All that matters [ really ] is what makes sense TO YOU.
One thing I find interesting about the GP GXP is that, in doing a local search on cars.com, I see one that:
Has a 5 year, 100, 000 mile Factory Warranty on the driveline.
And should be eligible for GMPP B2B wty extension – to way, way beyond the 3 year / 36,000 mile OEM wty.
And I see both of these as something akin to [ a factory version of ] “I’ll take a fairly pedestrian sedan & shoehorn a hotter V8 under the hood – just for chuckles & grins."
Just my 0.2 gallons worth . . . - Ray 4-cyl Altima? Really?????
I know...that almost doesn't sound like me talking, does it? I remember last year, when one of my co-workers bought a new Acura TL, I went out to look at it. There was a new-ish Civic parked nearby, and I mentioned that I kinda liked them, and thought about trying one out next time around. He just looked at me shocked, and said "Okay...who are you, and what have you done with Andre?!"
I gotta admit, I do still like the Civic, but I have a feeling that it would just be too small for my tastes on a regular basis. I'd probably be most comfortable in something at least midsized.
But, I'm really trying to force myself to stay from Intrepids...if nothing else, just so I can experience something new.
I hear you .. in a previous wife-time, when I lived in California, we bought a '91 Protege. Nice car, decent pickup. It was dark blue and an automatic - wife's choices.
Not many months later, it was time for me to get a new car .. we found another Protege - similar trim level, except this one was light blue and a stick. I passed, thinking that I didn't want two of the same car in the family. Bought a '91 Sentra SE instead - a couple thousand cheaper than the Protege, but not nearly as well equipped.
If you can find an Aura with the 4-cyl and 6-speed auto, I think that would make a good commute / road trip car. I think that combo gets 33 MPG highway, which is better than the AltiCamCord triplets. Plenty roomy, too.
God knows I've sat in enough of them over the years as I was getting my Saturns worked on at the dealership. I was focused more on the XR with the 3.6L V6, however.
Why not look at a pre-owned TL? It's highway MPG are not that far off of the 4 cylinder sedans, they are reliable, and a step up from Camrys, Accords, Bonnevilles, etc. The CIvic Si sedan was on my final list but, like you, I thought I would grow out of it pretty quickly and am trying to avoid the cycle that is CCB.
corvette: The Camry is a 36 month lease .The dealer paid my first payment for me so I have 35 payments left. I am hoping that this one lasts. If it does, it will be the car that I hand down to little Gee in 10 years when he is ready for his first car. I already like it more than I liked my 09 Accord. It is quieter and does not have the annoying issues my Accord had (sticky drivers door handling, click in steering wheel, warped rotors, and random pop from the rear suspension). It is just as roomy as has the same fuel economy, and in my opinion, the Camry SE looks better than the Accord.
If you can find an Aura with the 4-cyl and 6-speed auto, I think that would make a good commute / road trip car. I think that combo gets 33 MPG highway, which is better than the AltiCamCord triplets. Plenty roomy, too.
Yeah, if I go the 4-cyl route, I definitely want that 6-speed auto. Although I think I'd be happy with the 3.5/4-speed. I do like the sound of that 33 mpg on the highway, though! And I wonder if it would be easier to get even better than that, since that 33 is the newer, "dumbed-down" figure? Using those figures, my Intrepid got dumbed down to 27 highway, but its original EPA listing in the window sticker was 29. And it was easy to hit 29 with that car. I thin the best I ever did with that car was something like 32.1! So I wonder if that 33 mpg would equate to more like 36-37 mpg using the older ratings?
I think that local Bonnie GXP looks sharp. Lot of car for the money. Hope you'll test drive it and let us know how it feels.
There is something sharp and minimalist about current Civic. And they aren't that small these days--about the size of an 82-85 Accord, I think.
If you're thinking about Aura and Altima, however, what about that big other "A" name in the segment--the Accord. I own one myself, but I think they are terrific cars. But there are a lot of great choices out there for you.
I like the previous-gen TL, but just never thought to look, thinking they'd be more than I want to pay. But then, maybe not. I just did a quick search on the 2004-08 models in my area, and prices ranged from around $13K to 33K. Here's the cheapest one I found, a2004 with 83K miles on it for $12,988. That's about $1500 more, and 33K miles more than a 2004 Bonneville I had found. But then, who knows? While the TL is a smaller car, it's also a nicer car. And I'm sure the 3.2 in it would lay waste to the 3.8, non-supercharged pushrod in the Bonneville. And would probably hold its resale better if I decided it wasn't for me, after all.
There is something sharp and minimalist about current Civic. And they aren't that small these days--about the size of an 82-85 Accord, I think.
I've sat in a few Civics, and found them to be fairly roomy inside. But with a 106" wheelbase, they're not exactly tiny! Not too long ago, that would've been considered a midsized-car wheelbase. Back in college, a friend of mine had a 1984 Accord sedan. I rode in it a couple times, and seem to remember the passenger seat going back so far I could almost stretch my legs out straight! I never drove it though, so I dunno how the driver's seat was, in relation to the pedals and such. And with the seat all the way back, the back was really cramped. The new Civic though, still seems decent up front to me, and I can fit in the back okay too, although that's partly because of the way the seatbacks are shaped...my knees actually straddle the seat a bit.
