Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous (Archived)

henryn

nyccarguy said:

Count me among the droves of SUV owners who thought that owning a minivan was uncool. In May of 2011 with our 3rd child due in November, my wife and I decided that her 2010 Acura TSX wasn't going to cut the mustard as the official family hauler. We heard the cries from people we knew who drove minivans (and only had 1 or 2 children) that just LOVE them even though they aren't cool. We heard the remarks from family members: "3rd kid huh? So you are trading in the Prelude for a minivan?" So I stepped up to the plate, took it as a challenge, and started doing my research. I wanted 4WD, a usable 3rd row with, a backup camera, navigation, heated seats, & the ability to haul 3 kids (baby, 2 1/2, & 4 1/2 at the time) LATCHed into their respective seats in the 2nd row in case I needed to maximize cargo capacity. At the time, the only Minivan that offered AWD was the Sienna. The only AWD Siennas around were the upper tier models with sticker prices well into the $40s. I said to myself that I'm not spending $40K on a Minivan. As you all know we ended up with a 2011 Pilot (I just made September's payment today). It will be paid off by this coming May. We are happy with it as I've stated numerous times (except for the fact that my wife wanted a power liftgate, which she has stated numerous times). It just isn't cool. It is exactly the same as every other Polished Metal Metallic (Dark Grey) Honda Pilot out there. Believe me, there are A LOT of them.

You really can't buy a bad minivan. Your choices are Toyota, Honda, Chrysler, & Kia. If I had to do it again today, I'd go test drive a Sienna and probably end up buying one.

Minivans are infinitely more practical than your run of the mill SUV. In fact, before I bought my Legacy last September I considered some sort of a pickup truck in case my guys had to take deliveries into the city or I had to bring something big home. I told myself it would never work because I couldn't put 10' lengths of pipe into a pickup truck with a 5' bed. What If we had a minivan?

My truck driver recently had a stroke and they found a tumor on his brain. I don't have the experience (nor the time) to drive our company's 14' box truck around the streets of New York City. I started using my Dad's 2015 Tahoe to make deliveries until I realized that "nothing" fits into it. I was able to squeeze 1 big and 2 small orders on it. If I had a minivan? Bring it on!

I have to agree, that 5.5 foot bed on modern pickups is not very long, and not much use for carrying sheets of plywood or 8 foot 2x4s. Which is one reason I have been thinking of converting mine into a giant lockable trunk via a camper shell.

And I have to agree about the Tahoe, that thing has very little interior space. Don’t get me wrong, I owned one, and liked it. But it is most definitely not a “junk hauler”.

Seriously though, to carry 10 foot lengths of pipe, you need a pipe rack. There is no other good answer.

graphicguy

Never was tempted by a minivan....not even when my one and only son was a pup.

Hatches worked for me....the afore mentioned Saab, I had a Corolla GTS hatch that was loads of fun. Drove it back and forth to the grocery store and work during the week...autox on weekends. That's the closest I ever got to a minivan.

Had a Tahoe for a long period....previous generation. I used to tow a boat and haul tech equipment for work in it. Probably one of the best ownership experiences I ever had. No trouble from the time I drove it off the dealer's lot, until I sold it 5 years later with about 80K miles. Tires, oil changes, brakes, gas (lots and lots of gas). That's all it took.

VW fudging EPA testing....that's just crazy! U.S. smells blood and will fine them big dollars. Why VW/Audi would risk that by so flagrantly flaunting the regulations is beyond stupid.

stever

No worries, it's all a big conspiracy to embarrass Senator Coker and divert attention from GM's near billion dollar fine. That'd be about as dumb as the IRS targeting non-profits or pols closing bridge lanes to punish other pols. Never happen.

houdini1

graphicguy said:

Never was tempted by a minivan....not even when my one and only son was a pup.

Hatches worked for me....the afore mentioned Saab, I had a Corolla GTS hatch that was loads of fun. Drove it back and forth to the grocery store and work during the week...autox on weekends. That's the closest I ever got to a minivan.

