that newswire1 link mentions kiamedia.com. To log in there, you are supposed to be a 'journalist.' Turns out the ID is kiamedia and password is optima.
There are some preliminary specifications - fairly detailed ones - there if you poke around.
WOW...Just like the high-tech 3.5L in the current KIA Sedona that has 195 HP @ 5500 RPM and 218 lb-ft @ 3500 while the same size Odyssey engine has 255 HP @ 5750 RPM and 250 lb-ft @ 5000 RPM?
The higher powered Odyssey also has MUCH better gas mileage than the Sedona.
I'm not sure of your point. Your comparing your Oddly to the '02-'05 Sedona. This thread is about the redesigned '06. It appears the Sedona is going to take alot of sales away from Honda and Toyota.
BTW, from what I've read on the Minivan gas mileage thread, doesnt seem like the Oddlies get much better real world gas mileage than the Sedona.
KIA high-tech engines are NOT fuel efficient as indicated by the comparison of the KIA 3.5L V6 to the Honda 3.5L V6 (which, by the way, has more HP than the new 2006 KIA 3.8L V6).
BTW, the 1999 Odyssey EX delivered the BEST average MPG of the long term minivans tested by Edmunds.
Hopefully, KIA will have improved the performance and fuel economy of the engines for 2006. If KIA does, they will become a more competitive product.
Ha! I'm a CS major with an interest in computer security, so I'm always amused when someone protects a "secure" site with a bad password. Did you guess that, or did someone tell you?
Anyway, the new Sedona looks pretty impressive. In my opinion, the exterior styling is as good as or better than the similar Sienna and Odyssey. The features list looks impressive, too. I noticed the press release says that the weight will be "less" than the current model, but it doesn't say how much less. I hope it's hundreds of pounds and not, like, three. The current one is really a van'o'steel, which is kind of cool really, but the fuel economy is abysmal.
I typically get 18 city and as high as 23 in all highway driving(with no A/C). Compared to most other minivans its fairly typical. Most Sienna and Oddly owners report similar number.
Bottom line: the list of reasons why people don't choose Sedona as their minivan has shrunk considerably. <<
I does look impressive. However I think they are making a mistake in a brand new model w/ no available navigation (Unless I am missing something on their press release). Especially when it seems like they have added just about everything else. It seems like NAV is becoming more and more popular with Minivan buyers, many of whom are doing road trips frequently. Hyundai (sister company) is offering it in the new Sonata, so they can do it. It's still a big leap over the current offering, and will sell a lot more, but no NAV will be one reason for some to cross it off the shopping list
Sure, the current 3.5L Sedona engine makes less HP - by quite a bit - and less torque - by not a whole lot - than the competition's 3.5L motors. Still, this motor clearly has the high-tech pieces, save VVT-- 24 valves, DOHC, etc.
And we aren't talking about the '02-05 Sedona engine, anyway.
Are you forgetting that the '99 Odyssey did not have anywhere near 255 HP when it debuted? I believe the number was 205 or 210.
And Sedona is already competitive enough to be doing quite well in the U.S. minivan market. Not sure if you have noticed that. The '06 Sedona appears to have Kia poised to gain even more minivan market share, and compete with the big boys even more on product and less on value than in the past.
hansienna, you seem to be ignoring most of the real-world fuel economy findings from Sedona owners. The numbers are typically better, oftentimes MUCH better, than the EPA ratings. I think this is one reason why the EPA ratings were bumped upward slightly - in '03 or '04, I can't remember exactly when.
I'm not sure that VCM is all that it's hyped up to be, either. CR tested a Sienna and estimates it'll cost less to fuel up each year, and it doesn't have VCM.
Perhaps Honda is an expert at fooling the EPA in their tests.
it said Echo gets 37/42 but in real test from motorweek it was 35mpg. Kia rio's epa rating is 29/32 but same real test resulted 34mpg.
So Rio and Echo was pretty much same in real life. if you check the any test Drive Kia and Hyundai gets relatively higher mpg than epa rated and Honda and Toyotas get much real life mpg than EPA ratings.
One more before sienna, Sedona was second to oddyssey in Acceleration even though it is hundres pound heavier and Sedona also has very good braking distance.