I have thought about the Accord, too, but I think here I'd just go ahead and buy brand-new, since they don't depreciate that fast. As for that 2011 Hyundai, I'm not too crazy about it. I like the look of it from the rear, but not too crazy about the front, side, or most other angles!
I think all the die-hard CCBAers like me are going to die of impatience before you buy the replacement for the Intrepid! Forget all this "hey I just noticed this on the internet" and "there's no way I would buy one, but what an amazing ad for (Model X) this is!", get out there and DRIVE A FEW! :-)
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Biggest problem with the TL is they like to dump the transmission periodically (unless you get a TL-S with a stick, but you're not that sort of guy). If you want to give Nipponophilia a try, maybe you could hunt up a nice early-00s Maxima or I35?
The Hyundai looks like a ES350 and a CLS500 had a baby and Hyundai threw in an interior from the new CTS to make it a well-rounded product of other companies designs. Hyundai really needs to focus on coming out with an original design. I appreciate their offering for the money but it seems that they are taking cues from popular sedans and merging them into one design. I also do not like the steering wheel in that Hyundai. Maybe it translates better in person.
I like the Accord but my experience will not let me buy a new Honda for a while. As much as I loved them, I am a woman scorned right now and it would take something special to make me buy another new Honda. My cut off is 2007, I will buy used, but not newer.
This is going to drive us crazy. andre actually in the market and we get our hopes all up..... Mark my words, before he makes up his mind the DeSoto will be back on the road and he'll be saying "hey, this is all right".....
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
Andre: It's Interesting you don't like the new Sonata that much. It reminded me a bit of the Intrepid--but maybe I'm way off base with that.
OT: Recently bought a new piano, which is as fascinating and complicated as buying a car. On the piano world forums discussion there was a thread about weird things young students say when taking lessons from teachers. One little kid was told by her teacher that they were now going to work on their first "Sonata." "Sonata??!" The kid said, "That sounds like the stuff that comes out of your nose!" Well, it made be laugh a bit. But keep in mind that little "joke" if you can call it that was free--no extra charge. Somehow, thinking about the new Hyundai Sonata with it's super high pressure direct injection engine put that joke into a whole new vivid horror-film like light. Sorry. I apologize in advance if I've gone out of bounds. I'm easily amused in my middle age.
Now back to our regularly scheduled car shopping program.
The TL looks great in the 2004-2008 generation. The current generation TL is almost Aztec-ugly. Something went very wrong, although I kind of still like it a little in a bizarre way--kind of like andre liking the dash of a Bonnie, I suppose.
Anyway, a used TL could be a great car. 80k seems like a lot of miles, but maybe not for a Honda. For the price of a new Civic it sure is a lot more car.
A new Civic, however, is likely to go for 10 years without much more than oil changes, a set of brake pads, and a set of tires. The TL would likely need a lot, lot more...
You have to be weary with those. Nissan has had issues with O2 sensors needing almost annual replacement. Nissan's recent reliability is what kept me away from the new Altima. And Maximas/I35 have a rear axle which would annoy me.
The 3.5 / 4 speed auto is a very quiet powertrain in everyday driving. If I had the choice at the time, I'd probably have gone with the four cylinder / 6 speed auto. I don't think the performance is all that different, and the mileage would be better.
This is going to drive us crazy. andre actually in the market and we get our hopes all up..... Mark my words, before he makes up his mind the DeSoto will be back on the road and he'll be saying "hey, this is all right".....
LOL...I really wish I COULD make up my mind, though. My 2000 Intrepid was the most expensive automotive purchase of my life...yet I had no trouble at all making that decision. And yet I'm in better shape financially now than I was then, plus I'm considering used cars that will cost a lot less than that Intrepid did. The Intrepid was $22,389 out the door, which included a $1200 extended warranty that I probably overpaid for, and never needed to use. Adjusting for inflation, that's probably like paying $28-29,000 for a car nowadays!
Now the guys will hate this but take your time. You have the luxury of having indefinite time to play with since you've got the other cars and truck.
I know what you mean on deciding. When we bought the Accord it only took a week tops from when we decided we were in the market to buying. We were in a hurry to dump the Windstall before anything else went wrong with it. We looked at a Passat wagon which I'd have bought had i not owned a Rabbit before and got a case of VW jitters. Looked at a Leagcy wagon which we absolutely would have bought had it been just a touch bigger. Loved it but the rear seat was tight. Had I known the girls were only going to be 5'2" I'd have bought it. So we went back to Honda. We'd had two previous Accords so it was a playing it safe selection.
If I had to replace the Accord now I have no idea what I'd do. I'd be looking at most things in its class - Fusion, 6, Altima, Accord, Outback.... I might not look at a Malibu but that is only because of the distance from the dealer. The same thing might rule out VWs.
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
Well the good thing is that it's a buyer's market, so you're in full control here Andre.
