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lets not give out false information.
"lets not give out false information."
Okay let me put this another way.. When I received quotes from multiple Virginia and Maryland dealers NONE of them highlighted a DC assessment fee on their OTD price which I had them breakdown. All of them had a dealer processing fee (200-300 in Virginia, $99 in Maryland).
So, the fact that a Maryland dealer is requiring you to pay a DC assessment fee when you do not live in DC, and the dealer is not located in DC seems strange to me.. I would not pay it...
That is because the DC assessment fee is built into the invoice. It's not an extra charge. Sites like Edmunds and Kelly BB do not calculate the regional assessment fee built into the invoice. That is why their invoice prices on the cars is always a few hundred lower then the actual invoice. That is a constant problem with customers, they think I am trying to rip them off, or they think I am showing them a "false" invoice.
My invoices have a New York assessment on them.
Also, for the record, I have purchased many a new vehicle in both VA and Maryland and have always used Edmunds or KBB invoice as a guide. The invoice prices have always matched up. Your point is very valid, just not in the case of a Maryland or VA dealer.
DC assessment fees
Ad fees
Dealers Daughter needs new braces fees
Dealers Wife's restauraunt is going under fees
Are all legal and legit (as long as they aren't discriminatory based on race religion or sex)
That said, a bottom line bid totalling 2800 off MSRP including $500 in various fees is still superior to a bid of $2000 off MSRP with no fees. Keep your eyes based on price.
Since this is a prices paid forum its notable the gal a few posts ago got a hatchback mazda 3 for almost $3000 off msrp (1200 under invoice?) and didn't seem to work too hard to get it. The Hatches seem to move slower here in Southern Ohio too. I have seen numerous 05's even on the lots.
--jjf
I recently purchased a Mazda 3 S with the following options: Automatic, Moonroof/6 CD changer, Side Air Bags and Side Curtains Package and wheel locks.
For the vehicle, I paid $18,700 (including destination). For Out the door, it came to $19,650. It was in Fairfax, Virginia, where the sales tax on cars is 3.20 percent.
It was very difficult to find a dealer that had the car with the options I wanted. I'd appreciate anyone's opinion on whether the price I paid was too high, too low, etc.
It is a regional assessment. I guess people in Maryland are in the DC region. The region is determined my Mazda North American Operations. I'm a CT dealer, and I am in the New York region. Everyone I sell a Mazda to that live in CT pays the NY assessment. It's an advertising fee Mazda build into the invoice.
As I said before, Mazda places it in the invoice, not the dealer. Every single Mazda sold in North America has a region assessment on it. Every one. So, if the vehicle is sold in Maryland, it's obviously in the DC region, therefor, anyone that purchases a Mazda there will pay the DC regional assessment, no matter where you live.
I get 19,900 for the car and dest.(MSRP?) and your are paying 21000 ...over msrp? or even invoice? This seems way too high unless I am missing something and not good. Keep it simple MSRP,invoice (if you know it) and then offer(s) with all fees.
Congrats on being froggy and faxing up to 400mi? round trip. Putting 10 -20 dealerships in a competitive bidding situation is the best way to get the lowest price on any commodity. Which is what new cars are. You should get 50 60% response rate Negotiating by phone # and talking to the Sales or Fleet Manager (not internet sales manager) 2-3 of them will prove to be the best and most eager. Emphasize to your responses you are getting bids from 10+ dealers and you are definitely buying before the month ends. You look forward to doing business with them. If they equivocate tell them you will definitely be buying by the end of the month and something like "Give me your best ""Im a sales manager who wants to book a low profit deal at the end of the month"" shot." Numerous may say what a waste of time it is.... they all pay the same price... etc.
As a general rule its better to get the names of the sales/fleet managers and direct your fax directly to them. Then negotiate by phone, not email. They may handle it personally taking a commission to a salesperson off the table if possible (good for you) or delegate it. Get the number to their personal fax line or the machine closest to them (if it differs from the fax #on the website or dealer locator) Narrowing it down to the best 2 or so dealers before you even walk into a dealership is smart.
In any event regardless of fees , if you find for example a NC dealer who bids 18,000 with all fees, and another who bids 18200 with all fees A1000 under invoice or more seems to be possible (especially the hatch). Many times dealers will let a few go for a no or low profit deal (or even a loss?) to savvy negotiators towards the end of the month of a popular seller to prove sales power and guarantee a continuing or increasing allotment of a popular seller. Good business sense. Numerous other reasons exist. Your canvassing a wide number helps you find the dealer(S) in such situations if they exist that month.
