Toyota Highlander Hybrid

tsotsi

One advantage of shopping for a 4-cylinder instead of a hybrid is that it is possible to get rebates and other discounts. I ended up paying $23,000 for my 4-banger, with a power driver's seat and towing package. You are right about the power, compared with the hybrid, but it does very well here in South Florida. Drivers start out like a herd of cattle -- very slowly -- even though they eventually end up speeding.

When Toyota sells a hybrid for $29,000 -- standard Highlander plus $3000 hybrid premium -- I will trade in my present ride for one.

phoebeisis

HAH-Big mistake tsotsi,I gotcha now!!I only know one person with the 4cyl Highlander-and frankly,though I quoted his mpg figures earlier,I'm not thoroughly convinced he takes mpg as seriously as I do.I really liked the 4cyl Highlander-my wife made me go with the Pilot because of the greyhounds!The 4CYL Highlander actually surprised me by not being as slow as I expected it to be.It had usable around town acceleration.It isn't any slower than my Prizm(faint praise). A couple of questions,if you don't mind?
1)What is your average mpg?What sort of driving do you do?Thanks.Charlie
darmock,you are right of course.If we get a sudden spike to $4/gal,our economy will sink.Thanks.Charlie

tsotsi

Okay, phoebeisis, I confess. Guess I'm a wimp because the 4-cylinder is plenty powerful enough for me. Driving from Savannah to Palm Beach at between 70 and 80 mph, with A/C on, I averaged about 25 mpg. Around town, again with the A/C always on, I am getting around 20 mpg. These are real life figures and are about what I averaged with the Honda Accord I traded in on the Highlander.

If I assume an average of 22 mpg for the four and 27 mpg for the hybrid (real world) that is about 23% more fuel I am using. If a hybrid driver burns $1,000 worth of gas a year, I will burn $1,230. Interest on that $13,000 I saved will be at least $650 year. I still want a hybrid, but it doesn't make sense financially. I am a technology freak.

dehanc

Mike,
Please email me the dealership to me as well! Thanks. My email is in my profile.

phoebeisis

tsotsi.You mean your not planning to run your next car 618,502 miles($13000/$2.50 + X/27=X/22)??I always figured that the Highlander 4 cyl with just the things you need-like(power seat,and side curtains because idiots in New Orleans run redlights) would be the toughest comparable car(midsized SUV) for the HH to plausibly "beat"-considering value-mpg -reliability-resale-etc.The V-6 High and the CRV are also tough competition.
I hope Toyota decided to pump up production.A "stripped " HH at $29,995 would be a lot more tempting than the $37000 they currently are.Thanks for the figures.Charlie PS I really liked the 4cyl High-my wife vetoed it because Phoebe and Isis"didn't look comfortable".

fizban

Right you are. My bad. Thanks!

smaria

"That $3000 dollar premium is really only $1500 or $1000 if you take the tax deduction into consideration. This year it is $2000 dolars for buying a new hybrid and next year $500."

Unless I'm mistaken, the $2000 tax deduction is subtracted from your taxable income, not from the taxes that you owe (i.e., it's a tax deduction, not a tax credit). So, if you're in the 25% tax bracket, the $2000 deduction only saves you $500 in taxes. If your tax bracket is closer to 20%, it only saves you $400.

So, in short, the $3000 premium really is a $2500 premium, really. Of course, the money saved on gas helps make up for this, but the tax deduction doesn't help as much as most people think. Reporting that "this $x hybrid really costs only ($x - $2000)" isn't really accurate. I've seen some published reviews of hybrid vehicles report that the deduction "saves you $2000", which is misleading at best, IMHO.

If I'm wrong, please correct me (I'd love to be corrected and find out that I'm wrong). But this is how I understand the income tax deduction to work

gagrice

You have it figured out perfectly. That tax deduction on a $40k vehicle is near meaningless. If a person wants a hybrid because it is cool and they feel good about helping the environment, that is great. If a salesman or anyone tries to talk someone into a hybrid as a way to save money. It is not true, except in very rare cases. And even those may prove to be false if the repairs after warranty are more than on a non-hybrid comparable.

