You know the guy who does Alex on autos said really it's more important to drive what you like. I also think that of the VW line, Golfs have a pretty good reliability standing. So enjoy yours, Sandman!
Yep, happy as a pig in you know what and honestly, I think this really is my favorite vehicle I've ever owned, both of them are now. Just wish the wife would give me some actual seat time in her A3. Amazed at how similarly they both drive to be honest. Guess I should let it go know but I've always had a deep deep passion for the automobile that started as a young child where I'd actually stand behind either one of my parents when they drove. I could name most makes, models & year of vehicles back then. Loved those little Matchbox toys and anything automotive. Growing up, we were a mostly GM family with a Lincoln or two thrown into the mix while my grandparents loved Dodge and Chrysler. Heck, my one grandad owned a Dodge dealership when I was very young. Definitely lucked out with my current retirement part time gig at Hertz. Get to drive most makes and models and my lead driver is very good about giving me nice vehicles to transport. I think if I didn't have the Golf right now, a used BMW 1 Series would really float my boat as I like the small size of it and even don't mind that it's not a 4 door. At first I was a little bummed out about the longish 29 mile hike to work but now with the Golf, I actually look forward to getting in and going...the exhaust sound to me is intoxicating, crazy as that might sound. Just glad that I finally have the funds to afford what I really like without having to ask permission but have worked long and hard to get to this juncture!
The Sandman
2023 Hyundai Kona Limited AWD (wife) / 2025 VW GTI (me) / 2019 Chevrolet Cruze Premier RS (daughter #1) / 2020 Hyundai Accent SE (daughter #2) / 2023 Subaru Impreza Base (son)
I know the LS isn't the best car for my situation. I'll keep looking at Volvos.
Pretty big difference in modern conveniences and safety features between a 2002 Lincoln LS and a 2013/14 Volvo S60. The newer S80s are also really cheap on the used market, if you can find them--not as many of them made and not as many coming off lease. And I'm not sure it's really "more car" than the S60 anymore.
If I was still commuting 30 miles a day round trip, I would seriously consider the LS. Since I often drive 400+ miles in a day, I need something with better fuel economy and reliability. I still take my 130K mile Passat on those drives but I trust the car although it's age is starting to show.
CPO S80's are in the $32K+ price area. IMHO, the S60 is a better value and since it's only a 4 YO design, a more modern design.
Nice wagon. Volvo is one of the few brands that I'm not at all knowledgable on, but is that marketed as a true SUV or it it more of a tall wagon similar to an Outback? I thought all "XC" models were SUVs, and it could just be the pics but it looks lower and longer like a wagon would be. Years ago, I believe there was an 850 wagon. Is there a modern day equivalent?
2024 Ram 1500 Longhorn, 2019 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2019 Ford Mustang GT Premium, 2016 Kia Optima SX, 2000 Pontiac Trans Am WS6
I checked out the certified S60's at Red Bank and they are asking the same $22K or so as they are here in New England. AWD are in the $24K asking range.
Nice wagon. Volvo is one of the few brands that I'm not at all knowledgable on, but is that marketed as a true SUV or it it more of a tall wagon similar to an Outback? I thought all "XC" models were SUVs, and it could just be the pics but it looks lower and longer like a wagon would be. Years ago, I believe there was an 850 wagon. Is there a modern day equivalent?
Yes, its a wagon. It is a V70, just hiked up a bit on suspension and some plastic cladding thrown on. Where Subaru used to take the Legacy wagon and turn it into the Outback, Volvo did the same with the V70 to make the XC70. The 850 wagon's equivalent now would be the V60. Although I believe the 850 had more usable space.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I checked out the certified S60's at Red Bank and they are asking the same $22K or so as they are here in New England. AWD are in the $24K asking range.
Their prices are a bit wacky. The most expensive S60 they have is a 2013 T5 for $25k with Premier, climate, and 24k miles. Meanwhile, for $22k, you can get another 2013 T5 with premier, climate, and just 11k miles. Or get the 2012 with 20k for $20,599.
Of course, these are all just asking prices. I'm sure they would come down.
Volvo's website shows 22 CPO S60s with leather with less than 40k miles for under $20k. 14 of those have under 35k miles. It is certainly a compelling car for under $20k.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
One Volvo dealer had a CPO 2013 T5 with premier and climate with 18K with an asking of $21,998. When I arrived they had just taken a deposit on it. They showed me the same vehicle with 12K and a different color for $23,998.
