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Comments
Ever hear of Don Garlitz?
Glad you brought that one up...
- Tim
Don't you both realize that once the bowtie girls put out their wimp version that it will be subpar to Ford???? Forget the debate with the sheep followers--only the best here that never rest. How come when I'm checking out a Mack dump does the crew long for my Ford??
Here in real work world, Ford is king. Oh sure, not as pretty and not with the "fastest" engines but which truck works the best?
That w/t on Chevy means "we're trying". Trust me, every P-I-A truck in our fleet has been a GM product. Even the Dodges fare better.
ROC
Roc...you are killing me!
We will never agree..but that's OK....keeps me busy!
yeah...you came up with my 3 day nickname....what does that mean??..i owe you my life?..hehehhehe
if you could drive my new truck Monday..I'm telling ya...it will put Balls on your hair!
- Wrath of "Al Bundy" Tim
Now I know..
Maybe I'll switch??>.....NOT!
- Tim
BTW, what version of the pretty truck did you buy? Do you think you'll put..say.....100 whole pounds in the back?
Roc...100 pounds??!!...i don't know boss??..that sounds like an awfull lot of weight!...sure that's not too much??..wow!...How could I ever possibly haul that much!?...Hope the road could handle it?!...Could be real dangerous!...
Probably couldn't survive what your trucks call work...For a Chevrolet it isn't work at all!..hehehheheheeeee
Oh no!...You guys have me scared...perhaps I should refuse delivery and buy something else?...I'm so worried it won't be the truck I had hoped for!..How will I ever get over this?...hey..I know!..This Keg should do the trick!!
it's a 2000 LT 2500 SB (4x4 Ext.Cab..Obviously)
Although it won't be used as an Ape truck....It's more than capable.
Don't you know this is the Silverado/Dodge section?..get that Ford out of here!..it's stinking the place up!
- Tim
But back to pickups in general...they are light-duty. Stop pounding your chests you Neanderthals, unless you've been shopping at the local National Guard base and at least own a Hummer or deuce-and-a-half.
Run along now skippy...
- Tim
GM sales are up every month this year. What does that mean?
How come every catagory I'm active in seems to be very popular???....I'm seeing a pattern here!
More beer for everyone!!..(Timmy is quite pooo poooed right now)
- wrath of Tim
or "there just aren't many old Dodges out there, so Chevy must be better". I can't argue about those old numbers because Chevy has sold a lot of trucks, I just don't think that that is proof that they are better. You are right, these should be tech conversations. Dodge builds a better heavy duty pickup than Chevy. Better diesel engine, better big block gas engine, able to pull larger GVW loads, in other words, more truck.
Chevy10: Do you know what torque is? Dodge engines kill chevy engines in this area and thats what trucks need. You want a sports car go buy a corvette. A v-10 dodge will out pull a chevy 6.0litre any day. Wake-up!
P.S., you ever notice how all the technically challenged are GM fans?
Compare the 6.0 to the gas 5.9...pretty sad for Dodge. I had mentioned how close the 6.0 V-8 was to the Dodge V-10.....another sad for Dodge.
A Vortec version of the V-10?....Watch the hell out!....someday...
Dodge and performance have nothing to do with each other.
- Tim
OK..let me think about buying a dodge......
Still buying a Chevy!
Can't see myself driving such an Ugly truck as a Dodge...and the God awefull boring Interior would get to me way too quick..(the only thing associated with Dodge and Quick!)
So little time..and so many people to tick off....hehehehheeeee
(If you take this personal....you have a serious problem..or just are not plain fun at all?)
Guru
Just don't say anything bad about Chevys or good about Dodges or Tim gets a little out of hand.
Big bad Dodges rule.
Guru
THANKS GUYS!!
I knew you would lose!
Just the facts now pay attention:
Better diesel engine
Better Big Block gas engine
Able to tow more
Able to leap tall buildings in a single bound---a little humor for tim, he is a little short on it.
Guru
Pumping my chest about "light-duty" trucks? Hmm, I'm looking out of my office and what do I see? Two three axle Mack dumps along with a F-650. Oh, yeah, there is a F-550 and a overworked Freightliner missing the support tire on the passenger side. I know about heavy trucks but I'd rather talk light-duties here.
Find me at truckworld debating whether I need the series 50 or 60 from Detroit Diesel. While here, watch me laugh at Tim's very poor choice in a 3/4 ton truck. He must be a hell of a deerhunter--get that big in Michigan? Tim? LOL
Everybody!!.....Quit your jobs and let's all get Heavy Duty construction Jobs. Roc is gonna explode here if every truck in North America does not get pushed to the full GVW load!...No more 1/2 and 3/4 tons!...Only 1 Ton and up!!...Hurry!!Hurry!!Hurry!!....
