Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

tifighter

berri said:

I don't think I've seen a Volvo in that color. Is it new this year?

I seem to recall press shots in this color for awhile now, so I'm guessing it has been around for a few years. Most of the ones I see are black or silver.

fintail

Ah Poulsbo, been ages.

stever

tifighter said:

She is out of town at a conference until the weekend and has no idea I bought this.

Some would suggest that you are living dangerously, but I sort of wish my wife would just go us a car and surprise me. She's a bit intrigued by the Tucson now. Honestly, it's going to be hard to really get into a bad car these days.

graphicguy

tifighter said:

One last pic post-today's mountain bike ride. Thanks everyone for the kind words. The intent is this will be primarily driven by my wife. She is out of town at a conference until the weekend and has no idea I bought this. Before everyone starts suggesting lawyers, she was aware that things were at Defcon 2 when she left. Anyway, we'll see how long this one lasts, but my goal is four years. Wait, did I just say that?

@Michaell Outback is a nice machine. I found the lower seat cushions a bit short for me, but otherwise, it's a solid choice.

@nyccarguy Ah, the diesel thread. My sales experience would convince no one. Might as well save the caps lock on someone's keyboard from a heavy workout.

@xwesx Glad to help. I like the Flex a lot and it certainly shares a few attributes with the Volvo like great seats, nice equipment, quietness and a good ride. But most importantly, its upright, boxy and comes with a big honkin' 6-Cyl Turbo. Consider yourself enabled.

I'm not a wagon guy per se, but I like yours....a lot. Timeless look made by one of the all time great wagon manufacturers. I'm betting it brings you a lot of happy miles.

Michaell

stever said:

tifighter said:

She is out of town at a conference until the weekend and has no idea I bought this.

Some would suggest that you are living dangerously, but I sort of wish my wife would just go us a car and surprise me. She's a bit intrigued by the Tucson now. Honestly, it's going to be hard to really get into a bad car these days.

There is a local radio show about car repair, with a little bit about new cars - one of the hosts is always saying "there are no bad cars, just bad choices".

benjaminh

"Longer, lower, wider!" Sounds like a tagline from a 1950s car ad, but it also fits the new 2016 Honda Civic, which is an inch longer, an inch lower, and two inches wider than the current Civic. Large boomerang-shaped LED taillights will make this car almost as easy to spot as a 1957 DeSoto.

A 2016 Civic is now larger than a 1986 Accord.

With an available 1.5 liter turbo making 174 hp, it will probably be faster than a 2016 Accord with the 4-cylinder.

And Honda says highway mpg will be at least 41.

Seems like a compelling car to me, except for the poor rear visibility from the driver's seat.

suydam

I liked the early 90s Civics. I had a MT one -- totally basic-- windup windows, decent AC, just a radio -- and it was a hoot to drive. Regularly got 40 mpg without even trying. Now of course I would want a nicer interior, but I liked the shape and functionality of that car. A breeze to maneuver and park and easy to drive as a manual even in heavy traffic city driving. I will say the padding was thin and the car sat pretty close to the ground, so long drives were pretty tiring. The newest ones just seem clunky to me.

graphicguy

Michaell said:

stever said:

tifighter said:

She is out of town at a conference until the weekend and has no idea I bought this.

Some would suggest that you are living dangerously, but I sort of wish my wife would just go us a car and surprise me. She's a bit intrigued by the Tucson now. Honestly, it's going to be hard to really get into a bad car these days.

There is a local radio show about car repair, with a little bit about new cars - one of the hosts is always saying "there are no bad cars, just bad choices".

I don't know about that. I think some cars, for a variety of reasons, are not put together correctly, quality control fell through the cracks, parts vendors slipping on what they produce, etc, etc.

I suppose in the grand scheme of things, that means those types of cars make for bad choices. That inherently makes them bad cars.

Michaell

graphicguy said:

Michaell said:

stever said:

tifighter said:

She is out of town at a conference until the weekend and has no idea I bought this.