The salesperson then looked at what they did between the two cars to certify them. The first car took tires, a full detail, and the 20K service. The latter car was basically washed as they had just done a 10K service on it 3 months earlier just before the owner turned it in. They had similar in service dates. I tried to negotiate down and they told me they were not budging on the car since it had so few miles. I responded that 6K miles didn't warrant an additional $2K. It's been a month and it's still there.
The VW free fall may have started.
Have a poster in the GTI lease forum saying he's got an offer of $6K discount from MSRP on an S trim.
Base lease payment under $200/mo!
Wow. I posted asking if OP could break it down. My issue is I really don't want to lease this go around if I can avoid it - but I also recognize buying a VW at this juncture is a risky enterprise.
I think I've officially driven my wife crazy. She asked what she could get if she traded me in...
2025 Jetta GLI Autobahn, 2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4xE
Wow. I posted asking if OP could break it down. My issue is I really don't want to lease this go around if I can avoid it - but I also recognize buying a VW at this juncture is a risky enterprise.
I think I've officially driven my wife crazy. She asked what she could get if she traded me in...
Some peace and quiet? That's worth A LOT (or so MY wife tells me....).
2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 2013 Ford F250 Lariat D, 1976 Ford F250, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100
This hurts, being all carred up for 2 more years. A gti fir cheap would be hard to pass up.
The breakdown of the discount includes $1000 trade in allowance, $500 from VW Credit, $2000 owners loyalty, in addition to the discount from sticker.
I think I'm gonna be on the "value" wagon this next go around - even more so than my current lease. If I can get something for under $200/mo that would be great.
If I could get that $2K loyalty (never owned a VW), I might have a hard time passing up a GTI.. Nothing keeping me from selling the current ride, other than inertia.
Since we are talking about former $40K + luxury sedans (Volvos) that have now dipped into the $20K range, I've seen a few 2012 Acura TL SH-AWD w/ Techs that must have come off lease. 36 to 37K miles, CPO, asking $25K & change. (Not that I'm looking or anything)
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
So you could pay off the RDX, pawn your Sonata off on your wife & get yourself a GTI. Or you could use the loyalty cash to offset any negative equity you have on the Sonata. Or since you have 2 Jettas, maybe they are desperate enough to give you 2 $2000 loyalty bonus;)
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
pretty sure you can only use 1. plus the 2nd Jetta is actually registered to my son in Albany, but close enough! I can dig up paperwork with my address on it.
get both, and I will just add another car.
The wife just might take the sonata, but we would likely miss the space in the RDX. maybe!
Just checked out the local Volvo dealer's inventory - some of these CPO AWD S60s have so little mileage on them, are still covered under factory warranty, then the CPO warranty. Maybe @robr2 & @qbrozen as well as the other Volvo fans are on to something.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
The best part is the 7 year/100K mile warranty from in service date. It's basically bumper to bumper and based on the age/mileage, there are services still included.
I've seen most with under 20K miles. They are off lease units and it seems like nobody drove them.
I've noticed that the 2015 T5 V60s are really cheap, relatively speaking. I wonder why. Auction values for T5 Premier FWD wagons are mostly mid to low 20s. With a couple even below 20, such as a white example with 30k miles that got $19,700. Huh.
AWD brings them up to $28k for 10k-15k miles, and the T6 R-designs, on the other hand, are pushing $38k.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Speaking of Jags, my '13 XF turned 20k miles over the weekend. I am not driving as much as I used to, but life changes... Anyway, nothing to report reliability or quality wise; other than an occasional rattle when the sunroof shade is open (and the roof is closed). Vents continue to rotate (which, Jag, feel free to eliminate that bit of theatrics. I can program them to stay open, which I've done on occasion), hockey puck continues to rise and fall. The puck is actually a nice piece of work, feels good to the touch and solid. However, when in the sunlight for too long, gloves are recommended!
Still a looker, both inside and out. Good overall mpg, 20-22 mixed. But, made for highway cruising/charging where mpg is in the upper 20s, if I keep below 70 likely ~30. Holds the road beautifully, steering response is instant, if not total feel from the fronts. A bit of wind noise, think it's the side view mirrors, but overall a quiet, composed ride. With the fold down rear seats and ski pass through/bag, it's a mini SUV! Power more than adequate, when not, just shift into "Sport" mode, woo hoo! Visibility not a strong suit, but with mirrors, rear view camera and swiveling the old noggin to look around, I accept this for the lovely styling. Infotainment hasn't failed, but it is you father's system!