Oddssy higher hp does not really reflect on performance as other Hondas. And Oddssy requires PREMIUM GAS which make Honda to increase 15-30 more hp. see Altima's engine.
The engine appears to be mounted front-to-back, not sideways as is the norm for FWD minivans. I suppose it could just be cosmetic confusion. Or it could be anticipation of AWD?
Im thinking that would be very hoakey indeed to misrepresent an engine's orientation, but it seems the most logical answer. Note that the intake cover on the current Sedona implies the correct latitudinal layout.
Here's a speculative thought: the same 3.8 engine goes into the 06 Sorento, so Kia is standardizing for an AWD application which the Sedona may use later. Certainly you can make a latitudinal engine adapt to AWD but it seems that longitudinal is a bit easier if starting with a "clean sheet of paper". I believe the current Sorento engine (same 3.5 as the current Sedona) has an intake cover that implies it's correct longitudinal layout. Kia, so far, has displayed honesty in Engine Orientation Representation.
I think the old engine was iron and the new one is Aluminum which right there could knock off 100 lbs. I'm thinking the mileage may go up 1 or 2 MPG, because of a lighter total weight, engine technology improvement and maybe Kia figuring out the EPA game a little better. A similar case was the Mazda MPV getting higher MPG with the displacement/hp increase in 2002. In the Sedona case we get a weight drop too.
The position of the oil fill cap(traditionally in a valve cover indicates the engine is still mounted laterally(sideways). I suspect the plastic engine cover is nothing more than astetics and a little confusing.
Not only does it look like a good alternative but if it lives up to expectations it will put some pricing pressure on the segment.
To me it looks like a 90% Odyssey - similar styling, dimensions, features and power. It may not be quite there yet but it's getting a lot closer. The price and 100K warranty will have to leave a lot of prospective buyers at least considering it.
IMO, it looks(appearance) more like a sienna with power that is comparable to ody! but it is going to be a great alternative of both ody/sienna in terms of price and feature! it the only "mivi-van" with 6 bolts (for loads?), 5-speed with manual mode (sport-mode? tiptronic? whatever the name is), any other unique features?
Is the horsepower really 240 or is that an estimate? I am puzzled because the 3.3l engine in the Sonata is said to have an estimated 237 horsepower (according to hyundaisonata.com).
Only 3 horsepower difference between a 3.3 and a 3.8?
I presume the 3.8 is the same one going into the Hyundai Azera as well? (replacement for XG350).
I believe the replacement for the XG350 will be called the TG Granduer.
As for the 3.8, true it may not have all that much more horsepower that the 3.3 but consider one thing first. Minivans arent about horsepower. Its about torque and there is no replacement for cubic inches in this regard. expect the torque figured to be significantly greater on the 3.8.
A while back, the word was there would be a short and long version of the new Sedona. I even read that the short would be introduced first. Then the long version showed at the Chicago auto show. I'm wondering if the short version got canned?
I am so thankful I stumbled across this thread before I committed to buying a 2005 DC T&C Touring!
We had driven DC minivans for 12 years before going down in size to a 2005 Subaru Forester XS last July. It is really a great car for our local driving, but my wife and I find it just a bit too small for our long trips from Florida up North, so we were thinking seriously about swallowing the loss of trading too soon and getting back into a minivan.
Only the T&C Touring offered the mix of options closest to what we wanted and needed (Trailer Tow group, even though we never tow, for the HD stuff, adjustable pedals, leather group and side curtain airbags. Nothing more). So I was THIS close to putting down a deposit and ordering one.
We tried the Sedona back when it first came out and were really impressed by the quality, features and value for money, but it was just a bit too small for our wants. Now that we have seen the 2006 Sedona pics and read the preliminary specs, we have decided to wait and try one before committing to anything. We are even willing to take the risk inherent in buying an early production car if Kia can offer an EX with leather, adjustable pedals, ESP and TCS for around the same price (or hopefully even less) than a DC T&C with its more primitive engine, transmission and suspension. We really don't need disappearing second row seats.
