Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

woodyww

I've got a paid for, perfectly good, 05 Accord EX-6L Navi Coupe that provides plenty of power, is comfortable ... and only has 20K miles ... and I'm bored with it. It's fine .... nothing is wrong, it's cheap to own/maintain/drive

God, I hate when that happens--owning a 20K mile car with plenty of power, is comfortable....... cheap to own/maintain/drive......

But, big dog/little dog? I'd think a wagon/SUV/hatchback......your older Forester with 135K on it may not last forever. New Forester, or Subie wagon? Used bmw 3 or 5 series wagon???? Used X3?

lilengineerboy

Hey Boomcheck, its good to see you back around these parts.

lilengineerboy

How about a Subaru WRX 5-door hatchback? Great deals on the '08s, or wait a month and get the new one with 265 HP?

One of the reasons the '08 is on special is it was kind of regarded as a miss, the '09 should be much improved.

lilengineerboy

This may be sacrilege from a former Subie owner, but the new Lancer EVO-light (I think its the Ralliart edition this year??) is really appealing to me. Mostly for the DSG tranny.

Its funny how one man's pleasure is another man's poison. The lack of a real manual transmission keeps it off my list.

boomchek

Hey Boomcheck, its good to see you back around these parts.

Thanks, just been busy at work building up my future so when I get older I would be able to own cars like mark156 owns

corvette

Given what I'm reading in the news, I have a feeling the heavily-subsidized leases may be a thing of the past. I can either wait until November or December to see whether they appear (as companies try to prop up their year-end sales), or start looking for a clean used car now...

I ran into our old Volvo salesman today--he's no longer in the car business, but he still loves Volvos. He said used XC90s are pretty good values now, especially for someone who doesn't do a lot of driving. I'm undecided, since there's no nearby dealer/parts source, and I may not always have such a short commute. Also, I'm still seeing SUV asking prices that are way too high (at dealers) and reserve prices (at auctions--which pretty much ensures that it won't sell).

andre1969

I've ridden that idea into the toilet twice now--in the 3 year bear market that began in 2000, & the current one (gee--major bear markets, & financial meltdowns every 6 years--who knew?).

Actually, if you're willing to take a chance and can raise the money, the time to buy usually IS when the markets are down. I took a beating back in late 2000/early 2001, but was able to invest more money in. By May 2001 my portfolio was at an all time high. But that summer chipped away at it, 9/11 sunk it, and it wouldn't be until May 2003 that I would be back up to that level.

After that though, it seems like all the market did was go up. Through October 2007, at least. There were a few quick drops here and there, like the summer of 2006, February of 2007, where I saw a hit of 10-11%, almost overnight. But they bounced back. I think so far I'm down about 15% from October 2007, but it had to happen, eventually. 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, and 2007 were good to me. We have to get a bad year or two in there, eventually. :sick:

mark156

Corvette,

Yes, I have a degree in Accounting but it's the business ventures (adventures) that have worked so well. California real estate went crazy in the late 90's, early 2000's that worked well. Had a successful retail business that I sold at the right time.

I watch my pennies.... so I can spend them.

I'm really going to miss the E430. I have really enjoyed that car but it's time to let it go. Since I've turned 50, I thought a nice present to myself was due.

M156

kyfdx

Thank goodness for 401Ks.. I just keep plugging the money in it every week... The down times are good... because I get more shares...

As opposed to the accounts where I trade stocks... I put good safe blue chips in my wife's Roth.. She has more than doubled her money.... I played around with mine, and I've got enough left to make ONE car payment..

andre1969

As opposed to the accounts where I trade stocks... I put good safe blue chips in my wife's Roth.. She has more than doubled her money.... I played around with mine, and I've got enough left to make ONE car payment..

Yeah, I've learned even with those trading accounts, it's usually best to just let those stocks sit. I've found that almost every time that I've sold one stock to buy another, I'd end up losing out. Either the stock I sold would take off right after I sold it, or the one I bought would drop.

