I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

explorerx4

Saw this cutey while walking the granddog.
Plenty of room in that parking space!

stickguy

love the color but the bumpers have to go.

xwesx

stickguy said:

love the color but the bumpers have to go.

Ah, 5mph bumpers.... the ultimate test for originality buffs!

roadburner

Plus the suspension was lifted to meet the moronic bumper regs and emission issues caused one SU carb to be deleted.

explorerx4

https://youtu.be/IH3P-CYilzw

stickguy

roadburner said:

Plus the suspension was lifted to meet the moronic bumper regs and emission issues caused one SU carb to be deleted.

perfect candidate for a mild restomod.

texases

Moss Motors will get that back to chrome bumper spec in no time...just $$$.

imidazol97

A couple of classics that I found.

Almost original especially the Edsel. I'd like the Edsel better and consider it perfect were the rear antenna taken off. It only needs one antenna in those days. The Edsel is the best I've seen outside of a museum.

The wagon has unusual rims, IMHO. I took the photo to minimize the rims in the view.

fintail

Yeah what would be the point of an antenna in front and one in back other than looks? I have seen some cars with dual rear antennas too. Edsels are cool, for me, has to be a 58 or 60 though.

I am surprised a state as populous as Ohio had such short plate alphanumeric sequences then - I think by 1958 WA moved to 3 letters/3 numbers.

imidazol97

That would be 676,000 plates at first glance. But I believe OH added 4 digits with 1 letter and plates that were all numbers.

kyfdx

I love the wagon

ab348

kyfdx said:

I love the wagon

I kinda like these 2 better:

stickguy

an assortment driving around today. See how many I can remember!

a 67ish Nova, with some tasteful mods. mint green. 70 or so GTO convertible. A modified sounding 240Z. a guy driving through Aldis with a hot rod (I'm sure if was fiberglass, looked like a 32 Ford maybe, something of that vintage).

and a true oddball, a 70s vintage Rolls Royce, 4 door. Never see those moving.

tjc78

Saw a vintage Rolls Royce today. Not sure exactly what year but I’d guess 60s Silver Cloud. It was gorgeous.

imidazol97

ab348 said:

kyfdx said:

I love the wagon

I kinda like these 2 better:

I almost cropped the picture to remove those and decided to leave them in. 50 Ford?
19XX GTO with the tach in the hood! I remember both when they were new and hot models.

uplanderguy

'70 GTO.

Those Fords must have looked so fresh at the time. And this being a Club Coupe (I think that may be what Ford called that body), it's the most attractive body style IMHO.

uplanderguy

Some liberty taken in calling that '62 Chevy wagon a 'Nomad'!

That tailgate emblem appears to be a one-off custom thing.

In '62 the wagons were called the same names as the sedans; Biscayne, Bel Air, and Impala.

andre1969

fintail said:

Yeah what would be the point of an antenna in front and one in back other than looks? I have seen some cars with dual rear antennas too. Edsels are cool, for me, has to be a 58 or 60 though.

I am surprised a state as populous as Ohio had such short plate alphanumeric sequences then - I think by 1958 WA moved to 3 letters/3 numbers.

Maybe one of them is for the Sirius XM, or something. 🤡 My '57 DeSoto has dual antennas. I'm pretty sure one is a dummy. They're mounted on top of the tailfins though, so having two of them gives the car a more symmetrical look. I think if it was mounted anywhere else, the symmetry wouldn't be needed.

For some reason, I was thinking that the '57-58 Mercury Turnpike Cruisers/Park Lanes had dual antennas, integrated into those fresh air scoops mounted on top of the windshield. But upon looking at pictures, all I'm seeing is a conventional antenna mounted on the passenger side fender, and usually raked back a bit.

ab348

andre1969 said:

For some reason, I was thinking that the '57-58 Mercury Turnpike Cruisers/Park Lanes had dual antennas, integrated into those fresh air scoops mounted on top of the windshield. But upon looking at pictures, all I'm seeing is a conventional antenna mounted on the passenger side fender, and usually raked back a bit.

They had *fake* antennas mounted in the over-windshield scoops. Not overstyled or anything, that car.

andre1969

ab348 said:

andre1969 said:

For some reason, I was thinking that the '57-58 Mercury Turnpike Cruisers/Park Lanes had dual antennas, integrated into those fresh air scoops mounted on top of the windshield. But upon looking at pictures, all I'm seeing is a conventional antenna mounted on the passenger side fender, and usually raked back a bit.

They had *fake* antennas mounted in the over-windshield scoops. Not overstyled or anything, that car.

