Chevy Malibu Maxx

revkarevka Member Posts: 1,750
to discuss the Chevy Malibu Maxx. To start, here's some news from Edmunds' News Headlines. If you come across any more news on this upcoming wagon, please post it here. Thanks for your participation! ;-)

Revka

Hatchbacks & Wagons Host
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Comments

  • mitzijmitzij Member Posts: 613
    When a car is sold, the dealer has to report it to GM, entering VIN, date, mileage, that sort of thing. It goes to a database that is accessible by other GM dealers via a website. It looks like your dealer entered '100' as mileage when sold. If I were you, I'd look to get this corrected. I'm not sure how, though. If your deal paperwork shows mileage, that'll help. I'd try aggravating the dealer first.

    p.s. if you got a nice discount due to the 'high' miles when you bought the car, you might not want to stir the pot! ;)
  • e2helpere2helper Member Posts: 1,002
    Gee, I don't know if you needed to post it 3x :P

    Top speed is dependant upon tires usually especially in the case of the Malibu Maxx SS.

    So if you know what type of tires are on your vehicle we might be able to answer question. There are 2 different types of tires available. Both tire sizes are P225/50R-18 so you need to look at the brand and style. The standard tire is Goodyear Eagle LS-2 M+S all season with top speed limited to 115 or 118 MPH. I think the other tire is Bridgestone Potenza which is a high performance tire for summer only. I know that Malibu Maxx SS with that tire has a higher top speed limit but I don't know what it is - someone else might though.

    I drove an Malibu SS with the Potenza tires for a week a few months ago when we had a little ice/snow and I can confirm that it is a tire better suited for summer :D

    By the way Feb 2006 C/D mag has review on Malibu Maxx SS.
  • kiltmankiltman Member Posts: 67
    there is a 05 base model maxx on a used car lot here in Detroit area. They are asking just over 12k, and you know you could get them to go lower. There are no options on this vehicle to speak of.
  • mr_botsmr_bots Member Posts: 236
    No, it won't run on E85. It's getting the LZ4, the non flex-fuel version.
  • odmanodman Member Posts: 309
    The Malibu Maxx shares its architecture with the Vectra-based, Opel Signum in Europe. I imagine the final product will have the Chevy chrome strip grill but will retain much of the styling and proportions of this car. It should be nice, and is certainly innovative.


    http://www.cardesignnews.com/news/2002/020821opel-signum/index.html


    In addition to the Maxx, the British magazine CAR has a small article on the Vectra wagon, which uses the stretched Signum/Maxx wheelbase, and provides a traditional wagon overhang. It will rival Volvo's for spaciousness.


    Any interest in a large Malibu wagon?

  • revkarevka Member Posts: 1,750
    Look pretty sharp, imo. Also, the rear seating system sounds interesting. ;-)


    Revka

    Hatchbacks & Wagons Host

  • revkarevka Member Posts: 1,750
    Edmunds' now has information on the 2004 Chevrolet Malibu Midsize Wagon in their Future Vehicles Section. Hope you enjoy! Let us know what you think....


    image


    Thanks for your comments!


    Revka

    Hatchbacks & Wagons Host

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    While I do like some details, it lacks a 3rd side window and a D-pillar, so it's more LWB hatchback than wagon.

    Imagine a stretch limo version of the old Honda Civic.

    Also, there appears to be zero cargo space. The rear headrest almost touches the back window.

    The Opel front looks like Mercury's Mountaineer. Styling overall is OK, but the huge blind spot and lack of cargo space would nix it from my list right off the bat.

    -juice
  • logic1logic1 Member Posts: 2,433
    The Maxx/Signum is made with a certain buyer in mind. And I think I am one of them.

    I am married, no kids. My wife and I like to go out with friends. I frequently drive with clients on business. I live in Chicago where parking space is a precious commodity. When I travel long distance, I fly. On the weekends I like to put my bike in the car and drive to one of the many outlying bike paths. My bike cost almost two grand, so I like to keep it in the car, not on a rack exposed to flying debris.

    The Maxx provides exceptional space for four adults without having too large a parking footprint. As Odman's link points out, the rear seats will fold flat, meaning plenty of room for me to lay my bicycle in the back (or haul a good sized piece of furniture, etc.).

