2013 and earlier - BMW 5 Series Prices Paid and Buying Experience

bimmerdude

Hi,
I have 2 questions regarding leasing and ordering the car:

1. What should I get from the sales man when I put down the $1000 for ordering a car from BMW? like a written details about the deal, selling price, MF, fees, etc? Is email enough?

2. Can you cancel the order and get the $1000 back if anything happened? very unlikely, but good to know.

Please advice as soon as possible, I am on the verge of ordering the car -- 2006 530i.
Thanks very much!

needaride1

looking for another opinion...

I have a 2003 325i lease. I'm over on my miles to the tune of like 5k... Been going around looking for deal's and I don't want to pay what there asking me to get out the car. my payoff is like 22500 the residual is 19437. I'm thinking of taking 2-3k to put towards buying out my lease. then get the car I really want a year from now... any other thoughts???

Thanks

ponytrekker

>>BMW said my liabalities were around 6500

For what?

needaride1

miles

novass66

I'd like to know what the best deal over invoice is that I might expect in Dallas on a 2006 530i. Any dealers especially good to work with? Can I expect to get .0014 MF for 36 month 12K mile lease with security deposit?

wooohaaa

I'd like to know what you think a fair offer on the following 525i would be. Here's the details....

2005 525i
12,391 miles
Jet Black/Black leather
Automatic
Premium Package
Cold Weather Package
Xenon
Satellite Prep
Wood Trim

Need to make an offer soon. It's listed at 42,995. What's the best way to go if I would like to finance a used car like this 48-60 months? What else can I do to haggle them down.

Errr.. Who knows, they might be reading this too.. But I'd like a second opinion anyway.

If it's out of reach then I going with a Acura TL.

Thanks!

wing

i am totally confused on maco and training fee. is this charge avoidable also is it the same as dealers prep or am i paying double would appreciate feedback. dealer states a must in price maco 500 training fee 180 and dealer prep 380 paid 1200 over invoice on msrp of 56,280 plus all those fees kinda disappointed

kyfdx

The dealer's invoice is $180 lower than the invoice you see on-line.. and the difference is the training fee.. It is a separate line item on their invoice, so you aren't out anything there...

MACO is a legitimate fee and is on their invoice... We don't show it here on Edmunds because it varies by location.. Whether the dealer was being honest about the amount of his MACO, I couldn't say..

$380 dealer prep? Sounds like some serious padding to me.. That is the one that would stick in my craw..

Even with all this, you are only around $2000 over invoice.. that isn't a bad deal on a $56K car..

So.. do you like the car? Really, that is the most important thing..

regards,
kyfdx
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novass66

I have negotiated the following deal so far with a dealer in TX:

2006 530i with premium pkg, premium sound, sport pkg, automatic transmission, nav and satellite radio:

MSRP: $57,065
Sale Price: $53,670
36 mo lease, 12K miles, 62% residual, $0 down, $800 deposit, .0014 MF: Lease Pymt $771/month

Does this sound good for a deal and does the lease payment make sense? Is the 62% residual on MSRP or sales price?

kyfdx

Don't you pay tax on the entire car in Texas, even on a lease? The tax alone on the car is close to $100/mo., I think...

But, even so... adding the acquisition fee into the cap cost, I only come up with $651/mo. plus tax.... So, unless they are adding in some other costs, or the tax is $120/mo... then, it looks a little high...

Residual percentage is always multiplied by the full MSRP.

regards,
kyfdx
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novass66

Thanks for your response. It is my understanding that you pay the entire tax in TX also: Here is the info I'm getting from the dealer on lease components:

$875 Acq fee
$395 Warranty Prem (something about tires/wheels?)
$125 Govt Fees
$50 document fee
$3,354 taxes
$800 security deposit
$35,380 residual

Do you add 1/36th of the taxes to monthly amount?

Thanks for your help!

kyfdx

Yeah... if you add all of that on, it comes out to just about $771/mo..

I'm assuming with just the first payment and security deposit due at signing..

