By accessing this website, you acknowledge that Edmunds and its third party business partners may use cookies, pixels, and similar technologies to collect information about you and your interactions with the website as described in our
Privacy Statement, and you agree that your use of the website is subject to our
Visitor Agreement.
Comments
I agree that if you are on a tight budget and don't care about extra performance, the turbo or the H6 models are not right for you. The regular 2.5 engine is a Subaru workhorse, but I do feel it is a bit underpowered when mated to the 4-speed auto tranny pulling a Legacy chassis.
It's also in need of an update. The JDM/European versions get AVCS (variable valve timing) which helps to broaden it's usable torque range. If it's possible, the 5-speed manual will better let you tap into it's power.
Ken
From that statement, do you regret getting the auto instead of the Manual tranny?
Mark
Not one bit.
By nature of a torque converter, the 5EAT does cause some turbo lag, but not enough for it to be an issue for me. I just wanted to point out that it's almost non-existent with the 5MT.
For my needs, the 5EAT is great. It shifts smoothly and quickly and is still a hoot to drive. That's the nice thing about having a stout engine -- it easily masks the inherent lag/loss from a torque converter.
Ken
Outback is a lot nicer and more refined, but it costs more.
I still like the Forester, unbeatable value.
Subaru may not be offering traction control on the other models because it would have to be integrated with the AWD system. VDC does this by design, but the other AWD systems do not.
Competitors that have traction control, low budget ones anyway, usually only let the traction control act on one axle, the front axle, and disable it when AWD engages.
Mercedes and Audi have this sorted out, but only at higher price levels, where VDC is standard.
I don't think it's as simple as adding traction/stability control. It would fight with the AWD system.
-juice
Sly, I really don't think you can claim this is a valid statement untill and unless you have tried the new technology that is available, such as the Goodyear Assurance Triple Tred tire.
This last weekend, we had an ice storm here, which covered everything. I tried driving slowly up and down my (10 degree slope) driveway.....which I could not walk down sithout slipping. I came to a full stop, and started from rest several times, as well as slowly driving aroung my neighborhood, and never slipped a tire, never engaged ABS nor had any symptoms of slippery conditions UNLESS I was trying to spin or slide the tires. For "All Season" tires in full winter conditions, their grip is outstanding. There is, or was a 30 day full price return guarantee, so if you are not convenced, you can return them and try something else. They are NOT magic however;-)
We like the solid feel of the car, quiet ride, AWD, and the intuitive placement of controls. I would have liked the GT, but the wife wasn't too keen on the added cost or me having that much fun in our family car. She will probably drive it more so I let her have her way.
We were hoping for silver, but we wanted a manual on the Ltd wagon and this was the only car I could find in the entire SF bay area. We like the Atlantic Blue more than we though we would, but I'm worried it will show off the dirt and the inevitable scratches.
I'm very happy with the X-Ice. They are not as sticky on pure ice as the Blizzaks, but they are better in every other way. They are pretty quiet, provide decent dry hanlding, and excellent wet handling.
On my dirt road, which is now hard-packed snow with icy patches, I can drive as fast as I could on dirt.
Just this morning I pulled a brand new 4Runner V8 out of the snow bank. He had just done a 180. I didn;t even think it was slippery
I would buy again.
Sly
Given where I live, at the end of an icy dirt road with steep hills and tight curves, I will stick to my ice tires.
Sly
The 2.5i with a manual tranny should be more than adequate. Atlantic Blue is a very nice color too- I have the silver and sometimes wish I got one of the Blues. Oh well.
Enjoy your new ride. The GT is overkill anyway. I wanted a fast car without looking fast, but don't use more than 40% of the engine 90% of the time. (although that 10% is VERY entertaining!- still puts a smile on my face every time- and i've had mine for 7 months!)
tom
One point though. Someone mentioned a few days ago that the biggest factor in how well a car handles is the tire/surface interface. That's not true. It's the competence of the driver. If you treat a car's handling ability (not theoretical, but actually on the road) like a weighted average..... tires can only make up for so much; there's a driver in there telling the car what to do and in the end that person will make it or break it.
Anyway, the RE-92 were fine as far as all-seasons go, but it would have been nice to have some winter tires! I did notice that my OB XT, with VTD's 45/55 split, turns a lot better in slippery conditions than my previous 02 Outback that had active AWD. The 02 always understeered and plowed in slippery conditions. The 05 has slight understeer which can be pushed to neutral and then oversteer quite easily. I like it.
Pretty annoying to see pickup trucks getting zero traction and sliding sideways at lights. Apparently traction control has not made it into RWD trucks yet...