My truck is an excellent choice for me. You just can't get Past that somehow....Did you have a bundle of Shingles dropped on your head as a young boy??..or what?..hehehehhee
As a matter of fact...Yeah!...Some deer get very big here..Ever hear of the Rapala Buck?....Only the largest rack in the world!..(taken Last year)
Miller Lite is waiting for you.....Drink lots.
- Tim
first you post in 180 how GM is losing market share, so ford and dodge are better. Meaning of course, ford and dodge are selling more trucks, correct?
then, in post 193, you say how Chevy has sold a lot of trucks in the past, but you don't think that means anything about the quality of truck!
So what is it? I'll give you your chance to pick ONE side of the fence, so let me know.
A tech talk: I'll agree. Dodge has the better diesel. It can haul the most. thats about where my agreeing stops.
Dodge has the "biggest" big block, but not necesarily the best. Ford's v10 and Chevy's 454 are both excellent engines. Dodge has a enormous motor with a "poor" torque curve, meaning, you get all of that torque at one small rpm range. Still, a lot leftover, but contributes greatly to terrible gas mileage. And the v10 does not have a super reliability legacy. Ford's v10 has less torque, but a very flat torque curve, and in a motortrend test, with a 5000# boat i believe, the Ford outpulled the Dodge v10.
Flatter torque curve, means useable torque over more rpms. It used to be about peak torque. Guess who changed the rules: Not dodge. Ford and chevy both have gas engines with wide, flat powerbands.
Chevy's 454 is pretty much the same power as Ford's v10. a little more torque, a little less of a flat curve. but the 454 gets the best mileage out of all the big blocks. and a 454 has that 200-300K mile reliablity history that Dodge never has reached (with the v10) and Ford is still establishing ( i think they will).
so who has the best big block? what do you want the biggest torque numbers? the worst gas mileage? Or useable torque at any rpms. Torque curves: flatter is better.
dodge truck/chevy truck? up in the air i guess. i say dodge has the better towing platform, due to a more rigid frame rails. but the rest of the truck? will that tranny hold up? Oooh, thats been iffy for years. how bout the brakes. A dodge owner changes brake pads like a chevy owner changes oil.
My point is, its not cut and dry.
Snookey, please my friend.
you must love picking on the 6.0 because Dodge has a v10. why don't you compare the 6.0 to what ITS SUPPOSED TO BE COMPETING WITH. chevy has the 454 to compete with the v10s. why do you want to mention the 6.0.
example:
"Haha, Dodge's v6 IS A PIECE OF CRAP compared to a chevy 350. it can't haul anything!!"
the 6.0 is a mid sized v-8. comparable to the Dodge 360, or the Ford 5.4.
Dodge 360 345 ftlbs, 245 hp
ford 5.4 345 ftlbs, 245 hp????????????
GM 6.0 350 ftlbs, 300 hp.
Now, we're apples to apples. not only are the raw numbers bigger, but the actual torque curve is monstrous compared to the Ford and Dodge. Before your next statement, spend a little time and go drive one, and you will see what the affect of a flat torque curve is. refer to above: flatter is better.
I am a GM fan, i've had very good service with their products, as well as businesses I've worked for. But i take insult to your accusing me of being technically challenged. I am a mechanical engineer, I deal with high torque and hp diesel engines all day, Cummins and Cats and Detroits, etc. I spent several years doing sophisticated, computerized dynamometer testing of all engines from a small 3 liter Detroits, up to monstrous v16 Cats with 5000-7000 ftlbs of torque. I know engineering, I know engines, and I know what an engine can pull according to its torque curve.
if you have a generator that runs at 2400 rpms All day long, than a high peak torque at 2400 rpms is what you want in an engine. but if you have an application that calls for engine loads at all rpms--like say a car or truck, then you want torque to be available at all rpms. FLAT torque curves outpull triangular torque curves.
now somebody say something about strikes, sales, and car engines and whatever else my arguements ALWAYS make people turn to so they can change the subject...
guru
Nuff free radical testosterone floating around to excite Michaelangelo's "David."
I will remind you of your Participants Agreement regarding "civil discourse." To put it quaintly in a George Carlin metaphor "No Mutha's Man!!?!" or wives or sisters or....
Breaking bad I can live with if the language is clean and there are no personal attacks. Otherwise I can shut this down for a while and let ALL of you cool off.
Sheesh! Worse than a sports bar on Superbowl Sunday!....
Front Porch Philosopher
SUV, Pickups, & Aftermarket and Accessories Host
You guys are just "male bonding" right? Is this what that's all about? Whatever your doing, its keeping little ol' me entertained (and everyone else - I'm sure).
