Wow, as much as I enjoy reading these forums, I am very bummed now. I was so looking forward to an S-line in March. What you are saying makes sense, I will check with the other forum to dig up the info you are talking about.
Thanks for the informed reply!
I will still have a little hope that something will change or be made available before the release; however with what Mark's dealer has mentioned in the past and the info you are saying, there is little chance.
When do you think AUDI NA will make a formal announcement of the options etc?
Sorry for the letdown. I'm very much looking forward to the S-Line too as well as official news releases on the RS4 (spy pics have been captured from tests on the Nuremberg track).
I'm going to be visiting my dealer tomorrow (80,000 mile service), so I'll see if they have any more news.
If there's any consolation, we may get to see a Euro-spec S-Line on display at the various Auto Shows that will happen around the country. I'll be going to the main show in Detroit (NAIAS), so chances may be good there.
The "deal" on a new 2005 A4 1.8T (quattro and manual transmission ONLY) will be impossible to beat for a time after the intro of the new A4 -- probably a long time.
The 1.8T in its current iteration when mated with a 6speed manual, quattro and at least the sport suspension or Ultra Sport -- is a great engine, virtually trouble free. The engine and transmission can be upgraded to 100,000 warranty anytime before 50,000 miles or 4 years for ~ $1200 (a bargain, since it is from Audi).
The problem areas in the A4 1.8T are behind it -- this is probably the best time to buy this version of the A4.
The new version will have improvements to be sure -- the 2.0T engine being important.
I must tell you, however, that the 1.8T engine with the factory dual exhaust and about $1,000 worth of changes can be made to perform better than the 3.0 version. A "mild" chip reprogramming (nothing has to be removed) can add both substantial torque and extra HP and retain the daily driver personality (not high strung, that is).
It takes Premium Juice -- both before and after a mild ECU programming change.
If you get one of these beauties with Ultra Sport and only have a mild chip program upgrade (~$500) you will need do nothing else.
Perhaps, based on where you live, you could arrange with the dealer to have the car equipped with Ultra High Performance All Season tires.
Then drive it for 50 or 100,000 miles, smiling all the way (but don't forget to keep the warranty in force).
OH YEA -- use Mobil 1 or another syn oil from day one on.
For the money, this is the time and this is the car to get, In My Humble and Biased Opionion (IMHBO).
I have not heard about chip reprogramming before. Will this make the 1.8T quattro with Tiptronic perform better than the 3.0? Will Audi dealers do this work, and how much does it cost?
I am trying to decide whether to go for the 3.0 quattro, or a BMW 330xi, or wait till March for the new A4 3.2 and (as just announced) the new 330xi. Your post now adds the 1.8T (reprogrammed) into the mix. Decisions, decisions! Any suggestions?
What Mark is referring to is the ability to reflash the chip in the ECU to accept new programming for the management of the engine. This is typically done by an aftermarket performance company (APR for example). Other means for performance enhancement would be to open up the ECU module and physically replace the controller chip with a new chip that has the new software already flashed. Chipping a 1.8T engine will make it run and perform better than a stock 3.0 engine (and for slightly less money than buying the 3.0 A4).
Audi will not perform the performance modifications. One item to note is that with some Audi dealers, they do not have an appreciation of modified Audis and may challenge you to void your OEM warranty if they find out that you had your car "chipped". That is why many aftermarket companies who offer performance chip upgrades include a method to either switch back to the OEM programming or swap chips so that when you go in for service, the technician will only detect the OEM Audi programming.
Chipping a 1.8T A4 isn't as scary as it may seem. In fact, it's quite easy to have done in about an hour with a reputable installer. Costs for a simple chip upgrade can cost anywhere between $500 to $1000 depending on the amount of performance gain (and aftermarket brand). There is room in the engineering of the 1.8T engine to raise the performance bar safely and reliably.
If you want to get into a more detailed discussion about engine modifications and impact to warranties, I would suggest starting a separate thread. There are ways to upgrade while maintaining your OEM warranty and know when to use the warranty of the aftermarket product.
The best way to know which car you'll like (A4 3.0 quattro or 330xi) would be to go test drive each one on the same day.
If you want to get a deal, try to get a 2005 A4 1.8T with the Ultrasport package. Get the manual transmission for more precise control over the engine. Either with or without manual transmission, go do some research on some of the Audi entheusiast forums to get their opinions and experiences with the many vendors and their products.
My next choice would then be the A4 3.0 with the same Ultrasport package and a manual transmission. Believe it or not, there is a way to chip the 3.0 engine for some small performance gains, but the gains in performance will never be as dramatic as it would be for a 1.8T engine.
If you wait for the B7 A4, know that there will not be any performance products immediately available for you. It will take some time for the aftermarket companies to acquire one of the new cars to be used as a test mule while they work on designing new products.