    With the large rear window and side mirrors, I fail to see a problem with visibility. I already own a car with the ecotec engine, and would not hesitate to buy a Maxx with one.

    Far from being a stretch Civic, I see the Maxx as a good mix of SUV and sedan. Plenty of SUV like passenger comfort and storage flexibility. Sedan like size and economy.

    I understand GM hopes to sell about 70k Maxxs per anum. I think there are 70k people like me out there.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The visibility issue I mentioned was with the very thick C-pillar. It would leave a blind spot.

    Guess I'd have to get in one to be sure.

    -juice
  • wgrwgr Member Posts: 127
    Has anyone seen or heard of the price range for the Maxx ?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    At one point Lutz said those cars might hit the $30k price range, though he specifically mentioned the Grand Am.

    I think he's smoking some good stuff! ;-)

    -juice
  • cb70cb70 Member Posts: 226
    Where's my Mazda 6 Wagon or turbo Forester already?!!
  • 94_octane94_octane Member Posts: 14
    My impression is - the $30K price range is for the Saab versions of the Epsilon, not the Malibu. I think I read somewhere that the Malibu will undercut similar Camry/Accords in price, so more like $18-24K.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I'm sure that is more realistic. But Bob did mention the Grand Am could eventually compete in that price range. It was from an Automotive News article.

    -juice
  • nematodenematode Member Posts: 448
    First, you heard it here first: The Maxx will be a total failure along the lines of the Aztek IF it looks like the picture above and comes in at more than $18k FULLY loaded with every option. Second, I'm a wagon lover and thats not a wagon. Its like the ugly older brother of the Mazda Protege based P5. The front facia of a mid 90s Maxima glued to a Civic. I dont like it. I dont like it. I dont like it. I dont like it. I dont like it. I dont like it. I dont like it.

    Looks aside, as they are totally subjective, it better come in at closer to the $15-18k range if it wants to have a prayer of getting a foothold. Why on earth would you select that over the Subaru Legacy L wagon on the low end which you can have for $19k or even better the GT wagon for $24k nicely loaded?????? OR if you like that look you could just get the Mazda P5, Matrix/Vibe, or other little wagon clone.

    I would not produce that car. There is no reason to select it over a variety of BETTER options. Just different is not better. Only better is better. The Maxx is not better.
  • logic1logic1 Member Posts: 2,433
    You seem to be confused about several issues.

    First, this is not the Malibu wagon. GM is discussing a possible wagon. This is a mid-size hatch designed for maximum -- thus the name -- interior space.

    Second, note I said mid-size. The other cars you describe are compact. This is a car that will compare in size, weight, and features not to the cars you list, but to the CamCords, Mazda6, Passat and Taurus. All these cars are priced well above the range you feel the Maxx should come in.

    The idea behind the Maxx is to provide a comfortable environment for car buyers who want a car designed not for young families or carrying a lot of cargo, but for carrying several adults comfortably. In other words, a car alternative to a Grand Cherokee.

    Of the alternatives you list, maybe the Matrix/Vibe can fit four adults comfortably, but that whiney little engine and the compact car suspension sure would make all but the shortest trips a chore for people in the back.
  • revkarevka Member Posts: 1,750
    Good points. Also, regarding the Maxx classification: seems we've had similar confusion with a number of other wagons/hatches (i.e. Protege5, PT Cruiser, Matrix/Vibe) that have hit the market. I also recall reading another article which mentioned that Chevy was referring to it as an "extended sedan," because of the stigma behind owning a hatch or a wagon. ;-)

    Of course the ultimate test will be to see how the NHTSA classifies it. We could eventually link this discussion up to the Hatchbacks board if it becomes a real issue. Talk later.

    Revka

    Hatchbacks & Wagons Host
  • logic1logic1 Member Posts: 2,433
    Thanks.

    Perhaps I am reading too much into the design concept, but I think what GM actually is attempting to mimic some popular SUV features in a sedan-like vehicle.

    The point has been made many times here that most people who buy SUVs do not drive them off road and do not carry loads of plywood around. What they really want is a vehicle that allows them to sit higher off the ground with plenty of leg room.

    By pushing the wheels out further than in the sedan and moving the rear seat back, the Maxx will really be comfortable for every one.

