I have not come across any details about the PD engine running on "greasel"...but keep in mind that most of my research pertians to the TDI engine I have. (Not PD engine) so I have not specificly looked for that information.
On a related subject about PD engine - It is interesting to note that reciently, there have been some reports about the PD engine in respect to the use of incorrect oil.... SEVERE CAMSHAFT DAMAGE was the result. Specificly, somone had taken their PD-equiped TDI to a quickie-oil-change joint that had no clue that VW 505.01 oil is MANDITORY for that engine. Apparently the camshaft-driven fuel pumps put a lot of stress on the lobes.
Want to buy a TDI, but it seems that maintenance will be expensive. Can anyone the reliability of TDI. if Jetta GLI is better choice? Thanks in advance.
Will the Power Service, will also work in the 06 TDI Jetta, I have had 7 TDI's but not one since 02,and I did use it then,and worked great I am waiting to get my new JettaTDI in 2 weeks,I can't wait!
Since the "new" TDI with the Pumpe Duse (PD) engine was released in USA expecting the new laws to kick in mandating ELSD (Extremely Low Sulfer Diesel), I would expect that the PD engine would benifet from Cetane improve even more than previous TDI engines.
The first TDI was1998 Jetta I put 20,000 miles on it before I bought my 1999 Jetta ,and I drove that 85,000 miles, then I got my 2002 Jetta Wagon,and I put 20,000 on that one , now I am waiting to get my 06 TDI Jetta 5 sp with Pack 1 with XM Silver, with gray int
I recently purchased an '06 Jetta TDI with the DSG.
After driving it for several weeks, I don't understand why people continue to insist a manual will always do better? I have only gone about one tank so far in mostly mixed city driving here in San Antonio, i.e. > 50% highway + stop and go jams + local stop lights, parking lots, grocery store runs, etc. With A/C and radio running at least 85% of the time, got 40 mpg! The DSG shifts the car into 6th gear so fast, it makes my head spin! Far faster than I would ever shift it into sixth with a manual transmission. In fact, in manual shift mode, I've given up on trying to get it up to 6th that fast. I can't do it nearly as quickly or efficiently from a stop sign without sacrificing acceleration or torque.
Does anyone agree or disagree? I can see a manual perhaps adding 1 mpg, but not much more than that. For the added headache everytime someone ties up the highway with bumper to bumper traffic due to an accident, it's not worth it. It definitely feels "different", like a computer is manually shifting the car for you; not at all like an automatic. I personally prefer driving a manual, but between the invention of the cell phone and the maddening stop and go traffic that plagues San Antonio without warning, it doesn't seem worth it.
I just bought a 06 Jetta TDI Auto w/pkg 1 from Park Cities Volkswagen in Dallas 214-561-8107 ask for Johnathan, tell him Deryll from St. Louis sent ya. I paid MSRP and no more. In St. Louis the dealers are all sticking to $2000 above sticker price.
AGREE! The DSG xmission is a brand-new technology for the common-folks like us. Only VW/Audi has offerend DSG to the public. It has been reported that DSG can surpass most manual-xmission MPG. Previously, DSG technology has been used on F1 racecars with "paddle shifters" near the steering wheel to change the gears.
The DSG xmission is really a manual xmission with 2 seperate clutches that "swap" back and forth.... each clutch is pre-enguaged to the proper gear before swapping takes place. This makes it a VERY efficent (compared to humans) way of shifting a manual xmission.
Word on the street is that most vehicle manufacturers will have some sort of DSG xmission offering within the next 2 years. It is SOOOO much better than the old-technology automatic xmissions that use pressurized liquid to transfer torque to the wheels.
Once again, German engineerig brings us a new vehicle technology!!! Lets not forget that it was German engineering that brought us; The first automobile !! Invented the Sparkplug (Bosh) Diesel engine (Roudolph Diesel) Fuel injection (Bosch) AntiSkid technology (Bosch) ...etc
I have heard some folks complain about the "reliability" of VW.... but when you are on the "bleeding edge" of technology, some teething-pains are to be expected. Some car-companies work on perfecting old technology...while others choose another route.
My 1979 Volkswagen Scirocco had MECHANICAL fuel injection to each cylinder.(no electronics!) This was at least 5 years before fuel injection was available in some other cars. And even then, the other guys just stuck an injector in a carberator and CALLED it throttlebody fuel-injection.
Mid 60's top of the line corvettes also had mechanical fuel injection as well and it was used on race cars even earlier then that so that is not a new idea on the Scirocco.
back on topic --- I realize that, but the Scirocco, Rabbit, and Qantum all had mechanical multi-port fuel-injection across the entire product line. A technology on "top of the line" Corvettes and race cars can not be considerd bringing a new technology to the masses.
You have only strengthend my argument by pointing this out.... VW has introduced a technology across its product line (DSG xmission) that was previousy only seen in F1 race cars.