phoebeisis

gagrice,yeah,I think you are right,but
If the car you are comparing it to costs just $8000 less-$30,000
And the car you are comparing it to is going to average 15 mpg vs 25 mpg(or about 10 mpg difference in the general mid teen to mid 20 mpg range)
And you pay ~$2.50/gal
Then you break even at 120,000 miles-Call the tax break a tie with the interest you won't make on the $8000.
All full sized SUVs will pay off at well under 120,000-even $27000 Expeditions and Tahoes.
Many midsized SUV's will pay off around 120,000-Trailblazer-Explorer-Pilot-MDX.-4 Runner
The Highlander V-6 and the 4 cyl Highlander and the CRV can take 180000 to 600,000 to pay off(never).
If gas hit $4/gal-break even is quicker.
Bottom line-it won't save many folks money-but it is likely to end up costing the same as many "lesser" slower vehicles.Gets Middle East off our backs a bit sooner.Charlie

gagrice

Using your 120,000 mile break even point. How many people keep their vehicle 120k miles? From what I am reading it is 6 years & 90k miles. With the high price of repair parts that are showing up on hybrids vs non-hybrids, keeping a hybrid past the warranty is not too smart. If Toyota and Honda did not have a strangle hold on the limited parts for these cars it may be a different story. The only justification I can see is wanting to have an environmentally superior vehicle that is the latest in technology. I would never consider buying a hybrid from a purely economic standpoint. My own hybrid included.

stevedebi

"With the high price of repair parts that are showing up on hybrids vs non-hybrids, keeping a hybrid past the warranty is not too smart."

Hybrid owners had better hope you are wrong about this statement, or the resale values are going into the toilet - the person buying that used Hybrid has to think about maintenance.

toyotaken

I'm just wondering what "high price of repair parts" this is referring to? As far as I know there haven't been any that have been of note, just the oposite in fact. No Transmission to fail, brakes & pads lasting 100k or more, no starter, no belts or pulleys for the A/C, etc. Sounds as though, long run, the maintance and repair costs could well be much less.

Toyota Ken

otis1

I agree... there's some folks who are scared that if/when a component of the electrical side fails, it will be expensive. Since it's new, the fear is understandable. But why is this such a determining factor for some people. when BMW started putting iDrive's into their car, no one said, "wait, that's new technology, what if it fails, how much will it cost to fix it?" they either liked it or they didn't. the same could be said for the hybrids- you either like it or you don't.

the 2nd thing that's bugging me is this claim that it will take 120,000 miles to recover the premium. this is true if after XX years, the hybrid and the "equivalent" gas model cost the same. in other words, a HH may cost $39k today, while a lmt gas will cost $33k. In 3 years, will they both cost $16k? We'll know the answer in 3 years, but I'm willing to bet the HH will still be worth more than a gas model (maybe 20k?). then the "premium" is only $2k- still doesn't make financial sense, but it's not the big financial burden some people are making it out to be.

toyotaken

Very true, and just as you can purchase a regular Ford Escape, CRV, etc. for $$$$$ less than a Porche, BMW, VW, etc. sport ute, doesn't deter those purchasing those models either. The technology, abilities, and certainly name all factor into someone's purchase decisions. If everything came down to a simple math equation, there wouldn't be the great number of choices that we have available to us today. Maybe we should get the thead back to the discussion of the vehicle itself and what people's questions about it, as well as owner's experiences have been.

Toyota Ken

johnnyroaster

Good point above Ken.

About the tire pressure monitor: I checked my valve stems and they are rubber but a slightly large diameter than standard.

Has anybody else notice the handling to be a bit unstable during fast starts? I have not driven a front wheel drive car in a while, but it sometimes seems like the front wheels are lifting off the ground during quick starts. I don’t mean to imply I have been racing my new HH, but the front end seems to almost float. I do have the awd model, but from my understanding the majority of the power is delivered to the front wheels.

toyotaken

"awd" models use only the front elec. motor unless you're using full throttle or the vehicle detects wheel slippage or immenent wheel slippage from the front wheels. It may also have to do with the extra weight of the batteries and MGR(rear elec motor) further back in the vehicle, although I would think this would actually help as they ballance the weight front/back more evenly rather than as a normal FWD vehicle with most weight in the front.

Toyota Ken

boylan13

Carole,

Sorry for the delay - not sure if you're reading this now, but thanks for your reply. Actually my parents have a place in the Adirondacks about 140 miles north of Albany (in Long Lake), which is probably not far at all from your dealer. But it turns out that Prestige Toyota in Northern NJ got me a Highlander Hybrid (Limited 4WD with Nav) today at MSRP. I got on their wait list at the end of April (#20 at the time) and was expecting to get the car some time in late July or August. But apparently this one became available when someone else backed out. Woo hoo! We're picking it up on Saturday morning.

