I stopped by the original location of the MB dealer in Seattle today (a friend of mine just moved to the city, and had to show me the cars), and they had a nice display of classics in the old showroom. The place has been there since the 50s, and there were many cool poster sized pics of the showroom back in the day too - lots of fintails.
Anyway, they had a 300SL roadster, a beautiful 220SE ponton cabrio, a 280SE cabrio, a W111 220SE cabrio, a mint original 190 ponton, and a W107 280SL. It's nice to see a place in touch with its heritage.
I'm visiting in the Phoenix area. The dry desert air preserves cars very well but there aren't that many interesting cars around, it's all white Buicks and Grand Marquis.
Yesterday I did spot a '54 MG-TF and a nice Ford Model A. The Model A roadster was so clean and straight, I 'spect it may have been a replica.
...for fans of the 1960 Buick is "The Facts of Life" starring Bob Hope and Lucille Ball. Bob drives a big black 1960 Buick Electra hardtop and Lucy has a blue and white 1960 Buick convertible.
Yeah, maybe even on a commercial chassis. I have seen similar old motorhomes on Cadillac chassis. Those were probably the biggest and sturdiest platforms around.
I think all motorhomes from that time are crude. I once saw one that was based on a ca. 1950 Caddy...it was a Caddy front clip with a new body, more or less. It was badged by some company, but had the look of a backyard project.
A few oddballs out here today. A ca. 1970 Roadrunner. A pristine, I mean showroom looking 1985 Cavalier...who would have cared for this thing like that? A really decent looking (well, condition-wise)5 door Camry. A Lexus IS sportcross. The weirdest thing of the day - an Audi S6 wagon. But it was the old (1992-97?) style. It was red and looked BRAND NEW. I saw it in the parking lot of a local park where I was taking a walk. I looked it over closely...the interior looked brand new, the paint was unmarked...has to be rare. And I saw a Mercedes C36 AMG that didn't even notice me - young woman driving it. Probably has fallen down to the level of a normal used car rather than something that deserves to be enthusiast owned.
Why on earth would anyone bother to convert a Catera back to look like an Omega?
Same reason people convert Pontiac GTOs back to Holden Monaros, or put "H" badges on their '92 Integra: to be different and restore the car to its "original" appearance.
Busses from that era aren't crude though, nor are travel trailers (air streams, etc.) And certainly the Packard factory wouldn't build anything so badly.....might have come out of a steel company that used to make boilers or something...
I suspect it was from a place that made rowboats or wheelbarrows or something to that effect. The Caddy I saw was like a big box with a Caddy front clip - no design at all, even worse than that Packard.
Oh, on the obscure topic, last night I saw one of those weird mid 90s VW Golfs where every body panel is a different color. What a dumb idea, looks like a clown car.
I remember CAR making fun of that multicolored Golf back in the day, saying it would only appeal to German (read: bad) taste. I think it might have been called a harlequin.
Those Deltas make it on ebay now and then. Cool on paper, but I have to imagine they aren't reliable.
I don't think the big, medium and heavy-duty truck-based motorhomes that are the norm now were really mass produced until the early 1960's. I have seen various 50's campers, kind of the predecessor to the Class-C mini-motorhome, usually based on something sturdy like a Cadillac chassis. In 2005 though, I took a picture of this 1955 Chevy camper conversion
Here's a pic of the inside. Sorry, I was too lazy to rotate it! :P I thought it was kinda odd seeing one based on a Chevy, since back then comparing a Chevy to a Cadillac in terms of toughness was probably like comparing a Malibu to a 3/4 ton pickup today! Well, maybe not THAT extreme!
Back then they really didn't have vans yet, at least not in the form that we know them today. And most pickup trucks were relatively crude, underpowered things that were great for hauling hay and working around on the farm and such, and usually equipped with a 6-cyl or modest V-8 and a stick shift. Not the best design for hauling a heavy vehicle in comfort at highway speeds, the way a Caddy platform with its big V-8 and excellent 4-speed Hydramatic could.
