I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today! (Archived)

Mr_Shiftright

You mean the "Bicentennial Edition" of the Eldorado. Yeah, that adds a substantial premium, but actually getting someone to pay it isn't so easy. A '76 Eldo is a pretty dreadful car to drive, even for big car lovers. It was Cadillac on skid row.

andre1969

A '76 Eldo is a pretty dreadful car to drive, even for big car lovers. It was Cadillac on skid row.

I've never driven one, but a year or so ago, Grbeck and I sat in one that was for sale at Carlisle. Might've been a '75 though, I don't remember. I do remember though, when we started it up, the hood started doing that "oil-canning" effect you've described. I'd never seen anything like it before! I've seen "cowl shake", where the whole front-end clip of a car seems to shimmy at a different frequency from the rest of the car when you hit a bump...heck, I've seen that on vehicles as recently as mid-90's Ford Panthers and late 90's Tacomas! But seeing that Eldo's hood start shaking like a bowl of Jell-o just from idling there on the show field was interesting, to say the least!

One thing that's really sad, is that my '76 LeMans, which was a cheap car by comparison, won't do that trick, so people were paying a premium for these cars and getting that oil-canning effect! Okay, so my LeMans has another issue, where sometimes the right wind conditions and speed will make the back edge of the hood, at the base of the windshield, flutter up and down, but that's a different story!

I just looked up the specs on those Eldos, and it looks like they were around 224" long and the wheelbase was 126.3". On the surface that doesn't seem *that* big...I had a '69 Bonneville that was about 225" long, the three '79 Chrysler's I've had were all about 221" long, and even my grandmother's old '85 LeSabre was about 218". But I guess once you factor in that obscenely long hood, flexible body, and 5200 pound curb weight, it makes for an incredible amount of slop.

My buddy let me drive his '78 Mark V a couple times, and that thing just felt so out-of-control. Made my '79 New Yorker feel like a BMW in comparison! :surprise:

Mr_Shiftright

Yeah, maybe it was the lack of structural rigidity on the convertible versions of the Eldo that made them so bad. I don't think I ever drove a coupe. It's probably better, though no ballerina, that's for sure.

lemko

...I saw a black 1976 Coupe DeVille near a repair shop close to my workplace. I have to check it out for a close-up look someday. It looks good at a distance.

PF_Flyer

1988 Buick Alberter coach


And it turned into a blog entry on the Alternate Route too!

andre1969

I think I saw that same car at the Spring Carlisle swap meet this year. Here's a pic I took of another Buick hearse that was parked next to it. I remember I liked this one better because it looked bigger. The black one looked like it just had the regular 116" B-body wheelbase and an extended rump that made it look like it would do a wheelie if you used it for Roseanne Barr's funeral, but this grayish/brownish one had a longer wheelbase that I thought made it look dignified.

I was kinda tempted to buy this one. I think they only wanted $2495 for it, and it was in good shape except for one rust spot on the rear door. I forget how much they wanted for the black one. The other hearse that you can barely see in the pic is a 1973 or so converted Pontiac, like a Grand Ville or Bonneville.

PF_Flyer

Could have been the same one, PA plates and all.

fintail

Unusual even for a Trabi

Cooler than a Prius

One for the local Japanese car show

Good name for a car

Doesn't get much odder than this

Little old freakshows are coming out of the woodwork

Amazing it survived

Andre/lemko mobile

What is the upholstery pattern called? "Disco"?

It would be a lost cause it was 100x nicer...shame

Looks saveable

stickguy

a '66ish 4 door bel Air. Looked all original, including the paint, and right down to the driver! Decent shape, paint was beat and a few dents, but no noticeable rust.

andre1969

at the little plaza where our local grocery store is, I saw what I think was a 1962-63 Mercury Meteor. Could've been a Comet, though. I only saw it from the rear, and from a distance. Had two small round taillights on either side, tiny fins, and was a 2-door sedan. It was white, and looked okay from a distance...just used daily driver condition. Not ragged out, but not pristine.