1/36th of the taxes? More or less... actually, they just add it to the cap cost, and figure it into the lease.. so, you are paying a little bit of finance charge on it and the amount is slightly more than 1/36th..

A couple of things: The base acquisition fee is $625, so they are marking this up... and, I'm guessing that the $395 is for tire/wheel insurance, in case you bend a rim or blow out a tire.. I don't like to buy these kinds of plans, but others swear by them...

So, all in all... not a bad deal.. but, the sales taxes are onerous on leases in Texas... As I had guessed, about $100/mo. just for tax... the other $20/mo. is for the tire/wheel insurance and a bumped up acq.fee...

regards,
kyfdx
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novass66

Many thanks!

joewagon06

$53,200.00 Black Sapphire/Black leather W/Black anthracite trim, Auto., Winter & Premium Pkg's.,Satellite, Mud Flaps and IPod hardwired in glove box.
Easy to bargain with their inventory on wagons .
Joe
NYC

gumpire

here is a copy of an email after i offered $1000 over invoice msrp $57000.
"I understand. Unfortunately, dealers take the total expenses per month and divide by the number of cars sold to determine what their expense per car is. The average of just the advertising and floor plan alone is $1000. When you add to that the employee costs, rent, insurance, taxes, utilities, etc, etc, $1000 over invoice translates as a substantial loss. Should you decide to make an offer in the $56,000 range, we would be honored to consider it."

so tell me where are these bmw dealers at 1 2k over invoice?

hpowders

Try e-mailing all of the Florida BMW dealers.
Your best deal may be outside the Tampa area.
I would offer invoice + $1500.
Assuming your offer of invoice + $1500 is eventually accepted, the various "fees" they will add on will wind up being invoice + $2000 by the time they are finished with you.

rainmaker2

Not sure about Florida, but it seems like here in SoCal that multiple dealers were able to offer me $1000 over invoice. Once one did (and I forget who was the first), it was pretty easy to get the other ones jumping in with the same deal. I had a jerk of a salesman tell me several weeks ago that dealer profit on a 5 no matter what the MSRP was a little over 6%. So on a $56000 car, he claimed that they only made around $3400, even though my research says the difference between the invoice and the MSRP is closer to $5000. Is this guy telling the truth, or is he just some slimeball salesman trying to pull the wool over my eyes?

kyfdx

You are correct.. The spread is closer to $5000..

However, I wouldn't characterize a salesperson as a slimeball, just because he gives you diffent numbers... It is his job to sell the car for the greatest profit possible.. Those wholesale prices are technically "confidential".. So, you know what number is on the invoice.. but, it is possible his sales manager has told him that anything over $3400 less than MSRP is a money loser for the dealership, considering overhead costs, salaries, commissions, etc..

A negotiation is always somewhat adversarial, by definition.. Don't get too caught up in what salespeople say about pricing.. They don't determine the price you pay, anyway..

Hopefully, you'll get a salesperson that has product knowledge... that is where they are most useful.

regards,
kyfdx
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malibio

Since I got lots of information from these forums, I thought it would only be fair if I post the info on the deal I got over the Thanksgiving weekend.
Here's the config:

Titanium Gray Metallic
Beige Leather
Cold Weather Package
Premium Package
Automatic Transmission
Navigation

$48K plus tax, license and fees = $52K out the door.
Remember now, this is a used car with 2,823 miles.

I bought the extended BMW maintenance for about $1,595 (to 6yrs/100K miles).
Since it is technically used, they couldn't extend the BMW Factory Warranty (only available to original owners). They did offer me a GE Warranty for 6yrs/100K miles ($100 deductible) for $2,385...do you think it's worth it? Does anyone project anything going wrong with this vehicle after the 4yr/50K mile warranty? I told them that I'd get back to them on the warranty - although they warned me that the price will go up (whatever ).

Any thoughts are greatly appreciated. Thanks to all for their input.

