Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

graphicguy

HI all...I know I've been "hit and run" in here for quite some time. But, as always, good to see all oy Edmunds friends still hanging around.

Onward...

Sister and I just finished test driving the Polestar2. It really is a nice vehicle. It was a Long Range AWD. I think it MSRPs at $60K plus. Problem, she doesn't live anywhere close to a Polestar dealership. I wished she would have told me that before we trekked 2 hour one way to look at it.

Probably wondering why we aren't looking at a Tesla. She has a fundamental problem with buying a vehicle from a company whose CEO she can't stand. 'Nuff said!

@roadburner ...we're going to the Mercedes Dealer this afternoon after a visit to Lexus.

I like helping other people spend their money.

I was "semi-serious" in looking at EVs given this whole exercise.

The leases I'm seeing are pretty incredible. And, I don't even live in a state that kicks in money on them (like CO).

I really liked the Blazer EV. It's quick, roomy! Handles way better than I thought it would. But, it drives BIG! Last Chevy I had was a Tahoe, which I loved dearly. Will have to see what kind of money they are throwing at it. I do Love my CarPlay. Again, serious omission on Chevy's part.

Ionic 5 is a really nice vehicle, made even nicer by the lease cash quoted.

Lyric is in play for my sister. Not for me, for obvious reasons given my history with Cadillac.

Quick question....those of you with EVs, what does it cost for a Level 2 charger installation?

breld

Charger installation is very dependent on the proximity of your electrical box.

From my experience, install has ranged from $500 - $1,200. And the chargers themselves are around $600.

I've also used our local electric company (Xcel Energy) for install - they subsidize the install cost and then lease you the charger itself for like $13/month.

Chevy has a program that assists with getting a charger installed I believe?

breld

As for the EV choices, my $.02...

May want to give the Audi products a try. From my experience, they are very intentional in providing a traditional driving experience in their EVs. Transitioning from my wife's A6 to my Q8 e-tron is pretty seamless.

jmonroe1

corvette said:

I guess I'm becoming an old man... I prefer the styling of the EV6 to the Ioniq 5.

————————————————
Yep, it sneaks up on you when you’re not looking.

jmonroe

graphicguy

breld said:

Charger installation is very dependent on the proximity of your electrical box.

From my experience, install has ranged from $500 - $1,200. And the chargers themselves are around $600.

I've also used our local electric company (Xcel Energy) for install - they subsidize the install cost and then lease you the charger itself for like $13/month.

Chevy has a program that assists with getting a charger installed I believe?

Thanks. I don't think OHIO offers any EV perks...even for installation. I have Duke energy. Will check with them to see if they offer anything.

Test drove a Mercedes EQE. Quite nice. Low $80s, I think? Too rich for me. Sister didn't blink. She likes Mercedes. I thought it was pretty quick. Comfortable. But, she thought the value wasn't there. Can't disagree with her. She said the lyric offered more for less. Can't disagree with her.

Made a brief stop to the Lexus dealer. They only had one. We didn't even test drive it as she thought it was (her words) "butt ugly"!

Tried to get her to drop my the Genesis store. She wasn't interested. Maybe get her to go look at the Audi.

Not sure where we go from here. I think she's leaning towards a Lyric.

laurasdada

I believe that the Audi A6 EV is due soon ('25, hatchback!), if time isn't critical.

I do like the Lyriq, at least insofar as style and positive reviews. Well, except for consistent mention of typical GM build quality... The interior materials are supposed to be excellent.

I'm also still very intrigued by the Lucid Air, lease rates are reasonable now. And they're offering a subsidy on their charging equipment. But it's a start up, losing money consistently. Not Fisker, but I'll observe Lucid's status into '25.

stickguy

Is sister really ready to be an EV only person? That is a commitment!

I never priced chargers since I do t need o e yet but at least I have the outlet installed. Just have to buy one, screw it to the wall, and plug it in! I maybe I can take up heavy duty welding.

graphicguy

laurasdada said:

I believe that the Audi A6 EV is due soon ('25, hatchback!), if time isn't critical.

I do like the Lyriq, at least insofar as style and positive reviews. Well, except for consistent mention of typical GM build quality... The interior materials are supposed to be excellent.

I'm also still very intrigued by the Lucid Air, lease rates are reasonable now. And they're offering a subsidy on their charging equipment. But it's a start up, losing money consistently. Not Fisker, but I'll observe Lucid's status into '25.

stickguy said:

Is sister really ready to be an EV only person? That is a commitment!

I never priced chargers since I do t need o e yet but at least I have the outlet installed. Just have to buy one, screw it to the wall, and plug it in! I maybe I can take up heavy duty welding.

Lyric does indeed have the "pizazz" factor going on. My sister doesn't carry the same feelings towards Cadillac as I do.

So far, she hasn't shown much interest in Audi. I'll bring it up to her.

