Ford Fusion/Mercury Milan

akirby

What "gear hunting" are you talking about? I've not experience any at all and neither have any of the reviewers. In fact they've all praised it as one of the high points.

johnclineii

Many reviewers have commented how sixth is too high and it wanders back and forth between fifth and sixth...and that you can't manually downshift a gear but only into L. I experienced this myself during my test drives...

I will wait for the GM/Ford joint venture transmission before I buy any six speed from Aisin (who happens to be a Toyota affiliate, by the way).

The Five Hundred uses the same six speed, and has had the same owner comments...

akirby

If it wanders between 5th and 6th then it's so smooth that I've never noticed it. I understand the lack of gear selection but so far it hasn't been an issue for me.

poodog13

You are officially a woman.

It is also against the law to "cruise" in the left lane in many states. So when these laws come into conflict, I say it's pretty clear that the person doing 50 in a 65 should move over or face the wrath of whomever is behind them and actually trying to get somewhere.

pat

we just skip telling others how to drive and stick to talking about what we are driving.

johnclineii

not to mention skipping the sexist remarks...how people drive has NOTHING to do with their gender...that being said Mercury is targeting the Milan towards females and is somewhat surprised at how many males are buying the car!

mtnman1

It's no surprise to me that Males are buying the Milan. I just came back from my local Lincoln Mercury Dealer. I was waiting for my Mountaineer's routine maintenance. Looked at and sat in a Milan Premier. What a gorgeous vehicle. It was loaded and still had a sticker of about $25,000. I was planning on replacing my 2003 Sonata in about 2 years with another Sonata, a Honda Accord, or the new Impala. After seeing the Milan I have to add another to the list. Can't wait to test drive it sometime. I also looked at the Lincoln Zephyr which is the price range I will be looking at to replace the Mountaineer in about 3 years. It is another fine looking car. It will be on my list along with the Toyota Avalon Limited and even Hyundai's new Azera. I love the cars Ford/Lincoln Mercury are starting to produce. Now if they can only get the narrow minded Honda and Toyota buyers to broaden their horizons. American made cars have been gaining on the Asian cars with leaps and bounds as far as quality. Now with the latest cars I think they are much more exciting than the dull Camry and Accord.

johnclineii

Be aware that the Fusion/Milan/Zephyr ARE made in Mexico...and many of the transplants are made here, such as the Accord, Camry and Civic....

Also, the Zephyr is floaty--unlike the great handling in the Fusion/Milan, at least to my tastes.

mtnman1

I understand your point that they are built out of country, but the design and engineering came from America. The real dollars end up back in the States except for the wages they are paying the people on the line. Just as Honda may make the vehicles here, but the real money makes it back to Japan. I have nothing against Asian made vehicles. I will consider them anytime I'm buying. The thing I notice is that Honda and Toyota buyers are very closed minded and would never consider a "Big Three" vehicle. They won't even test drive them and kind of have a snobby attitude like they are beneath them. I think this is where Ford, GM, and Chrysler have their work cut out for them. That is "enlightening" these car buyers. Broadening their horizons. Some will never be reached.

theman123

The thing I notice is that Honda and Toyota buyers are very closed minded and would never consider a "Big Three" vehicle. They won't even test drive them and kind of have a snobby attitude like they are beneath them.

Somebody sees the light !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Man I thought I was the only one who thought that.

akirby

I've owned one Acura and 3 Hondas back in the late 80s and early 90s. Back then the snobbery was well earned because of the crap that Detroit was putting out. That has now changed drastically, at least at Ford. But it will take many years of sustained quality and improvement for some people to consider switching.

The interesting thing in all this is that the Korean makes are now doing to the Japanese what the Japanese did to Detroit back in the 80's. What goes around comes around.

theman123

That has now changed drastically, at least at Ford. But it will take many years of sustained quality and improvement for some people to consider switching.

Yeah the key word being SOME people. just like the person said. Most of them would never in a million years even think of buying a Domestic. The reason being just like your story. Back in 1996 their grandmother rented a Taurus and she said it was terrible, so they would never consider buying a Ford. To be blunt, it should never have been that way in the first place. Just like the person was saying. Domestics could blow Honda and Toyota out of the water for the next 100 years. Most Honda and Toyota fans would flat out ignore the progress, so it would all be a mute point. That's the problem

tmp888

"Be aware that the Fusion/Milan/Zephyr ARE made in Mexico...and many of the transplants are made here, such as the Accord, Camry and Civic.... ".