Also saw a '77-79 Delta 88 coupe, in a deep red, in nice condition. Weird to think that suddenly, something like that is a ~30 year old car! I still keep thinking of a 30 year old car as having tailfins! But time marches on...

andre1969

That '76 Electra looks like a beautifully preserved car, but I dunno if Lemko and I would fight over it. He'd thumb his nose at it, probably, because it's a base model, and when it comes to this style, I prefer the hardtop sedan! Still, looks like a nice car!

That upholstery pattern on the '75 Century is pretty odd. I think it would actually look better in a louder color, like red, gold, or green. But that light blue is just too understated and tasteful, I guess. I always thought that style of Century/Regal had a nice looking dashboard. I also notice that Century has interior opera lights on the B-pillar trim. My '76 LeMans doesn't have those...I'm jealous. Guess my LeMans isn't Grand enough.

Mr_Shiftright

Hmmmm---seller calls that 300SE "first car in the world with fuel injection". We need to show him a 1955 Mercedes Gullwing or a '57 Chevy. Looks beyond repair anyway, too bad.

Baker Electric: Funny thing is that its range and performance is about the same as some of the brand new electric cars being marketed. Now that's 89 years of progress--LOL!

Lloyd: me likee....if you look close, you'll see that it's a very well made little car. Bid is plenty, though. Not cute like a Nash Metro or kiss-me, hug-me Fiat 500. A lovable mutt.

Studebaker Dictator -- I wonder who was the brilliant marketing guy who came up with THAT name in 1937 as the Spanish Civil War was raging and Hitler and Mussolini were on a rampage?

Renault -- $810 bucks sounds right.

andre1969

yeah, that is an interesting name. What I want to know though, is what is Regis the Saint of? I had always just thought it was an upper-crusty sounding name that Mopar pulled out of thin air back around 1955, to use on occasion. But if Studebaker thought of it first, I'm guessing there was more to it than that.

Isn't there a hotel called the St. Regis? Maybe Regis is the patron saint of defunct automobiles. :P

andre1969

I had to run some errands, and coming home, saw a nice looking '66 T-bird coming off a side street. Kinda of a dark candy apple red, with a white vinyl top. Unfortunately it was that awful landau roof model, which does away with the rear quarter windows, creating a huge blind spot. Too bad it wasn't just a regular hardtop, or better yet, a convertible.

Could you get these things without fender skirts, or were they mandatory?

mazda6iguy

I would love it if they'd have one one Pimp My Ride... it would be cool to see how it'd turn out. I saw recently someone brought in a 1972 Ford van and it came out pretty good looking...

fintail

I noticed that comment on that sad 300SE as well. He does say "First car in the world with fuel injection, sunroof and all air suspension"...maybe he means it in combination? Wasn't air suspension and FI optional on 1958 Pontiacs or something? But no sunroof then, so he still gets it lol.

I'd love to find a LWB 300SE sunroof model, but only a handful remain.

That Lloyd reminds me of some kind of prewar experiment that made it into the 50s, especially that little engine. Probably has jewel-like build quality, like the other tiny German cars.

I think the Dictator is one of those 1920s model names, like the Chevy 'Confederate'.

Mr_Shiftright

Yeah, okay, then, my car is the world's first blue hatchback with satellite radio, yellow slip covers and a frog in the glove box.

british_rover

What kind of frog?

Mr_Shiftright

Bavarian Beach Frog----*very* rare.

seminole_kev

Had to do a double take, but on a drive from Orlando to Mount Dora, FL today I saw a (drumroll please) Bricklin SV-1. It was for sale and the coming up from the rear end of it I at first thought it was some sort of 280Z with a bad body kit.....then got around the front and was really surprised.

Was some kind of almond/tan-ish color. Weird color.

fintail

I saw this elegant old beast in a parking lot today. It looked to be an original unrestored car. Odd that the fender skirts are off. I think that widewall width is period correct too."

bumpy

633CSi, this time in faded red. This one was reasonably kept up, but the owner decided to let it senesce into "unrestored old car" territory.

bumpy

St. Regis

andre1969

Even though it has a bit of an incomplete look, I thnk that Caddy looks good without the fender skirts!

andys120

Isn't there a hotel called the St. Regis?

link Sure is, it's one of Manhattan's finest old hotels.
I used to go to a bookstore next door that had all kinds of great books on cars and airplanes (Gordon's Books).

