Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous

Mr_Shiftright

Let's say you're selling a car for your invalided neighbor. That's a kind of curbstoning isn't it? I wonder if there's actually a definition for a "curbstoner"?

jayrider

@oldfarmer50 said:
This plate also appeared on a Taurus, Focus, Galant

What a co-inkydink !!

iluvmysephia1

On a separate note, Dodge has some nice incentives on the Challenger. $1000 Customer Cash, $1,000 Conquest Cash, & $1,000 HEMI credit. They seem to hold their value too. Invoice minus $3K on an RT with a 6-Speed Stick would be fun:)

nyccarguy - I would prefer a new Dodge Challenger like you describe here to a new Mustang. Dodge nailed it with this car! And a 6-speed stick would make it so much more fun.

jayrider

@iluvmysephia1 said:
On a separate note, Dodge has some nice incentives on the Challenger. $1000 Customer Cash, $1,000 Conquest Cash, & $1,000 HEMI credit. They seem to hold their value too. Invoice minus $3K on an RT with a 6-Speed Stick would be fun:)

nyccarguy - I would prefer a new Dodge Challenger like you describe here to a new Mustang. Dodge nailed it with this car!

It is a bigger car than the Mustang. Reasonable back seat and trunk. More practicle but when it comes to cars in this genre, practicality is trumped by emotion.

iluvmysephia1

It is a bigger car than the Mustang. Reasonable back seat and trunk. More practicle but when it comes to cars in this genre, practicality is trumped by emotion.

And it doesn't hurt that I like late 60's Mopar sporty looking cars. Dodge nailed it with this new retro-late 60's look on the Challenger. Just trumps the new Mustang IMHO.

ab348

@iluvmysephia1 said:
It is a bigger car than the Mustang. Reasonable back seat and trunk. More practicle but when it comes to cars in this genre, practicality is trumped by emotion.

And it doesn't hurt that I like late 60's Mopar sporty looking cars. Dodge nailed it with this new retro-late 60's look on the Challenger. Just trumps the new Mustang IMHO.

The Challenger is just too big, heavy, and bulky-looking for my liking. Compare it to one of the originals side by side and you immediately see the problem, especially in the rear quarters. A shame, since if they could have made an 85%-scale version it would be really appealing.

I'm waiting to see the new Mustang in person before passing a verdict. I didn't like the first pictures of it that I saw but I may be warming to it now. But a lot will depend on how Ford handled the details, especially in the interior. Ford interiors generally leave me very unimpressed.

qbrozen

wow. What a load of crap (speaking of the Stop Curbstoning website). They make it sound like all curbstoners are out to take advantage of people and sell crap cars. There are many people who do it for extra money and know a good bit about cars. Hell, by the definition put forth that that KSL.com article, "Simply put, it's when someone sells more than two cars in a year without a dealer's license. Many times those cars are loaded with problems." I am a curbstoner, or at least have been in the past. I definitely sold at least 3 in one year not long ago, none of which had any problems at all. And I've often thought of making a little money on the side by purchasing cars in need, fixing them, and reselling. Apparently, that would make me scum of the earth and a scourge on the dealer society. Oh boy.

stever

As I recall, state law in Alaska said that more than five sales a year made you a dealer - otherwise you were a "curbstoner". [edit - it's five a year in Michigan.]

If you don't like NADA writing the laws, I guess you need to start a curbstoner's lobby. I'm sure the guy in the Hudson Valley would be happy to join in and donate some seed money.

henryn

@qbrozen‌

>

I've often thought of making a little money on the side by purchasing cars in need, fixing them, and reselling. Apparently, that would make me scum of the earth and a scourge on the dealer society.

Only if you were misleading people. Which most curbstoners are. Not all, but definitely most.

Back in the day, a friend of mine used to rebuild the classic Volkswagen Beetles. He would do 3 or 4 per year, and usually had a waiting list of people who wanted to buy one of his rebuilt VWs. I think this would be a very interesting hobby, pick a make and model that appeals to you, buy several of them (some to be rebuilt, others strictly as "donors"), and go for it. You would definitely have to buy a place out in the country so that deed restrictions wouldn't eat you alive.