THAAT's right. For some reason I was thinking the little antennas stuck on top of those little scoops, and were raked back. But instead, they were mounted in the middle of them, and pointed straight out, forward. That's probably why they don't really show up in the pics I found online.

Here's a closeup though, of a set that popped up on eBay. One of them is missing, but the other is intact: '57-59 for Mercury might be one of those rare instances where the cars actually improved, style-wise, with each passing year. At least in my opinion, I think the '58 Merc is slighty better looking than the '57, although neither one really appeals to me. I always found the '59 Mercury to be really good looking, for some reason. The '59-60 is supposedly an all-new body, compared to '57-58, but for '59, it really doesn't look "all new" enough. I used to think the '57-59 was all one design, and then the '60 was a one-year only, but it turns out the '60 is just a REALLY heavy facelift of the '59.

fintail

andre1969 said:

fintail said:

Yeah what would be the point of an antenna in front and one in back other than looks? I have seen some cars with dual rear antennas too. Edsels are cool, for me, has to be a 58 or 60 though.

I am surprised a state as populous as Ohio had such short plate alphanumeric sequences then - I think by 1958 WA moved to 3 letters/3 numbers.

Maybe one of them is for the Sirius XM, or something. 🤡 My '57 DeSoto has dual antennas. I'm pretty sure one is a dummy. They're mounted on top of the tailfins though, so having two of them gives the car a more symmetrical look. I think if it was mounted anywhere else, the symmetry wouldn't be needed.

For some reason, I was thinking that the '57-58 Mercury Turnpike Cruisers/Park Lanes had dual antennas, integrated into those fresh air scoops mounted on top of the windshield. But upon looking at pictures, all I'm seeing is a conventional antenna mounted on the passenger side fender, and usually raked back a bit.

I was thinking the same thing - symmetry. Another one comes to mind, the 58 Impala. I remember back in the day, probably approaching 30 years ago, a friend of mine who liked period cars wanted a 58 Impala, specifically calling out "dual rear antennas", so I guess that feature is memorable.

Funny thing how some are predisposed to certain cars - that guy ended up buying a couple of MKZs - new - when he was in his 30s, and then bought a CT6. He brought down some average customer age numbers. On the flipside, my friend who was really into Monte Carlos and 70s/80s Chevys now has a Subaru and his wife an Odyssey.

explorerx4

I saw a Range Rover the other day that had side by side shark fin antenna's.
Just another small way to one up your neighbors SUV.

stickguy

A TJC machine. a 1980s something Town Car (possibly Continental, but a long, square box 4 door) in that silver blue that was comment. the "downsized" ones (only compared to the mid 70s vintage)

then just up the road, a guy washing a 1956 T Bird. Black.

tjc78

Like this?

stickguy

yup. looks like the color and everything. was street parked in town so being driven.

sda

https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https://www.motoexotica.com/vehicles/4253/1959-mercury-monterey-1959-mercury-monterey&psig=AOvVaw26Zs_SKGUZcgwM8-=1717433578767000&source=images&cd=vfe&opi=89978449&ved=

Mercury for 59 made a big deal of changing to parallel sweep wipers for the better coverage in the middle of the windshield.
For 61, 62 they reverted back to opposing sweep wipers. Cost? For 63 Ford and Mercury went to parallel sweep wipers.

uplanderguy

RE.: Edsels--agree with fin; I like the '58 and '60 and not the '59.

About the '58's--I do think that since I first heard people talk about the grille and female anatomy, I can't unsee that when I look at one.

uplanderguy

Spotted at the Stude meet I was at in South Bend this past weekend. For Andre. ‘57. No price noted. Why do people do that?

uplanderguy

Only true ‘spotting' I saw on the road, about an hour east of South Bend, slightly west of Angola, IN, on Route 20.

'62 Gran Turismo Hawk. Looks nice, but asking $25K. Yeesh.

'63 paint color, some rust on bumpers, old tires, '64-only taillight chrome surrounds.

explorerx4

I don't like it, only one antenna.

andre1969

Interesting...that DeSoto only has one antenna, looks like no outside mirrors at all, but they sprung for the chrome pieces on top of the fenders. At least, I think those trim pieces were optional on the Firedome, standard on the Fireflite. I know I've seen Firedomes without them, but I guess that could also just mean they were restored and those pieces weren't put back on.