Keep in mind that despite invoice, Msrp and advertised dealer inscentives being public, you have no idea what their profit is on a machine.
In the last decade an increasing amount of profit on new cars has been in the form of unadvertised inscentives usually based on sales performance and customer satisfaction indexes. More than 70% of dealer profits come from used cars and the service dept.
I sold cars for a number of years, and many times found myself responding to customer objections with (as I was trained) "We gotta make something on this". If I had a $20 bill for every time I made this remark I'd be retired, whether I grossed $50 or $3000 on the deal, depending on how I read the customer.
Regards
--jjf
Just sent out faxed requests for bids to dealers a couple hundred miles in every direction from our home in North Carolina. Got what I think is a good bid from a Maryland dealer (details below, if anyone wants to analyze). But it includes a $240 "Washington D.C. Assessment fee" in addition to the $99 processing fee (which I know MD dealers charge). I can find no online reference to any such legitimate fee. In addition, I can't imagine why I'd have to pay anything to the District of Columbia when I'm buying a car in Maryland and when I live in North Carolina. I'd love to get everyone's feedback on whether this is legit.
Here's the deal:
5-door, Mazda3 S-GT base price: $18,135
Sunroof/Bose/6CD bundle: $1,148
Wheel locks: $32
Destination: $560
Tag and title: $83 (including $15 MD temp. license so I can drive it back to N.C.)
Processing: $99
Washington D.C. Assessment: $240
N.C. Highway use tax (this is def. legit; it's instead of sales tax): $632.07
Total out-the-door: $21,784.07
OTD minus tax, tag, title= $21,069
Thanks in advance for your insights.
--Vance
Vance-
I get 19,900 for the car and dest.(MSRP?) and your are paying 21000 ...over msrp? or even invoice? This seems way too high unless I am missing something and not good. Keep it simple MSRP,invoice (if you know it) and then offer(s) with all fees.
Congrats on being froggy and faxing up to 400mi? round trip. Putting 10 -20 dealerships in a competitive bidding situation is the best way to get the lowest price on any commodity. Which is what new cars are. You should get 50 60% response rate Negotiating by phone # and talking to the Sales or Fleet Manager (not internet sales manager) 2-3 of them will prove to be the best and most eager. Emphasize to your responses you are getting bids from 10+ dealers and you are definitely buying before the month ends. You look forward to doing business with them. If they equivocate tell them you will definitely be buying by the end of the month and something like "Give me your best ""Im a sales manager who wants to book a low profit deal at the end of the month"" shot." Numerous may say what a waste of time it is.... they all pay the same price... etc.
As a general rule its better to get the names of the sales/fleet managers and direct your fax directly to them. Then negotiate by phone, not email. They may handle it personally taking a commission to a salesperson off the table if possible (good for you) or delegate it. Get the number to their personal fax line or the machine closest to them (if it differs from the fax #on the website or dealer locator) Narrowing it down to the best 2 or so dealers before you even walk into a dealership is smart.
In any event regardless of fees , if you find for example a NC dealer who bids 18,000 with all fees, and another who bids 18200 with all fees A is greater than B and the choice is simple, unless we have to drive 400mi to save $200... not cool.
Getting the total emphasizing with ALL fees (itemized) and everything is good anyway lest we drive 200 mi and get a nasty $500 "Dealers daughter needs expensive dentalwork fee" or such by the F&I guy who knows you drove a long way and trys a fast one. Rare but not so rare either.
DC assessment fees
Ad fees
Dealers Horsetrack losses fees
Dealers Wife's restauraunt is going under fees
Are all legal and legit (as long as they aren't discriminatory based on race religion or sex)
They may be itemized, included in his offer hidden or non existent. If they want to compete they will drop the fees or lower the price and keep the fees. It doesn't matter What matters is lowest price OTD. (sales tax or hwy tax from your state is a constant)
Bid one off the other and see if any are especially eager the last 4 days of the month with any callbacks.
