, with the air conditioning on in 100 degree weather and loaded with a passenger and luggage for two for two weeks.
It seems unbelievable a car can excel at the best of both worlds - super fast yet super economical.
The high gas mileage is probably also the result high gearing with the 6-speed. The high torgue of the V8 allows the Z06 to travel at highway speeds with very little effort. Motor Trend's specs show that the Z06 can go 170MPH in 5th gear - and there's one more gear left! I wonder how fast the Z06 would go if it weren't governed at 171MPH?
It is acknowledged that the gearing is part of what makes the Corvette do what it does well in terms of speed, torque,band width, gas mileage, etc. However it is not necessarily the best combination. Having said that, each of the other CAR examples has precisely the same opportunities to put together each OEM example.
In the case of the 171-176 mph top end, the combination of the 6th speed (too tall a gear for the torque) and hp rating) mitigates against pushing it over the above speed. So a combination of slightly lower gear and higher hp 425-450 hp etc. can certainly bring it up.
I did a mileage check last summer on my Z06. All interstate for 600 miles. 80-85 on the way up and my mileage was 28.5. Trip back was 75 for 300 miles and 70 for the last 300. MPG was an astounding 29.3! 6th gear is tall for sure but it did not lack for any extra "oomph" when necessary. I found that incredible.
Just replaced the Alternator on my low miles 2001.
Aftr driving for a while, Alernator should be warm to the touch. If it is hot to the touch, that is the problem. Mines was draining the battery even after the wire was pulled. Some sort of grounding or short problem.
The amount of HP needed to go faster and faster is exponential. So to go from say 170 to 200 takes an substantial boost in HP due to aero problems. It's not just a gearing issue, it's also a matter of overcoming downforce (which you'd better have plenty of).
Obviously, the Z06 has a "sweet spot" in highway RPMs at "reasonable" speeds, but it may not be very economical at the higher speeds. This isn't an issue in the USA but Europeans can and do go 120-130 mph.
So what I mean is (just guessing) is that the Euro cars may be designed to operate more efficiently at a higher speed/rpm level than the Z06.
If that's not it, then I don't know the answer, but I'll try to talk to some RSP (IReal Smart People) about the fuel efficiency issue and get back to you.
This is the first Corvette in my life, so I am new to the technology. The car warranty is 36 months, for those of you who have had corvettes beyond 50K miles, do I need extended warranty? Should I protect the front of the car with a car bra - or do the aerodynamics of the car keep it safe from flying debris?
First of all congratulations on your new Corvette! You ask two difficult questions. I think the first question you have to get a feeling for is are you more concerned with time and or mileage. If you got one off the line that is considered "average" then probably you will not need it. I personally got the extended warranty 7yr/72k.I got it because it was the first year Z06 (2001, and this car is loaded with electronics. Frankly, I dont get the feeling I will get the chance to fulfill on it. Although it is a good feeling to know that if I do have a problem is a small deductible away from getting fixed.
Whether or not to get a bra, I think it is a matter of when you get road dings, not if. If you like the paint job close to pristine, I would get it. The only two dings I got were when I decided to take a short jaunt and not put on the bra.
There is another product called cleartastic (www.cleartastic.com) that is "always on" that could be an alternative to a bra. When my coupe arrives, I will be trying the cleartastic approach.
When you see the dings in the bra after a long trip. I have one gash in the bra that is half inch by quarter inch at right angles, and another gouge about the size of a bb. Even with using the bra on anything over 100 miles I still have two small nicks in the front end paint after 15,000 miles in 16 months. As to the warranty, I also extended to 5 yrs. 60k and I don't usually buy extended warranties but with all the electronics I too thought maybe in this case it might come in handy. Also, with the Z06 out there, I might get a new one at some point and figured the warranty might assist in a direct sale vs. a trade-in, which I have hardly ever done. Congrats also on the 50th, enjoy the miles of smiles and don't forget to wave.