CRaig
Craig
Wet ice is the worst kind of slippery; glad to hear you made it okay!
Where in the Bay Area are you? Which dealer did you buy from? I work near San Jose and purchased from Santa Cruz Subaru.
Ken
It was truly bizarre and I am completely befuddled.
Amen to that!
Craig
Sly
Frank
I'm extremely happy with my winter tires, Dunlop WinterSport M3.
~Colin
I am hoping I can get some input on choosing between the two transmissions. I have read that there is a substantial turbo lag with the automatic. Is there any consensus about this? Also, can someone comment on the stereo quality? Thanks in advance!
Terry
Just kidding.
Both transmission are excellent, and ther is no difference in turbo lag: almost non-existent in both. What difference there is is that with a manual you can more easily keep the engine in the turbo boost range, so it is faster off the mark.
The real question is whether or not you enjoy a stick shift. Also, if you are in situations where you need to crawl (pulling a boat out of water for example) the auto will be much better, as the manual is impossible to crawl wihtout slipping the clutch and stinking the inside of the car.
Sly
Krzys
To make a long story as short as possible, in July of 2004, my parents (49 yrs old) were in the market for a new car, and wanted AWD, but preferably not an SUV. Liking cars, and becoming increasingly interested in Subaru's focused line, I directed them to the redesigned 2005 Legacy. Prior to this, my parents had mostly excellent experiences with Toyotas since 1986.
At the 3000 mile service at Flemington Subaru, the vehicle was retained for a week due to a non-crippling but incredibly annoying problem- whenever the rear defogger was activated, the stereo would completely lose reception. After reviewing wiring, connections, the head unit, etc, it was deemed an issue with the rear window, and that was replaced. Problem solved. Flemington Subaru NJ was phenomenal during this time, and provided a Legacy rental car for the entire week ours was out of commission. This was in early November.
Just yesterday, on January 19th , my father (the vehicle's primary driver) noted a strange burning odor as he pulled into work in Princeton, NJ. Upon looking under the hood, he noticed coolant spewed all over the engine, but also that the level of coolant in the resivoir had not dropped- it was still full. He called me, and I directed him to 1-800-SUBARU3, at which time they connected him to the nearest dealership (Nitti's Subaru in Hamilton Square, NJ). They told him to bring the car in immediately as long as it was driveable and the temperature gauge did not indicate a problem. He did so.(They provided him a loaner, from the rental agency across the street- a Mitsu Lancer. Fine, but no AWD, ABS, or side airbags- all features the Sube was purchased FOR).
Today, he (my father) called me to report that he spoke with the mechanic who inspected our Legacy (VIN 4S3BL616X57200310 and 7,000 miles on the odo). The mechanic originally thought that the head gasket was the culprit. However, after further inspection of the block, it was revealed that one of the six 'studs' that go in the engine block was stripped, likely the result of overtorquing at the factory. This resulted in the lack of a true seal forming. So, the Head Gasket was not the issue, but rather the block itself.
Bottom Line: Our Legacy will be out of service until next Thursday, as an ENTIRELY NEW BLOCK is going to be installed.
I am not a mechanic, and neither is my dad, so I've tried to explain this to the best of my ability. But, to say the least, I am floored that this level of quality non-control could be allowed to occur. Additionally, I have serious reservations to the fact that this engine needs to be rebuilt after 7,000 miles. My parents are NOT satisfied customers, and are questioning whether its really a good idea to hang on to a vehicle with such a significant failure so early in its useful life.
The advice I need is on how to proceed, as I dont feel that the repair itself is enough. This is a MAJOR repair, and I know from experience that once something like this has occured, it seems rare that the vehicle truly runs as well as it should. I want to believe in Subaru. Do folks here feel a letter to SoA is best, or a call to 1-800-SUBARU3 to voice my opinion? Honestly, what I believe is deserved is that Subaru offer an extended powertrain warranty free of charge.
Needless to say, this experience has left my parents cold, and not very willing to consider Subaru anything in the future.
For me personally, I am more saddened by this experience than anything else- as up to this point, I did love the car and had a great deal of respect for the company.
-Joe
1) is it an isolated problem (does it reecur often) or is it a "programatic error"?
2) how does your dealer resolve this issue. Is it completely resolved to your satisfaction, and at no expense to you, and with minimum inconvenience.
Pete
This would be a perfect case for Patti to get involved, but she is not on Edmunds anymore. Maybe Juice or Bob can offer advice.
The folks at SOA are pretty reasonable in cases like this, and they do try to keep customers happy whenever possible. So it seems like they should be able to do something for you.
Good luck!
Craig
it's about as relevant as Michelin owning BFGoodrich, separate plants, separate products.
