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And, as always, there will be those to really like the changes, and others who will ask why Honda screwed them up! Happens every time.
Yeah, doesn't Honda take a lot of flak every time they redesign the Accord? I remember a lot of people griped about the 2003-2007, but I liked it. The styling took a bit for me to warm up to, but I liked the size and interior room. I know the EPA says otherwise, but IMO, the 2003 was the first Accord that could truly be called midsized. I thought the '98-82 was a nicer looking car, but too small inside for my tastes.
Then, people griped about the 2008 Accord being too big, losing touch with its former self, etc. And I'm sure they'll gripe about the 2013 or whenever the next one comes out!
The Camry seems to just evolve from one generation to the next, where even if it might be an all-new design, it just doesn't feel all-new. And because of that, I guess people just feel comfortable with it, because you get that feeling that you're used to it the second you hop in. But with the Accord, it seems like they just totally throw the old design out, and start from scratch, and it may alienate some people who got comfy with their previous Accord, and are now miffed that the new one is a whole different breed.
I hope not, I do think the pictures will help. I don't know about it being minor, my back certainly doesn't think so. I think the only reason damage to my car wasn't more is that the bumper took most of the hit. The minivan that started the whole thing was totaled, he hit the Expedition at around 45 mph. Thankfully there was no real major structural damage to the Pilot and hopefully they will replace the rear liftgate rather than fix the damaged one.
I have some thoughts of trading the Pilot for something bigger, but with gas prices the way they are I think I'll hang on to it. I drove yesterday for the first time since the accident, I was a nervous wreck, I watch my rearview mirror obsessively.
The Sandman
2023 Hyundai Kona Limited AWD (wife) / 2025 VW GTI (me) / 2019 Chevrolet Cruze Premier RS (daughter #1) / 2020 Hyundai Accent SE (daughter #2) / 2023 Subaru Impreza Base (son)
The MDX and RDX must be getting updates soon too, given they both came out for the 07 model year as well...
25 NX 450h+ / 24 Sienna Plat AWD / 23 Civic Type-R / 21 Boxster GTS 4.0
The Sandman
2023 Hyundai Kona Limited AWD (wife) / 2025 VW GTI (me) / 2019 Chevrolet Cruze Premier RS (daughter #1) / 2020 Hyundai Accent SE (daughter #2) / 2023 Subaru Impreza Base (son)
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
Technically, the current Accord is actually a full-sized car, with 106 cubic feet of passenger volume and 15 cubic feet of trunk space, for 121 cubic feet combined. Anything 120 cubic feet and up, the EPA classifies as a full-sized car. However, the Accord gets a great deal of that volume from interior height. And if you get a sunroof, it gets cut from 106 to 101 cubic feet.
As for exterior dimensions, wheelbase is 110.2", overall length 194.9. The Camry is 189.2" long, on a 109.3" wb. The Sonata is 189.8" long, and 110" wb.
On the surface, those dimensions are close enough that they shouldn't make much difference. Even though the Accord is almost 6" longer than the Camry, I'd think wheelbase would have more of an impact on how well a car handles. And suspension design is probably the biggest determinant of all.
I wonder if the Accord and Civic will grow again with their next redesign? IMO, they don't need to. The Civic could use a little more legroom, but they could accomplish that simply by giving the seat a greater range of motion. And nobody really buys cars that are much bigger than the current Accord, anyway. Well, except for Lemko and me. :P
Back in the 1970s, Toyota and Honda were the bargain-basement cars that everyone laughed at, and we all know what happened to those companies.
Yes, she still wants a Jetta for her next vehicle, but the Jetta she wants and the Jetta I would want could not be more different.
You think the new Accords should be smaller, others want them bigger...go figure!
I've been known to buy a big one here or there.... This has caught my eye at a good price I don't know if I can take the ride in my Genesis for another 14 months. If I knew I could get 23K for it, I would consider dumping it now.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
Remind me of the details on your Genny.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I know of all places, them and Auto Lenders are usually pretty high.
My Genesis is a 2009 Sedan V6 w/ Premium package (but not tech, ie no NAV). Just about ready to turn 20K miles. It is pretty much perfect condition wise.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
Vue rises from the dead
Looks like they're only selling to fleets, though.
It was a popular model, though... and, not bad looking... they should sell for peanuts when the rental companies get through with them..
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2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
I think our F-250 will remain a yard ornament for the most part, 9 mpg is a killer with high gas prices. :sick:
Looking up stats though, it looks like the Vue was around 181", while the Terrain is 185 and the Equinox is 187. So maybe it's not that much smaller after all.
I was thinking that bringing it back isn't a bad idea, to have a smaller crossover around now that the others are getting bulkier. But those few inches might not really make much difference.
I do like the idea though, of having the thing be rental fleet only, so they don't try dumping the "nicer" models into fleets. There's nothing wrong with having a few nice models in rental fleets, as people like to rent nice cars too. But just don't get to the point that your business depends on it!
How this relates to the Equinox is hard to say. I have not bothered to try to understand GM's small SUV platform strategy so i do not know how this is different. One thing that does differ from the Saturn version is that it could be had with the Malibu's 3.6 V-6 (the reduced-output version) while this new Chevy version will have the 3.0 V-6 available.