The Civic and Camry are being assembling in Canada also (you should get the facts right). To me what country the components were made before finally putting in the vehicles are more important (I look at the whole picture not just the final assembly point). Last year 2004, Toyota made US$10+ billions profits (half of that in US). Honda and Nissan were not far behind. This year, they are making about the same or more. I wish that kind of money stay here in US. If you don't have the same wish like mine, I guess you do not live in US.

johnclineii

You assume where "here" is. We have many readers from Canada (and other countries) on this board....for some the issue of where cars are assembled is important, for others it is not. I assume you are in the latter camp, but only when a so-called "American" company is the assembler. Be that as it may, to call the Fusion/Milan/Zephyr domestics while calling the Accord/Camry imports is being too picky by far...at least from where I sit.

The post to which I was replying called the Fusion/Milan/Zephyr American cars. Strictly speaking, they are not. Then again, strictly speaking, virtually nothing is. We live in a global economy, and that's the way it is, like it or not.

tmp888

"Back in 1996 their grandmother rented a Taurus and she said it was terrible, so they would never consider buying a Ford."

I hope that SOME people are not investing stock market that way (just based on the history and irrationalities). Look at VW and Huyndai in the early 80's and now. Their quality are going the opposite.

alpha01

The Camry IS NOT made in Canada. Camrys sold in the USA come from either Georgetown KY or Japan. HOWEVER, some Corollas are made in Canada.

Maybe you should get your facts right.

~alpha

savetheland

What difference it makes where car is made? Do you think where TV set is made when you buy it (in China mosty likely)?. Important thing is that it reflects your personality.

audia8q

I hope that SOME people are not investing stock market that way (just based on the history and irrationalities).

Your kidding right?? My broker has endless stories about folks picking stocks based exactly on individual perceptions and irrationalities. We see people buy cars the same way everyday.

mtnman1

John, My point in my original reply to your statement about Fusion/Milan/Zephyr was that so many people are very closed minded about considering a "Big Three" vehicle. I on the other hand understand fully how we live in a Global Economy. I'm currently shopping for an HDTV. I've narrowed my search to a Sony Rear Projection LCD and a Panasonic 50" Plasma. Because these TV's are made overseas I'm able to now afford a Plasma because of competition and cheap labor. I will look at every good brand of car in a particular class before I decide. Doesn't matter to me if it's Ford, GM, Honda, Toyota, Hyundai, etc. I have an open mind. Many car buyers have just decided that American based Car makers produce a crappy product. They have not seen the great value in today's American based brands. Not to mention that Consumer Reports just stated recently that there is only a minuscule difference any more in the quality in the "Big Three" versus Asian Brands. I just challenge all car buyers to take a closer look at all car makers. You might be pleasantly surprised. I know I was when I was looking for an SUV in 2004. Found you couldn't beat the value that Mercury offered in the Mountaineer. The service department at this dealership has been outstanding in addressing any issue I have had as well. Lincoln Mercury was rated recently as having the best service departments as far as customer satisfaction goes. Again I'm all for a Global Economy when it saves me money.

mschmal

Absolutely.

For about the tenth time me saying this. In today's Market, its all about PERSONAL PREFERENCE!

The OBJECTIVE differences in the cars in this class are SO SMALL that ultimately the consumer will be making a SUBJECTIVE CHOICE.

IMHO Fusion has a competitive edge over the Sonata because the Fusion is very different from the Camry and somewhat different than the Accord. The Sonata is just a Camry copy, which begs the question, why by the copy when you can buy the original?

I really hope that Ford continues to make DISTINCTIVE products that stand out and thus create greater choice and consumer excitement.

Distinctiveness is the Chrysler 300's biggest advantage and I think its the Fusion's as well.

Mark

skibry1

I'm a manual tranny lover and have been waiting for Ford
to put a left-leg flexor in something economical,sporty and
roomy. Choices...isn't America Grand!

growwise

Is there enough room for 3 adults in the back of fusion? Or is it just 2. I sat in the rear seat of a fusion in the showroom and it didnt look like the car had enough rear hiproom/shoulder room...

akirby

I think the new Tri-bar chrome grill is essential to set the Fusion apart from the competition. Otherwise it just gets lost in the crowd. I think Ford has really got their stuff together now in the design department and it should only improve with Horbury at the helm. The new Lincoln vehicles are stunning as you'll see at the Detroit auto show in a couple of weeks.

mschmal

Its tight,

Obviously not for long trips.