Some would suggest that you are living dangerously, but I sort of wish my wife would just go us a car and surprise me. She's a bit intrigued by the Tucson now. Honestly, it's going to be hard to really get into a bad car these days.

There is a local radio show about car repair, with a little bit about new cars - one of the hosts is always saying "there are no bad cars, just bad choices".

I don't know about that. I think some cars, for a variety of reasons, are not put together correctly, quality control fell through the cracks, parts vendors slipping on what they produce, etc, etc.

I suppose in the grand scheme of things, that means those types of cars make for bad choices. That inherently makes them bad cars.

Given your recent history with the Audi and the Cadillac, I can totally understand where you're coming from with that statement.

breld

suydam said:

I liked the early 90s Civics. I had a MT one -- totally basic-- windup windows, decent AC, just a radio -- and it was a hoot to drive. Regularly got 40 mpg without even trying. Now of course I would want a nicer interior, but I liked the shape and functionality of that car. A breeze to maneuver and park and easy to drive as a manual even in heavy traffic city driving. I will say the padding was thin and the car sat pretty close to the ground, so long drives were pretty tiring. The newest ones just seem clunky to me.

Yup, my fondness for the Civic also stems from the 1990 Si I had through college. That car carried a lot of stuff, and memories.

I'm happy to see Honda respond so quickly to the negative response to the previous gen Civic. Bringing back the hatchback is a good idea I think, if not a bit overdue, what with the Focus and Mazda3 offerings out there, not to mention the Golf.

From the pictures, it also seems they've gone more traditional on the dash layout and abandoned the upper tier approach with the digital gauges. I can't say I minded it (just from test drives), but I think the more traditional look is more mature.

breld

stever said:

tifighter said:

She is out of town at a conference until the weekend and has no idea I bought this.

Some would suggest that you are living dangerously, but I sort of wish my wife would just go us a car and surprise me. She's a bit intrigued by the Tucson now. Honestly, it's going to be hard to really get into a bad car these days.

I like the new Tucson too. I was passing a Hyundai dealership on the way into work the other morning, and one them, in a nice bright blue, caught my eye. Nice little SUV.

suydam

Just curious -- what kind of mileage does it get?

laurasdada

.Hi: On the way to work this am, Costco gas, Boston area: RUG $1.99/gal; PUG $2.49/gal. Do they still make Hummers?

I did stop by the local Ferrari/Maserati dealer, looked at a '14 AM Vantage. Only $99,900! But, checked yesterday online, down to $97,900! Too bad I'm a Jag loyalist (for now). And, poor (for a bit longer than now!). If I could, I'd likely buy a new F-Type over used AM V.

Chronic Car Shopper.

stever

The Tucson? 23/31, 26 combined. Almost as good as the GT, which comes in at 24/33, 27 combined..

Encore is 25/33, 28 combined. Soul is 23/31, Prius 44/40.

ab348

breld said:

Yup, my fondness for the Civic also stems from the 1990 Si I had through college. That car carried a lot of stuff, and memories.

I dunno how much of my affection for that particular model is due to 25 years of time and memories of youth, etc. But that car seemed to be a high-water mark for the Civic, and Honda. Lightweight, low cowl, lots of glass, great visibility, airy-feeling, lots of room, clean design. It just worked. I know you can't make that same car today with airbags and crash test requirements, etc. But I wonder how far we've really come sometimes.

robr2

laurasdada said:

.Hi: On the way to work this am, Costco gas, Boston area: RUG $1.99/gal; PUG $2.49/gal. Do they still make Hummers?

I did stop by the local Ferrari/Maserati dealer, looked at a '14 AM Vantage. Only $99,900! But, checked yesterday online, down to $97,900! Too bad I'm a Jag loyalist (for now). And, poor (for a bit longer than now!). If I could, I'd likely buy a new F-Type over used AM V.

Chronic Car Shopper.