In the early 60's there was a motorhome based on the Chevy Corvair, believe it or not. It was rear-engined, just like the Corvair, and was relatively compact as motorhomes go. I think it "only" weighed about 5,000 pounds.
I think the first company to really put motorhomes on the map was a company called Frank. One of their more famous early products was the 1963 Dodge motorhome, later called Travco. Here's an old brochure for one. Kind of a nice trip back in time.
A pristine '96 BMW M3.. I've admired it for a few years.. it resides about a mile from where I live.. Always assumed it was a '98 or '99 because it is in great shape, and has the M-Contour wheels..
Yesterday, it is parked in the bank parking lot on the corner with a 4-sale sign.. No mileage or price.. no cosmetic issues, except the interior leather is showing the wear and tear of a ten-year old car..
I heard the nice, deep, rumbling sound that was unmistakably understressed domestic big-block coming from my cousins' place next door (we're all related around here but not like THAT, now...this ain't West VA :P ).
I look out the window to see this light silvery metallic green '66 Olds 4-door hardtop. I saw an old lady get out of it that I didn't recognize at first. Then it dawned on me...it was my cousin's ex-wife. I hadn't seen her in oh, at least a decade. I went out to say hey, and briefly catch up on old times. The car was a Dynamic 88. I'm not sure where that fell in the 88 lineup...was that one the cheapest? It had a big-block 2-bbl under the hood, I'd guess a 425? Interior was black and the seats had a fragile cloth pattern that was tearing in spots. The car looked pretty solid, except for the typical rust on the lower rear quarters.
I'd seen the car around before, but it just never dawned on me that it belonged to a cousin (ex-cousin?) of mine! Oh well, I guess I come by my taste in cars honestly.
I should've told her that if she ever decides to get rid of it, give me first dibs at it. But these are the same people I bought a '69 Bonneville from years ago. One of the biggest turds I've ever owned, although I blame them for that more than I blame GM. Plus, I only paid $400 for that turd, so I guess I can't complain!
A nice bunch of cars, more rare there than here, in the main. Intergrale is one of the greats, regardless of the rust, while the Cosworth is rare here now, as so many were stolen and crashed by joyriders - although several of our police forces used them for pursuit work as they were verrrry quick... I also like the Toyota Sera. It wasn't sold here new, but they are quite a common 'grey import'. brought in second-hand from JDM, in fact I saw one last week. The Micra was actually made in UK for the Euro market, it is known in Japan as the March, I think, and one of the girls in our office is still running one of the earliest ones as her everyday car, it just goes for ever...
Just that the car hasn't had the snot beaten out of it. My opinion is that M3 motors are stressed to begin with and aren't as long-lived as the more leisurely big sixes.
Actually I'd be concerned about the oil quality during the time she owned it because it was driven so little and on short drives which means a lot of contaminants stay in the sump rather than being purged by high engine temperatures over long drives between starts. Grocery store, doctors office, church most likely aren't 15 mile drives at normal speeds.
And I hope it wasn't the little, old lady driving the wrong way on a 4 lane boulevard like it waas a two lane street that my wife met yesterday. I wonder if the 80-year old knew she was on the wrong side of the center divider. My wife said it was a Toyota-guess their demographics is getting higher in age.
The "old lady" or "old man" myth needs serious re-visiting. I deal with these types of cars in appraisal work and they aren't what they are cracked up to be. Most are neglected despite their originality, and if an older person was driving, invariably you will see little scrapes and dents on just about every panel. Problem is the older drivers don't SEE a lot of the defects---LOL!
I was just passing along what my father taught me about cars and farm machinery. He bought a Studebaker that had been driven only across town to work and back. It was sludged up greatly and wasn't as good as he had expected.
There's a lot to be said for 6 month oil changes even if mileage hasn't accumulated and for cars driven on highways at 60 mph for 20 minutes or so.
My cars run better after a 100 mile round trip to Cinci to visit friends.