I must say dealing with Mario Puentes, the internet manager from Prestige Toyota in Ramsey NJ has been a real pleasure unlike most of my other dealings with delaers via phone and e-mail. They are charging no premium above MSRP and are great about keeping you in the loop on availability and progress. Because of their strong sales record on Prius and Highlander, they're getting more of the HH than most other dealers in the area (9 in their first allocation alone).

Manhattan Toyota called me about 3 or 4 weeks after I filled out the enquiry form on Edmunds, but they told me I would have to wait a year if I wanted to pay MSRP. I'm sure Prestige's waiting list is still growing, but because thir volume is so high the wait will probably be less than at the other NYC-area dealers. And if you're flexible on color/options you can get someone else's car if they back out. Anyone in the NYC/NJ area considering the HH should give Mario a call - 201-258-2176 - tell him Chris Boylan sent you (no, I don't get a commission)...

Later,

-Chris

chgohhltd

We picked up our 2006 Highlander Hybrid Limited 4WD yesterday.

We want to add a trailer hitch to the car, but there is NO sign of any wiring harness. The owner's manual (page 334) says it should be there, and I confirmed it with Toyota's customer service people.

Short of removing things that we really don't want to touch, we looked around very thoroughly (even removed the spare tire) and there does not seem to be any sign of it. I'm wondering if it was left off accidentally when it was made.

If anyone else already has their Hybrid, have you looked under the rear of the car for the wiring harness? I'd appreciate it if you could take a look and let me know if you see it. Thanks!

johnnyroaster

The manual suggests it is stored in the body panel on the right side. I could not find any sign of it on my HH. I pulled the tool tray out and found what I think is an amp for the stereo on one side and a mysterious black box on the other.

Are you planning on putting the trailer hitch on yourself? My dealer did not seem interested in installing one and suggested I go to a Uhaul dealer. I don't like the idea of some kid drilling holes when 650 volts are close by.

I will take a closer look tonight and let you know if I find anything on mine.

gagrice

I'm just wondering what "high price of repair parts" this is referring to?

On the Prius there have been at least two posters that paid $2100 & $2800 for a catalytic convertor. You can buy a cat convertor for a Camry for under $200. That is the kind of gouging those with hybrids are going to face very soon, if not already. Honda is doing the same. A 2003 Civic hybrid owner with a $7000 CVT transmission repair bill.

toyotaken

I honestly can't say that I am familiar with ANY prius that I'm aware of having such a repair, but it could be. Is there any difference between that and a $2000 transmission replacement on a conventional vehicle? I guess I'm just not understanding how this is MORE expensive than any other vehicle on the road. Close to, or at this point, over 300,000 Prius's on the road and two repairs to catalytic converters do not indicate a trend to higher ownership costs.

Just my thoughts.

Toyota Ken

ssachnoff

I went out to my garage this am to drive my base model 2WD HH #6960 AF to the Y for my morning swim. Perturbed when the auto-unlock didn't work. Put key in the ignition and NOTHING. DEAD. No lights. No dashboard display NADA. :lemon: I had not driven the vehicle for 3 days but YIKES! The owner's manual says if you're not driving it for 1-2 WEEKS then it should be started up and charged. Has anyone else had this happen? Is it attributable to break-in period? To be fair, the HH started right up when I jumped it with my 2001 Camry. Kids were quite freaked out when they heard HH wouldn't start (remembering horrible mostly dead-of-winter experiences with our 1994 Voyager) but I told them it "had just gone to sleep and needed to be woken up."

stevedebi

"I honestly can't say that I am familiar with ANY prius that I'm aware of having such a repair, but it could be. Is there any difference between that and a $2000 transmission replacement on a conventional vehicle? I guess I'm just not understanding how this is MORE expensive than any other vehicle on the road."

Well, in my math, $7000 dollars (for a hybrid transmission) is $5000 dollars more than $2000. That is why it is different than a conventional car.

I understand your point about trends and mileage, but the question is how much do repairs cost when they are needed. By the above standards, the HSD would have to last three times as long to be worth the extra $$ for repair.

upstateny5

Thanks Chris for the info and hope you are real happy with your HH. I am still holding out for the base model and the color blue to boot so I may have to wait quite a while. I just wish Toyota would give out for information about how long a wait customers have ahead of them.

mackabee

These repairs should have been covered under the emissions warranty which is longer than the power train warranty.