Some companies take risks and lead the pack...while the others dont.
My brother put down money on a new Jetta TDI when the price of diesel was about the price of gasoline. His original delivery date was the middle of September. As time went by that date was moved to the middle of October then November then December - maybe even January. Then came the big run up in the price of diesel and the drop in the price of gasoline. Now the delivery date is moved up to early in November.
Has anyone heard of people walking away from their deals because of the high price of diesel or is this par for the course on delivery dates?
I'm sure everyone here who drives a TDI had noticed that diesel prices have skyocketed. The station that I go to charges $0.60 more per gallon for diesel than for reg gas ($3.30 vs 2.70).
Does this have anything to do with seasonal additives, or higher cetane fuel being sold this time of year? What about low sulfur fuel? I haven't noticed much of a difference in performance on the higher priced fuel. Is this simply a matter of supply and demand?
I am thinking about moving to Maine, but I know that they are one of 5 states which ban the sale of (new) diesel automobiles. If I have a 2005 Jetta TDI with approximately 13K on it, would I be able to register this vehicle in Maine?
Since TDI engine is about 30% more efficnet than gasoline.... that would mean the Diesel fuel prices would have to be 30% higher than gasoline JUST TO BREAK EVEN (fuel-cost wise)... all the other benifets of a TDI engine would still exist over gasoline engines.
For those of you who are relatively new to the world of TDI engines, it is totally normal for diesel prices to go up in the wintertime. Dont forget that a lot of the fuel must now be re-routed to being burned for heat. Since the DEMAND for the fuel increases in the winter... so does the cost.
Also, the diesel at the pumps now has more expensive kerosene added to it to lower the gell-point.
Besides, if the cost of diesel goes up as you are suggesting...we will ALL have a lot worse things to worry about. The very economy runs on Diesel fuel... all trucks, trains, and ships use Diesel to move. Beleive me, the cost of the fuel is ALWAYS reflected in all the products you purchase.
Local BP's around Pittsburgh down to $2.39 a gallon for diesel
According to the BP website all BP diesel is low sulfur or ultra low sulfur diesel. No more than 30 PPM. They are leading the way to better diesel in the US. Hopefully all refineries will get in gear and clean up their diesel. Then we can get a variety of diesel vehicles to choose from.
Ummm .... BP is not doing anything special. LSD (Low Sulfer Diesel= 30PPM) has been around for many years.
The ULSD (Ultra Low Sulfer Diesel) is the new-upcoming standard for 2005.... HOWEVER: reicent events in the deep south prompted the president of the free world to "waver" the 2005 deadline for ULSD. I have not heard if any new deadline for ULSD has been set.
I think in CA the mandate is currently at 140 PPM. I believe the mandate for the rest of the US is September of 2006. When all highway diesel has to be 15 PPM or less.
Up here in Canada...at least Edmonton anyways TDI Jettas are nowhere to be found. They are sold so fast people are waiting 3-4 months to get one. It took me 2 months for mine, just got it this past weekend. I love it. Even though the price of diesel here is basically the same a gasoline now the TDI is so much more fuel efficient that nobody seems to care. :P "> I can not wait to see how my new car deals with freezing weather and loads of snow that is in the near forecast. Canadian winter here we come.................. :shades:
In general, a TDI does NOT have "added maintenance".,, It is too bad that you were misled into thinking that. In reality, TDI may have less maintenance than a gasser. (No ignition system to maintain, longer OilChangeIntervals, and in general--- less need for attention)
Why do you think that long-haul truckers use diesel engines? One reason is that they can get 800,000 miles out of an engine with very little maintenance.
If you were meaning to say "added maintenance costs", then you may be mistaken on that point too. In reality (based on real facts from TDI owners) the cost of keeping a TDI going is about the same as gassers. (what costs more for some items is saved in other areas)
I have no question in my mind that your old TDI will sell at a premium price. Most educated folks looking for a long-term savings will be able to overlook the perceived short-term expense.
Most short-sighted people will just look at the price of diesel in the winter and think it is "too expensive" without understanding the long-term benifets.
Total Miles: 1300 First tank 50/50 (city/hwy): 39.0 mpg Second tank 70/30: 42.6 mpg
I'm a lead foot, run the AC, manually down shift for corners, etc
If you're thinking of a Pkg 1 skip it and go to a Pkg 2. Things on the Pkg 2 I wish I had: audio controls on the wheel, the ability to change how the key fob, locks, etc work, dual zone climate control.
TDI is not for everyone. Best of luck with your replacement vehicle.
Regarding TDI maintenance - There is less maintenance on TDI compared to VW gas model. Parts are available online if you wish to save money compared to the dealer. For example, oil change kit with filter, oil, and oil drain plug is $37 at IMPEX. You do not have to use the dealer for maintenance. If you do not have a dealer you trust or an independent mechanic/shop that is competent and trustworthy in your area, then I advise not buying a TDI or other VW model.
