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Lexus GS 300/GS 430

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Comments

  • Like I said, I can't quantify it precisely (actually, I probably could, but I'm not going to take the time to do it just for this discussion). Go to ebay-motors or autotrader and run a search for low-mileage 2006 GS's and you'll get a bunch of results. Run the same search for the competitors and you'll get less than a third - and the listed prices for those will be closer to original MSRP. Also, on ebay for example, one wholesaler has "many to choose from" at large discounts. I called and was quoted $5K off MSRP before trying to negotiate. I'm not trying to make an argument against the car: I like it. I just wonder why there are so many showing up for resale with low miles. Also, in my area (DC), dealers are using them as service loaner vehicles. Also strange in my experience. Luxury dealers usually use their lower end models or some fleet vehicles (ie, Taurus) for that purpose, not high-end, coveted cars.
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Posts: 692
    Just curious what part of the country you live in where you got $5,000 quote off sticker right off the bat.

    It's possible there are more used GS300 for sale than competitors because they sell more new ones. For example, I imagine there are a lot more used GS for sale than Acura RLs because Lexus sells so many more new ones to begin with.
  • I'm in DC, but that ad was from a wholesaler in FL (who was willing to pay the shipping). The prices seem quite soft on these cars. (There are strong rumors of a GS 350 by Fall, which may be contributing.) Here's a quote from someone in the GS Prices Paid and Buying Experience forum about a published ad in Denver area for the same discount:

    "I went to the dealership that had posted the ad yesterday, and it is what it is. $5,000 off MSRP on any in-stock GS 300 AWD (actually, I think it's for any GS, but the ad just called out the AWDs).

    They have around 30 of them on the lot, from "stripped" models at around $48k on up to ones with Nav/Levinson at around $52k.

    So, $43k for a GS300 AWD seems like a pretty good deal to me."

    The other point you made about numbers sold compared to Acura RL (a car with rapidly shrinking sales numbers) is actually a bad comparison. The RL is appearing in newspapers and on-line in large numbers with steep discounts. Acura dealers are using them as demos just so they can justify selling them used for $8-10K discounts. Acura reached too high with the RL price and already has announced a cheaper, stripped down version because dealers can't move a $50K Acura. They've admitted that in published reports. Both the GS and RL seem to be available way below MSRP. Tha must be disturbing for Lexus. Not the company they want to keep.
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Posts: 692
    You're right about the GS350. It's due out this fall, replacing the GS300. So in the meantime, the expensive GS300 has a smaller engine than, not only the forthcoming ES350, but also than the Toyota Avalon and forthcoming Camry! Lexus is upside down here. On the other hand, I doubt that many GS buyers are aware that it's going to be replaced in the fall. I doubt it, because it hasn't been widely publicized.

    Actually, GS sales have been strong ever since its introduction last year, far stronger than the RL which has never sold well because it's way overpriced
  • Whoooo haaaaa!!!!!

    I can' wait for the fall to test drive and probably pull the plug on the 350.

    I am hoping that Lexus will debut the GS 350 at the upcoming New York Auto Show.
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Posts: 692
    I doubt Lexus will introduce the GS350 at the NY show. It will probably be the identical car with just the other engine. Plus it would kill sales of the GS300 for the rest of the year. I may be wrong. The big Q. about the 350 in the GS is whether it will be the same gas-guzzling, powerful engine (direct injection) as in the IS350, or the much more economical and less powerful engine that's in the Avalon, Camry, and the new ES350.
  • I know why there are GS300s available. here are the facts:
    1. Dealers know they will be receiving a 2007 car with a bigger engine and some modifications. They do not not want to have both on the lot
    2. Consumers will shortly become aware of the modified 2007 model and stop buying the 06.
    3. If you bought the 06 recently, you were ripped off.
    4. The ES350 for 2007 will pretty much be the same car as the GS300 except for AWD

    Glen.
  • I bought my GS 300 AWD fully loaded in early Decemberfor $49K. Now I know I was ripped off, given the fact that the ES350 for 07 will have all the same options, features, etc.

    Glen.
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Posts: 692
    The ES350 is not going to be the same car as the GS300, any more than the ES330 was the same car as the previous generation GS300. The ES is a luxo-cruiser with no sporty pretensions, with plenty of body lean on turns and little handling ability. The GS ain't no BMW, but is certainly sportier than the ES. That will remain, I believe.
  • The GS350 and GS350AWD is already being sold in Japan
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Posts: 692
    objectiveview: Do you have any idea what the horsepower rating is of the GS350s being sold in Japan?
  • donbldonbl Posts: 42
    Before buying GS300, I first drove the "IS350" and it was not comparable in the "feel of power" to my V8 Jag which has slightly les power.