Had a Tahoe for a long period....previous generation. I used to tow a boat and haul tech equipment for work in it. Probably one of the best ownership experiences I ever had. No trouble from the time I drove it off the dealer's lot, until I sold it 5 years later with about 80K miles. Tires, oil changes, brakes, gas (lots and lots of gas). That's all it took.

VW fudging EPA testing....that's just crazy! U.S. smells blood and will fine them big dollars. Why VW/Audi would risk that by so flagrantly flaunting the regulations is beyond stupid.

Maybe that is why VW diesels have always been able to beat the EPA estimates so handily.

corvette

rayainsw said:

This is very interesting
[ at least, to me ]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/19/business/volkswagen-is-ordered-to-recall-nearly-500000-vehicles-over-emissions-software.html?_r=0

If the car was designed to disable emissions equipment during normal driving, and the recall is to update the software to trigger the emissions equipment, I wonder if the emissions hardware was only designed to be used for a few hours throughout the car's lifetime, and will fail shortly after having the software updated as part of the recall?

xwesx

corvette said:

rayainsw said:

This is very interesting
[ at least, to me ]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/19/business/volkswagen-is-ordered-to-recall-nearly-500000-vehicles-over-emissions-software.html?_r=0

If the car was designed to disable emissions equipment during normal driving, and the recall is to update the software to trigger the emissions equipment, I wonder if the emissions hardware was only designed to be used for a few hours throughout the car's lifetime, and will fail shortly after having the software updated as part of the recall?

I wonder that, too, though I doubt that it would fail *that* soon. If I owned one, I wouldn't be taking it in to address this recall.

ab348

corvette said:

If the car was designed to disable emissions equipment during normal driving, and the recall is to update the software to trigger the emissions equipment, I wonder if the emissions hardware was only designed to be used for a few hours throughout the car's lifetime, and will fail shortly after having the software updated as part of the recall?

Probably more likely that driveability and performance will suffer.

stever

xwesx said:

I wonder that, too, though I doubt that it would fail *that* soon. If I owned one, I wouldn't be taking it in to address this recall.

And that attitude will be common, and could impact people who have problems with diesel fumes. You know, like my wife. (For those who never ventured into the "diesel" discussion, my wife has mild asthma and diesel may be a trigger for her)

Good thing the air is so clean up in FBX so it won't be an issue in your valley.

From Forbes opinion piece - "the only way to reprogram the engine to get NOx emissions to acceptable levels will be to reduce engine power and torque. That means on-the-road performance will be compromised. The reprogramming could mean that the diesel engines’ outstanding fuel economy – the primary reason most people buy a diesel – also will be reduced."

breld

Like others have said. Wow!

It will be interesting to see what the fallout is - but seems pretty darn significant to me. I imagine there will be an official "adjustment" to the EPA ratings and perhaps the hp/tq numbers for those TDIs. Didn't Hyundai have to pay some hefty fines based on EPA "cheating" a few years ago?

Regarding minivans, I will say the wife and I really like the Kia. Between me driving it all around town to baseball workouts, games and tournaments, and my wife driving it to San Diego and back, we are very pleased with our choice. Still think it's by far the best looking van out there, inside and out. I wouldn't mind a bit more grunt from the engine, and the transmission seems to be a bit slow to anticipate your intentions, but these don't amount to anything too aggravating. And for that matter, it does offer "tiptronic" shifting which I've used here and there when I needed a bit more input on the gear selection.

As you may recall, we strongly considered replacing the Odyssey with an SUV, but as we looked at them, we just couldn't get over the sacrifice made in functionality and overall interior room, at a higher cost.

As a blended family, we have all the kids together every other weekend - so it's not every day that we need the van. But when we do, getting 4 kids, ages 10, 12, 17 and 19, into the vehicle is immensely easier (and comfortable) with the minivan than pretty much any SUV out there.

houdini1

xwesx said:

corvette said:

rayainsw said:

This is very interesting
[ at least, to me ]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/19/business/volkswagen-is-ordered-to-recall-nearly-500000-vehicles-over-emissions-software.html?_r=0

If the car was designed to disable emissions equipment during normal driving, and the recall is to update the software to trigger the emissions equipment, I wonder if the emissions hardware was only designed to be used for a few hours throughout the car's lifetime, and will fail shortly after having the software updated as part of the recall?