    It is hard to categorize. It is bigger, and should be nicer than the typical hatch, does not offer the same cargo eating features as a wagon, and is more sedan-like inside than most of the current cross overs.

    Manufacturing flexibility is finally reaching the point where we observers cannot keep up with category naming.
  • nematodenematode Member Posts: 448
    Oh, I'm usually confused BUT:
    1) MOST small cars (Protege, Civic, Vibe, or whatever) can carry 4 adults just fine AND carry cargo. If you put 4 people in the Maxx there is no cargo space. Not even for 4 sets of golf clubs. The rear seats are basically in the trunk to give the illusion of having a bigger car. Thats fine but then you have no trunk.
    2) If you want a mid sized car, and the car in the picture is bigger than it actually appears, then you can just get one. Camry, Impala, Accord, Legacy, or whatever. There are plenty of mid sized cars that can carry 4 people with room to spare.

    3) The price is just too high. Well equipped Accords, Camrys, and even the new 6 run about $20k. To under cut that popular segment then you need to come in at between $15-18k MAX.

    In this case I think that GM is confused more than I am. There is no market for a mid sized car with a small trunk, questionable sytle, and price tag that competes with established cars.
  • logic1logic1 Member Posts: 2,433
    Well, I am not sure why a new GM the same size as the new CamCords would have to undercut them in price. More than likely, the GM will come with friendlier loan terms than the CamCords, and probably the same as the 6. I do not understand at all why you think the Malibu and the Maxx need be less expensive than their competitors.

    The Maxx will have better rear seat space than the Camcords and 6, and much better than the econoboxes you site. It will also have a midsize ride and handling, again, much better than the econoboxes.

    I have a mid-size sedan and do not use the trunk for much of anything. When I do need storage space, it is to carry large items, such as my bike (which will never go on a rack outside of the car) or when I bring large ticket items home from the store.

    The Maxx with its hatch back and fold down seats will accomodate such things far easier than a mid-size sedan and than an econobox.

    When I look at the interior of the Maxx, I see GM taking the interior of an SUV and putting it into a safer, more practical, economical, and better driving sedan. So many people are saying this country should get away from SUVs. I expect some SUV people will look at alternatives. I doubt many will want to go from a Trailblazer to a Vibe though. The Maxx may be more to their liking.
  • revkarevka Member Posts: 1,750
    Here's a little more news from Edmunds' Headlines section: Chevy Confirms Malibu Maxx.

     

    Revka

    Hatchbacks & Wagons
  • logic1logic1 Member Posts: 2,433
    And I see where Edmunds highlights exactly why I am interested in the Maxx.

    It can act like a Sedan when I want to take colleagues or friends around. And it can act like an SUV when I want to go camping and biking.

    Plus, it has the advantage of mid-size sedan ride and handling and mpg.
  • phoenexiusphoenexius Member Posts: 30
    This looks like a GM attempt at selling a European car in the US.

    There are many vehicles of that design here. See the Renault Megane, Peugot 307, Honda Jazz, Fiat Multipla, Audi A2, Benz A-Class, etc.

    They are designed to have 4+ seats and a little cargo room. It is the perfect alternative to the minivan for small families. The seating is upright, visibility is pretty good (you can see over the small hatches). Entry is much easier than hatches of old, you don't have to step down.

    The success in europe is because of the increase in space and visibility over a small hatch, minivans are too big and expensive, wagons are too long.

    I think it's going to be a hard sell in North America.
  • logic1logic1 Member Posts: 2,433
    I think a limited edition might work.

    I was a passenger in a few Multipla taxis in Rome recently, and really liked the lay out.

    A mini-van and a wagon are not quite what I want. A sedan based vehicle will get much better mileage than an SUV.

    Most people will opt for the mini-van or wagon. But 70 or so thousand many urban people might see the Maxx as a good alternative.
  • 94_octane94_octane Member Posts: 14
    Nematode - I don't quite understand your logic. You do realize this car is much bigger than a Matrix/Vibe, Pro5, etc..? It's sort of like saying - "well, a Corolla and a Camry both look alike, so I can't understand why Toyota needs to build both".