I feel that the current A4 is a lot better than the current 330xi. I do not care for the new styling of the upcomming 3Series, so it doesn't rate a vote. If you have patience, you can wait for the release of the new models and try them out for yourself. By that time, if you're not completely happy, the dealers should have some big incentives to move any remaining B6 A4s off their lots.
I have gone round and round and round with folks who must have the tip transmission. The 1.8T with the tip will need a tip chip as well, IMO. Either flashing the ECU chip or replacing it (warning be aware of the "chasity belt" tell tale signs if you go the replacement chip route) with software that has "stock" and performance programs (secretly controlled by your cruise control button) will allow you to have both the high performance that the engine can deliver and allow the engine to be switched back to "stock" when it is in for service.
The 5spd tip which, at this time, is the auto for all the 4's except the S4 (which has a 6spd tip) has a lot of DBW (drive by wire, tip lag or some other names) problems. If for whatever reason you cannot handle getting a 6spd manual, then try to go for a 1.8T with Ultra Sport which you will then upgrade with a tip chip and an ECU flash (and the afforementioned UHP A/S tires on those 18" wheels).
Then for another couple bucks (~$200) get high performance BPVs (by pass valve) and a high performance air cleaner filter (or even an aftermarket air cleaner altogether).
These BPV's + the HP air cleaner filter + the ECU flash/upgrade + the tip chip on top of an Ultra Sport equipped A4 1.8T will outperform and be more economical than an A4 3.0 -- and it will be thousands less (it will actually handle better too, due to less weight on the front end).
If you are looking for a "deal" -- I think this one as noted (but with my urging that you consider the manual transmission) would be tough to beat. You WILL not beat it with the 2005.5 money - wise.
And, as noted, there will not be any 2.0T or 3.2 upgrades brought to market for several months (or longer) after launch.
If you have even more money to lay out to improve your 1.8T -- there are exhaust system upgrades that will improve the breathing of the engine and, hence, its power.
Of course you could go all the way and upgrade the 1.8T's turbos -- but, personally, I would avoid this route.
Now, for the record, MY DEALER, did CHIP my 1.8T TT -- I got the chip (no flash was available at that time -- 2001) from Joe Hoppen Motorsport. At JHM, you can find many performance accessories for your 1.8T that will not break the bank.
Of course, you can go from mild to wild on your upgrades if you have a stack of $100 dollar bills about "this high!"
Another point of view: 2005.5 stuff.
The current A4 1.8T cannot be had with a navigation system. If you would not get one, then this is no big deal. The current A4 3.0 can be had with a very usable but not full color moving map system -- and it works just fine (I have it).
However, if you want the DVD based full color screen, high zoot sat nav system that is all the rage these days, you will have to wait for the 2005.5 A4. My comments about the current A4 being a bargain stand if you care NOT about this feature.
Thanks guys for the info on the chip. I think I will pass on it because of the potential warranty problems with the Audi dealer.
In any case, I am leaning towards waiting until March for the new A4 3.2. At that time, I can try it out and compare that with the existing A4 3.0 as well as the BMW 330xi, if the new one is out by then. The new A4 3.2 sounds just about perfect, depending on what features/options/price/lease terms we get here (hopefully more reasonable than Acura RL's Canadian pricing and lease terms). If it isn't as good as expected, I can still opt for the 2004/5 A4 3.0 or the 330xi, which should be very attractively priced by then.
I had a '97 A4 2.8 and a '93 325c, and loved them both (and both were very reliable).
Last night, December 1, 2004, my dealer faxed the "final" (uh huh) order guides for the new 2005.5 A4 2.0 and 3.2.
Note: at this point, of the two of us, my wife seems to have honed in on a new A4 as the replacement for her TT (time frame 3 - 5 months). Furthermore, after her last loaner A4 1.8T (2004), she even thought the power was NOT inadequate, and therefore assumes (presumes?) that a 200HP and 207 lb/ft torque 2.0FSI with a 6spd manual will be "more than adequate."
We were pleased with the option selection, but noted three options that we would be glad to pay "the going rate" for:
1. Paint (specifically a color that can be had everywhere else -- Panther Black Pearl).
2. Leather/Seating (specifically Amaretto(?) color and sport seats -- rather than comfort seats)
3. 18" Wheels/tires
Here goes. . .with the experience of almost 30 Audis (97.5% of them pre-ordered) we would like to order Panther Pearl, Amaretto leather seats (comfort OR sport seats, frankly) and 18" wheels (e.g., as on the current S-Line 2005 A4).) Our long time salesman (and trusted friend) says the last few orders he placed with special paint were first accepted then later rejected NOT by Audi but by Audi of America. Huh?!?
Does anyone on this erudite forum have any info that would suggest that it is possible to configure a new A4 with the same choices they have in the UK or elsewhere, for that matter?
Sorry to hear about the block by AoA. That sounds to me that although those options may be offered by Audi AG, AoA is in the process of restricting the choices for the North American distribution. Sure, they'll take some of the individual items and group them into packages, but there will be other items that AoA will refuse to be sent to our shores.