The only turn-off we see in the pics is that the radio and HVAC control displays are no longer illuminated characters on a dark background (as are those in DC minivans) but are black LCDs on a green background. We have that latter setup on our Forester and find the characters hard to read in full daylight, besides being just butt-ugly!
But the ability to play MP3s would be most welcome. None of the music we like is available on CDs, anyway.
Another thing I notice in the pics of the interior of the new Sedona is that the armrests appear to be padded, a nice touch that I don't remember in the 2005 DC T&C I test drove.
An interesting bit of errata in the pics posted on the Chicago Auto Show web site is the remark about a removable (on rollers) third row seat.
tomorrow hyundai will unveil at NY replacement for XG350 with new 3.8L-V6 (autoweek.com). Isn't this the same engine in new Sedona? Anyway, I like to see Sedona with 265-hp, that would help compete better will Sienna or Odyssey.
Even the preliminary spec of 240 hp in the Sedona will be more than ample. I have noticed that the same engine used in different vehicles often carries differing hp/torque ratings, sometimes due to tuning for different uses and sometimes due to no more than restrictions arising from a more convoluted and restricted exhaust system.
Our 2002 Sedona has rubberized armrests. They aren't rock-hard, but they sure aren't what I'd call 'padded.' The armrests in my parents' 2003 Sedona are leather-covered and nicely padded. This was one of a few minor but noticeable improvements Kia made on the 2003 Sedona. The other that stands out in my mind is the addition of a gas cap holder.
Designers Take Note! Shiny chrome and shiny surfaces in the front driving area reflect light. A lot of it. So don't put shiny chrome that will reflect sunlight in the drivers eyes! OK? Thank you
Honda Odyssey EX (cloth) Dodge Grand Caravan SXT Caravan SXT
Our minivan MUST have separately controlled temperature for driver and front passenger. Honda added it to the Odyssey for 2005. KIA is reportedly going to add it to ALL 2006 Sedonas.
IF the 2006 KIA Sedona lives up to pre-introduction hype, my choice for a 2006 minivan would probably be:
KIA Sedona LX or EX Honda Odyssey EX (cloth) Dodge Grand Caravan SXT Dodge Caravan SXT
Although the Toyota Sienna is a very nice, reliable minivan, it does not have Dual Zone temp unless one pays over $31,000 and the 2nd row seats are not comfortable for me.
I'm thinking more of the EX-L for me (mainly for the VCM where I can get 28 MPG). The MDX is an option, as it should be up for a redesign by then and I can get the current gen for cheap. It's not as roomy or efficient though...
In my Odyssey right now, (2002 EX) I can get 26-27 Highway if I drive conservatively and set the cruise control, so 28-29 MPG should be realistic for the VCM version.
One thing to note with the VCM is that it has a shorter top gear than the non VCM model, so you are revving higher and burning more fuel when the VCM is not being used, such as going up hills or driving 80 mph. Under ideal conditions it will certainly get better mpg than the non-VCM, but in normal real world driving it is probably not much better- if any.
I will be very interested in seeing what kind of EPA numbers the Sedona gets.
2006 Sedona will be lighter with more power than 2005 Sedona and is reported to have considerably better gas mileage. Sedona may steal sales from ALL other brands if pre-production information is correct.
Comments
There are some preliminary specifications - fairly detailed ones - there if you poke around.
The higher powered Odyssey also has MUCH better gas mileage than the Sedona.
I'm not sure of your point. Your comparing your Oddly to the '02-'05 Sedona. This thread is about the redesigned '06. It appears the Sedona is going to take alot of sales away from Honda and Toyota.
BTW, from what I've read on the Minivan gas mileage thread, doesnt seem like the Oddlies get much better real world gas mileage than the Sedona.
Craig
'04 Sedona EX
BTW, the 1999 Odyssey EX delivered the BEST average MPG of the long term minivans tested by Edmunds.
Hopefully, KIA will have improved the performance and fuel economy of the engines for 2006. If KIA does, they will become a more competitive product.
Anyway, the new Sedona looks pretty impressive. In my opinion, the exterior styling is as good as or better than the similar Sienna and Odyssey. The features list looks impressive, too. I noticed the press release says that the weight will be "less" than the current model, but it doesn't say how much less. I hope it's hundreds of pounds and not, like, three. The current one is really a van'o'steel, which is kind of cool really, but the fuel economy is abysmal.