I can't imagine they will sell very many and even though I like the vehicle's styling better than either the Equinox or the Terrain, it is hard to understand why they are doing this.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
Just curious as my kids roommate hit her car backing out of their garage last year & we didn't claim it on anyone's insurance so there's probably no carfax on it. But a dealers used car department might know by looking at it that work was done on it...how would that affect their trade-in price? Probably lower than the same car without any body repairs. Right?
Also, do you have access to carfax so I could check the carfax?
Thanks for your help with all this!
The Sandman
2023 Hyundai Kona Limited AWD (wife) / 2025 VW GTI (me) / 2019 Chevrolet Cruze Premier RS (daughter #1) / 2020 Hyundai Accent SE (daughter #2) / 2023 Subaru Impreza Base (son)
Oh yes, on that MB 'vert...sweet ride!!!
And thanks in advance for any help I can get...you guys rock!
The Sandman
2023 Hyundai Kona Limited AWD (wife) / 2025 VW GTI (me) / 2019 Chevrolet Cruze Premier RS (daughter #1) / 2020 Hyundai Accent SE (daughter #2) / 2023 Subaru Impreza Base (son)
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
From what I've been told so far, diminished value is kind of a controversial thing. Its hard to put a number on it. The way the insurance adjuster explained it to me might be the easiest way to explain it.
Take my car for example, since it is so new I may have a valid claim, especially if I plan to trade it in the next year or so. He said when I go to trade it in there is a chance that my car would be worth less, say for example $2500 less, than an equivalent 2011 Pilot with no accident history. That's the diminished value, so after the repair on my car if I took it to an independant appraiser and they said yes, your car is worth $2500 less because of the accident, I could turn around and file a claim with Progressive (the at fault driver's insurance) for the $2500. No promise I'd get it, but I could try.
He also said that diminished value usually only comes in to play if the car is traded a few months to 2 years after the accident. He said if I was keeping it for 8-10 years it probably wouldn't make a difference in the value.
Certain insurance companies will not pay out, like Allstate, but some will. Most states do not recognize diminished value, especially if the accident was your own fault. In this case I'm lucky it wasn't.
I hope that helps explain it.
Tehre is no fixed amount of dollars and insurance companies will fight it every step of the way and I can't blame them.
The spend, say 5000.00 to have a quality body shop restore a car to like new condition and then the owner excepts even more?
In my opinion, a well repaired car isn't "damaged merchandise" and shouldn't be devalued.
A lot of buyers won't care. Some will, and others that really don't care will try to use an accident history to grind down the price of the car.
It's a tough subject.
How do you propose they re- hot galvanize a damaged panel that has been sanded and in the process, the HG removed? No matter how competent the repair, rust will find that spot long before the car wears out due to miles and it will not look as desirable as a used car that is not rusting in that location. And we all know that the odds of getting a less than competent repair are actually greater than not, even at a dealer body shop. Even if they cut out the old panel and replace with new HG panel from the factory, there will be an unprotected weld seam and guess where the rust will show itself? Diminished value is the ONLY way to properly compensate an innocent (not at fault) owner who was at the wrong place at the wrong time. The newer their car at that time, the more significant the placement of a DV be assigned and reimbursed. Jumping through hoops should be part of the process. Why should a crash victim be further penalized by their vehicle reminding them of the crash before they are ready to retire it?
And let's say they get a repair that manages to dodge the rust factor. Will it still dodge the wiring issues that you find out you now have in an area that no other owner of the exact same vehicle and age that hasn't been crashed, is having?
Chassis forming and stretching/pulling back into spec is never as strong or have the ability to retain a proper alignment after the so-called repair, as the same vehicle that has never had that chassis part bent from it's original shape. This fact can be tested by simply bending and straightening a teaspoon handle from your kitchen. It will re-bend where the original injury happened, and with less force than originally also.
IMHO, anyone who purports that DV denial to be a non-issue, has never experienced after-crash issue$ that can be easily associated directly due to the result of a previous crash.
Sam
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
In the yellow pages was a company that was in the business of generating 'deminished value' statements. Cost was $500, up front (Maybe $750?).
The car was repaired at a top of the line import body shop. It was a Mercedes. After repair, an appraiser from the DV company examined the car and they generated a multi page report on the damage and repair. The deminished value claim was filed, separate and after the orginial claim for the repair. Using the report generated from the company. This is how it's done in Texas.
I don't remember the exact numbers, but the report gave something like $6,000 in deminished value. The insurance company offered $2,500 and she took it.
Different states and/or insurance companies do not allow/recognize deminished value claim. So, any answer to this question of how this works depends on what state your are in and what insurance company you are dealing with.
As a matter of fact, the answer to any insurance, tax, or tag question will vary significantly depending on the state.
I feel you will not get a used or new car dealership to give a written, signed statement of deminished value. Unless the company is 'in the business', I think your would have a hard time finding a body shop that would do this either. Just too much liability, and possible future cost of defending your estimate in a court. These business that do this are specialized, and have found a nitch market for something.
