Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

fezo

Oh, that pass through to the trunk would be a great thing for me!

I like being able to have the trunk at the same temperature as the rest of the car when I'm lugging a guitar or two. Beats splitting the wood!

andre1969

Yeah, I've seen a few of those cars where the glass slides up over the roof. I guess it's a good idea on the surface, since it doesn't cut into headroom like the one that goes into the roof would. But in this Park Ave, I still think it has good headroom. If the sunroof is cutting into the headroom, I don't notice it.

I also finally figured out the trip computer and some other functions. It's actually not that hard to figure out, since I guess they were designed with old people in mind. It computes instant and average mpg, miles to empty, and also monitors tire pressure, oil life (currently 99%), battery voltage (I think it said 13.4V?), oil pressure (I think it said 130 psi...isn't that kinda high?), and coolant temp (167 degrees). All these readings were taken while we were sitting out in the driveway, playing with it.

I do think I really got lucky with this car. Just seemed to be in the right place at the right time. And at least it got me off that Bonneville kick! It's really too much car for my needs, but hell, I'm pushing 40...maybe it's time to indulge! For some reason, the theme song to "The Jeffersons" is going through my mind now...

imidazol97

>130 psi

60-70 cold with xx-30 oil in it. A failure of the pressure sender is to give high pressure. It's a fairly easy reach above the oil filter to replace the sender with car on jackstands.

benjaminh

Up to the top. To a deluxe Ultra in the garaaaage.

Seems like you did get lucky. Hey, is that the exact same year as your old Intrepid? If so, you now know what you could have gotten back then if you were spending c.35K for a car rather than 21--or whatever you paid for the Trep. In your research have you discovered what the msrp of that puppy was back at the turn of the century?

andre1969

Yep, the Intrepid was a 2000. Its MSRP was $20,950 ($20,390 + 560 freight). I ended up paying $22,389 out the door, which included a $1200 extended warranty I never needed to use. I think I had calculated that once I subtracted out the tax, extended warranty, freight and such, I effectively paid about $19,000 for the car, which I think was close to invoice.

I think the base MSRP on this Ultra was $36,800. I guess the sunroof would've added $900 or so? Dunno how much the cd/cassette combo would've added.

When you adjust for inflation, this Park Ave is the most expensive original MSRP car I've ever owned. By today's standards, I think the $36.8K would be in excess of $45K. I think my '79 5th Ave, which MSRP'ed for around $12K, would be around $35K today.

ghulet

with the over-the-roof sunroofs, it's usually on compacts (or sub-compacts) like the older, Saturns, Civics, etc., so I imagine not cutting into already skimpy headroom was probably part of the idea, along with cost-cutting. Not necessary on a car like your Ultra.
Isn't it nice, though, that you 'indulged' in a somewhat lavish vehicle that isn't going to bust your budget? What could be better? You kinda feel like you received a gift in a sense, eh?
Sadly, I still haven't figured out the ancient trip computer thingy in my 528e (and I've owned it for almost five months); admittedly, I'm more than a bit lazy, and also not willing to spend the (ridiculous) $35 or so that old BMW owners' manuals are going for on eBay, since the car didn't come with one. Mine doesn't do the oil life, pressure, tire pressure or any of those functions-I think it's basically MPG, averages of speed and it has a timer and clock. Woo-hoo. :P
Scariest thing, my compact (by today's interior standards), 127hp 1988 car had an MSRP of $31995, plus leather, plus automatic, so probably $33995. Good thing the dollar vs. deutschmark has evened out since then!

rayainsw

From the manual -
appears that it does not open over the roof -
but does have a tilt up \ vent position -
in addition to full slide back into roof mode:

"The sunroof switch can be operated in four directions to
control sunroof movement. To open the glass panel and
sunshade, press the switch rearward and release. The
sunroof will open automatically to the full-open
position. To stop the panel in a partially-open position,
press the switch again at the desired point. To continue
to open fully, press the switch rearward again and
release. The sunshade can also be opened manually.
To close the glass panel, press and hold the switch
forward. The sunshade must be manually closed.

Once the sunroof is closed, it can be opened to a vent
position. Push the switch upward to vent. To close, pull
the switch downward. The sunshade must be opened and
closed manually for vent operation."

js06gv

On the moonroof, try pushing the "close" portion of the switch when the sunroof is already fully closed. This should tilt it up. Pushing the "open" portion of the switch while tilted up should tilt it back down.

ghulet

....I push the 'forward' switch and it tilts up (with a little help from me, it's 22 years old), then push the backward for it to go back down from 'vent' mode (I think my mom's 300E had a separate switch for each)....one of those things I wouldn't have discovered if I didn't already know that the feature existed.

fintail

On my modern car, you push the switch "up" (I guess it could also be called forward) to tilt the roof up, and down or back to lower it. It's been the same on my previous MB. I assumed it was a universal.

andre1969

that I got really lucky with that Intrepid I had. I was talking with one of my friends last night, and he mentioned that his sister had a 2001 Intrepid and his brother had a 2002, both with the 2.7. Both of them are dead now. I don't know all the specific details about mileage and such, but the 2001 seized up, and the 2002 ruined the engine somehow...blown head gasket, maybe?