Another practical thing about the bra I like is that when I stop at a service station for gas, I can wipe the bugs clean off the front of the bra with that ubiquitous nasty sponge squeegee with not a fear of damaging the paint underneath. When you run this thing when the insects are out, believe me it can be quite the kill zone.
May I also recommend that you get your alignment and your wheel balanced checked by your dealer(under warranty)? If your alignment doesn't fit your driving style or if it is off, you will probably find out too far into the wear pattern to maximize the wear patterns on your EXPENSIVE tires.
Thank you all for the good advice, I have a Lexus now and it would be nicer if I have had a bra from the beginning. It's down right ugly in the front.
As for the extended warranty, I was mechanically concerned, I am in the computer network business and if the electronics doesn't break in the first week, it won't.
I also noticed when I first drove the car that the alignment was weird, it didn't track straight. It pulled left for me and right for the manager. I will insist on a check up just to be sure.
In regard to the electronics failing under the warranty (first week) or not at all, you may be right about that. I have pretty close to 50k on mine and all systems, electronic and mechanical are GO.
In regard to the alignment, be advised of three things: 1. Insist on a print out of your alignment. Balance doesn't need a print out. 2. Do your homework and find out the exact specifications that are good for YOUR type of driving. Your whole goal here is to get the maximum even and long wear and performance, consistent with your driving and or conditions. Each goal of your needs and wants has a conversion number in terms of: camber, caster, toe, sai, included angle,cross camber, cross caster, total toe, ON the rear: camber, toe,total toe, thrust angle, KNOW WHAT THOSE NUMBERS ARE AND MAKE THEM GIVE THEM TO YOU 3. The specifications are sufficiently broad. That is to meet the needs of MANY uses and users. So do not take their word for it that "it meets/falls/is within specifications.
So for example, my goal was to drive the car in that broad expanse of space in the western states @cruising speed. I also place a premium on straight line tracking (especially on two lane black top, Route 66 et al), etc etc.
I've been lurking here for awhile and would enjoy having some owners talk about reliability issues ... I've been looking at used NSXs, and now a 92 Z06.
The Z06 (used) is dramatically cheaper and much faster in acceleration. What I'm interested in is "living" with it. How come the reliability ratings are so poor (CR)? Is it 'just' electronic issues? What would be some of the chronic issues that I should think about, and check, before buying one .... I mean, Corvette- specific issues rather than the things you do with any used vehicle.
I think one of the variables that say a Honda Accord or Toyota Camry vs a z06 is a much lower statistical number of sample folks. (not even to mention all out performance car vs family sedan)
In the case of the Z06 2001 there are only 5733 total owners. If you look at Z06's direct competitors like the BMW Z-8 or the Porsche's 911TT I am sure you will find there are even smaller populations of owners. Or in the case of the 2001 BMW M-3 (the nearest competitor due to price only) there are 3000 owners. Of this BMW -M-3 variety BMW did a momentous thing, they extended the warranty ad hoc, due to the fact that folks were blowing up those finely crafted German engines, even after the usual and customary BMW denial that manufacturing had anything to do with it! (They usually blamed the client)
My seat of the pants feeling would be the Z06 would be better. Since you used the NSX as an example, my sister in law's brother, finally gave up his NSX because he was scared it would need a second transmission. (first was covered under warranty)and the NSX practically ATE tires and brakes. (his was a garage queen with 30k miles)
Having said the above, the only(common) problem I have had is leaking rear differential seals. (Fixed under warranty)
#399 QUOTE) "The amount of HP needed to go faster and faster is exponential. So to go from say 170 to 200 takes an substantial boost in HP due to aero problems. It's not just a gearing issue, it's also a matter of overcoming downforce (which you'd better have plenty of).
Obviously, the Z06 has a "sweet spot" in highway RPMs at "reasonable" speeds, but it may not be very economical at the higher speeds. This isn't an issue in the USA but Europeans can and do go 120-130 mph.
So what I mean is (just guessing) is that the Euro cars may be designed to operate more efficiently at a higher speed/rpm level than the Z06.