Mark

fjolset

Oh, I don't know. I'd rather that people in my town worked making cars instead of clerking at wal-mart. They earn more, can take better care of their families, and so on.

jeffyscott

I guess I don't have a problem with folks in Mexico also having the opportunity to get a good job. In any case, I imagine Ford has a few other good paying jobs in the US, besides assembly line workers.

day9

I like the grill, but thought the tail is not a good match with it.

allfiredup

Hondas used to be a blast to drive, even though they weren't the fastest or best handling in their class. My '85 and '91 CRXs were probably the most fun to drive cars I've ever owned. Even my '89 Accord LXi and '92 Accord EX were fun. They've overengineered their cars to the point where they're becoming numb (much like Toyota/Lexus).

As a result, after owning Honda/Acura products for all my 16 years of driving, I just bought my first Mazda. To me, the Mazda3 is much more driver oriented than the Honda Civic (Si excluded). Taking the leap was scary and actually I was quite apprehensive, despite the fact that I liked the car better.

This is where I actually get back on topic- I think a lot of people really like the looks of the Fusion and would love how it drives, if only they gave it a chance. Years of Honda/Toyota loyalty and snobbery are definitely an obstacle for great cars like the Fusion. Hopefully, more people will be able to explore cars outside of their familiar/comfort zone. I wonder if every Honda/Toyota loyalist sampled at least a few other makes before buying, how many of them would choose something else? From reading these and other forum posts, it does seem that more and more people are "jumping ship", but it's going to take a long time before significant results will be seen.

Since Olds isn't around anymore, perhaps Ford should steal their catchphrase- "This isn't your father's Ford"!

johnclineii

Given how wonderfully that phrase worked at Oldsmobile, perhaps they'd best not. Generational differences may well work in Ford's favor soon. After all, many twenty somethings these days have fathers who drove Hondas and Toyotas! Or they grew up in SUV's. I often think that just as we boomers rejected the station wagons we grew up in, this generation is rejecting the SUVs and minivans they grew up in.

They might well give Fusion a chance because Father did NOT own a Ford...

scape2

Ford will move some production of the Fusion/Milan or Zeph to the U.S. I have read the Hermisillo plant can only produce 300,000 of these vehicles a year. My bet is Ford is using the lower cost labor in Mexico to see if the American market will accept the trio to begin with. Sales of these vehicles so far look promising to Ford.
Saw my first Milan the other day. Styling is very eye catching. From behind I thought at first it was some new BMW or Acura until I read the badge..

rscherb

Ford is simply doing a great job now with the Fusion. Yes, sales are encouraging. More than 54,000 sold and some dealers are experiencing real buzz about the car, and even waiting lists.
Some of Ford's new models look even better. I saw some of the new lincoln cars and the new Edge. They look good.

The Sonata looks like such an obvious Camry copy it's laughable. BMW has the most comprehensivly ugly styling of any major manufacturer, but it doesn't matter. Because they have a backlog of moronic customers who will buy anything they make.

allfiredup

Why would they move it to the U.S. unless they do exceed capacity? Although I don't think they'll be topping 300k units, but I could be wrong. Anyway, it would cost them more to build the cars here and that'd be shooting themselves in the foot price-wise. Not to mention they'd have to tool another factory and they're in the process of closing a bunch of plants. I think they'll leave production in Mexico where it is. Cheap labor is a great thing for automakers and autobuyers.

allfiredup

Where are you getting that 54,000 figure? It would be great if they've really sold that many, but thru the end of 11/05 they'd only sold 9,415 Fusions, 3,210 Milans and 2,856 Zephyrs. Perhaps 54k is the production figure thus far? Or have the actually sold 38,000 in December?

navigator89

While we're on the topic of sales figures, is there a website or database out there that shows sales figures as per make and model? If so could someone post a link.

Thanks.

akirby

Ford posts theirs at media.ford.com. Or just do a google search for Ford November sales (or Chrysler November sales, etc.) and you'll usually find the link.

mschmal

Mercury allows Ford to make a sedan that may be more appealing to a different demographic than the Milan. This way Ford doesn't have to sacrafice the balance/focus of the Fusion.

Modern Manufacturering really makes this easy to do. For instance, with the new Super Duty Ford was able to END payload loss creep as you added more options to the truck.

