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Jeep Liberty Diesel

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Comments

  • faroutfarout Posts: 1,609
    nescosmo: I have read a total of three posts you made and I think you perhaps need to rethink how we should respond to your demeaning remarks. This is an open forum, and as long as I do not attack you person or be little you, I would HOPE you would extend the same courtesy to me and others who don't see things exactally as you do.
    Now, as for the Sprinter, a MB diesel is in a class that is all together different. We need to compare oranges to oranges, these engine are not the same.
    NOW PLEASE, GIVE US OUR FREEDOM OF THE POST

    Farout
  • tidestertidester Posts: 10,059
    NOW PLEASE, GIVE US OUR FREEDOM OF THE POST

    You have it! :)

    Now let's all move on.

    tidester, host
  • faroutfarout Posts: 1,609
    winter2: Betrayed is a bit stronger than I will put it. But, DCX sprung a surprise about not making any more CRD's even on the dealers. They sent tec's to learn about the CRD and, only to have the time spent to be short lived. But you can be assured DCX knew before this engine came into the US that it would only be two years. However, V M Motori does have a CRD that does meet the 2007 emissions test. DCX made the "test market" to see if they did nothing but make the CRD and send them to the dealers, how the CRD would do. No money spent for TV or news papers, only word of month. Now 11,000 CRD's just by chance is not to bad! But I resent not being told the WHOLE TRUTH! If your gang busters over your CRD thats wonderful. I wish I has the assurance that the EGR, and transmission, and a lot of other stuff was going to last. DCX knows now that there are problems, and STAR is very limited in helping the TEC's now, just imagine how it' going to be in 4 years when parts WILL be an issue, at least to how long we have to wait for a part. I have had our CRD since Sept 05, and I like it but getting work done on technical things is as slow as Missouri mule.

    Farout
  • faroutfarout Posts: 1,609
    tideseter: Thanks I needed that! Now I feel much better!

    Farout
  • goodcrdgoodcrd Posts: 253
    You bought something different. An engine is an engine. Gas, diesel or whatever it is a machine. The biggest problem you are having with your CRDs is the dealers don't like doing warranty work!! It pays only what the warranty work says it pays. If Jeep says it will pay .5 hours to replace defective glow plugs that is all Jeep will pay the dealer!!!!!!!! The techs are not willing to spend the time to learn. They want to make money fast and often. So if they don't know how long it will take them before they start the job they resist and avoid it. They don't want to think. Thinking takes them too much time and it doesn't pay as well as changing parts and charging you whatever the labor manuals state for a job. The old 4100 engines in the Caddies had bad cams. After the same bull that you CRD owners are going through the techs learned to change the cams in 1/4 the time the book listed then they'd knock each other out to get the job. Dodge 2.0 engines had head gasket problems. They would charge you $800 to $1200 to replace a $60 gasket and if they were good, could do the whole job in 2 hours and keep all that extra fast money for themselves. Stop crying!! You have a good vehicle. I have over twenty years experience with diesels. This is a very good diesel. Yea it has some querks that your not used to. Variable nozzle turbos are common. Egr valves are common. (Pain in the butt if not using ULSD) Soot filter part of the cat converter in mass transit are common (Pain in the butt if not using ULSD) Ask these techs the difference between a 2 and 4 stroke diesel. Many of them will give you the wrong answer. All they know is 4 stroke gas engine and maybe how the gas versions egr valves work. And just because the ECM or whatever they call the computer/processor controlling the engine or trans gives them a code. It only indicates where they should look for a problem. Just getting a code for an egr valve doesn't mean the egr valve is bad. But it pays better to change it then clean it. Takes the tech less time because he doesn't have to think. I've read about the oil getting into the intake from the CCV. Take the CCV out clean with a good detergent and put it back in. It is just like a PCV used in a gas engine. It is supposed to vent the crankcase gases into the intake. (Emission). So the oil may be too thin and oil vapor pressure higher. I won't use the 0w40. But the 15w40 is too heavy which "will" damage your oil pump. Using 15w40 about 60K to 80K miles later you will be having low oil pressure problems and when you drop the pan you will have oil pump bearings laying in your oil pan. Got about $1200 to spare?
    Relax. When USLD is mandated and used, most of your emission related problems will go away. This is the main reason small diesels are not sold here. You are experiencing first hand why other manufactures won't offer a diesel powered product in the US market. The Crappy fuel clogges everything up. This is the only thing which I will give Clinton credit for. The mandating of USLD. It was not mandated for the tree huggers. The soot produced by our crappy fuel causes engine component failure and increased operating costs.
    Sorry for venting!!!!!!
  • nescosmonescosmo Posts: 453
    Goodcrd... Thank you for telling them how it is Vm engine is the best I have a German friend that visit me all the time and he has the 2.5 with 700000 miles and keep counting.
  • tidestertidester Posts: 10,059
    with 700000 miles