Mr_Shiftright

the only problem with curbstoning is that a private party sale that goes wrong leaves the buyer with fewer legal protections than if he had bought from a licensed dealer. A curbstoner just folds up the tent and leaves. I've certainly curbstoned in the past...but I don't think I ever exceeded the legal limit.

If I ever did find a car I wanted to flip, I'd register it in my own name, then nobody can say beans about it.

stever

@Mr_Shiftright said:

If I ever did find a car I wanted to flip, I'd register it in my own name,

Now we're getting to the crux; the states don't like curbstoning because they're losing sale tax revenue and registration fees.

qbrozen

Huh. Interesting thought.

So OUR definition of a curbstoner should probably include selling multiple cars in a year that were never titled in the seller's name.

henryn

My definition of a curbstoner is someone selling a car where the title is not in his name, and he does not have a dealer's permit.

qbrozen

for me, it would have to be that plus a certain number per year. I guess 3 sounds about right. Only because the situation can certainly come up where you are selling a car for someone else. I sold my FIL's car for him, and the guy I bought a 300z from was flipping it because it was given to him to satisfy a debt.

oldfarmer50

@ab348 said:
I'm waiting to see the new Mustang in person before passing a verdict. I didn't like the first pictures of it that I saw but I may be warming to it now. But a lot will depend on how Ford handled the details, especially in the interior. Ford interiors generally leave me very unimpressed.

I like the interior on the 2015 although I prefer anything but black. Wondering how that ceramic color looks in person.

oldfarmer50

@qbrozen said:
wow. What a load of crap (speaking of the Stop Curbstoning website). They make it sound like all curbstoners are out to take advantage of people and sell crap cars. There are many people who do it for extra money and know a good bit about cars. Hell, by the definition put forth that that KSL.com article, "Simply put, it's when someone sells more than two cars in a year without a dealer's license. Many times those cars are loaded with problems." I am a curbstoner, or at least have been in the past. I definitely sold at least 3 in one year not long ago, none of which had any problems at all. And I've often thought of making a little money on the side by purchasing cars in need, fixing them, and reselling. Apparently, that would make me scum of the earth and a scourge on the dealer society. Oh boy.

In NY you need a dealer's license if you sell more than 5. If your MB is any indication I'd love to see you curbstoning on my block.

The problem is that many unlicensed sellers don't have your integrity and do sell junk without disclosing serious issues.

oldfarmer50

@stever said:

>

If you don't like NADA writing the laws, I guess you need to start a curbstoner's lobby. I'm sure the guy in the Hudson Valley would be happy to join in and donate some seed money.

Ha ha ha that's funny!

stevedebi

@stever said:
Now we're getting to the crux; the states don't like curbstoning because they're losing sale tax revenue and registration fees.

Here ic CA, you are required to pay the sales tax when you register the car after a private sale. The DMV collects it, I believe.

At least that is my understanding.

Mr_Shiftright

Yes, but if the curbstoner had registered the vehicle, he'd pay the sales tax, and if you bought it the next day, then you'd pay another sales tax. If a vehicle is sold 10X in a year, that's 10 sales taxes.

So if a mere 100 curbstoners out of the 20 million licensed drivers in California beat the sales tax each day on cars worth $5000, that's about $400 X 100, or $40K a day X 365 = $14,600,000 bucks!

Sandman6472

Wife spoke to me earlier tonight and was questioning me about the regular Mazda3 as I think she's taking the "S" off her short list and concentrtating on the top model with the 2.0 engine...I wasn't really sure what model that is so anyone who has some knowledge about this, feel free to jump in here. She's now not sure if she can live with the smaller engine in the Accent and has said that a back-up camera like I have is something she wants after seeing how well mine in the Tuscon works...hell, she even mentioned a vehicle that beeps also when backing but I doubt that's in the price that she wants to spend and that's $20K plus whatever little we can get. But if we can find a vehicle with both these features and she really really likes it, she would probably spend a bit more as this new vehicle is gonna be a 10 year vehicle also, G-d willing so I told her to get what she really wants so she won't be unhappy a couple years down the road.
She is planning to take her vehicle to the a/c guy I found and if it's not to cost prohibitive to fix, she'll just do it and keep it a bit longer but told her when is it going to be enough already, hate to throw more $ into it and have some issue a couple weeks later. Said she has to eventually pick a point where she's absolutely done! The problem is that she really likes her vehicle and when it runs properly, it's absolutely great...Roadburner knows this also, Mazda does make a fine vehicle. So that's the latest but that could all change in a heartbeat and at any time. So, I'm ready to do what needs to be done here when I get the word to test drive the final choice and then head into the negotiations and then, the finance office. Just want this done already!!!