The best way to find something without getting distracted is to browse the net, read some reviews, browse your head and make a list of all cars you' would be interested in. Even if the list has 30 different models on it, just write them all down.
Then start corssing them out based on price, availability, impracticality, or if they don't meet any other criteria you chose.
After that you should have a list of 5-10 cars left.
Go out and test drive each of those models from the list. When you're done you should have crossed out another half off your list, leaving you with 3-5 cars.
Then start shopping for exact models, Ideally leave 3 vehicles on your final list and go out and actuallylook at potential examples you'd be willing to buy.
Don't forget to consider resale. Although you do keep your cars forever (which is anti-CCBA behavior) consider resale should you get bored of the car. A Bonny will be worth considerably less than a TL in 3 or so years. I'd also check Consumer Reports as their reliablity indicators are pretty accurate for older cars.
But that's how we bought our condo. There were always new ones coming on the market, but time was running out and I was getting tired of the shopping and looking at countless units. I made a list of about 20 condos and gave it to my realtor. I told him we'll be buying one of these off the list that month. So he crossed out the crappy ones for us, told us about the rest, which then we crossed out leaving us with 4 units. We looked at all 4 on the final list, picked 2, narrowed down to 1 and bought.
"Okay...who are you, and what have you done with Andre?!"
Andre, take a "walk on the wild side" (Lou Reed). Life is too short just to keep buying the same brands of cars that all seem so similar. (Unless you have a bmw or Porsche addiction maybe). You like TL's? Altimas? Check them out. Subies? No-one's tried to talk you into a Subie yet--......Old Volvo, 850 say, drive one, maybe??
You know I bet Andre would like a old body style S80. You should be able to pick up 2005 or 2006 MY certified ones for the upper teen range. Warranty out to 100,000 miles, torquey turbo five cylinder, nice big comfy seats with a nice floaty ride. They made then FWD or AWD.
What year is this again? Sounds like a steal if it's an E39.
It's a 2000 with almost 91k on it. My service advisor just called and said it checks out 100%, and he put his most nitpicking tech on the car. I won't need another service visit for @5k. Now, if I can only get it for around $2k + my MS3...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Your name is Andre and you like American cars. If you got a European car, you'd have to change your name to a standard American name, like Andrew. No one wants that... :P
I drove that 2000 Park Ave Ultra. And I kinda hate to say it, but I'm in love! Or, at least, lust. It was big and comfy inside, like I knew it would be, but I was impressed that the seats were a bit more firm and supportive than I expected. Side bolstering was minimal, so it's not going to hold me in place if I go autocrossing in it, but it seemed to hit my thighs and back in just the right places. Definitely more comfy than the Intrepid, and better legroom to boot. Although to be fair, a Trep with a power seat would be an improvement over what I had.
The interior also seemed higher quality than what I was expecting. No, it's not a Lexus or Benz, but it didn't feel like anything was going to fall off, either. And everything lined up fairly well. GM's current efforts are better, but I'd say this thing is a big step up from my Dad's '03 Regal, where the dashboard is off by about 3/4 inch on the passenger side.
The supercharged 3.8 sounded nicer than I expected, too. Maybe my standards are just too low, or I got used to driving around in that '79 NYer with no muffler and I'm now going tone-deaf, but it didn't bother me. I stomped on it a few times, and it seemed to take off pretty well, but somehow it didn't seem as fast as I thought it would be. But then, it's also a bigger, quieter car than my Intrepid, and sometimes those cars that isolate you feel like they're slower than they really are. What's one of these good for 0-60 for? Around 7.5-8 seconds?
I took it down a narrow, bumpy, back country road, to see how bad the interior rattled. I was impressed. Not a squeak or rattle to be heard. And I had a friend with me, to listen out for that kind of stuff, so I could get an objective opinion (even if he does drive a Chevy truck :P )
Now, it was dark when I looked the car over, and I really want to see it in the daylight, but overall the only thing I could find wrong with it was some small scratches on the rear bumper fascia, possibly from taking stuff in and out of the trunk. And on the edge of the trunk lid, there were some minor scratches.
I was also pleasantly surprised that the car had a sunroof! I didn't think it would, as the website didn't mention it, and unfortunately there are no pics. And damn, I forgot to bring my digital camera!
It also has a heads-up-display for the speedo, which I thought was a cool touch. It also has heated seats on both sides, power seats on both sides, dual zone climate control, a nice sound system with an amplifier, and probably a few other things I'm forgetting to mention. Now my friend was ragging on the radio, because it won't tell you the name of the song that's on, but I don't think too many cars did that back then!
It was also owned by an older lady, but one not too ancient. 65, so she would've been 55 when she bought it. She traded it on a new 2010 LaCrosse CXL, or whatever the one is with the 3.6 DOHC. So, maybe she's more the little old lady from Pasadena type, but if she was, she still seemed to take good care of this Park Ave.
Anyway, $7500, 56000 miles, Maryland inspected, and they're throwing in a new battery. It started fine for me, but the salesguy said it seemed a little weak when he first started it.