    As for the lack of trunk space, it is my understanding that the rear seat will be adjustable fore/aft, like a minivan, so you can either have maximum legroom or maximum trunk room.
  • maxx4memaxx4me Member Posts: 1,340
    harry: I am amazed that anyone would pay 30K for a Pacifica; yes, it is yet another beautiful vehicle by Chrysler, but is probably another venus fly trap as well. One of the problems with me keeping my car 10 years, and factoring in that there are few cars on the market that I fit it, is that when the right thing comes along I have to grab it. That was the case with the Vibe, and it will likely be the case with the Maxx. My 13 year old Corolla was on its last legs when the Vibe came along, and after only 7 years my Ford 626 is beginning to push up dasies. I also have a strong moral streak which forbids me from selling my car when there is a mechanical problem with it. Since there are several with my 626, I will donate it and take the tax write off. I have no doubt that I will buy an extended warranty with my Maxx. I am however, contemplating NOT getting one for my Vibe since it is a Corolla aferall. If there is to be two "GMs" in my driveway, I'd best apply the warranty money towards the Maxx, don't you think?
  • nematodenematode Member Posts: 448
    Looks are only part of it. The Corolla and Camry are both leaders in their field. Honda competes with the Civic and Accord which are not only different but better in some aspects. If you want small you can go with the Corolla/Matrix and so on. If you want larger you can go Camry or one of the mini-SUVs or Subaru wagons and so on. So two questions:
    1) What does the Maxx do differently?
    2) What does the Maxx do better?
    3) Is the Maxx priced low enough to attract people?

    1) The Maxx does not have what most people would call classic good looks. It does have a sliding second seat with allow you to increase or decrease trunk space or leg room as needed. That attractive but not enough to get more than a tiny niche market to buy it. You cannot slide seats but you can fold or remove seats in most minivans, fold in wagons, fold and slide in small SUVs.
    2) Its different but not really better. Its good to have options. The Mazda 6 and Camry are different and thats good enough. Will being different be good enough to get people to buy the Maxx. My prediction is no.
    3) It needs to be priced really low to attract people. The price can only go higher if there is a market. The Aztek may not have failed if it was priced between $18-22k loaded where it should have been.
  • 94_octane94_octane Member Posts: 14
    Are you opposed to the concept, or just the fact that it's a GM car?

    In other words, if Toyota came out with a larger Camry-based Matrix/Vibe type "tall wagon", would that be a good idea?

    Is a Matrix/Vibe 'different but not really better' than a Corolla?

    Would a larger Camry-based "tall wagon" be 'different but not better' than a Camry?

    I think the concept of a 'larger than Matrix/Vibe' 'tall wagon' is certainly viable. Maybe the Maxx won't be successful due to the "baggage" of the Chevrolet and Malibu name, but I think there is a niche in the market for this type of vehicle.

    Would you expect to pay more for the "tall wagon" version or the sedan version of the Camry?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    So, nematode, do you like it? You were kind of vague. ;-)

    I don't see that the design breaks any new ground. Looks like a 5 door hatchback, just maybe a little taller than usual. Like a modern Saab 9000, but smaller and with less cargo space.

    Camry has gotten taller over the years, and the Ford 500 will do the same. The Maxx doesn't seem to stretch the height much more than those.

    What's funny is that Saab has left the hatchback arena. Coincidentally it'll share a platform with Saab.

    SUVs have lots and lots of cargo space, plus a nice flat roof usually with a rack for extra capacity. I don't see the Maxx as a suitable substitute for an SUV for those specific reasons.

    And GM should change the name. When you say "Malibu" I immediately think of $15,000 rental cars, poor resale, so-so reliability, etc.

    Call it just "Maxx". Then offer a turbo version and call it the Mad Maxx. :-)

    -juice
  • nematodenematode Member Posts: 448
    So here are the answers to your questions:
    1) I'm never opposed to diversity in the automotive world.
    2) I like GM. I have my GM card earning pretty much maxed out.

