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VW Jetta TDI



  • sebring95sebring95 Posts: 3,238
    Reduce? Yes. Eliminate? No. Plus, driving hard is fun!
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 18,333
    I think the case/s truly has/have been laid out. As they are your dollars, it is truly your choice to pick your driving styles or even mix them up, etc.

    All we are really trying to do is to point out the various factors and knowing them, (and how/why they work) put as many of the factors (as one wishes) in your favor or...NOT. NONE by itself is a "magic bullet. " or... "bullet to the head" for that matter.

    So for example, do you think I got 112,300 miles on GY LS-H (aka CRAPPY) oem tires by "abusing" them?

    Since it can be dicey to fault isolate in print, let's take a stab @ tire edge wear. Edge wear can be due to a host of variables. So for example, in addition to your hypothesis, it can be alignment related, lack of /too much/incorrect rotation, too little/much tire pressure, or less likely, mechanic issues.

    As to your 1.5 mpg, again a host of reasons but for example, I have experienced that just switching from old to new tires, or even increase/decrease in tire pressure.

    All the best for trouble free operation.
  • shriftyshrifty Posts: 255
    Siberia, lately when I've been running the car a bit hard, it hasn't been for too long, maybe about 15 minutes every few days and then moderately the rest of the time. This seems to be a good mix for me. It seems that running the car hard all of the time wouldn't be too good over a period of time with respect to increased wear and tear, but running it easy all of the time would lead to a buildup of soot.

    I'm going to try a bit of mixed driving, hopefully that will keep the car running for as long as possible. We'll see in a few years.
  • morey000morey000 Posts: 384
    My wife, who's had her heart set on a Prius for the last year, just drove one and hated it. (yeah!) She's got a '01 BMW 330i right now and is a sporty driver. No surprise that the feel and handling of the Prius wasn't to her liking. I've been gently pushing her in the direction of the Jetta TDI. Hopefully a sportwagen.

    We're not ready to buy until the fall. Would actually love a Passat TDI or an A4 TDI, but not sure if we could wait THAT long.

    I've driven the Jetta TDI which I liked. How does the Sportwagen TDI feel and handle in comparison?
  • bpeeblesbpeebles Posts: 4,085
    My 2003 TDI would be in the top 10.

    I have a spreadsheet of every drop of fuel pumped into it for over 100K miles. I was just playin around learnin how to use Excell and kinda went overboard.

    My spreadsheet automatically calculates for each fillup;

    My spreadsheet also calculates overall statistics. Here are my hilights as of 100,925 miles;
    min MPG = 36
    average MPG = 50
    max MPG = 65

    min cost/mile = 0.03/mile
    overall cost/mile = 0.05/mile
    max cost/mile = 0.1/mile

    I even programmed excell to graph MPG and fuel-cost for every fillup.
  • jkinzeljkinzel Posts: 735
    You should market that program, that would be handy to have.

    I'm using a Auto Maint. software that kind of does the same thing but it is for a small fleet and is some what over kill.
  • siberiasiberia Posts: 520
    So for example, do you think I got 112,300 miles on GY LS-H (aka CRAPPY) oem tires by "abusing" them?

    No, Ruking1, I absolutely do not think you are abusing them. When I first read that I thought it was a stunning achievement. Also, this calls into question my definition of what hard driving really is. I may be driving harder than you and thinking that my driving is "easy" driving when it's not. So I'll drop that issue as somewhat undefinable.

    I am happy with the way this discussion is going but I am not happy with my ability to communicate.

    The 05 TDI that I purchased already had 79k miles on the clock. The Nokian WRs look like they were new maybe 10K miles before that. The rear tires (now front) showed almost no wear and the front tires (now back) showed what I would call severe bevel in the braking direction. This means hard stopping but not necessarily hard acceleration, but I think they go together. 10K miles later the fronts still look perfect and the rears look about the same – still beveled. I may have to go another 20k miles before the next rotation to get this straightened out. Nokian WRs are directional.

    Alignment is good based on no repeat of bevel on the front tires and pretty good fuel economy for an automatic 5 speed (45.7 mpg now overall and not quite 50 mpg when all highway at 65 mph). Tire pressure is 38 psi front and 40 psi rear. I check often. The only way that I am getting improved mileage due to wheel alignment is that it was a little out of alignment and it is wearing towards better alignment. Possible, I guess.

