Mazda RX-8 Problems and Solutions

pathstar1

"A bunch of minor bug fixes plus the air/fuel and timing changes from the "L" flash" was what the dealer said.

I think they (Mazda) are still trying to get the cat. to last the required mileage plus give the owners close to promised power. They are also working on the flooding problem. The A/C problems owners are reporting are rumored to be fixed by hardware changes in the next model. They may not be able to address it in the current cars, as I think it's a design change. The new ducting probably wouldn't fit into the current cars, or would require dash removal, which would be prohibitively expensive.

mikem1

Care to elaborate on the A/C problems?

qbrozen

read that discussion I posted a link to. It gives some very different opinions of rebuilt engines (not all, mind you, just depends on who rebuilds it).

audia8q

I don't have experience with every brand...so I can't speak for them all....but the brands that I have been with for a long time are really good.

georgporsche

Can an RX8 owner look underneath their car and let me know if there is overspray paint there? I own a velocity red RX8, and I noticed some red paint underneath the car on the undercarriage. Is this normal?????

thanks for your help

pathstar1

A/C problems were not major, just a lot of southern owners report that the system isn't very capable/powerful.

As for a "rebuilt" renesis engine - I'm pretty sure Mazda hasn't got a rebuilder in NA yet. They are probably "freshening up" the ones returned to Japan that had problems. If that's the case they are "factory rebuilt" and will be as good as new (or better - most parts tested). My friend got a new "long block" replacement when his went last fall - including a new PCM.

Failures I've heard about so far on the "grapevine" are:
1. Coolant leaks - mostly caused by machining problems of the "O" ring grooves allowing the "O" ring to move.
2. Rotor or e-shaft bearing failures, most probably caused by lubrication failure (fuel in oil, low oil, etc.). As all engines have gone right back to Japan, this is all speculation.

The number of failures has been average for any kind of engine, so don't let this worry you.

The rotary engine is actually a very reliable design, as long as it gets enough oil and coolant. There are very few moving parts! In fact, I think you can count them on one hand!

2 - rotors (do we count the seals?)
1 - eccentric shaft
Do we count the electric intake routing valves?
I must be missing something else.

andym

Just bought the RX-8 sport package AT on Tuesday. Driving home from the dealership, after having paid in full, I experienced the strong pulling I've read about in other threads.

This happened after I was 25 or so miles away, by the way. Happened again a lot on Wednesday thru Friday. Always when I was braking. Didn't matter in which direction the road crowned, the pulling sometimes went with, sometimes against.

It feels like I have the ghost of Arnold Schwarzenegger sitting on my lap and he's driving. I really have to use my biceps and shoulders to keep the car in my lane to prevent it from sideswiping someone else or from crashing into the curb. And this is at low speeds!

Doesn't always happen, but I can feel it through the steering column when it's coming on. Wierd. A little difficult to explain. Very dangerous and I'm afraid to keep driving it. Needless to say, I'm not having any fun, yet.

Showed up at the dealership mad as hell when they opened on Saturday. Went for a ride with one of the techs. He felt it. When I brake at 30mph and let go of the wheel, it spins on its own,hard at least180 to 270! Said, "That's not right" Had to wait till Monday for certified Mazda tech to go over it.

andym

...(continued from post 420)

Tech said that it's not right. Got a call today. Told me all they did was a front end alignment! Is that it? Could that have been causing such a drastic problem? Or am I getting snowed?

Will the L (or I guess now, "M" reflash help?

I used to own the beloved RX-7, and definitely whacked the fron end out a bunch of times, but never experienced ANYTHING like this!

Anyone else got similar prob/solution?

graphicguy

There was one other poster here who mentioned pulling while braking. It certainly could be the alignment. It could also be the tires (my guess).

Not having any experience with your issue, I'd rely on the Mazda tech's advice.

bigmike5

Andym--sounds like an ABS, warped rotor, or sticking caliper problem to me.

graphicguy

I agree...it could also be a warped rotor or sticky caliper, too.