    That's GOT to be a record or close to one!

    tidester, host
  • caribou1caribou1 Posts: 1,354
    Hi farout,
    Why is it that only the 545 RFE is announced and described everywhere and people don't look at their stickers? Now I understand better why soda-pops are sold in a different area than dish washing solutions.
    My first oil change was at 3000 miles, then I skipped the 6000 and changed it at 12,000. My 3rd change was at 24,000, 4th at 42,000. In the future it will be entering winter for many years I hope...
    http://www.shell-lubricants.com/products/product_details.php?code=50044 for diesels is what I have in the engine now.
    I never had to add any oil between changes, and my dipstick is closer to the engine head than yours is. This could explain the uncertainty of the Max-Min marks some posters refer to: we have the same stick but your guiding tube is longer.
    Our diesel fuel varies between 1.10 and 1.25 Euro per liter making a pretty sum of 5.5 to 6.25 USD per gallon.
    I have a question for you: could you look at one of your ball joints and tell me if you have the heat spreading fin installed?
  • nescosmonescosmo Posts: 453
    Tidester..Yes that much mileage; Maintenance that all it take; He travel all over, that is his job.
  • C ustomer.......R esearch........D evelopment CRD
  • steverstever Posts: 52,462
    I was going to guess it was 700k kilometers. :shades: Even that would be an impressive number!

    Steve, Host
  • winter2winter2 Posts: 1,801
    Caribou,

    To answer the ball joint question, yes there is a heat shield/fin in place on my CRD. Some time ago you posted a picture and I have the same shield/fin in place.
  • winter2winter2 Posts: 1,801
    Goodcrd,

    Why is the Amsoil synthetic 15W-40 too heavy? It specs out closely to the Mobil 1 products.

    The oil pump in the CRD engine is a vane type pump. In a few diagrams I have seen of them, there are no bearings that I can see. Could you please enlighten me and others?
  • winter2winter2 Posts: 1,801
    No, CRD means Common Rail Diesel
  • goodcrdgoodcrd Posts: 253
    A bearing is any surface the bears a load. It is like mechanics calling a bearing a race which is incorrect. It is a bearing just a different type. Vane type pumps when they fail will still give you pieces of metal in the pan. It is bearing material. As for the bigger diesel engines, if you don't get 500,000 miles before the first rebuild your doing something wrong. I've seen equipment with over 1 million plus miles still running with the original diesel engines. Granted that they have been rebuilt once or twice. People here don't keep their cars that long. After say 5 years they get a new one because it is easier and less stress for the unknowledgeable. Cars today depending on the quality of the chassis will last a good 15 to 20 years. Winter2 email VM and ask them what they recommend. You could also find out what the manufacturer of the oil pump recommends. It will save you money in the long run.
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    Hey, new to the forum here, Have a 2005 with 12,000 miles, and reside in Missouri.

    This is my first question. Has anyone used a Fabric guard sucessfully (non-staining on light color seats) on the Liberty? I have light gray interior, and I'm afraid to sneeze in the vehicle!! :surprise:

    I'm also trying to find a suitable set of floor mats, that will do a better job covering the wear areas. My trucks all have vinyl, and I just hate carpet on the floors, even though I know it helps with sound deading. Thanks

    Tailgate
  • vtdogvtdog Posts: 163
    I also have an '05 with fabric seats. I bought neoprene (think wet suit) covers for the front seats. The neoprene is thermally neutral (not hot in summer, etc) and is easy to wash if you want. I had to look around to find a set with map pockets behind the seats. I think I got them at seatcovers.com, but am not sure.

    For mats, I bought weathertec. I get them via mail order. They are full rubber and hold alot of liquid, which can be important here in winter. They last a long time and I have used them on many vehicles.
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    I will look for the seatcovers.com site. I would need to find a grayish or black & gray type cover. How well were they able to size up your Liberty seats? Just wondering if they have, or use a chart for proper size selection, or if it will be pretty much a one size fits all.