BTW, this was bought in Southern Cali!!!

ktran

I have also learned quite a bit from this forum. We have never leased a car until now. Here was the deal we signed over the past weekend:
2006 530i with Auto, Prem package, Navigation, and Cold weather package
MSRP $53,120
Selling price $50,220
36 months, 15K/yr
MF 0.00155
$0 security deposit
Bank Fee $825
--> monthly payment (incl. 7.75% tax) = $712.34
Due at signing: $1153.09 (first payment + $45 doc fee + $387 DMV + $8.75 tire fee)
I think some people on this board have been able to get a better deal. I might be able to negotiate some more but as you all know the sales guy will always try to sneak something in. Also, the car was not available on the West Coast and had to be trucked in from the East Coast. I can't comment on the dealer just yet since I have not picked up the car as it is still on its way to Calif. I will post more info next week. Again, thank you all for your advises and wonderful posts.

kyfdx

That looks like a great deal.. a big discount off MSRP.. and the base money factor... The only "extra" that I see is they bumped up the acquisition fee by $200...

Congratulations!!

andrewcap

Good day all,
Looking at the 528iT wagon '99, 77K for $14,500. I was talking with a friend and he said there was a problem with the suspension in the 5 series. There were too many parts to it and it got loose over time. He thinks the problem was corrected in one of the following years 99, 00, 01, somewhere around there. Does anyone know about this? Please let me know. Cheers, Andrew

kyfdx

Hi, andrewcap...

The best place to get answers about possible 5-series issues would be here: BMW 5-Series Owners: Problems & Solutions

A lot of knowledgeable owners hang out there..

regards,
kyfdx
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andrewcap

Thanks I'll check it out.
Andrew

jo2

I was very happy with my deal but I am now second guessing my decision, especially after seeing that AUDI is running an amzing deal on a well equipped A6 for 519/mo with about the same equipment.

Here is the deal I got:

BMW 530i with Premuim package, Sport Package, and Navigation
Total MSRP 54,500

2000/drive off
24/ mo lease
12,000 miles year
694.00/month

What do all you BMW experts think?

kyfdx

I'd say that is a very good deal on the 530i..

There is always a better deal out there... on a different car... If you were only shopping for the lowest lease payment, then, yeah.. . you missed the boat on the Audi..

But, if you were looking for a good lease deal on a 530i, it looks like you got one... the lease program on the 530i isn't too bad, either...

regards,
kyfdx
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bmwdoug

I have been offered the following deal: New 06 530i, which will have to be ordered, it will take 6 to 8 weeks. It has the following options:
Black Sapphire Metallic
Black Interior
Automatic
Sport Package
Premium Package
Navigation
Sirius Satellite Radio
Rear Seat Fold Down
Rear Seat Air Bags

OUT THE DOOR PRICE is $57, 906.
Broken down as follows: Selling Price is $53,065, California Sales Tax is 7.75%, License and Doc Fees. I would like to know opinions on whether I should except this deal or shop around. Thank you.

low_ball_88

How much below msrp is the selling price?

What dealer (northern or So Cal.)?

ntu

I wanted to get people's opinion on the following car that I am considering.

2005 BMW 545
Options: Every available option(Performance, sports,cold weather nav, etc.).
Mileage - 7K

Price: 54K from a private party (pay the remainder owed to BMW Finance) or I can take over his current lease 4% ~$750 a month. My thoughts would be that I would take over the lease then pay off car to avoid paying taxes on the car.

Thoughts? Comments?

bdr127

Taxes are already figured into the lease payment, so you are still paying taxes..... Anyways, $750/mo for that 545i? I'd jump on that!

ntu

Thanks for the response - This would be my first time buying from a private party so let me see if I understand correctly.

If I purchase the car outright from BMW finance (and have the owner transfer the car to me) I won't have to pay any additional taxes when I register the car. Is that right?

It's the same as if I decide to just pay the lease for a while and then buy out the car at a later date?

I'm trying to figure out my total "out the door/bank" costs.

A couple of other questions have now popped out - Does anyone know if I can get the extended BMW factory warranty and/or BMW extended maintenance program if I take over/buy out this lease?

kyfdx

Tax on leases depends on where you live... If you actually buy the car from BMWFS, I'm sure you will have to pay sales tax on it.. unless your state does not charge sales taxes on used cars..