As always, everyone in North America is denied to buy their Audis with every possible option that is made by the manufacturer. Now I can understand if there's an option that doesn't meet the safety standards set by the US or by Canada, but that shouldn't stop other items from being offered.
I'm starting to keep an eye out for the B7 DTM Edition. It's a special package designed by quattro GmbH (who designed the RS4 and RS6). It was unveiled at this year's Essen Motorshow. It's a full performance package designed to celebrate the success of DTM's racing victory for the 2004 season.
The DTM model has special ground effects including a carbon fiber front lip and rear spoiler. The suspension is lowered and stiffened. Special 18" wheels designed to look like the ones on the DTM race car are on the car.
The engine also gets a performance tuneup. They use the new 2.0T FSI engine, but improved the performance to provide 220 HP and 280 ft/lbs of torque and the crank. This is what really caught my interest.
Inside, there's carbon fiber door trim, suede door inserts, a specially embroidered DTM floor mat, and Recaro sport seats (I love the Recaros on the B6 S4!).
The rumor is that the A4 DTM Edition will be arriving in North America sometime during the Summer of 2005. I can wait for this! Hopefully, AoA doesn't take it through the chopper and pull out items from the whole DTM package.
There are pictures of this A4 DTM Edition posted on some other Audi websites that provided press covereage of the Essen Motorshow that was held a week ago.
You know, or may, that AoA generally charges for certain colors of paint (on the A4 line). I believe the up-charge over, for instance, Brilliant Black, for a metallic or "pearl" color has, historically been from $150 to $1250 (in my personal experience). The metallic colors recently have commanded a price of $450 over the non-metallic colors.
In the days when Pearl White was "off the color charts" you could (at the last attempt I made) order Pearl White for an extra $1250 if you were willing.
It is my considered opinion right now that for "environmental" reasons, Pearl White is no longer an option at virtually any price.
Looking on other countries' Audi websites, I was able to find Panther Black Pearl at a price I would think would translate (at most) to about USD $750. Right on the edge of sanity, but probably an OK choice for the passionate.
Here is TODAY's USD price for Panther Black Pearl: $2,500! Well, for pity's sake -- that, on a sub $40,000 car seems nuts!
Amaretto Leather and 18" wheels -- nope. The way around this: order the car with 17" wheels and then "special order" via the parts catalog the appropriate 18" wheels (at REALLY high prices) from the US Audi Dealer. I don't know if there is any way, that is affordable, around the leather option.
Solution? Go with the flow.
Today we placed (to replace my wife's TT) a "soft order," since "hard orders" (apparently) are not yet available, for a 2005.5 A4 2.0T FSI 6spd manual. Color Gray Quartz Pearl, Beige Leather and 17" wheels as part of the sport package (all season UHP tires.)
We ordered literally all options, except the automatic transmission and chose XM over Sirius. This was for the sedan, not the Avant.
The order will be placed [for sure] "probably" first quarter 2005. No prices, but there were order codes.
One down -- now if only I could drive the new Acura RL and the AWD 300C -- then who knows, the allroad goes away and ? replaces it.
It will be difficult to imagine something impressing me more than the new A6 -- and, at this point the new A4 with the 3.2 ONLY comes in auto trans configuration -- what a world, what a world.
I'll keep you posted on the progress of the 2.0T FSI A4 quattro, as soon as I know anything.
$2,500 for a "stock color" -- what were they thinking? What was I thinking?!?
I like the A4 Cabriolet, but I want to make sure I'm not getting the last of the old version...
Does this new 2005.5 represent a redesign that is likely to hold for a while, or is 2006 going to be a new design as well (I've seen references to a new design for 2006 but maybe it's just people confusing the 2005.5 with 2006)?
It appears there is a new DVD-based nav system with a real map in the new version. My dealer has a few coming in in a month or so. Do you suppose that if it has the new DVD it is the full new design, or could they be introducing features incrementally?
No Ultra Sport, No S-Line. Nothing in writing -- probably can be ordered in June or July, then + 10 - 14 weeks, your S-Line will come in.
Currently you can place a "hard" positioning order for an AUTO only 3.2 A4 or either transmission 2.0T FSI (quattros, of course).
We did the soft order thing for a couple of reasons -- we won't buy sight unseen and NOT driven (not to mention NO prices); we have +/- 3 months wiggle room in my wife's lease. So we order in Feb or March (or perhaps as late as April) and delivery time is estimated at 10 weeks, my best guess based on experience is 14 weeks.
Everyone KNOWS there will be an SLine (in fact you can as of NOW order a new A6 4.2 SLine, but, thus far NOT the A6 3.2 (+ 3 to 6 months?))
All the web sites that claim to know claim Sline will be "late introduction" probably August September time frame (which kind of makes sense since Audi shuts the plant down in Ingolstadt in late June and reopens in July for the new model year production -- so, I suspect that means that the Slines will go into production in July, which puts them here in North America around September.)