-Andrew L
I typically get 18 city and as high as 23 in all highway driving(with no A/C). Compared to most other minivans its fairly typical. Most Sienna and Oddly owners report similar number.
Craig
'04 Sedona EX
I does look impressive. However I think they are making a mistake in a brand new model w/ no available navigation (Unless I am missing something on their press release). Especially when it seems like they have added just about everything else. It seems like NAV is becoming more and more popular with Minivan buyers, many of whom are doing road trips frequently. Hyundai (sister company) is offering it in the new Sonata, so they can do it. It's still a big leap over the current offering, and will sell a lot more, but no NAV will be one reason for some to cross it off the shopping list
Sure, the current 3.5L Sedona engine makes less HP - by quite a bit - and less torque - by not a whole lot - than the competition's 3.5L motors. Still, this motor clearly has the high-tech pieces, save VVT-- 24 valves, DOHC, etc.
And we aren't talking about the '02-05 Sedona engine, anyway.
Are you forgetting that the '99 Odyssey did not have anywhere near 255 HP when it debuted? I believe the number was 205 or 210.
And Sedona is already competitive enough to be doing quite well in the U.S. minivan market. Not sure if you have noticed that. The '06 Sedona appears to have Kia poised to gain even more minivan market share, and compete with the big boys even more on product and less on value than in the past.
Perhaps Honda is an expert at fooling the EPA in their tests.
-juice
it is true that EPA is not trustworthy.
it said Echo gets 37/42 but in real test from motorweek it was 35mpg. Kia rio's epa rating is 29/32 but same real test resulted 34mpg.
So Rio and Echo was pretty much same in real life. if you check the any test Drive Kia and Hyundai gets relatively higher mpg than epa rated and Honda and Toyotas get much real life mpg than EPA ratings.
One more before sienna, Sedona was second to oddyssey in Acceleration even though it is hundres pound heavier and Sedona also has very good braking distance.
Oddssy higher hp does not really reflect on performance as other Hondas. And Oddssy requires PREMIUM GAS which make Honda to increase 15-30 more hp. see Altima's engine.
length-202,----- 194.1,--- 200.5,---201,-----200
width--78.3,------74.6,----78.6,----77.1,----77.4
height 69.3-------69.3-----68.6,----70,------68.9
wheelbase 118.9,--114.6,---119.3----118.1---119.3
cargo---147-------128-------168------145-----149
hp------240(est)--195-------215------255-----230
tq------250+(est)--218------245------250-----242
http://www.autoweek.com/files/specials/2005_chicago/sedona/pages/- - z21Sedona.htm
The engine appears to be mounted front-to-back, not sideways as is the norm for FWD minivans. I suppose it could just be cosmetic confusion. Or it could be anticipation of AWD?
Jaz
Previews say good things, it's a lot lighter despite being bigger, and a lot more powerful than the outgoing van.
-juice
Here's a speculative thought: the same 3.8 engine goes into the 06 Sorento, so Kia is standardizing for an AWD application which the Sedona may use later. Certainly you can make a latitudinal engine adapt to AWD but it seems that longitudinal is a bit easier if starting with a "clean sheet of paper". I believe the current Sorento engine (same 3.5 as the current Sedona) has an intake cover that implies it's correct longitudinal layout. Kia, so far, has displayed honesty in Engine Orientation Representation.
I think the old engine was iron and the new one is Aluminum which right there could knock off 100 lbs. I'm thinking the mileage may go up 1 or 2 MPG, because of a lighter total weight, engine technology improvement and maybe Kia figuring out the EPA game a little better. A similar case was the Mazda MPV getting higher MPG with the displacement/hp increase in 2002. In the Sedona case we get a weight drop too.
Jaz
-juice
Craig
'04 Sedona EX
Craig, your are correct. Good observation.
To me it looks like a 90% Odyssey - similar styling, dimensions, features and power. It may not be quite there yet but it's getting a lot closer. The price and 100K warranty will have to leave a lot of prospective buyers at least considering it.