I wonder that, too, though I doubt that it would fail *that* soon. If I owned one, I wouldn't be taking it in to address this recall.

Me neither...I would just ask for a cash settlement !

xwesx

stever said:

Good thing the air is so clean up in FBX so it won't be an issue in your valley.

Hahah! Yeah, exactly. Emissions from these diesel (vehicle) exhausts are a total non-starter given all the other things contributing, whether that's here or anywhere. So, if the solution is something that has a real impact on my vehicle's performance (the one I already purchased), it is not a solution that my vehicle will get. I think I would go with Houdini's suggestion first (or at least wait a good long while to gauge real-world impacts of this "recall").

Sure, change the new ones out there to limit overall exposure, but reinventing the past is a lot of wasted time and effort that won't amount to a hill of beans.

sb55

henryn said:

nyccarguy said:

Count me among the droves of SUV owners who thought that owning a minivan was uncool. In May of 2011 with our 3rd child due in November, my wife and I decided that her 2010 Acura TSX wasn't going to cut the mustard as the official family hauler. We heard the cries from people we knew who drove minivans (and only had 1 or 2 children) that just LOVE them even though they aren't cool. We heard the remarks from family members: "3rd kid huh? So you are trading in the Prelude for a minivan?" So I stepped up to the plate, took it as a challenge, and started doing my research. I wanted 4WD, a usable 3rd row with, a backup camera, navigation, heated seats, & the ability to haul 3 kids (baby, 2 1/2, & 4 1/2 at the time) LATCHed into their respective seats in the 2nd row in case I needed to maximize cargo capacity. At the time, the only Minivan that offered AWD was the Sienna. The only AWD Siennas around were the upper tier models with sticker prices well into the $40s. I said to myself that I'm not spending $40K on a Minivan. As you all know we ended up with a 2011 Pilot (I just made September's payment today). It will be paid off by this coming May. We are happy with it as I've stated numerous times (except for the fact that my wife wanted a power liftgate, which she has stated numerous times). It just isn't cool. It is exactly the same as every other Polished Metal Metallic (Dark Grey) Honda Pilot out there. Believe me, there are A LOT of them.

You really can't buy a bad minivan. Your choices are Toyota, Honda, Chrysler, & Kia. If I had to do it again today, I'd go test drive a Sienna and probably end up buying one.

Minivans are infinitely more practical than your run of the mill SUV. In fact, before I bought my Legacy last September I considered some sort of a pickup truck in case my guys had to take deliveries into the city or I had to bring something big home. I told myself it would never work because I couldn't put 10' lengths of pipe into a pickup truck with a 5' bed. What If we had a minivan?

My truck driver recently had a stroke and they found a tumor on his brain. I don't have the experience (nor the time) to drive our company's 14' box truck around the streets of New York City. I started using my Dad's 2015 Tahoe to make deliveries until I realized that "nothing" fits into it. I was able to squeeze 1 big and 2 small orders on it. If I had a minivan? Bring it on!

I have to agree, that 5.5 foot bed on modern pickups is not very long, and not much use for carrying sheets of plywood or 8 foot 2x4s. Which is one reason I have been thinking of converting mine into a giant lockable trunk via a camper shell.

And I have to agree about the Tahoe, that thing has very little interior space. Don’t get me wrong, I owned one, and liked it. But it is most definitely not a “junk hauler”.

Seriously though, to carry 10 foot lengths of pipe, you need a pipe rack. There is no other good answer.