On the old truck, you had to subtract from the payload the weight of options like power locks, windows and seats. On the new truck, the right springs are automaticly selected to maintain the payload capacity of the truck.

Ford can make a sporty Fusion and a plush Milan on the same assembly line with little or no additional cost.

Mark.

mtnman1

Sonata looks like a Camry? I've never heard that one. It looks nothing like a Camry. It is a lot more like an Accord. Especially, the back end.

allfiredup

The best site I can find for sales figures from almost every company is www.theautochannel.com. Here's a link to the Ford November 2005 figures they posted-

http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2005/12/01/153569.html

navigator89

Actually designers for the Sonata said they used the Audi A6 as inspiration, and if you look real hard you can see it there.

The Azera looks like it has the same rear as the 03-05 Accord, not the Sonata. But in any case Honda has made the car look better by resdesigning the back.

Allfiredup thanks for the link. Wow it seems like almost every Ford/Lincoln/Mercury vehicle has posted a loss in sales compared to last year except the Freestyle, Five Hundred and Montego.

Funny, look at the sales figures and you see the Taurus outsold the Fusion by almost 3000 units!

poodog13

The Sonata is just a Camry copy, which begs the question, why by the copy when you can buy the original?

I don't know, could it be price???

navigator89

Lol, good one, also the Sonata offers more equipment at a lower price. Thats why it smoked the Accord and Camry in the Edmunds $22,000 comparison. It also gives the chance to be a bit unique and not blend in with the other guzillion Camry owners (like me).

theman123

Hey this is a little off the topic of the Fusion. It's a web cast featuring Mark Fields he is the new vice president of the Americas. he talks about some of his plans for Ford in the Future. A couple of things
1. you need Media player to watch the web cast
2. it's about 29 minutes long
What do you guys think ????

Mark Fields LA Autoshow

justgreat47

not in the sense that this one particular model will be sold worldwide but more of the fact that it's a mazda platform massaged by ford and if there is one continual comment i have read in the roadtests of the fusion is the ride/handling "sweetspot". ford decided to give the fusion a european ride...great handling without the harshness of the asian/german cars. for years, well before the onslaught of the japanese brands, renaults, peuogots (sp?) and alfa romeos from italy were well known for having that perfect blend of a compliant ride but tenacious as hell in the corners...they stuck like glue but still had a nice ride.

sounds like ford hit the "sweetspot".

calidave

What do you think of the Fusion ad campaign? I don't even know what they are trying to say, that a car should not just use energy but make energy. It sounds to me like they are trying to confust the public into thinking that the Fusion is a hybrid. So all the stupid car buyers (some % of car buyers are not very bright) will come in to see the new Ford hybrid. Of course, it isn't a hybrid, but some of those people will now be in the door of the Ford dealership.

Thoughts?

I'm not slamming Ford or the ad campaign. Am just curious what folks think.

calidave

do you understand the engineering history explanation for that legendary French and Italian ride?

legend is that the Germans, because they have such nicely-maintained roads, didn't need any softness in the ride, whereas the French and Italians, because the roads are so crummy, had to engineer in some softness. German cars are great on German roads, but they hurt your bum when on American, French, etc. roads.

and the French cars are a bit too sloppy when on the German roads.

just a legend - maybe there is some truth to it

jaxs1

The ad is dumb, but I doubt many people will assume hybrid when they never say anything about hybrids.
However, one Fusion ad features an iPod even though you cannot cannot an iPod to a Fusion.
That will cause worse Fusion confusion.

calidave

I'd like to see that iPod ad. Tha tmight be false advertising in California. I've got a DA friend who might take that on. There's good money to be made when corporations lie to people in ads.

how do you not assume "hybrid" when the ad says a car should generate energy? What else can that mean?

I've seen other stupid ad campaigns. The SUV ad (Chevy) when the two kids are left standing in their driveway. There is a big piece of info left out of the logic of that ad - that there's no room in the vehicle, so they need a bigger SUV. But you nver see that there's no room in the vehicle that left the kids behind.

jaxs1

The iPod ad never actually shows the iPod inside the car and I think that ad has already been pulled.
By "energy," they are probably trying to say it gives you energy, by making you feel "energetic" when you drive it.

chrisford

The iPod ad never actually shows the iPod inside the car and I think that ad has already been pulled.

That ad is still showing. Just saw it last night. Don't know why Ford thinks these ads will sell the Fusion.

akirby

Since when do hybrids "create" energy??

You guys are reading way too much into a simple commercial.