Regarding diesel fuel- diesel fuel price is $0.10 more than regular now in my area. Spike in diesel prices was temporary.
VW models are for the most part marketed and priced as a premium vehicle compared to domestic and asian brand competitors. If you do not see value in the driving experience and interior quality of the VW, don't buy it.
If you are only buying a TDI for cost savings, check your math again and carefully evaluate what you expect of the TDI. TDI is competitive against hybrids due to the high hybrid cost, howeve, lower initial purchase price and high mpg of Civic and Corolla will have lower ownership cost unless you keep the TDI for 200,000 miles plus.
If you are not willing to or simply do not want to seek information above and beyond dealer and owners manual on maintenance, alternate parts sources, known problems, driving technique, sources of good fuel, and etc., then TDI may not be the best choice. The more knowledge you have, the better your ownership experience.
I got a new 2006 Jetta TDI about 10 days ago. It's package 0 with no options and manual transmission. It's my first VW - though I learned to drive in my dad's Thing and I had a sporty Audi when I lived in Germany. FYI - I had to pay MSRP as listed on VW website but I got exactly the colors, trim, options, etc. that I wanted. I love the car, but I have two problems.
First, I got only a valet key. The car came straight from Mexico to my dealership. It had just 9 miles on it. But the keys did not fit the car. The dealer ordered new keys, and I returned the car two days ago for the keys to be programmed. But the car has been with the dealer for almost three days now. I don't care too much because I have nice loaner. But the dealer says that the VW intranet is not working and the keys cannot be programmed until it is. Is anyone has similar problems? I am a little worried that the dealer might not be telling me something.
Second, on my first tank of diesel, I got just 25.8 mpg - really low. That's a rough number because the dealer may not have filled the tank completely (though the gauge read full) and I spilled a bit when refilling. But even if I deducted 3.3 gallons, I would not have hit the 35 mpg mark for driving that was about 50/50 city/highway. That's disappointing.
If you are not willing to or simply do not want to seek information above and beyond dealer and owners manual on maintenance, alternate parts sources, known problems, driving technique, sources of good fuel, and etc., then TDI may not be the best choice
I agree with you that if you're just trying to save money and get the most reliable car, you should get a honda or toyoya. The new civic gets 30/38 which probably puts it darn close to a Jetta TDI in mixed suburban driving. You have to want the extra performance/handling and fit and finish of a near luxury German "sports" car to spring for the Jetta as I have. It is a premium in price - however - if, like many Americans, that Jetta is replacing an SUV that got 17 mpg, it will save you >$1,000 a year in gas costs. Let's also remember we Americans LOVE cars - it's never simply about cheap, efficient transportation - otherwise we might all be in Kia Rio's.
I disagree that you have to become some kind of TDI expert and go into great detail on the maintenance and fuel as described above. Millions of europeans drive TDI's without doing anything more than filling the tank at the nearest service station and dropping the car off at the dealer for oil changes. You are going to scare off thousands of customers with your unsubstantiated warnings and everyone will keep driving their suburbans instead of embracing the promise of diesel technology which is both very old and very proven.
Potential buyers do need to know that the PD engine requires a special oil and that you want to buy diesel that is relatively "fresh", i.e. from a gas station with good turnover, but fresh diesel will quickly become common as Honda, BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Chrysler, GM and Ford are speaking in a deadly serious manner about bringing more diesels to market in the next 12 months. It's going to be an exciting time to be a TDI owner - let's not scare everyone off.
Millions of europeans drive TDI's without doing anything more than filling the tank at the nearest service station and dropping the car off at the dealer for oil changes. You are going to scare off thousands of customers with your unsubstantiated warnings
Exlain relay 109, symptoms of failed MAF, window regulator repair, clogged intakes, vent trick, timing belt replacement interval for A3-A4-B5-B4-and B5 TDI, which coolant, which brake fluid, which power steering fluid, shift interlock problem, VAG-COM, and changing of EGR setting.
I can substantiate all of the above which apply to TDI models selectively from 1996 to present.
There are not millions of TDI in North America. There is not yet widespread availability of low sulfur-high cetane diesel in North America. If this was Europe there would be no need to be well informed as the fuel is excellent and there are a multitude of dealerships and independent mechanics that understand VW's and diesels. VW sells fewer than 400,000 vehicles in US and less than 15% of the vehicles they sell are diesel. VW has been last or second to last in service satisfaction scores of ANY maker for the last few years. Some of the dealers are very good, many install the wrong oil at oil change, give the wrong timing belt change intervals, do not recognize a failed MAF, charge $80 to $100 for oil change, charge $1000 or more for timing belt change, and the list goes on and on.