The Sandman

stickguy

Sandy, the touring model 3 and above has the backup cam. And I agree that the 2.0 is more than enough engine, and should be comparable to the 2.3 in her current car.

I would say go with the touring. This is what you get going from the baser models:

The 3i Touring models lose the CD player but add 16-inch alloy wheels, foglights, heated side mirrors, a rear spoiler, keyless ignition and entry, a leather-wrapped steering wheel, a rear-seat center armrest, a blind-spot warning system with rear cross-traffic alerts and a rearview camera.

there is also a tech package with Nav, fancier stereo/bigger screen, moonroof and sat radio. The GT has all that standard, plus heated leather seats.

so, from what you have said, a 3i touring without the tech package would give her everything that is a must have, without too much fluff (and a few nice extras). That MSRP for a 2015 is $21,440, and a lot of car for the money. Invoice is $20,551. And I assume you would have to order it, but you can get backup sensors for an extra $450!

so, seems to be well within budget with the trade. Plus there are some discounts, and I think a loyalty rebate.

having driven one, it is a very, very nice car. and a good value IMO compared to the competition. great MPG too.

iluvmysephia1

I would have ta say, in all fairness to Fo-Mo-Co and their new '15 Mustang, it's not that I dislike the 2015 Mustang. It's just that I prefer the new Challenger to the Mustang. What did I read in the September Road and Track, the new Challenger has an 8 cyl. engine with 740 hp?!!

Evidently the 6-speed stick isn't available yet, just the automatic CVT. I saw a front-end look at the new 2015 Dodge Charger and it sure trumped the outgoing Charger. Though I'd want ta look at pics of the whole Charger before I'd say that for sure.

oldfarmer50

Mustang purchase plan hits a snag.

My wife has been bring up the topic of me buying one more frequently lately which I took as a green light. Today she asked how much I thought it would cost.

When I told her about $38k including tax she was shocked. Later, she came to me and said "if you get to spend that much for yourself you can never say no to anything I want EVER again...and that includes getting a boyfriend on the side".

I hope he doesn't want to drive my Stang.

suydam

Backup cameras are now a must-have for me. I think the sensors might be annoying but then I haven't driven a car with them. Mazda is a great car and now it gets really good fuel economy too.

Sandman6472

Yes Stick, it sounds like the perfect vehicle for her actually and if it drives similarly to her current "S" model, think it could be a winner. She likes the Accent size, a lot, but that and the Kia Rio just don't have the creature comfort features she wants and if she's like your wife, she will not settle for anything less! It also falls into the preferred money amount also...we briefly talked leasing but she nixed that idea very quickly. We already know and like Mazda dependability and having the dealer right next door to the Hyundai store could just be the icing on the cake. My gut is telling me it's going to come down to the '15 Elantra GLS or the '15 Mazda 3i Touring and personally, I'd be happy with either one. If they can be equipped almost the same, it's gonna come down to which one drives better and must say the Hyundai warranty could tip the choice in their favor. But again, it's totally going to be her choice, as it should be, and all I'll have to do is maintain it from time to time but hey, I do that for all four of our vehicles in the family stable.
Leaving in a few to meet the movers at 10 and after they're done, it's off to Tires Plus with my oil change coupon for the Versa. Luckily there's one right down the street from her new place. And have decided to hold off on the Accent's oil change a month or two since it's only gone about 1500 miles since it's last one last late August. Now that it's really getting used, figure I'll do it either on Columbus Day or Veteran's Day so I can just run down to my daughter's place and take it in while she's studying or in class. She doesn't use it on the weekdays, she lives right across the street from the pharmacy school, so I can do it early and then proceed on into work since it's on the way.

The Sandman

qbrozen

@iluvmysephia1 said:
I would have ta say, in all fairness to Fo-Mo-Co and their new '15 Mustang, it's not that I dislike the 2015 Mustang. It's just that I prefer the new Challenger to the Mustang. What did I read in the September Road and Track, the new Challenger has an 8 cyl. engine with 740 hp?!!