I bought some Toyota stock, not too long after I bought that '76 LeMans out in Ohio (when we met up). At one point, it shot up enough that it essentially paid for that LeMans, which I thought was cool in an ironic sort of way...Toyota profits paying for my GM car. :shades:

Of course, when I had GM stock, let's not talk about what that ended up paying for. The shirt on my back, maybe? Actually, that's one I probably unloaded at just the right time.

I'm still getting an occasional new-car itchy trigger finger, but trying to keep that urge down, by just rotating through the cars I already have. That at least keeps them feeling a little fresher, instead of driving the same old thing every day.

guss

That is the problem with buying individual stocks. Most people panic when it starts dropping and sell at the worst possible time. I tend to put it in a good mutual fund and put the blinders on so that I don't get itchy.

I have been waiting for the new Mazda6 to come out and it looks like they are finally here. I am going to drive it along with the last generation to compare them. I will see if the new one is worth the extra 5 grand because the '08's are heavily discounted and have a big rebate.

I have never been one to have to have the latest and greatest before anyone else, but the new 6 looks like it will fit my needs more than the '08s. I just have to leave my cheapfrugal side at home.

lemmer

I refuse to look at my long term investments. I picked them to be money makers over 20-30 years, so why torture myself on a regular basis?

On the other hand, with cars I think about buying and selling on a daily basis. That is why I am here.

michaellno

He said used XC90s are pretty good values now, especially for someone who doesn't do a lot of driving.

My sister has a lease of a Honda Pilot that is up next April and that is exactly what she is thinking of doing, much like qbrozen. Find a good, 2 or 3 year old XC90 for $20-22K and hang onto it. Of course, she's got three boys (ages 11, 8 and 5), so she's very much into safety. And, she drives about 5 miles a day between home, work and the kids' school.

corvette

On the other hand, with cars I think about buying and selling on a daily basis. That is why I am here.

And I think we run a pretty good group. So long as you don't expect treatment, or a cure! :P

qbrozen

The lack of a real manual transmission keeps it off my list.

I'm pretty sure it can be had with a regular manual trans.
The EVO can, so I don't see why the Evo light wouldn't. Like with VW, that DSG is a pretty expensive option, so I don't see them forcing it on buyers anytime soon (unless its an expensive car, like the GTR).

kyfdx

Most people panic when it starts dropping and sell at the worst possible time.

Oh... not me... I'll ride that dog all the way down to ZERO..

Fortunately, the bulk of my savings is in a Vanguard 401K... It does substantially better than my preferred alternative investment (Porsche Cayman..lol).

My new Subie seems to be getting 26-28 MPG... So, saving about $30/mo. in gas over the CR-V.. Unfortunately, the higher insurance takes about half of that savings....

roadburner

I'm still looking at a couple of E46 M3s. I've about decided that I just can't abide a Black/Black car(boring, hot, and hard to keep clean), so the loaded SMG is off the list. I love the Titanium/Imola CPO car- especially since it has manual seats and no sunroof, but it's a bit more than I want to spend. To further muddy the waters, a nearby BMW/M-B/Porsche/Lexus used car dealer just traded for an Imola 330i ZHP that still has 40K miles and 18 months of the BMW CPO warranty remaining. It's about $6000 less than the cheapest E46 M3 I've looked at. And then there's the Wild Card- but first, a bit of background information:
The one "problem" with the RB fleet is that every car except for the X3 is a stick, and my wife has a mental block about driving anything with a clutch. It would be nice if she could drive at least 50% of the fleet(not counting the Speed Triple). Which brings me to what I found yesterday- a Dolphin Gray 2005 S4 Tip. The price is decent but still negotiable, and the car also has the Audi equivalent of the BMW CPO warranty. My new (semi) retired status means I'll be spending the next 4-5 years travelling all over the state filling in for other co-workers, and the S4 is most certainly a nice fast cruiser/all-weather sled. My main concerns are long term reliability as well as maintenance/repair costs. I also don't know if the dealer and Audi would give me any warranty hassles for using the car in HPDEs; I KNOW BMW won't. The car is fitted with new Yoko all-seasons which means I'd have to buy a set of summer tires/wheels for track work. I guess it can't hurt to go drive it tonight- just to see what it's like... :P :surprise: :P

qbrozen

You lost me on a couple of points ... "speed triple"? HPDE?