Rumor rumor rumor: 3.2 WILL offer 6speed manual as a late introduction -- hmm, same time as the Sline, perhaps????
Mark, thanks for the info. Well that S Line puts it out a little later than the BMW 2006 330i. I was really hoping they would be out together to compare; I guess we will know much more next year.
I definitely don't want to buy the 2005.5 in April just to have the S Line come out 3-4 months later.
I like the A4 Cabriolet, but I want to make sure I'm not getting the last of the old version...
Does this new 2005.5 represent a redesign that is likely to hold for a while, or is 2006 going to be a new design as well (I've seen references to a new design for 2006 but maybe it's just people confusing the 2005.5 with 2006)?
It appears there is a new DVD-based nav system with a real map in the new version. My dealer has a few coming in in a month or so. Do you suppose that if it has the new DVD it is the full new design, or could they be introducing features incrementally?
Not sure if this is the right place to post this, but here goes:
With the new A4s coming out, I'm wondering how long the previous generation will be available. Specifically, I'm looking to purchase a 2005 A4, with a fairly specific list of "must-have/must-not-have" options. (I'm picky.) I'm wary of the changes in the 05.5/06, and I like the look of the old one better.
If I wait until my lease is up (May 05) to go shopping, will I be stuck with a handful of lot-rotted A4s with options I don't want? How quickly do previous-generation models sell out after a mid-model-year introduction?
You would be hard pressed to get an order in for a new B6 (2005) A4 as of now, let alone in May '05.
As I understand it Audi is not taking orders on them anymore as they have already re-tooled the production line for the B7 (2005.5)
That being said anything you get will have been sitting on someone's lot.
If your local dealers don't have the car with the options you want when you want it, they can search the system and provided they find one, trade cars with that dealer to get it for you. Or you can search for the car/options you want yourself.
There's really no way to predict how quickly last years models will move off a dealers lot. Too many variables.
I wrecked my '96 Saturn SL 2 a few weeks ago (sober). Honestly loved that car - had only 1 problem with it. It was great for San Francisco because it was light and had tons of torque for a compact (122 ft-lbs at 2400 rpm), way more than Civic, Corolla, etc. Couldn't find one similar so I considered getting a new car -- Mazda 3, Ford Focus, etc. Then I saw the 2005 a4 1.8T CVT specs and figured I could afford the price. Problem -- the 1.8 just didn't have the oomph from a standing start you often need here. I don't care what a car does from 30-60, I want to know what it does 0-30, and even 15. So I checked out the 3.0 CVT. More powerful. However, the configuration I want (black/black, premium package) is simply not available in California. Doing some research, it seems that there is indeed a new 2005.5 line up. Problem is, the CVT is only available in the turbocharged 4 config. Now it does get 200 HP (up from 170) and the torque has increased (to 280 Nm which I don't understand) but will it be enough? I could place an order now for Spring delivery, but I think I will wait to hit the showroom. The options have changed as well and I'd like a real brochure too, not an e-mailed spec sheet or so.
Javan: I live in "THE CITY" as well and drive a 1.8T with tiptronic and drive throughout SF. The car has more than enough power for the hills and for the coast. The options of being in straight D or moving to S will take care of most of your power issues and you will find that moving over into tiptronic gives you more than enough hustle for most driving situations. The fact of the matter in downtown SF is that you will never have many chances to drive very fast anyway. You just end up looking good while going slow on Van Ness, Gough, 3rd and 5th! I have not driven a CVT car so I don't know whether there is a performance issue with that car; but I do know how you might feel if you only drive in "D". Give the tiptronic a try and drive in S as well and you might have a different experience.
Does anyone know when production started on the Audi s4 2005.5. I ordered a car that was in production during late November. It will arrive in January and as I have been told there has been a price increase I am hoping that my fully loaded car is a 2005.5 with the new navigational map system.
This article doesn't bring any new info. to the table. Maybe I missed something. Anyway, I think the real choice for the new A4 version will not be the spring released model but the 2006 version releasing in the summer/fall of this year. This will truly have more options, S package etc.
I haven't read a lot of past posts, so if this is a duplicate I apologize. Any word on whether the DSG transmission will be offered on A4 models here in the U.S.?
I was wondering if anybody knew if the cabriolet will be offered with the new engine choices this spring or if it will be a phased roll out similar to the way the new 3 series will implemented in stages. Thanks for any info available.
...will not be offered on the '05.5 or '06 A4 (AFAIK). Presently it can only be configured to transversely mounted engines. Audi does plan to adapt the DSG transmission to the A4 range in the hazy future.
Just placed a soft order for the 2006 A4 2.0T 6M, to arrive late April. It will come with everything (quattro, sport, premium, convenience, weather, xenon, tire pressure monitor, nav, etc.) except premium audio which I don't need. No price structure set up yet (expected to be announced in 2 weeks), but dealer said cost will be about 2K more than current model. Will get the VIN in early April as soon as production is completed.