Mackabee

gagrice

These repairs should have been covered under the emissions warranty

That was my feeling exactly. Toyota got around it some way or another. The problem as I see it is the special parts that are only used in hybrids will be over priced. The longer the warranty the better off you will be.

fizban

So the 12v battery died. That's suspicious. If you're sure you didn't leave something turned on, I'd have it checked out.

tomslyck

There's a news article out today that "The Internal Revenue Service has certified the model year 2006 Toyota Highlander Hybrid as being eligible for the clean-burning fuel deduction." Lots of folks predicted it, but it's still nice when it becomes official.

http://accounting.smartpros.com/x48749.xml

bouvsrus

Two nights ago, I exit car from driver's side, my son remains in the front passenger side for several morning minutes (chilling to his favorite song on car radio). He opens and closes passenger door and goes into house, locking the car with the remote.

Two hours later, neighbor knocks on door to let us know our car lights are on? Weird as I went back and all doors were shut properly. The auto light feature on the headlights I don't think keep the lights on after the driver exist vehicle and closes door well?

Any theories on what happened? Happen to anyone else?

Steve

waltrde

phoebeisis, your manufactured number is based on several factors being heavily biased against the HH and you admit you're guessing on at least one factor. I imagine that given that you're in a region that is hot market for Hybrids, dealers are heavily discounting conventional Highlanders and heavily marking up Hybrid Highlanders and Toyota is offering large rebates on the conventional Highlander, you can achieve your $8000 premium.

I know from research and personal experience that those factors don't apply broadly across the country. The HH is my wife and I's third Hybrid. We own a 2001 and a 2004 Prius (both bought without dealer markup). We saw the same dealer price gouging going on in several hot markets in the country while waiting for the '04 to arrive. I know from following the Prius forums that it wasn't hard to find a dealer that would sell at MSRP, even when people were selling used Prii for more than MSRP.

You fail to consider the tax advantages possible. Of course the Federal deduction of $2000 doesn't do much for most folks, but several states have tax incentives for buying a Hybrid vehicle. If you are a resident of Oregon, you get $1500 tax Credit. Colorado residents get a credit equal to 85% of the differential between the conventional and hybrid equivalent. If you sell your 10-year-old car to an out of state resident, or junk it, the credit is 100% of the difference.

The only state I found a $1000 cash back incentive is California (I didn't try all 50). In Chicago, Denver and Boston, $800 is available. In the Central Atlantic, it is $750. If you buy from a Dealer in Seattle or New Jersey, there's no cash back for you.

According to Edmonds, the spread between MSRP and Invoice on a 2005 Highlander is approximately $3000. You say you can get the conventional Highlander for $4000 under list from the right dealer. This would only be plausible in the regions that offer $1000 cash back on a Highlander and would probably require an afternoon's haggling. I know from personal experience that can buy a HH at true MSRP from the right dealer. Yes many dealers are taking advantage of a tight market, but plenty of dealers aren't throwing dealer options to create an inflated "MSRP".

The Highlander I bought, at the MSRP listed online, had no dealer options and the only port option was cargo/floor mats. They had two AWD Limited with Nav on the lot. The one that had been prepped had a supplimentary sticker where they had added $199 for paint sealant and $3000 Additional Dealer Markup. When I said I pay either, they didn't blink and asked me which color I preferred. It was so easy I feel I could have gotten them to go below MSRP if felt like really haggling.

Of course the real problem is that too many people (usually people that will never be hybrid buyers) focus entirely on fuel economy improvements that hybrids provide and make a big deal that the ROI from fuel savings doesn't cover the premium for the Hybrid. Except for people who can get a state tax break, this is almost invariably true. What they fail to consider are the other factors that add value to a hybrid vehicle, such as benefit the the environment, advanced electronic systems (Especially in the case of the Prius, which has more Lexus in it than Toyota when it comes to the electronics), higher performance (Highlander, RX400h, Accord), etc.

One point that most people don't understand that Toyota's prime hybrid design objective is to minimize exhaust emissions. Fuel economy and/or higher performance simple come along for the ride.

Walt

toyotaken

I am not sure if you're telling us it was the headlights or the interior lights. If it was the headlights, they will shut off when you take the key out of the ignition and open the door. (within a minute or so with the "twilight sentinel"). If, however the car is turned off and you manually turn the headlights on, they will stay on.

Hope this helps, and if not, a bit of clarifiaction would help.