The more I research, the less I get the feeling that going EV is a commitment. There are probably 5 or 6 EVs residing on my cul-de-sac. One has an ID.4. She adores it. Another has 2 Teslas (one of them is 10 years old). Another has a Nissan Leaf. There's another with a Mach E. So, in talking to a couple of them, they are all positive.

From my sister's stand point, EVs are the present and the future. Can't argue with her on that.

As far as me? I'm EV curious. I know a lot of you were early adopters. Just the brief time I've looked around, it's clear they are going mainstream. And, also from what you all are telling me, the incentives are making them quite the bargain right now. Kind of a confluence of factors colliding where they make sense right now.

stickguy

I think they are great in many ways. As long as your use case works for them.

oldfarmer50

graphicguy said:

laurasdada said:

I believe that the Audi A6 EV is due soon ('25, hatchback!), if time isn't critical.

I do like the Lyriq, at least insofar as style and positive reviews. Well, except for consistent mention of typical GM build quality... The interior materials are supposed to be excellent.

I'm also still very intrigued by the Lucid Air, lease rates are reasonable now. And they're offering a subsidy on their charging equipment. But it's a start up, losing money consistently. Not Fisker, but I'll observe Lucid's status into '25.

stickguy said:

Is sister really ready to be an EV only person? That is a commitment!

I never priced chargers since I do t need o e yet but at least I have the outlet installed. Just have to buy one, screw it to the wall, and plug it in! I maybe I can take up heavy duty welding.

Lyric does indeed have the "pizazz" factor going on. My sister doesn't carry the same feelings towards Cadillac as I do.

So far, she hasn't shown much interest in Audi. I'll bring it up to her.

The more I research, the less I get the feeling that going EV is a commitment. There are probably 5 or 6 EVs residing on my cul-de-sac. One has an ID.4. She adores it. Another has 2 Teslas (one of them is 10 years old). Another has a Nissan Leaf. There's another with a Mach E. So, in talking to a couple of them, they are all positive.

From my sister's stand point, EVs are the present and the future. Can't argue with her on that.

As far as me? I'm EV curious. I know a lot of you were early adopters. Just the brief time I've looked around, it's clear they are going mainstream. And, also from what you all are telling me, the incentives are making them quite the bargain right now. Kind of a confluence of factors colliding where they make sense right now.

IMO leasing is the way to go with EVs. A guy at work bought a Polestar and he is devastated by the depreciation. He also complains about losing range in cold weather.

Then there’s this:
https://youtu.be/5rnVEiaAzKI?si=SIVkf9ua5If0oepP

roadburner

In my area a PHEV is much more practical. I love our Wrangler 4xe, but the current crop of PHEV performance cars tend to be too expensive, too heavy, or both. As I say far too often, there's virtually nothing on the market that I like more than the C43- in my price range, at any rate.

au1994

PHEV will definitely get a look from us in the future. Even in a major metro area, the charging network is below par.

mjfloyd1

@nyccarguy said:
@mjfloyd1

I must have missed your post that you got the Lexus! I went back to check it out. Looks great! Congrats on the punch! I like the current RX in White. I'm glad you can put the ordeal with the Q7 in your rearview mirror.

Did you sort everything out with the Lexus dealership or did they try and play games with you?

No games. She was just aloof. They added to this RX 350 what was on the one that she sent the window sticker (without me asking) and the one that they had had more port installed options so it turned out to be a better deal. In and out in 45 minutes

stickguy

I most likely would go PHEV too, but for a 2nd car a true EV still makes a lot of sense.

suydam

I just love how h

stickguy said:

I most likely would go PHEV too, but for a 2nd car a true EV still makes a lot of sense.

That’s what we did.

tjc78

@graphicguy said:
Thanks. I don't think OHIO offers any EV perks...even for installation. I have Duke energy. Will check with them to see if they offer anything.

Test drove a Mercedes EQE. Quite nice. Low $80s, I think? Too rich for me. Sister didn't blink. She likes Mercedes. I thought it was pretty quick. Comfortable. But, she thought the value wasn't there. Can't disagree with her. She said the lyric offered more for less. Can't disagree with her.

Made a brief stop to the Lexus dealer. They only had one. We didn't even test drive it as she thought it was (her words) "butt ugly"!

Tried to get her to drop my the Genesis store. She wasn't interested. Maybe get her to go look at the Audi.

Not sure where we go from here. I think she's leaning towards a Lyric.

They are offering a ton of incentives on the EQE. I agree without significant discounts the sticker price is very high. Mine was 85k and very well equipped but nowhere near top trim.

graphicguy

Someone mentioned the sales people currently employed. Generally speaking, I respect the job. they have. But, all of us here have bought enough cars we know how the game is played.

It's been a couple of years since I was in a new car dealership (save for my one free oil change on my Accord). So, maybe a little behind the curve.

I keep telling myself I'm only helping my sister buy a car, but more and more, I think I'm doing the routine and research of me potentially doing so, also. Nothing definitive....just a gut feel.