I saw a well-preserved early 80's Pontiac Phoenix coupe in one of the parking lots at work. White with a burgundy/brown interior. Nothing to really get excited about, but not something that you see everyday anymore, either. Seems like the X-body Citation, Phoenix, and Omega fell from grace very quickly after the first couple years, but for some reason the Skylark sold fairly well even in its final year.
I agree. Back in 1984 my grandfather willed me his 1976 Olds 98 (plain jane...no options!) with 20,000 miles. I thought it had been a great car. But I made it my driver it went from being driven 50 miles a month to 50 miles a day. That car broke down every time I turned around!
this morning: orange 1975 Pontiac Grand Ville convertible with white top.
That thing sounds pretty scary to me! I always considered the big Pontiacs to be a bit tackier than their Olds/Buick/Chevy counterparts, but putting a loud orange color on one just makes it that much worse!
Years ago, a local Honda dealer, of all places, had a 1973 Caprice convertible for sale. It was kind somewhere in between that school bus looking shade of yellow/orange that kids like to put on Mustangs, Civics, etc., and maybe about what you'd get if you put a sweet potato and some butterscotch pudding together in a blender. The car was actually in very nice shape, but I just couldn't get past that Godawful color!
Sounds kind of like that god-awful color on that overpriced 1974 Cadillac Sedan DeVille that kept showing up at Macungie. The original owner must've been color-blind.
Spotted another orange-metallic car at lunchtime - a lightly customized 1965 Chevrolet Malibu with Ralleye wheels.
I like that '61 Caddy. Didn't we discuss that one before, and there was some kind of issue with it? I remember thinking it was odd that it didn't have a/c. I know a/c was still expensive and comparatively rare by then, but I figured it would've been pretty common on a Caddy. Still, this is more of a low-line model.
I never thought I'd say this about one of my beloved 70's Electras, but that that '74 hurts my eyes! I think it's a combination of too much red and that loud, clashy print cloth pattern. I usually prefer big Buicks of this era to big Cadillacs, because they're usually a bit more smoothly styled and less conservative than the Oldsmobiles, but still not as loud and pimpy as the Cadillacs often are. But this thing is just too much for my tastes! Seems like the big Electra were really smooth and clean for '71-72, but got a bit loud and garish for '73-74, but then cleaned up again for '75-76. Of course, color plays a major role, too, in how pimpy or loud the car looks.
As for that green '79 New Yorker, I've already emailed the seller to find out WHICH Brownsville he's in! :shades: Turns out there are two of them in PA. One's near Pittsburgh and the other is near the Harrisburg/Chambersburg area, maybe two hours from me. Hey Shifty, if you're around and paying attention, how high should I be willing to go on that New Yorker? Looking at the bid history, it looks like it's starting to stall out around the $1500-1600 range.
I think about $3,000--$3,500 is all the money for the New Yorker and you should be able to recoup that if you don't keep the car. Won't be an easy re-sell (as you can see from the eBay "action") but low miles are always attractive to someone, even if the buyer pool for a '79 NYer is small.
Fiat 130 -- somebody at eBay needs to create an avatar called the "Bidding Dummy", which will pop up whenever someone puts up a starting bid that's higher than the value of the car.
'48 Dodge -- I see that some people continue to confuse the early Chrysler "Hemi" with the "real" Hemis of the 60s. The early Hemi engine was not particularly powerful and is not that easy to build up. I think a short stroke Chevy of the same era offers so much more possibility.
Ponton Wagon -- interesting. I'm going to watch it and see what it bids to. I still don't think these wagons or the fintail wagons are really worth more than $6,000 bucks on average (if you cut out the few real highs and few real lows in the sales database).
PACER -- if the seller turns down the money that's already been offered, he's crazy. I'm watching this one, too. I figure $5,500 tops and even then the buyer is buried for life. But this IS eBay after all, where we often see more dollars than sense.
Fintail w a/c: my fintail had that same unit I think. Worked fine, even if it did weigh 500 lbs. A testament to the strength of Mercedes' dashboards. I'll watch this one, too. Here again, I'm thinking $5,500 is all the money for a mint fintail...maybe more for an SE or a 300.
