I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

roadburner

In the early '70s I badgered my dad to go look at cars at Grand Prix Motors, whicch was a BMW, Ferrari, and Saab dealership. I managed to nab a ride in a new Bavaria, where the British salesman demonstrated that it really would cruise at 120 mph- as the ads claimed.
My home town had a Chevy and a Chrysler dealership but the only cars they had that interested me were the musclecars and ponycars. I do remember checking out the 1973 Monte Carlo, because it was one of the GM intermediates that was designed to emulate the European driving experience- largely a result of high caster steering, tighter shock control, and a standard rear anti-roll bar.

fintail

You guys wouldn't have had as much fun growing up when I did.

When I was maybe 6, I had a thing for the Renault Fuego, and I recall my dad stopping by a dealer on one of our car browsing Sunday trips. I got some Renault promo posters, which I wish I still had.

The 80s weren't like the 60s for car launches, and we lived in a small town, so there was even less to see. I do recall seeing my first Mk II Jetta (which I liked for some reason), also the debut of the Corsica, and I recall seeing a Taurus wagon for the first time, and enjoying how it looked so futuristic. I also recall a neighbor had the first Camry I remember seeing. We didn't have any German brand dealers nearby other than VW, but I recall seeing my first W124 when they debuted, the memory has stuck with me.

tjc78

The 80s was such a transition time. You still had so many 70s barges on the road along with Accords and Camrys. Then like Fin said the Taurus came and made everything look old. There were Grand Nationals, Irocs, and Mustang along with Z cars.. if you wanted sporty.

Cars talked, they had digital dashes with giant green numbers, 10 band equalizers and tape decks. The luxury cars had overstuffed button tufted seats. What’s not to love?

Oh … they were almost all underpowered, had 85 mph speedometers and weren’t very reliable!

benjaminh

uplanderguy

I grew up thinking, and reading, that the first Riviera was a great design, and a good friend of mine has a very nice red-on-red one. But now I look at the front end styling, and think it's cartoonish.

I know what they say about opinions, they're like, well, you know, everybody has one.

texases

I think that photo of the Riv does exaggerate the look a bit, but I agree, it looks a bit overdone.

Great Plymouth pics, coming home from school I walked by a neighbor's house with identical '55ish Plymouths parked in the drive. I especially remember the Mayflower logo, one I've had a problem finding in my searches.

andre1969

I never really cared for the tacked-on headlights of the '63-64 Riviera, but like the design, otherwise. I thought the '65, with its hidden headlights, was a huge improvement though.

Oh, I just remembered...another detail about the '63-64 I'm also not crazy about is the rear-end treatment. The taillights seem too small, and it gives the car a bit of an unfinished look, to me. Again, I think they improved it for '65.

uplanderguy

For awhile, I have thought the '65 was my favorite Riv. Got rid of the plain taillights, fake rear-quarter scoops, and inboard headlights, although I'm still not crazy about the big corners in front.

I've been liking the '66 and '67 more and more lately.

I might be off a year or so here, but the '68/69 looks nice everywhere but talk about 'inboard headlights'. They're more egregious than the '63-64!

andre1969

In my mind, I tend to just lump the '66-69 Rivieras all together, I think they're all great looking, as long as you don't turn the headlights on. Although admittedly, most cars that have headlights that either pop up, or have to somehow roll into place, don't look good with them on. Now simpler designs, where the headlights are stationary and you just have covers that drop down, like what was common in the 70's, I think they're fine.

One thing I think is nice about the '65 Riviera, is that even with the headlights exposed, it still looks good. It looks kind of like a Pontiac without a split in the center of the grille, but still handsome I think.

The one Riv I like the least, style-wise, is the 1970. It just looks like a fat, bloated Skylark to me. I think those do tend to be a bit sought after though, because with the optional engine, they have the most hp of any Riviera ever, I believe.

I'm sort of the same way with the Toronado, except there I see a bigger difference with the '68 restyle. Most people prefer the '66-67, but for some reason, I find myself attracted to the '68-69! I'm not a huge fan of the '70, although it doesn't turn me off as much as the '70 Riv.

uplanderguy

To my eyes, anyway, the '70 is the worst-looking Riv to that date! That side molding, and had choice of two skirt styles. The smaller one always made me think, "Why bother?". Big visible seams! Arrgh!