... the best with that new A4. At this point I just might wait it out until fall '05 and see if I might be able to afford the 3.2 with a manual. My only complaint on my '02 A4 Avant 5sp is the 1.8t engine. It's just too anemic. The extra 30 hp in the 2.0t will help but me wants MORE!
Thanks. The lease on my current car, 2002 A6 2.7T 6M, is running out end of March, so I grabbed the new A4 with the 2.0T. I can't wait for AOA to decide on outfitting the 3.2 with a manual, and I'm not sure that will happen. I'm very happy with my current car and the new A4 will be just a smaller version of it. I know what you mean about the HP, but I figured, this is a smaller car anyway, and would not be too shabby.
The lack of a manual on the current A6 soured me on that line, as well as the A8. So, there. Cheers.
...that the 3.2 will come with the manual as an '06 model. In reality (what's that?), the 2.0t engine is probably enough for the A4. But there's good news for those not worried about trivialities such as engine / drive train warranties: MTM has an ECU chip upgrade ready and waiting. Expect around 45 extra hp.
As for price increases, the A4 is expected to go up around 5 to 7%. Part of this is the dollar / euro rate and part is from extra content.
I am waiting for the 2006 version A4 3.2 with the S-line option as well as all the other extras. I know there will be some differences between the 2005.5 and the 2006, might as well wait for those changes or additional options for a few more months.
What month do you guys think the 2006 model will start showing up on the floor rooms?
The dealer I went to said their 2006 cars are coming in March. Mine was special order so I have to wait. He had a list of orders coming in and my specs didn't match anything arriving earlier. My current car was a compromise (no nav, no shades, etc.), but I can wait this time. Not long enough for the stick on the 3.2 though. Buy what you want, and enjoy the ride.
The 2005.5 A4 model is coming in March, the 2006 cars are coming in the summer. There are some differences, if you are interested, read some previous posts. Example would be possible manual option, S-Line option, rim options, badging etc.
No. The most recent order guide offers a full screen DVD navi with MMI-like controls as an OPTION. There is no navi, not even a compass, in the base A4 as far as I can tell.
Both the navi and the compass, however are "offered" either in a package or as a stand alone option.
Anyone have advance notice of any special leasing promotions?
The 2005 A4 Special Edition lease looks tempting - but I want an automatic w/ quatro, and prefer a powerful engine. (Ok so it isn't that tempting to me - hoping that when the 2005.5 model comes out there may be some promotions)
Comments
Wow, as much as I enjoy reading these forums, I am very bummed now. I was so looking forward to an S-line in March. What you are saying makes sense, I will check with the other forum to dig up the info you are talking about.
Thanks for the informed reply!
I will still have a little hope that something will change or be made available before the release; however with what Mark's dealer has mentioned in the past and the info you are saying, there is little chance.
When do you think AUDI NA will make a formal announcement of the options etc?
I'm going to be visiting my dealer tomorrow (80,000 mile service), so I'll see if they have any more news.
If there's any consolation, we may get to see a Euro-spec S-Line on display at the various Auto Shows that will happen around the country. I'll be going to the main show in Detroit (NAIAS), so chances may be good there.
The 1.8T in its current iteration when mated with a 6speed manual, quattro and at least the sport suspension or Ultra Sport -- is a great engine, virtually trouble free. The engine and transmission can be upgraded to 100,000 warranty anytime before 50,000 miles or 4 years for ~ $1200 (a bargain, since it is from Audi).
The problem areas in the A4 1.8T are behind it -- this is probably the best time to buy this version of the A4.
The new version will have improvements to be sure -- the 2.0T engine being important.
I must tell you, however, that the 1.8T engine with the factory dual exhaust and about $1,000 worth of changes can be made to perform better than the 3.0 version. A "mild" chip reprogramming (nothing has to be removed) can add both substantial torque and extra HP and retain the daily driver personality (not high strung, that is).
It takes Premium Juice -- both before and after a mild ECU programming change.
If you get one of these beauties with Ultra Sport and only have a mild chip program upgrade (~$500) you will need do nothing else.
Perhaps, based on where you live, you could arrange with the dealer to have the car equipped with Ultra High Performance All Season tires.
Then drive it for 50 or 100,000 miles, smiling all the way (but don't forget to keep the warranty in force).
OH YEA -- use Mobil 1 or another syn oil from day one on.
For the money, this is the time and this is the car to get, In My Humble and Biased Opionion (IMHBO).
I am trying to decide whether to go for the 3.0 quattro, or a BMW 330xi, or wait till March for the new A4 3.2 and (as just announced) the new 330xi. Your post now adds the 1.8T (reprogrammed) into the mix. Decisions, decisions! Any suggestions?