'48 Dodge -- I see that some people continue to confuse the early Chrysler "Hemi" with the "real" Hemis of the 60s. The early Hemi engine was not particularly powerful and is not that easy to build up.
But then why was it so common back in the day for people to yank these things out of passenger cars and put them in hotrods and such?
Now FWIW, a 1954 DeSoto Hemi only puts out 170 hp with a 2-bbl carb. It was a fairly powerful engine in its day, given its displacement, which was only 276.1 cubic inches. In 1952-53 it had 160 hp. In comparison, Oldsmobile around that time needed a ~303 CID to get 160 hp.
However, times changed fast back then, especially when Chevy came out with the 265 smallblock.
The seller mentions that DeSoto hemi is a 330, though. That would make it a 1956 DeSoto hemi, a 330.4 (I dunno why DeSoto tended to carry out their displacements to the tenths in their listings). 230 hp with the 2-bbl, 255 with the 4-bbl.
I think the "whale" Hemi (that term came out after they started calling the 426 the "elephant" Hemi) that most people want is the Chrysler 392. In 1957-58, I think it put out 350 hp with a 4-bbl, 375 with dual quads, and 390 with dual quads and higher compression.
Consumer reports used to gripe about the DeSoto and Chrysler Hemis as being overpowered, but I think if they had their way we would've all driven around in 6-cyl Ramblers back then.
The guy with the Plymouth was probably just trying to keep it Mopar, and a DeSoto Hemi really isn't that heavy as far as engines go...about 675 lb. That's about 100 more than the Chevy smallblock, but still considerably less than a Chrysler Hemi or later 426. And when you figure back in the 50's, a DeSoto 341 put out 270 hp with just a 2-bbl carb. To get a period Chevy 283 up to that you needed dual quads.
The Chevy smallblock would have much more aftermarket than an early Mopar Hemi, but would also have to be rebuilt a lot more often! :P
Comments
Anyway, they had a 300SL roadster, a beautiful 220SE ponton cabrio, a 280SE cabrio, a W111 220SE cabrio, a mint original 190 ponton, and a W107 280SL. It's nice to see a place in touch with its heritage.
Yesterday I did spot a '54 MG-TF and a nice Ford Model A.
The Model A roadster was so clean and straight, I 'spect it may have been a replica.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
Good freakshow value, looks like a project equal to restoring a 100 year old 5000 sq ft house
Someone got a little OCD, but it's cool in its own way
Might be the best left, but seems steep for something with such a propensity for fall-apart
At one time, GM could distinguish glamor from bling
Can't be many of these left
This Andre-mobile is getting healthy bids
-That Pierce Arrow Landaulet is a beauty, no wonder they were considered one of the best cars of thir day.
-Why on earth would anyone bother to convert a Catera back to look like an Omega?
Nothing from nothing is still nothing.:lemon:
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
Probably a home-built thing or one of those loony post WWII get-rich quick schemes....like flying cars and hover-craft made from vacuum cleaners.
Same reason people convert Pontiac GTOs back to Holden Monaros, or put "H" badges on their '92 Integra: to be different and restore the car to its "original" appearance.
Oh, on the obscure topic, last night I saw one of those weird mid 90s VW Golfs where every body panel is a different color. What a dumb idea, looks like a clown car.
Speaking of VWs someone imported a 1991 Golf 4WD here and they're selling it.
Golf Country
In Canada we have a rule that you can import anything 15 years or older without having to go through strict emission tests or inspections.
Here's some one offs that have been popping up recently from overseas:
Toyota Sera
Ford Cosworth
Japanese Micra
4 door Skyline
Topo something
Lancia Delta Integrale HF
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
Those Deltas make it on ebay now and then. Cool on paper, but I have to imagine they aren't reliable.
Here's a pic of the inside. Sorry, I was too lazy to rotate it! :P I thought it was kinda odd seeing one based on a Chevy, since back then comparing a Chevy to a Cadillac in terms of toughness was probably like comparing a Malibu to a 3/4 ton pickup today! Well, maybe not THAT extreme!