The St. Regis name is probably the last carryover of the long MoPar tradition of naming Chrysler models after swanky East Coast places (Saratoga, Newport, New Yorker).

Nowadays if a car carries the name of a place it's from the Southwest (Durango, Tucson, SantaFe).

andys120

I thnk that Caddy looks good without the fender skirts!

If any cars were made to wear skirts it was Caddies of the 50s and 60s.

parm

The Cadillac in the photo is a 1964, which is an era of Caddy's I know a bit about. In 1964, the Eldorado didn't have fender skirts, though this car obviously came with them so it's not an Eldorado. 1964 was the first year for the Deville. The entry level car was the Series 62 (which was in replaced in '65 by the Calais). The Series 62 didn't have any script at the rear and I think I see a rear script (just above the side trim) in the photo, so I'm guessing it's a Deville.

The color appears correct and someone earlier mentioned the whitewalls - they're pretty much the correct width for a '64.

lemko

Do you mean 1964 was the first year for the DeVille convertible? I guess non-Eldo convertibles prior to '64 were Series 62 convertibles. The Coupe DeVille was around since 1949 and I believe the Sedan DeVille arrived in 1956 with the advent of four-door hardtops.

lemko

I saw a rather obscure film called Two-Lane Blacktop late Saturday night. The two main cars were a primer gray 1955 Chevrolet two-door sedan hot rod driven by James Taylor and a then-new 1970 Pontiac GTO Judge driven by Warren Oates. Too bad it came on so late as I kept falling asleep in and out during the movie. Spotted in the movie was a 1966 Chevrolet Biscayne police cruiser and a 1967 Plymouth Fury I cruiser.

andre1969

burning up some "use it or lose it" time. So I probably won't see much of interest today. On the tv in the other room there's an amusing old movie on called "Two for the Road", with Albert Finney and Audrey Hepburn, and I've been catching bits and pieces of it. Albert Finney was underneath a broken down car griping about it, trying to fix it, and Audrey Hepburn deadpans, in a cute, haughty British tone..."You shouldn't have bought an MG...you should have bought a tractor!"

Lots of interesting old Euro cars in it. One of 'em I spotted, quickly, was one of those old Citroens that looks like a 30's car, but could be as late as a '56 or so. The one that preceded that French Pastry DS style.

fintail

The Citroen 'Traction', made from 1934 to 1956-7 I believe. Amazing run, and a very significant car. Unibody and FWD in 1934.

andys120

. One of 'em I spotted, quickly, was one of those old Citroens that looks like a 30's car, but could be as late as a '56 or so. The one that preceded that French Pastry DS style.

Is this it Andre?:



It's from Two for The Road, it's a Citroen 2CV, the car that put France on wheels, a very simple, rugged yet sophisticated design that was hugely popular in postwar France. They didn't stop making them until the late 70s IIRC.

andre1969

Nah, it wasn't a 2cv, I know what those look like. In one of my Mopar clubs, they used to rag on it and say that translated literally that deux chevaux stood for "two horse" or 2-horsepower! :P I think they're neat little cars though. I see 'em occasionally at shows, and a few years back, actually saw one parked on a street in DC. Oddly, it was behind a 1946 or so Oldsmobile.

I think Fintail got it right when he mentioned the Traction. I think these are neat looking cars. Outdated looking by 1950's standards, but I still think they have a neat, almost customized look to 'em. I never knew they were FWD.

fintail

They have a low long look due to the drivetrain and construction, custom looking in the time indeed. Compare it to a normal 1934 car, and how it must have looked to people used to things Model A style. There were several models and variants of this design. They were great performers for the era, the police loved them and during the occupation the Germans loved them as well. A significant car by any means.

andre1969

okay, now that I probably have the attention of the censors, it's time to show off some "baby" pictures. Just washed up my $500 New Yorker this evening. Ain't she purty?