I talked with a dealer yesterday (just some dealer I called to pump info from - not my dealer) He was telling me about the GM Ordering system (VOMS - vehicle ordering managment system). Seems that this new system - been in effect since sometime last year, has everyone mad, dealers and customers alike.
Use to be you could order a truck and it would be here in 6-8 weeks. Now, dealers have to continually monitor the computer for GM to be ready to built "your particular truck - or vehicle" This is supposedly part of the long delays with all the new truck orders. I can't believe some people waited 9 months until delivery. What a crock! This is the new system for ALL GM makes and models, not just Silverados. Is there anything us consumers can do about this crappy system?
What's the game plan here with GM? I want my darn truck, makes me feel helpless. What's a girl to do? (Except read these intense truck posts).
Cindy
Have a new 99 and have not found but 1 shortcoming so far. You MUST shut it off at drive-thrus. You know, out West, we must not be getting the good Chevs I keep reading about. Or maybe the central part of the country is not getting the average Dodge or Ford. Or maybe, somebody is really a Ford/Dodge supporter, and is working under cover to discredit them so the secret will not get out! But then, if all you do is go to taverns, and an occasion drive to the hills, maybe all you need is GM truck. Hey, isn't there a car called the Camaro, with a Z-28 package, that will do the same thing? I think I'm wrong, the Z-28 has a heaver frame.
Just stirrng the pot, don't want it to burn!
Wildmanbaker
I've tried Fords, Chevy's & finally Dodges.
Lately, I'm stuck on 3/4T. Dodges w/ 5.9 Cummins & 5 sp. Trans. I typically get 3 years & 100,000 miles of hard use w/ no more than one set of tires & one set of front brake pads for expense other than scheduled (by the book) maintainence, with a normal 16-17 mpg.
My favorite engine was my '90, my favorite driver was my '96, and now my '98 Quad Cab is got the best body arrangement for keeping my expensive survey suff INSIDE where it belongs.
My horse trailer pulling friends tell me that Dodges are better on the hills and Ford Powerstrokes are better on the flat.
Comments?
you seemed to have (conveniently, for your arguement) ignored everything i just said about the 6.0 being a mid size v8. you went right to comparing it to the v10. The Silverado 3/4 ton is a light duty 3/4 just like Ford has a light duty 3/4 ton. Do you know what the biggest motor in the Ford light duty 3/4 ton is???? It is the 5.4. Direct competitor with the 6.0. Not supposed to compete with any v10s. Chevy has a HD 3/4 ton, its called the C/K. You can get a Vortec 350 or a Vortec 454. those trucks are about to get redesigned. those come next year. look out.
GM is just giving you an ADDITIONAL mid v8 choice. If ford offered 3 different v6's, would we be comparing it to the Chevy 5.3? don't think so. Chevy's Silverado 3/4 ton is just a little heavier than the 1/2. JUST LIKE FORDS 3/4 LD. Not meant for the rigors of a Superduty 3/4 or C/K 3/4 or Ram 2500. So why does the 6.0 HAVE to be in a half-ton? chevy set up so you can get a light load truck with great fuel mileage in the 1/2 tons, or get a little heavier truck (3/4) with an engine better than the old workhorse, the 350. Its only 360 something cubes. just like the Dodge 360. No one is bitchin' about how the the Dodge 360 in the 3/4 ton can't keep up with Ford's V10 or Chevy's 454, which is the exact same arguement, just different viewpoint.
I haven't heard about the 460 lasting longer in motorhomes. I know they've got a little more power than the 454, but less gas mileage as well. Generally in trucks, i've seen 460's lose they're "newness" (loss of power and mileage) quicker than the 454. a friend of mine just bought an '84 motorhome with a 454. It has 160K on it and still runs great.
This is a Chevrolet/Dodge Topic.
- Tim
Perhaps you would like to put Our Black trucks back to back and hook up a chain and see what happens......Girly Man.
I know....I got a 3/4......I'll only use half throttle!..LOL!!
You are right about small differences....but Dodge looks way to dorky for me. Kinda like a bad cartoon...Didn't Wyle E. have one of those?...he never could catch the Road Runner...could he?
- Tim
hehehehhee
- Wrath of Tim Re-Visited!
It's an honor to recieve this award!
I'd like to thank my family and all my Fan club here at Edmunds!
I will treasure this for as long as I live.
Thanks again.
- Tim
(Just defending my beliefs)
All I'm reading is how to trick-up or over-tire a 1/2T. pick up, sounds like a bunch of high school kids to me.
What really matters in the real world is how often is the SOB in the shop?
Will it get me 60 miles to the job & BACK?
I mean day after day, regardless of weather.
That's why Dodges w/Cummins 5.9 Turbos are so good to me, they run like a Timex watch.
I saw one with 800+K miles on it the other day.
I'll let ya'll have your fun.