    The problems:
    1) I'm opposed to THIS concept vehicle. The goal of a concept (other than the usual flash, techno, possibility) is to explore a niche. To do this you need to:
    a) have a niche to market. Kids love sports cars but you dont market sports cars to kids. A better market is like Buick aimed at my mom (60yo). That works.
    b) Its also the place where demand and quantity demanded come into play. The demand for the Ferrari Maranello is high but the actual quantity demanded is low....yet price is high because demand is high. If you have low demand and are in a niche market than price will not hold because people will not buy. The Aztek lesson GM should have learned. You need to target a market and make the vechicle they "NEED" to have over other choices.
    So why does this apply here? The demand for the Maxx will be low. It will be even lower if the price is high....so price has to be low....but its going after a niche market. The arguement is circular. As I see it the market will be people who dont have kids and want a few extra inches in the back seat......The niche the are going after is covered pretty well so you have to have that "something" people want. It there is nothing special about the Maxx other than a few extra inches of leg room in the rear the 10k people a year in the US who want it will buy it and then it will fall off the map. As far as tall Camry's and such.....The Camry, Accord, and even Buick Regal wagons have been done. The Camry and Accord wagons did not sell well as they came along during the upswing in SUV and, to some degree, minivan sales. They also had clunky broken lines and were pretty ugly, which never helps. If there was a Camry and/or Accord wagon now it would probably be a fair seller at best and not worth the development cost. Yes they would be different and not really better....but you cant really compare established brands with new ones anyway. If that were the case then Huyndai would rule the market right now.
    The wagon market is growing but Subaru, Volvo, Audi, Saab, and other are already there. The Mazda 6 will be the new hot one on the block too. So the Maxx is not a wagon? Ita a tall car? Sure. Same principle applies. Why would Toyota build another tall Camry? The already make the RX300 and Highlander. Honda has the CRV and the Pilot. Subaru offers the Forrester, Impreza in various versions, and the Legacy based things like the Outbak and the Baja. The niche may be saturated for "tall cars". If Toyota were to build a tall Camry, it would just be different without the looks and AWD of the other (RX300 and Highlander) options. Just different.
    2) I like GM but I'm not loyal to any company. Even with all the rebates and all my GM dollars I still got a Mazda Protege ES as my daily commuter. I dont want to see GM make a horrible mistake with the Maxx. If the are going to go after than niche it has to be with:
    a) price. Its gotta be cheap relative to others because they are not established in the niche. Niche buyers are pretty loyal so why would they switch?
    b) content. It better have AWD, 200+hp, and/or all the other goodies that come with the others in that range. Thats unless it comes in at closer to $18k in which case you could get away with less.
    There needs to be a reason to select the Maxx over an SUV (GM offering included), mini-SUV, wagon, tall car, and other stuff thats out there already and made.

    Does not mean you should not like the Maxx. Just means I dont like it and think. I used to like the close to 300hp SVO minivan (based on the Montana) that GM used to show. The one with the 18in rims, lowered, with all the boy racer ground effects. I loved that thing and hoped they would make it but I knew it would not happen. If I were in charge the Maxx would not happen until I could build something that had a fighting chance in the market.
  • 94_octane94_octane Member Posts: 14
    Ok, nematode - I understand where you're coming from now.
    I still don't agree that the Maxx has absolutely no chance in the market, but I will grant you that it is highly dependent on the price. Obviously, it will be more attractive at $18-22K than at $30K. However, I would expect it to cost more than the regular 4-door Malibu, just like a Matrix costs more than a Corolla or a Highlander costs more than a Camry, or a PT Cruiser costs more than a Neon, etc...

    As someone mentioned above, it's sort of ironic that Chevrolet is making a 5-door and Saab is not. This car seems better suited as a Saab.

    I still like the idea of taking some risks. Sometimes you strike out, like the Aztek, and sometimes you hit it out of the park, like the PT Cruiser.
  • nematodenematode Member Posts: 448
    as you said in the $18-22k range. BUT at $22k it has to be a full content vehicle. There are too many other choices once you crack the $20k mark for it to be a sales success. If it came standard with the 3.5L motor and AWD for $22k then it would be a very interesting vehicle. I dont think it really needs the AWD in the market they want so just the 3.5L standard would be a good start. I think they should just drop the idea of the 2.2L variant unless they want to sell it at closer to $16-18k like an Accord or Camry range. So I think if it comes with the 3.5L, ABS, leather, auto, CD, power seat, power windows, rear wiper, curise, and all the other people friendly stuff like that for $22k it will sell. The only other things in that range would the Subaru wagons (no 6 in that range) , Mazda 6 (but its a tratitional wagon), and the mini-SUVs (some with 6s). There it would compete well as a people hauler. The problem is that I predict it will come in at about $28k loaded like the Aztek did and flop. I hope it does not but.....only time will tell. The MSRP is everyting on this vehicle.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Lots of home-run cars were big risks - Miata, New Beetle, PT Cruiser, and Mini Cooper. So yeah, I love to see innovation.