In either event, it's an easy enough fix if the Mazda tech knows what he/she is doing.

tomatnavy

I'm one of the others that has the pulling problem.In my case the dealer did nothing--could not find a problem. I have put on 600 miles since then with no major pulling occuring. However at times it will still pull to one side while braking. The reaction is much milder though. No strong and violent pull. I don't like to speculate on this,it's intuitively obvious that one side is "braking more[harder--etc] than the other side when this occurs--but the cause can be many.I'll had a similar problem with my ford some years back-- the dealer replaced the calipers and this seemed to help for awhile, but the problem reappeared. The warranty was up so I looked at it myself. One of the rotors was warped and replacement fixed the problem. I will continue to monitor this problem on the rx8 and give feedback when things change.

canuette

Has anybody had troule getting the center console lid open? The top slides back but the lid will not open.I'm the 77 year oldfart who loves his 8 just took a 750 mile trip averaged 21 mpg had the l reflash in a few mos ago.Incidently I ordered my 8 on the internet back in June of 03.

mkoll

Well, the dealer had my RX8 for about 1 week and replaced my transmission. So far, so good. I suffered with a rental ( '04 Chey Aveo ) last week. What a bizare vehicle that was. It handled terribly. Now I can finally get back to driving a real car; one that doesn't try to throw me off the side of the road when I take an exit ramp at a few mph over the speed limit.
Someone pulled out in front of me on my way to return the rental car, and I hit him. Luckily I had insurance coverage through the rental agency.
Thank goodness I wasn't driving my 8 at the time.
Needless to say I was overly cautious on my way home after picking up my car from the Mazda dealer.

Cheese-
So far I have not heard that peculiar clunking noise while putting the car in "park" since the new transmission....hmmm? But being the great skeptic that I am, I still spend a lot of time listening to the trans for any unusual sounds.

Nice to have her back!!

graphicguy

canuette...My center console got stuck, too. This was when I first got my RX8. My dealer said I tried to stuff too many CDs in that space (only 4). They had to replace a little "catch" on the lid and I was back in business. Now I only carry 3 CDs in that space and have had no problems.

mkoll....I can't fathom being without my 8 for any period of time. What the heck is an AVEO? I've never heard of those. Wrecking a rental car always sends a shiver up the spine. It's only happened to me a couple of times (I travel a lot and average 45 rentals/year). The rental car companies scare you so badly in warning you about what they won't cover if you don't opt for their outrageously expensive "additional insurance". I've never taken the insurance and the couple of little accidents I've had were always covered by my credit card company. In one of the accidents, the rental car company tried to charge me for the time they couldn't rent the car while it was in the shop. The credit card company came to the rescue, though. They fought it and won by saying the car was still driveable and that it wasn't a certainty the car would be rented during the time it was being fixed. All-in-all, no out of pocket expense and no "extra insurance" was needed from the rental car company.

carliker

Graphic, you don't know what an Aveo is?! It's the latest Korean car masked with a domestic badge. It's actually a Daewoo that GM now owns. The car actually starts at below $9K. I'm just glad mkoll is alright. He should actually be filing a lawsuit with the dealership that gave it as a rental. Anyone remember the Ford Aspire that was actually a Kia in the mid-90s? Very dangerous.

mkoll - I once almost drove a Toyota Corolla rental over a cliff in Hawaii. In Maui, there is this one road that you can take around the island that actually becomes a one lane road at one point. Talking about scary, there is no guard rail and you actually see crosses set up randomly for people who met their end. It was frustrating on the one lane road because I had to keep going back in reverse to let other vehicles get by who were going the other direction. Finally, I said no more! This mini-van driver wasn't yielding so I had to slowly go passed him without scraping the vehicle. Then, I felt the car sink and obviously noticed the front right wheel was over the cliff. Due to helpful residents, I was able to pull the car up and save it. The rental car company none the wiser. The funny thing was, the rental car company still overcharged me and it took me three months to get it straightened out with my credit card company. I think the rental car ratted me out.

graphicguy

Ahhhh....now I know why I don't know what an AVEO is. Something like that wouldn't even be on my "radar".

Those little cars have never held any interest to me....thus, I don't follow the latest developments with them.

Did a proper "spring detail" on my RX8 on Saturday. Only problem was getting the dirt out from around the lug nuts on the wheels. Anyone try any of those "wheel cleaners" on the market? I've always been fearful of them because I wax my wheels and don't want any "harsh chemicals" ruining the wax or the wheels.