    My buying decision for the GS300 over the GS430 was one of "good power" and excellent gas mileage with all the gadgets (which I really don't use much).... at those price levels, what's another $4K for a V8. Mileage and good power were the right blend for me.

    So, if the 2007 GS350 has the same gas mileage as IS350, and I were buying, then I would just go with the GS430/460 this time....
  • 315ps(306 SAE HP) in both 2WD and AWD versions :D

    Strange thing is, the 4.3 V8 is rated at 280, which I would think, is a conservative estimate
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Posts: 692
    objectiveview: Thanks for the HP figures on the Japanese GS350. That means it's probably the same engine configuration as the IS350. Is there a website where you got this info?
  • I have the GS300 AWD Love it great overall performer. With all this talk about the GS350 I approached my sales rep when I was getting the car cleaned. He and the other sales people are under the assumption that the new GS350 is going to be a Hybrid. Being confused about this whole thing I did a google on Lexus 2007 GS350 and there were some references to it being hybrid also (107hp electric). Can someone comment ont this. Are there 2 models coming? Or is Lexus playing with our heads?

    There was also a mention a few posts back on whether or not the 350 will have the "direct injection", I ask that question also...the was response was "Yours has it - why would they get rid of it"

    As for the GS being sold, I am not sure it is truly related to 350 coming out next year. From what I gathered from a my sales man, everyone is getting tired of bring the cars back for the "cold weather rattling dashboard noises" - According to him Lexus is going to be addressing the matter other than jamming more insulation and removing the clips etc...
  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    >"everyone is getting tired of bring the cars back for the "cold weather rattling dashboard noises" - According to him Lexus is going to be addressing the matter other than jamming more insulation and removing the clips etc..."

    Mine just went in this morning for the fifth time for that issue. This time the rattles are coming from the left and right speaker area, and I could duplicate it during a road test with the tech (thank God). I've found that I can get rid of the rattles by stuffing my wallet where the windshield and dashboard meet, right above the speaker. Seems kind of appropriate.

    I asked if they had been having problems with the 06 GS300's and rattles, and he said that other than one with some sort of window cowl near the wipers, he wasn't aware of any.

    BTW: It was 4 degrees here when I woke up this morning (southern NH).
  • I am in Boston, same the rattling beast reared its ugly head this morning. I have had enough with this rattling issue(went through the work orders...7 times so far)....placed a formal complaint with Lexus N. America.
  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    Please let us all know how it goes - I'll do the same.

    FWIW: I just got a call from the dealer (Lexus of Manchester). They've been working on my car since I dropped it off around 8:15 this morning, and they want to keep it overnight so it gets really cold, then do a road test in the morning.

    I'm not happy with the rattles, but the dealer service to try and fix them has been very good.

    I haven't seen any TSBs issued about this yet. I was just on Toyota's TIS site last night; I saw one about the speaker rattle in cars with ML, but my VIN was already after the cut-off. There was also one about a rattle due to rear window retaining clips, but my VIN was also after the cut off. Nothing TSBs about cold weather so far....
  • I will keep you updated. The customer care rep asked me what I would like to do. I stated if the car can not be repaired properly to have them take it back. She then asked if I would want antother car (which struck me that she would even say that) My response was that I would cross that road when it comes. So I would have to guess that this a wide spread issue and they are scrambling to do good - what ever it is they consider good it to be seen. Can you forward me the link for the TSB site
  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    http://techinfo.lexus.com/

    It isn't just for TSBs - it has repair manuals, owner's manual, technician training, and a whole bunch of other stuff. There are three subscription rates: $10/day, $50/month, or $350/year. The nice thing about the day rate is it goes until midnight the day after you sign up, so you can actually get a 48 hour subscription for $10 if you plan it right.

    All of the information on the site is in PDF files, grouped by different categories. FYI: the repair manual is a total of 2,154 files in 56 different categories.

    I downloaded everything that has anything to do with the 06 GS300 - a total of 2,588 files and 423 meg! I'm sure I won't use a lot of it, but there is also a lot of really good stuff in there.

