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It's not bigoted. It's actually kind of sad that minorites have to have stuff like this mandated or "given" rather than earned like everyone else. I'm a minority and I have three auto loans in my name. I have the 1.9% special on my Civic SI, and the Honda special lease rate on my Ody and EX-L. I didn't need anything given to me. I fought off the finance guy just like any other informed consumer would.
Heck, the car business needs those people. They make it possible for me to get my EX-L with all accessories for a 22300 cap cost 123000 residual 360 month total pymnt. While they pay straight sticker at 15% interest. You can't protect the ignorant from themselves.
On second thought, I didn't mean to insult my son's diaper.
That class of car is called a "B/C" car isn't it Andre? Little bigger than a B (Focus), and a little smaller than a C (Taurus), IIRC. And Ford believed the Contour failed because of the size, which works great at a HUGE car in Europe, but over on this side of the drink, it's too small and too big. Personally I felt it failed because it tended to go to crap after about 80,000 miles myself, but Ford thought it had no market in that size, from what I have read.
In any case, the thought that dealers might be trying to um... dishonorably (since it's not illegal and only arguably immoral)... strikes me with a big "duh". It doesn't take racism.
==
The Temple of VTEC has SUT spyshots.
http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=255729
I'm not sure why I shouldn't expect it to share the Baja's fate, and I hope its development didn't negatively affect the development of cars more true to Honda's identity. Good luck to it though.
That's a little vague, so I'm only guessing here, fin, ok? First, no I haven't heard of this before. Second, this statement from the dealer/tech could mean two things in my experience with my former Honda. 1) Honda seems to build from the inside out, so though repairs are rarely needed, when you do, you may have to peel off several layers of components to get to the offending part. OR: It could be like a bad harness or something, OR EVEN, like the multi-components under the hood, there are a LOT of relays, switches and capaciters in a Honda, and perhaps whatever shorted out, blew a ton of subcomponents. Hard to tell....
http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=255829
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In reality though, I guess today a Focus probably is about the same size as a Contour was. The difference though, is that a Focus gets most of its interior volume from height, whereas there was a bit more stretch-out room in the Contour. Contour might've been a bit wider inside, too. And I think shoulder room is usually the one dimension that usually makes a car feel bigger or smaller inside. After all, legroom usually doesn't vary too much from car to car, as most cars, regardless of size class usually have around 41-43" of legroom up front, and probably 35-39" in back (although the tiniest cars might have around 29-30"). But shoulder room, I've seen vary from something like 49-50" in cars like a Chevette, or maybe a Metro, all the way up to around 64-65", which is what those outsized '71-76 Impalas, Caprices, etc had. I think those "whale/suppository" '90's Caprices, Impala SS'es, etc also had about the same shoulder room.
Perhaps Honda would rather sell more profitable CR-Vs and Pilots, but I think an Accord wagon is ready for a come back.
Or just bring the TSX wagon since it's already made in Europe that way. But even that might compete for attention with the new RDX.
-juice
On a side note, I think it is a mistake for Mazda to have a 6 hatch AND a 6 wagon. Have you seen them side by side? Hardly any difference between them. The hatch can go head to head with the Malibu Maxx and you can cancel the wagon, or you could just leave the hatch out entirely and be the only carmaker with a midsize wagon (after the imminent demise of the Taurus wagon).
I think it's a great idea to have run-flats on the new Odyssey this fall, as Honda has announced. As long as they don't make the ride too harsh, they will be a boon for interior space, which will be increased now there is no need for a spare. Wonder if any of the other minivan makers will follow suit...
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Ford has the Freestyle coming out, though it'll be bigger. And it's based on the 6 I think.
Ody will have some sort of lazy susan storage where the spare used to be. Interesting...
-juice
Honda's not eliminating the spare tire, are they? ;-)
-juice
Interestingly though, while the Passat doesn't have much legroom on paper, I find them to be pretty comfy. A buddy of mine has a 2001.5 (IIRC) model though, and lately it's been acting up worse than a 1980 Citation!