If that's not it, then I don't know the answer, but I'll try to talk to some RSP (IReal Smart People) about the fuel efficiency issue and get back to you. "
(unquote)
First of all, I think a lot more is going on here than meets the eye. The first seen and unseen modifier is the 65 mph speed limit vs say 80 mph speed limit only in urban autobahn type situations, and unlimited on the rest.
In terms of the Z06 and or the Corvette, without super bowl type advertising, it dispels the notion that American car's have poor performance and are gas guzzlers.
In fact, its foreign competitor's consume more fuel. If you look at Porsche 911 TT, BMW Z-8, BMW M-3 etc's, EPA mileage figures, that is proof.
However, a large majority of cars that operate in Euro are not allowed into the USA, i.e., the ones with better gas mileage. So I can see why Euro folks consider us in the USA of being gas guzzlers. We only allow in their biggest GAS GUZZLERS !!!!!Porsche, Ferrari, BMW, Bentley, MB, ETC. One glaring example of exclusion on a class of cars are the diesels, which structurally get 33-65% better mileage than unleaded gas!!
The Vettes are definitely capable of cruising at 120-130 mph. with say 23-26 mpg. It is equally as obvious that those speeds are about TWICE the posted highway speeds. So while, say a BMW that is exported here is designed for 120-130 mph and probably a tad beyond, I would hazard a guess that most American and even Japanese cars are not designed with this in mind.
It's good to know you are at 50K miles without any issues. As you can see from below CR is not kind in it's rating for this car, but I have learned to ignore them and buy American made cars. They have always been dependable.
And yes, if electronics are going to fail, they will do so early on, I did not opt for the extended warranty. Statistically speaking, and even CR agrees, extended warranties may not always be a good investment.
I had a chance to drive my car through the country side for 200 miles today and the steering was much better. It tracked straight on the freeway, but it still drifts at low speeds. I also spoke to the service manager to make an appointment to check the alignment and he said the mfg wants 500 miles in the car before checking it; I am at 225 now. Where might I find the alignment specifications, it sounds like we have similar driving patterns?
Comments
How does the allocation work? Is it based on total annual volume through to customers so they are trying to move the last of the current units, or is it some specific time frame? Interested since I had difficulty getting info when I bought my Vette in '00 until I found some on the internet willing to explain that I got a specific allocation they had in the build que at the plant.
Any additional input would be helpful for those looking at Vette's in the future.
Question: has anyone had similar experience? Is there a fix?
Thanks !
The allocation thing is a much bigger deal than it seems when your experience is only with other vehicles. One salesman locally sold me a car, taking a deposit, but at the price the salesman gave me, his marketing manager wouldn't give him a factory allocation until they had all their showroom models in, so I waited 2 months with no factory slot in sight (some dealers only get 1 a month or less, some a lot more). Then I used the internet to get delivery in 3 months with a confirmed factory build week and estimate of delivery with a better price. Much easier if you want what they have in stock and right now there seems to be plenty in stock in some areas. Good Luck.
http://www.motorsporttech.com/2002_website/VTdrivetrain.html
As my neighbor who recently got an M3 said after we had both been in the other car a few times, his was a coupe/sedan and fit his needs, and mine was sportscar/coupe and was fun. But he still has a child seat to go in the back and ours is out of college, so it's time for fun.
The car is not perfect, and I'll be the first to admit that, but for all the problems and ailments you have, I find them a little hard to believe. I'm not saying you're a liar, but I'm finding it hard to believe that you are having all of these problems at once to the degree you state.
If your driver's side door is rattling to that degree....what did the dealer say when you brought it in to them for repair? You did bring it to the dealer, right?
Regarding closing the hood....how did you attempt to close it in order to receive the feeling that you almost bent the hood? If you push down on the corner of any hood, you're going to come close to bending it. (I won't even mention what happens to the hoods of the earlier generation Vipers.