    I guess I want to see them push the envelope a little more than they did with the Maxx. It's just a tall hatchback.

    Look at the Murano, for instance. It's got style, space, big-league power, and a unique feature (CVT). You need all of those to compete at the $30k level.

    -juice
  • nematodenematode Member Posts: 448
    Camry and Accord: Build a quality car and people will forgive their lack of excitement.

    Regal/Impala: for the rental set. In the mid-size fleet there is no better rental than the Regal LS.

    The minivan in general: Its bigger than a station wagon and smaller than a full size van. Its a pot of gold.

    The SUV: made for people who dont want to be seen driving a minivan.....the Explorer et al. are basically minivans.

    The mini-SUV: its looks cooler than a Civic/Corolla. Its a little bigger than a compact car but smaller than a real SUV. Its that pot of gold again.

    I do have to admit I was shocked at the sales of the Beetle and PT.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Camry reliability fell to just average lately. But they're banking on historical reputation.

    Car makers are looking for the next big thing, the next segment to explode. Right now it's actually luxury SUVs, believe it or not. The RX300 is Lexus' biggest seller, and Lexus lead the luxury segment on its back.

    Everyone is looking to crossovers to be the next big thing.

    -juice
  • 94_octane94_octane Member Posts: 14
    The thing is - in the GM pricing model, the MSRP is almost irrelevant. Nobody pays MSRP for a GM car, except maybe a few specialty cars like the Corvette Z06 or the new SSR hotrod/truck. If the MSRP is $25K, the average "out the door" transaction price is probably more like $22K or even less with a big rebate and/or 0% financing.

    I agree with juice above - everyone is looking for that next 'segment buster', like the new Chrysler Pacifica, the Honda Element, or the new Nissan Murano, that aren't quite SUVs, aren't quite wagons, aren't quite cars.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    High MSRPs can scare people off, GM should be careful.

    Buyers are also addicted to rebates, but I hate them. For instance, in MD, you pay sales tax on the full amount before rebate. So with a $3000 rebate, you pay $150 extra in state sales tax. It's dumb, just lower the freakin' price!

    -juice
  • nematodenematode Member Posts: 448
    Subaru does the same thing. I remember my wifes Outback Ltd. wagon had a list price of $28k+ (including the 6CD changer and some other stuff) with everything except the gate bar, diffy protector, and auto dimming mirror. We almost left without talking to the sales guy. After about 5min it was down $2k and we eventually got it for $200 over invoice from a different dealer. At $25k its a great car with leather, ABS, AWD, seat heaters, the premium sound system, power seat, and all the goodies. At close to $30k it was not that interesting.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Subaru's highest rebate on the Legacy for the past couple of years was $750. That's nothing compared to the $2-3 grand the Big 3 give away routinely.

    Right now they have some financing incentives, but not zero percent, and no rebates at all.

    -juice
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Member Posts: 2,287
    But, but, but...

    The Big Three, particularly GM, pad prices (including invoice prices) in order to allow huge incentives later. This is especially easily seen in the difference in pricing in the Matrix and Vibe.

    This does help those who cannot otherwise come up with a down payment, though.
  • rcf8000rcf8000 Member Posts: 619
    The PT Cruiser, Vibe, and Matrix have proven that there is a market for tall wagons. It's not a stretch to conclude that there would be a market for a larger, more upscale tall wagon. I haven't seen any info on the height of the Maxx. Anybody know? I tried to scale it off of a photo and got 61 inches. Don't know how accurate that would be, though.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Did you see that Saturn now offers rebates? That was just about the last thing left to distinguish them. :-(

    Autoweek had a funny little tidbit about SoCal dealers stuck with leftover Lincoln Blackwoods. For the $53 grand or so MSRP, they would throw in a FREE Mercury Cougar! Both leftover 2002s. The funny thing is the dealer still made a 1-2 grand profit.