I have the "extended cab" Silverado, so my bed is 6.5'. With the tailgate down the bed area is 8' long. It works great for me. BTW, I have an Extang tri-fold cover and really like it. It is easy to install and remove if necessary.

suydam

If you have 3 kids or more (plus their friends) you really can't beat a minivan. We drove one happily throughout their kid years and just as happily don't have one now. Stages of life!

xwesx

The van body style has always been a favorite of mine. You just can't beat the versatility and practicality of one! Wagons are a small compromise, but come in a close second.

nyccarguy

I am proud of our Pilot's people hauling ability. On Tuesday we went apple picking in Cheshire, CT (about 1 1/2 hours away). I loaded up the Pilot with 8 people. I drove, my wife rode shot gun. My Mother-In-Law sat in the second row with my 7 year old nephew & my 6 year old son (both in high back boosters). My 3 year old daughter sat in the 3rd row in her Britax Marathon car seat with my 9 year old son in his high back booster on the other side and my (not so small) 9 1/2 year old niece.

robr2

suydam said:

If you have 3 kids or more (plus their friends) you really can't beat a minivan. We drove one happily throughout their kid years and just as happily don't have one now. Stages of life!

The toughest part of owning a minivan is actually admitting you need one. Once you get past that you wonder what all the fuss was about.

nyccarguy

@robr2 - I agree 100%

tifighter

stever said:

rayainsw said:

This is very interesting
[ at least, to me ]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/19/business/volkswagen-is-ordered-to-recall-nearly-500000-vehicles-over-emissions-software.html?_r=0

Wow. Just wow.

Yeah, that's some serious wow.

At least it will bring some spice to the diesel thread...;)

js06gv

I have to agree, that 5.5 foot bed on modern pickups is not very long, and not much use for carrying sheets of plywood or 8 foot 2x4s. Which is one reason I have been thinking of converting mine into a giant lockable trunk via a camper shell.

And I have to agree about the Tahoe, that thing has very little interior space. Don’t get me wrong, I owned one, and liked it. But it is most definitely not a “junk hauler”.

Seriously though, to carry 10 foot lengths of pipe, you need a pipe rack. There is no other good answer.




How sure are you that you need a big camper shell? I put a BAKFlip G2 trifold cover on my '13 F-150, created the lockable trunk you mentioned, have made minimal changes to the appearance, and in the end have something flexible enough that it has multiple configurations and never has to be removed for taller loads. About $750 purchased on Amazon and installed at a local truck accessory place.

Michaell

All this truck talk has been interesting. We're getting to the end of the renovations on our new house and we've used my son's friend's Chevy pickup for lots of hauling of materials. Today we have to purchase baseboards - they come in 8' or 12' strips. He's got one of those short bed trucks - he tells me the bed is 8' long with the tailgate down, so if we go with the 12' long strips, there will still be 4' sticking out.

Yesterday, I had 400 pounds of tile mortar in the back of my Elantra. Made the sluggish acceleration even worse, as you can imagine.

robr2

nyccarguy said:

@robr2 - I agree 100%

And now that we are pretty much past the kid years, we still have that 2000 Odyssey as the 3rd car. I used it last week to haul home sheets of MDF. The Explorer can't carry items that big. I keep thinking it's time to retire the van and then I use it for things like that.

jpp75

tifighter said:

I have a punch to report.

In the quest to replace our Gen 1 RDX ski & bikemobile, I've driven some SUV's (4Runner, GX), CUV's (GLK, Q5, RX, Touareg), a wagon on stilts (XC70), and even considered a truck. Do not want a 3rd row. Quick impressions-
4Runner - Trucky but honest. Limited trim has some modern things like smart key, dual climate heated/cooled seats and full-time 4wd which is nice for a skier. Stiff ride, noisy, and the hood occasionally flutters. Resale monster. Few discounts to be had. People love buying a Japanese-made Toyota.
GX - The 4Runner's refined brother. Better ride, interior, NVH, transmission and motor. Cannot buy without 3rd row. Despite the off-road chops, it still looks like something a realtor would drive. Not cheap, but cheaper I guess than a Land Cruiser.
GLK Bluetec- Really likeable. Back seat is not for adults. Even small ones. Too bad, because it checks many boxes.
Q5 TDI- See above, but with back seats that slide and accommodate humans. Nice. And torque. Unfortunately, the local dealer is beyond bad. Really.
RX - That Lexus mouse controller. Ugh. Next...
Touareg - I really like this one. Great size. Drove the TDI and gasser, both drove great. I'm not sure the TDI is worth the premium. Maybe the price diff is only $3 or 4k on paper, but in the real world, dealers would knock serious money off the gas model, and none off the diesel. In one instance, the difference was approaching $10k. Um, wow. But even so, these are still really expensive compared to what you'd cross shop.
XC70 - Tasteful inside and out, those seats, good value considering the content. Here in the PNW, almost none of these have the climate package (heated everything) for reasons I don't understand. And I hope you like black, otherwise, expect to probably pick it up in Sweden. Back seat a little tight for adults.
Truck - Love the idea. But everytime I think about parking it. In a space. Around other stuff. Worse, my wife parking it...nope.

