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Comments
Acura TL3.2 reguire premium for its v6, I think. Maybe I am wrong.
"2005 Odyssey.
The all-new 2005 Honda Odyssey is coming soon and ready to raise the bar once again for minivans. Showcasing the latest technologies and features, it will anticipate your needs and exceed your expectations."
http://www.hondacars.com/info/prototypes/2005_odyssey.asp
Those big purchases, cars and homes, people usually like to negotiate, because they are negotiable. There is a high price in the first place.
I actually once opened a tread here in Town Hall about that subject, too (I think in smart shopper) that the way we buy cars should already change once for all. it would be better for some dealers (not all) and for the consumer. If I find it I'll post a link.
Just North of th I-90 and east of the I-405?
You are right about everything going on sale. I recently bought a vaccum cleaner that is regularly priced at $500.00 and NEVER goes on sale. Well, smart informed consumer that I am I was determined NOT to pay full price and I got my way. I found a website selling it for about $75.00 cheaper and since it was out of state, I paid no sales tax and no shipping either. So I got the same thing cheaper than anyone in this town. It pays to be persistent, what is the old saying? "Patience is a virtue."
Does everything go on sale? Depends on what you think something is worth, and what constitutes a sale, real value, and many other complicating factors.
Personally, I'm not foolish enough to believe that if I pay more - I'll get more everytime or most of the time. Actually we decided to purchase an ODY LX. So for us - less was more. Heh heh heh. (And no, we didn't pay MSRP for the van).
But - did we pay more than the deeply discounted domestics? Yes we did - but not by that much and definitely not when you factor in true cost of ownership and resale value.
There were many bells and whistles in both the Toyota and the Honda vehicles that we just didn't value. More was not more for us. Our equation isn't everyone's equation.
But, my point was for a manufacturer to set inflated MSRP figures and then deep discount the pricing with incentives, rebates, and yada yada - I contend they don't do themselves, or their customer-base any favors.
Weren't the '04 Siennas priced without much flexibilty when they first came out? Wasn't it a take it or leave it proposition for shoppers?
Is your point: wait for the people that feel the need to buy now, buy at MSRP, and then wait for a "good deal"?
What's a "good deal"? Does paying under MSRP automatically translate into good deal?
Was the Sienna "over-priced" then. How about now? Was it a good deal then? Is it a good deal now?
Do you think Honda will price themselves to be uncompetitive?
Peace.
Does this bode well for an Edix/FR-V appearance on our shores?
I bought my '99 Ody and my '03 Pilot at MSRP. Why? Value, in my opinion. With the Ody, I had enough problems with our '97 Dodge GC ES POS that I was worried about my wife and kids riding in it. After decades of ONLY Honda automobiles and no problems, I put reliability high on the list and I felt that this was worth the MSRP. Afterall, you can't put a price on your family's safety and I wanted some of the BEST ODDS that they would never be stranded. That's not to say that we will never have a problem with a Honda...but I truly believe that I am less likely than most other brands (except maybe Toyota). The '99 never let us down. With the Pilot...same thing. I could have bought an Exploder...er, Explorer, for less, but wanted the reliability, comfort and "Value" that I perceived.
Now, with our '03 Sub, I wouldn't pay MSRP. I bought it for Invoice, then got the $5K rebate, PLUS ~44% trade in allowance for my '99 Ody with 98K miles. I only lost 56% over 98K miles on my Ody while my brother lost ~94% on his Dodge GC with similar miles. THAT is added value in my mind.
So, what I am saying is that we each make up our own minds on purchasing based on aesthetics, value, and what we can afford or want to pay. I am more willing to pay MSRP for a Honda based on my past experiences and my perceptions. But that doesn't mean that my decision is right or wrong for anybody else except my family and me.
The problem is (if it is one) the Odys always seem to go for MSRP...they have since 99 (for the most part) . until this year when they wanted to unload the 04s.
I am on a list for an 05 and will probably pay MSRP...but not a penny over. It has a lot of features that we have been looking to get and are looking forward to seeing them come in.
My 2 cents.