But, it seems some tried and true tactics have resurfaced.

As always, researching the hell out of potential targeted vehicles. Surprised at the large incentives available on EVs. Manufacturers are coming out with more EV models. So, they are here to stay IMHO.

Some dealerships are pretty up front with pricing. There's one Hyundai dealer near me that's fairly transparent. They even print out deal sheets with no prompting.

Visited another one last night by myself. Was there for an hour. I probably asked for pricing at least 4 times. Never got any. I even pointed to a particular car they had in stock (an Ionic 5) and asked point blank what a lease would look like. Provided all the details....10k/year-36 mos-no money down. I made it as easy as I could. Still couldn't get pricing. Don't know how they can sell anything with that tactic.

Best closing line I've heard so far....."you have to love this car before I let you buy it". My reply? "I don't!". Then the sales person tried other closes...ending with the proverbial "these cars are popular...this might not be here tomorrow". He said this as I observed at least a dozen of the same car model on his lot.

I suggested leasing an EV to my sister (who has NEVER leased a car) to get the large incentives. Problem is, the Lyric she's really interested in doesn't have any lease incentives. So, that might be a moot point. She's in "thinking it over" mode.

Me? I'm shopping! LOL!

graphicguy

I was surfing through a bunch of posts and can't find one that I hope y'all can help me with.

Someone mentioned a guy who brokers leases throughout the U.S. Common name. But, I didn't copy the link. Anyone know who I'm talking about? Contact info?

Michaell

graphicguy said:

Someone mentioned the sales people currently employed. Generally speaking, I respect the job. they have. But, all of us here have bought enough cars we know how the game is played.

It's been a couple of years since I was in a new car dealership (save for my one free oil change on my Accord). So, maybe a little behind the curve.

I keep telling myself I'm only helping my sister buy a car, but more and more, I think I'm doing the routine and research of me potentially doing so, also. Nothing definitive....just a gut feel.

But, it seems some tried and true tactics have resurfaced.

As always, researching the hell out of potential targeted vehicles. Surprised at the large incentives available on EVs. Manufacturers are coming out with more EV models. So, they are here to stay IMHO.

Some dealerships are pretty up front with pricing. There's one Hyundai dealer near me that's fairly transparent. They even print out deal sheets with no prompting.

Visited another one last night by myself. Was there for an hour. I probably asked for pricing at least 4 times. Never got any. I even pointed to a particular car they had in stock (an Ionic 5) and asked point blank what a lease would look like. Provided all the details....10k/year-36 mos-no money down. I made it as easy as I could. Still couldn't get pricing. Don't know how they can sell anything with that tactic.

Best closing line I've heard so far....."you have to love this car before I let you buy it". My reply? "I don't!". Then the sales person tried other closes...ending with the proverbial "these cars are popular...this might not be here tomorrow". He said this as I observed at least a dozen of the same car model on his lot.

I suggested leasing an EV to my sister (who has NEVER leased a car) to get the large incentives. Problem is, the Lyric she's really interested in doesn't have any lease incentives. So, that might be a moot point. She's in "thinking it over" mode.

Me? I'm shopping! LOL!

What GM is doing with the Lyric (and the Hummer, Blazer and Equinox EVs), is that they add the $7500 incentive to the residual value rather than provide it as a cash incentive.

The benefit is that you don't pay tax on the incentive amount, which saves you money, yet the payment amount goes down, which is the intention of the incentive in the first place.

The bad news is that the car is more expensive to buy out at the end of the lease.

suydam

Michaell said:

graphicguy said:

Someone mentioned the sales people currently employed. Generally speaking, I respect the job. they have. But, all of us here have bought enough cars we know how the game is played.

It's been a couple of years since I was in a new car dealership (save for my one free oil change on my Accord). So, maybe a little behind the curve.

I keep telling myself I'm only helping my sister buy a car, but more and more, I think I'm doing the routine and research of me potentially doing so, also. Nothing definitive....just a gut feel.

But, it seems some tried and true tactics have resurfaced.

As always, researching the hell out of potential targeted vehicles. Surprised at the large incentives available on EVs. Manufacturers are coming out with more EV models. So, they are here to stay IMHO.

Some dealerships are pretty up front with pricing. There's one Hyundai dealer near me that's fairly transparent. They even print out deal sheets with no prompting.

Visited another one last night by myself. Was there for an hour. I probably asked for pricing at least 4 times. Never got any. I even pointed to a particular car they had in stock (an Ionic 5) and asked point blank what a lease would look like. Provided all the details....10k/year-36 mos-no money down. I made it as easy as I could. Still couldn't get pricing. Don't know how they can sell anything with that tactic.

Best closing line I've heard so far....."you have to love this car before I let you buy it". My reply? "I don't!". Then the sales person tried other closes...ending with the proverbial "these cars are popular...this might not be here tomorrow". He said this as I observed at least a dozen of the same car model on his lot.