Was mulling over, no hurry. Then I recently read the XC70 T6 was being dropped, smaller engines only for '16. Only a handful left in the region, and only one as I would want it for hundreds of miles. So now I have a twilight bronze (i.e. brown) T6 AWD Platinum in the driveway w/climate, BLIS, etc. 300hp/325 lb-ft. It reads speed limit signs and puts it on the dash. The active cruise drove itself in stop and go traffic on the way home. Fancy stuff for this guy. Below invoice, 0% and a tow hitch thrown in. Feeling good.

Congrats! I've come to love the active cruise feature on my S60.

sda

About 2 years after my daughter was born and getting tired of having to find room to put stuff in my wife's 99 Passat (seems we carried the whole house around when we traveled), we did a 24 month lease on an 03 Honda Odyssey. Our biggest complaint at the time is that it didn't have nor was available with a sunroof. If it had manual transmission, my wife would have been in heaven as that is all she likes to drive! The Odyssey proved invaluable when we moved from our old house into an apartment as our new house was being built. I took the middle row seats out, and it was a huge box to fill and enabled me to carry many boxes, gas grill, lawn mower to the storage unit. We turned in the Odyssey to lease an 06 Pilot EXL. A good vehicle in its own right, and would seat even more passengers because the middle row was a bench seat instead of captains chairs. It did have a sunroof, yay, but I never thought it drove as well as the Odyssey and gas mileage no

sda

Sorry, not sure what happened, item posted I didn't hit Post nor will let me edit. All I was going to say is the Pilot didn't get as good of gas mileage and drives more truckish. Same with our 2010. We are pleased with both.

stickguy

so, I am now back from a week in a "foreign land". Talk about feeding the disease, especially if you have a fondness for small hatchbacks!

talking about Bermuda. Interesting changes in the last 30-40 years. in the old days, it was mostly English cars (lots of Fords and BMC). Now, almost all Asian.

Only a few true US cars. Police use Jeep patriots, and I saw 1-2 civilian. And a Wrangler unlimited jacked up (a construction company had that). And the weirdest of all, a PT cruiser. Why?

closest thing to a British car was a Mini!

other than that, a boatload of Suzukis. Man, that company makes a huge array of Tiny and just small boxy cars. Loved the APV. super space efficient. SteveR would love it!

and coolest to me, an assortment of Euro iron. Peugeot (206 and 307?), Citroen, Renault. many I did not recognize. And hatchbacks rule.

oh, there were other US models: full sized tractor cabs. With LHD even. I could not imagine driving something that big on those tiny roads with zero shoulders. From the wrong side (since they drive on the left) of the cab!

Michaell

stickguy said:

so, I am now back from a week in a "foreign land". Talk about feeding the disease, especially if you have a fondness for small hatchbacks!

talking about Bermuda. Interesting changes in the last 30-40 years. in the old days, it was mostly English cars (lots of Fords and BMC). Now, almost all Asian.

Only a few true US cars. Police use Jeep patriots, and I saw 1-2 civilian. And a Wrangler unlimited jacked up (a construction company had that). And the weirdest of all, a PT cruiser. Why?

closest thing to a British car was a Mini!

other than that, a boatload of Suzukis. Man, that company makes a huge array of Tiny and just small boxy cars. Loved the APV. super space efficient. SteveR would love it!

and coolest to me, an assortment of Euro iron. Peugeot (206 and 307?), Citroen, Renault. many I did not recognize. And hatchbacks rule.

oh, there were other US models: full sized tractor cabs. With LHD even. I could not imagine driving something that big on those tiny roads with zero shoulders. From the wrong side (since they drive on the left) of the cab!