Does someone have any insight/experience with the spray on wheel cleaners?

davesaunders

The problem I have with the wheels is the black brake pad (I guess) dust that accumulates so quickly between washings. Does waxing the wheels help with this?

beacon2

I have read this "L" Flash from a few guys. I have not been on here since my last problems. Thought it would be good to get as much info up as it occurrs. We have had a new intake manifold installed. New oil pan installed. Various re-programs...and the list goes on. Now after three weeks of slow starts car finally would not start period. Delaer says, as everyone else has....flooded !!!!! Gave no solution other then I started it wrong. Car sat all weekend after a 35 mile drive friday. Anyone care to comment. Dealer says they have no comments other then my fault. we asked what to do next time we got...don't know!

graphicguy

davesaunders....yes, waxing the wheels does help with the brake dust. While it may only cut down on accumulation minimally, it sure makes it easier to clean them (usually the grime comes off with just a regular wash). Plus, it makes them look shinier.

beacon....refresh my memory....

oil pan was an oil level sensor replacement and baffles, correct? This was done because of getting false "low oil level" readings?

intake manifold was replaced because of the CEL? Did they also replace the EVAP? Which ECU flash did they do (letter)?

You drove it 35 miles, turned it off and the next day it wouldn't start? Do I understand this correctly? Did they put in the leading "hot plugs"?

I don't remember, but are you using the same dealer for all service? If so, change dealers. These guys don't sound like they are "with it". There is no way they should tell you your car flooded given the information you posted. Also, they should cover it under warranty. If they don't, give Mazda customer service a shout.

Again, from your description, your servicing dealer sounds a bit "shaky".

Let us know what Mazda customer service says....this shouldn't be happening.

beacon2

Thanks for the response. I am going to get my files out of the car. The list was lengthy.
I will report full on the problems leading up to the latest nonsense. Picked it up last night covered under warranty. The oil change because of contamination was covered cause I took the free service package instead of trading in the car when the whole Horsepower thing occurred. Option of Mazda buy-back, or 500 certificate and free maint.

graphicguy

Yes, please do post back....

Maybe I'm fortunate because I've got a stellar "tech" that works on my car (same guy all the time).

The reason I bought from the dealer I bought from was because of this "tech". He has a reputation in the rotary community as being the top guy in the city. I had a dealership closer to me (multi-line), but had dealings with them before when I owned BMWs. They were always looking for a way not to cover warranty related issues.

It really irritates me when I hear of any dealership trying to parlay either their lack of knowledge or their lack of responsibility back onto the owner.

The rotary is just now back on the market. The dealer techs should have had proper training to do diagnotics. I've even heard of some dealers not investing in the proper diagnostic equipment to work on the RENESIS. To me, that's just not good business.

beacon2

I thought the files were here at work or in the car. Obvously made a mistake...I will have to find them at home. Not good with paperwork. The reason i keep going back to the same dealer is the tech serviced my 93 twin turbo, which despit all the major problems was my favourite car. He always got it running perfectly after some major problems. The old 93 had a new engine installed, new turbos, 3 or 4 water pumps, anti-theft sytem etc. Have not had the best luck but like most RX fans...i am dedicated!!!

donalds

Took the RX8 in for the two recalls, ask them to find out why the idle was bouncing from 850 to 1100, when it hit 850 there is a very noticeable shake, went to get it today, they said there was nothing showing up on the computer and they had driven it and could not duplicate the problem, I asked what flash was on it and they said it was the m and must have been done at the factory.
The production date was April 03, bought it sept. 03.Was not told about the H/P thing, I have the window sticker still saying it is 250hp
So I left the car and called Mazda service rep. not much help, he said he had to believe if they found nothing wrong then there was nothing wrong, went back and to the service manager, he agreed to call Mazda tech support, they said never had the complaint before try to look at the cam programming, does anyone know when was the m flash released?Tried the brakepedal thing and nothing happened

svorick

According to Mazda Service Bulletin 01-011/04 dated 4/12/2004 the "m" flash is on vehicles produced on or after 3/14/2004.. Also it states that all vehicles in for service must be reflashed to this level to fix flooding issue, even for vehicles with unrelated issues.

graphicguy

The RPMs will bounce around when the engine is started cold and then settle down to around the 850 RPMs mark.