Audi will not perform the performance modifications. One item to note is that with some Audi dealers, they do not have an appreciation of modified Audis and may challenge you to void your OEM warranty if they find out that you had your car "chipped". That is why many aftermarket companies who offer performance chip upgrades include a method to either switch back to the OEM programming or swap chips so that when you go in for service, the technician will only detect the OEM Audi programming.
Chipping a 1.8T A4 isn't as scary as it may seem. In fact, it's quite easy to have done in about an hour with a reputable installer. Costs for a simple chip upgrade can cost anywhere between $500 to $1000 depending on the amount of performance gain (and aftermarket brand). There is room in the engineering of the 1.8T engine to raise the performance bar safely and reliably.
If you want to get into a more detailed discussion about engine modifications and impact to warranties, I would suggest starting a separate thread. There are ways to upgrade while maintaining your OEM warranty and know when to use the warranty of the aftermarket product.
The best way to know which car you'll like (A4 3.0 quattro or 330xi) would be to go test drive each one on the same day.
If you want to get a deal, try to get a 2005 A4 1.8T with the Ultrasport package. Get the manual transmission for more precise control over the engine. Either with or without manual transmission, go do some research on some of the Audi entheusiast forums to get their opinions and experiences with the many vendors and their products.
My next choice would then be the A4 3.0 with the same Ultrasport package and a manual transmission. Believe it or not, there is a way to chip the 3.0 engine for some small performance gains, but the gains in performance will never be as dramatic as it would be for a 1.8T engine.
If you wait for the B7 A4, know that there will not be any performance products immediately available for you. It will take some time for the aftermarket companies to acquire one of the new cars to be used as a test mule while they work on designing new products.
I feel that the current A4 is a lot better than the current 330xi. I do not care for the new styling of the upcomming 3Series, so it doesn't rate a vote. If you have patience, you can wait for the release of the new models and try them out for yourself. By that time, if you're not completely happy, the dealers should have some big incentives to move any remaining B6 A4s off their lots.
The 5spd tip which, at this time, is the auto for all the 4's except the S4 (which has a 6spd tip) has a lot of DBW (drive by wire, tip lag or some other names) problems. If for whatever reason you cannot handle getting a 6spd manual, then try to go for a 1.8T with Ultra Sport which you will then upgrade with a tip chip and an ECU flash (and the afforementioned UHP A/S tires on those 18" wheels).
Then for another couple bucks (~$200) get high performance BPVs (by pass valve) and a high performance air cleaner filter (or even an aftermarket air cleaner altogether).
These BPV's + the HP air cleaner filter + the ECU flash/upgrade + the tip chip on top of an Ultra Sport equipped A4 1.8T will outperform and be more economical than an A4 3.0 -- and it will be thousands less (it will actually handle better too, due to less weight on the front end).
If you are looking for a "deal" -- I think this one as noted (but with my urging that you consider the manual transmission) would be tough to beat. You WILL not beat it with the 2005.5 money - wise.
And, as noted, there will not be any 2.0T or 3.2 upgrades brought to market for several months (or longer) after launch.
If you have even more money to lay out to improve your 1.8T -- there are exhaust system upgrades that will improve the breathing of the engine and, hence, its power.
Of course you could go all the way and upgrade the 1.8T's turbos -- but, personally, I would avoid this route.
Now, for the record, MY DEALER, did CHIP my 1.8T TT -- I got the chip (no flash was available at that time -- 2001) from Joe Hoppen Motorsport. At JHM, you can find many performance accessories for your 1.8T that will not break the bank.
Of course, you can go from mild to wild on your upgrades if you have a stack of $100 dollar bills about "this high!"
Another point of view: 2005.5 stuff.
The current A4 1.8T cannot be had with a navigation system. If you would not get one, then this is no big deal. The current A4 3.0 can be had with a very usable but not full color moving map system -- and it works just fine (I have it).
However, if you want the DVD based full color screen, high zoot sat nav system that is all the rage these days, you will have to wait for the 2005.5 A4. My comments about the current A4 being a bargain stand if you care NOT about this feature.
In any case, I am leaning towards waiting until March for the new A4 3.2. At that time, I can try it out and compare that with the existing A4 3.0 as well as the BMW 330xi, if the new one is out by then. The new A4 3.2 sounds just about perfect, depending on what features/options/price/lease terms we get here (hopefully more reasonable than Acura RL's Canadian pricing and lease terms). If it isn't as good as expected, I can still opt for the 2004/5 A4 3.0 or the 330xi, which should be very attractively priced by then.
I had a '97 A4 2.8 and a '93 325c, and loved them both (and both were very reliable).
Note: at this point, of the two of us, my wife seems to have honed in on a new A4 as the replacement for her TT (time frame 3 - 5 months). Furthermore, after her last loaner A4 1.8T (2004), she even thought the power was NOT inadequate, and therefore assumes (presumes?) that a 200HP and 207 lb/ft torque 2.0FSI with a 6spd manual will be "more than adequate."