You state: "The Vette to me feels like I have to push the accelerator down further to make anything happen. Even then the poor thing sounds like the motor is working too hard and noisy relative to the MPH". Have you brought the car in to the dealer to have them run a diagnostic check-up on it? In comparing the performance numbers of a Corvette to a BMW, it would stand to reason that you should be feeling something greater in terms of performance from the Vette than you would the BMW. In terms of sound, the Corvette is high performance sports car. The BMW is more a 4-seat luxo-cruiser meant to instill driving pleasure while wrapping the occupants in a cocoon of luxury and cushioning. Hence - the higher curb weight of a BMW over a Corvette.
If you feel that the performance of your Corvette is inherent to all C5s rather than the possibility that just maybe, something might be wrong with *your* Corvette, then what were your thoughts after you test drove a Corvette prior to buying one?? Have you gone to a dealer and test driven other Corvettes to see how they compare to yours?
I'm sorry if I sound rude here, but in my own opinion, I think your harsh criticism of Corvettes is slightly flawed based upon what you have written above. By comparing the BMW to the Corvette, you are comparing apples to oranges. They are two completely different cars built for different purposes.
I also think a more apples to apples comparison would be with the BMW Z-8 two seater and C-5 variants such as Z06, Coupe, Convertible Corvettes. The M-3 is clearly a sports sedan and the C-5 is clearly a sports car.
Link to interesting article and ref: to Corvette in middle of article.
http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/030122/law038_1.html
Hope the top comes off without anything getting pinched .....
watch those fingers.
Release left and right front levers. Pull down on rear lever and reverse to reinstall. Lift out with two people unless you can stand outside and reach to the middle of the car and lift top with one arm and not lose control as you lift, not super easy to do.
Major point, there are many stories about those that did latch all three on reinstall and the top seems to come off due to air pressure about 50mph or so, they are all sad to hear, so be careful.
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Absolutely great day with light broken clouds and lots of sun for a local drive with the top out. Enjoy your Vette's and Go Raider's.
Ruking1, don't brag, we would all love to have a Z06. At least when we need a top
Would any of you know of a rack-and-pinion steering upgrade for a C3? I have a perfectly stock-looking (sneaky grin) '73 with significant (but subtle) performance upgrades and the only mechanical system in the car that hasn't been restored, replaced, or tweaked is the steering. I've checked Eckler's, ZIP, Mid-America, etc. and come up empty.
Alpine is not a Corvette Guy (with apologies to the Corvette Ladies). Corvettes, and American cars in general, have not always been for everyone, which is perfectly proven by the sales success of the Honda Accord and the Toyota Camry. A lot of people simply have no tolerance for the occasional mis-aligned panel, or improperly-formed window seal, or that peculiar dashboard rattle that comes on between 35 and 41 mph. And you can preach all the history and racing legacy you want. It's just not their thing.
The difference between a light, nimble, high-revving, superbly crafted German road machine vs. a heavy, wide, snarling, mass-produced, modern-day muscle car just emphasizes how different things are for different folks.
My '73 is loud, poorly assembled, handles terribly (by today's standards), squeaks, rattles, leaks, and shakes. It's also blisteringly fast and wonderfully terrifying to drive. I absolutely love it!
While our Corvettes are still running strong decades from now, I wonder where all those Hondas and BMWs will be?
Would like to get some advice on how and where to shop for the best deal.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
After you find a dealer that you are comfortable working with, you may have to wait for a produciton slot to get your car scheduled for production. Depeding on which options you want (such as 3.15 performance axle), you may have to wait quite a while for a production slot to become available. The 3.15 performance axle affects the Corporate Average Fuel Economy calculation, so GM puts the option on a very tigh allocation. I placed my order the last week of December, 2002 and only last week was confirmed for a February 17th build date (and I wanted the 3.15 performance rear axle....)
Lots of luck on your quest.
the Museum Delivery option. I did it and it
was a great experience and had a wonderful drive
home to San Diego. If you do the Mueseum delivery
then you can shop the whole country for your best
deal. If you place your order soon, you might
be able to pick it up during the C5 birthday
bash celebration at the Museum. Lots of seminars
and fun events. It is April 24 – 27.