Back then they really didn't have vans yet, at least not in the form that we know them today. And most pickup trucks were relatively crude, underpowered things that were great for hauling hay and working around on the farm and such, and usually equipped with a 6-cyl or modest V-8 and a stick shift. Not the best design for hauling a heavy vehicle in comfort at highway speeds, the way a Caddy platform with its big V-8 and excellent 4-speed Hydramatic could.
In the early 60's there was a motorhome based on the Chevy Corvair, believe it or not. It was rear-engined, just like the Corvair, and was relatively compact as motorhomes go. I think it "only" weighed about 5,000 pounds.
I think the first company to really put motorhomes on the map was a company called Frank. One of their more famous early products was the 1963 Dodge motorhome, later called Travco. Here's an old brochure for one. Kind of a nice trip back in time.
Waaay overpriced as well
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
I love these cars...
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Yesterday, it is parked in the bank parking lot on the corner with a 4-sale sign.. No mileage or price.. no cosmetic issues, except the interior leather is showing the wear and tear of a ten-year old car..
Silver with gray leather...
I really want it.. :surprise:
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I look out the window to see this light silvery metallic green '66 Olds 4-door hardtop. I saw an old lady get out of it that I didn't recognize at first. Then it dawned on me...it was my cousin's ex-wife. I hadn't seen her in oh, at least a decade. I went out to say hey, and briefly catch up on old times. The car was a Dynamic 88. I'm not sure where that fell in the 88 lineup...was that one the cheapest? It had a big-block 2-bbl under the hood, I'd guess a 425? Interior was black and the seats had a fragile cloth pattern that was tearing in spots. The car looked pretty solid, except for the typical rust on the lower rear quarters.
I'd seen the car around before, but it just never dawned on me that it belonged to a cousin (ex-cousin?) of mine! Oh well, I guess I come by my taste in cars honestly.
I should've told her that if she ever decides to get rid of it, give me first dibs at it. But these are the same people I bought a '69 Bonneville from years ago. One of the biggest turds I've ever owned, although I blame them for that more than I blame GM. Plus, I only paid $400 for that turd, so I guess I can't complain!
I also like the Toyota Sera. It wasn't sold here new, but they are quite a common 'grey import'. brought in second-hand from JDM, in fact I saw one last week. The Micra was actually made in UK for the Euro market, it is known in Japan as the March, I think, and one of the girls in our office is still running one of the earliest ones as her everyday car, it just goes for ever...
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I'm sorry... that is already 1/3 of what I need to get that M3.. What the heck is she thinking??
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And I hope it wasn't the little, old lady driving the wrong way on a 4 lane boulevard like it waas a two lane street that my wife met yesterday. I wonder if the 80-year old knew she was on the wrong side of the center divider. My wife said it was a Toyota-guess their demographics is getting higher in age.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
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There's a lot to be said for 6 month oil changes even if mileage hasn't accumulated and for cars driven on highways at 60 mph for 20 minutes or so.
My cars run better after a 100 mile round trip to Cinci to visit friends.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
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That thing sounds pretty scary to me! I always considered the big Pontiacs to be a bit tackier than their Olds/Buick/Chevy counterparts, but putting a loud orange color on one just makes it that much worse!
Years ago, a local Honda dealer, of all places, had a 1973 Caprice convertible for sale. It was kind somewhere in between that school bus looking shade of yellow/orange that kids like to put on Mustangs, Civics, etc., and maybe about what you'd get if you put a sweet potato and some butterscotch pudding together in a blender. The car was actually in very nice shape, but I just couldn't get past that Godawful color!
Spotted another orange-metallic car at lunchtime - a lightly customized 1965 Chevrolet Malibu with Ralleye wheels.