I can't comment on your "shake" issue as my engine has always been as smooth as glass. As a matter of fact, when it gets warm, it's hard to tell the engine is idling in mine.

I didn't think there were any built for North America as long ago as 4/03. I thought they were built in July...maybe June of '03?

If your dealer has never done a reflash, there is no way you have the most recent upgrades to the ECU.

donalds

I could be wrong on the build date, but I have never had it in for service, but they insist the ECU has the "M" flash, I cannot go to another dealer to verify, nearest one is 150 miles away.
All they keep saying is "all systems passed no DTCS" even though you can see the shift lever vibrating.
I guess eventually whatever is causing it will completely fail and then maybe they can find it.

davesaunders

I think 4/03 is about right. The first RX8s were delivered to dealers in the U.S. in late 06 or early 07/03 and I'm sure they were in transit for a month or two. I received mine the first week in 07.

I've got mine in today for the two recalls and the oil sensor fix. I guess I need to ask them about the reflash as well.

graphicguy

Just want to make certain I'm clear....you've never gone back to your dealer for service?

You've had your car for 3/4 year (July '03)? Did you get the "free service + cash" offer from Mazda? If not, you should have and I would contact Mazda customer service about it.

If that's the case, then get back to your dealer as there are several things your dealer should be doing.

--oil level sensor upgrade (if applicable)
--CEL fix (if applicable)
--recall for minor airbag work and some minor sheilding
--latest reflash of the ECU

Are you changing your oil every 5K miles? If so, where do you get that done?

My gearshift shakes a little when idling, but I don't notice it that much. It's not really a "fault" with the car. If the car is shaking violently, then something's wrong.

davesaunders

I've been to the dealer once before for an oil change. I'm only at about 10,000 miles so they're doing my second oil change today. Yes, I did get the free maintenance card and the $500 debit card. The oil sensor upgrade,CEL fix and the airbag sensor recall are the things I left it for today. I just need to check with them to be sure they also reflash the ECU.

I'm very pleased with the car. I haven't experinced any shaking with the gearshift. The only real problem is the gas mileage. I haven't done any better than 21 mpg and that was on a trip with all highway speeds. I understand that the reflash might help this some.

bigmike5

Last time I had a problem like you describe, albeit not with a rotary vehicle, it was caused by a defective sparkplug wire that was causing a miss and rough engine. Just a thought.

kbull

Whenever I try to load a burned CD into my 6 disc changer, it tells me to check the disc and then ejects it. I can get it to play by skipping a couple of tracks before it ejects, but it's kind of annoying. I understand this type of problem is sometimes caused by the brand of media used (Imation vs. Memorex vs. Verbatim, etc.) Does anyone out there burn their own CD's and get them to load successfully? And if so, what brand of media are you using?

pathstar1

Did you put a stick-on label on the CD? That can really mess up 6 disc changers.

graphicguy

As pathstar said, most CD players do not like those "stick-on" labels.

I find Memorex to be the brand my RX8 CD player likes best for burned CDs.

bigmike5

I've seen this kind of complaint with CDs that are personally burned rather than commercial CDs by some owners of 300M's. Since I do not have any created CDs, I just assume it has something to do with the sensitivity of the particular vehicle player unit, or with some aspect of the recorder unit that created it. Some others said their car units had no trouble with the created CD's.

graphicguy

I find that most burned CDs, regardless of which car I use them in, tend to "skip" when going over bumps.

I don't have a problem with any commercially bought CDs. Really can't say why, however.

kbull

No, I didn't have any stick-on labels on the cd. Good to know I shouldn't be using them, anyway. And I'll try out some Memorex, see if I have graphic's luck with them.

As for the difference between burned and commercial cd's, burned cd's are done with chemicals whose reflectivity is changed by the burning laser, whereas commercial cd's are stamped with a glass master. It's easier for the laser to track a physically stamped groove than a chemically imprinted one. It's interesting that any kind of cd's skip nowadays- I'd imagine that all car players have sufficient anti-shock buffers, which is apparently not the case if your cd's are skipping.