If one dealer proposes a 18000 offer + 600 in processing and title fees etc, this is obviously superior to a 18900 offer with no fees for the same car. (To get silly a 10,000 offer with $8100 in fees is the best to demonstrate a point)
IF you truly get a standout deal far away and your requirements arent exacting obviously offer your business to get some of the locals to meet or beat it. Emphasize they will be stop one for all service (where most dealership profits are anyway) and to all they will get the highest customer satisfaction score for any surveys on this purchase you can provide. (Don't underestimate this)
When you finally walk in to the 1-2 standouts don't be afraid to walk out and sleep on it. If they are close by. Especially if we have a few days left in the month (Anyone responsible spending a lot of money would do so no? , or "that Focus is a helluva lot cheaper and may meet my needs" )If they say the offer will vaporize, good for this minute only if you walk out, give a amused smile as you graduated kiddiegarten long ago)
You may get a cell call within the next few days with a lower bid for your business, or a salesman stopping you in the parking lot with a lower offer. And you can always walk right back in and accept immediately or in a day or two. As long as its before "witching hour " (end of month).
The mazda 3 sedan seems to be more popular than the hatch, and 1000 under invoice or more seems to be possible (especially the hatch). Many times dealers will let a few go for a no or low profit deal (or even a loss?) to savvy negotiators towards the end of the month of a popular seller to prove sales power and guarantee a continuing or increasing allotment of a popular seller. Good business sense. Numerous other reasons exist. Your canvassing a wide number helps you find the dealer(S) in such situations if they exist that month.
Keep in mind that despite invoice, Msrp and advertised dealer inscentives being public, you have no idea what their profit is on a machine.
In the last decade an increasing amount of profit on new cars has been in the form of unadvertised inscentives usually based on sales performance and customer satisfaction indexes. More than 70% of dealer profits come from used cars and the service dept.
I sold cars for a number of years, and many times found myself responding to customer objections with (as I was trained) "We gotta make something on this". If I had a $20 bill for every time I made this remark I'd be retired, whether I grossed $50 or $3000 on the deal, depending on how I read the customer.
Regards
--jjf
Just sent out faxed requests for bids to dealers a couple hundred miles in every direction from our home in North Carolina. Got what I think is a good bid from a Maryland dealer (details below, if anyone wants to analyze). But it includes a $240 "Washington D.C. Assessment fee" in addition to the $99 processing fee (which I know MD dealers charge). I can find no online reference to any such legitimate fee. In addition, I can't imagine why I'd have to pay anything to the District of Columbia when I'm buying a car in Maryland and when I live in North Carolina. I'd love to get everyone's feedback on whether this is legit.
Here's the deal:
5-door, Mazda3 S-GT base price: $18,135
Sunroof/Bose/6CD bundle: $1,148
Wheel locks: $32
Destination: $560
Tag and title: $83 (including $15 MD temp. license so I can drive it back to N.C.)
Processing: $99
Washington D.C. Assessment: $240
N.C. Highway use tax (this is def. legit; it's instead of sales tax): $632.07
Total out-the-door: $21,784.07
OTD minus tax, tag, title= $21,069
Thanks in advance for your insights.
--Vance
The Sandman :confuse: :confuse: :confuse:
1. For mazda owners, how reliable is the car?
2. I wanted to get the same features and options the civic ex has into the mazda 3 hatch, so I was thinkin the S Touring (AT) with only the moonroof package(for now). After calculating this on mazda's site it comes to a little over 20k (not too bad for all the options and safety features i guess).
3.If any of you own this type of setup listed above, how much did you end up paying?
4. I guess in the longrun the mazda is a couple thou cheaper? *oh no minor venting period ahead*: Since the CA amongst other dealers think its an excellent idea to markup the civic with rediculus numbers-23,999+tax+tags+emissions+docfees+whatever else they can think of tacking on the OTDP- I can understand a little bit of a markup but yuck.) I dunno anymore
5. I really love the hatch, and can't stand regular trunks(you can fit so much more) but I like the civic ex.
well i guess my whole point is i need some guidance or something. Have a good day everyone .
And if you like hatches much better, I think you just about made your mind up.
I had a 3 hatch for a month (coincidence rental from Enterprise). I liked it and probably would have gotten one if I could go back in time - especially the fact you had a remote release for the trunk (unlike the sedan)
I am planning to purchase a 2006 mazda 3i Touring within the next week. The only add-ons: Auto tranny and an ABS package (maybe the moonroof package if I afford it). Went to Koeppel Mazda in NY and got quoted 16,800 which included a $200 NY Assessment Fee (is that fee actually something legit?).