Did you say hi to Ernie?

laurasdada

robr2 said:

laurasdada said:

.Hi: On the way to work this am, Costco gas, Boston area: RUG $1.99/gal; PUG $2.49/gal. Do they still make Hummers?

I did stop by the local Ferrari/Maserati dealer, looked at a '14 AM Vantage. Only $99,900! But, checked yesterday online, down to $97,900! Too bad I'm a Jag loyalist (for now). And, poor (for a bit longer than now!). If I could, I'd likely buy a new F-Type over used AM V.

Chronic Car Shopper.

Did you say hi to Ernie?

No Ernie,Jr. in sight. But, I did chat up the young salesman, Ishmael. No, he did not introduce himself with, "Call me Ishmael." He was more than willing to hand me the keys to the AM, however. Haven't bought a car from Ernie, Herb has earned all my business lately. Hope this doesn't push back Ernie's retirement plans!

Michaell

ab348 said:

Yup, my fondness for the Civic also stems from the 1990 Si I had through college. That car carried a lot of stuff, and memories.

I dunno how much of my affection for that particular model is due to 25 years of time and memories of youth, etc. But that car seemed to be a high-water mark for the Civic, and Honda. Lightweight, low cowl, lots of glass, great visibility, airy-feeling, lots of room, clean design. It just worked. I know you can't make that same car today with airbags and crash test requirements, etc. But I wonder how far we've really come sometimes.

Back in 1991 I was looking for a new car. Narrowed it down to the Sentra SE (not SE-R) or the Civic Si. The Civic would have been more expensive to insure, so I got the Nissan. 

Silly me. 

laurasdada

Michaell said:

ab348 said:

breld said:

Yup, my fondness for the Civic also stems from the 1990 Si I had through college. That car carried a lot of stuff, and memories.

I dunno how much of my affection for that particular model is due to 25 years of time and memories of youth, etc. But that car seemed to be a high-water mark for the Civic, and Honda. Lightweight, low cowl, lots of glass, great visibility, airy-feeling, lots of room, clean design. It just worked. I know you can't make that same car today with airbags and crash test requirements, etc. But I wonder how far we've really come sometimes.

Back in 1991 I was looking for a new car. Narrowed it down to the Sentra SE (not SE-R) or the Civic Si. The Civic would have been more expensive to insure, so I got the Nissan. 

Silly me. 


First new car we bought after marriage? '92 Nissan Sentra SE-R. Loaded, taught the wife how to drive a stick in that car (as it was her car, I had a boring co. car...). Fun.

laurasdada

One in the GG camp (unfortunately): One of our IT guys just dumped, in total frustration, his gremlin plagued Caddy ATS. He said he really liked driving the car, when it wasn't in the shop (sounds like my Dad and his Catera saga). He replaced it with a....Chevy Volt! He also has a Caddy SRX which he said he hates and a Saab 9-3 convertible which he loves!

Michaell

laurasdada said:

ab348 said:

Yup, my fondness for the Civic also stems from the 1990 Si I had through college. That car carried a lot of stuff, and memories.

I dunno how much of my affection for that particular model is due to 25 years of time and memories of youth, etc. But that car seemed to be a high-water mark for the Civic, and Honda. Lightweight, low cowl, lots of glass, great visibility, airy-feeling, lots of room, clean design. It just worked. I know you can't make that same car today with airbags and crash test requirements, etc. But I wonder how far we've really come sometimes.

Back in 1991 I was looking for a new car. Narrowed it down to the Sentra SE (not SE-R) or the Civic Si. The Civic would have been more expensive to insure, so I got the Nissan. 

Silly me. 

First new car we bought after marriage? '92 Nissan Sentra SE-R. Loaded, taught the wife how to drive a stick in that car (as it was her car, I had a boring co. car...). Fun.