If your state charges sales tax on the lease payment, then if you acquire the lease, you will have to pay on the monthly payment.. Is the current lessee in the same state as you? How does your state handle taxes on leases?

Those are questions you will have to get the answer to.. If your prospective seller can give you the number to BMWFS, then they can probably answer all of those questions for you...

regards,
kyfdx
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ntu

Thanks for the reply - I live in California and the car is being leased from a California dealer.

The $750 lease payment amount does include taxes already.

I would assume the total purchase price to close out the lease would also include tax already (I'll double check with BMWFS).

So the total out the purchase price would be $54K for a slightly used 545 BMW - Thoughts on whether this is a good deal. I had a similar deal slip thru my fingers $50K total price.....

Thanks in advance!

kyfdx

If you and the current lessee are both in California, then that simplifies things...

I'd certainly take over the lease for $750/mo. tax included, rather than pay $54K for the car.. But, take into account the miles left, and whether that fits into your driving needs....

Of course, if you decide to buy the car from BMWFS, when the lease is finished... you'll have to pay sales tax on that amount...

regards,
kyfdx
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rainmaker2

That looks to be $1270 over invoice, assuming a MACO of $425. Sounds very reasonable, although I was able to push a few dealers to give me $1000 over.

jackz

Hi,

I have a tough decision to make right now. Should I go buy/lease 525xi AWD or X5? For the similar options, X5 is around $5k cheaper.

Questions:

1. Does 525xi have the same driving experience as X5 on slippery road/HWY?

2. I don't drive much on business days. Top $8-10k miles a year.

3. Should I buy or lease?

Thanks a lot!

bway

Do you have the MF and residuals for the 550 and 530? I want to lease for 20K per year and obviously live in SoCal.

Do you think deals are better now or Jan/Feb?

thanks
B-man

rroyce10

..... You need to get out and drive em' both ... 2 different vehicles doing 2 different things ...

Not to sound smart, but asking someone for their opinion on how a particular vehicle drives is like asking someone how a particular golf club plays .. it's all in the touch and feel.

Terry

rroyce10

... Your better deals will be between now and Jan 1st, it's called tumbleweed time .... dealers don't want to be seeing that floorplan come mid-January and they don't want to miss any bonus that will be riding on the their 05 year ...

Terry.

bmwdoug

This situation seems very odd to me. I would like opinions. I have been corresponding via email with a BMW Dealer about the purchase of a car. I gave an out the door price, the dealer said he would accept the offer. I had given the dealer the color combination I wanted and the options I wanted. The Dealer said he would sell the car at the price I stated, but wanted a deposit so he could locate the car.

I replied, I would gladly give a deposit if the Dealer guaranteed me that the exact car I wanted would be available. (I know sometimes certain Dealers will not give up certain cars in Dealer trades.) The Dealer wrote me back and said, "In life nothing is certain but death and taxes, I need a deposit to secure your car. I will have it in about 1 to 2 weeks." I wrote back and said, "I will gladly give a deposit, if you guarantee me that you can secure the exact car I want, with the exact options I want, at the exact price we discussed, and a 1 to 2 week time frame as you suggested. I want to know for certain the car is available."

The Dealer wrote back again, and said " I have explained myself, I need a deposit to continue, or we need to move on" I wrote back to the Dealer and said, "we need to move on. I all honesty I have never heard of anyone giving a deposit on a car or any tangible item without a guarantee that the item actually exists."