    If I bought the printed manuals, for just the repair manual it costs over $1,000. I downloaded everything (repair manual plus a bunch of other stuff) for $20.
  • kvd2pallakvd2palla Posts: 29
    OK here is the deal...Lexus called me back..They are scheduling a visit to review the vehicle. They are planning on keeping the vehicle for up to 3 days - some kind of Engineer/Rep. will be inspecting it and make his diagnosis. Once again...the customer rep mentioned getting a new car....very surprising...I will keep you posted. They are assured me that all this will happen with in the next three-five business day.
  • ao2ao2 Posts: 44
    I've had the rattling problems since the day I bought the car.

    They started on the left side and the center...they somehow fixed it and now it has moved to the Right Side of the Dash and it is much louder and worse.
  • kvd2pallakvd2palla Posts: 29
    I have the same exact issue but reverse the sides where the noise started and where it is now!!! It's a real shame....Great Car, Great Overall Performer, Great Looks/Styling....Loud crappyu dashboard!!!

    On a side note....note sure if anyone on the forum has installed a K&N airfilter.....I did it, incredible difference in throttle response, not too much louder, and yes...after 4 weeks of driving...better gas mileage... ~3mpg more. But the real difference is the throttle control, the moment you touch accelerator the response is night and day.
  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    Good luck with the rep - I hope they are able to fix things for you.

    Here's what happened with mine: I dropped it off on Monday to get the dashboard rattles fixed (they were around the two front speakers). I had to go on a road test, and was able to reproduce it. I grabbed a loaner and went on my way.

    Later that day, they called and said they were done but would like to keep the car overnight to get it nice and cold, then do a road test the next day. I thought that was good service on their part.

    The next morning they called, and told me the road test showed the dash was quiet - but the driver's door and glove box were making noise! I had reported those both before, but they were supposedly fixed. They couldn't remove & fix the door panel since they come in two parts and are glued, so they had to order a new one and it would take a day to come in. No sweat - I had the loaner - so they kept it another night.

    I picked it up yesterday around noon, and so far so good. Everything has been quiet, although I haven't driven it too much so it's early to declare victory; I've been fooled before!

    I will say, however, that the service at Lexus of Manchester (NH) has been good. I'm not thrilled about the car (so far), but Lexus of Manchester has taken good care of me.

    Here are the notes the tech entered on the work order, in case they help you (this is exactly what the tech typed in):

    Problem: Left and right front speaker on dash rattles. Cause: Rattle from dash (speaker area) contact point in and around speaker wires. Removed speaker grills, speakers, and there was still a noise. Called tech line. Removed dash assembly and resecured pins and out felt apron around the a/c ducts. Epoxy the center speaker wiring harness connector to the speaker. Put foam along any contact points. R&R dash and put foam on any contact points.

    Problem: Rattle LF door LF door panel upper and middle parts of door panel loose R&R door panel.
    Cause: Noise from the dash, found coming from left front door panel where upper and middle parts meet loose, replaced door panel

    Problem: Noise from dash area by glove box
    Cause: rattle from dash glove box R&R glove box latch & moulding. Applied felt tape to contact points. Door was loose, removed glove box latch moldings and put felt on any contact points.
  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    >"K&N air filter"

    Is this the one you bought? http://www.knfilters.com/search/product.aspx?Prod=33-2220
  • Lexus Japan website has the info available
    see here

    Curiously enough, it seems that the IS350 has 315hp as opposed to the 306 you guys get in the US
  • I'm 6'6" and have had no long-term "fit" issues with either the 98 GS400 I drove for the last 8 years or my new GS430. The only real complaint I have is that my long hair definitely gets an unwanted workout when I have the moonroof open while driving. ;-) I do keep the passenger seat all the way back and parallel with mine.
  • kvd2pallakvd2palla Posts: 29
    Thats looks like the one.
  • newcarmannewcarman Posts: 55
    Good day. Can any present owner of the GS 300 2006, Rear wheel drive tell me how is the cars traction and handling in the rain ice and snow?? Also, how about the ALL Wheel drive model?

    Also, any noticeable problems with the car??Im seriously considering buying a GS 300.

    Thank you
  • kvd2pallakvd2palla Posts: 29
    I have a huge favor to ask of all the 06 GS owners with Nav. What version is on the DVD? does it say 4.2 (Green) ? This is for the N. America area. Also what is being presented when going into the info screen on the Nav. I heard a rumor that there is a new version already out.