Toyota Ken

phoebeisis

Good points toyotaken..The overall "green ness" ,nice interior, extremely handy size-big enough for long trip comfort,but small enough to be a great town car(4" shorter than a Camry), and 7.2 0-60 are a lot more important than couple of thousand $ one way or another on a $40,000 vehicle.
Ok.Lets have some more MPG numbers?!Charlie

phoebeisis

waltrde,you are right on all points.I might nit pick on how hard it is to get $4000 off MSRP,but an afternoon fighting the sales manager sounds about right.Many markets have $1000 rebates on the regular highlander.
I don't think I am in-New Orleans-a hot Hybrid market.MPG, green ness, and safety aren't really big selling points around here.I confused the issue by mentioning Carson toyota-a big online discounter that does a lot of out of state sales.They even have a Prius on special now(no price unfortunately-bad sign).
Well,gotta agree.The overall green ness,very handy size-long trip comfortable,but city "parkable",near lux level of options available,acceleration and "funness" are all more important than the couple of $$ difference in "eventually cost" of owning.Heck,it is a $40,000 car-$2000 is a drop in the bucket.Thanks.Charlie
PS I didn't think I was biased against the HH??120,000 miles is a plausible length of time to keep it.Granted,I wouldn't dispute the 80,000-90,000 miles figure I saw here.All my figures were guess-estimates ($30,000 vs $38000;$2.50 gal;15mpg vs 25mpg).I ignore resale trade in(HH++ is my guess).I ignored fed-state tax break(HH++).Interest not earned(HH-) I think the factor that is going to end up being the "worst guess" is the price of gasoline.It is more than $2.50/gal in some places already!!In 5 years it might be $4/gal+ and that will make for a sweet trade in resale to say nothing of directly dropping the break even miles.
The HH is a good bet to PAY OFF based just on MPG(another guess,but 7 years ago I paid 89 cents/gal))!!Now I will shut up about break even.

rx400_owner

You might check your tire pressure and if that is okay, have the dealer check alignment. A number of posters on a Lexus forum have reported finding that the tires in the new Lexus Rx400Hs were inflated well above spec. At least one of them said that their handling problems went away when they corrected the tire pressure (and one of their complaints was about behavior under acceleration though they didn't describe it as lifting).

The Rx400 has different alignment settings from the Rx330 and some seem to have been set up to the wrong settings. Perhaps the same confusion applies to the Highlander and HH.

waltrde

Charlie,
I've been through the hybrid break even from gas savings argument through two generations of the Prius and now the Highlander (not so much with the 2001 Prius) which has made me rather sensitive on the subject, since if all you are interested in is saving $$$ you don't want a hybrid. It was really the $8,000 figure (which I've seen bandied about by others online) that pushed me over the edge, since my personal research didn't come close support it. Sorry if I went overboard.

I only meant that your figures seemed biased against the HH, except for what used to seem to be expensive gas. You pointed out some valid factors that I had failed to take into account as well. One thing I've learned is that it is too much work to try and figure out the real difference in price between the conventional and Hybrid Highlander when Toyota offers a $750 rebate in Dover, DE and no rebate in Newark, DE on a conventional Highlander.

Glad we've worked it out.

Walt

phoebeisis

Walt,no problem.Heck the "fun-ness,new ness,quickness and Green ness,and different ness,1st on block ness" are all more important.Heck,I must be out of my mind because I'm seriously considering trading my Titan and $21,000- for one.I sure as heck won't figure-and don't want to know- the break even on that!
Thanks.Charlie

bean88

I just had a toyota hitch installed by the dealer (NW-suburbs of Chicago). I don't know what was in place before the installation but a harness now snakes from the hitch through a rubber grommet on the underside of the vehicle (driver side behind the rear wheelwell) and plugs into the vehicle wiring harness. I had to remove the black plastic tray located behind the wheelwell to access the harness. The parts list also indicated that a "converter" was necessary for the wiring. I am not sure what that is but there was a loose electrical device (looked like a big relay) also plugged into a different location of the harness. I suspect this was the converter because it was not secured to the vehicle (like everything else installed by the factory) even though there was mounting bracket attached. It was just hanging loose.
My understanding is that with all Highlanders, the converter is required for trailer wiring and I believe Toyota is the only source. The dealer parts department should be able to tell you what is needed. Hope this helps.

ulev

Is the hitch you mentioned a 'Class II ' hitch ?

Also, my dealer quoted a $450.00 price for the hitch + installation.