Evidently the 6-speed stick isn't available yet, just the automatic CVT. I saw a front-end look at the new 2015 Dodge Charger and it sure trumped the outgoing Charger. Though I'd want ta look at pics of the whole Charger before I'd say that for sure.

Its 707 hp for the Hellcat, which will be quite expensive ($60k). Its more of a Shelby competitor, not base GT. FYI, its NOT a CVT. I'd bet it will launch with both transmissions, the 6-speed stick and 8-speed auto.

qbrozen

@oldfarmer50 said:
Mustang purchase plan hits a snag.

My wife has been bring up the topic of me buying one more frequently lately which I took as a green light. Today she asked how much I thought it would cost.

When I told her about $38k including tax she was shocked. Later, she came to me and said "if you get to spend that much for yourself you can never say no to anything I want EVER again...and that includes getting a boyfriend on the side".

I hope he doesn't want to drive my Stang.

$38k??! That's 50% more than I paid for my 2013. I guess you are looking at a Premium with some add-ons. Too rich for me.

jayrider

@oldfarmer50 said:
Mustang purchase plan hits a snag.

My wife has been bring up the topic of me buying one more frequently lately which I took as a green light. Today she asked how much I thought it would cost.

When I told her about $38k including tax she was shocked. Later, she came to me and said "if you get to spend that much for yourself you can never say no to anything I want EVER again...and that includes getting a boyfriend on the side".

I hope he doesn't want to drive my Stang.

You should have talked monthly payments not total price. That always works. As far as her demands if you buy the Mustang, they sound pretty reasonable to me.

graphicguy

I know some curbstoners. The cars they turn> @oldfarmer50 said:

Mustang purchase plan hits a snag.

My wife has been bring up the topic of me buying one more frequently lately which I took as a green light. Today she asked how much I thought it would cost.

When I told her about $38k including tax she was shocked. Later, she came to me and said "if you get to spend that much for yourself you can never say no to anything I want EVER again...and that includes getting a boyfriend on the side".

I hope he doesn't want to drive my Stang.

Would he share the rent, utilities and food cost? This might be a "win-win" for everybody.......

Mr_Shiftright

We aren't monogamous in our car ownership, so there is a precedent here.

oldfarmer50

@qbrozen said:
$38k??! That's 50% more than I paid for my 2013. I guess you are looking at a Premium with some add-ons. Too rich for me.

No, that's for the base GT without much more than auto and premium paint. Both Ford and Edmunds price it out at $35,515 IIRC. Add 8% tax (thanks NY) and it comes out to $38k+. I figure I'll have to pay close to sticker because it's new and demand will be high for awhile.

If I can trade the Eclipse for $10k that will save me $800 in tax.

When I actually get close to pulling the trigger I'll have to pick the expert's brains here to see what the going prices are.

Edmunds TMV on a new 2013 GT base with auto is $27,000 with a MSRP of $32k and change. You must have gotten a pretty good deal on yours.

oldfarmer50

@jayrider said:
...you should talk monthly payments...

Nah, my wife is too smart for that. She hates making monthly payments. Actually told me to cash in our savings and buy it outright.

stickguy

Move to Florida first. Save on sales tax.

stickguy

Sandy, having driven both, IMO, the Mazda drives much better overall.

qbrozen

I think I paid $25,600, IIRC for a base GT manual with zero options. It was a heck of a deal.

henryn

@qbrozen said:

>

I think I paid $25,600, IIRC for a base GT manual with zero options. It was a heck of a deal.

You can do that right now for a 2014 model. If you can still find one.

oldfarmer50

@stickguy said:
Move to Florida first. Save on sales tax.

Don't think I haven't considered that.

oldfarmer50

@henryn said:
You can do that right now for a 2014 model. If you can still find one.

Most sites say $5k off of $32k sticker. I don't know how many are left.

Update: Edmunds lists 204 within 200 miles.

henryn

@oldfarmer50‌
>

Edmunds lists 204 within 200 miles.

Is that quantity 204 of 2014 Mustangs in general, or 2014 Mustang GT's that are equipped such that you might possibly be able to buy it for $25.6? That is, no automatic, no Premium, nothing but the base GT with the 6 speed standard.

qbrozen

Dealer had to bring mine in from another state when I got it last May.