I suggested leasing an EV to my sister (who has NEVER leased a car) to get the large incentives. Problem is, the Lyric she's really interested in doesn't have any lease incentives. So, that might be a moot point. She's in "thinking it over" mode.

Me? I'm shopping! LOL!

What GM is doing with the Lyric (and the Hummer, Blazer and Equinox EVs), is that they add the $7500 incentive to the residual value rather than provide it as a cash incentive.

The benefit is that you don't pay tax on the incentive amount, which saves you money, yet the payment amount goes down, which is the intention of the incentive in the first place.

The bad news is that the car is more expensive to buy out at the end of the lease.

That’s why we bought the Blazer and leased the Kia. Part of the research you have to do with these incentives is figure out which way works out best.
Does Costco still have the $1000 coupon on the Blazer and Equinox EVs? I don’t know if that applied to the Lyriq as well.

jmonroe1

Michaell said:

graphicguy said:

Someone mentioned the sales people currently employed. Generally speaking, I respect the job. they have. But, all of us here have bought enough cars we know how the game is played.

It's been a couple of years since I was in a new car dealership (save for my one free oil change on my Accord). So, maybe a little behind the curve.

I keep telling myself I'm only helping my sister buy a car, but more and more, I think I'm doing the routine and research of me potentially doing so, also. Nothing definitive....just a gut feel.

But, it seems some tried and true tactics have resurfaced.

As always, researching the hell out of potential targeted vehicles. Surprised at the large incentives available on EVs. Manufacturers are coming out with more EV models. So, they are here to stay IMHO.

Some dealerships are pretty up front with pricing. There's one Hyundai dealer near me that's fairly transparent. They even print out deal sheets with no prompting.

Visited another one last night by myself. Was there for an hour. I probably asked for pricing at least 4 times. Never got any. I even pointed to a particular car they had in stock (an Ionic 5) and asked point blank what a lease would look like. Provided all the details....10k/year-36 mos-no money down. I made it as easy as I could. Still couldn't get pricing. Don't know how they can sell anything with that tactic.

Best closing line I've heard so far....."you have to love this car before I let you buy it". My reply? "I don't!". Then the sales person tried other closes...ending with the proverbial "these cars are popular...this might not be here tomorrow". He said this as I observed at least a dozen of the same car model on his lot.

I suggested leasing an EV to my sister (who has NEVER leased a car) to get the large incentives. Problem is, the Lyric she's really interested in doesn't have any lease incentives. So, that might be a moot point. She's in "thinking it over" mode.

Me? I'm shopping! LOL!

What GM is doing with the Lyric (and the Hummer, Blazer and Equinox EVs), is that they add the $7500 incentive to the residual value rather than provide it as a cash incentive.

The benefit is that you don't pay tax on the incentive amount, which saves you money, yet the payment amount goes down, which is the intention of the incentive in the first place.

The bad news is that the car is more expensive to buy out at the end of the lease.

————————————————
So, GM wants the dealer to have more cars on his lot a couple years down the line. From what I’ve read, used EVs of all types are languishing on dealers lots already. Does GM know something that no other manufacturer knows?

jmonroe

Michaell

suydam said:

Michaell said:

graphicguy said:

Someone mentioned the sales people currently employed. Generally speaking, I respect the job. they have. But, all of us here have bought enough cars we know how the game is played.

It's been a couple of years since I was in a new car dealership (save for my one free oil change on my Accord). So, maybe a little behind the curve.

I keep telling myself I'm only helping my sister buy a car, but more and more, I think I'm doing the routine and research of me potentially doing so, also. Nothing definitive....just a gut feel.

But, it seems some tried and true tactics have resurfaced.

As always, researching the hell out of potential targeted vehicles. Surprised at the large incentives available on EVs. Manufacturers are coming out with more EV models. So, they are here to stay IMHO.

Some dealerships are pretty up front with pricing. There's one Hyundai dealer near me that's fairly transparent. They even print out deal sheets with no prompting.

Visited another one last night by myself. Was there for an hour. I probably asked for pricing at least 4 times. Never got any. I even pointed to a particular car they had in stock (an Ionic 5) and asked point blank what a lease would look like. Provided all the details....10k/year-36 mos-no money down. I made it as easy as I could. Still couldn't get pricing. Don't know how they can sell anything with that tactic.

Best closing line I've heard so far....."you have to love this car before I let you buy it". My reply? "I don't!". Then the sales person tried other closes...ending with the proverbial "these cars are popular...this might not be here tomorrow". He said this as I observed at least a dozen of the same car model on his lot.

I suggested leasing an EV to my sister (who has NEVER leased a car) to get the large incentives. Problem is, the Lyric she's really interested in doesn't have any lease incentives. So, that might be a moot point. She's in "thinking it over" mode.