Of course, maintenance is also a critical factor. I have no idea how these other cars were cared for.

michaellno

Both the ION and the L300 have sunroofs. Both tilt and slide. The ION goes outside the roof, the L300 slides inside the roof.

However, I don't think the sunroof on the ION has been used more than a half dozen times in the three years my daughter has driven the car.

fintail

Even on my old 1989 S-class, the roof would tilt and slide. I have to imagine it does on Andre's fancy Buick too.

A sunroof is one of those things I really like to have now that I have lived with one for many years. If anything, just to let the light in with the shade open.

mark156

Andre, you are SO in your element with that BIG Buick Ultra and all your American Iron!! :P

Enjoy,
Mark

mark156

Fin, I had a '91 560 SEL with the sliding/tilting sunroof. It was all metal which I actually liked. I think the sunroof was the only thing that didn't break on that car. :sick:

Seriously though, the car was pretty good until it's last few years and 84,000 miles... new fuel injection, new power steering gear box and other misc. items. After about $8,000 in repairs, I decided to trade for a new 2000 E430 Sport. Now, my brother owns it buying the 'E' last year just before the '09 Bentley arrived.

Mark

andre1969

I drove the Buick in to work. Got it up to 60 mph on one stretch, to see what kind of rpms it pulled. Around 1600, so pretty loafy. My Intrepid, in comparison, did around 2000@60.

Checking the instantaneous mpg readout, the best I got was 75 mpg on one downhill stretch. I wonder how high the reading can go? My old '88 LeBaron kept track of fuel economy, and it would max out at 99 mpg.

I just hope that when I leave work today, I remember what I drove in! I got so used to that New Yorker or my pickup, both of which would stick out like a sore thumb. The Park Ave blends in more, although it does still stick out a bit being one of the few domestic-branded cars in the parking lot. Most of what's out there is a truck, SUV, or import car.

michaellno

I just hope that when I leave work today, I remember what I drove in!

You should get yourself a nice "Buick" keyring for the PA keys, so if you forget, you just pull the keys out of your pocket and remind yourself.

I have a much more difficult problem .. owning 3 Saturns, all the keys look exactly alike .. and, 2 of the 3 keyfobs are identical (the VUE is different as it has the remote start feature and a separate button on the remote).

As I drive the L300 and VUE regularly, I've got different key rings for each set of keys. The L300 has a nice "Saturn" keyring, while the VUE keys go onto a "Denver Broncos" keyring. Easy for me to identify them at a glance in my drawer.

The Park Ave blends in more, although it does still stick out a bit being one of the few domestic-branded cars in the parking lot. Most of what's out there is a truck, SUV, or import car.

When I was driving to work, the office building I worked in had many different types of cars in the lot. My co-workers drive everything from a Prius to a Saturn coupe. Some American iron, but certainly in the minority.

corvette

My late grandfather hit the "Eng/Met" button once by mistake, and was complaining that the speedometer said he was going over 100... Of course, that button switched it to KM/h.

fintail

Yeah, all MB back then had metal roofs...I don't think the glass roof became an item until the W140.

I drove my car, which was a 6cyl, for a few years...didn't spend more than a few hundred in surprise repairs. You had better luck with the W210, right?

colloquor

As one who worked at a Dodge dealer, the 2.7L V6 was (is) very prone to sludge. That could have been the cause of death of both of your friend's Intrepids.

andre1969

Yeah, I have heard that the 2.7 is prone to sludging, although every mechanic I've talked to said you have to neglect them to get them to do it. Let them run too low on oil, overheat for too long, go too long before changing, etc. I'd had good luck with mine, but then I bought it new and tried to keep up on oil changes. Never let it run too low, never overheated the car, etc. But because of that, when I was looking for a used car, I was automatically excluding used 2.7's, because I was worried about how the previous owner might have maintained them. I did find a couple of nice-sounding used Intrepids with the 3.2, and was tempted. It's just that after having an Intrepid for 10 years, I wanted to try something different.

roadburner

I saw that the dealer now has the M5 listed on its web site for $16950. That's no big deal; what really got my blood boiling was that the ad goes on to say "We have just had the inspection completed and all service updated as well." I paid for the inspection which, among other things, revealed that no service was due for @5k miles... :mad: :mad: :mad:

stickguy

go throw a tantrum at the dealer. Either get it for what they promised + wholesale cost of tires, or get your PPI money back since they fouled up the deal.

boomchek

And in addition to what stickguy is saying, you should write a letter or email to the General Manager.

