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Premium Package
Sport Package
On-Board Navigation System
STEPTRONIC automatic transmission
All-Weather Cargo Liner (need further price check, no expensive anyway
All-Weather Floor Mats
Aluminum Pedals (need further price check, no expensive anyway)
Titanium Silver Metallic
Black Dakota Leather
Aluminum Trim (doesn't have it
The MSRP is $44545
Dealer is offering $42355+ (the Cargo Liner & Aluminum Pedals), which is about $1500 over invoice.
So I will be paying for $45955+ (basically $42355 + $3600 tax because of the 8.5% tax rate :mad: )
Is it a good deal?
Thanks for reading and suggestion are strongly welcome.
Saying that the new '06 BMW 3 series cars are a great deal at MSRP (I'll give you credit that certain E90s come with more standard equipment along with the more powerful engines for pretty much the same price as their E46 counterparts) is an insult to our intelligence. I'm sure at whatever dealership (sorry, Authorized BMW Center) you work at sells a ton of BMWs, especially in SoCal (9th best selling car in the State of California is a BMW 3 series) where many people want to be the first on the block to have the latest and greatest. You must be a bright guy and realize that you're dealing with a different crowd here on the Internet. Obviously the laws of supply and demand supercede the fact that we have the invoice pricing at our disposal.
I do credit you with the fact that you haven't mentioned what dealership you work for and have abided by TH rules and have not tried to solicit business for yourself (or your dealership).
Maybe you can help the board out by saying, hey...$1500 off MSRP is a great deal, we've had X number of E90 3 series come in and they're out the door before we can pull them off the truck. We're selling them at MSRP and not a penny less.
I hope you take this as constructive criticisim and not a personal insult. I think it is great (and smart) that a dealer monitors our chat.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
Getting ready to close a deal on a 330 with 330 miles on it, steptronic convenience package and silvet ti. Need some advice as I smell something here:
Was told no money down, 39 months, 45000 miles, $559 w/o tax.
I get the contract in the mail and it has:
$907 capitalized Cost reduction
$126.98 sales tax on Cap cost
$603 first month payment
no security deposit
$200 Title
A)Gross Capitialized Cost: 39480 but line item under A reads 40175.13?
B)Adjusted Capitalized Cost: 38268.13
C)Residual: 22150.80
D)Depreciation: 17,117.33
E)Rent Charge: 4671.19
Then they tell me the bank they are using does not offer a standard 39 month lease so I will only get 13,846 miles per year?
Advice? Should I not be leasing a "used" one? I thought it would help the price but it seems not to!
2006 325i 24month/12k MSRP: $38.040 - Negotiated: $36,410
$468 Per Month (Excluding Tax - Tax is included below in upfront payment)
$1600 Down
$900 Bank Fee (acquisition fee?)
$1185 Tax (NY Tax 8.25% (Includes tax on all payments and money down)
$468 First Month
$500 Security Deposit (Refundable)
$155 Motor Vehicle (Plates Tags?)
$12.50 Tire Fee
$189 Vin Etch
Total: $5010
$1500 off is great. I'm not insulting anyone's intelligence. These are just business transactions and there is never any reason to take it personally. I realize that on the internet many times we're dealing with clients that are most concerned about the final few hundred of a 30 to 90 thousand dollar transaction. That's no problem. Being on this end I can tell you that once people take delivery of a BMW there is very, very little concern about what the dealer made or if they got a "good deal". They're just loving their 'bimmers.
Sometimes, I wonder if a lot of these people chatting are really buying anything at all. For instance, if you're getting 2 grand off of merchandise as hot as the new 3, with a track record as bullet proof as the 3 and you have to ask and wonder if you're getting a good deal then you have to question.
First and foremost, I recommend a 36 month lease instead of 24, unless your company is paying for it. A 36 month lease will bring your monthly payments down.
Secondly never put more than $2000 down on a lease. If your car is stolen, your insurance will not pay for your downpayment. Remaining owned on the car will be payed to the dealer only.
The $900 bank fee seems flaky
The etching fee is also flaky. Those are just padded numbers.
Take your own time to shop around.
Use this formula to work out lease deals:
Monthly Depreciation Fee: (Negotiated price - Residual)/Lease term(months) =?
Monthly finance charge: (negotiated price + Residual) * Money factor=?
Sales Tax per month: (Monthly depreciation fee+Monthly finance charge)*8.25% =?
Total monthly payments : Monthly depreciation fee + Monthly finance charge + Monthly Sales tax=?
I am not sure what the residuals are on the new ones. It's probably close to 60%. The residual comes of the MSRP, not the negotiated price. The money factor should be 0.00255(multiply this with 2400 to get the interest rates). Plug in all these numbers in the formula.
You can't go wrong with this formula. Additionally you should only put down the license/tilte fee, security deposit of $500 if required. Not sure how much the acquisition fee is. Plus the first month payment.
Kyfdx-
What is the residual on this and also the acquistion?
Thanks.