Welcome back - glad that you were able to feed your car fix with some foreign iron.

We are down to the last day of the renovations to the new house ... movers are set to come tomorrow. It's been a hectic couple of days trying to get everything done. Hoping to wrap up the important stuff today - install bathroom vanity in daughter's bath, rehang all the doors (whether they've been painted or not), finish tile work, install over the range microwave, attach baseboards throughout the whole house (that project was started last night, so I don't know how much got done), etc, etc, etc.

The punch list is a page long in my notebook. Some of it will get done during the upcoming week.

Good news - the carpet got installed yesterday and the TV/Internet/Phone folks will be here this morning so I'll have Wifi in the new house.

songbird54

I have my first punch to report on the forum (I'm not sure if I ever put the Elantra on)

I traded the Elantra and now own a 2016 Forester premium all weather in white with light gray interior. I'm excited and nervous at the same time. Mostly nervous about extending my car loan, but at least my apr is pretty low and I will be able to add to the payments, hopefully long term.

I cross shopped this with Tucson, encore, trax, outlander sport. It was down to encore and forester and I just feel roomier and safer in forester and the gas mileage is better for AWD. I will have the storage and passenger space when needed. Supposedly the retained value is high with the Subaru which is A plus for me.

It practically drives itself and will serve me well in all seasons here in NJ. I will need a nice soft broom to push snow off the roof though. It's pretty high.

I would love to keep this beyond my last payment but I guess I'm in the wrong forum for that

stever

Congrats! We haven't looked at the Outlander; mostly avoiding "marginal" brands in the US even though it shoudn't matter to us, since we drive them forever. We kind of ruled out the Forester last year but that was before we put the Encore and Tucson on our list. It was about as big as the CR-V, CX-5, etc.

I think the height may be related a bit to the ground clearance. Subaru excels in that area.

Heresy to the true believers, but we'd be more interested in another Subaru if there was a FWD option for one.

carnaught

songbird, congrats! Great choice. Keep us informed about your ownership experience.

suydam

We had a '99 Forester. I liked it but fuel economy was poor. The main reason I rule them out is that there is only 1 dealer in the area (the one we bought from back then), and their service department was so awful I would never buy there again. So many people love them, and they are much improved since then in every way! Congrats on the purchase. It should be a very reliable car.

breld

Congrats! The Forester has always been a solid choice, the current model being a particularly good one.

stickguy

Steve, among my fleet history, I have owned 2 Subarus. And both were FWD! A 1979ish hatch (no clue what they even called it then), and a 1992 Legacy wagon. Both 5 speeds of course.

a stick shift FWD Legacy wagon. There is something you will never see new again!

stever

Amazing. I saw one FWD Legacy in Boise once. Rare birds for sure.

My sister's '05 Forester is pushing 200k. She just drove it to TN from VA and back a week ago. She's about as bad as me; been threatening to get a new car for a few years now. Her Subaru won't die.

nyccarguy

@songbird54 - congrats on the punch! Extending the car loan is par for the course with this group, so is not keeping it past the last payment (not even close). No need to worry about it with the Forester. They hold their value very well here in the northeast. I've got a 2015 Legacy that I've had for about a year (9/27) & I'm happy with it. You'll be astonished by how well it does in the winter.

breld

I found these comments from a long-term test of the WRX interesting. They articulate the way I felt after many test drives of the car earlier this year.

When driven hard, the WRX’s 268-hp flat-four is a riot. But when driven in traffic, the boosted engine requires elevated concentration and a careful right foot to keep things smooth. Wide spreads between the gear ratios make it a challenge to shift without subtle bucking. At part throttle, the engine surges and jerks as it delivers power to the wheels.

It's why I ended up with the Mazda3 instead (not that it really mattered apparently what I had ended up with then )

In contrast, the S4 is surprisingly smooth in stop and go traffic. It creeps along well in 1st gear, only requiring the clutch to be depressed at a complete stop.

roadburner

breld said:

I found these comments from a long-term test of the WRX interesting. They articulate the way I felt after many test drives of the car earlier this year.