I wouldn't buy a BFG except for the KD or KO, and I still believe that you can do better than a Goodyear when you look at price- or feature-based competitors.
what's all the hype about this triple tred? did Consumer Reports rate it highly or something?
~Colin
Well, according to the TireRack survey they are best in category (passenger all season). But this is obviously a highly subjective question. In those consumer reviews a given tire can be called "the best I've ever owned" by one person and "the worst ..." by another.
Sorry to hear of your folks' problem with their new Subaru. I'd have to agree with the advice/comments which have been offered by everyone else thus far; every automobile, no matter how reliable the product line or manufacturer, has its "mishaps" and sometimes even its "lemons". Which category their car falls into, I don't know. I have no doubt in my mind these are terrific cars, and in the lion's share of instances I've read/heard about, Subaru does do its best to take care of its customers. I know this doesn't make it any easier from where you're standing right now, but hang in there.
As annoying as this may for you to continue working the 'customer service process', as has been said, "killing them with kindness" will go further than blowing up at them. Gentle perseverance will get you where you need to go. Sounds as though SoA should be contacted, if for nothing else, to be made aware of the situation, and to be provided the opportunity to get involved and make good on the situation.
Pls keep us posted on how you fare. Also, where in NJ do you live? I'm in Bloomsbury, about 15 mins from Flemington Subaru.
Rgds,
Tim G.
'05 OBXTL- 5MT
7k miles and counting!
Bob
I wouldn't put anything less than a performance all-season on a Legacy or Outback. it's not a minivan! the RE92s handle poorly enough, I can't imagine stepping down in sidewall firmness and dry grip.
and those survey results are laughable. what's each person's basis for rating? I imagine they're a lot better than an Eagle RS-A that a lot of the survey responders driving domestics probably had OE, but the survey results are skewed by those who have never driven a better tire.
~Colin
Anyone hear anything good about these, or are they just another second-coming of "The Tornado"? For $39 (driver's side) and $24 (passenger's side), they'd better be able to make me a sandwich, too!
Just curious,
Tim G.
'05 OBXTL-5MT
I dunno, I guess I'm a patient person but I'd wait and not rush them to get it right. I'd ask for them to test the engine extensively before returning it to me, the customer.
You might also want to demand a full new car warranty for that engine, i.e. 5/60 from the delivery date of the new engine.
-juice
Bob, thank you for cutting and pasting the post and sending it on to Patti. I actually have her email address but was hesitant to send a communication to her as I am aware of the increased job demands that she's faced in her transition, and I also did not want to seem like some whiny customer looking for a freebie.
With regard to all that have stated a defect rate is to be expected with all products, I completely agree and respect the viewpoint. My intention in posting the events was not to denigrate the Subaru brand. That said, after 7000 miles, I do not feel that 16 days out of service is acceptable, and with respect to the gravity of the current issue, have serious doubts as to the reliability of this vehicle in the future. My expectation, which I believe is reasonable, is that Subaru will make an effort to mitigate/allay this valid concern.
I will also definitely heed the advice of those who have stated that gentle perserverance with SoA will be most effective. As stated, I am either going to compose a letter or call the Customer Service line. Most likely, it will be the latter, as work has been busy and talking to people is often more efficacious than not.
timo- Sweet! An NJ native! A little about me, (cause its fun to talk about myself, lol). I'm 23, I graduated from school Dec 2003, started working in June 2004, and live at home (thankfully rent-free with the parents) in the Old Bridge area. I'm moving out in March though, because my current job (which Im actually not enthralled with) is rotational, and I will soon be working in Skillman, NJ. The commute from home would be way too much, so I'm moving to Princeton.
This forum is frekin' AWESOME, btw.
Thank you again
-Joe
I'm not rushing anyone. Since the time the vehicle went in, there has only been one communication with Nitti's (the dealership) in which they told us the vehicle needed a new block, and we'd have the car back in a week. There's not many option the consumer has when a car is undriveable, so we said fine.
Some kind of warranty extension is exactly what Im after.
-Joe
Out of curiousity, have you tried talking with Diane at Flemington? I have always found them to be quite helpful regarding any work done on my OB. One of the reasons I travel 45 min. from SI to them:-).
Here's hoping everything works out.
Mark
The commute from Old Bridge to Flemington is also about 50 mins, but I really thought both she and Carlo did such an awesome job that Id happily have the Subaru serviced there for as long as I was living with my parents.
Thanks, btw!
-Joe
Appreciate your input.
Terry
You should have asked for an EVO for the AWD. LOL
Once they did give us a C240 4Matic wagon, when our Legacy wagon was recalled.
-juice