I used to think the first Toronados were too big for the styling, but I've grown to like the '66-67. At Hershey a few years back, a friend of mine was looking at a '70 Toronado GT for sale in the car corral. I guess it's a pretty desirable iteration. For some reason I think I remember some subtle blue accents in chrome, which seemed a little weird. I'm foggy on that though.

UPDATE: After looking at pics online, I recall the Toro GT we looked at was silver with blue interior and blue vinyl top, so the GT stripes around the wheel openings (fairly subtle) were blue, which was a bit jarring on a silver luxury coupe.

benjaminh

sda

For the 70 Rivera, Buick replaced the Riv specific dash with that of the standard full size dash (LeSabre/Electra). The drum speedometer was no longer, standard square shaped speedo. The Toro still had its specific dash and drum speedo.

andre1969

benjaminh said:

When I see this full-sized '61 Buick viewed head-on like that, I can sort of understand what the stylists were thinking of, when they did the headlights for the '63-64 Riviera. It still doesn't quite work, in my opinion, on the Riv, but at least I think I can figure out their inspiration.

roadburner

uplanderguy said:

For awhile, I have thought the '65 was my favorite Riv. Got rid of the plain taillights, fake rear-quarter scoops, and inboard headlights, although I'm still not crazy about the big corners in front.

I've been liking the '66 and '67 more and more lately.

I might be off a year or so here, but the '68/69 looks nice everywhere but talk about 'inboard headlights'. They're more egregious than the '63-64!

I had a 1967 that I bought for $5.00 and then drove all that summer. I loved it.

explorerx4

Cringey Motorweek Cimmaron review.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E77io_1O6NU

texases

As much as I admire his staying power, I find a lot of his narratives ‘cringeworthy’.

kyfdx

texases said:

As much as I admire his staying power, I find a lot of his narratives ‘cringeworthy’.

The current shows are like a trip back to the ‘80s.

kyfdx

On I-75, today.
Please excuse the crappy pictures. My wife is an even worse photographer than me.

kyfdx

jpp75

Great pictures as always @andre1969 Lots of great classics at the show, thanks for posting them!

xwesx

An old Willys on a huge flatbed; that's an odd sight!

kyfdx

xwesx said:

An old Willys on a huge flatbed; that's an odd sight!

Shocked to see it. Not shocked by my wife’s photo skills. 🙁

benjaminh

She got the shots in a tricky situation!++ Please send her our thanks.

fintail

And they seemed so cool and modern compared to the 70s barges that seemed hopelessly out of date, now people pine for the older cars.

I'll admit I am very amused by digital dashes and talking on-board computer systems, and a fancy period stereo is cool too. Funny how things come around, with LED gauges being a trend now, kind of the modern equivalent of a digital dash, maybe the reason I like the LED gauges in my car. MB never had a digital dash or talking car back in the day, same for BMW I am pretty sure, but Audi had a digital dash/talking option on the original Quattro.

tjc78 said:

The 80s was such a transition time. You still had so many 70s barges on the road along with Accords and Camrys. Then like Fin said the Taurus came and made everything look old. There were Grand Nationals, Irocs, and Mustang along with Z cars.. if you wanted sporty.

Cars talked, they had digital dashes with giant green numbers, 10 band equalizers and tape decks. The luxury cars had overstuffed button tufted seats. What’s not to love?

Oh … they were almost all underpowered, had 85 mph speedometers and weren’t very reliable!

benjaminh

imidazol97

I was looking at the dash on the 1946 Plymouth.

There's a cruise control (labelled "throttle"). IIRC, those could be pulled out
to maintain a higher engine speed.

The car has push button start on the left of the speedometer. We
have push button starting today!

I see the radio has push buttons. I didn't think those came about until the 50's.

kyfdx

Member needs help identifying old car in picture:
https://forums.edmunds.com/discussion/66792/general/x/any-thoughts-on-what-car-this-is#latest

andre1969

This popped up in my facebook feed. Ouch.



Looks like another '49-51 customized Mercury might be getting a donor grille.

xwesx

sad

uplanderguy

The Ohio plates got me curious. I see that recently happened in Toledo.