Your 2003 Corvette front to rear weight distribution is 51/49 per my wife's now 4 broken bathroom scales.
If you have a local Corvette Club meeting in your area that serves good pizza you should go (and invite your good buddy along). Best regards,
JQ Public
1) There is an annoying whine that seems to be electrical related...when the ignition is on (but not the engine) is is not there....when the engine is on it is quite obvious. Events such as the a/c kicking on or the turn signals are registered in the whine....at speed you can not hear it...only at idle....any ideas? It is not in the radio....perhaps a flow thru vent motor?
2) There seems to be a lot of play in the seat backs (power leather seats both sides)...is this normal?
3) How accurate is the tire pressure system?
4) The car has the performance handling package...how much does this effect the day in and day out ride?
Much thanks!
It seems that your #'s one and two are candidates for a dealer's care or a shop that you trust. There is a certain amount of seat back play that is quite normal, due to the fact they had to allow for some seatback angle motion room, because of the tight and close fit of the seat when it is operated to the full rearward position. You may want to ask the dealer to look up any TSB's on your concern (technical service bulletin)
#3 The tire pressure sensor system is very accurate. Since my Z06 does not come with this option, I can not comment on the livability. My tire guys tell me that during tire change procedures that the presence of sensors is a REAL PITA. However, if you take measurements with three different "accurate" or digital air pressure instruments you will in all likelihood get three separate (but close) answers. The other thing that you may want to watch for is that while the manual calls for 30 psi cold, ambient temperature change of temperature of 10 degrees (plus or minus) causes app 1# of psi change. Taking pressure readings during or just after operating temperatures usually adds app 3 to 4 #'s of psi.
4. Chances are at 39k and if the previous owner/owners didnt beat the car to death that the Z-51 (performance package) is still very good. If you are a moderate driver, the shops estimate that the shocks usually go to 100k with not much effort. The ride as you can imagine is a little more tight and stiffer and compliant. Mine comes standard with the Z-51 and I would not get a Vette any other way.
http://corvetteactioncenter.com/kb/category.php?catId=82
How does the cheapest car (Z06) with the largest engine (Z06), most horsepower and torque (Z06), best acceleration times (Z06), also get the best gas mileage??? Plus the Z06 does it with the old technology pushrod engine. (The others have twin turbos, 4 valves / cylinder, Dual OverHead Cam etc,)
I thought Porsche, Acura, BMW, etc were the technology leaders?
You have to like those apples,eh? (well, if you don't, at least I do)
Almost all of the above mentioned cars use old technology frame and body technology. The Z06 uses hydro formed steel and aluminum cross frames and steel frame weighs 400#'s and of course uses STP or a composite type of fiberglass. This is the weight side of the power to weight equation. As you can see the examples weigh anywhere from 300-600#'s more than the Z06 @3115 #'s.
The Z06 engine is very light and also well worked over from a technology point of view. It produces anywhere from 385-405 hp. It is also a beast when it is operated in its upper RPM range. So as you can probably see, you can add power or lose weight or add power AND lose weight. I would suspect that buyers of the other examples really don't care much about how a Z06 gets its edge. So consequently the OEM makes changes in what the target market wants. This car can cruise all day at 100 mph and get 25-27 mpg. Of course mileage improves as you travel at 65-75 mph. The car can put you 450 miles further away before you need gas, with the air conditioning on in 100 degree weather and loaded with a passenger and luggage for two for two weeks.
The high gas mileage is probably also the result high gearing with the 6-speed. The high torgue of the V8 allows the Z06 to travel at highway speeds with very little effort. Motor Trend's specs show that the Z06 can go 170MPH in 5th gear - and there's one more gear left! I wonder how fast the Z06 would go if it weren't governed at 171MPH?
It is acknowledged that the gearing is part of what makes the Corvette do what it does well in terms of speed, torque,band width, gas mileage, etc. However it is not necessarily the best combination. Having said that, each of the other CAR examples has precisely the same opportunities to put together each OEM example.