 I wanted the SE – R.  It was $1000 more than the SE. Out of the budget. Argh. 

suydam

Our first few cars were essentially gifts from one parent or the other because we didn't have 2 nickels to rub together. They were generally older cars but we were glad to have them. Our first real car that we bought and paid for and didn't feel we settled was a 1988 Mazda 323 MT. We really loved that car and when it was older it was the perfect vehicle to teach our oldest son how to drive a stick.

fezo

Good reason to love that Saab 9-3 convertible. My brother has one. Love it. He has that rare Saab that takes little repair.

tifighter

A friend also had one of those rare Saabs. I think a 03 9-3 Aero manual when that generation first came out. Proceeded to put 240k on it without a hiccup, and didn't baby it at all. He basically works out of his car and bought it for the seats.

I guess he must have been feeling lucky as he replaced it last year with a Golf TDI.

fezo

There's a man who lives a charmed life.

stever

I'm sure a Soul or Encore would handle this load fine. Got about 4 boxes laid down so far this week at a friend's house. There was about 840 pounds of wood in the van plus three of us cruising the mile home from Home Depot. Short boxes - 4 footers, so the boxes would easily fit in most hatches. Maybe not in one trip though. The top box is an 8 footer full of molding.

suydam

But you wouldn't have 3 people in the car.

stever

As many body parts that are aching right now, and I'm only 25% done with the first of three rooms, this is gonna be my last big van load. Ever.

tifighter

Yikes.

We just had new hardwoods put in about 3 weeks ago. I pulled up the old flooring, underlay and nails. Lots of nails. I salute your back, sir.

stever

Prep was pretty easy, just a carpet that pulled up fast. Lots of cleaning and vacuuming before the foam went down. The carpet is spoken for so at least I don't have to load that on the roof of the van and take it to the dump.

(This may be a good week to buy Advil stock...)

graphicguy

stever....I've done my own carpet......ONCE! I hear hardwood is easier, but I hired someone for that job. Will never attempt it again. I ached in places that I didn't know were attached to my body. Good for you.

graphicguy

laurasdada said:

One in the GG camp (unfortunately): One of our IT guys just dumped, in total frustration, his gremlin plagued Caddy ATS. He said he really liked driving the car, when it wasn't in the shop (sounds like my Dad and his Catera saga). He replaced it with a....Chevy Volt! He also has a Caddy SRX which he said he hates and a Saab 9-3 convertible which he loves!

And Cadillac wonders why they're sales are in the dumpster.

Talk about a different driving experience.....going from an ATS to a Volt. That would be a shock to the system.

I had a Saab 9000 turbo, late '80s model (I think '88???). Bought used. Fast for the time. Terrible turbo lag and torque steer, though. Rubbery shifter...it was a manual...great fun....pull away from a stop light....wait for the turbo to spool up...hang on for dear life hoping you don't end up in a ditch. Only had it a couple of years. No troubles with it. Comfy...had a lot of luxury touches for the period, too. Put together well. I remember service costing a lot, though.

houdini1

stever said:

I'm sure a Soul or Encore would handle this load fine. Got about 4 boxes laid down so far this week at a friend's house. There was about 840 pounds of wood in the van plus three of us cruising the mile home from Home Depot. Short boxes - 4 footers, so the boxes would easily fit in most hatches. Maybe not in one trip though. The top box is an 8 footer full of molding.

Wow ! That is the best reason I have ever seen NOT to own a van !

stever

@houdini1, a pickup would be worse - everyone would want to borrow it for dump runs and big box runs. And they often want you to help. No one realizes that you can do 99% of pickup hauling in a van. I think my record for hauling hay bales in and on the Quest was 9 of those old fashioned kind. It took three trips but the Caravan moved us. Cheap, good excuse for roadtripping, and unlike our Port Huron friend who followed us here a few months later and paid a mover, nothing got lost or smashed.