AMT-
The residual for 36 month lease is 61%
According to my calculations using the above formula:
Monthly payment for a 24 month lease is $582.25 (including tax)
Monthly payment for a 36 month lease is $561 (including tax)
This is with about $1500-$2000 fown pay (license/title, first months deposit, acquistion etc).
From what you have, if you put $2K down instead of $5K and roll the remaining $3K, you pretty much end up with the same as this.
KYFDX should be able to fine tune this and confirm for accuracy.
AMT-
2) The $900 bank fee is the acquisition fee.. $900 is the base fee for NY.
3) All of the other fees look okay, except for Vin Etch.. I wouldn't pay for this..
4) I always recommend rolling as much of the upfront cost as possible into the lease... In this case, the $1600 down, $900 bank fee, and $1185 tax would go back into the cap cost, reducing your upfront payment by $3685, and increasing your payment by $163/mo.
If the June numbers are different, then none of this may be accurate..
I concur with the suggestion to go for a three year lease.. Though the numbers are not overwhelmingly in favor of the 36 month term, they are slightly better.. An actual 36 month payment, vs. a 24 month payment results in a savings of around $35/mo.
I'll post an example later...
regards,
kyfdx
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And to say that we clients should not care about a few hundred dollars when dealing with a 30K to 40K car is nothing more than self-serving. If a few hundred dollars is not a big deal, why doesn't the typical dealership, with a multi-million dollars in annual sales, haggle so hard for those same few hundred dollars? Why do they mark up the MF to extract $30-$60 a month more in leases?
Sport Package
Navigation System
automatic transmission
Titanium Silver Metallic
Black Dakota Leather
MSRP is $44545,
ED invoice is $40825
Dealer is offering $42355, which is about $1500 over invoice.
So I will be paying for $45955+ (basically $42355 + $3600 tax because of the 8.5% tax rate )
Is it a good deal? Can I get further discount? Please help, I need to decide soon, very soon
It seems that the spread would be much larger if that were the US MSRP..
$1500 over ED invoice is a very good deal on an '06.. If you are certain the numbers are correct..
regards,
kyfdx
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Premium, sport, navi, auto, shipping, metallic paint and got an ED price of 38,330 before dealer profit (and before bmw cca rebate).
???
How can you get 38,330? I start with this link, and keep on getting 40825 :confuse:
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2006/bmw/3series/100530524/prices.html
Could you tell me how, thank a lot
Around here, ED stands for European Delivery..
Perhaps you meant something else? EDmunds invoice?
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http://www.edmunds.com/new/2006/bmw/3series/100530524/prices.html
I am new, so any suggestion is helpful. Thanks.
Were you planning on taking European Delivery? (in Munich?)
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could you tell me where to get the ED link? thanks
When saying whether these two numbers are accurate or not, do you mean whether they match the numbers on the sticker of the side rare window of the car?
Thanks a lot.
-UNO
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.ef0f82e
Im also going to drop the vin etch.
the residuals is 74% on a 24/12k and this month the 325i 2006 is 0.00255 MF
Im worried that i will want a diffrent car in 24 months and worried i will be stuck in this lease longer then i want to be (its my first car...) am i being silly?
I checked around, and the money factor has dropped slightly in June.. the new MF is .00250
Here is how my lease deal would look.
'06 325i
2yr/24K lease
Residual 74%
MF .0025
$38,040 MSRP
$36,410 Selling price
$900 acq.fee
$1080 tax
$38,390 Cap cost (selling price + acq.fee + tax)
Payment $593/mo. tax included..
Due at signing:
$593 1st pymt
$600 security deposit
$155 motor vehicle
$12.50 tire fee
$1360 total.
For 3yr/36K:
Change residual to 63%
Change tax to $1556
Change cap cost to $38,866
Change payment to $571/mo. tax included
Change due at signing to $1338
Hope this helps,
kyfdx
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I was only $10.00 off from KYFDXs numbers. Not bad.
AMT-
I didn't say at all that clients shouldn't car about a few hundred dollars. In fact, I said that I understand and that it's "no problem".
Perhaps, you don't care but if I have a young salesperson that's bright and personable and he's willing to work hard, learn and try to make it in this business then sometimes a few hundred dollars one way or another can make or break the guy/gal. As hard as I see some of these people work, I think that they deserve the sometimes meager commissions that they make. The dealer principals are not the ones trying to make it in the business or support a family. The bad one's don't make it and I'd suggest that if you don't like the person helping you buy the car, work with someone else.
Ultimately, the consumer benefits WAY more from the product than the salesperson does. Maybe, they make a couple hundred or more but you get to enjoy the everyday for miles and miles. In my view, I think that at the good BMW Center around the country, their are good and not so good, that you have some great credible people in the sales departments that really care about what they do and have a great passion for the cars just like you do.
Money factors are marked up so that you have some profit to pay good finance people and their are a lot of good finance people that work for BMW Centers. If there's no profit, there's no service and who wants some dope handling the documents on your 40, 50, 60 thousand dollar transaction.