In the case of the 171-176 mph top end, the combination of the 6th speed (too tall a gear for the torque) and hp rating) mitigates against pushing it over the above speed. So a combination of slightly lower gear and higher hp 425-450 hp etc. can certainly bring it up.
6th gear is tall for sure but it did not lack for any extra "oomph" when necessary.
I found that incredible.
Aftr driving for a while, Alernator should be warm to the touch. If it is hot to the touch, that is the problem. Mines was draining the battery even after the wire was pulled. Some sort of grounding or short problem.
Obviously, the Z06 has a "sweet spot" in highway RPMs at "reasonable" speeds, but it may not be very economical at the higher speeds. This isn't an issue in the USA but Europeans can and do go 120-130 mph.
So what I mean is (just guessing) is that the Euro cars may be designed to operate more efficiently at a higher speed/rpm level than the Z06.
If that's not it, then I don't know the answer, but I'll try to talk to some RSP (IReal Smart People) about the fuel efficiency issue and get back to you.
First of all congratulations on your new Corvette! You ask two difficult questions. I think the first question you have to get a feeling for is are you more concerned with time and or mileage. If you got one off the line that is considered "average" then probably you will not need it. I personally got the extended warranty 7yr/72k.I got it because it was the first year Z06 (2001, and this car is loaded with electronics. Frankly, I dont get the feeling I will get the chance to fulfill on it. Although it is a good feeling to know that if I do have a problem is a small deductible away from getting fixed.
Whether or not to get a bra, I think it is a matter of when you get road dings, not if. If you like the paint job close to pristine, I would get it. The only two dings I got were when I decided to take a short jaunt and not put on the bra.
As to the warranty, I also extended to 5 yrs. 60k and I don't usually buy extended warranties but with all the electronics I too thought maybe in this case it might come in handy. Also, with the Z06 out there, I might get a new one at some point and figured the warranty might assist in a direct sale vs. a trade-in, which I have hardly ever done.
Congrats also on the 50th, enjoy the miles of smiles and don't forget to wave.
Another practical thing about the bra I like is that when I stop at a service station for gas, I can wipe the bugs clean off the front of the bra with that ubiquitous nasty sponge squeegee with not a fear of damaging the paint underneath. When you run this thing when the insects are out, believe me it can be quite the kill zone.
May I also recommend that you get your alignment and your wheel balanced checked by your dealer(under warranty)? If your alignment doesn't fit your driving style or if it is off, you will probably find out too far into the wear pattern to maximize the wear patterns on your EXPENSIVE tires.
As for the extended warranty, I was mechanically concerned, I am in the computer network business and if the electronics doesn't break in the first week, it won't.
I also noticed when I first drove the car that the alignment was weird, it didn't track straight. It pulled left for me and right for the manager. I will insist on a check up just to be sure.
Thank you all and see you on the road.
In regard to the electronics failing under the warranty (first week) or not at all, you may be right about that. I have pretty close to 50k on mine and all systems, electronic and mechanical are GO.
In regard to the alignment, be advised of three things: 1. Insist on a print out of your alignment. Balance doesn't need a print out. 2. Do your homework and find out the exact specifications that are good for YOUR type of driving. Your whole goal here is to get the maximum even and long wear and performance, consistent with your driving and or conditions. Each goal of your needs and wants has a conversion number in terms of: camber, caster, toe, sai, included angle,cross camber, cross caster, total toe, ON the rear: camber, toe,total toe, thrust angle, KNOW WHAT THOSE NUMBERS ARE AND MAKE THEM GIVE THEM TO YOU 3. The specifications are sufficiently broad. That is to meet the needs of MANY uses and users. So do not take their word for it that "it meets/falls/is within specifications.
So for example, my goal was to drive the car in that broad expanse of space in the western states @cruising speed. I also place a premium on straight line tracking (especially on two lane black top, Route 66 et al), etc etc.
