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Comments
Bob
2. XJ Vanden Plas- all aluminum, really nice piece of work. English comfort, style, it's different, and if she really wants more power there's always the XJR.
3. STS- but I'm concerned because it's the first year
4. A8L- nice car, but I don't think she'll buy into the Audi name
5. S500- I just can't see plunking down $90k on a car that's going to be replaced next year.
6. 745iL- But I don't see her using i-drive, which means she won't be able to control a lot of stuff in the car, like the radio!
**7. 2 RLs- I'm going to go drive one to make Bob happy. ;-)**
8. A Legacy GT ltd, an OB VDC, and an STi (all three for just under $100K!)- just had to throw that in. ;-)
Sorry Bob, I was just joking. Of course my parents would never consider 3 Subarus. But it's what I would do! ;-) Ok, maybe 1 RL and 2 Subarus. ;-)
Craig- I know the concern about Jags, but they have a brand new plant, they were ranked 3rd in JD powers new car survey (I know, only 90 days of ownership), and I don't see my parents putting more than 60K miles before getting rid of it.
tom
-mike
-mike
I would be interested in your thoughts about the X-type. I drove a Mondeo Ghia X hatchback some years ago for 10 days in England and was very impressed by it. Shows that Ford can get it right, despite the watered down Contour that we got over here.
How is the AWD system?
Steve
Seriously, search online and you will find SRX V8s for as little as $23 grand.
That's about half the price of a new one after just one year! Ouch!
Some Subies hold as much value after FOUR years!
-juice
The reason I am asking, my family and I were discussing up to what point do you hold onto a car before going for a new one. My OB is 4 years old with 64000 miles on it. While I know that is "young" for a Subaru, I would love to move up to the new '05 OB or Legacy. I'm just looking for points to make in an argument for a new car:-)
Either way, if I want to go for the new car my IMBA discount does not go into effect until Jan05.
Mark
However, once your loan is paid off, you have the biggest down payment (potentially) for your next car.
If you are not disciplined enough to put away the money that you would have made on car payments, then you end up getting further and further away from that new car.
So if I've just described you, by all means, take your equity, which is now at its peak, and use that as a down payment on the new Subaru.
I fall into the "disciplined" category. I saved up for my Forester from 1993-1998 and bought it for cash in 1998. I have not made a car payment for 6+ years.
Tragically, the wife was aware of that and put us in a beach condo! So my Turbo Fund vanished.
So run, don't walk, to your Subaru dealer before your wife does something responsible like that. Save yourselves! ;-)
-juice
I have become accustomed to car payments, so the main issue becomes having fun with the car, and accepting the tradeoff between something old, familiar, and relaxed (easy to own), or something new and exciting (an OCD nightmare). That's pretty much how I weigh things, so I see advantages to keeping an old car and advantages to getting a new one.
Over the last three months owning my 05 OB XT, I have enjoyed it quite a bit. But there are several instances where I regretted trading in my old Outback. The driving experience of the 05 is significantly improved over the 02, but the 02 was kind of a trusty buddy and I miss it. So that sort of illustrates the demented thought process in my head.
BTW, don't wait for the IMBA discount unless you want to -- the 05 models can be had for at/below invoice already (I paid invoice back in July).
Craig
If you need a solid reason, maybe the new safety features? SAC. Better tires, too. VTD AWD.
-juice
Juice- I actually paid off the car about a year and a half ago when we refinanced the house. The extra payments have been going towards the principal on the new mortgage, so that we can have more of our house than the bank:-). You are correct about having the new car fever. I am trying to do the rational thing and stay away, but it is hard. Especially when you compare the features between my base 2000 OBW and the OB XT LTD I would want get. Part of my argument for the new model are the safety features, as well as the dual climate control.
For now, I get to live/drive through all of the new owners here.
Mark
Of course, the turbo is a little harder to justify. ;-)
good luck.
tom
my girlfriend absolutely loves the Evo and appreciates four doors and seating for four adults.
~c
What she really means is she appreciates seating for two adults and three future kids. ;-)
DaveM
actually yeah, she's pretty blunt. not that I know anyone else like that...
~Colin
I've been very impressed with the vehicle as a whole and with the AWD. It's every bit as effective as the AWD system on my wife's Subaru Forester.
I definitely see you in the Yukon XL. That is a Paisan truck, almost like it was designed for your needs.
Mark
All the radio & Television stations were talking about that. It defintely made people take notice.
Mark
Chuck, normally I would agree with you on the truth in advertising thing, but nobody seriously believes that a Jeep could climb a vertical wall. This is taking an idea too an absurd extreme, to make a point. I see nothing wrong with that. To me that's great advertising.
Bottom line: It worked, judging by all the media reaction.
Bob
I want a turbo but I'd rather she *not* get one, she tends to get tickets when she has that much power.
-juice
Mark
-juice
I think they *really* try to push that outdoor/4WD adventure image they currently have, perhaps because the product is lagging a bit.
-juice
Sounds to me like, deep down, you kinda wished LR came up with the idea, and not Jeep; whether you care to admit it or not.
Bob <ducking and running>
I think at NY a couple of years ago they had one where you could walk underneath a Disco that was laden with tons o' mud.