    Update on the Dashboard and Lexus Corporate:

    My car is being dropped of monday morning for 3-5days. They would not tell me what their intentions are until they are completed doing their thing with the car.
  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    Mine says "Data: ver. 04.2"

    Good luck with your car! After they had mine for three days (they had to order a new door panel), it was fine for about a week or two, but now is rattling again. :mad:
  • donbldonbl Posts: 42
    Finally got it all together and entered:

    Sprint LG325 would not load phonebook. Ordered from Ebay a used SE T608 and loaded my phonebook via PC into the new phone.

    Uploaded phonebook (Business Card) to the Lexus and it worked PERFECTLY and EASILY.

    Then tried LG325 with phone book and all is well. T608 is now my Lexus phonebook remote control.... unless my wife decides to change (not likely).

    Three week project to get all the parts.

    Will now keep the car.......
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Posts: 692
    The GS300 will become the GS350 this fall (with 305hp--essentially the same engine as the IS), and the GS400 will become the GS480 in spring '07, with the same engine as the new LS.
  • kvd2pallakvd2palla Posts: 29
    Did they offer anything for aggravation factor? I am on fence the whether or not I want to keep the car. If it was not for the all the rattling I would not even hesitate on keeping it. I think I would rather have mechanical issues that the rattles!!!!

    As for the Map Version, 5.1 came out some time in October, trying to see if they will give me a gratis upgrade especially with all the BS I have gone through with the interior noises.
  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    >"Did they offer anything for aggravation factor?"

    Nope, nothing at all. I was pleased that the dealer took the extra time to make sure everything was OK (which resulted in a new door panel) though.

    Although... it started rattling again. Not as bad as before, but I'm now driving with an old sock stuck between the dash and the windshield on the right, and I sometimes leave my glove box open to stop that from rattling.

    I could take it back again, but if it couldn't be fixed in five attempts I don't hold out much hope for something magical to happen during the sixth attempt. It's going to start getting warm soon, so hopefully that will help.

    I would ditch it and get a BMW 530i, but I'd take a huge hit and I'm saving for a house now. If they would give me back the money I paid for it, I'd jump on that in a second.
  • gillekengilleken Posts: 4
    Got an odd one here! Car has 10,000 miles on it. Noticing an occasional scary feeling while moving over dry pavement at freeway speeds that I've lost control of steering...only for a second. Similar sensation to hydro- planing over water at high speeds...you think you've lost control, then it returns. During a two day trip from Florida to Jersey this occured about 3X. Also has occured 5-10X over the course of 6 months, always just for a split second. Will be visiting dealer and bring this us...wondering if anyone else has experienced?
  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    Confirmed - I've had the same thing happen. I can't tell if it feels like the tires are moving but the steering wheel isn't, or if the steering wheel is moving but the tires aren't, or if it feels like "regular" hydroplaning.

    It's only happened to me a few times (maybe a total of ten in seven months of ownership), but it's really freaky when it does. Scares the hell out of me.
  • wwestwwest Posts: 10,706
    The AWD GS300 has EPS and VSGR, Electric Power Stearing and Variable Stearing Gear Ratio.

    VDIM is coupled to these via CC, Cooperative Control.

    Under some conditions the EPS can be commanded to actively resist (RESIST, not "ignore") driver inputs via the stearing wheel. For instance under hard or aggressive acceleration EPS will be commanded to "stiffen" up and not provide a normal level of power stearing assistance.

    Or in the case of overstearing, the rear end skidding around to the right, not only will the EPS actively resist your turning of the stearing wheel in a direction that would exacerbate the skid, it will also use the VGRS system to reduce your influence on the angle of the front wheels, in effect automatically counterstearing into the direction of the skid.

    The documents quite clearly state that VDIM is now designed to be predictive, detect IMPENDING events that might become unsafe, and activate corrective meausures accordingly.

    Like not assisting you in turning the stearing wheel during high levels of acceleration, many activations of VDIM will be taken for preventative reasons and no alarm or visual indication would be appropreate.

    So yes, for those vehicles equipped with EPS, VSGR, VSC, Trac, and VDIM there will be inexplicable times (brief ones, hopefully) when it feels as if you are not "in control".

    Get used to it, "more" is coming....
  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    That would make sense during extreme maneuvers, not driving down the highway (which is when it happened to me). I may have been moving the steering wheel slightly, but no more than normal highway driving.

    BTW: VDIM is only on the GS430, not the 300.
  • wwestwwest Posts: 10,706
    The 2006 repair manuals at techinfo.toyota.com indicate that both the GS430 and GS300 have VDIM and EPS. It is unclear as to whether the GS300 has VSGR.