So, I'm lovin' it! Really looks like Jag (at least iron-wise, if not sales-wise yet) is on the rise; the Auto mags all seem to love the F-Type, early reviews of the XE are aces, and, egads, the F-Pace will hopefully make a ripple... Think about it folks! The 2016s now come with 5/60k warranty/service (of course, after I bought a '13!).
I think I want an F-Type... Although my work has put in four electric charging stations in the garage for use, gratis. May be time for an i8! Or, a place to live/own...
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
I think only the XC90 has carplay for now, with the other models phasing it in for '16+.
I had a V60 CC T5 for a loaner while they installed the trailer hitch on our wagon. Not bad; nice size in the city, but noticeably louder and rougher on the freeway vs the 70. It definitely has much less room than a RDX...
my accord was silver over black leather. so got tired of it. and swore I would never have another full black leather interior.
plus there are many cooler colors!
I happened to find the same basic car up in Jersey (probably red bank) in white over saddle. now that, I liked! I think they wanted more like 32K for it (though it did only have 5K miles on the clock). to save $9,000, I will compromise on color and give up 12,000 miles.
@qbrozen I remember looking at Red Bank Volvo when I was looking for my S60. They were always pretty fairly priced. I do have to say, watch out for the 18" Sleipner Alloy Wheels on the S60 depending on where you live. They're beautiful looking, but it does ride a tad rough for the pothole ridden upstate NY. I already have a bubble on the sidewall of one of the new tires (less than 8 months old), so I'll probably have to replace one tire already . Other than that, great value for a lot of car! I highly reccomend!
Interesting things happen after you have a busy day at work, watch some baseball (congrats METS fans), and start paper work after midnight. I happened to start checking out the TLX lease questions board. Then took the information & plugged it into lease guide's most excellent lease vs. buy calculator. A 2015 TLX V6 with SH-AWD & the Tech Pkg stickers for $42,495. I deducted the $2250 lease cash from the invoice and got a selling price of $37,630 (I'm sure there is still meat on the bone to grind away). $478.38 per month for 36 months/15K per year compared to $717.31 for 60 months using Acura's 2.9% financing rate. Hmm (stay away from the dealership Bradd. Stay away from the dealership).
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
Back for a brief update while I procrastinate on homework. Got the '15 Focus back about 3 weeks ago, the body shop did an amazing job. To quote my wholesaler friend "if you didn't know you wouldn't know." Car is still the same as it was before the accident. I was hesitant about the repair but it's flawless and the car is fine. It was nice I was able to see it at various stages of repair which gave me peace of mind that it would be fine. Final bill was $11,035. Allstate was really good about diminished value, I had done some checking around with various used car dealers and my wholesaler friend and the general consensus was approx $3000 in diminished value. Allstate came back with $1750-2250. I held firm at $3000 and they gave it to me. I'll pay off our other Focus with that. Everything with the car is taken care of as far as insurance/repairs/diminished value now. Just the injury portion left to deal with and I'll probably hire an attorney.
Comments
Definitely lucked out with my current retirement part time gig at Hertz. Get to drive most makes and models and my lead driver is very good about giving me nice vehicles to transport. I think if I didn't have the Golf right now, a used BMW 1 Series would really float my boat as I like the small size of it and even don't mind that it's not a 4 door. At first I was a little bummed out about the longish 29 mile hike to work but now with the Golf, I actually look forward to getting in and going...the exhaust sound to me is intoxicating, crazy as that might sound. Just glad that I finally have the funds to afford what I really like without having to ask permission but have worked long and hard to get to this juncture!
The Sandman
2023 Hyundai Kona Limited AWD (wife) / 2025 VW GTI (me) / 2019 Chevrolet Cruze Premier RS (daughter #1) / 2020 Hyundai Accent SE (daughter #2) / 2023 Subaru Impreza Base (son)
CPO S80's are in the $32K+ price area. IMHO, the S60 is a better value and since it's only a 4 YO design, a more modern design.
On the other side of the value debate, I saw a 2004 S80 2.5T with low miles for $8k. Can't seem to find it again; the ad is dead.