Comparable ?

bean88

I think it is a class III hitch with a 2" receiver. The decal on the hitch lists the towing capacity of 3500 lbs which corresponds with the capacity of the 4WD HH. I can't remember if the tongue weight was rated at 300 or 350. I made a deal for the hitch complete when I bought the HH so I only paid $250 installed. Look online and you can get the same Toyota hitch (Toyota # PT228-69045) for about $250 plus shipping. It is actually the same as the 2005 model hitch. It will take you 20-minutes to install the hitch and you do not have to drop the exhaust like you would with some other aftermarket hitches. You won't even need to jack up the car or remove anything.

The converter (# 08921-48860) can be had online for about $60. It will take you about 10-minutes to figure out how to remove the black plastic tray behind the wheel well then plugging the harness in will be easy. You can get a ball and ball mount from Toyota (mine came with it) or you can get it at Walmart for about $22 which is what I would have done if necessary.

I would have taken this route if the dealer wanted to charge me too much.

Hope this helps.

tpatin

I've read a number of messages on this forum that indicate how parts of the HH engine/motor system works. Does anyone know of a good web site that goes into some detail-- --preferably including diagrams-- --about how the whole HH system works?

Thanks :confuse:

phoebeisis

I spent some time on Toyota's site "studying' the HH.Side Curtain Air Bags and Side Airbags are an option on all other Highlanders-even Limiteds.It is standard on all HH's.Air Bag pks are about a $600-$1000 option on most vehicles,so the HH is actually about ~$800 less than it "appears" to be relative to a "normal" Highlander.There are certainly other extras,but the Airbag PK was the most significant to me.Toyota always mixes the Airbag PKS with other option pks,so you end up buying stuff you have no interest in.
If I'm wrong about the Limited gasoline Highlanders,set me straight!Charlie

tsotsi

I found a pretty good description of how the Prius works and apparently the HH is just a scaled up version. The gear ratios will be different, but the principle pretty much the same. I had to read it a couple of times before I started to get it.

http://home.earthlink.net/~graham1/MyToyotaPrius/Understanding/ContinuouslyVariableTransmi- ssion.htm

Kirstie_H

I get page not found - you might want to modifiy your link using the "url" tool below.

ccox2

One difference I understand from the Prius is that the accessories like the AC run off of the battery now, not off of the engine. That means that without turning on the car completely, the AC works just like the engine is turned on and running. The best site I found for how it works was Toyota's web site on the HH.

http://www.toyota.com/vehicles/minisite/hhybrid/hsd.html

ccox2

From what I have read here and other places, one of the main differences between the HH and other cars is the high voltage lines running throughout the car. Do any of these go underneath the car? In my Truck, I don't think twice about running through water about half way up the tires. I slow down and go on through. Is there any danger to the battery or high voltage electrical system doing this in the HH?

My HH should be here by Thursday or Friday. Are there any other Maintenance tips I should know about that apply specifically to Hybrids as opposed to regular cars??
Thanks

sky_king

I bought a Toyota Highlander Hybrid Ltd. on June 26th, just slightly below MSRP. The salesman gave me a bit of a break on the price as he remembered that I had bought two Rav 4s from him 3 years earlier. At my urging, he even threw in the hood protector and moonroof/sunroof deflector at no cost.
It's black with a tan leather interior and has all the options except for the navigation system which I couldn't see paying $2000 for. I'll just pick up one of those portable nav systems later.
Now comes the hard part...I have to wait 3-6 weeks for it.

otis1

Hey, if you bought a LMT model w/o nav, doesn't that mean you bought a "stripped" model since the nav was the only option on that car? you got a car with none of the options :P

I'm just kidding- good luck on your wait!

tsotsi

I'll try again. This website gives a lot of information on the Prius that also applies to the HH in a general way. The first time I gave the address it was too long for one line and when it wrapped around it inserted a comma, which of course was the wrong address. This time try:

http://home.earthlink.net/~graham1/MyToyotaPrius/Understanding/

and then click on "continuously variable transmission" It is pretty interesting.">link title

ulev

Thanks !!!

Great Info.

I think I will search out the items you have so conveniently defined...
I would just appreciate one more item...perhaps`a link to the web site where you found these items ? Performance auto ?? :confuse:
Thx !

bean88

Toyota parts people is just one source. BTW, the ball mount is a 2" drop. Walmart sells Reese brand ball mounts and balls for very reasonable prices.