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What most people here think of buying 2-3 years old cars? Most of the cars still work great, reliable and I assume you can have mechanic look at the car before you buy. Five or 10 years old cars can be tricky but I have not heard many horror stories of buying 2 or 3 years old cars. I am fan of buying outright and no loan outstanding and in this way I don't have to have insurance deductibles what dealers dictate? It is kind of self insurance and use insurance for higher things if some thing bad happens.
Do they? The M3 lease i mentioned above, had a finance charge of $355. That's total. Over the course of 3 years the M3's interest would be $355. 57% residual too.
Well, you're saying it's on the residual they make it up. If they're selling me a 59.3k car for 52k and the residual is 33.8k, how much are they really getting from me? 18.2k + the lousy $355 interest charge or 18.5k.
I also only pay tax on what I spend, so my tax is only on the 18.5k - sop $1433.
Tell, me, if I bought the car what's the best finance rate? BMWFS isn't offering 2.9 on Ms. It's 5% through my credit union. First, I'll end up paying all tax on the purchase price - so off the bat the car's selling for 56k. That's a payment of 1070 a month.
Over 36 months that's $38520 out the door. At the end of 3 years you owe ~24k on the loan and you might be able to get that back on if the residual is legit. Problem is, if the car is worth less than 57% of its MSRP then you've lost even more. To be nice we'll say by a miracle the residual was right and your M3 is worth 33829. If you sell the car and pay off your loan you're still down 9-10k more than if you had leased it.
Remember, if the car is worth more than 57% on the lease at lease end, you can always buy it and sell it yourself or just walk away.
Leasing can be an insane advantage. Right now the lease deals on M3s and 3 series cars of the 08 year are to the buyer's advantage if they're clever (MSDs, insisting on sub-invoice pricing).
What most people here think of buying 2-3 years old cars? Most of the cars still work great, reliable and I assume you can have mechanic look at the car before you buy.
Yes great deals on 2-3 year old cars. I've seen 2007 3 series cars listed for 22-23k. but after 3 BMW products though, I will admit I'm disinclined to believe they're good cars. I love driving them and don't mind all the warranty work as it's their dime but I fear the repair bill on used bimmers. Others have had better luck than I. And in the case of the current lease deals, it's hard to find another situation where you pay so little in interest.
Five or 10 years old cars can be tricky but I have not heard many horror stories of buying 2 or 3 years old cars. I am fan of buying outright and no loan outstanding
When you can get close to 0% on a loan - 1% and lower - it's hard to agree with investing cash into a car. I'd rather have 56k sitting in the bank collecting 3%-4% (or invested) than sitting in my garage depreciating.
At 4% and up a case can be made for buying with cash and certainly buying used for full cash. Then again, 2006 3 series cars are going for 0.9% financing and two payments made by BMW. Why would you put your cash into the car when you make more with it sitting in the bank?
and in this way I don't have to have insurance deductibles what dealers dictate?
Not following. Nobody really dictates anything beyond $500 deductibles. I've leased two BMWs...they don't check and they don't press on deductibles. My 2003 330i was hit a few times (parked 2 of them and a girlfriend drove it into a pole another time) - BMW didn't blink when I returned the car.
You are generally right about leasing. But on some occasions the deals are too good, the interest too low and the deal just right. Heck, people who leased 06 330is are now buying out their leases as CPO (warranty to 100k on powertrain) for 3-4k below the original lease residual. They're getting a crazy deal on a used car they already leased!
I guess I was thinking from the point of simplicity. What you are telling works for perfect world. Lets say if I miss one payment or lost job and can't pay lease payment, you do know what impact it will have on my credit report and not to mention you loose car as well. So far I am in ok financial condition so I just don't like to take loan unless absolute necessary.
What I have seen, brand new 2009 328xi are going close to 40K and in case of lease you are kind of renting it for 3 years at the cost close to 18K for that time period. But when I can get 07 328xi for 22-23K and I own it outright, that's why I am not very much fan of lease. Other thing is I am really not into getting latest model every few years. I have bought brand new car (camry) and it was due to price difference between used and new was only 3 or 4 thousands plus at that time most used cars just did not have safety features like side curtain airbags, I guess most people just buy what come standard.
Regarding insurance (I should have been more clear), I like to have $1000 and I with loan/lease I think you are supposed to have $500 deductible.
First I'd like to tell blueguy that you made some excellent points.