I know my wife would probably prefer this, though.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
2024 Ram 1500 Longhorn, 2019 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon, 2019 Ford Mustang GT Premium, 2016 Kia Optima SX, 2000 Pontiac Trans Am WS6
But for $4k less and 9k fewer miles, but a year older, this may be a better value prop. Tough call.
Or, if pinching pennies, could justify a FWD model for quite a bit less. Personally, I'd probably have to pick the turbo, though.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Have a poster in the GTI lease forum saying he's got an offer of $6K discount from MSRP on an S trim.
Base lease payment under $200/mo!
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2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Of course, these are all just asking prices. I'm sure they would come down.
Volvo's website shows 22 CPO S60s with leather with less than 40k miles for under $20k. 14 of those have under 35k miles. It is certainly a compelling car for under $20k.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
The salesperson then looked at what they did between the two cars to certify them. The first car took tires, a full detail, and the 20K service. The latter car was basically washed as they had just done a 10K service on it 3 months earlier just before the owner turned it in. They had similar in service dates. I tried to negotiate down and they told me they were not budging on the car since it had so few miles. I responded that 6K miles didn't warrant an additional $2K. It's been a month and it's still there.
I think I've officially driven my wife crazy. She asked what she could get if she traded me in...
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I think I'm gonna be on the "value" wagon this next go around - even more so than my current lease. If I can get something for under $200/mo that would be great.
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2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
Curious what next month brings for VW and if they do anything for non-VW owners.
The $1000 trade credit is dealer specific...
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2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
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2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
get both, and I will just add another car.
The wife just might take the sonata, but we would likely miss the space in the RDX. maybe!
good plans though.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
I've seen most with under 20K miles. They are off lease units and it seems like nobody drove them.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
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2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2024 Kia Sportage Hybrid SX Prestige
AWD brings them up to $28k for 10k-15k miles, and the T6 R-designs, on the other hand, are pushing $38k.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Still a looker, both inside and out. Good overall mpg, 20-22 mixed. But, made for highway cruising/charging where mpg is in the upper 20s, if I keep below 70 likely ~30. Holds the road beautifully, steering response is instant, if not total feel from the fronts. A bit of wind noise, think it's the side view mirrors, but overall a quiet, composed ride. With the fold down rear seats and ski pass through/bag, it's a mini SUV! Power more than adequate, when not, just shift into "Sport" mode, woo hoo! Visibility not a strong suit, but with mirrors, rear view camera and swiveling the old noggin to look around, I accept this for the lovely styling. Infotainment hasn't failed, but it is you father's system!
So, I'm lovin' it! Really looks like Jag (at least iron-wise, if not sales-wise yet) is on the rise; the Auto mags all seem to love the F-Type, early reviews of the XE are aces, and, egads, the F-Pace will hopefully make a ripple... Think about it folks! The 2016s now come with 5/60k warranty/service (of course, after I bought a '13!).
I think I want an F-Type... Although my work has put in four electric charging stations in the garage for use, gratis. May be time for an i8! Or, a place to live/own...
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
Got city safety too. Looks like just missing navi.
Love that car. Would ditch my RDX for that. Heck, might get close to that money on a trade. And pick up years of warranty.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Wonder if a Polestar version will ever be as reasonable used.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I do love the big screen navi in my sonata, but could live without it if need be. Wonder if that has the apple CarPlay stuff?
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I had a V60 CC T5 for a loaner while they installed the trailer hitch on our wagon. Not bad; nice size in the city, but noticeably louder and rougher on the freeway vs the 70. It definitely has much less room than a RDX...
25 NX 450h+ / 24 Sienna Plat AWD / 23 Civic Type-R / 21 Boxster GTS 4.0 / 03 Montero Ltd
2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee L Limited Velvet Red over Wicker Beige
2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
Geez, I would guess silver paint with black interior makes up about half the new cars on dealer lots around here.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
plus there are many cooler colors!
I happened to find the same basic car up in Jersey (probably red bank) in white over saddle. now that, I liked! I think they wanted more like 32K for it (though it did only have 5K miles on the clock). to save $9,000, I will compromise on color and give up 12,000 miles.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
That Volvo wagon would look much better if the windows were tinted.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic
Other than that, great value for a lot of car! I highly reccomend!
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD
Sounds like a reasonable outcome, so far.
Good luck with the next step!
- Ray
Not an attorney....
Akangl, glad you got the car back in good shape and got paid for the diminished value without hassle. Hope your daughter is healing up.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S