Me? I'm shopping! LOL!

What GM is doing with the Lyric (and the Hummer, Blazer and Equinox EVs), is that they add the $7500 incentive to the residual value rather than provide it as a cash incentive.

The benefit is that you don't pay tax on the incentive amount, which saves you money, yet the payment amount goes down, which is the intention of the incentive in the first place.

The bad news is that the car is more expensive to buy out at the end of the lease.

That’s why we bought the Blazer and leased the Kia. Part of the research you have to do with these incentives is figure out which way works out best.
Does Costco still have the $1000 coupon on the Blazer and Equinox EVs? I don’t know if that applied to the Lyriq as well.

Sorry, we don't have any information on Costco programs.

Michaell

jmonroe1 said:

Michaell said:

graphicguy said:

Someone mentioned the sales people currently employed. Generally speaking, I respect the job. they have. But, all of us here have bought enough cars we know how the game is played.

It's been a couple of years since I was in a new car dealership (save for my one free oil change on my Accord). So, maybe a little behind the curve.

I keep telling myself I'm only helping my sister buy a car, but more and more, I think I'm doing the routine and research of me potentially doing so, also. Nothing definitive....just a gut feel.

But, it seems some tried and true tactics have resurfaced.

As always, researching the hell out of potential targeted vehicles. Surprised at the large incentives available on EVs. Manufacturers are coming out with more EV models. So, they are here to stay IMHO.

Some dealerships are pretty up front with pricing. There's one Hyundai dealer near me that's fairly transparent. They even print out deal sheets with no prompting.

Visited another one last night by myself. Was there for an hour. I probably asked for pricing at least 4 times. Never got any. I even pointed to a particular car they had in stock (an Ionic 5) and asked point blank what a lease would look like. Provided all the details....10k/year-36 mos-no money down. I made it as easy as I could. Still couldn't get pricing. Don't know how they can sell anything with that tactic.

Best closing line I've heard so far....."you have to love this car before I let you buy it". My reply? "I don't!". Then the sales person tried other closes...ending with the proverbial "these cars are popular...this might not be here tomorrow". He said this as I observed at least a dozen of the same car model on his lot.

I suggested leasing an EV to my sister (who has NEVER leased a car) to get the large incentives. Problem is, the Lyric she's really interested in doesn't have any lease incentives. So, that might be a moot point. She's in "thinking it over" mode.

Me? I'm shopping! LOL!

What GM is doing with the Lyric (and the Hummer, Blazer and Equinox EVs), is that they add the $7500 incentive to the residual value rather than provide it as a cash incentive.

The benefit is that you don't pay tax on the incentive amount, which saves you money, yet the payment amount goes down, which is the intention of the incentive in the first place.

The bad news is that the car is more expensive to buy out at the end of the lease.

————————————————
So, GM wants the dealer to have more cars on his lot a couple years down the line. From what I’ve read, used EVs of all types are languishing on dealers lots already. Does GM know something that no other manufacturer knows?

jmonroe

I doubt GM is thinking that far ahead; they are just trying to move inventory, today, and not think about the repurcussions down the road.

I know used EVs are a real bargain, at the moment.

nyccarguy

Michaell said:

jmonroe1 said:

Michaell said:

graphicguy said:

Someone mentioned the sales people currently employed. Generally speaking, I respect the job. they have. But, all of us here have bought enough cars we know how the game is played.

It's been a couple of years since I was in a new car dealership (save for my one free oil change on my Accord). So, maybe a little behind the curve.

I keep telling myself I'm only helping my sister buy a car, but more and more, I think I'm doing the routine and research of me potentially doing so, also. Nothing definitive....just a gut feel.

But, it seems some tried and true tactics have resurfaced.

As always, researching the hell out of potential targeted vehicles. Surprised at the large incentives available on EVs. Manufacturers are coming out with more EV models. So, they are here to stay IMHO.

Some dealerships are pretty up front with pricing. There's one Hyundai dealer near me that's fairly transparent. They even print out deal sheets with no prompting.

Visited another one last night by myself. Was there for an hour. I probably asked for pricing at least 4 times. Never got any. I even pointed to a particular car they had in stock (an Ionic 5) and asked point blank what a lease would look like. Provided all the details....10k/year-36 mos-no money down. I made it as easy as I could. Still couldn't get pricing. Don't know how they can sell anything with that tactic.

Best closing line I've heard so far....."you have to love this car before I let you buy it". My reply? "I don't!". Then the sales person tried other closes...ending with the proverbial "these cars are popular...this might not be here tomorrow". He said this as I observed at least a dozen of the same car model on his lot.

I suggested leasing an EV to my sister (who has NEVER leased a car) to get the large incentives. Problem is, the Lyric she's really interested in doesn't have any lease incentives. So, that might be a moot point. She's in "thinking it over" mode.

Me? I'm shopping! LOL!