I think quad headlights were federalized on 1/1/1957. At least, my reasoning behind that is that DeSoto held back introduction of the Adventurer model until the '57 calendar year started, so they could give them all quad headlights. So this '57 Firedome is probably an early production model. I wonder though, once quads were federalized, if Mopar continued to build single-headlight Firedome/Fireflites, Chryslers, and Imperials, or if they were quad-only? The entry level DeSoto Firesweep was Dodge-based, and all of them were single headlights for '57.

On the bigger DeSotos and Chryslers, I had always thought those headlight openings were designed to take either single or quad setups, but apparently the openings are slightly different. The single-headlight opening is a bit taller, and a bit narrower. It's subtle, but just enough to make the headlight bezels, chrome surrounds, etc incompatible with each other.

I'm liking that '62 Gran Turismo Hawk. Even if there are flaws, it looks good in the pic. I like that color!

ab348

Back when quads were introduced, approval or denial of their use was on a state by state basis. There are several articles on the entire issue giving far more detail than you ever wanted to know noted below. Note, Andre, that the first one takes issue with your statement that the DeSoto headlamp pods differed, Not sure who is correct:

https://www.curbsideclassic.com/automotive-histories/curbside-face-off-all-the-1957-cars-with-alternate-front-ends/

https://www.curbsideclassic.com/blog/cc-humor/monday-funnies-headlamp-hassles/

https://books.google.com/books?id=iSUDAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PP1&pg=PA65#v=onepage&q&f=false

In all of that discussion an d related commentary, I failed to note any criticism of the truly awful single rectangular sealed beams introduced on some 1978 models, which seemed the worse of both worlds.

andre1969

Thinking back now, it is kind of interesting that while rectangular lights first came into use in '75 on the domestics, they were all quad lights. So yeah, the single rectangulars didn't come out until 1978, with one exception...the 1977 Pontiac Phoenix. I think it was a mid/late '77 introduction though.

I did think that when GM downsized the intermediates for '78, going back to single headlights seemed like a step downmarket. But then the '78 Grand Prix, which kept the quad lights, with the turn signal in between, it just looked too big for the car! And then with cars like the Ford Fairmont/Mercury Zephyr, the quad headlight models definitely looked nicer. Same with say, a '77 Diplomat or LeBaron vs an Aspen or Volare, although to be fair, Chrysler also did a lot of sheetmetal changes on those, as well to make the Diplomat/LeBaron look more upscale. And I think the '80 Dodge Mirada/Cordoba LS models looked nice, with single headlights, but wonder if they would've looked better with quads. The regular '80 Cordoba though, with the more upright grille, looked a bit awkward to me regardless, and I don't know if quad lights would have worked.

As for the single vs quad headlight '57 Chryslers and senior DeSoto models, I'll be damned if I can tell a difference between the size of the openings, when I see them side by side like that! But, someone mentioned to me, on a DeSoto or Forward Look facebook page, I think, that they were all built with quad headlight fenders, but for the singles, they cut the front part of the fender out, and welded in a slightly different part, that housed the single headlight bezels. And if you know what to look for, you can spot it. Someone else mentioned buying the chrome trim surround for one size, thinking they were one size fits all, only to find out they weren't.

uplanderguy

andre, I've got a close-up of the phone number for that '57 DeSoto if you want it.

uplanderguy

andre, I like the color on that Hawk too, even though it's incorrect for the year.

For years, a guy from Illinois would have his '64 Gran Turismo Hawk at this show and meet every year. It was a similar, though not exact, correct color called 'Horizon Green'. It had green vinyl interior, and the full instrumentation including tach. It had the Powershift automatic on the floor (PRND21), and correct-size tires with factory-looking whitewall width and placement. Beautiful car that looked totally stock. He had owned it since 1966, having bought it in South Bend then as a two-year-old car.

He knew I lusted after it, and it got to be a running joke that when he'd see me there, he'd smile and say, "Still not for sale".

uplanderguy

Quickly found a pic of his car:

I'm pretty sure, though will have to check, that the decklid antenna was no longer an option for '64.

The '64 has the smooth, denuded decklid instead of one with that large metal panel in back. I like the plain decklid.

A '64 Hawk is my favorite Studebaker. Still some visible DNA from the '53 there, but supposedly only a handful of part nos. are perfect interchanges. Studebaker often seemed to use the word "classic" in the Hawk's advertising in that '62-64 period.

‘64 Hawk production, 1,767.

uplanderguy

Spotted at my local donut place. ‘63. Emblem on front fender reads “Golden Commando Powered”.

imidazol97

uplanderguy said:

Quickly found a pic of his car:

I'm pretty sure, though will have to check, that the decklid antenna was no longer an option for '64.

The '64 has the smooth, denuded decklid instead of one with that large metal panel in back. I like the plain decklid.