Also, I'm not sure what your (asi12) work schedule is like, but selling a car isn't all that easy. All you need is one person, but you've got to sift through a lot of BS getting to THE ONE. Especially when you're talking about collecting Close to $34,000 from a private party. How do you know the certified bank check they give you isn't phony? Then you say, OK, I'll trade the car in and the dealer gives you a couple of lines of BS and tells you the best he can do is $25K.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
I agree selling in the car is pain in neck esp. when you deal with 20-30k valued car. But I was not suggesting to sell a car every 2 or 3 years either. Perhaps I am not just not lease kind of person.
1. Someone was claiming the ability to buy a car for cash, so therefore, the cash is still available.
2. You can get rid of a leased car easily through Swapalease.com But when I can get 07 328xi for 22-23K and I own it outright, that's why I am not very much fan of lease.
You can get an 06 with 0.9% financing and save even more, the car is CPO and you keep your cash in the bank, protecting you on the off chance of losing a job.
Regarding insurance (I should have been more clear), I like to have $1000 and I with loan/lease I think you are supposed to have $500 deductible.
There's not much difference in insurance rates, so I still don't get this...sorry but no loan or lease demands to see a copy of your insurance paperwork.
From the convenience point of view, smell of new leather, no hustle to deal with individual buyers lease make sense but I just don't buy a car with a intention of keeping just for 2 or 3 years.
I decreased my car insurance rate little over $100 per year from going $500 to $1000 deductible.
A friend of mine is driving a 2009 xDrive 328i coupe loaner while his 535 wagon is in the shop, waiting for a part to come in from Germany. He's let me borrow it for an extended test drive. I have nothing bad to say about the car - it's more than fast enough for around here (NYC suburb) & it's better in the handling department than the 330xi I drove a couple of years ago - but it's no more entertaining to drive than my 8-year-old car is. At the end of the drive, I didn't feel even the slightest urge to swap my car for it - although I did like the heated steering wheel.
Funny thing -- the version of this advice that I was taught many years ago was "Finance only that which appreciates & pay cash for everything else".
sage advice indeed. when you say finance, I assume you mean to purchase with help of a loan (not lease). One other thing.........in my opinion, only cars that retain their value well are good candidates for leasing. If you like a car that happens to have horrible resale, then I say you just buy and enjoy what you like. But for cars that have a record of holding their value (honda, bmw), leasing is a great option and is often less expensive than if you had purchased (either with cash or with a loan)
2009 328xi Coupe auto, nav, prem pkg & some more. Basically fully loaded.
MSRP $47,995
Selling price: $1,000 over invoice..not yet disclosed, but I think around $44,250
Less $1,500 rebate for a cap cost of $500 below invoice
I am pushing for closer to $500 over invoice before rebate.
What do you guys think? This is in SoCal.
Anyone heard if the rebates will be extended through Feb?
Also, there's a dealer who works through bimmerfest members and he's out of LA. He hooks people up left and right on that site.
Makes sense if you're comparing a 3-year lease to buying a new car & then trading it in for another new car 3 years later. But I'd rather buy something I like & keep it for 8 to 10 years. This approach yields the lowest cost per mile.
If you buy a new car & then get rid of it before its 8th birthday, you're missing out on the financial "sweet spot" of car ownership, which begins when the car is 4 years old. By that time, you should have paid off any car loan, which means that your interest expense is zero, & the steepest part of the depreciation curve is behind you. Although your car is no longer under warranty, your repair costs should be a small fraction of what depreciation would cost you if you bought or leased a new car. (As a car ages, rising repair costs are offset by falling depreciation costs.)
A well cared-for 4 to 8 year old car that you own free & clear is just about the best transportation bargain available.
I wouldn't keep a car much longer than 10 or 11 years. I kept one of our cars for over 13 years, & the last 2 years killed me. (At the time, work & family issues kept me too busy to shop for a replacement, so I just kept fixing it.)
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
I just did a spreadsheet today comparing a 2006 3 series with .9% financing to a 2008 328i lease. The lease, assuming my conservative repair/maintenance estimates are decent, came out 2k cheaper over the 3 year period.
Yes if I were willing to buy a 2006 and keep it for 7-8 years it'd return cash like crazy. But I can't see holding onto a car that long.
Are you married? (Sorry - I couldn't resist.)
As I said in an earlier post, I drove a new 328xi coupe last week & came away from it completely satisfied with my nearly 8-year-old 330i sedan. While the coupe had some neat features that weren't available on the 3 in 2001, it wasn't in any way a more entertaining ride than what I have now. If I bought it, I wouldn't have any more fun than I'm having now.