What GM is doing with the Lyric (and the Hummer, Blazer and Equinox EVs), is that they add the $7500 incentive to the residual value rather than provide it as a cash incentive.

The benefit is that you don't pay tax on the incentive amount, which saves you money, yet the payment amount goes down, which is the intention of the incentive in the first place.

The bad news is that the car is more expensive to buy out at the end of the lease.

————————————————
So, GM wants the dealer to have more cars on his lot a couple years down the line. From what I’ve read, used EVs of all types are languishing on dealers lots already. Does GM know something that no other manufacturer knows?

jmonroe

I doubt GM is thinking that far ahead; they are just trying to move inventory, today, and not think about the repurcussions down the road.

I know used EVs are a real bargain, at the moment.

Until you have to pay the insurance premiums, want to unload it because it doesn't fit your needs (or because it is a random Wednesday), or have to replace the battery.

BTW, poor @Michaell is getting absolutely slaughtered by the facebook keyboard warriors on a page for Subaru Outback Owners for posting his pic with the landscaping pavers. You did a wonderful job! It came out great! Let's send some love his way!

oldfarmer50

“ I know used EVs are a real bargain, at the moment.”

But are they? If the stories of severe battery degradation after 4 or 5 years are true you could be buying an expensive repair.

Would you buy a used EV with the intent of keeping it long term or just a year or two?

Michaell

nyccarguy said:

BTW, poor @Michaell is getting absolutely slaughtered by the facebook keyboard warriors on a page for Subaru Outback Owners for posting his pic with the landscaping pavers. You did a wonderful job! It came out great! Let's send some love his way!

I deal with those comments much like I do with those on these forums - a big dose of Vitamin I.

My CVT is fine, after 65,000 miles.

Yes, I thought about what would happen if I got into an accident, and drove cautiously.

I don't have the space nor inclination to own a small trailer - I use the Outback for this kind of duty maybe 2 or 3 times a year.

Michaell

oldfarmer50 said:

“ I know used EVs are a real bargain, at the moment.”

But are they? If the stories of severe battery degradation after 4 or 5 years are true you could be buying an expensive repair.

Would you buy a used EV with the intent of keeping it long term or just a year or two?

I'm not talking about a 3-5 year old EV.

I'm talking about an EV with less than 10,000 miles on it, for 60% of the original MSRP.

Now, that doesn't mean it won't depreciate further like the Titanic after it hit the iceberg.

My money? Nope, I'd rather lease. I think the technology for EVs is moving too fast to invest in long term ownership. Plus, with the available lease incentives, it's probably cheaper to lease at the moment.

ab348

Are people criticizing you for putting your Subaru CVT at risk for putting 500lbs in it?

Maybe they should turn in their fanboy cards if it is such a weak design. Jeebus.

nyccarguy

Michaell said:

nyccarguy said:

BTW, poor @Michaell is getting absolutely slaughtered by the facebook keyboard warriors on a page for Subaru Outback Owners for posting his pic with the landscaping pavers. You did a wonderful job! It came out great! Let's send some love his way!

I deal with those comments much like I do with those on these forums - a big dose of Vitamin I.

My CVT is fine, after 65,000 miles. - You've changed the fluid, correct?

Yes, I thought about what would happen if I got into an accident, and drove cautiously.I have no doubt you did.

I don't have the space nor inclination to own a small trailer Nor do I. In CT, if you have a trailer, you have to pay personal property tax on it as well - I use the Outback for this kind of duty maybe 2 or 3 times a year.

ab348

jmonroe1 said:

————————————————
So, GM wants the dealer to have more cars on his lot a couple years down the line. From what I’ve read, used EVs of all types are languishing on dealers lots already. Does GM know something that no other manufacturer knows?

I had a GM lease directly through GM Financial and the selling dealer just did the lease return (not the inspection, oddly, which was outsourced) but in my experience they otherwise have nothing to do with the vehicle after that. They get shipped off to auction and is never seen again unless they decide to buy it there.

venture

mjfloyd1 said:

@nyccarguy said:
@mjfloyd1

I must have missed your post that you got the Lexus! I went back to check it out. Looks great! Congrats on the punch! I like the current RX in White. I'm glad you can put the ordeal with the Q7 in your rearview mirror.

Did you sort everything out with the Lexus dealership or did they try and play games with you?

No games. She was just aloof. They added to this RX 350 what was on the one that she sent the window sticker (without me asking) and the one that they had had more port installed options so it turned out to be a better deal. In and out in 45 minutes

But did you take all their cookies when you left?

Michaell

nyccarguy said:

Michaell said:

nyccarguy said:

BTW, poor @Michaell is getting absolutely slaughtered by the facebook keyboard warriors on a page for Subaru Outback Owners for posting his pic with the landscaping pavers. You did a wonderful job! It came out great! Let's send some love his way!

I deal with those comments much like I do with those on these forums - a big dose of Vitamin I.