Anyway, I feel your pain. It is why I got an automatic this time around. With the stick pickup and stick Alfa, it left us in a difficult place. Granted, my wife still had 2 vehicles, but she refuses to use the bimmer in any kind of inclement weather.

michaellno

"Speed Triple" - some type of motorcycle; I forget the brand (Ducati?)

"HPDE" - High Performance Driving Events

corvette

I think an Audi will always be a lot less hardcore than the equivalent BMW.

My service loaner is a 2008 A4 2.0T FWD S-line with the CVT. I think Nissan does a better CVT than Audi, but it's still pretty neat. There is an awful rattle at certain RPMs, with only 5,500 miles on the clock...

Congratulations on your semi-retirement!

Kirstie_H

A reporter would like to speak with consumers who are in the market for a new vehicle and are looking into their financing and leasing options. Please respond to jwahl@edmunds.com with your daytime contact information no later than Monday, August 11th.

roadburner

"speed triple"?

It's a Triumph motorcycle; mine is a 1996:



Anyway, I feel your pain. It is why I got an automatic this time around.

Exactly. I've even told her to practice using the Wrangler- it's not like she's going to hurt it.

mark156

To make this car related, I wanted my stocks to grow to pay for my car....

About 8 yrs ago I bought Pfizer stock. Since Pfizer makes Viagra... I just knew the stock wouldn't go down.... but, it did. I'm in the hole for a little more than half what I paid. Hopefully, it will come back as Pfizer is VERY cash rich. They just need to bring the stock up so I can get a pin-stripe on the Bentley.

M156

andre1969

Mmmkay, all this talk about Viagra and not going down, and bringing it back up is just too much for me to handle with a straight face at 3:00 on a Friday afternoon. :P

roadburner

Mmmkay, all this talk about Viagra and not going down, and bringing it back up is just too much for me to handle with a straight face at 3:00 on a Friday afternoon

That's what SHE said!

woodyww

You've got the needle in way deep, dude. I could almost figure this out, except that you intend to track this expensive car, also drive it on the street, & the wife who needs an automatic. Possibly?--it's too many demands for one vehicle?

What are the prices & mileages of those 4 cars? The Imola 330i ZHP that still has 40K miles and 18 months of the BMW CPO warranty remaining sounds real good to me. Affordable? The S4--always wanted one, never had the guts so far to buy an audi, but what's the price/mileage?

lemmer

Get the stick. If you get an automatic, most likely she will find something else to complain about. Your Speed Triple might be next on the list.

roadburner

What are the prices & mileages of those 4 cars?

Well, its down to two at present, as the Titan/Imola M3 was sold. The ZHP has 60K on it and they are asking $23,000. The S4 has 36K and is priced at $31,900. I sure wish that 72K 2004 M3 with SMG was a different color- it just about splits the difference at $28,700- I could probably bag it for under $25,000.

roadburner

Your Speed Triple might be next on the list.

I don't think so; she has encouraged me to consider a more practical new bike. She especially likes the Bonneville T 100.

corvette

Is this at Bluegrass? They've got the same car listed at their main portal at $31900, and on their Audi portal at $35900.

guss

Sounds like my wife...........before we got married.

roadburner

Is this at Bluegrass? They've got the same car listed at their main portal at $31900, and on their Audi portal at $35900.

Yes, I looked at the car yesterday and the tag on the rear view mirror said $31900 while the Audi Pre-Owned sticker had $35900.

corvette

I dropped my A4 off there Thursday for service... They had a banner hanging in the service department thanking all of the customers who had given them perfect marks on the CSI (including names). Guess it's a carrot/stick sort of thing... Not to mention the privacy concerns.

woodyww

I love the Titanium/Imola CPO car- especially since it has manual seats and no sunroof, but it's a bit more than I want to spend.