Scare tactic? This is reality. Many, many of the owners of TDI that thouroughly understand the maintenance and operation of TDI will not even allow a dealership service department to work on their car due to the incompetence of some select dealers. (Disclaimer- Some of the dealers are excellent)
Understanding the requirements of TDI and of a VW, knowing the quality of local service department, taking the time to learn the quirks by spending time online among VW and TDI enthusiasts, knowing where to obtain parts other than the dealer either online or locally will make ownership of a VW TDI much more pleasant and more $ will stay in your pocket.
I'm not trying to scare anyone. I want to prevent unpleasant ownership experience of the uninformed who scream "VW Lemon".
The people who enjoy their TDI will be the best ambassadors of diesel.
You may not need to be an expert, you better at least take the time to be an apprentice.
I certainly appreciate yuor excellent counsel but I honestly believe that if you want to sell 100,000 cars in the U.S. in the yeat 2005, you can't make it as complicated as you describe and survive. If you're correct, and you may well be, VW will be out of business in the U.S. within the next 5 years.
In my limited experience, I know several owners of VW TDI's who have driven for years without the problems you describe.
You make a large number of general claims, which in the aggregate, are likely correct, but I think they're a little misleading.
1. Yes, many dealerships were not aware of the oil requirement and there have been some early fiascos, but my experience recently is that all the sales people in my town (San Antonio) are acutely aware of the oil requirements and actively educate their new buyers about it.
2. Having owned Honda, Toyota, Lexus, Acura, and BMW vehicles in the past ten years, at some time or another, all these dealers have given wrong advice about service intervals, failed to diagnose a problem, ripped me off, or overcharged for service. That is definitely not unique to VW!
3. I agree gas quality is lower compared to Europe and said so in my post. I never claimed there were millions of diesels in America - only millions in Europe. I plan on taking my TDI to my dealer for oil changes, filling it with fuel at a service station with fresh fuel - and if that's not enough to keep it going for the next 5 or more years, I won't be buying a VW again.
4. I refuse to perform all the ridiculous things you profess are absolutely necessary to get this vehicle to function on a regular basis. If I'm right, great - if you're right, and you may well be, we won't be discussing VW TDI's on this web site for many more years - especially if Honda brings their excellent, reliable 2.2 liter CDI to the U.S.
I refuse to perform all the ridiculous things you profess are absolutely necessary to get this vehicle to function on a regular basis.
Which things are ridiculous?
This is your 1st VW TDI, am I correct?
My prediction - You will either change your mind about what I've said in the next few years or be a former VW owner.
In the meantime, in the event you have a problem with your VW TDI, there are many people willing to help solve the problem if you are willing to accept assistance.
I have had my 06 jetta tdi for almost 2 months now with 2k miles on it. I absolutely love it. I have been getting 38/39 mpg. I drive about 50/50 highway to city.
What additive do I need to put in my diesel? The weather here can get cold in December- February. What temperature should I be concerned with?
Is there a special kind of diesel that maximizs performance for the car or will help in the long run? I have been using diesel #2 at chevron. Should I be using BP? What are their pros?
Any additive that "prevents gelling" would be worth considering. The ambient temp that gelling occours depends on how "winterized" your last tankfull of fuel is.
It is best to not take any chances and put the the additive in long before it may be needed. (Since I get at least 700 miles per tankful, I may go *weeks* between fillups....Here in Vermont, the weather may drop 40 degrees during that time ;-))
What is the name of the additives and when should I put it in? I usually fill up with 1/4 tank left. So could I put the additive in then or do I need to wait until it is empty?
Is there a winter and a summer additive?
Where can I buy the additive?
What is the temperature outside that "gelling" can occur?
Do the new TDIs have anything that can prevent gelling?
I use powerservice available from wallmart. White bottle for winter and grey bottle for summer.
You can put the additive in at any time. I like to put some in at each fillup. I measure out approx. 6 oz. in a 8oz. paper cup put into fueltank then toss the paper cup in the trash. You can use simple math to determine how much additive to use based on how much fuel you put into the tank. Using too much will not hurt. (besides use up your additive faster)
The ambient temp that gelling occours depends on how "winterized" your last tankfull of fuel is. Technically, it is called the CFPP (Cold-Filter Plugging Point)
It's easy to read and covered just about anything I could have ever imagined asking about - and more that now looks important even if I wasn't going to ask...
I see the TDI EPA mileage ratings are a little higher for the auto than the manual transmission. Is this for real? I wonder if the auto transmission would be as good in bad weather conditions as I know the manuals are. With that new type auto transmission maybe it‘s on par? Any knowledgeable real world input would be appreciated.
That is ONLY for the DSG automatic xmission. And yes--- it is for real.
Do some research on the DSG xmission. You will find that is more like an automatically-shifted-manual xmission. It actually has DUAL clutches which switch back-n-forth between them to shift gears.
The DSG xmission is more closely related to the xmissions used on F1 race cars with the "paddle shifters" behind the steering wheel.... instantanious shifts!!
As for bad weather, do not forget that VW has "traction control", "throttle management" and "ESP" all of which work together to virtually eliminate wheelslip and sliding sideways (skids).