These were longer boards, 8 footers I guess, in the Quest. Had three people in the car that day too.

suydam

Hay bales + minivan = picking straw out of the corners for months.
Hay bales + pickup = wash out the bed and you're done.
Been there.
But I don't want to own either one any more!

stever

A tarp underneath helped, but my wife is always hitting nurseries or getting plants from friends, so the fresh straw just refreshed the detritus.

It would be a fun experiment to get the leather Encore and see how we treat it. I suspect nothing would change....

henryn

suydam said:

Hay bales + minivan = picking straw out of the corners for months.
Hay bales + pickup = wash out the bed and you're done.
Been there.
But I don't want to own either one any more!

When I had horses as pets, I used to haul hay in a pickup that had a camper shell. It was nearly impossible to get all of the hay out of the pickup bed, I don't even want to think about the inside of a minivan or SUV.

A couple of years ago, I was buying some grass squares (St Augustine), and watched a guy loading up the back of his VERY expensive SUV with sod. Be damned if I wouldn't have rented a truck rather than use my $60k SUV.

houdini1

stever said:

@houdini1, a pickup would be worse - everyone would want to borrow it for dump runs and big box runs. And they often want you to help. No one realizes that you can do 99% of pickup hauling in a van. I think my record for hauling hay bales in and on the Quest was 9 of those old fashioned kind. It took three trips but the Caravan moved us. Cheap, good excuse for roadtripping, and unlike our Port Huron friend who followed us here a few months later and paid a mover, nothing got lost or smashed.

These were longer boards, 8 footers I guess, in the Quest. Had three people in the car that day too.

You are right, most people would never suspect that a mini van could carry a load like that. The mini van is still the most practical all around utility vehicle ever made. A bunch of us went on a golf road trip a couple of years ago. We took a Honda Odyssey and a Toyota Sienna and they hauled 8 guys with all our clothes and gear across Kansas and Nebraska for 6 or 7 days without a hiccup. I drove both of them over a few hundred miles and I was shocked at how well they both drove, even loaded down like that. That said, my wife won't go near one even though it would be perfect for her, so no mini van for me.

rayainsw

This is very interesting
[ at least, to me ]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/19/business/volkswagen-is-ordered-to-recall-nearly-500000-vehicles-over-emissions-software.html?_r=0

nyccarguy

@graphicguy - I leased a 2000 Saab 9-3 in December of 1999.  I loved every second of it.  The practicality of the hatch back, the uber comfortable seats, the way the tach needle would just rocket forward once the turbo spooled up.  Even as a slush box it was fun to drive.  I rear ended somebody in heavy traffic on Staten Island, the coolant spilled out all over the highway.  I drove it for 100 miles with ZERO coolant.  Thus is why I'm wary of buying used cars that are "off lease."  You just never know.  At the end of the lease I turned it in with exactly 36,000 miles on the odometer.  The salesman jokingly asked if there was any gas in the car.  I replied:  "yes.  Enough to get to the back of the dealership."

laurasdada

Learned to drive in a '71 Saab 99. Got rear ended by a drunk in dad's 'new 76 99 GLE, hit at about 35mph, trunk folded, three occupants uninjured. Bought a '95 900s when we were expecting our first, was afraid the wife would want an suv or minivan. Saab worked just as well for us. No Saab stories regarding reliability or quality to relay, just a really nice, fun, practical car. RIP.

stever

rayainsw said:

This is very interesting
[ at least, to me ]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/19/business/volkswagen-is-ordered-to-recall-nearly-500000-vehicles-over-emissions-software.html?_r=0

Wow. Just wow.

qbrozen

ditto. "wow" is all I can say.

And, to think, just this morn I came across a CPO Jetta sportwagen TDI for $17,400 with 14k miles and thought "hmmmm." Guess I can forget that.

au1994

suydam said:

Hay bales + minivan = picking straw out of the corners for months.
Hay bales + pickup = wash out the bed and you're done.
Been there.
But I don't want to own either one any more!