We were pleased with the option selection, but noted three options that we would be glad to pay "the going rate" for:
1. Paint (specifically a color that can be had everywhere else -- Panther Black Pearl).
2. Leather/Seating (specifically Amaretto(?) color and sport seats -- rather than comfort seats)
3. 18" Wheels/tires
Here goes. . .with the experience of almost 30 Audis (97.5% of them pre-ordered) we would like to order Panther Pearl, Amaretto leather seats (comfort OR sport seats, frankly) and 18" wheels (e.g., as on the current S-Line 2005 A4).) Our long time salesman (and trusted friend) says the last few orders he placed with special paint were first accepted then later rejected NOT by Audi but by Audi of America. Huh?!?
Does anyone on this erudite forum have any info that would suggest that it is possible to configure a new A4 with the same choices they have in the UK or elsewhere, for that matter?
Thanks.
Sorry to hear about the block by AoA. That sounds to me that although those options may be offered by Audi AG, AoA is in the process of restricting the choices for the North American distribution. Sure, they'll take some of the individual items and group them into packages, but there will be other items that AoA will refuse to be sent to our shores.
As always, everyone in North America is denied to buy their Audis with every possible option that is made by the manufacturer. Now I can understand if there's an option that doesn't meet the safety standards set by the US or by Canada, but that shouldn't stop other items from being offered.
I'm starting to keep an eye out for the B7 DTM Edition. It's a special package designed by quattro GmbH (who designed the RS4 and RS6). It was unveiled at this year's Essen Motorshow. It's a full performance package designed to celebrate the success of DTM's racing victory for the 2004 season.
The DTM model has special ground effects including a carbon fiber front lip and rear spoiler. The suspension is lowered and stiffened. Special 18" wheels designed to look like the ones on the DTM race car are on the car.
The engine also gets a performance tuneup. They use the new 2.0T FSI engine, but improved the performance to provide 220 HP and 280 ft/lbs of torque and the crank. This is what really caught my interest.
Inside, there's carbon fiber door trim, suede door inserts, a specially embroidered DTM floor mat, and Recaro sport seats (I love the Recaros on the B6 S4!).
The rumor is that the A4 DTM Edition will be arriving in North America sometime during the Summer of 2005. I can wait for this! Hopefully, AoA doesn't take it through the chopper and pull out items from the whole DTM package.
There are pictures of this A4 DTM Edition posted on some other Audi websites that provided press covereage of the Essen Motorshow that was held a week ago.
In the days when Pearl White was "off the color charts" you could (at the last attempt I made) order Pearl White for an extra $1250 if you were willing.
It is my considered opinion right now that for "environmental" reasons, Pearl White is no longer an option at virtually any price.
Looking on other countries' Audi websites, I was able to find Panther Black Pearl at a price I would think would translate (at most) to about USD $750. Right on the edge of sanity, but probably an OK choice for the passionate.
Here is TODAY's USD price for Panther Black Pearl: $2,500! Well, for pity's sake -- that, on a sub $40,000 car seems nuts!
Amaretto Leather and 18" wheels -- nope. The way around this: order the car with 17" wheels and then "special order" via the parts catalog the appropriate 18" wheels (at REALLY high prices) from the US Audi Dealer. I don't know if there is any way, that is affordable, around the leather option.
Solution? Go with the flow.
Today we placed (to replace my wife's TT) a "soft order," since "hard orders" (apparently) are not yet available, for a 2005.5 A4 2.0T FSI 6spd manual. Color Gray Quartz Pearl, Beige Leather and 17" wheels as part of the sport package (all season UHP tires.)
We ordered literally all options, except the automatic transmission and chose XM over Sirius. This was for the sedan, not the Avant.
The order will be placed [for sure] "probably" first quarter 2005. No prices, but there were order codes.
One down -- now if only I could drive the new Acura RL and the AWD 300C -- then who knows, the allroad goes away and ? replaces it.
It will be difficult to imagine something impressing me more than the new A6 -- and, at this point the new A4 with the 3.2 ONLY comes in auto trans configuration -- what a world, what a world.
I'll keep you posted on the progress of the 2.0T FSI A4 quattro, as soon as I know anything.
$2,500 for a "stock color" -- what were they thinking? What was I thinking?!?
Seems like we are getting closer to getting an actual order guide for this car.
You did a soft order recently and ordered all the options, did they have any type of S Line package or Ultra sport package?
I know they did not have any pricing, but could you list the packages available for the 2005.5 3.2 FSI.
Why are you getting the 2.0T over the 3.2?
Thanks
Does this new 2005.5 represent a redesign that is likely to hold for a while, or is 2006 going to be a new design as well (I've seen references to a new design for 2006 but maybe it's just people confusing the 2005.5 with 2006)?