I have a manuall-xmission on my VW and it is almost impossible to apply too much throttle in the snow.... the onboard computer takes over and cuts the throttle to reduce wheelspin...it also applies the brakes on the wheel with the least traction.... forcing the torque to the wheel with the most tracion. An indicator on the dashboard flashes while these systems are "doing their thing".
Thanks for input...It would seem buying a manual is really for the fun of it rather than practical matters with today’s advanced technology. I was concerned about manual versus auto in bad weather conditions. I am currently working with VW and "may" need to make these considerations.
My 2000 Jetta TDI drives great -- 112,000 --- BUT, last March I had to replace the diesel fuel injection pump at $1800. Now the check engine light is on, and a local mechanic says the code indicates torque converter failure. Anyone have experience with this? Can the the converter be replaced/rebuilt? Or will a new auto transmission be required? $3-4,000!!! Not really happy. Symptoms are fluctuating rpms. Too bad it drives so great, because everything else is breaking: glove compartment door, cup holder, mirror adjustment switch. :sick:
A good (not AAMCO) transmission shop should be able to rebuild/replace whatever is bad on the transmission. Ask around, and see who is recommended locally. A VW dealer will simply swap in a factory reman tranny for $3,000-$4,000 as you mentioned. A good rebuild should be less than $2,000. Auto trannys don't last much over 120,000-140,000 on average. I was talking to a tranny guy awhile back and he said these VW automatics are generally quite good and can last 200k miles ore more easily. The ones he's rebuilt have some sort of pump problem that will degrade the torque converters life. He said it was probably bad from day one but some lasted a long time anyway.
Does anyone know if they VW-Audi is thinking of bringing their Euro Diesel over? in Europe they have 3 Liter V6 that has an output of 204Cv and a ton of torque. Will it ever make it on the Audi A4? I'd like to get an A4 Avant, but i wil gladly wait if the diesel is coming anytime soon, Thanks
THe 3 most popular choices for anti gel additives that people use in the winter are: 1) Standyne performance formula 2) Power Services (white bottle) available at Walmart or Auto zone 3) Howe's Diesel treat with anti-jell. I just bought a 5 gallon container of the Stanadyne performance formula from www.blueridgediesel.com. It was $129, but it will last a very long time. Stanadyne performance will drop the Gel point to -66 degF. It will also boost your cetane and has a lubricity improver. Pilot gas stations are selling the Howe's diesel treat with anti-gel for $54 for a case of 6each 1/2 gallons (most truck stops sell the Howe's also). If you get the case, there is a card inside of it where you can register as a Howe's user and if your fuel gels in the winter they will pay for your tow. The Howe's will prevent gelling down to -33 degF. The Power Services white can be purchased at Walmart, Auto Zone or most other chain automotive stores. Usually it sells for about $13 per 1/2 gallon. The power services also has a cetane booster and a lubricity improver. I think they say it will drop the gel point 40 degF in your fuel. There are some lengthy discussions at tdiclub.com on these additives (there are others also) if you want to read more on them.
HI I JUST BOUGHT A NEW JETTA 2006 TDI TRIPTRONIC AND IT TOO HAS A RATTLING SOUND WHEN YOU ARE IN PARK OR SWITCH BETWEEN GEARS . EVEN IN PARK. SO I ASKED THE DEALER AND HE REPLIED THAT IT WAS A CHARACTERSTIC OF THIS MODEL. I AM STILL WORKING ON IT.
HI I JUST BOUGHT A NEW JETTA 2006 TDI TRIPTRONIC AND IT HAS A RATTLING SOUND WHEN YOU ARE IN PARK OR SWITCH BETWEEN GEARS . EVEN IN PARK. SO I ASKED THE DEALER AND HE REPLIED THAT IT WAS A CHARACTERISTIC OF THIS MODEL. I AM STILL WORKING WITH THE DEALER TO GET IT FIXED. ANY ONE ELSE HAS THE SAME PROBLEM. I HAVE 1000 KM ON IT.
Your dealer is obviously wrong telling you that it is a "Characteristic of this model." As a proud owner of the new 2006 TDI Jetta, mine sounds and runs perfectly. I would not let a problem like this be ignored, talk to your sales & service manager together, if no solution is reached talk to VW directly.
Comments
On a related subject about PD engine - It is interesting to note that reciently, there have been some reports about the PD engine in respect to the use of incorrect oil.... SEVERE CAMSHAFT DAMAGE was the result. Specificly, somone had taken their PD-equiped TDI to a quickie-oil-change joint that had no clue that VW 505.01 oil is MANDITORY for that engine. Apparently the camshaft-driven fuel pumps put a lot of stress on the lobes.