Is that a good deal or should I be trying to get the one with the moonroof for the same price??
Any info you could give me would really help out. Thanks.
2.3L ENGINE BADGE [BDG]
CARGO NET [CGN]
SIRIUS SATELLITE RADIO [SAT]
WHEEL LOCKS [WLK]
PWR SLIDING MOONROOF & IN-DASH 6-DISC CD CHANGER PKG [1MC]
FRONT SIDE-IMPACT AIRBAGS & FRONT/REAR SIDE AIR CURTAINS [2AB]
this seems way to high. I can get s-pricing for 18688. Was wondering how much lower I showed ask.also should I wait for the 2007 model and how is the depreciation on these cars?
thanks for any info you can offer
If you need a target to shoot for, (not the best way to do it) shoot for 1200 off invoice and get the best you can.
Best if you get 10-15 competitive quotes last week of the month. Helpful if you are flexible on colors/options.
1)Go to fightingchance.com Get Braggs kit on your car, maybe buy his book. ($34.00 and well worth it)This should help you before EOM.
2)Later go to library or Amazon (may be updated) and read the classic (1981)"Don't get taken every time" by Remar Sutton.
Been in the business and it is the most accurate description I've read. Fun read too.
Do this and you will know more than 99% of new car buyers out there. Do your studying and know how to buy a car for life.
--jjf
msrp was 20230 but he stated I'll knock it to 19138+ fees(1428)so out the door was 20566. Tax in state is 6.25. I just wanted to see what they would offer. I knew I could get s-pricing.
The bottom line is they quoted me 20,989.44 OTD.
Here are the fees they listed:
18,500 or the car
199.00 for VIN etching (which i wanted for insurance purposes)
12.50 Waste tire fee
150 Registration
10 inspection
45 dealer fee
Are there are hidden charges in there somewhere because this doesn't seem to add up? Could they have possibly added the finance charge from the bank to this maybe?
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I may be wrong but a lot of dealers only have the cahones to ask $50 for the VIN etching.
--jjf
From CarMax - 2005 Mazda 6
27,000 mileage. AC/power steering/air bags/power windows/power seats/alloy wheels/ABS brakes/AMFM CD system/power locks/power mirrors/cruise control/auto. transmission. 100% OK by AutoCheck.
no haggle price of $15,998.
Once they had the Mazda3's back in(Today 8/20/06), it was NOW $200 over invoice! How convienient. Never shop there.
How does this sound?
Lee
The bright side to this whole thing is I paid a visit to Wantagh Mazda who only had an S Touring but guess what folks? It cost me less than the S once it was all written up AND i got wheel locks!!! 21,500 and I'm out the door! Picking it up tomorrow and can't wait!!!!
Can you usually get as good a deal on an order as one that's on the lot?
How long does a car usually take to arrive once ordered?
I'd like to have financing arranged before negotiating price. Should I arrange financing before I go into the dealer when ordering or wait until a couple of weeks before the car arrives?
How much of a deposit is "normal"?
Thanks in advance. I'm new to car buying and these forums are a great resource.
-Brian
Tell them you are looking for the best price out of 10 dealers you're contacting on your ordered car with whatever. Give others the chance to compete on lowest price iteratively. Take the final lowest price (with dealer fees, taxes, title...OTD) Simple.
Perhaps the low bid has one on the lot like it or close and can transfer it too. This gets more likely as sept-oct rolls around.
Since it is not sitting on anyones lot an ordered car has no floor plan interest or anything on the sale. So certainly no extra charge. I would think an ordered car should have a 2-8wk wait. (If shipped from far east? where are M3's made?) Depends on where in the supply chain it is.
Getting your financing straight soon is obviously good, although I don't know how long the terms will hold.
I would put 500-1000 on credit card deposit for an order. Its easier to dispute if something comes up. Perhaps they want some cash unrefundable but I would negotiate the best terms I could get.
Happy hunting
--jjf
a) the precise model,
b) your preferred options,
c) the date by which the car is needed,
d) the action if you are not totally satisfied.
Stating the delivery date prevents you being held hostage waiting for a car that has "not yet arrived, but will be here soon." Since the Mazda3 is manufactured in Japan you should expect several months wait. If there is an interruption (as happened last year due to a major fire in the factory and as happened this year due to an incredible ship wreck) you may be waiting far longer (4 to 6 months?). Consider including a clause in the contract like "the car as described herein must be delivered prior to Dec 1, 2006 or a full refund will be provided". Dealerships obviously want you to have a car, however, they cannot control all the circumstances and so you need to protect yourself in case you want to back out of the deal.