Does this Dealer seem shady?

rainmaker2

I would agree it seems suspicious. I have never heard of a dealer asking for a deposit BEFORE even doing the legwork to see if the actual car you desire is out there. I had a salesperson refuse to even do a search for me unless I was ready to commit to buying with him, which I find utterly ridiculous. I think some salespeople will try to milk the customer for whatever they can. One dealership required a $1000 deposit to order a car. Another said they needed $3000. It seems that there is no standard for what is required in terms of a deposit, and that it's pretty much at the whim of the dealership. I would definitely walk away from a dealer who is asking for a deposit even before he or she is willing to look for the car. There's plenty of other dealerships out there that can get you the car you want, if it indeed already exists. How did the dealer respond to your email, if at all?

bmwdoug

Rainmaker thanks for the reply. I agree with your comments. Here is how the dealer responded to my last email: "I have taken 2 deposits on vehicles this weekend and gotten vehicles the very same day. If I don't have a car I can't guarantee anything. Variables outside of my control may prevent me from delivering on the terms we discussed. If I can't deliver then you don't get charged. That is how we conduct business and it protects both my interests and yours. I would rather coduct business ethically than make a promise I can't keep. I am sorry that we couldn't make a deal."

Again, I think it is wrong and unethical to take a deposit when you don't even know if the car exists or if you don't know a Dealer will trade. I have NEVER experienced a request for a deposit on an item of any type that may not even exist.

locer

Have a offer on the table for a CPO 525i with automatic and premium package with about 25K miles from a BMW dealer. Dealer was originally asking about $39,000 and is agreeing to sell the car now for $37,250. Do you guys think this is a fair deal. The price I quoted excludes TT&L.

Locer in Texas

bmwdoug

What year is the 525i?

locer

I was referring to a 2004 525i.

I also have another offer for a demo 2005 525i with 14000 miles for $38500, but this car does not have CPO. However, it has the 5-spoke wheels and xenon, which the 2004 did not have. As a result, is it worth paying a little more for a 2005 even though it doesn't have CPO?

bmwdoug

Check Edmunds used prices to see where it falls. Also, check http://www.kbb.com for their perspective on used prices. I think it sounds like a pretty fair deal for a 2004 525 with CPO. CPO I believe cost about $1400, I could be wrong, someone else may know the correct amount. I think I would go for the 2005, the Xeon are worth an extra $700. Find out how much it is to have the Dealer CPO a car. Then offer $38,000 for the 2005 Demo, and add the cost of of the CPO to your offer of $38,000...

vsaxena

bmwdoug:
At least in California all deposits are refundable. PERIOD.

The dealer wants to be sure that you are dead serious about the car and wants you to put a nominal (2-3%) down on your CC so that he knows that you are not taking him for a ride. Once he gets your deposit, he will start searching and calling the dealers he knows he can work with. Imagine if you were in his place, you did all the leg-work and then the buyer backs out at the last minute. He does not want that to happen so wants some commitment.

You might wonder why he does not guarantee you a car? He can not because even if the car is available at a nearby dealer, he can not be sure that he can get it. This is because the car might be sold before he can get it. Even worse, if for some reason you had already called the other dealer to negotiate for the car, the other dealer will not trade the car. So he is right in saying that there is no guarantee.

If I was in your place, I would put the $1K on a CC whose billing cycle just closed. Then I would have at least a few weeks before I am actually supposed to pay the cc company; enough time for the dealer to work with.

kyfdx

If I was in your place, I would put the $1K on a CC whose billing cycle just closed. Then I would have at least a few weeks before I am actually supposed to pay the cc company; enough time for the dealer to work with.

Good advice there...

backbonz

I love my car, but i am now wanting an M3. Im about to sell my '03 525i (28k miles) and am confused about the CPO status. Would the CPO status transfer to anyone i sold the car to?

hpia4v2

Doug,
first of all, I am not a car saleman and rarely side with them. But I think if you are dealing with a genuine BMW dealer this is OK. I put $1000 deposit back in 2000 for an X5 and after 6weeks had to cancel due to wide spread problems on aux fan overheating. The dealer gave my money back. I had to go to a different dealer when buying my 2002 X5 though

If I were you just put it on Amex credit card and give the dealer 2 weeks to work on the trade. Then if they try to pull a fast one on you, just call Amex to dispute the charge. Amex takes care the dispute, you don't even have to contact the dealer Amex will.

Off course only if the price on the car is too good to pass up.

I really think the salesman just want to lock you in, to make sure you are not just wondering if you can get the car for that price.