All of a sudden, that Pontiac Bonne-whatever I'd been lamenting over has sort of slipped my mind. :P
Is this one at Fitzmall? From what I gather, they seem to be a pretty reasonable dealership to do business with.
I've driven my late grandfather's PA Ultra, and it's not for me, but it did have some neat features (the telescoping plastic covers over the seat rails come to mind).
that I wouldn't like this Park Avenue, as I was looking forward to checking out some other cars. In fact, when I called the salesman to see if tonight was good to come out and look at it, I asked him a question that I figured would sour me a bit. I asked him if it had a sunroof or not, as the website didn't specify. I just presumed that, since they didn't mention a sunroof, it didn't have one. So imagine my shock when he put me on hold, went to find out, and came back to say it DID have a sunroof! I'm starting to like this old lady who owned this car before me...I wonder if she needs a pool boy? :P
Maybe I am jumping the gun a bit, but I do have a good feeling about this. I mean, c'mon, how often is it that you find a GM car of that vintage that's rattle-free and doesn't have things falling off of it? :shades: It's also rare to find a Park Ave of this vintage around here in this kind of condition. Usually they're more beat-up and a bit ghetto-ed out, and tend to pop up in the buy-here-pay-here yo' job's yo' credit type lots closer in to the District.
While in graduate school around 2000, one of the researchers in my department was doing this FOT (field operational test) or something with a bunch of prototype collision avoidance and mitigation systems. The test vehicles were 7 Buick Le Sabers all totally loaded. Leather, auto this and that, loaded (at the time I had a no A/C '93 Civic with 180k). The cars weren't my thing but they were big and comfy and great cruisers. The Ultra is a supercharged 3.8, right? That seems like a pretty well proven drivetrain at this point. Tires and shocks make a big difference on those cars. Worn shocks make the car feel bloated and unresponsive, and crummy tires make it worse. Good shocks give a comfortable, controlled ride, and a "performance touring" tire should help it soak up the bumps without feeling totally disconnected from the road.
No, this one's at Capitol Cadillac in Greenbelt, MD (http://www.capitolcadillac.com/VehicleDetails/558829563). Fitzmall does have this similar 1998 model, though. It's $1000 less, but is two years older and has 32,000 more miles. The one I'm looking at is more of a light champagne color. It's not my first choice in a color...if I was buying new and had more choice I'd be more likely to pick a blue or green (even if green tends to be "no-sale" come resale time). But, it's still a color that looks good on the car, and won't start looking tacky in a few years, like some of those once-fashionable 70's colors did.
Andre have you thought about a an STS or DTS or another alphabet soup Northstar Cadillac?
Well, I like the older Seville-type STS, but the current model just doesn't do it for me. There's just something about the styling that seems a bit anonymous to me...kinda like a slightly larger CTS without the pizzaz. I didn't really care for the previous DeVille/DTS, but the newer one, like what Lemko has, is really nice. They're probably more than what I want to pay though. Plus, I have heard that the Northstar doesn't always age well and can get a bit expensive when it needs work. With the way I drive though, that might not be too much of a concern. If I do decide to buy this 56000 mile Park Ave, my guess is that it's going to be about 7 years before I hit 100,000 miles. Unless something happens like I take a job further away or something, but I don't see that happening.
And I don't think Lemko really needs to worry too much, either. I think his 2007 DTS has a whopping 10,000 miles on it after about two years of ownership!
That is a lot of car for the money. That car originally listed for c. 35k+, I think.
I rented an Ultra once and loved it. You step on the gas and it goes.
Loads of room everywhere. And if you haven't already seen it, you won't believe the trunk. It's huuuuuge. Great trip car. Dashboard is a bit plain, but better than most bonnies imho. Nice features throughout.
Get a mechanic to check it out, I think, but here's hoping it pans out.
Even if it only lives 5 years you'll get your money's worth, imho, and it's likely to last longer than that, maybe a lot longer. Might even have a good 10 years/100k miles left in her.
>I mean, c'mon, how often is it that you find a GM car of that vintage that's rattle-free and doesn't have things falling off of it?
Fairly often. The Buicks are well built. My 170,000 1998 leSabre doesn't rattle--well, the cigarette lighter rolls a little in the ash tray because I don't leave it in the socket: it's never been used. My 95,000 03 leSabre doesn't rattle. Drives like a dream with quality Michelins 225x60 on the 16-inch wheels. I would have bought the burgundy Park Ave the dealer had but my wife (and I liked the crimson red available again on the leSabre for the Celebration instead of the older colors).
The supercharger oil change is a turkey baster type suction removal and refill with a couple of bottles of dealer oil specifically for superchargers. Reported to stink fairly strongly probably high sulfur content like some differential oils were.
The gear ratio may be different for the supercharged car vs the standard engine. That might make it feel less responsive. It also may need some "tough love" miles to get the computer used to a "youthful" driving style as opposed to the little old lady's style which probably never engaged the supercharger boost!
I assume it has Stabilitrak and Traction Control...