Thanks in advance.
http://ecdiesel.com/faq/index.asp
After driving it for several weeks, I don't understand why people continue to insist a manual will always do better? I have only gone about one tank so far in mostly mixed city driving here in San Antonio, i.e. > 50% highway + stop and go jams + local stop lights, parking lots, grocery store runs, etc. With A/C and radio running at least 85% of the time, got 40 mpg! The DSG shifts the car into 6th gear so fast, it makes my head spin! Far faster than I would ever shift it into sixth with a manual transmission. In fact, in manual shift mode, I've given up on trying to get it up to 6th that fast. I can't do it nearly as quickly or efficiently from a stop sign without sacrificing acceleration or torque.
Does anyone agree or disagree? I can see a manual perhaps adding 1 mpg, but not much more than that. For the added headache everytime someone ties up the highway with bumper to bumper traffic due to an accident, it's not worth it. It definitely feels "different", like a computer is manually shifting the car for you; not at all like an automatic. I personally prefer driving a manual, but between the invention of the cell phone and the maddening stop and go traffic that plagues San Antonio without warning, it doesn't seem worth it.
Hope that helps.
We sold off the Ford F-150 truck my wife drove for this new Jetta. 16 -17 mpg in the Ford to 40mpg is fine with us.
The DSG xmission is really a manual xmission with 2 seperate clutches that "swap" back and forth.... each clutch is pre-enguaged to the proper gear before swapping takes place. This makes it a VERY efficent (compared to humans) way of shifting a manual xmission.
Word on the street is that most vehicle manufacturers will have some sort of DSG xmission offering within the next 2 years. It is SOOOO much better than the old-technology automatic xmissions that use pressurized liquid to transfer torque to the wheels.
Once again, German engineerig brings us a new vehicle technology!!! Lets not forget that it was German engineering that brought us;
The first automobile !!
Invented the Sparkplug (Bosh)
Diesel engine (Roudolph Diesel)
Fuel injection (Bosch)
AntiSkid technology (Bosch)
...etc
I have heard some folks complain about the "reliability" of VW.... but when you are on the "bleeding edge" of technology, some teething-pains are to be expected. Some car-companies work on perfecting old technology...while others choose another route.
My 1979 Volkswagen Scirocco had MECHANICAL fuel injection to each cylinder.(no electronics!) This was at least 5 years before fuel injection was available in some other cars. And even then, the other guys just stuck an injector in a carberator and CALLED it throttlebody fuel-injection.
Mid 60's top of the line corvettes also had mechanical fuel injection as well and it was used on race cars even earlier then that so that is not a new idea on the Scirocco.
You have only strengthend my argument by pointing this out.... VW has introduced a technology across its product line (DSG xmission) that was previousy only seen in F1 race cars.
Some companies take risks and lead the pack...while the others dont.
Has anyone heard of people walking away from their deals because of the high price of diesel or is this par for the course on delivery dates?
Does this have anything to do with seasonal additives, or higher cetane fuel being sold this time of year? What about low sulfur fuel? I haven't noticed much of a difference in performance on the higher priced fuel. Is this simply a matter of supply and demand?
For those of you who are relatively new to the world of TDI engines, it is totally normal for diesel prices to go up in the wintertime. Dont forget that a lot of the fuel must now be re-routed to being burned for heat. Since the DEMAND for the fuel increases in the winter... so does the cost.
Also, the diesel at the pumps now has more expensive kerosene added to it to lower the gell-point.
Besides, if the cost of diesel goes up as you are suggesting...we will ALL have a lot worse things to worry about. The very economy runs on Diesel fuel... all trucks, trains, and ships use Diesel to move. Beleive me, the cost of the fuel is ALWAYS reflected in all the products you purchase.
According to the BP website all BP diesel is low sulfur or ultra low sulfur diesel. No more than 30 PPM. They are leading the way to better diesel in the US. Hopefully all refineries will get in gear and clean up their diesel. Then we can get a variety of diesel vehicles to choose from.
The ULSD (Ultra Low Sulfer Diesel) is the new-upcoming standard for 2005.... HOWEVER: reicent events in the deep south prompted the president of the free world to "waver" the 2005 deadline for ULSD. I have not heard if any new deadline for ULSD has been set.
Please review these 2 websites for diesel fuel pricing across the USA.
http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/oog/info/gdu/gasdiesel.asp
http://www.flyingj.com/fuel/diesel_CF.cfm
Why do you think that long-haul truckers use diesel engines? One reason is that they can get 800,000 miles out of an engine with very little maintenance.
If you were meaning to say "added maintenance costs", then you may be mistaken on that point too. In reality (based on real facts from TDI owners) the cost of keeping a TDI going is about the same as gassers. (what costs more for some items is saved in other areas)
I have no question in my mind that your old TDI will sell at a premium price. Most educated folks looking for a long-term savings will be able to overlook the perceived short-term expense.
Most short-sighted people will just look at the price of diesel in the winter and think it is "too expensive" without understanding the long-term benifets.