Driver's side front
Passenger side front
Driver's side

It's amazing how nice a wet car can look. I guess that's why they say you should never buy a used car in the rain! :surprise:

parm

Yes, 1964 was the first year for the Deville convertible. And, you're also correct that non-Eldorado convertibles (all Eldorados were convertibles) prior to 1964 were Series 62's. I wouldn't swear to it in court, but I've always been under the impression that 1964 was the first year Cadillac ever offered a DeVille of any kind. But, my Cadillac expertise (such as it is) is generally limited to those produced in the 1960's.

lemko

Technically, not all Eldos were convertibles - there was the 1957-60 Eldorado Brougham which was a four-door hardtop. The Calais, or the "working man's Cadillac," would last through the 1976 model year. My best friend's cousin has a 1967 Cadillac Calais. It has crank windows in place of the power units.

parm

Well, that's true, the Eldorado Brougham was a hardtop - and a particularly stunning one in 1957. I knew that when I wrote about all Eldos being convertibles and almost amended that post/statment. But, I rank the Brougham in a different category because it was totally unlike the "run of the mill" Eldorado. LOL!

jwm40517

How do I post a picture of an unusual car I saw this weekend?

fiatlux1969

I understand that the Eldorado Brougham bodies were built in Italy, I believe by Pininfarina, an arrangement repeated in the Nineties with the Allante. They were a four-door car without a center pillar, something Lancia did earlier.

andre1969

I understand that the Eldorado Brougham bodies were built in Italy, I believe by Pininfarina, an arrangement repeated in the Nineties with the Allante. They were a four-door car without a center pillar, something Lancia did earlier.

Were the 1957-58 Eldorado Brougham bodies built by Pininfarina, or was that just the 1959? As I recall, the '59 was a really sharp looking car, in stark contrast to the over-the-top mass-market Caddies. It heavily influenced the clean, linear, chiseled styling of the '61-62 Caddies.

lemko

The '59 and '60 was a beautiful car that first used the gently curved A-pillar that showed up on the 1961 GM cars. The 1959 Eldorado Brougham featured far more retrained styling than the rest of Cadillac's '59 lineup.

bumpy

How do I post a picture of an unusual car I saw this weekend?

Put the photo on the Internet: on your Carspace page, Photobucket, or somewhere; then paste the location of the photo itself (not the page it's on) into a message here, then highlight it and hit the little Img button above the car icons.

andys120

As I recall, the '59 was a really sharp looking car, in stark contrast to the over-the-top mass-market Caddies. It heavily influenced the clean, linear, chiseled styling of the '61-62 Caddies.

You said a mouthful my friend. I never paid much attention to the '59 Broughams but a quick search showed how much better looking they were than Standard bodied cars>

'59 Eldorado Seville>


'59 Eldorado Brougham (PF)>


Eldorados during this era often presaged the styling of cars in future years.

As you say '61 Caddies looked very much like the '59 Brougham whose partial wraparound windshield was used on all full size '61-'62 GMs ('tho more upright.)

1961 Cadillac Series 60>

fiatlux1969

It has been a long time since I did any reading on this subject, but I believe the credit for the '59 all goes to GM (Bill Mitchell?). The '57s and '58s with the stainless roofs were the Italian jobs (sorry, couldn't resist).

andys120

From Wikipedia:

A different Eldorado Brougham was sold for 1959 and 1960. These cars were not quite so extravagantly styled but were very unusual pieces in themselves. Priced at $13,075, they cost $1 more, each, than their older siblings. The design was 100% Cadillac but the company contracted out the assembly to Pininfarina of Italy, with whom the division has had a long-running relationship.

Wiki does not mention any involvement by PF in the '57 or '58 Broughams.

Whether Mitchell was involved personally or not, the '59 Brougham does mark the transition from the exuberant designs of the Harley Earl era to the more subdued but handsome lines of the Mitchell era.

IMO the early '60s were the pinnacle of GM design.

im_brentwood

57-58 Eldo Broughams = Bpdy by Fisher

59-60 = Italian.

59s and 60s are extremely rare.. they only made roughly 100 each year.

texases

Can you imagine being an Italian in '59 working on one of those monsters? Not much in common with a Fiat of the day...

Mr_Shiftright

He probably thought he was working on an apartment building.

fiatlux1969

I defer to your greater knowledge. I remember (or mis-remember) an R&T Salon feature on the stainless-topped Broughams, in which it was stated that they were built in Italy. This seems to be one occasion where Wikipedia has it right, although I have learned that it can often be less than authoritative.