In fairness to the coupe, it was an automatic, & I have a bone-deep prejudice against 3s with slushboxes.
We are looking at a base 2009 328i 4-door.
The costco price quoted from dealer is $1,200 over cost. With cost being the invoice price of the vehicle + destination charge of $825 + MACO of $200 + Training & Service fee of $180.
The dealer will pass on the $1,500 rebate from BMW if we purchase before that offer expires.
Does this sound a fair price? Or we could negotiate on our own to get a better deal? We are in Oregon with few BMW dealers, and the dealer is pretty nice which makes our not-good neogitating skills even less effective.
Thanks.
clriufs3
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive
I am in the market for a 3-series, unfortunately I can't afford to buy a new one however I can afford a used vehicle. I was looking around the 2001-04 models which I have the cash now to buy out right but they have no warranty and who knows what repairs I might have to make in the future. So I went to check out a lease instead, low down payment, reasonable monthly payments, plus the free maintenance makes it pretty tempting. I went to two dealers, one give me an offer for a 09(I believe it was 09 as I went early January) 328i Xdrive, real leather, powerseats(basically the cold weather package) for 550/month, 2331 due on signing while another one afford basically the standard package 09' 328ix for 497/month, 3646.86 due upfront with a residual value at 22,390.50(the car's worth now is about36-38k).
Now, the only reason I wanted a AWD was because I live in CT and we have had our share of bad snow storms over the years(especially this winter) but I have a Honda Pilot which is great in the snow however I not a big fan of SUVs. Maybe I should instead look at the RWD.
So my question is do I buy a used 2001-04 BMW 3-series which I can afford to buy out right but doesn't have a warranty and is in the 50-80k miles or do I lease one with a warranty, 0$ maintenance fee but obviously I end up paying more in the end. Maybe i should look in the middle and finance a certified used from one of the dealers. What would be the best move?
I have never owned a BMW and the main reason why I want one is for the aesthetics and reputation of the company. I'm not really into fancy luxury features, I just want to feel comfortable in the car(leg room, my butt not feeling sore after a long ride) and I want to feel confident about the car, that it won't let me down over the years of due to use. Hope you guys can help me.
I don't mind the car. Its been well taken care of and all that jazz, but I did have my heart set on either a new 2009 Audi or a CPO 330ci with or w/o ZHP.
So my question is....is this deal good enough to jump on or should I shop around for another CPO or buy / lease a new car.
FYI - not a huge fan of the newer BMW body styles. Loathe the interior.
link title
I'm quite tempted, but can't get myself to get rid of my '02 330i manual...
By far, the best car I've owned! After purchasing it 4 years ago (as a CPO w/ 40K miles), I've managed to put 75K of absolutely trouble-free miles on it! In this timeframe, the only thing that I actually had to do to it is change the oil and air filter (by myself) every 15K miles and replace couple bulbs...
The 2001-2004 3ers have a pretty decent reliability record. At @60,000 miles you'll probably need a water pump, but that is no big deal. Older cars had problems with window regulators but the newer cars(and replacement regulators) have an improved design. The real key is to find a car that has been maintained by the book, as BMW's do not tolerate neglect. Find a decent dealer and/or a good indie BMW tech and you'll be good to go. I'd say that maintenance and repairs for a 3er of that vintage should amount to no more than $900 per year.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive
When you push the lever to the left.. you are in Sport mode... That is still fully automatic, but with more aggressive shift points (higher revs before shifting, quicker downshifts when slowing down).
Once you are in Sport mode, you can then shift manually by tipping the lever forward and backward to upshift or downshift...
Nothing you are doing is going to hurt the transmission, but it's totally unnecessary, especially on the freeway. In fact, by shifting over to Sport mode, you are probably going to use way more fuel than just leaving it in D (which is where it belongs for highway use).
regards,
kyfdx
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Out on the highway, if you need maximum power, just floor it... There is no difference with your foot on the floor..
Also.. once you are in manual mode, you have to move the lever back to "D" to get back in automatic... If you then want the Sport mode in automatic, just push it back to the left..
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For psychological reasons. It's there to massage the psyche.
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In essence: 0.9% for 60 months and first two payments made by bmw. That's for anyone.
On leases there's no rebate (beyond auto trans rebates on 08s) for normal buyers. If you currently have a lease or loan with BMW FS or ended one in the last 6 months, you can get 1k off a lease and a reduction on the money factor.
BMW apparently wants to encourage purchasing of their cars instead of leasing. Hopefully they'll modify their offers by the end of the month (like the end of January).