I don't know about $25,600 at this moment, but can't hurt to try if you are really interested. I just asked them to match the truecar price when I went in, which was, I think, $25,800 or so. Knocked a couple hundred more off during negotiation regarding my trade-in.

Right now, truecar is showing $26,708 for a base GT manual. $27,799 with the automatic.

qbrozen

Several interesting things on ebay near me currently. I'm a little all over the place because I'm pretty flexible with what I get next. I think I'd like a WRX or S60R/V70R, but tough to find cheap enough that aren't miled up/beat to hell.

'04 Impreza Sport for $6400

'06 for $7800

'05 Outback for $7K

'03 Legacy wagon for ???

'07 SX4? What's with the Maryland disclaimer??

Rare Contour... I mean Jaguar

Huh. I wonder if this is really the 3.6.

Pricey Jeep, but looks to be done right.

They have had this thing for a long time



I'm not sure what I like best out of all those. They each interest me in different ways. That green/tan color combo on the one Impreza is sharp. CTS seems like a good bargain. Mazda5 would be useful and I could modify it with mazda3 aftermarket bits.

stever

@qbrozen said:
'07 SX4? What's with the Maryland disclaimer

Trying to avoid the safety inspection?

stickguy

Q, if you had the mothballed MB anyway, why the need to replace it? Just because you want something? Which is fine by me.

Oh if you want a 2000 TL or 2007 S40, just let me know. I game having a liter garage sale!

stickguy

Legacy gt looks nice. Lots of woke done. Price at $6300 still seems steep. Hope they did the head gaskets while it was 1/2 apart.

xwesx

@qbrozen said:
Mazda5 would be useful and I could modify it with mazda3 aftermarket bits.

Would be useful? You do have another minivan already, so I can't see this one sticking around very long. Granted, I have looked at the 5 before and it's a nice rig for its size (great use of space), plus this one is basically as optioned up as you can get it with the MT. I dunno, it looks like it has a lot of wear on the interior. Judging from that driver seat, those miles weren't added more than a few at a time, so probably a tough life so far.

Perhaps if the dealer actually cleaned the interior (namely, seats!), it would show a little better in the pics.

oldfarmer50

@henryn said:
oldfarmer50‌
Is that quantity 204 of 2014 Mustangs in general, or 2014 Mustang GT's that are equipped such that you might possibly be able to buy it for $25.6? That is, no automatic, no Premium, nothing but the base GT with the 6 speed standard.

That's total cars. I didn't go through them all but among the first 3 there was one GT base with manual.

oldfarmer50

The Subies all seem nice. I wouldn't pay that much for those miles but Subaru fans pay the world for them.

I like the Caddy. Why do you doubt that it's a 3.6? That engine was even in Pontiacs by 2008 so Caddy should have had them in 2006.

That Suzuki looks like trouble. Why isn't it for sale in MD by a MD dealer. Besides would you really want a car that was made fun of on Top Gear every week?

The Jeep, is it show quality or something collectible? Otherwise I don't get it.

qbrozen

Stick - the MB just isn't my thing. Its OK and I don't mind driving it, but it doesn't hit all the right points for me. It was for the wife and she abandoned it, so its time for it to go. I need something ... more lively?

xwesx - we had an automatic version of that car. Again, the wife's. I liked it quite a bit while she decided she wanted something bigger and more luxurious. To me, the T&C is TOO big. A mazda3 wagon is definitely on my list and just happened upon that.

farmer - well, they are saying its a "base" model, although I'm not sure why. A base model would have technically been the 2.8. Plus, the price is pretty low. The Jeep? CJ7s are desirable and a 350 swap is pretty common. I like what he's done to it. Seems understated compared to others I've seen. I have a softspot for Jeeps, and a '79 CJ7 was my first vehicle. I've always wanted another one. Thing is, I'm not sure how well it fits my current life situation. Not very, frankly, but doesn't stop me from wanting one.

qbrozen

Perusing Cars.com and came upon some more.

Here is an S60R that largely fits the bill

'03 Bugeye wagon seems a little pricey

2 years younger for essentially the same $$

newer, cheaper, slower, but no miles listed

oldfarmer50

newer, cheaper, slower, but no miles listed

I like that it has 0 miles. My kind of car.