My CVT is fine, after 65,000 miles. - You've changed the fluid, correct?

Yes, I thought about what would happen if I got into an accident, and drove cautiously.I have no doubt you did.

I don't have the space nor inclination to own a small trailer Nor do I. In CT, if you have a trailer, you have to pay personal property tax on it as well - I use the Outback for this kind of duty maybe 2 or 3 times a year.

Uh, hmmm.

Just reviewed my maintenance log spreadsheet, and I don't see any CVT services performed.

I guess I should look at the manual to see what the expectations are.

corvette

If I were buying a used EV, I think I'd stick to something in the $30k price range, and have a plan to get rid of it when the manufacturer's battery warranty expires (a used Model 3 or Model Y would still have 4-ish years of battery coverage remaining).

oldfarmer50

ab348 said:

Are people criticizing you for putting your Subaru CVT at risk for putting 500lbs in it?

Maybe they should turn in their fanboy cards if it is such a weak design. Jeebus.

They are probably worried that the stones will take up much needed space for the obligatory dog.🐕😊

Michaell

ab348 said:

Are people criticizing you for putting your Subaru CVT at risk for putting 500lbs in it?

Maybe they should turn in their fanboy cards if it is such a weak design. Jeebus.

Some folks are.

A lot - and, I mean, A LOT - of people said that those blocks looked like drugs. Sheesh!

This is a global group, so I'm getting comments from folks in Europe, as well.

Even though my 2015 was the first year after a redesign, it was using the powertrain that was not new. I feel like we got a great car - lots of folks with the latest iteration are experiencing all sorts of issues with their infotainment systems.

Me? I can't get my phone to pair with Bluetooth, but I can manage without it, given that we only put on 6-7000 miles a year on the car.

qbrozen

@corvette said:
If I were buying a used EV, I think I'd stick to something in the $30k price range, and have a plan to get rid of it when the manufacturer's battery warranty expires (a used Model 3 or Model Y would still have 4-ish years of battery coverage remaining).

Heck, you can get a 2023 model3 for mid 20s, and that would have another 6 years powertrain warranty, right?

corvette

qbrozen said:

Heck, you can get a 2023 model3 for mid 20s, and that would have another 6 years powertrain warranty, right?

That sounds right. I had only pulled up listings for Model Ys, and just assumed one could find a 3 for less money.

pensfan83

venture said:

mjfloyd1 said:

@nyccarguy said:
@mjfloyd1

I must have missed your post that you got the Lexus! I went back to check it out. Looks great! Congrats on the punch! I like the current RX in White. I'm glad you can put the ordeal with the Q7 in your rearview mirror.

Did you sort everything out with the Lexus dealership or did they try and play games with you?

No games. She was just aloof. They added to this RX 350 what was on the one that she sent the window sticker (without me asking) and the one that they had had more port installed options so it turned out to be a better deal. In and out in 45 minutes

But did you take all their cookies when you left?

I have a service appointment at the Acura dealer on Friday and know the bar is high. I'll do my best to meet the moment.

jmonroe1

oldfarmer50 said:

ab348 said:

Are people criticizing you for putting your Subaru CVT at risk for putting 500lbs in it?

Maybe they should turn in their fanboy cards if it is such a weak design. Jeebus.

They are probably worried that the stones will take up much needed space for the obligatory dog.🐕😊

————————————————-
I’ve heard restraints used for dogs today don’t allow the poor thing to move very much if at all. If that’s true you might as well put the blocks on top of the dog to insure no movement if you insist on taking the dog along.

jmonroe

nyccarguy

Michaell said:

nyccarguy said:

Michaell said:

nyccarguy said:

BTW, poor @Michaell is getting absolutely slaughtered by the facebook keyboard warriors on a page for Subaru Outback Owners for posting his pic with the landscaping pavers. You did a wonderful job! It came out great! Let's send some love his way!

I deal with those comments much like I do with those on these forums - a big dose of Vitamin I.

My CVT is fine, after 65,000 miles. - You've changed the fluid, correct?

Yes, I thought about what would happen if I got into an accident, and drove cautiously.I have no doubt you did.

I don't have the space nor inclination to own a small trailer Nor do I. In CT, if you have a trailer, you have to pay personal property tax on it as well - I use the Outback for this kind of duty maybe 2 or 3 times a year.

Uh, hmmm.

Just reviewed my maintenance log spreadsheet, and I don't see any CVT services performed.

I guess I should look at the manual to see what the expectations are.

I'd say it is due sooner rather than later. Curious to what the manual says.

au1994

Michaell said:

ab348 said:

Are people criticizing you for putting your Subaru CVT at risk for putting 500lbs in it?

Maybe they should turn in their fanboy cards if it is such a weak design. Jeebus.

Some folks are.

A lot - and, I mean, A LOT - of people said that those blocks looked like drugs. Sheesh!

This is a global group, so I'm getting comments from folks in Europe, as well.