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flatpick

Also check the format your burning to CD....make sure you've burnt as digital audio and not .wav, mp3, .shn, or .flac as most car player will not recognize that format. Also, are you burning DAO - Disc at Once or TAO - Track at Once ? I'd try TAO. This puts a track id and that might what you CD player is not finding, hence error. Good Luck. I've been burning Fuji disc DAO w/ Roxio CD Creator and XP's built in CD Copier/Burner software on my Dell and have had no problems with play back in my RX8 (The Red Hornet!!) :-P

kbull

That's a good point- I've been burning .wav's, but I think Nero converts them to whatever CD audio is when you tell it to make an audio CD, but I haven't been checking to see if it's doing DAO or TAO. I'll give that a try. Thanks.

vtlc

Hi all, its been a while since someone posted something so I'm guessing everyone and your rides are doing good. Well I just took mine in for an oil change and they also put in the M reflash thingy. I just got it back today and after coming home, I went to Blockbuster for a movie and after I started the car to drive home I can hear a loud tapping noise on the drivers side from the engine. As I started to drive away the sound got louder and faster as the revs went up. I then drove it to the dealer and when I got there the sound was very quite, it was barely audible. They told me to bring it back if it happens again. As I got home and parked it for about 4 hours, restarted and went to the store for some burgers, I stopped at a light I can feel the car shaking a bit. The tach does not fluctuate but I can feel the shake. I pulled into a gas station and I went to listen to the tail pipes. Every other second I would hear a little cough like sound. buh buh buh boomp..buh buh buh boomp, and at the boomp the car would shake a bit. I have no idea what is going on so maybe someone can give me so info on my situation. Thanks

graphicguy

Yes, we're all having fun driving...no issues. Wow...I have no idea what your issue would be.

Just make sure you're checking the oil regularly. Matter of fact, make sure your dealer filled your oil since they just changed it. I've seen it happen during an oil change... mechanic drains the oil, puts the new filter on, screws in the oil plug, and then forgets to refill with oil (happened to me at a Jiffy Lube a long time ago...it cost them a new engine).

If nothing's turning up on the dealer's computer, then maybe the reflash is causing the ECU to "relearn" and that's causing some of the sounds you're hearing...that's a "long shot" but would be the best explanation I have. If indeed that's the case, it will disappear over time. Mine accelerates as smooth as glass. My shifter vibrates just a "wee bit" during idle, but that's no big deal.

pathstar1

I've seen two things. First the tapping sound. Told my friend his valves needed adjusting ;-). It's the fuel injectors, actually. The are quite easy to hear because the engine is otherwise so quiet. The latest flash makes them do strange things (that you can hear).

Rough idle - we've had some coilpacks go flakey. We ARE messing with the ignition system, so that could be the cause, but the front leading pack started to fire a bit around the time the rear one fired, and that messed up the idle on his car. It probably runs hotter than the rest, being at the front and closest to the radiator. I swapped the pack with the rear rotor trailing one and that solved the problem. The front leading is the pack at the front of the set (four of them on a bar, seen way down under the intake hose).

You can only see this problem with a scope, although it doesn't take a genius to tell it's idling roughly.

coronaca

greeting rx8 owners: i recently bought one and notice that the oil gauge does not move. on mine it's 1-2 bars to the right of middle and no matter how hard i rev it up it does not move, what is up. secondly the oil indicator light comes on once in a blue moon and yes i check my oil level it's full. would appreciate any advice.
i recently bought the exhaust finisher and will attempt to install it on my own without taking off the bumper,will be more than happy to let any one interested know how that goes.

graphicguy

pathstar...thanks for the explanation. Got a couple of questions for you...

...what's Maurice's take on the recent ECU reflashes? Do they affect his ECU mod in any way?

...do the reports of rough idle have anything to do with the leading "hot plugs" being installed?

As a side note, I've got the "regular plugs" installed and I made a point of getting out of my car last night while it was idling and put my hand on the hood. Fact is, if I didn't know for a fact the car was indeed running, I couldn't have told it by putting my hand on it...it was running that smoothly. Even though my shifter shakes ever so slightly at first, once it gets to operating temps, it doesn't shake at all.

pathstar1

The ECU mod takes RPM and throttle readings and modifies the fuel and ign. timing per a pre-set map. So yes, a reflash of the PCM will affect the result. The current map is set for the "L" and "M" flash, but will work with all previous flashes. That was lots of work, but it appears to function well.