You are correct. And as for me, I KNOW they are making a killing selling at MSRP (have never paid MSRP+). But that is what is amazing to me. I still think that my '99 Ody and '03 Pilot were a great value, even at that price. But, personally, I don't think the Ford and Dodge are a good value at invoice. That's a $35K opinion to me...probably less than $0.02 for anybody else!! ;-)
I bet in 5-6 years this model will be selling at invoice when the its replacement hybrid 4WD 600hp model arrives. ;-)
It's a matter of timing. Another advantage is the old model is sorted out, no v1.0 glitches.
BUT...of course everyone wants the latest and greatest, you just have to pay for it.
Note - the Highlander hybrid will come in 2 flavors, FWD will be like the Prius, basically.
AWD is very interesting, it has one electric motor for each axle but it's still based on the FWD model, so no driveshaft to the rear! The rear wheels will get electric propulsion only.
This contrasts with the gas AWD model with sends power to both axles from the engine, and has a viscous coupling in the middle to manage the power split.
So the funny thing is the hybrid Highlander and RX400H will actually be based on the existing FWD models, not the AWD ones.
-juice
Also, not everything goes on sale, things like Bose systems etc. don’t. (okay, okay, you can get them on sale too if you wait long enough or shop on ebay or something) It is said that there are people (usually men) who buys what they need and then there are people (usually women) who buys what's on sale.
Hope I didn't start the world war III now.
So, MSRP, above MSRP, below MSRP, above invoice, below invoie or free, just enjoy your choice.
Now I hope to see some concrete information on 2005 Odyssey (as well as pilot)
Cheers,
onlysurfer
Regardless, it's clear that the '05 Ody has the potential to sell at MSRP and be the best value you can get for your dollar or maybe even a "bargain" in my book as I'm not looking for the cheapest but rather quality, safety and value over the long term. So, even though I'm not crazy about the Sienna if they can beat the Ody's price, apples for apples, by a big enough margin, it will be declared the winner. Keep your fingers crossed for the Ody........
I still think that Sienna's interior will beat the new Ody 100 times. I still hate the interior of the new Odyssey, with that fat climate control system which blocks the lower audio controls completely. And the models w/o NAV the audio controls on top does not fit well together... I'm still not judging until I will sit in one and try it out myself.
I was hoping that only the touring would have it.
I wish Honda would just put the features list up on the web site and get this over with. They finally admitted that it's coming, and dealers can't have too big of a supply of '04s left by now.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Does ACE mostly make Ody safer for smaller vehicle occupants, or does it also create greater Ody passenger safety?
If you say that ACE makes Ody safer for its own occupants, is there any proof of this?
If ACE makes van safer for smaller vehicle occupants, will having it make the vehicle liability insurance cost less?
I am disappointed that you didn't mention anything about noise. It makes me think that the '05 Ody is as noisy as the '04. I'll be very sad if it is because that was the main thing keeping me thinking about Sienna.
Will key fob open moonroof?
Can a second row passenger in the RES/NAV Touring listen to the radio with headphones?
Can a front row passenger listen to CD or cassette (does it have cassete?) while second row passenger watches DVD or listens to the radio?
Thanks very much!
Normally I hate it when car manufacturers offer a ton of options, because you rarely can find a vehicle that has exactly what you want. But in this case, Honda would have done well to offer a few stand alone options available across the model range (except where standard, such as a power liftgate on the Touring).
Jeff at TOV just said that the EX and EX-L having the power liftgate is "inaccurate". I, for one, am interested in this feature. I am trying to see if he will confirm that it is available as an option.
**hee**hee
That's a good name, man.
Yeah, I guess when the demands are high, it makes no difference when you buy them.
If you want a good deal, you will just have to wait until the smoke clears because this baby will be red hot and will be smoking.
But to me, more features=more fun too.
Life is short, live it up, don't hold back, and enjoy while you can.
Peace:-)
Does point out the problem with Honda's all or nothing packaging, although there are starting to be some additional permutations. It would be nice for some of hte more polorizing big-ticket items (power doors/liftgate, moonroof) if they were somehow optional on each model, say a power package and roof package.
The way they are now, almost everyone is either going to pay extra and get some features they don't want (say by getting the touring for the power liftgate), or skip a feature they do want (by getting an EX-L and missing something on the touring).
Most of hte gadgety stuff shouldn't be a deal breaker (although auto climate might be to some), but the power options and moonroof seem to be hot buttons for some folks (and of course a chrome grill and wood trim).
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Any advice, opinions are appreciated!
Although some people don't like woodtrim, they may prefer the nickel-satin finish.