-Brian
Be careful with that advise. Mazda3's are made in Japan. From the time you order until it is on the dealer lot is roughly 14-18 weeks. Dealers only place allocations once a month, for Mazda, it usually runs in the middle of the month. If you order a Mazda3 late in the month, it will not get placed until mid following month.
This time frame would only change if you happen to reserve an incoming car already allocated to the dealer, and that depends on where it is. If it's on the water, its anywhere from 8-3 weeks.
Just some advise for all of you wanting '07 Mazda3's, some are here, I am already sold out of '07's, and the rest are not due until the end of September, early October. Most of the 2006 inventory is already gone.
2006 Mazda3i
Automatic
A/C
Cargo Mat
Cargo Net
Door Guards
MSRP $16,230
Invoice $15,119
Plus I received a Platinum detailing package and free oil change
Wrote a check for $16,000 OTD (NJ 7% tax included)
I basically got the car almost $200 under invoice with NO FEES. I think I got a pretty good deal, what do you think?
(I entered similar email yesterday on the "Mazda 3:Official 2007 U.S. Info" forum but found this would be the more appropriate site.)
I want to make a single figure (OTD)out-the-door offer and let the dealer distribute the amount of the check to whatever "fees" or "actual price of the car" that he wants to. I'm not wanting to get into the negotiate this/negotiate that.
Considering any appropriate fees; tax,title,license; destination; holdback/other dealer's profit; PLUS THE FACT I want the car for as little cost to me as possible, but a REASONABLE, FAIR profit for the dealer, WHAT WOULD BE CONSIDERED A FAIR o-t-d OFFER??
The only figures I have right now are --
MSRP $19,275 (anyone know the Invoice??)
Dest. 560
Opts./ 1,700 (appx. based on 2006 invoice)
Acces.
Would this FAIR PRICE I am seeking
offering Invoice for car; Invoice for Opts./Acces.; tax,title,license PLUS destination
I may have to order my specific car as there are few on the lets already. Any advice on the ordering procedure?? (deposit, etc.)
I would appreciate several replies, from both shoppers, buyers AND dealers. Thanks in advance.
I want to make a single figure (OTD)out-the-door offer and let the dealer distribute the amount of the check to whatever "fees" or "actual price of the car" that he wants to. I'm not wanting to get into the negotiate this/negotiate that.
Would this FAIR PRICE I am seeking consist of:
Invoice (for car)
Invoice (for options/accessories)
Destination
Tax/title/license
Should I offer even lower due to various sources of dealer profit?? (i.e. holdback, etc.)
I would appreciate several replies, from both shoppers, buyers AND dealers. Thanks in advance.
in PA, 7% tax and 145 transaction fee.
Is it a resasonable price, though higher than I thought for a compact car.
$18,500 plus 8.8% tax ($1628) plus about $280 for title and registration would be $20,408.
It looks like they threw in over $1000 in bogus fees somewhere. Invoice on that model with options would be $18,929 so the price of $18,500 looks good (assuming you got an automatic, if not subtract $855) but they screwed you with added fees. Sorry.
'duff
Always cheat the customer by saying they have the car you are looking for, but when you get there , they will rip u off by selling you another crappy car.
What is a fair price for a 3i with a/c only or a 3i touring with no options (if I can find one in the next couple weeks)?
Any help would be appreciated
Can you go lower?
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Hey, I appreciate the information. I have one more question if you don't mind. Your information seems accurate because even the calculations I was coming up with seemed questionable. Your tax percentage is definitely correct. I was wondering how you got the licensing fee info, where can I see the actual break down, and can I dispute the charge? I made the purchase Saturday, August 28, 2006.
Thanks,
Joe
I took the license fee info from the Edmunds loan calculator which seems to pretty reasonable maybe give or take a hundred bucks. I don't have a breakdown for you.
Some one more an expert than me would be able to answer your question about disputing the charges but my gut feeling is that once you signed the dotted line you probably won't be able to dispute it. Unless they mischarged for taxes or registration, any documentation fees, dealer prep fees, owner's daughter's college fund fee, etc. are legal.
-'duff