    Now THAT is price padding! Jeez!

    Any how, the Blackwood is an important lesson - you have to offer utility, period. Cadillac is selling Escalade EXTs at huge profits while Lincoln had to swallow huge losses with the Blackwood. Guess which one has a functional midgate and 4WD, and which one doesn't?

    Malibu Maxx should have AWD and lots and lots of cargo space and utility. Make a roof rack standard, with cross bars. Offer a tow package option. Hopefully they can avoid $3000 cash back.

    -juice
  • nematodenematode Member Posts: 448
    "Malibu Maxx should have AWD and lots and lots of cargo space and utility. Make a roof rack standard, with cross bars. Offer a tow package option."

    Thats about what I was getting at. I want it to work but I have not like the press I have seen on the Maxx. GM needs to make a vehicle that has a fighting chance. Just throwing out ANOTHER tall wagon is not going to work. Off the top of my head:
    Volvo has 2: XC90 (on the way); and the Cross country.
    Subaru: They are all tall wagons but the Outback, Baja, OBS, and Forester reall look like tall wagons.
    BMW: The 2 X5 variants are supposed to be SUVs but are basically tall wagons.
    DC: Pacifica (out soon), the ML series
    Toyota/Lexus: Matrix, if you want more of the SUV look you can go with the RX350 (and its bigger brother) or Highlander.
    Honda/Acura: The Pilot is supposed to be an SUV but its also more tall wagon (and its really big), if you want tall minivan you can go MDX, or smaller in the CRV.
    GM: also has their own version of the Matrix (Vibe). I think the Vibe tops out at about $19k so if they made a bigger Vibe for say $20-22k it would have interesting...if thats what the Maxx is then why is under Chevy?
    DSM: has the Outlander which looks pretty cool on paper and undercuts the Forester/Outback in price. Its definately a tall wagon.
    Nissan/Inf: Has the Murano under Nissan and the bionic cheeta thing (I forget the name) under Infinity on the way. Both are tall wagons. The Maxx actually looks a little like the Murano.

    There are simply too many choices in that range. Giving it a 3.5L V6 (perhaps a bored and stroked H6 from the Subaru), AWD, roof rack, stability control, ABS, full power package all standard would set it apart to some degree if the price was right. Leather, wood trim, towing package, and a fancy sound system would be nice options. If they could offer a loaded model with everyting for around $30k it would work. I think it would hammer the middle of the segment and get a nice foothold. I think down scaling the Maxx would be a huge mistake. If they want to do that they should release a cheaper FWD (less content) version under Pontiac as a bigger Vibe. Chevy does not need any more down scaling of its reputation.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    You can add X3, Aerio, Focus, FX45, an upcoming Dodge, a Ford 500 variant, and Element, to the list.

    It's getting crowded, so they have to find a way to stand out, or noone will even notice it.

    -juice
  • nematodenematode Member Posts: 448
    Thats the bionic cheetah right? I think thats the one I thought was really interesting when they mentioned it was getting the Q45 V8. The looks are "interesting". Not really my style but if you are going to do it......and V8 will not hurt you.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Kinda wierd looking to me, and I'm a HUGE wagon fan.

    -juice
  • logic1logic1 Member Posts: 2,433
    You guys are either not doing the research or missing the point.

    The Maxx rear seats are designed to either fold flat, roll up, or possibly to be removed all together. Racks are always options in cars like the Maxx.

    The idea is to have a car with a roomy rear seat for two adults that can then be reconfigured to near cargo van interior.

    Nematode, most of the vehicles you discuss in #41 are going to compete with the Cadillac SRX. I just do not even follow the argument at all.

    Then your argument becomes even more confused. A few posts up, you said the Maxx should be less expensive. Now you are saying it should be more deluxe. The Maxx is meant to be a varient of what will be Chevrolet's mid market car. Mid market today is approx 18.5 to 28 or so (you can pay in the 30s for a maxed out Passat, but few do). The Maxx will probably come in the middle, as Chevrolets always do.

    More than likely, the most expensive Malibu will be a Sedan SS model with a supercharged V6. Another Chevrolet tradition.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I'd have to see interior measurements, but it doesn't seem like it'd be any bigger than a RAV4, and much smaller than an Element, as a cargo van.

    -juice
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