The Z06 (used) is dramatically cheaper and much faster in acceleration. What I'm interested in is "living" with it. How come the reliability ratings are so poor (CR)? Is it 'just' electronic issues? What would be some of the chronic issues that I should think about, and check, before buying one .... I mean, Corvette- specific issues rather than the things you do with any used vehicle.
Thanks, if you feel like replying.
JW
I think one of the variables that say a Honda Accord or Toyota Camry vs a z06 is a much lower statistical number of sample folks. (not even to mention all out performance car vs family sedan)
In the case of the Z06 2001 there are only 5733 total owners. If you look at Z06's direct competitors like the BMW Z-8 or the Porsche's 911TT I am sure you will find there are even smaller populations of owners. Or in the case of the 2001 BMW M-3 (the nearest competitor due to price only) there are 3000 owners. Of this BMW -M-3 variety BMW did a momentous thing, they extended the warranty ad hoc, due to the fact that folks were blowing up those finely crafted German engines, even after the usual and customary BMW denial that manufacturing had anything to do with it! (They usually blamed the client)
My seat of the pants feeling would be the Z06 would be better. Since you used the NSX as an example, my sister in law's brother, finally gave up his NSX because he was scared it would need a second transmission. (first was covered under warranty)and the NSX practically ATE tires and brakes. (his was a garage queen with 30k miles)
Having said the above, the only(common) problem I have had is leaking rear differential seals. (Fixed under warranty)
QUOTE)
"The amount of HP needed to go faster and faster is exponential. So to go from say 170 to 200 takes an substantial boost in HP due to aero problems. It's not just a gearing issue, it's also a matter of overcoming downforce (which you'd better have plenty of).
Obviously, the Z06 has a "sweet spot" in highway RPMs at "reasonable" speeds, but it may not be very economical at the higher speeds. This isn't an issue in the USA but Europeans can and do go 120-130 mph.
So what I mean is (just guessing) is that the Euro cars may be designed to operate more efficiently at a higher speed/rpm level than the Z06.
If that's not it, then I don't know the answer, but I'll try to talk to some RSP (IReal Smart People) about the fuel efficiency issue and get back to you. "
(unquote)
First of all, I think a lot more is going on here than meets the eye. The first seen and unseen modifier is the 65 mph speed limit vs say 80 mph speed limit only in urban autobahn type situations, and unlimited on the rest.
In terms of the Z06 and or the Corvette, without super bowl type advertising, it dispels the notion that American car's have poor performance and are gas guzzlers.
In fact, its foreign competitor's consume more fuel. If you look at Porsche 911 TT, BMW Z-8, BMW M-3 etc's, EPA mileage figures, that is proof.
However, a large majority of cars that operate in Euro are not allowed into the USA, i.e., the ones with better gas mileage. So I can see why Euro folks consider us in the USA of being gas guzzlers. We only allow in their biggest GAS GUZZLERS !!!!!Porsche, Ferrari, BMW, Bentley, MB, ETC. One glaring example of exclusion on a class of cars are the diesels, which structurally get 33-65% better mileage than unleaded gas!!
The Vettes are definitely capable of cruising at 120-130 mph. with say 23-26 mpg. It is equally as obvious that those speeds are about TWICE the posted highway speeds. So while, say a BMW that is exported here is designed for 120-130 mph and probably a tad beyond, I would hazard a guess that most American and even Japanese cars are not designed with this in mind.
And yes, if electronics are going to fail, they will do so early on, I did not opt for the extended warranty. Statistically speaking, and even CR agrees, extended warranties may not always be a good investment.
I had a chance to drive my car through the country side for 200 miles today and the steering was much better. It tracked straight on the freeway, but it still drifts at low speeds. I also spoke to the service manager to make an appointment to check the alignment and he said the mfg wants 500 miles in the car before checking it; I am at 225 now. Where might I find the alignment specifications, it sounds like we have similar driving patterns?
Another place for the discussion would be:
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/zeromain
Do a search on alignment.