    I stopped at Auto zone and found a reasonable set of mats for the front.
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    There is 12k miles on mine (bought it used) and notice the overflow tank was kinda dark, opened the top, and the fluid looks more of an orange color, rather than Pink. I'm not sure about this darker color, but the fluid did not appear to have an diesel mixed in it. Can anyone verify their reservoir tanks have this brownish color to it (looking from the outside) at the normal liquid levels. Thanks in advance
  • I thought CRD stood for Converter Ruins Drivetrain! :sick:

    Or Constant Rebuilding Disenchants ?

    Ok, this is too easy.... goodnight all. :D
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    Good night...SLeep tight...

    If you have trouble fallin asleep...count your gas pumps ;)
  • dmkkengdmkkeng Posts: 11
    Did you do anything to equip your Liberty for towing - electric brakes or transmission cooler? Are you using an equalizer hitch. Whats the loaded wieght of your 18' trailer? Does the Liberty do a good job of pulling this trailer? Any problems with hills or wind?
  • zoomy2zoomy2 Posts: 50
    My CRD has the factory tow package. Added was an electric brake controller. The trailer has a 250 tounge weight so I am using a dead weight insert with a friction sway control (Reese). The GVW of the trailer is 4800. I didn't weight it yet, as we haven't decided what we are going to keep in it as we have only had it 3 weeks.

    [IMG]http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL1211/5578087/11123017/160659791.jpg[/IMG]

    I'm not the fastest on the road but we get there! It pulls in OD very well at 60mpg there is a very little sway but I think its the tires (Goodyear ST). We have had it Southeast Ohio and it didn't have any problems, other that dropping down a gear and going slower, 50mph on the hills. I don't push it either as I try to keep the RPM under 2600. Didn't notice any wind loads like I did when I pulled a 8600lb 5th wheel.
  • siberiasiberia Posts: 520
    Actually, the vane oil pump is an interesting topic, Goodcrd and Winter2. Vane pumps have an advantage over gear or lobe pumps by maintaining full pressure and volume while pumping thin and hot fluids such as 0W40 or 5W40 oils. The vanes are spring loaded and maintain contact with the pump housing over a very long period of time as the vanes wear. Since the pump is pumping oil in the CRD (as opposed to some chemical) it wears very slowly.

    Gear oil pumps, on the other hand, have a built in clearance and generally do not wear much at all. But, as the oils get hot and thin, the oil pressure drops – sometimes dramatically because oil slips by the pump and more easily through oil clearances in the engine. Hot oil still slips past engine clearances more with a vane pump but it does not slip additionally past the pump itself.

    Power steering pumps are an example of vane pumps that we take for granted because they almost never fail and when they do it is usually the oil seal on the shaft. On very rare occasions the vanes develop a whine but the pump still works until you cannot stand the noise and change it out (shedding material into the power steering oil no doubt).

    Additionally, vane pumps are better at self priming and flow fluids very quickly compared to a gear pump. Under certain conditions where there is difficulty drawing the fluid and a vacuum is produced cavitations can occur causing erosion of metal. Can this condition occur in the CRD when drawing thicker 15W40 oil? I doubt it, but I don’t know for sure.

    I have always heard that diesels do not tolerate low oil pressure and I was concerned about the thin oil. Apparently, thin oil is not a problem with a vane pump. Does anyone with a shop manual know what the oil pressure is in the 2.8 engine?
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    I have been searching for either "Turbo" or "Turbo Diesel" chrome Body tags. Anyone know where to get them? :blush:
  • winter2winter2 Posts: 1,801
    Siberia,

    Thanks for your input. Learned something new today from your post and that is appreciated.

    Your concern about 15W-40 oil, especially Amsoil Synthetic, does not bother me. I researched Mobil 1, Shell, Chevron, Red Line, Royal Purple, etc. and found that some of the 15W-40 synthetics have properties very similar to the 5W-40 oils. Amsoil and Red Line values fall right in between those for Mobil 1 0W-40 and their 5W-40 synthetics.

    I have written to V.M. Motori about Amsoil's 15W-40 Synthetic oil. As soon as I hear from them, I will share the information with everyone on this forum.
  • winter2winter2 Posts: 1,801
    Almost funny! ;)
  • zachinmizachinmi Posts: 228
    Have you thought about putting on a Cummins badge and making people wonder? It's not accurate of course. Or a Detroit Diesel badge, which is almost accurate (VM Motori is a subsidiary of theirs).