A '64 Hawk is my favorite Studebaker. Still some visible DNA from the '53 there, but supposedly only a handful of part nos. are perfect interchanges. Studebaker often seemed to use the word "classic" in the Hawk's advertising in that '62-64 period.

‘64 Hawk production, 1,767.

Is the house in the background related in some way to STudebaker history?

lBeautiful car. I like the single, centered rear antenna. That was popular for a time in that era.

imidazol97

uplanderguy said:

Spotted at my local donut place. ‘63. Emblem on front fender reads “Golden Commando Powered”.

Wow. Love that car. Like the wheels. It's 1963 all over again just like it was fresh out of the factory.

uplanderguy

The house behind the Hawk is Copshaholm, the Oliver mansion. Oliver Tractor was also HQ’d in South Bend.

I really enjoy South Bend. Go outside the city limits about five miles in any direction and you see corn fields. Hard to imagine it was the home base, in fact the only U.S. operations, of the fifth-largest domestic automaker, and in my lifetime.

explorerx4

That Plymouth has a large diameter exhaust system.

texases

Thanks for introducing me to "Golden Commando", I hadn't heard of it. Seems to have been a bigger deal in the earlier Furies, late '50s.

ab348

While I have found the decline in content and usefulness at hemmings.com very sad, and so seldom visit there these days, I still get a daily email update from them. This was interesting today. Quite the classic car theft ring, in sleepy little Belleville, Ontario!

https://www.hemmings.com/stories/police-raid-leads-to-barn-find

explorerx4

Some Chrysler/Dodge 383 trivia.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPs9HkUG8I0

andre1969

Interesting. I had always theorized that they had two different 383s in 1959-60 to try and keep some kind of engine exclusivity/prestige with Chrysler. Perhaps trying to push the angle that it didn't share engines with the cheaper cars? They were able to do that in earlier years, when Plymouth, Dodge, DeSoto, and Chrysler/Imperial all had unique engines, but starting in 1957 they started to go a bit more "corporate."

I didn't realize it was simply supply/demand issues. Although it is curious that they picked 383 for the Chrysler version of the RB.

I've heard that too, about people complaining about the demise of the Chrysler Hemi, and initially not embracing the Wedge head...even though the 300E performed better than the 300D.

Interestingly though, with DeSoto, the wedge heads didn't perform quite as well as the Hemi had, at least not initially. I have a book that has a compilation of DeSoto road tests from 1952-60. It includes a test of a 1957 Firedome convertible with the 270 hp 341-2bbl Hemi, a 1958 Firesweep convertible with the 280 hp 350-2bbl B wedge, and a 1958 Firedome hardtop coupe with the 295 hp 361 2-bbl wedge.

The '57 did 0-60 in 9.7 seconds, while the two '58's took 10.8 seconds, despite having more hp, more torque, and lighter weight. They all used the 3-speed Torqueflite. However, the '57 used a 3.31:1 axle, while the two '58s used a 3.15. Interestingly, they also had a test of a 1958 South African Diplomat, essentially a Plymouth, with the 230 hp 318-2bbl poly-head, and 2-speed Powerflite, and got the same 10.8 seconds, 0-60. No mention on that one's axle, but I'd guess around 3.54:1

It also has a test of a 1959 Fireflite with the 325 hp 383-4bbl. They were back to a 3.31:1 axle. 0-60 was 8.9 seconds.

roadburner

A cool ad that popped up on my FB feed:

fintail

In 1983, that 300SD was probably the best sedan one could buy on this market. It came at a price, around 35K of those dollars, but those and the 300D probably have the highest survival rate of somewhat mass market sedans of the same year.

roadburner said:

A cool ad that popped up on my FB feed:

texases

Saw a rough second-gen (early '80s) Supra, missing trim, windows open in 93 degrees (no a/c, likely), it had the wheel arches and performance model alloys, no rear wing, I bet it would need a lot of work.

Like this, but silver over black, and rough:

uplanderguy

This came up on my FB feed today. Wife and I are planning in a month or less to see the Truman Home and museum, and WWI Museum, on the way home from driving to visit our daughter in Seattle (Ravenna section, near Roosevelt section).

Truman was a Mopar man; I've seen several pics of him with Mopars over the years, including a '57 Dodge and this '72 Newport, his last car, in the ubiquitous light green. Car has just under 19K miles per the site.

Note Truman's license plate no. from when he owned the car--"5745".

https://www.facebook.com/HarrySTrumanNHS/videos/959840448941435

explorerx4

V-E Day.