I couldn't agree more. A few years ago we purchased a 1996 GMC K2500 used and about a month after we purchased it the bedside developed a crack. I was baffled, we had not been told of any accident history, but on further inspection there was indeed bondo on the bedside. A little digging into the truck's history revealed a big repair to that side of the truck. The insurance company simply repaired a bedside that should have been replaced. Even after it was repaired again it was obvious to me.
Problem with me is I can spot body work very easily and I know that I will be miserable if they simply pull the dents in the rear liftgate and bondo it. I will always notice the repair and I know it will bother me. I would make a bad UCM, I'm very critical of a used car.
This reminds me of a few years back when my Grandfather was looking at a used Town Car. At the time all Town Cars had factory painted pin stripes. They had a really nice loaded up one that he had taken a like to. I go over the dealer with him and look the car over. The fender had obviously been repaired and I showed the dealer. The reason I noticed it was the striping wasn't uniform.
We argued about it for a while and I ended up getting him a screaming deal on that car (and they fixed the stripe). It was one of the best cars he ever owned.
While I would be worried to buy a car with an accident on the carfax, I am have to say that I agree with Isell that if a vehicle is properly repaired all will be fine. My GFs Elantra needed almost 10k in body work in the first week she owned it. 20K miles and three years later the car is perfect and the repaired areas look as good as the factory panels.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
When our 1993 Ford Explorer was six months old, the original owner lost it on an icy mountain curve and it flipped on it's side doing, at the time, over 12,000 in damage. He wanted them to total it but his ins. company insisted on fixing it. When he got it back two months later he decided he would just take his lumps and trade it in "knowing" it wold never be the same.
Thirteen years later, he sold it to me after disclosing the damage. It drives straight as an arrow, has no rust, has no electrical problems and unless the damage was disclosed few would ever know.
In his words..." If I had traded it in, I would have missed out on the best car I've ever owned"
Is this always the case? Of course not! A lot of lesser shops would have turned out an inferior product.
The spend, say 5000.00 to have a quality body shop restore a car to like new condition and then the owner excepts even more?
I do blame them. Why do insurance companies fight something that is obviously 100% true, real, and verified? It's obvious the car's value goes down even with a quality repair (it's just never the same). Just like you said "some will care" and that means you lose some of the buyer's market, which means there is a real value loss, cause the bigger your market of buyers, the better your value is. Law of supply and demand.
The solution isn't for insurance companies to fight the one that has sufferred a loss, the solution is for insurance companies to punish the bad drivers that actually CAUSE the accidents. Tell them NOT to cause accidents.
I don't cause them, I've only suffered them due to others' negligence.
But, that has nothing to do with a DV claim. It is simply an economic deal. Your explorer, if the original owner had traded it, would have gotten a lower trade offer. therefore, his property was worth less as a result of the accident, so by rights, he should have been compensated for it. How well the repair was done is actually irrelevant to the claim.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I'm not sure what we're discussing here... of course the car is worth less, even if perfectly repaired. Whether it's just as safe, rides just as well, etc. is a related but separate question.
How much less the car is worth depends on many factors. "Transportation" type cars, like Corollas, will still be fine for the intended purpose, so the loss will be moderate... and for an older one, it probaqbly doesn't matter.
Status/Enthusiasts/OCD cars -- cough, BMW, cough -- will take a nasty hit.
Also, laws differ by state, and in some, diminished value does not have to be compensated for. Michigan comes to mind :shades:
LOTS of people now use carfax... a "negative" on the carfax will affect the private-party value. Them's the breaks.
Cheers -Mathias
We did a car switcheroo, sold my wife's Civic coupe I used as a commuter and got a new 2011 Xterra for me. It's a company demo from my dealership (I'm an Asst. Mgr at a Nissan dealership) that I can have until I get to 10k on the odo after which I can choose something else new from our lot, so not sure if that counts towards CCBA membership, but hey it's a new car for me every 6 or so months
Then just recently we got rid of our 2008 Jeep Patriot and I picked up a 2007 BMW 328i sedan our dealership bought in. It's supposed to be my wife's car but I'm the one driving it and left her the Xterra as she feels safer in large SUV's.
I love the way the 328 handles and feels but I'm kicking myself for missing out on an 06 330i sedan with all options (except Nav) and only 13k miles on it. We sold it a day before I was going to buy it.
Anyways I'll try to pop back in and see what everyone's up to more often!
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2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
And, yes the older the car gets, the less it'll matter.
And, Car Fax misses a lot too along with scaring people over what was something so minor it didn't really matter.
My Grandfather's car has a blemish on the Carfax showing an accident. We know for a fact that it is an error. Some data processing person must have typed the wrong VIN.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
Anyway... if it has the 18" wheels, you aren't TOO far off. $23k is the HIGH trade in. It would be tough to get a dealer to go that high (especially carsense), but you never know.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
The driver got out and made sure the bicyclist was OK. He hit the spare tire mounted on the rear of her CRV and no damage was done.
As they were about to leave the scene, a cop happened to come by. Although they assured him everything was OK, he filled out some kind of a report which years later, showed up as "ACCIDENT REPORTED"on it's Car Fax.
What a joke!