I'm sure if you're a repeat customer they might take you seriously and offer some sort of a deal for you.

corvette

A lot of companies/dealers behave as if they don't value their customers' loyalty.

Didn't realize you paid for the inspection on their car. If they were doing that, you should've gotten first dibs on the purchase. It may not have been malicious on their part, but it was at the very least incompetent, and they should have made it right already (without any of the fuss and frustration you've already encountered).

woodyww

Did you get the PPI there??? That would make what they're doing worse, duh.

I know you liked your salesman & all, but esp. with a large dealership, until you have a deposit down on the car, any sales-person, or the UCM, could sell it to anybody while you were checking it out. I'm also thinking, your salesman should have known that, & if he really was authorized to sell it for $14K, had you put down a $500 deposit, contingent on the PPI, etc.

I understand why you're steamed, but there's a ton of used e39 M5's out there......don't let this raise your BP for too long......

roadburner

Did you get the PPI there???

Yes, that's what really yanked my chain. Which brings me to another thing that angers me. I believe I mentioned earlier that when the UCM thought I wanted the dealer to pay for the PPI, he told my sales guy that he wasn't going to "put another $300-$400 into the car."
Now, guess what my service advisor -at the same dealer- charged for the thorough PPI?
Give up?
Would you believe $64.00?
:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

corvette

Conspiracy theory: It sounds like the UCM has an axe to grind with the sales guy, and you're part of the collateral damage.

Karen_S

A reporter is looking to speak to consumers who are researching buying a vehicle and why or why not Chrysler vehicles were considered. Please send your daytime phone number and the car you purchased to ctalati@edmunds.com by Thursday, December 17, 2009.

mark156

Fin, I don't keep up with the chassis lettering, etc... so, I'm assuming that you are talking about the "E". It was a wonderful car. No problems except the sunvisor mirror lids kept breaking off. Both rear window regulators went out (typical of Mercedes). Other than that, not any problems. I sold it with 39,000 miles.

Honestly, no more Mercedes for me for a while. Just don't like the new styling. Really looking forward to seeing the new Jaguar XJL which is coming out in April as a 2011 (Land Rover guy told me about them and gave me a brochure). They have a Black w/tan interior Supersport coming in that might fit the bill (510 hp). We'll trade the 2001 S500 in on that if we like it. The 'new' style (2007+) Mercedes S-class just didn't click with us. :sick:

Mark

fintail

Yeah, that's the E. The earlier models, maybe 1996-99 had some issues, but the refreshed 2000-02 version seemed better. I live in fear of rear window regulator failure, so I don't even roll them down. It's been a MB issue for decades. My E55 is from the last couple months of production, and it's been decent, just a hiccup here and there.

This new XJ will be the last car developed under western ownership...I wonder if the brand will change. I can't imagine the Indians to be crazy or egoistic enough to make many changes in direction.

You also have a previous (W220) S-class? How has that been? I know some of the 2000-01 models have been very troublesome. I test drove one of those once, when I was younger and more foolishly-spending...it was 3 years old and it scared me, it was very plush and nice, but just so complex.

kplacer

A friend has a 2001 S430 which he purchased used, from the dealer, in 2006. New, here in Canada, it stickered at $96,000; he overpaid for it at just under $50K, because, I suspect, he trusted the dealer and they included a warranty. He needed that warranty. Problems with the car have been never-ending, including the need for new lifters in the engine, endless electrical and computer glitches, and most surprisingly, lots of paint and rust issues. They tell him that M-B used a new type of body finishing process on those cars and it did not work.

He is looking to unload it now and has been offered next to nothing for it. It is a real shame as the car is superb when all is well. That just doesn't happen very often.

fintail

Sounds like a nightmare. Engine problems don't seem to be too common on those, but electrical and airmatic failures are very common. One MB I advise people to run away from is a 2000-2002 S-class.

There was a paint finish issue on late 90s-early 00s cars - especially dark colored cars - that makes the paint chip easily, and probably doesn't help with rust prevention. Some 80s-90s MB can really start to get rusty in the right climate, and only time will tell if newer models have finally moved past that.

woodyww

The last S-class that I liked was the late '80's W126, either the SL, or SEC, those were some of the last "classic" M-B's IMO. (I'd love to have one now, if I had the $$ to build a bigger garage, pay whatever per year for maintenence, etc.).

I drove an early '90's used W140 S-class (in the early '90's), it did nothing for me. Your friend's experience with his S430 sounds worse than the worst Land-Rover stories you hear even; at least they have really nice paint; even less electrical issues in my experience ......

qbrozen

One just popped up on Ebay for you.

fintail

Those 126s can be had for not much now...the money you save vs some random new car (like a Bentley :P ) could buy the mintest Pebble Beach quality one in the world and maintain it spotlessly for a few lifetimes.