Lincoln Navigator offers REAL woodtrim PLUS Nickel-Satin finish Plus Wood+Leather steering wheel and A LOT OF CHROME on the grille, side body, and rear. For 2005, they even added A LOT of chrome to the new 6-Speed auto trany SHIFTER.
Too bad I can't get that kind of treatment in the new Ody. But, I guess they had to keep prices down.
Ten Things I am loving about the '05 Ody Touring:
1) more Chrome (grille, sides, hopefully rear)
2) more Leather (steering wheel)
3) more Power "toys" and Buttons (liftgate, Trizone, etc.)
4) more NAV (600+ voice commands, bigger screen, more functions like restaurant guide, etc.)
5) more RES (bigger screen)
6) more Stereo (360W, Subwoofer, 6-CD, XM Radio).
7) more safety (side curtain airbags, rearview camera, back+front sensors, Run-Flat, tire pressure sensors, VSC, etc.)
8) more Storage (Lazy Susan)
9) more Lights (fog lamps)
10) more room (rumored to be bigger than current Ody
I guess we will know soon....
It will help me make my decision between a Touring NAV/RES and a EX-L NAV/RES. I wonder what the price difference will be bewteen these models.
Actually, these are trim pieces that you can always add to any model. Interior trim kits are common, although who knows how they might look in this van, and you could always swap the grille if it meant that much to you.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
You would think they could offer an 8th seat in the Touring too, but noooooooooooooooooo. They just had to make one little mistake just to be imperfect. I guess being perfect would put too much stress on them or something.
But oh, well, Touring sounds a lot more fun.
Have you seen the new grille, real wood, satin-nickel trim, and interior chrome on the '05 Navigator? I believe they have put Lexus to shame in my poor mind's eye.
And I thought Lexus was the best of the best and domestic makes were just terrible. And to think that Ford makes the Lincoln Navigator! Oh, it's just unbearable. I have to confess to my family that I've sided with Ford!
A salesman in CA has told a person on Odyclub that the 8th seat will be an option on the Touring. It will come standard with a center console. There may still be a chance...
Most folks coming to a dealership prefer to work with a sales professional who is courteous, has excellent product knowledge, and follows the true golden rule.
Most customers raise the concern about how much the dealer makes--but what of your salesperson. I will not speak for all, but the dealership I work for(and a lot of others for that matter)pay the salesperson commission only. If you work a week and sell one car- you only get paid for that one car. (yes, there are bonuses and spiffs available and that varied per dealership). I guess what I am trying to say is, if you have a salesman you enjoyed and he spent a lot of time with you---give him the last chance to work out the deal with you. If he makes $100 or $700 commission, he at least is compensated for the time he spent with you.
As a salesperson, I try to treat my customers with the utmost respect and courtesy, but find it utterly frustrating when you spend valuable time in providing a good presentation and then lose the deal for a couple of hundred dollars. We are just trying to make an honest living for our families as well.
PS. Thank you Edmunds. I refer my customers to your site all the time. I also thank all the people who post here. It is true that Honda is quite secretive about new models and withhold information to the dealer and sales personnel until the last minute. I learn a lot from you folks. Thanks for letting me vent a little.
Yeah, I remember that post on the OdyClub.
I think he said TWO dealers have confirmed that the 8th seat will be an option on the Touring. So the person pre-ordered a Touring w/NAV+RES+8th Seat. But then some people have stated as a FACT that it would not. But I just don't see how it is a fact when the actual product is not officially released yet.
Like you said, there may be a chance.
I think if I were a sales person, $1,000 would be understandable. Now I still would want the sale, but I would understand.
The Sienna has 3 seats in the middle and while they are smaller than the captains chairs, an adult can fit in them comfortably.
The Sienna 8psngr seats are just wide enough to accomodate Britax convertible seats side by side - I have just that setup.
Also, it's time you stop wasting countless hours of customer's time. There is no need to spend "lot of time" with a customer. Average customer (not the dumb type, but the average) can do research online, figure out what is what by looking at a vehicle in the showroom and drive alone without help from a salesperson.
That way, there will be less overhead in selling a vehicle and a better deal for the customer. Car buying should not be a big deal and again, please stop wasting our time by going back-and-forth to your managers and buddies to discuss the price (or Red Sox games and whatchyouwaannadoontheweekend...or whatever)