Even though my 2015 was the first year after a redesign, it was using the powertrain that was not new. I feel like we got a great car - lots of folks with the latest iteration are experiencing all sorts of issues with their infotainment systems.

Me? I can't get my phone to pair with Bluetooth, but I can manage without it, given that we only put on 6-7000 miles a year on the car.

Sorry, but the street drug comment made me LOL. Me thinks those folks may be ON said street drugs.

stickguy

@Michaell said:
Uh, hmmm.

Just reviewed my maintenance log spreadsheet, and I don't see any CVT services performed.

I guess I should look at the manual to see what the expectations are.

Manual likely says not needed. Or at best after 100k. I think you probably wanted it at $60k. Pretty simple fluid drain and fill I assume. At least on a Nissan it is.

ab348

au1994 said:

Sorry, but the street drug comment made me LOL. Me thinks those folks may be ON said street drugs.

Like, really, dude…

The fanboy cult for any product/brand is not known for their logical, fact-based thinking. The mystery for me is how so many of said cults get created and why people like joining them.

ab348

The whole issue of auto manufacturers not wanting to keep partnering with Apple/Google for CarPlay/AA is a murky mess of fault, greed, arrogance and who knows what else. There’s a whole lot of blame to go around. From what I’ve read Apple initially played nice with the manufacturers by making CarPlay work on all their different in-car systems. Great! But apparently last year or earlier this year Apple announced a direction that they were developing a way to let you control your vehicle’s systems and settings via CarPlay. That set off alarm bells because that opened up long-forbidden tunnels to the vehicle’s internal software that nobody from outside is supposed to enter. You can well imagine the finger pointing that might go on if, for example, your engine or transmission computer or any of the safety systems were to go wonky as a result.

GM isn’t the only auto maker doing this. Tesla and Rivian in the EV space do not offer it either. They say it reduces distractions when you’re behind the wheel. With GM rolling out SuperCruise in a lot of models they don’t want any outside access to that logic and data. They also say that using their NAV in one of their EVs lets it use the vehicle’s energy/range data to route you in a way that can take into account charging locations, etc. But really though, who knows. A lot of it sounds like a classic urination contest. Undoubtedly though a big part of this is automakers wanting to make subscription revenue from owners using their services instead of outside ones, which I suspect is unlikely to happen. Most people will use what they like using. Maybe I’ll invest in a company making phone/tablet mounts for vehicles like its 2014…

oldfarmer50

jmonroe1 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

ab348 said:

Are people criticizing you for putting your Subaru CVT at risk for putting 500lbs in it?

Maybe they should turn in their fanboy cards if it is such a weak design. Jeebus.

They are probably worried that the stones will take up much needed space for the obligatory dog.🐕😊

————————————————-
I’ve heard restraints used for dogs today don’t allow the poor thing to move very much if at all. If that’s true you might as well put the blocks on top of the dog to insure no movement if you insist on taking the dog along.

jmonroe

What? And risk the poor dog ingesting some of those drugs?😨

mjfloyd1

@venture said:
But did you take all their cookies when you left?

Wife got some Cheez its. I wondered about the choice with the tan interior😂

Michaell

@stickguy said:

@Michaell said:
Uh, hmmm.

Just reviewed my maintenance log spreadsheet, and I don't see any CVT services performed.

I guess I should look at the manual to see what the expectations are.

Manual likely says not needed. Or at best after 100k. I think you probably wanted it at $60k. Pretty simple fluid drain and fill I assume. At least on a Nissan it is.

I had the 60k service done 3 years ago. I remember looking in the manual then and didn’t see anyone about the transmission.

I’m not hard on the engine or transmission, but I will look again to see if/when it should be serviced.

Michaell

@ab348 said:
Like, really, dude…

The fanboy cult for any product/brand is not known for their logical, fact-based thinking. The mystery for me is how so many of said cults get created and why people like joining them.

In addition to the Outback group, I joined one for the Sportage HEV/PHEV, as my daughter was (is) interested in them. Signal to noise ratio is kinda high in both, but I’m good with scrolling past stuff.

I don’t have that luxury here, however.

suydam

She hasn’t gotten one?

oldfarmer50

Michaell said:

@stickguy said:

@Michaell said:

Uh, hmmm.

Just reviewed my maintenance log spreadsheet, and I don't see any CVT services performed.

I guess I should look at the manual to see what the expectations are.

Manual likely says not needed. Or at best after 100k. I think you probably wanted it at $60k. Pretty simple fluid drain and fill I assume. At least on a Nissan it is.

I had the 60k service done 3 years ago. I remember looking in the manual then and didn’t see anyone about the transmission.

I’m not hard on the engine or transmission, but I will look again to see if/when it should be serviced.

I’d do it now, just a fluid and filter exchange. Not knowing the towing history of my truck I had mine done at 31k. I had all fluids changed on the Sebring when I bought it at 82k.