Total Miles: 1300
First tank 50/50 (city/hwy): 39.0 mpg
Second tank 70/30: 42.6 mpg
I'm a lead foot, run the AC, manually down shift for corners, etc
If you're thinking of a Pkg 1 skip it and go to a Pkg 2. Things on the Pkg 2 I wish I had: audio controls on the wheel, the ability to change how the key fob, locks, etc work, dual zone climate control.
Regarding TDI maintenance -
There is less maintenance on TDI compared to VW gas model.
Parts are available online if you wish to save money compared to the dealer. For example, oil change kit with filter, oil, and oil drain plug is $37 at IMPEX.
You do not have to use the dealer for maintenance. If you do not have a dealer you trust or an independent mechanic/shop that is competent and trustworthy in your area, then I advise not buying a TDI or other VW model.
Regarding diesel fuel- diesel fuel price is $0.10 more than regular now in my area. Spike in diesel prices was temporary.
VW models are for the most part marketed and priced as a premium vehicle compared to domestic and asian brand competitors. If you do not see value in the driving experience and interior quality of the VW, don't buy it.
If you are only buying a TDI for cost savings, check your math again and carefully evaluate what you expect of the TDI. TDI is competitive against hybrids due to the high hybrid cost, howeve, lower initial purchase price and high mpg of Civic and Corolla will have lower ownership cost unless you keep the TDI for 200,000 miles plus.
If you are not willing to or simply do not want to seek information above and beyond dealer and owners manual on maintenance, alternate parts sources, known problems, driving technique, sources of good fuel, and etc., then TDI may not be the best choice. The more knowledge you have, the better your ownership experience.
I got a new 2006 Jetta TDI about 10 days ago. It's package 0 with no options and manual transmission. It's my first VW - though I learned to drive in my dad's Thing and I had a sporty Audi when I lived in Germany. FYI - I had to pay MSRP as listed on VW website but I got exactly the colors, trim, options, etc. that I wanted. I love the car, but I have two problems.
First, I got only a valet key. The car came straight from Mexico to my dealership. It had just 9 miles on it. But the keys did not fit the car. The dealer ordered new keys, and I returned the car two days ago for the keys to be programmed. But the car has been with the dealer for almost three days now. I don't care too much because I have nice loaner. But the dealer says that the VW intranet is not working and the keys cannot be programmed until it is. Is anyone has similar problems? I am a little worried that the dealer might not be telling me something.
Second, on my first tank of diesel, I got just 25.8 mpg - really low. That's a rough number because the dealer may not have filled the tank completely (though the gauge read full) and I spilled a bit when refilling. But even if I deducted 3.3 gallons, I would not have hit the 35 mpg mark for driving that was about 50/50 city/highway. That's disappointing.
Any insight? I really love the car otherwise.
I agree with you that if you're just trying to save money and get the most reliable car, you should get a honda or toyoya. The new civic gets 30/38 which probably puts it darn close to a Jetta TDI in mixed suburban driving. You have to want the extra performance/handling and fit and finish of a near luxury German "sports" car to spring for the Jetta as I have. It is a premium in price - however - if, like many Americans, that Jetta is replacing an SUV that got 17 mpg, it will save you >$1,000 a year in gas costs. Let's also remember we Americans LOVE cars - it's never simply about cheap, efficient transportation - otherwise we might all be in Kia Rio's.
I disagree that you have to become some kind of TDI expert and go into great detail on the maintenance and fuel as described above. Millions of europeans drive TDI's without doing anything more than filling the tank at the nearest service station and dropping the car off at the dealer for oil changes. You are going to scare off thousands of customers with your unsubstantiated warnings and everyone will keep driving their suburbans instead of embracing the promise of diesel technology which is both very old and very proven.
Potential buyers do need to know that the PD engine requires a special oil and that you want to buy diesel that is relatively "fresh", i.e. from a gas station with good turnover, but fresh diesel will quickly become common as Honda, BMW, Mercedes, Audi, Chrysler, GM and Ford are speaking in a deadly serious manner about bringing more diesels to market in the next 12 months. It's going to be an exciting time to be a TDI owner - let's not scare everyone off.
Exlain relay 109, symptoms of failed MAF, window regulator repair, clogged intakes, vent trick, timing belt replacement interval for A3-A4-B5-B4-and B5 TDI, which coolant, which brake fluid, which power steering fluid, shift interlock problem, VAG-COM, and changing of EGR setting.
I can substantiate all of the above which apply to TDI models selectively from 1996 to present.
There are not millions of TDI in North America. There is not yet widespread availability of low sulfur-high cetane diesel in North America. If this was Europe there would be no need to be well informed as the fuel is excellent and there are a multitude of dealerships and independent mechanics that understand VW's and diesels.
VW sells fewer than 400,000 vehicles in US and less than 15% of the vehicles they sell are diesel. VW has been last or second to last in service satisfaction scores of ANY maker for the last few years. Some of the dealers are very good, many install the wrong oil at oil change, give the wrong timing belt change intervals, do not recognize a failed MAF, charge $80 to $100 for oil change, charge $1000 or more for timing belt change, and the list goes on and on.