W140s can be a little troublesome too...it is all about maintenance, which includes replacing electrical and cooling system components as they age. 140 sedans are just OK for me, but a nice light blue C140 would be kind of cool, those are kind of weird (for MB) cars.

An early W220 or a Disco (or maybe late 90s Range Rover)...yeah, that's hard to decide, both can be hot depths of hell.

I read a post from a guy on a MB forum who owns both a V12 W140 and an old Bentley Turbo R...there's a glutton for punishment!

stickguy

that one I like. interesting color.

2 years newer with the same miles. I think the 2002 had some upgrades over the 2000 MY also. Not even too far away.

might have to bid on this one. Seems to have good hsitory (well, the owner seems to think so!)

stickguy

my accord decided to get a flat tonight, on Rt. 81. Only 200 miles from home.

man, after a couple of miles at 60 going flat, it was shred city. Hopefully the wheel is OK.

stuck in scranton for the night, since you apparently can't find a yokohama tire after the tire stores are closed!

I relaly need to figure out at home how to get the jack out of the trunk. Never did get that before teh AAA guy showed up!

also discovered some water in the spare tire well. That was not a pleasant surprise. No idea where that came from, but the donut had an ice skin on it!

changing a tire when it is 16 out is no fun.

kyfdx

Dang.... .. what a needle in a haystack!!

I like that gray-green color, but it was a dog to sell.... new or used.. It sure wouldn't keep me from getting it..

The only other drawback is the tan (sand) interior... Carpets the same color as the seats... sometimes it looks a little tired...

Okay... you go buy it... then sell it to me when I need a car in July...

fintail

What year is that Accord?

A friend of mine has an 03 Accord coupe. Earlier this year he was driving across a mountain pass in a 35 degree slush-storm, and got a flat. He pulls over and opens the trunk, to find a couple of inches of water in the spare well. Apparently the trunk seal was bad.

qbrozen

Hey stick. I was taking a look at the book trying to figure a value on that '02. Its kinda tricky, and maybe britishrover could help out here, but I think, given the carfax and miles, a dealer may be hard pressed to put $6k on it at trade time. So $7500 private party would be MORE than fair, I think.

british_rover

Which BMW was this again repost the link I must have missed it.

qbrozen

2002 325iT 5-spd, sport, luxo, 95k miles

stickguy

2005 4 door. Same deal, it was really cold and I had to drive through some slush (car was filthy), and it had been outside recently in a heavy, heavy rain

Found a little puddle in the bottom of the spare well when I took the donut out (even had some ice on the tire it was so cold).

Mopped it out today, and can't see how it got there. Was also nice and clean, and no signs of staining or rust, so must be recent.

Never would have found it if it wasn't for the flat.

Will monitor to see if it comes back.

Can't be too many entry points, since the carpet was dry, and I have a rubber liner covering the rest trunk floor.

Far easier to sell the car than to troubleshoot!

stickguy

sounds about right. So apply my usual 10-15% Ebay deduction, and 6-6,500 max bid!

that 2000 at the dealer in PA we decided that 7K should take it home, so a private sale needs to be lower, so figure the same. At 7K, I doubt I could pass up the 2002 if it was clean. Even the BIN is not too bad I guess.

One problem I have is I am not good enough on my own to eval a car like this, and logistically getting it inspected is going to be hard. Any pros close by want to go check it out?

michaellno

Saw a doppleganger of your car last night in a Target parking lot ... not sure of the year, but it was the same color and had the "Supercharger" badge on the trunk lid, so I know it was an Ultra.

Very nice looking car, given that it's close to 10 years old.

woodyww

Wow does that look nice. "It's got it all": SPP, stick, PP, even Xenons. But, 95K miles, & yeah, It should have had the Grey int., not tan, that's a bit weird. I don't know if you'd want to lose it over a few hundred $$?, but it's not my $$.

There must be good indie bmw shops near there for a PPI? But I kind of think driving it, & getting all the maint. records from the seller, might be enough for me....I love that blue & it sounds like the seller is good......

qbrozen

I never would have imagined they offered this with a stick.

Manual trans twin-turbo, 4200 lbs, and 14/19 mpg

kyfdx

Pretty cool.... I didn't realize you could get an All-Road with a stick, either...

But, I would be seriously afraid of that 2.7T engine... No way I would buy one of those..

If you really wanted a 5-speed RWD 3-series wagon, you won't find one better equipped than that one... Only other thing you could want is a different color combo.. ... and of course, you'd hope for a creampuff with only 60K miles, but that would just be greedy..

This is where the eBay thing bugs me.... It's hard to arrange a PPI, when you have the clock ticking on an auction...

tifighter

You guys get some nice deals on these E46 wagons on the east coast. These just don't really drop below $10k here in the Bay Area. And that's with 100k+ miles.