The car--I can remember when my low-income widowed aunt had one of those, in maroon. My grandfather had bought it for her from his elderly neighbors, the McDonalds. I was born in 1958 and I can remember the car pretty clearly, which tells you how old it would have been. It was followed by a '56 Ford Customline two-door sedan in mint green.

That old Willys pickup would have been built in Toledo, also. Jeep is still in Toledo, pretty cool after all these years.

explorerx4

The Fins seem to love their big iron and big cams. About 8 minutes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-O1SE3CHq4U

fintail

Old American cars are big in Sweden and Norway too.

fintail

Out early this morning, saw several custom/rod type rigs, as there's apparently a car show in town. Also saw a 60s Dodge pickup that appeared to be still doing hard work (from the days when trucks were used as tools instead of by tools), and most memorable, an early 240Z, a little aged looking, definitely not detailed and shined up, still on original hubcaps - a desirable and swiftly appreciating car today.

The car show appears to not be my kind of thing, so I am not attending. I will sound jaded and jerky, but I have seen enough of that, maybe I am getting older and lazy. If you want to see an orange 38 Chevy with a 350 under the hood, a bright yellow 69 Camaro with a 402 under the hood, a purple 54 Ford pickup with a 350 under the hood, etc, you'll be in heaven. Funny how I see that material on the road and might remark that it looks clean and cared for, but if I see an Audi 5000 or a Fairmont etc on the road, I think 'holy crap, look at that!'.

sda

While stopping at the local nursery to buy some plants I spotted this. Looked clean and fairly original. Torino GT with the 302.

ab348

The latest old-car YouTube sensation, Adam of Rare Classic Cars, has been busy for the last few days and produced a number of new videos. Here’s one of them:

https://youtu.be/7FSptVe2ExI

fintail

I agree with him about those wheelcovers - I usually hate wire caps, but somehow they are well suited for that car. The power antenna also amused me.

texases

Those are some of the nicest wire wheel hubcaps I've seen. I don't like most of them, mostly because they tend to be flat, with no resemblance to real wire wheels.

ab348

GM made some very good-looking wire wheel covers back then. Later on they weren't so great. I think that had something to do with the introduction of the "key" to retain them. These do not seem to have that.

I was also amused by the "local/distance" power antenna - I had never seen that before. I was interested in his reaction at the end to GM's non-AC ventilation system. Up here in the great white north the inability to shut the fan completely off was a real annoyance in the winter as it would be sucking in subzero air before the car warmed up. The other thing with it was that in most of the cars I had experience with, the fan motor invariably made a noise after some number of months/years and you couldn't get rid of it by shutting it down.

The '75 is certainly a very nice example, but as a car I have to admit it does little for me.

stickguy

out driving on I287, heading toward the traffic jam on the TZ bridge westbound, a bright green 50s something Mercury Monclair. Happy looking guy driving with his elbow out the window. Hopefully he likes to sweat since no AC, and that his cooling system is fresh!

andre1969

I know I'm in the minority here, but I actually like that odd '74-76 B-body hardtop roofline, where it appears they tried to combine "Colonade" with "true hardtop". I think it looks best on a '75-76 LeSabre, but I like it on the Delta, as well.

It's funny...sometimes I can find something to be offputting because it's weird, but sometimes, the weirdness is a part of its charm!

uplanderguy

I never liked that roofline, although I realize it is good in that it does allow for a roll-down quarter window.

I never liked the looks of three side windows, or even the look of two vent/rear quarter windows up against each other, like some Fords and Chryslers had in the '80's and '90's.

It was always funny to me, that although the Chevy (Impala Custom and Caprice Classic) two-door roofline from '74 to '76 wasn't beautiful, the more-expensive Pontiac, Olds, and Buicks used a roofline more similar to the Chevy than the three-window look the 'regular' full-size coupes did.

sda

I understand why the owner didn't opt for a/c, upper WI, little need. I would have thought they would have at least ordered the AM/FM mono radio instead of the AM. Perhaps the owner was located in a very rural area where FM broadcasts were sketchy? Even though the 67 Delta didn't have a/c Olds did a nice job of providing an upscale presentation of vacuum activated vent doors actuated by nice push buttons on the climate control panel. For the 75, Olds cheaped out and provided two cheap cable operated vent levers and made little attempt to hide the fact the car didn't have a/c by covering up what would have been a/c vent outlets with cheap looking black plastic blanks.

andre1969

Back in college I knew a guy with an '87-91 style Civic. It didn't have a/c, which I thought was a bit odd, but he was a recent transplant from Washington State, near Seattle I think. I also had a friend who got a '90 Plymouth Horizon, brand new, and it didn't have a/c. I remember him saying something like "There's only three days out of the year you need a/c in this area!"