    After reading a ton of posts on where mileage is dropping it seems very odd to have mileage increasing after 80k miles - this isn't really my usual luck. ;)

    Thanks for the responses.
  • longo2longo2 Posts: 347
    This Jetta has everything I want except the Navi, (I can live without) need some input on the miles vrs' price if anyone has an opinion...let er rip...
    Thanks..need to know soon, I would have to buy it sight unseen. - dan-Deasil-Leather-Sunroof_W0QQitemZ220407978448QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUS_Cars_Truck- - s?hash=item335156d9d0&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=72%3A317%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A- - 1%7C240%3A1318
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 18,333
    Ok, if it is not mechanical as in worn/bad bearings, etc, one thing that is problematic is the right front passenger side (design issue-torque steer power issue) tends to wear front rotors, pads, bearings, and by "inference" front right tire faster. I saw this very early on (miles wise) in the Bentley's technical manual. The "inference"raised my curiosity, so I started to research/track it.

    Long story short, instead of doing the oem recommended tire rotation of front to back back to front, where in effect only two tires get onto the front right passenger side, I went to a 4/5 tire, cross the rears and fronts straight back rotation. The upshot was EVERY tire spend 10,000 miles on the right front passenger side. The corollary, each tire spend 10,000 miles in each position also, evening out the wear.

    So since you have or have chosen the directional tires, the best advice (swag) would be to have (a 5th tire or) 3rd right side tire. The upshot here is wear would now be spread over 3 tires (directional) instead of two. Or if you only go with 4 total directional tires, once the scalloping starts, it is hard to reverse. Sorry this is not better news.

    I do run 38-36 psi fronts and 38-34 rears.
  • siberiasiberia Posts: 520
    Thanks, you wrote some mechanical things that I did not know about the front wheel drive Jetta. I have a similar tire wear problem with my Liberty diesel. It goes after the rears, especially the right rear. I have to measure with a tire gauge every rotation and put the best tire on the right rear, the next best on the left rear, the 2 worst on the front and the last is the spare.

    So here's the short list of candidates so far:
    1. Fuel has been gradually improving. I use the same fuel in my Liberty with no improvement, but that could be the Jeep's fault and the fuel is really better.
    2. A mechanical wear - timing belt, front end alignment or other that is wearing in a direction that is temporarily improving mileage.
    3. Something different between the previous drivers driving style and mine (not a serious candidate in my mind).
    4. Improper maintenance by previous owner such as wrong oil or too extended oil changes. Some things in the engine were gummed up (rings? Lifters?) and now it's cleaning up with correct oil and change intervals (doing 7,500 right now will go to 10k after 3 changes).
    5. A ha! Just occurred to me thinking about no 1. Previous owner used bad fuel and good fuel is cleaning it up now.
    6. None of the above. "We can never KNOW anything". :)
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,080
    Have you had a chance to drive the Jetta on snow and ice? If so how would you rate the handling compared to your Liberty? I would assume the Liberty is better in deep snow.
  • sebring95sebring95 Posts: 3,238
    There is no way I would buy that vehicle.

    -Completely unknown maintenance history.
    -No-name used car lot lacking grasp of English language (Deasil ???)
    -Likely an auction car
    -No warranty
    -Buy-it-now price is likely close to reserve.

    I've seen a couple VERY nice private party cars with known maintenance history sell for similar coin. A couple had lower mileage than this one. These '06 models are starting to come around to reasonable cost on the resale market. Considering you can pickup a brand new '09 for around $20,000....I'd have a very hard time buying a used one, particularly with an unknown past.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,080
    Buying any used vehicle in this day and age without a complete title & maintenance history with factory warranty left is scary. Any vehicle like that would have to be dirt cheap. A friend just went to trade in his Altima that he bought used with a clean title here in CA. Only to find out it was totalled before he bought it. Extensive repairs that diminish the resale or trade value. Buyer beware!
  • longo2longo2 Posts: 347
    Yes this deal would have to be a big leap of faith.

    From the CarFAx details, the only maintence record is the wash job at 88681 miles just before it was sold at a dealer auction.

    It is recorded as a one owner vehicle, but I guess he/she is long gone and any service records too.
  • siberiasiberia Posts: 520
    Yeah, I did Gagrice. Last winter I drove it in 4-5 inches of kinda wet fresh snow. The combination of front wheel drive diesel, ESP and Nokian WRs on the Jetta is impressive. I drove the Jeep on a couple of trips when I knew there was going to be snow only to find out later that the Jetta would have been fine with maybe a little better feel and control on the slick stuff. I could maybe relax more and rely on the Jetta electronics. The antilock brakes seem the same.