My BIL had a 1989 and 1997 Park Avenue and now has 2006 Lucerne. The P A's were not turbo's. The Lucerne has an 8cyl. He has had good luck with all three. The 97 went through 2 alternators and a starter I think. He told me it was never towed and never left him stranded. He liked the Park Avenues better than the Lucerne. He always admired The Bonneville but never owned one. I think he test drove one once and liked the Park Avenue better. It may not have been equippted the same way.
I have another friend who had a 1994 Bonneville and now has a 2003 Bonneville. He loved them both. He told me that the trunk was bigger on the 1994. He is upset that he can not get another. He has ridden in my Concorde and he says that it has more room inside than his Bonneville.
The supercharger oil change is a turkey baster type suction removal and refill with a couple of bottles of dealer oil specifically for superchargers. Reported to stink fairly strongly probably high sulfur content like some differential oils were.
Come on, man, I was going to wait until he bought the Park Ave, and then suggest he change the supercharger oil himself, as a way of getting to know the car, since "it's an easy job." (Actually, it's probably never been done on that car, since most people don't bother to change it.)
I thought the supercharged engine had a shorter, more responsive final drive, which is part of the reason it gets lower fuel economy than the standard version. I don't think they had Stabilitrak on the Park Ave in 2000, but it would've had traction control.
....when my mom still had her 300E, she would go on trips with one of her friends (woman in her 70s) and drive her LeSabre (and it was considerably older than that Park Avenue--it was the '92-99 variety); mom always raved about the comfort, quiet and even the engine (it was the regular non-aspirated 3.8). I rented a Regal LS (same engine, but maybe a bit higher HP) in 2000 for a trip to TN, through lots of mountain passes....I LOVED that car: lots of power (again, compared to the low-power hoopties I've owned), very comfortable seats, nice features and it literally got 30mpg on flat highway stretches. I had another Regal on our trip to Phoenix (yes, I drove from Chicago to Phoenix, this is when gas was ~$1/gal and the car, including mileage, was a little over $300 for ten days). It got a flat, thus running on a donut after, so was replaced with a Bonneville (the older variety). I liked that one, too (again, same engine) and we were taking two people back to Chicago from AZ with us, so I appreciated the extra room. Of the two, I'd take the Regal over the Bonneville. Nutshell, I like the idea of the PA Ultra, it's Bonne-sized with nicer Buick finishes and more power. Now, if only I could get my mom to buy one (she's been driving a RENTAL car for two years, because she insists she can't get a car loan, despite having equity in her house and retirement money; I want to choke her sometimes). :mad:
My parents have a LeSabre. The big bulbous one. Growing up, all we had were Toyotas and Porsches, usually in tandem, so the Buick still feels like its out of left field. Its a living room on wheels. Anyhow, they now maybe have 65k miles on it, and service it all the time despite rarely driving it. Anyhow, another reason why used Buicks are usually solid bets...
I'm almost afraid to ask, but what brand/model/vintage piano? There's something crazy about musicians who are also car nuts; it's fairly common tho......(I have stories, but I'll restrain myself).....
funny you say that, my mom bought a brand new Camry ('84), Cressida ('86), then a 944 ('87, which she still owns), and likely will have an American car this time (maybe a Buick, but she's been renting a Chevy HHR, of all things, and she likes it!). Mom is in her early 60s.
Comments
One thing I find interesting about the GP GXP is that, in doing a local search on cars.com, I see one that:
Has a 5 year, 100, 000 mile Factory Warranty on the driveline.
And should be eligible for GMPP B2B wty extension – to way, way beyond the 3 year / 36,000 mile OEM wty.
And I see both of these as something akin to [ a factory version of ] “I’ll take a fairly pedestrian sedan & shoehorn a hotter V8 under the hood – just for chuckles & grins."
Just my 0.2 gallons worth . . .
- Ray
4-cyl Altima? Really?????
[[ Edit: Meant to include the link:
http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail.jsp?tracktype=usedcc&csDlId=&csDgId=&listin- gId=33731012&listingRecNum=1&criteria=sf1Dir%3DDESC%26mkId%3D20035%26stkTyp%3DU%- 26mdId%3D21251%26rd%3D30%26crSrtFlds%3DstkTypId-feedSegId-mkId-mdId-trId%26zc%3D- 30096%26rn%3D0%26PMmt%3D1-1-1%26stkTypId%3D28881%26sf2Dir%3DASC%26sf1Nm%3Dprice%- 26sf2Nm%3Dmiles%26trId%3D24023%26rpp%3D50%26feedSegId%3D28705&aff=national
In the Grand Prix GXP [ with 2.93:1 final drive ]
2,000 RPM is over 70 MPH...
I know...that almost doesn't sound like me talking, does it? I remember last year, when one of my co-workers bought a new Acura TL, I went out to look at it. There was a new-ish Civic parked nearby, and I mentioned that I kinda liked them, and thought about trying one out next time around. He just looked at me shocked, and said "Okay...who are you, and what have you done with Andre?!"
I gotta admit, I do still like the Civic, but I have a feeling that it would just be too small for my tastes on a regular basis. I'd probably be most comfortable in something at least midsized.