    The way I read the material the faster you travel down the high the harder it becomes to move the stearing wheel due to less "help" from EPS.
  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    >"The 2006 repair manuals at techinfo.toyota.com indicate that both the GS430 and GS300 have VDIM"

    I have the repair manual - could you tell me what section/file you read that in?

    Page 11 of the 2006 GS brochure says: "Though the GS 300 is not available with the prescient Vehicle Dynamics Integrated Management (VDIM) system offered on the GS 430, it is still well equipped with safety features should an emergency arise. In addition to its Traction Control (TRAC) and Vehicle Stability Control (VSC)..."
  • Karen_SKaren_S Posts: 5,092
    A national newspaper is looking to interview consumers who have had to replace a car key, which ended up costing over $200 or $300. Please send an e-mail to [email protected] no later than Monday, April 2, 2006 containing your daytime contact information, the cost to replace your key along with the make and model your vehicle.

    Thanks,
    Chintan Talati
    Corporate Communications
    Edmunds.com
  • kvd2pallakvd2palla Posts: 29
    The GS300 AWD has VDIM. It is in the manual and more importantly it is listed on the Window Sticker under standard options. I have the same thing happen to me - its a little freaky. I have noticed mainly on the highway going about 70+mph. The above makes sense..when I ask dealership technicians they thought I was losing my mind...unfortunately they are still learning what the car, unfortunately they should be on this site reviewing these posts.
  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    >"The GS300 AWD has VDIM. It is in the manual and more importantly it is listed on the Window Sticker under standard options."

    Where in the manual? What page? I just looked through the whole thing (I have it as multiple PDF files), and the only place VDIM is mentioned is on page 426 under the heading "VEHICLE DYNAMICS INTEGRATED MANAGEMENT (GS430 ONLY)".

    I also looked on my window sticker, and found nothing about VDIM. It lists VSC (Vehicle Stability Control), BA (Brake Assist) and TRAC (Traction Control), but not VDIM.

    I also have every available PDF file from the Toyota tech site (2,586 files in all), and there isn't anything in there that says the GS300 (AWD or RWD) has VDIM - it only mentions the GS430.

    So....sorry - no VDIM on the GS300. If anyone can point to documented proof, then please point away, but when the brochure, owner's manual, technical manuals, and window sticker all say that the GS300 doesn't have it, I tend to believe them.

    I agree that the "slipping" feeling is freaky, and when you try to explain it to the techs they look at you like you're crazy. I had one suggest that maybe I just rode over some uneven pavement. :confuse:

    BTW: what is going on with your car? Does the Lexus rep still have it, or have you gotten in back from them? Any news?
  • wwestwwest Posts: 10,706
    Okay, lets assume your GS doesn't have VDIM. That doesn't mean that the earlier VSC firmware didn't "tell" the EPS how to react, or not, during VSC activation.
  • Karen_SKaren_S Posts: 5,092
    A large local newspaper is looking to interview consumers who purchased a Lexus, Toyota or Scion vehicle and what led you to purchase that vehicle. Please send an e-mail to [email protected] no later than Wednesday, April 5, 2006 containing your daytime contact information, along with the make and model your vehicle.

    Thanks,
    Chintan Talati
    Corporate Communications
    Edmunds.com
  • I ordered a GS430 yesterday and assumed that Blackberry's would work with the Bluetooth, but just noticed that the Lexus web site (lexus.letstalk.com) does not list any Blackberry phones (that i can find at least). Does anyone know if Blackberry's would work. The Infiniti M has a bunch of Blackberry's listed. Thanks.
  • bdkinnhbdkinnh Posts: 292
    The Lexus site doesn't list my phone either (LG 8100), but it works fine.

    If you already have a Blackberry phone, just go to the dealership and try to pair it with a demo car.
  • I skipped the Lo Jack ($695.00) when we purchased our GS300. We just received a letter from the dealer stating that they would not deactivate the system and let us keep it for $300. This is just a basic Lo Jack Recovery System... no Early Warning.

    Can someone comment on this? We're thinking of going for it... but it does not make sense that they are willing to give us $395 discount. Thanks.
  • Are the wheels on the GS430 chrome? The brochure says aluminum alloy, and I thought at one point that getting them in chrome was an add on, but I don't see that option anymore. I just saw one and wheels looked chrome, but I don't remember the one at the car show being chrome. The ones in the pictures in the brochure don't really look chrome but it's hard to tell. thanks.
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