I don't see how hot plugs would affect the idle. It should actually idle better (plugs run cold at idle). In Maurice's case it was a flakey coil, because when I switched it, it idled fine. We've been fine-tuning the ECU mod. output to the coil packs, trying to get the pulses into the packs the same as the stock PCM. Just to make sure the coil pack flakeyness will not repeat because of what we do. I'm pretty sure it was not us. They are marginal to begin with. Not very well heatsunk. The coil pack is an ignition coil (a rather small one), with a transistor that grounds it (that is, when the transistor is turned on by the PCM - a 3V 5 mS pulse - current flows through the coil charging it up - and when the pulse ends the coil sparks).

vtlc

Took it back to the dealer to check it out, cuz this morning it was idling even worst then before. you can actually see the car shake if standing about 2 feet away from it and the boomp boomp noise from the pipes got louder. The service rep said something about a miss, or something like that. He said he will call me when they find out whats wrong with the car. The day has gone and still no call. As much as like my 8, it just saddens me that its in the shop so much.

graphicguy

Thanks....

I didn't think the "hot plugs" would make much of a difference. I was just curious on your take.

Just a guess, but I would think any reprogramming that Mazda does with the ECU would cause the "mod" piggyback board Maurice has would either close the gap between Maurice's mod vs the stock ECU or cause it to be totally ineffective.

Do you have to reprogram the mod every time there's a reflash from Mazda?

vtlc...without knowing more, it may be that there a "miss" causing your car shake as you describe. The Mazda tech should be able to be diagnose it easily by hooking your car up to the dealer's diagnostic computer and reading the codes.

I have to admit, hearing the number of times you have to go back to your dealer for "this & that" is extremely unusual. These cars are very robust in both build and design. I believe you said you've tried many different MAzda techs to service your car? Has your dealer seen it shake when you take it in? If so, is the only thing they say is wrong is it's missing? Have you ever done a very hard launch? If so, then you may have broken a motor mount. That would cause it to shake. It's highly unusual, but still possible. That said, I've launched mine by doing a clutch dump at 4K RPMs (takes off like a "jack rabbit") and have found the car to be stable and stout under those conditions. The trade rags have launched at 8K RPMs without any trauma, either. I have never heard of any of the cars shaking like yours.

As mentioned, they run as smooth as glass. I can barely tell when mine is idling. It's revs are nothing but a model of smoothness.

darrshe

My last post was several months ago, after the A/C system was given a full recharge. Still experienced the cool/warm air surging out of vents and vehicle wouldn't cool down in warm weather. Dealer told me they were waiting for TSB from Mazda on what will be the real fix. Anyway, I called the dealer 4-23-04 and found that a factory fix has been identified. Brought the car in to get the fix (A/C amplifier). Only dropped the air temp by 4 degrees per service rep. Per Mazda, they put in a whole new A/C system, which took two days of work. Seems to blow harder out of vents and stays cooler, however, it has only been in the 50-60's here in New Jersey. Will not be able to confirm that this fix has corrected the problem until the weather gets warmer. For those who are experiencing the low A/C performance, recommend that you contact your dealer to get this new fix installed. I also had the recall for the passenger air bag wiring completed.

vtlc

Service rep called me and went to pic up my 8. It was idling smoothe again and no more tapping noise or shakes. Very happy about that and drives very strong now. I asked the rep what was wrong before and he said that 2 of my spark plug wires were shorting with the engine. I had no clue what he was saying so I asked him to explain. He said the wires are connected to the engine on top and sparks on the side bottom. As the wires come over the side of the engine block the currents were making contact with the block because they were defective. They replaced all 4 of the wires he said. I really dont know why the wires could do that, cuz I always thought they were plastic coated. But its running good now and Im happy. Oh the bad news, I found the defroster button cracked, so Im headed back to talk to the rep again. Looks good luck bad luck again, for its so small and the crack line was 3/4 of the button. I just wish one fix stops equalling one need fix.

I drive very easy around 4 to 6k rpm. To me the car has pretty good power there already, only few times ever went above 6k.

No matter how many times I have to take my 8 back to the shop, Im enjoying every minute of driving it when its not being serviced.