I was just out mowing my yard, & thinking I'd post: "how would you feel if that bmw you really liked the most sold"? (It was either bmw's, or the latest paris hilton video to think about).

that 72K 2004 M3 with SMG: the miles, & the SMG, would scare the H*ll out of me. Low-ish miles are really key with cars like these. And there was some thread on the RWTIV board a year or so ago about the SMG; it wasn't favorable. How reliable is the SMG?

The S4--1/2 the miles, w/warranty, CPO? For about the same $$? In snow country? I'd be checking that one out. Heck, I test-drove a new 1.8T A4 stick, SPP, a few years ago, I loved it.

(But then, should you take advice from a guy who thinks about paris hilton in her bathing suit while he's mowing his yard?????? )

woodyww

About 8 yrs ago I bought Pfizer stock.......I wanted my stocks to grow to pay for my car.....

I bailed on that awful Pfizer stock a few weeks ago, at a few $$thou loss. Also GE, ditto (could have been a mistake, selling GE when I did; it's a good company). Oh, & CBS, what a horrible turkey. I don't have the fortitude you guys do, to hang on forever. But I hung onto my "good" stocks: Pepsi, JNJ, Genuine Parts. (Never bottom-fish, in "value-trap" stocks with low PE's & high dividends, just pay the 20 P/E for coke or pepsi or P&G or......).

But I also equate $$ losses in the stock market with cars: I'm down enough in one year to have paid for a brand new Porsche 911, & maybe a new Subie too, for winter duty. Or a very large down payment on a $500K house.......

PS-this guy Michael Kahn, in Barrons, who's been right on about the bear market so far, is saying the current rally is just another "rally in a bear market". FWIW......

(I know this is OT, but there were already a lot of posts about it so.....).

abrown1966

My daughter has a 2000 Grand Prix that has started making a whiring noise under the hood.. If the air conditioner is turned the noise changes, but does not go away. With the hood up, it seems to come from the air compressor, and I'm thinking it is probably the clutch on the compressor.

Is there a way to check this or doe you have any other suggestions?

Thanks

Alan

stever

Hey Alan, try the Pontiac Grand Prix Climate Control/AC discussion or perhaps Climate Control Problems (Air Conditioning, Heat) - All Cars.

roadburner

the miles, & the SMG, would scare the H*ll out of me. Low-ish miles are really key with cars like these. And there was some thread on the RWTIV board a year or so ago about the SMG; it wasn't favorable. How reliable is the SMG?

I was looking at a an M3 w/SMG about a year ago and my service advisor told me that they are actually very reliable. He went onto say, "Just dont try to hold them on a hill using just the throttle; the result isn't pretty." As for the miles, I'm not that worried; that engine is dead nuts reliable as long as you keep it under 7000 rpm. The only real down side is that the valve adjustment on all 24 valves makes the Inspection I and II a bit pricey(might have to learn how to DIY if I get one).

The S4--1/2 the miles, w/warranty, CPO? For about the same $$? In snow country? I'd be checking that one out. Heck, I test-drove a new 1.8T A4 stick, SPP, a few years ago, I loved it.

It's still on the radar; I really need to find out exactly what the S4 maintenance requirements/costs are. I've run into so many "experts" on BMW running costs-most of whom have never sat in one-that I want to be certain that I get my information from someone who actually KNOWS S4s...

corvette

Bluegrass publishes a maintenance schedule with prices for the factory recommended services, along with prices for their additional recommended services. E.g., $229.07 plus taxes and a $13 "environmental charge" for the 15k service on my 2.0T. I'm sure the S4 is a different animal, but they probably publish a price list for it, too...

Audis call for service at 5,000 miles and then every 10,000 miles thereafter. On the pre-2008 A4, the service light will come on every 5,000 miles even though the maintenance schedule only requires it every 10.