It appears there is a new DVD-based nav system with a real map in the new version. My dealer has a few coming in in a month or so. Do you suppose that if it has the new DVD it is the full new design, or could they be introducing features incrementally?
Thanks for any help
Currently you can place a "hard" positioning order for an AUTO only 3.2 A4 or either transmission 2.0T FSI (quattros, of course).
We did the soft order thing for a couple of reasons -- we won't buy sight unseen and NOT driven (not to mention NO prices); we have +/- 3 months wiggle room in my wife's lease. So we order in Feb or March (or perhaps as late as April) and delivery time is estimated at 10 weeks, my best guess based on experience is 14 weeks.
Everyone KNOWS there will be an SLine (in fact you can as of NOW order a new A6 4.2 SLine, but, thus far NOT the A6 3.2 (+ 3 to 6 months?))
All the web sites that claim to know claim Sline will be "late introduction" probably August September time frame (which kind of makes sense since Audi shuts the plant down in Ingolstadt in late June and reopens in July for the new model year production -- so, I suspect that means that the Slines will go into production in July, which puts them here in North America around September.)
Rumor rumor rumor: 3.2 WILL offer 6speed manual as a late introduction -- hmm, same time as the Sline, perhaps????
I definitely don't want to buy the 2005.5 in April just to have the S Line come out 3-4 months later.
More rental car driving for me I guess.
Does this new 2005.5 represent a redesign that is likely to hold for a while, or is 2006 going to be a new design as well (I've seen references to a new design for 2006 but maybe it's just people confusing the 2005.5 with 2006)?
It appears there is a new DVD-based nav system with a real map in the new version. My dealer has a few coming in in a month or so. Do you suppose that if it has the new DVD it is the full new design, or could they be introducing features incrementally?
Thanks for any help
With the new A4s coming out, I'm wondering how long the previous generation will be available. Specifically, I'm looking to purchase a 2005 A4, with a fairly specific list of "must-have/must-not-have" options. (I'm picky.) I'm wary of the changes in the 05.5/06, and I like the look of the old one better.
If I wait until my lease is up (May 05) to go shopping, will I be stuck with a handful of lot-rotted A4s with options I don't want? How quickly do previous-generation models sell out after a mid-model-year introduction?
As I understand it Audi is not taking orders on them anymore as they have already re-tooled the production line for the B7 (2005.5)
That being said anything you get will have been sitting on someone's lot.
If your local dealers don't have the car with the options you want when you want it, they can search the system and provided they find one, trade cars with that dealer to get it for you. Or you can search for the car/options you want yourself.
There's really no way to predict how quickly last years models will move off a dealers lot. Too many variables.
HTH
2.0T FSI SE Multitronic 0-62 7.3 sec
1.8T SE Multitronic 0-62 8.6 sec
also fuel mileage was listed
2.oT FSi urban 25/ extra urban 44.1
1.8T urban 24.6/ extra urban 42.8
can anyone compute these into miles per gallon?
The 2.0TFSI not only appears to be quite more powerful but slighly better fuel economy.
DL
25/1.18 = 21.2 city
44/1.18 = 37.3 highway
Those would be fairly good figures if EPA is the same.
DL
European testing conditions are different. I suppose they use a lower highway speed, and more stop & go in the city.
With my swami hat on, i predict 24/34, 23/33 with quattro.
dave
Looks like I'm carless for the holidays!
By my reading of the UK site info, the fuel tank size on the new A4 will be approx. 16.6 gal.
Even the 3.1 and even the S4.
I was hoping for 18 - 20 gal.
Odd.
- Ray
Waiting for March to see / drive one anyway . . .
From what I've read the torque comes on faster and stronger than the 1.8T.
Mileage: I think it is common for direct injection engines to have much better MPG on the highway than a conventional engine.
DL
Thanks for your Info!
There is quite a difference, I am sure your salesperson would be able to tell you.
http://www.autoweek.com/article.cms?articleId=101605
- Ray
Reading at lunch . . .
-Chris-
If they fix the problems that were reported on the TT it may make it here along with the S-line options for the 2006 model.
The lack of a manual on the current A6 soured me on that line, as well as the A8. So, there. Cheers.
DL
As for price increases, the A4 is expected to go up around 5 to 7%. Part of this is the dollar / euro rate and part is from extra content.
What month do you guys think the 2006 model will start showing up on the floor rooms?
The 2005.5 A4 model is coming in March, the 2006 cars are coming in the summer. There are some differences, if you are interested, read some previous posts. Example would be possible manual option, S-Line option, rim options, badging etc.
The New 3 went up a paltry 30 euro's, Id think the A4 would remain competitive.
DL
dave
Both the navi and the compass, however are "offered" either in a package or as a stand alone option.
The 2005 A4 Special Edition lease looks tempting - but I want an automatic w/ quatro, and prefer a powerful engine. (Ok so it isn't that tempting to me - hoping that when the 2005.5 model comes out there may be some promotions)