A lot of times we're just like the clients in that all we want is a little mutual respect and then we're a lot easier to deal with. It's usually not a probably but you chat room guys can be a little tough sometimes. So, negotiate your deals and be nice about it.
I also discovered that my boss knows the owner of New Century (Alhambra), so I'm going to see if I can get a better deal from them. Has anyone dealt with either of these dealerships? Feedback would be much appreciated.
Also, I'd probably be doing ED in Dec. I can't get an adequate vacation time until then. Would Europe be too harsh of a climate in the winter? I was hoping to visit Paris and Rome.
It's not so much a safety issue as one of fun and how much crap you want the car to acquire every day it's on the road - as a certifed car nut, I would never subject a new car I cared about to a European winter. Just one opinion...
When you talk about an informed buyer, do you really have to sell him/her? I mean, what is a quick test drive and a sales pitch really worth? Not much in my mind. If one bmw dealer had the guts to advertise invoice for 2006 models, it'd be flooded with buyers.
PS: I had my 330i serviced at New Century and they are great if you get the right person.
Sometimes people that don't care about anything other than squeezing every possible penny out of the dealer is just not a client that we care to have. It's funny we had someone in here like that a couple of weeks ago on a brand new three and we bended a little for the deal and the guy was basically a jerk. We easily could have sold the car to someone else because our market has a very low supply of the cars and the demand is nuts but the guy leaves and then calls me back a couple of hours later because he took a rock in the windshield and wanted us to help. We did. We put him in a loaner car (a BMW) and got the guy taken care of quickly but I thought that he spent probably an extra hour or more grinding on the salesperson to get an extra couple of hundred off of a 40 some thousand dollar transaction and now has to spend damn near a thousand dollars on a windshield. If he had left the store an hour or so sooner than maybe/probably he wouldn't have taken the rock to the windshield. The guy had a thousand dollar insurance deductible so he's on the hook for the whole amount.
If I offered invoice for new 3's a lot of people would just take that # and try to get other dealers to beat it. Don't get me wrong.......I know that it's part of the business to deal with the public directly and we're very courteous to even the most obnoxious customers but frankly whether some nickle diming jerk buys from us or not I'll most likely be eating steak tonight and being loved by my wife and kids.
Onto bigger and better subjects. can you please tell me is there an extra expense to taking ED and can it be done if you are going to lease the car or is it only for purchases? sounds like a cool thing to do, and I may do that when my 05 325i 2 year lease expires in May..
Sorry but many of us see dealerships as a holding station - sort of the equivalent of Best Buy with cars. We just buy the car there...the salesguy is irrelevant as he adds no value to the transaction (just like the kid at Best Buy).
The 2006 xi's begins production in sept. It will blow this car away with x-drive and all the new technology.
But i'd pass on it. Get your 330xi via ED and save your pennies until the car is built.
ED is not the way to go. Some of this advice being thrown around is absurd.
Mark one up for the car salesman.
1. Where are you getting ED prices that are so bad? My guess is you're working off the BMW site's listing for ED prices. Only an ill-informed consumer would try to negotiate ED based on that price structure- it's a financial raping by the dealer. ED munich pick up invoice price is the starting point for negotiating (30,720). From there you add options and $400 profit. Usually you negotiate to $1000-1200 over ED munich pick up invoice pricing. Check other forums or even the one on Edmunds for a tutorial on how to do this. Their are dealers all over the country that will make this happen.
2. We're talking about professionals mostly buying these cars. Ever heard of PTO? It's not that rare...in fact I've never had a job without PTO. If I take 2 days (max of what I'd really need to accomplish ED easily) or two weeks, I still get my paycheck.
If I take two days (fly out saturday, land sunday, pick up monday, drop off at port monday, hop on plane tuesday AM, land tuesday night) I'm barely missing any work. Flight there - with some effort is in the 400--800 range. But again most of us are professionals or good with money and we have frequent flyer miles (from actual flights and from credit cards...put a home mortgage and other bills on a 1-1 card and you get points real fast) that we can use for free flights. Two night's hotel = $200 (if you're not good at booking). Food, misc, transport and you're at maybe another $200. Spent lots of time in europe (earlier this year I was in Paris for weeks) and it's really not that expensive. The BMW salesman will tell you otherwise...he wants you to pad him with a fat commission for grinning at you during a test drive.
The main thing is, you're dealing with people who for the most part can crunch numbers. If someone wants to buy an e90 330i with sports, leather, pdc, metallic paint for 40,870, off the lot, that's his business. I'd rather give a dealer 1k profit and get it for 35940. That's almost 5k in savings. The trip won't be free but even if a bare minimum trip runs 1k or an extended 2 week one hits 3k, you have saved money, you got the car you wanted, you had a totally unique experience and you never had to rent a car while there.
ED is not the way to go. Some of this advice being thrown around is absurd.
Absurd? Only a salesman will poo-poo ED. maybe a bad sales manager would too...but I can't conceive of many longtime managers turning down 1k profit for a car that isn't part of their allocation. sure some exist. but the idea of them keeping that position is...well...absurd.