At dealers you see them on top of piles of rocks.
Stuff like that. Same basic idea - get the customer thinking about how cool the potential is off road, even though they'll never use it.
-juice
It's advertising an image, pure and simple—and the key to any successful ad campaign remembering the product. I think Jeep succeeded here in doing just that.
Bob
Like that is soooo important in the parking lot of Bloomies.
-juice
But it's the potential that matters!
I spoke with my dad yesterday.
They are strongly considering the S500 and LS430, and are willing to look at the Jag, although it's a distant third.
My dad doesn't even like MB and won't even look at an Audi (I tried) and the STS just isn't upscale enough.
Thanks for everyone's input. Now my parents will probably think about it long enough for the redesigned '06 S class to come out! (which is one option I told them about)
tom
On a similar note,still haven't figured out what to do with the self supporting pool. Spent an entire afternoon draining and leaving it to dry, only to see it buried under snow in less than 2 days.
Nicholas
It's because our vehicles can slog through the jungles of Central America. If they show a Jeep slogging through some difficult terrain, I'd have no problem with it. No vehicle can climb vertically though. I hope I never see Land Rover do something like that, I prefer to see what the vehicle can actually do. One of our core Marque Values is Authenticity and seeing one of our vehicles doing the impossible is not very authentic.
I thought the commercial for the Explorer was just as ridiculous as the idea of using it for the Jeep.
LR3 review is up on the Edmunds home page, speaking of LR.
-juice
And the other one where claws came out of the tires to grip the road.
Not that I hold you responsible for Jaguar's adverstising, but that must've made you cringe.
Saab also has the 9-2x driving up walls to make a point about the increased traction.
They don't go as far as Jeep's publicity stunt.
I think they are clever ads, look at all the free press coverage it got.
-juice
-juice
I can see your point Chuck. I just don't agree with it. Maybe given LR's audience and market position, perhaps. But as a general rule of thumb, I don't agree with your position. Maybe it's because I'm part of the advertising industry, where creativity (even goofy, off-the-wall (pun intended)) is valued so highly.
Bob
Chuck- do you know much about how the new XJs are doing? They seem to improved their fit and finish a lot. And I think R&T has a long term tester that's doing well. They don't have a good history, reliability wise.
I'm going to go look at one this weekend.
I think if an ad has grabbed your attention, it's done it's job. Why bring reality into it? No one likes reality- it's too depressing and boring. People want to know what they could be, and an SUV can take you places, even to the top (of a building anyway) ;-)
tom
I'm not in advertising myself, but I know what I like. I can also see your point, but we'll just have to agree to disagree.
What's new here is the fact that a vehicle is hanging off a building, and the large parking sign above. The visual impact of that is completely different than that of something similar being done with computer graphics. While the (root) idea may not be new, the execution sure is.
Bob
both are awesome powerful cars and strong engines its hard to choose between the two,Subaru is a strong company and Mitsu has financial problems or something so tell me is mitsu going to survive and if not then whats going to happen?......discuss! thanks people.
The folks over at nabisco are going nuts over it, which I'm sure surprises no one here.
Bob
I'll keep the SVX as my backup/commuter car and convert it to 5MT eventually. The Legacy may get caged for track only and the impreza maybe sold (long term plan mind you)
-mike
I didn't want either as a daily driver so I bought a Legacy GT. But if I was going to buy an extra car and only had $30K-ish to spend, I would (and have) strongly consider one.
Colin has an Evo, he might be able to give you more insight. I have spent minimal time inside each (was fun while it lasted though!)
tom
-mike
It has a computer controlled suspension- taking fast right turns was almost flat- very minimal roll. Impressive. It's a large car, longer than an S500 or 745iL, so it's no sports car, but certainly seems to handle curves like a much smaller car. Definitely more fun than the LS430. Perhaps a little better than an S500, and not quite as firm as the BMW.
The base engine is a 4.2L V8 294hp/303lb torque with a ZF 6sp tranny which gets this 3800 lb (incredibly light for its size!) sedan to 60 in about 6 seconds, while getting an EPA 18/28mpg! That's better than my LGT! And almost as fast! You can just hear the engine growl a bit as you accelerate hard, but not enough to disrupt any important conversation you might be having. The supercharged V8 has 390hp/399lb ft torque and gets the car to 60 in about 5 seconds. But top speed is electronically governed in this country to 121mph. Odd, I thought. Not that many people need to go that fast in this country.
It's also very classy looking from the outside, with lots of wood and leather on the inside. You can even get Jaguar's classic 'picnic tables' which are like the fold down tables on airplanes. Not sure I'd eat on them during traffic though. There's a DVD entertainment option, with 2 monitors in the front seat headrests, and you can get 20" rims with Brembo brakes on the XJR or Super 8. Cool.
I think I would have to put the XJR at the top of my list, above the Lexus, MB, and BMW. Don't know about the Audi (unless they bring back an S8). It's fast, comfortable, well designed and put together, classy, and different.
I'm going to try to talk my parents into buying one, but I think they're leaning towards the S500. Oh well. Maybe I'll need to start saving up. If only they had an AWD version. ;-)
tom