I hear you .. in a previous wife-time, when I lived in California, we bought a '91 Protege. Nice car, decent pickup. It was dark blue and an automatic - wife's choices.
Not many months later, it was time for me to get a new car .. we found another Protege - similar trim level, except this one was light blue and a stick. I passed, thinking that I didn't want two of the same car in the family. Bought a '91 Sentra SE instead - a couple thousand cheaper than the Protege, but not nearly as well equipped.
If you can find an Aura with the 4-cyl and 6-speed auto, I think that would make a good commute / road trip car. I think that combo gets 33 MPG highway, which is better than the AltiCamCord triplets. Plenty roomy, too.
God knows I've sat in enough of them over the years as I was getting my Saturns worked on at the dealership. I was focused more on the XR with the 3.6L V6, however.
corvette: The Camry is a 36 month lease .The dealer paid my first payment for me so I have 35 payments left. I am hoping that this one lasts. If it does, it will be the car that I hand down to little Gee in 10 years when he is ready for his first car. I already like it more than I liked my 09 Accord. It is quieter and does not have the annoying issues my Accord had (sticky drivers door handling, click in steering wheel, warped rotors, and random pop from the rear suspension). It is just as roomy as has the same fuel economy, and in my opinion, the Camry SE looks better than the Accord.
Yeah, if I go the 4-cyl route, I definitely want that 6-speed auto. Although I think I'd be happy with the 3.5/4-speed. I do like the sound of that 33 mpg on the highway, though! And I wonder if it would be easier to get even better than that, since that 33 is the newer, "dumbed-down" figure? Using those figures, my Intrepid got dumbed down to 27 highway, but its original EPA listing in the window sticker was 29. And it was easy to hit 29 with that car. I thin the best I ever did with that car was something like 32.1! So I wonder if that 33 mpg would equate to more like 36-37 mpg using the older ratings?
Jumping back to Bonnevilles, I was curious to see what was local in the way of GXP's, and found this black 2005 with 46K miles for $12,974
There is something sharp and minimalist about current Civic. And they aren't that small these days--about the size of an 82-85 Accord, I think.
If you're thinking about Aura and Altima, however, what about that big other "A" name in the segment--the Accord. I own one myself, but I think they are terrific cars. But there are a lot of great choices out there for you.
No comment on the 2011 Hyundai?
I've sat in a few Civics, and found them to be fairly roomy inside. But with a 106" wheelbase, they're not exactly tiny! Not too long ago, that would've been considered a midsized-car wheelbase. Back in college, a friend of mine had a 1984 Accord sedan. I rode in it a couple times, and seem to remember the passenger seat going back so far I could almost stretch my legs out straight! I never drove it though, so I dunno how the driver's seat was, in relation to the pedals and such. And with the seat all the way back, the back was really cramped. The new Civic though, still seems decent up front to me, and I can fit in the back okay too, although that's partly because of the way the seatbacks are shaped...my knees actually straddle the seat a bit.
I have thought about the Accord, too, but I think here I'd just go ahead and buy brand-new, since they don't depreciate that fast. As for that 2011 Hyundai, I'm not too crazy about it. I like the look of it from the rear, but not too crazy about the front, side, or most other angles!
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I like the Accord but my experience will not let me buy a new Honda for a while. As much as I loved them, I am a woman scorned right now and it would take something special to make me buy another new Honda. My cut off is 2007, I will buy used, but not newer.
OT: Recently bought a new piano, which is as fascinating and complicated as buying a car. On the piano world forums discussion there was a thread about weird things young students say when taking lessons from teachers. One little kid was told by her teacher that they were now going to work on their first "Sonata." "Sonata??!" The kid said, "That sounds like the stuff that comes out of your nose!" Well, it made be laugh a bit. But keep in mind that little "joke" if you can call it that was free--no extra charge. Somehow, thinking about the new Hyundai Sonata with it's super high pressure direct injection engine put that joke into a whole new vivid horror-film like light. Sorry. I apologize in advance if I've gone out of bounds. I'm easily amused in my middle age.
Now back to our regularly scheduled car shopping program.
The TL looks great in the 2004-2008 generation. The current generation TL is almost Aztec-ugly. Something went very wrong, although I kind of still like it a little in a bizarre way--kind of like andre liking the dash of a Bonnie, I suppose.
Anyway, a used TL could be a great car. 80k seems like a lot of miles, but maybe not for a Honda. For the price of a new Civic it sure is a lot more car.
A new Civic, however, is likely to go for 10 years without much more than oil changes, a set of brake pads, and a set of tires. The TL would likely need a lot, lot more...
http://autos.yahoo.com/used-cars/infiniti-i35-cars332482514;_ylt=AnT5CCvnPWuOzNQ- 5xrioquA6VI54;_ylv=3?sortcol=price&sortdir=up&location=Hagerstown%2C+MD+21740&li- stingtype=used&model=&make=infiniti&distance=50
(the Fitzmall car was in Florida)
LOL...I really wish I COULD make up my mind, though. My 2000 Intrepid was the most expensive automotive purchase of my life...yet I had no trouble at all making that decision. And yet I'm in better shape financially now than I was then, plus I'm considering used cars that will cost a lot less than that Intrepid did. The Intrepid was $22,389 out the door, which included a $1200 extended warranty that I probably overpaid for, and never needed to use. Adjusting for inflation, that's probably like paying $28-29,000 for a car nowadays!