Of course the wagon has a ton of headroom, so that helps a bit. Funny thing is 93% of Outbacks sold are wagons, sedans are rare.
-juice
The hybrid Pilot due next year is supposed to give the mileage of a small wagon with the size and utility of an SUV. Plowing tons of money into developing hybrids is probably another reason why T/H aren't bringing out new wagons.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I think smaller makes like Mazda and Subaru *have* to sell wagons to get more volume. Honda and Toyota seem to have plenty of volume even without them.
-juice
In case of Honda, I think bringing over FR-V/Edix would be a good idea though (with K24 powering it, and offer with the diesel as well when conditions permit), instead of Accord wagon. It looks and supposedly feels more like a car/wagon, but has utility similar to that of small sport utes (CR-V).
I'll see a '94-97 Accord wagon every once in awhile. I think that's a pretty nice style. Been awhile since I saw a '90-93 though.
-juice
-juice
-juice
Nice job Subie
If the xB can sell a very healthy mix of manuals, why not the Element and CRV? I forget exactly how it goes, but I know manuals are limited to FWD models or something, and just try finding one on a dealer's lot anywhere. (he said bitterly!) :-P
Same thing is true for the RAV4, especially if you want an AWD.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
They were VERY slow sellers.
Surely not the V-6 models? I didn't think there had ever been a manual V-6 Accord before the current coupe. And how is the 6-speed V-6 coupe selling anyway? Slow seller also?
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Accord Wagons were produced from 1991-1997 in both LX and EX versions Either could be had with an automatic or a five speed.
Every year, sales declined although our store for some reason, did pretty well with them.
As used cars, they are quite popular UNLESS, they have a five speed.
Of course, around here, we have lots of traffic and lots of hills that make sticks a whole lot less attractive.
These sell O.K. The people who want one REALLY want one. The vast majority want automatics.
Have to? I think the reason why we have a Mazda6 wagon is because unlike the Honda Accord, there is only one version of the Mazda6 for the whole world. Might as well have the wagon here. It's as simple as that.
If the "we build em anyway" notion were true, we'd have a diesel 6 too.
Honda still doesn't put a manual on its V6 sedan (Accord), but the coupe gets it. So they're overlooking the sports sedan segment entirely. Or leaving that to the TSX.
Back in 2002 we went to 5 Toyota dealers and did not find a single Camry 5 speed manual with ABS, not a one.
Prolly too "small potatoes" for Honda and Toyota to bother with.
newcar31: I agree with that theory for the most part, but then why no TSX wagon? They sell one in Europe, it's really nice.
-juice
Another example is the Accord EX-L 5 speed I bought a couple weeks ago. It was born in January I think. It had been sitting for 6 months.
isell: wow, never knew that. I just figured if you could get a V-6 sedan, it would make sense that you could also get a V-6 wagon, since wagons weigh more. Surprising.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
1) The Accord didn't even have a V-6 until the 1995 model year!
2) The first V-6 in the Accord was a 2.7 unit, which was replaced by a 3.0 for the 1998 redesign. It had 170 hp @ 5600 rpm and 165 ft-lb of torque @ 4500 rpm.
I know the Acura Legend had a 2.7 V-6 when it first came out. Was this the same V-6?
I wonder what the rationale was for not offering a V-6 in the wagon models? I checked the weights on various 1995 models, and here's what I found...
1995 EX sedan, 4-cyl: 3009 lb
1995 EX wagon, 4-cyl: 3197 lb
1995 EX sedan, V-6: 3285 lb
So it looks like the wagon model added about 190 lb over the 4-cyl sedan, but interestingly, the V-6 sedan added almost 280 lb over the 4-cyl sedan! I wonder if a V-6 wagon would've just been too heavy, using up too much of the car's GVWR and not allowing for much of a load capacity?