When driven hard, the WRX’s 268-hp flat-four is a riot. But when driven in traffic, the boosted engine requires elevated concentration and a careful right foot to keep things smooth. Wide spreads between the gear ratios make it a challenge to shift without subtle bucking. At part throttle, the engine surges and jerks as it delivers power to the wheels.

It's why I ended up with the Mazda3 instead (not that it really mattered apparently what I had ended up with then )

In contrast, the S4 is surprisingly smooth in stop and go traffic. It creeps along well in 1st gear, only requiring the clutch to be depressed at a complete stop.

I drove an STI and I didn't find the low speed behavior to be a problem, but then the STI has a different engine.

breld

@roadburner - you could simply be more skillful than the average driver too.

xwesx

songbird54 said:

It practically drives itself and will serve me well in all seasons here in NJ. I will need a nice soft broom to push snow off the roof though. It's pretty high.

I would love to keep this beyond my last payment but I guess I'm in the wrong forum for that

Hah! I made the last payment on mine (the 2010) a year-and-a-half ago, have owned it for six years on the nose, and they haven't kicked me out yet. Yet. I think you're in pretty safe company.

As for the clearing snow, I have an old shop broom (I think it's about 30" wide?) that I use for sweeping off my truck and trailer beds in the summer, which doubles as a snow clearer in the winter. One swipe across the windshield, two across the hood, and two down the length of the roof, and the car is good to go on most days!

Congrats on the punch!

My car is all ready for winter (just put the winter tires on yesterday).....

tifighter

@xwesx That doesn't look like a Flex...

berri

Where are the bears

stever

Berry picking.

xwesx

tifighter said:

@xwesx That doesn't look like a Flex...

You just HAD to go there....


-----

Actually this is really my car (the '10 is my wife's). The dealer told me it is a 2008 Flex, low miles, in perfect condition. Was I mislead?

corvette

Apparently, VW publicly announced they put aside 6.5 billion Euros to deal with the TDI problem. Given that they have essentially admitted liability, I think that effectively sets a floor for the fines assessed--the regulators can't be seen as letting them off "cheap."

Wasn't there a Cadillac or something back in the day that was rigged to turn off the HVAC during emissions testing?

The corporate apologies do ring slightly less hollow than the missive issued by Amazon's CEO after the New York Times story about both blue-collar and white-collar working conditions broke.

stever

Yep, 1995, $11 million fine against GM for using "defeat devices" on Sevilles and Devilles. (Detroit News).

Same story in '98 against diesel semi engine makers. (Jalopnik) The EPA settled for a billion in that one.

robr2

corvette said:

Apparently, VW publicly announced they put aside 6.5 billion Euros to deal with the TDI problem. Given that they have essentially admitted liability, I think that effectively sets a floor for the fines assessed--the regulators can't be seen as letting them off "cheap."

What I have read notes the €6.5 billion set aside is to deal with repairs and settlements. The fine will be dealt with when it happens.

corvette

That's only $500 or so per car if there are 11 million affected worldwide. Of course, they may not know what the fix is yet. 

benjaminh

Slowly getting ready to buy a new car in the next year, even though my current car, a 2008 Accord EXL navi 5MT has nothing wrong with it.

Trying to clarify for myself things I value in a car. Here goes:

1. Reliabilty
2. Safety
3. Visibility
4. MPG
5. Performance
6. Sound System

Given those requirements, and especially Visibility, I don't see any choice but the Honda Accord as a replacement. The only car I can think of that has visibility as good as the Accord is the BMW 3-series. But a comparably equipped 3-series costs c. $10k more than a Honda Accord. Since I'm not rich, I need that 10k for other things—like college money for kids, retirement, etc.

au1994

Don't forget about the amount of capital that is tied up in VW and Audi dealership inventory that can't be sold for the time being.

imidazol97

berri said:

Where are the bears

stever said:

Berry picking.

Wouldn't that be "beary picking"?

xwesx

I don't know about "bearies" at this point. Snow is on the agenda for Friday, so I think the time for picking berries is at an end, and the bears are definitely in last-minute-calorie-packing mode prior to the long sleep, which is typically within the next few weeks.