I know what you mean on deciding. When we bought the Accord it only took a week tops from when we decided we were in the market to buying. We were in a hurry to dump the Windstall before anything else went wrong with it. We looked at a Passat wagon which I'd have bought had i not owned a Rabbit before and got a case of VW jitters. Looked at a Leagcy wagon which we absolutely would have bought had it been just a touch bigger. Loved it but the rear seat was tight. Had I known the girls were only going to be 5'2" I'd have bought it. So we went back to Honda. We'd had two previous Accords so it was a playing it safe selection.
If I had to replace the Accord now I have no idea what I'd do. I'd be looking at most things in its class - Fusion, 6, Altima, Accord, Outback.... I might not look at a Malibu but that is only because of the distance from the dealer. The same thing might rule out VWs.
The best way to find something without getting distracted is to browse the net, read some reviews, browse your head and make a list of all cars you' would be interested in. Even if the list has 30 different models on it, just write them all down.
Then start corssing them out based on price, availability, impracticality, or if they don't meet any other criteria you chose.
After that you should have a list of 5-10 cars left.
Go out and test drive each of those models from the list. When you're done you should have crossed out another half off your list, leaving you with 3-5 cars.
Then start shopping for exact models, Ideally leave 3 vehicles on your final list and go out and actuallylook at potential examples you'd be willing to buy.
Don't forget to consider resale. Although you do keep your cars forever (which is anti-CCBA behavior) consider resale should you get bored of the car. A Bonny will be worth considerably less than a TL in 3 or so years. I'd also check Consumer Reports as their reliablity indicators are pretty accurate for older cars.
But that's how we bought our condo. There were always new ones coming on the market, but time was running out and I was getting tired of the shopping and looking at countless units. I made a list of about 20 condos and gave it to my realtor. I told him we'll be buying one of these off the list that month. So he crossed out the crappy ones for us, told us about the rest, which then we crossed out leaving us with 4 units. We looked at all 4 on the final list, picked 2, narrowed down to 1 and bought.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
Andre, take a "walk on the wild side" (Lou Reed). Life is too short just to keep buying the same brands of cars that all seem so similar. (Unless you have a bmw or Porsche addiction maybe). You like TL's? Altimas? Check them out. Subies? No-one's tried to talk you into a Subie yet--......Old Volvo, 850 say, drive one, maybe??
It's a 2000 with almost 91k on it. My service advisor just called and said it checks out 100%, and he put his most nitpicking tech on the car. I won't need another service visit for @5k.
Now, if I can only get it for around $2k + my MS3...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
I'd jump all over that.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
Your name is Andre and you like American cars. If you got a European car, you'd have to change your name to a standard American name, like Andrew. No one wants that... :P
25 NX 450h+ / 24 Sienna Plat AWD / 23 Civic Type-R / 21 Boxster GTS 4.0
The interior also seemed higher quality than what I was expecting. No, it's not a Lexus or Benz, but it didn't feel like anything was going to fall off, either. And everything lined up fairly well. GM's current efforts are better, but I'd say this thing is a big step up from my Dad's '03 Regal, where the dashboard is off by about 3/4 inch on the passenger side.
The supercharged 3.8 sounded nicer than I expected, too. Maybe my standards are just too low, or I got used to driving around in that '79 NYer with no muffler and I'm now going tone-deaf, but it didn't bother me. I stomped on it a few times, and it seemed to take off pretty well, but somehow it didn't seem as fast as I thought it would be. But then, it's also a bigger, quieter car than my Intrepid, and sometimes those cars that isolate you feel like they're slower than they really are. What's one of these good for 0-60 for? Around 7.5-8 seconds?
I took it down a narrow, bumpy, back country road, to see how bad the interior rattled. I was impressed. Not a squeak or rattle to be heard. And I had a friend with me, to listen out for that kind of stuff, so I could get an objective opinion (even if he does drive a Chevy truck :P )
Now, it was dark when I looked the car over, and I really want to see it in the daylight, but overall the only thing I could find wrong with it was some small scratches on the rear bumper fascia, possibly from taking stuff in and out of the trunk. And on the edge of the trunk lid, there were some minor scratches.
I was also pleasantly surprised that the car had a sunroof! I didn't think it would, as the website didn't mention it, and unfortunately there are no pics. And damn, I forgot to bring my digital camera!
It also has a heads-up-display for the speedo, which I thought was a cool touch. It also has heated seats on both sides, power seats on both sides, dual zone climate control, a nice sound system with an amplifier, and probably a few other things I'm forgetting to mention. Now my friend was ragging on the radio, because it won't tell you the name of the song that's on, but I don't think too many cars did that back then!
It was also owned by an older lady, but one not too ancient. 65, so she would've been 55 when she bought it. She traded it on a new 2010 LaCrosse CXL, or whatever the one is with the 3.6 DOHC. So, maybe she's more the little old lady from Pasadena type, but if she was, she still seemed to take good care of this Park Ave.