I hauled bales of pines straw in a 4Runner once. Once. What a mess, those pine needles worked their way into the carpet weave and my poor little Hoover didn't have the juice to suck them out. It became a manual process!

benjaminh

Very strange that VW would do something like that...."Clean" diesel indeed.....

ab348

"German engineering...."

nyccarguy

Count me among the droves of SUV owners who thought that owning a minivan was uncool. In May of 2011 with our 3rd child due in November, my wife and I decided that her 2010 Acura TSX wasn't going to cut the mustard as the official family hauler. We heard the cries from people we knew who drove minivans (and only had 1 or 2 children) that just LOVE them even though they aren't cool. We heard the remarks from family members: "3rd kid huh? So you are trading in the Prelude for a minivan?" So I stepped up to the plate, took it as a challenge, and started doing my research. I wanted 4WD, a usable 3rd row with, a backup camera, navigation, heated seats, & the ability to haul 3 kids (baby, 2 1/2, & 4 1/2 at the time) LATCHed into their respective seats in the 2nd row in case I needed to maximize cargo capacity. At the time, the only Minivan that offered AWD was the Sienna. The only AWD Siennas around were the upper tier models with sticker prices well into the $40s. I said to myself that I'm not spending $40K on a Minivan. As you all know we ended up with a 2011 Pilot (I just made September's payment today). It will be paid off by this coming May. We are happy with it as I've stated numerous times (except for the fact that my wife wanted a power liftgate, which she has stated numerous times). It just isn't cool. It is exactly the same as every other Polished Metal Metallic (Dark Grey) Honda Pilot out there. Believe me, there are A LOT of them.

You really can't buy a bad minivan. Your choices are Toyota, Honda, Chrysler, & Kia. If I had to do it again today, I'd go test drive a Sienna and probably end up buying one.

Minivans are infinitely more practical than your run of the mill SUV. In fact, before I bought my Legacy last September I considered some sort of a pickup truck in case my guys had to take deliveries into the city or I had to bring something big home. I told myself it would never work because I couldn't put 10' lengths of pipe into a pickup truck with a 5' bed. What If we had a minivan?

My truck driver recently had a stroke and they found a tumor on his brain. I don't have the experience (nor the time) to drive our company's 14' box truck around the streets of New York City. I started using my Dad's 2015 Tahoe to make deliveries until I realized that "nothing" fits into it. I was able to squeeze 1 big and 2 small orders on it. If I had a minivan? Bring it on!

rayainsw

' If I had to do it again today, I'd go test drive a Sienna and probably end up buying one.'
My ex-wife just bought a 2015 AWD Sienna.
I will drive it sometime next week.
[ We live just about 1,000 miles apart now,
but will be together for our Daughter's wedding. ]
- Ray
Looking forward to the 'test drive' ....

suydam

stever said:

A tarp underneath helped, but my wife is always hitting nurseries or getting plants from friends, so the fresh straw just refreshed the detritus.

It would be a fun experiment to get the leather Encore and see how we treat it. I suspect nothing would change....

Using the all weather trunk mat + a large tarp for the folded seat backs in our Encore, we have so far hauled mulch and a power washer without any residual mud or other stuff. And I put up a dog mat and rug in the back seats to catch all the fur my black lab sheds on a daily basis. So far so good.

imidazol97

rayainsw said:

This is very interesting
[ at least, to me ]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/19/business/volkswagen-is-ordered-to-recall-nearly-500000-vehicles-over-emissions-software.html?_r=0

Wow. Outrageous. Intentionally misleading the test for pollution equipment by bypassing the required antipollution level when testing equipment is NOT connected.

"The Environmental Protection Agency issued the company a notice of violation and accused the company of breaking the law by installing software known as a “defeat device” in 4-cylinder Volkswagen and Audi vehicles from model years 2009-15. The device is programmed to detect when the car is undergoing official emissions testing, and to only turn on full emissions control systems during that testing. Those controls are turned off during normal driving situations, when the vehicles pollute far more heavily than reported by the manufacturer, the E.P.A. said."