Of course, back in those days, we were in our late teens and early 20's, and I'm convinced we had a higher tolerance for wild temperature swings when we were younger. I don't know that I'd be able to tolerate a car without a/c for very long, nowadays. Admittedly, the a/c doesn't work in my convertible or the 5th Ave, and the DeSoto doesn't have it. But I also don't drive those cars in brutally hot weather, either. And in situations where there's a car show during hot weather, I'm usually on the field in the morning, and driving home in the evening, so I'm not driving during the hottest part of the day.

kyfdx

My first car with A/C was in 1990, when I was 32. Of course, I was still single, so didn't have a lot of pressure from you know who.

andre1969

uplanderguy said:

I never liked that roofline, although I realize it is good in that it does allow for a roll-down quarter window.

It was always funny to me, that although the Chevy (Impala Custom and Caprice Classic) two-door roofline from '74 to '76 wasn't beautiful, the more-expensive Pontiac, Olds, and Buicks used a roofline more similar to the Chevy than the three-window look the 'regular' full-size coupes did.

As much as I prefer a true hardtop, with a roll-down rear window, I wonder how much that feature would have swayed my purchase decision, if I was shopping for a new car around 1974-76? I think the base 1975 Impala sport coupe is a really sharp looking car. Buyers seemed to overwhelmingly choose the fixed-window styles, though. For '75 they sold 21,333 of the hardtop sport coupe, while the fixed-window Custom coupe sold 49,455, and the Caprice coupe sold 36,041.

I think it just hit me, why I like that '74-76 B-O-P roofline. Here's a shot of it from the side.



I never cared for the fixed-window models, because it didn't seem like they lined up at the B-pillar. The rear window followed the line of the decklid fairly closely, but the door window followed the line of the hood, and where they met at the B-pillar, it looked like they were designed by two different committees.


And two-toned like this, I think it looks even worse, because where the color breaks between the red and white doesn't line up with the bottom of either window, but sort of splits the difference. I think that extra-thick B-pillar on the Chevy looks out of place too, as we tend to be more accustomed to either a thin B-pillar, or no pillar at all, and then a thick C-pillar.

In contrast, the "Colonade/hardtop" roofline of the '74-76 B-O-Ps, it lets the back window follow the trunk line, and the roll-down window follow the beltline, and where they meet at the pillar, just seems a bit more sleek and flowing to me. The way they meet up, and with the way that pillar slants forward, it makes the mis-matched windows look more like they're a part of the design, rather than thrown on at random.

**EDIT: I know I've asked this before, but I can't remember...was there any difference in interior trim with the Impala Custom? Like, did you get any interior upgrades? Or was it just a matter of giving it the Caprice-like roofline?

sda

I do prefer the styling of the Olds over the Chevy. Black looks nice on the Olds. The color gives the car a dignified look.

benjaminh

sda

benjaminh said:

59 Galaxie with a/c and electric windows. That has to be fairly rare.

andre1969

Ford really got a lot of mileage out of that body design. They changed the styling enough that the '57, '58, and especially the '59 looked like considerably different cars.

For comparison, the '59 Plymouth just looks like a slightly more garish '57. And for those three years, the Chevy actually WAS three totally different cars!

The '60 Ford must have been some really bad timing, too. The fairly formal '59 was a pretty hot seller, and beat out the Chevy that year, but I guess the Ford designers figured the '59 Chevy would be a hot item, so they let it influence their '60 styling?

I like the '59 dash too, the way it wraps around into the dogleg A-pillars. '57-58 did that too, although it looks like the design was changed a bit, and bulked up, for '59.

explorerx4

Not as many chicklets in the grille as a '59 Cadi but still al lot.