Well preserved
This has an odd story behind it
Cool in its own way, but I don't know what could be done with it
Ridiculous price, but interesting in a big Italian train wreck way
This will always have issues
The subject of recent discussion
Wow, it's like a headache inducing time warp
Andre-mobile
Now this is a Caddy
Something else for Andre
And another
Of all the things to survive
Shame it's rusty...this is a real SUV
Neat little weirdo
Nice fintail, amusing AC unit
I never thought I'd say this about one of my beloved 70's Electras, but that that '74 hurts my eyes! I think it's a combination of too much red and that loud, clashy print cloth pattern. I usually prefer big Buicks of this era to big Cadillacs, because they're usually a bit more smoothly styled and less conservative than the Oldsmobiles, but still not as loud and pimpy as the Cadillacs often are. But this thing is just too much for my tastes! Seems like the big Electra were really smooth and clean for '71-72, but got a bit loud and garish for '73-74, but then cleaned up again for '75-76. Of course, color plays a major role, too, in how pimpy or loud the car looks.
As for that green '79 New Yorker, I've already emailed the seller to find out WHICH Brownsville he's in! :shades: Turns out there are two of them in PA. One's near Pittsburgh and the other is near the Harrisburg/Chambersburg area, maybe two hours from me. Hey Shifty, if you're around and paying attention, how high should I be willing to go on that New Yorker? Looking at the bid history, it looks like it's starting to stall out around the $1500-1600 range.
I think about $3,000--$3,500 is all the money for the New Yorker and you should be able to recoup that if you don't keep the car. Won't be an easy re-sell (as you can see from the eBay "action") but low miles are always attractive to someone, even if the buyer pool for a '79 NYer is small.
'48 Dodge -- I see that some people continue to confuse the early Chrysler "Hemi" with the "real" Hemis of the 60s. The early Hemi engine was not particularly powerful and is not that easy to build up. I think a short stroke Chevy of the same era offers so much more possibility.
Ponton Wagon -- interesting. I'm going to watch it and see what it bids to. I still don't think these wagons or the fintail wagons are really worth more than $6,000 bucks on average (if you cut out the few real highs and few real lows in the sales database).
PACER -- if the seller turns down the money that's already been offered, he's crazy. I'm watching this one, too. I figure $5,500 tops and even then the buyer is buried for life. But this IS eBay after all, where we often see more dollars than sense.
Fintail w a/c: my fintail had that same unit I think. Worked fine, even if it did weigh 500 lbs. A testament to the strength of Mercedes' dashboards. I'll watch this one, too. Here again, I'm thinking $5,500 is all the money for a mint fintail...maybe more for an SE or a 300.
But then why was it so common back in the day for people to yank these things out of passenger cars and put them in hotrods and such?
Now FWIW, a 1954 DeSoto Hemi only puts out 170 hp with a 2-bbl carb. It was a fairly powerful engine in its day, given its displacement, which was only 276.1 cubic inches. In 1952-53 it had 160 hp. In comparison, Oldsmobile around that time needed a ~303 CID to get 160 hp.
However, times changed fast back then, especially when Chevy came out with the 265 smallblock.
The seller mentions that DeSoto hemi is a 330, though. That would make it a 1956 DeSoto hemi, a 330.4 (I dunno why DeSoto tended to carry out their displacements to the tenths in their listings). 230 hp with the 2-bbl, 255 with the 4-bbl.
I think the "whale" Hemi (that term came out after they started calling the 426 the "elephant" Hemi) that most people want is the Chrysler 392. In 1957-58, I think it put out 350 hp with a 4-bbl, 375 with dual quads, and 390 with dual quads and higher compression.
Consumer reports used to gripe about the DeSoto and Chrysler Hemis as being overpowered, but I think if they had their way we would've all driven around in 6-cyl Ramblers back then.
The guy with the Plymouth was probably just trying to keep it Mopar, and a DeSoto Hemi really isn't that heavy as far as engines go...about 675 lb. That's about 100 more than the Chevy smallblock, but still considerably less than a Chrysler Hemi or later 426. And when you figure back in the 50's, a DeSoto 341 put out 270 hp with just a 2-bbl carb. To get a period Chevy 283 up to that you needed dual quads.
The Chevy smallblock would have much more aftermarket than an early Mopar Hemi, but would also have to be rebuilt a lot more often! :P