    Or you could add what I saw on the cowl of a very tough-looking Class 8 semi in Nebraska: a circular badge that says "Kitten Power" complete with a leaping fuzzy kitten. I'm guessing it had a CAT engine, who knows?
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    Well...I at least wanted it to be accurate, that is enough to make most people do a double take. ;) I might have to go to a body shop and ask to get one ordered from their supply catalogs. Their was one poster on this fourm, who showed his "turbo diesel" tag, but didnt mention where he got it.

    I have a cummins in my 1 ton, but I dont want to rob it! :P
  • siberiasiberia Posts: 520
    Consumer Reports Dissed
  • anomiousanomious Posts: 170
    Hi! "Bimmian.com" has 3/4 inch chrome letters with 3M sticky backings. I bought "D I E S E L" Looks good!

    Check em out! LK :)

    go to: "Exterior appointments" and then
    "similar products"
  • Mercedes diesel powered cars come with a "Turbo Diesel" chrome letter plate for the rear. Check ebay for used or even a junk yard. Even used will clean up like new again.

    You could even put the Mercedes flying star emblem on your jeep while your at it, right? :D
  • zachinmizachinmi Posts: 228
    Wow, I think you're at least the third CRD owner who also has a Dodge Ram/Cummins pickup (along with me and one other poster who I can't remember offhand).

    I like diesels.
  • You guys mind if I ask what kind of mileage you are seeing with the Cummins? I'm seriously thinking about trading in the CRD for one before the 07 emissions hit the trucks.

    Thanks
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    Thanks for the tip. I did find a nice set on Ebay which said

    "Turbo
    Diesel"

    Red or Silver color choices. I typed in "turbo diesel badges" for the search
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    My One ton is a 98 with the older 12 valve design. I do like it, and its not bad on fuel.
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    :mad:

    I saw this tonight while looking for sources of popping and rattling too.

    Does everyone have a 1/8 hole, drilled close to the bottom seam, facing towards the catalict converter?

    Thought maybe either the dealer done it to over come a problem, or its there from the factory as a drain. The dealer passed it in an inspection, I need to know if its legal, otherwise I will have to put a new muffler on next inspection.
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    This is what I found....

    On top the guard plate, that is just below the front differetial is another plastic plate, wider than the metal guard plate itself. It hangs over, covering the both ends of the axle diffential (it has the sound damping material on top of it). It isnt secured tightly, but it is captive by the guard plate, and you and move it around. I think it vibrates during the right conditions, ruining what would be a otherwise "magic carpet ride". The vibration feeling I feel reminds me what you would feel when a wheel bearing is going out, but this vibration is intermittant. I also found some rocks ontop the plastic damper pan too. Anyone have andy comments?
  • gadget1gadget1 Posts: 1
    US Customer Service - ASKDRZ Brand Site
    Brief Description:
    I have a Jeep Liberty CRD. I thought DC was devoted to diesel
    technology but now I hear that this model will no longer be available
    with this engine. DC had to know that the new SO2 rules were coming. Why
    deceive people and bring out this model with this engine for only two
    years? I am concerned that a model with only 10,000 versions made will
    not have good maintenance support by dealers and the spare parts costs
    will skyrocket. How will Liberty CRD owners be protected?

    Thanks for contacting Dr.Z. Your message has been forwarded to us for
    response.

    6/13/2006 - A new 3.0-liter turbo Common Rail Diesel (CRD) will debut in
    the 2007.5 Jeep® Grand Cherokee.

    With more torque than most eight-cylinder engines, equal acceleration
    and the fuel economy of a small six-cylinder gasoline engine, the
    Mercedes built 3.0-liter CRD is one of the most advanced powerplants
    available in the marketplace today. It is designed to be an efficient,
    smooth-running engine that gives customers up to 30 percent improved
    fuel economy without sacrificing performance.

    For more information see our brand websites which provide a wealth of
    information, including vehicle information, specifications, towing
    capabilities, comparisons, pricing, incentives, Dealer Locators,
    brochures and more.

    Visit them at:

    http://www.chrysler.com
    http://www.jeep.com
    http://www.dodge.com

    If you would rather speak to someone on the phone, the numbers are as
    follows:

    1-800-CHRYSLER (247-9753)
    1-800-4ADODGE (423-6343)
    1-800-925-JEEP (925-5337)
  • julie10julie10 Posts: 6
    Hi there. I posted a message back on July 1 but no one has given me a reply. :( I was wondering if anyone had a good solution to getting rain spots and condensation from drinks and so forth off of the seats. I bought some Turtle Wax Upholstry cleaner and used in "an inconspicuous area" and it seemed to leave a spot.

    Any suggestions?