Jaz
it the only "mivi-van" with 6 bolts (for loads?), 5-speed with manual mode (sport-mode? tiptronic? whatever the name is), any other unique features?
-juice
Only 3 horsepower difference between a 3.3 and a 3.8?
I presume the 3.8 is the same one going into the Hyundai Azera as well? (replacement for XG350).
As for the 3.8, true it may not have all that much more horsepower that the 3.3 but consider one thing first. Minivans arent about horsepower. Its about torque and there is no replacement for cubic inches in this regard. expect the torque figured to be significantly greater on the 3.8.
Craig
'04 Sedona EX
Horsepowers figures are kind of like a first impression. For example, take into account Honda and Nissan's horsepower war over the Accord and Altima.
This 3.8l is already being used in the domestic market Equus 'luxury sedan'. I think I heard that the Equus has 280 horsepower.
-juice
Jaz
-juice
We had driven DC minivans for 12 years before going down in size to a 2005 Subaru Forester XS last July. It is really a great car for our local driving, but my wife and I find it just a bit too small for our long trips from Florida up North, so we were thinking seriously about swallowing the loss of trading too soon and getting back into a minivan.
Only the T&C Touring offered the mix of options closest to what we wanted and needed (Trailer Tow group, even though we never tow, for the HD stuff, adjustable pedals, leather group and side curtain airbags. Nothing more). So I was THIS close to putting down a deposit and ordering one.
We tried the Sedona back when it first came out and were really impressed by the quality, features and value for money, but it was just a bit too small for our wants. Now that we have seen the 2006 Sedona pics and read the preliminary specs, we have decided to wait and try one before committing to anything. We are even willing to take the risk inherent in buying an early production car if Kia can offer an EX with leather, adjustable pedals, ESP and TCS for around the same price (or hopefully even less) than a DC T&C with its more primitive engine, transmission and suspension. We really don't need disappearing second row seats.
The only turn-off we see in the pics is that the radio and HVAC control displays are no longer illuminated characters on a dark background (as are those in DC minivans) but are black LCDs on a green background. We have that latter setup on our Forester and find the characters hard to read in full daylight, besides being just butt-ugly!
But the ability to play MP3s would be most welcome. None of the music we like is available on CDs, anyway.
http://www.chicagoautoshow.com/neatstuff/photogalleries/gallery.asp?GALLERY_ID=52
An interesting bit of errata in the pics posted on the Chicago Auto Show web site is the remark about a removable (on rollers) third row seat.
Kia Sedona
Toyota Sienna
Honda Odyssey
DCX vans
A numerous number of crossovers.
Any word about pricing for the Sedona?
Isn't this the same engine in new Sedona?
Anyway, I like to see Sedona with 265-hp, that would help compete better will Sienna or Odyssey.
240hp seems somewhat conservative based on the other specs given for that engine. 265hp seems more likely.
Our 2002 Sedona has rubberized armrests. They aren't rock-hard, but they sure aren't what I'd call 'padded.' The armrests in my parents' 2003 Sedona are leather-covered and nicely padded. This was one of a few minor but noticeable improvements Kia made on the 2003 Sedona. The other that stands out in my mind is the addition of a gas cap holder.
-juice
Thank you
Try black electrical tape, perhaps.
-juice
Honda Odyssey EX (cloth)
Dodge Grand Caravan SXT
Caravan SXT
Our minivan MUST have separately controlled temperature for driver and front passenger. Honda added it to the Odyssey for 2005. KIA is reportedly going to add it to ALL 2006 Sedonas.
IF the 2006 KIA Sedona lives up to pre-introduction hype, my choice for a 2006 minivan would probably be:
KIA Sedona LX or EX
Honda Odyssey EX (cloth)
Dodge Grand Caravan SXT
Dodge Caravan SXT
Although the Toyota Sienna is a very nice, reliable minivan, it does not have Dual Zone temp unless one pays over $31,000 and the 2nd row seats are not comfortable for me.
CR's tests had lower annual fuel costs for their Sienna than their Ody with the tecnology.
So maybe it's more hype than substance.
-juice
I will be very interested in seeing what kind of EPA numbers the Sedona gets.
Sedona may steal sales from ALL other brands if pre-production information is correct.
-juice