Anyway, $7500, 56000 miles, Maryland inspected, and they're throwing in a new battery. It started fine for me, but the salesguy said it seemed a little weak when he first started it.
All of a sudden, that Pontiac Bonne-whatever I'd been lamenting over has sort of slipped my mind. :P
Mark
Heck, I'd want to be in Andre's for the DeSoto.... But he's much younger than I am....
I've driven my late grandfather's PA Ultra, and it's not for me, but it did have some neat features (the telescoping plastic covers over the seat rails come to mind).
Maybe I am jumping the gun a bit, but I do have a good feeling about this. I mean, c'mon, how often is it that you find a GM car of that vintage that's rattle-free and doesn't have things falling off of it? :shades: It's also rare to find a Park Ave of this vintage around here in this kind of condition. Usually they're more beat-up and a bit ghetto-ed out, and tend to pop up in the buy-here-pay-here yo' job's yo' credit type lots closer in to the District.
The Ultra is a supercharged 3.8, right? That seems like a pretty well proven drivetrain at this point.
Tires and shocks make a big difference on those cars. Worn shocks make the car feel bloated and unresponsive, and crummy tires make it worse. Good shocks give a comfortable, controlled ride, and a "performance touring" tire should help it soak up the bumps without feeling totally disconnected from the road.
Well, I like the older Seville-type STS, but the current model just doesn't do it for me. There's just something about the styling that seems a bit anonymous to me...kinda like a slightly larger CTS without the pizzaz. I didn't really care for the previous DeVille/DTS, but the newer one, like what Lemko has, is really nice. They're probably more than what I want to pay though. Plus, I have heard that the Northstar doesn't always age well and can get a bit expensive when it needs work. With the way I drive though, that might not be too much of a concern. If I do decide to buy this 56000 mile Park Ave, my guess is that it's going to be about 7 years before I hit 100,000 miles. Unless something happens like I take a job further away or something, but I don't see that happening.
And I don't think Lemko really needs to worry too much, either. I think his 2007 DTS has a whopping 10,000 miles on it after about two years of ownership!
Yeah, I know - he also has other cars to drive around...
I rented an Ultra once and loved it. You step on the gas and it goes.
Loads of room everywhere. And if you haven't already seen it, you won't believe the trunk. It's huuuuuge. Great trip car. Dashboard is a bit plain, but better than most bonnies imho. Nice features throughout.
Get a mechanic to check it out, I think, but here's hoping it pans out.
Even if it only lives 5 years you'll get your money's worth, imho, and it's likely to last longer than that, maybe a lot longer. Might even have a good 10 years/100k miles left in her.
Someone will get this.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Well, I'll let you know if I get clawed. :shades:
Fairly often. The Buicks are well built. My 170,000 1998 leSabre doesn't rattle--well, the cigarette lighter rolls a little in the ash tray because I don't leave it in the socket: it's never been used. My 95,000 03 leSabre doesn't rattle. Drives like a dream with quality Michelins 225x60 on the 16-inch wheels. I would have bought the burgundy Park Ave the dealer had but my wife (and I liked the crimson red available again on the leSabre for the Celebration instead of the older colors).
The supercharger oil change is a turkey baster type suction removal and refill with a couple of bottles of dealer oil specifically for superchargers. Reported to stink fairly strongly probably high sulfur content like some differential oils were.
The gear ratio may be different for the supercharged car vs the standard engine. That might make it feel less responsive. It also may need some "tough love" miles to get the computer used to a "youthful" driving style as opposed to the little old lady's style which probably never engaged the supercharger boost!
I assume it has Stabilitrak and Traction Control...
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
were not turbo's. The Lucerne has an 8cyl. He has had good luck with all three.
The 97 went through 2 alternators and a starter I think. He told me it was never
towed and never left him stranded. He liked the Park Avenues better than the
Lucerne. He always admired The Bonneville but never owned one. I think he test
drove one once and liked the Park Avenue better. It may not have been equippted
the same way.
I have another friend who had a 1994 Bonneville and now has a 2003 Bonneville. He loved them both. He told me that the trunk was bigger on the 1994. He is upset
that he can not get another. He has ridden in my Concorde and he says that it
has more room inside than his Bonneville.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
Come on, man, I was going to wait until he bought the Park Ave, and then suggest he change the supercharger oil himself, as a way of getting to know the car, since "it's an easy job." (Actually, it's probably never been done on that car, since most people don't bother to change it.)
I thought the supercharged engine had a shorter, more responsive final drive, which is part of the reason it gets lower fuel economy than the standard version. I don't think they had Stabilitrak on the Park Ave in 2000, but it would've had traction control.
25 NX 450h+ / 24 Sienna Plat AWD / 23 Civic Type-R / 21 Boxster GTS 4.0
I'm almost afraid to ask, but what brand/model/vintage piano? There's something crazy about musicians who are also car nuts; it's fairly common tho......(I have stories, but I'll restrain myself).....