    Oh...after having the CRD for 10 1/2 months I finally got 27 mpg on a trip. Yeah!

    Thanks.
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    I Saw your post, and I wondered if Scotch Guard itself would also stain the fabric.

    Maybe someone who knows will chime in here
  • steverstever Posts: 52,462
    I think Scotchgard is supposed to help prevent stains - don't know if it would help after the fact. Try looking around the Cleaning Leather/Cloth Interiors discussion too. It's heavy on leather questions but if you do a discussion search on cloth maybe some suggestions will pop up.

    Steve, Host
  • The parts availablitiy might not be as bad as you think. DC is not going to stop making the Liberty CRD, they are just going to stop selling it in the US. They will continue to make it here and export it to Europe. Also, this VM Motori diesel is used in several other vehicle brands that are sold in Europe.
  • siberiasiberia Posts: 520
    I'm seriously thinking about trading in the CRD for one before the 07 emissions hit the trucks.

    Hi Modelaford,

    Implicit in your statement is that you prefer or value a vehicle that complies with 2006 emission standards rather than 2007 emission standards and I agree. Unless you need to tow a house .......
  • alljeepalljeep Posts: 35
    Hi there. I posted a message back on July 1 but no one has given me a reply. I was wondering if anyone had a good solution to getting rain spots and condensation from drinks and so forth off of the seats. I bought some Turtle Wax Upholstry cleaner and used in "an inconspicuous area" and it seemed to leave a spot.

    I use "Resolve Triple Action Carpet Cleaner" in the hand-pump spray bottle. Found at many local grocery stores. Works perfect on my light khaki interior.

    Just spray it on and scrub it immediately and real hard with a clean white cloth. It will appear to leave a mark, but it just needs to dry. Once dry - it's all good. ;)
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    Steve,
    Thanks for the chime in. What I was wondering, since the cloth fabric seems to stain simply with only water, I was wondering perhaps just the application of a Stain prohibitor would also stain the seats. One has to apply to enough to the seats that they are then wet.

    However, if its a even application, then any "spots" wouldnt be appearant, and maybe it would simply cause the complete seat to darking evenly, which I would certainly perfer anyway.

    Tailgate
  • zachinmizachinmi Posts: 228
    Our truck is a 2006 Dodge Ram 2500 4x4 quad cab short bed with the Cummins and 4spd automatic. We typically get 12-15mpg in around town driving (all slow speeds as I live near the center of town) and around 18mpg freeway, with a best tank of 19.5mpg. Currently has 11000 miles so it may still be in the break-in period.

    The Ram and CRD are in completely different categories. I love the Ram, but it's awfully big for a daily driver. Whenever I drive it I love it for the first 10-15 minutes and then gradually feel more neutral. Then I get in the CRD and am amazed at how quiet it is and how smooth it rides.

    The Cummins will be available in the 2007 Ram but will be revised and probably cost more. If it's the same as the Cummins in the Chassis Cab version for 2007, it will offer reduced hp (305 instead of 325), same torque, and significantly greater displacement. Not sure if these changes will increase or decrease its mpg.

    My ideal personal vehicle would be roughly Durango sized with a diesel I-6 in the 200-250hp range. The Jeep is a little small and the Ram is very big. I'm intrigued by the upcoming Grand Cherokee diesel except that the GC seems hardly any bigger than the Liberty.
  • Zachinimi,

    Thanks. That is exactly what I was looking for. I had a 1500 RAM with the Hemi that I traded in for the CRD - again, looking for a smarter commuter, which the CRD surely is. But I do sorely miss the comfort of that truck. Personally, I'd love to see a smaller engine (like maybe that MB 3.0L V6) in the 1500. The ride of the 1500 with a more efficient engine would be great. That Hemi never got anything better then 12.5. I've driven the 2500 QC 4x4, and the difference in height between it and my 4x2 1500 makes the thing feel three times the size. Well, I guess I'll just sit tight and wait to see what DCX has in store for us in the smaller trucks.

    Thanks again,
    Paul
  • tailgatetailgate Posts: 32
    I think its ok to post an link, here is a company that sells the Turbo badges: detailhaus.com
  • steverstever Posts: 52,462
    You may be able to find a fabric scrap hanging down under the seat you could try a test patch on. Or you could email the manufacturer(s). They may have some good advice - maybe they'll even mail you a coupon or free sample. :shades:

    An upholstery shop could help too; they might be able to dye the seats if you want to go that far. The Resolve suggestion would be a lot cheaper to test on your fabric though.

    Steve, Host
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