I drove a used XC90 2.5T yesterday. Really nice, solid vehicle, and it handled well. A little sluggish on acceleration, but the engine was eager (and not terribly noisy) to rev. Not as nice as an X5, but not nearly as expensive, although I think the asking prices still don't reflect current market realities.

kyfdx

There was an '05 Imola/alcantara ZHP that D&R had for sale in Indy, last month...

The guy that bought it already has it back up for sale... It's CPO... can't remember the asking price, but it's at least a couple thou lower than what the dealer had it listed for... low miles, too..

If you browse the BMW-interest classifieds, you can probably find it.. he lives in Michigan..

regards,
kyfdx

kyfdx

Report in Prices Paid..

new '08 XC90 with the 3.2 engine..

$42,XXX MSRP

$28,XXX selling price

Might be leaving something out.. but, that seems like a great deal to me.. (unless it's really and XC70?)

corvette

Looks like $4250 dealer cash on the new ones, but that's still $10k under invoice. I find that hard to believe!

The sales consultant did say that there are always plenty of them coming off lease, so it's no trouble to get a used one in a specific color or with a specific option. The backup sensors were really neat--they actually detected a curb that only stood 6" off the ground!

kyfdx

It's in the XC90 lease questions forum, if you want to look at it...

Volvo is weird, though... Sometimes they give bigger incentives for third-party leases, than they do for straight purchases... That makes no sense, unless they have some sort of kickback deal with the 3rd party lessors...

Maybe volvomax would know..

woodyww

I'm not an expert, but if maintenance requirements/costs are a factor, it's hard for me to believe that a 330 ZHP wouldn't be less expensive to maintain than an M3 w/SMG, or an S4 (Esp. when the warranty runs out).

Any of these cars would be like candy or catnip to a lot/most of us. But: what do you really want? Do you love driveing the S4 more than the M3, or???? How does driving the ZHP compare to an M3????

roadburner

Any of these cars would be like candy or catnip to a lot/most of us. But: what do you really want?

That's why I'm taking my time deciding; I've learned my lesson with the Mazdaspeed debacle. The 330i ZHP is gorgeous, but it just doesn't grab me. I do want to drive the S4 to just see what it's like. The E46 M3s remind me of my E24 M6- only with a bit less weight and a lot more power. I'd seriously consider the new EVO if Mitsubishi's warranty practices weren't so assinine.

corvette

If you want to kick it up a notch further, you can always look for an M Coupe (same engine as the M3, but it felt faster/lighter when I drove one). Not very practical, and might be harder to find than an M3, though.

I doubt that you can go wrong with an M3.

roadburner

If you want to kick it up a notch further, you can always look for an M Coupe (same engine as the M3, but it felt faster/lighter when I drove one). Not very practical, and might be harder to find than an M3, though.

I'd love an M Coupe, but like you said, not very practical. I need a somewhat usable rear seat.

tifighter

If you want to kick it up a notch further, you can always look for an M Coupe

M coupe...guaranteed classic. Stop talking about them...I want them cheap when I'm ready...

Hey Roadburner, maybe we need to make a Chronic Triumph Buyers Anon. thread...just bought a Sprint ST a few weeks ago and need to get it logged somewhere.

roadburner

Hey Roadburner, maybe we need to make a Chronic Triumph Buyers Anon. thread...just bought a Sprint ST a few weeks ago and need to get it logged somewhere.

That's a nice bike. Have you checked out the Triumph RAT forums? It doesn't cost anything to join RAT and you get a quarterly magazine as well. I really don't need a new bike, but that 50th Anniversary Bonneville would sure look nice next to the S3...

woodyww

The E46 M3s remind me of my E24 M6

I owned an E24 M6-I loved it, but IMO fairly antiquated compared to an E46. Even just an ordinary E46 with the smallest 6 & SPP blew away my M6 in Handling & overall performance.

I bet the guy who writes "tech talk" in the Roundel could nail all of your questions & give you some great advice....... seems to have an awesome knowledge of every bmw ever made.........& kind of an "advice guru" IMO.......