Scare tactic? This is reality. Many, many of the owners of TDI that thouroughly understand the maintenance and operation of TDI will not even allow a dealership service department to work on their car due to the incompetence of some select dealers. (Disclaimer- Some of the dealers are excellent)
Understanding the requirements of TDI and of a VW, knowing the quality of local service department, taking the time to learn the quirks by spending time online among VW and TDI enthusiasts, knowing where to obtain parts other than the dealer either online or locally will make ownership of a VW TDI much more pleasant and more $ will stay in your pocket.
I'm not trying to scare anyone. I want to prevent unpleasant ownership experience of the uninformed who scream "VW Lemon".
The people who enjoy their TDI will be the best ambassadors of diesel.
You may not need to be an expert, you better at least take the time to be an apprentice.
In my limited experience, I know several owners of VW TDI's who have driven for years without the problems you describe.
You make a large number of general claims, which in the aggregate, are likely correct, but I think they're a little misleading.
1. Yes, many dealerships were not aware of the oil requirement and there have been some early fiascos, but my experience recently is that all the sales people in my town (San Antonio) are acutely aware of the oil requirements and actively educate their new buyers about it.
2. Having owned Honda, Toyota, Lexus, Acura, and BMW vehicles in the past ten years, at some time or another, all these dealers have given wrong advice about service intervals, failed to diagnose a problem, ripped me off, or overcharged for service. That is definitely not unique to VW!
3. I agree gas quality is lower compared to Europe and said so in my post. I never claimed there were millions of diesels in America - only millions in Europe. I plan on taking my TDI to my dealer for oil changes, filling it with fuel at a service station with fresh fuel - and if that's not enough to keep it going for the next 5 or more years, I won't be buying a VW again.
4. I refuse to perform all the ridiculous things you profess are absolutely necessary to get this vehicle to function on a regular basis. If I'm right, great - if you're right, and you may well be, we won't be discussing VW TDI's on this web site for many more years - especially if Honda brings their excellent, reliable 2.2 liter CDI to the U.S.
Which things are ridiculous?
This is your 1st VW TDI, am I correct?
My prediction - You will either change your mind about what I've said in the next few years or be a former VW owner.
In the meantime, in the event you have a problem with your VW TDI, there are many people willing to help solve the problem if you are willing to accept assistance.
May your ownership experience be problem free.
What additive do I need to put in my diesel? The weather here can get cold in December- February. What temperature should I be concerned with?
Is there a special kind of diesel that maximizs performance for the car or will help in the long run? I have been using diesel #2 at chevron. Should I be using BP? What are their pros?
It is best to not take any chances and put the the additive in long before it may be needed. (Since I get at least 700 miles per tankful, I may go *weeks* between fillups....Here in Vermont, the weather may drop 40 degrees during that time ;-))
Is there a winter and a summer additive?
Where can I buy the additive?
What is the temperature outside that "gelling" can occur?
Do the new TDIs have anything that can prevent gelling?
Where is the best place to buy Diesel?
I use powerservice available from wallmart. White bottle for winter and grey bottle for summer.
You can put the additive in at any time. I like to put some in at each fillup. I measure out approx. 6 oz. in a 8oz. paper cup put into fueltank then toss the paper cup in the trash. You can use simple math to determine how much additive to use based on how much fuel you put into the tank. Using too much will not hurt. (besides use up your additive faster)
The ambient temp that gelling occours depends on how "winterized" your last tankfull of fuel is. Technically, it is called the CFPP (Cold-Filter Plugging Point)
You can research CFPP by searching the internet.
I am not aware of any TDIs that have heaters in the fuel tank... thus gelling can ocour no matter how "modern" your automobile is.
Purchase diesel "where it flows like wine". A high-volume seller will have the freshest fuel. (Diesel fuel actually grows mold as it ages.)
It's easy to read and covered just about anything I could have ever imagined asking about - and more that now looks important even if I wasn't going to ask...
Do some research on the DSG xmission. You will find that is more like an automatically-shifted-manual xmission. It actually has DUAL clutches which switch back-n-forth between them to shift gears.
The DSG xmission is more closely related to the xmissions used on F1 race cars with the "paddle shifters" behind the steering wheel.... instantanious shifts!!
As for bad weather, do not forget that VW has "traction control", "throttle management" and "ESP" all of which work together to virtually eliminate wheelslip and sliding sideways (skids).
I have a manuall-xmission on my VW and it is almost impossible to apply too much throttle in the snow.... the onboard computer takes over and cuts the throttle to reduce wheelspin...it also applies the brakes on the wheel with the least traction.... forcing the torque to the wheel with the most tracion. An indicator on the dashboard flashes while these systems are "doing their thing".
Thanks
Anybody seeing dealers starting to budge off sticker yet on TDIs?