    In the Jeep, we got caught in a blizzard with bumper deep fresh powder that was drifted half way up the radiator at times - plugged the radiator with snow almost to the top on one side. I believe the diesel engine kept us going when a gasser might not have, because the power is so steady. All I had to do was hold the pedal and concentrate on steering.

    I have driven the Jeep in the Ozarks with 4-5 inches of snow on the road and had no trouble driving around front wheel drive cars that were stuck on hills. I may be delusional, but I think the Jetta TDI with good snow tires would go right up those hills. I think I would put money on it. Of course when there is an ice storm in the Ozarks nothing goes anywhere without chains or studs until the salt and gravel trucks get out.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 63,171
    The Nokian WRs are awesome tires... I had a set on my CR-V. It's the only all-season tire that is truly suitable for snow travel.


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  • mike91326mike91326 SoCalPosts: 251
    Does anyone know if you can get steering wheel mounted audio controls on the TDI SportWagen like that are on the TDI sedan? Can they be added after market? You would think that the radio and wiring are the same.
  • mikemartinmikemartin Posts: 205
    Nokian WRs are fantastic tires.
  • sebring95sebring95 Posts: 3,238
    yes, my '00 went like a tank with the WR's and I didn't have all the fancy traction control stuff either. Still handled pretty good in the dry too. Only problem with the Jetta was it sat pretty low to the ground, so deep stuff could get hairy. We ran Blizzaks on our Odyssey this winter and it wasn't anywhere near as good in the snow.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,080
    Only one little obscure tire store in San Diego sells Nokian tires. Then I think the last snow was about 30 years ago.
  • longo2longo2 Posts: 347
    mike, take a number, if you read the owner reviews on the new VW Sportwagons, no steering wheel controls is about all everyone is complaining about.

    Considering that the SW, costs a premium price over the Sedan, I think VW dropped the ball on this one.

    To retro a Jetta Steering Wheel with the audio controls onto a SW would probably involve a different wiring harness right to the computer as those buttons are also linked to the muti function trip display as well as the bluetooth conections.

    I know it sucks that VW didn't think SW owners would want those controls, but it might be easier to install a new radio that uses a hand held remote to tune and volume.

    When I changed the head unit in my Honda Odyssey I lost the steering wheel controls as well, but the little remote that sits in a cup holder runs all the functions just as well, including 'power off and on'.

    But still...... :mad:
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,080
    I thought that was standard on anything above a stripped Yaris. My 2005 Passat TDI had all the controls on the steering wheel. That and no leather would be hard for me to accept. Does it have XM or Sirius and a CD changer? Looking at the VW website it looks like they worried more about wheels and bling than the important stuff on the interior. I would rather have the Audi Allroad Quattro with the same engine that is being sold in 1st World countries. I got the local Audi dealer all fired up looking for them. Of course he tried selling me everything on his lot. I don't really like the looks of the Q5 or Q7. I may test drive the Q7 TDI that is in stock now. I like the Touareg TDI somewhat better. A little smaller which I can live with.
  • mortalmortal Posts: 1
    Howdy folks,

    I've recently become interested in the new tdi engines that vw is putting in some of it's new models.

    I was on car and driver earlier, and I noticed that the 'passing acceleration' for the tdi was astonishingly quick. Volkswagen+Jetta+TDI.pdf

    "50-70 6 seconds"

    Now, I understand diesels enjoy an advantage at highway speeds due to the amount of torque they produce at lower rpms. However, this number is faster than a honda fit, gti, a mini cooper s, miata, etc virtually every thing else on my shopping list (in terms of passing power).

    While I believe it would be reasonibly fast, certainly faster than the honda fit (which did the same test in ~12 seconds), I find it very hard to believe that it is faster than the others. I believe they must have gotten the math wrong. For example, if you look at the test sheet, and you compare the 50mph time with the 70mph time you get 5.1s, not the 6 seconds they claim.

    Does anyone have any other sources that provide a 40-70 ish number?
  • fho2008fho2008 Posts: 393
    I did drive a TDI and I know its slower in the 1/4 mile by 2 seconds I think, compared to the gas turbo 4, it did not feel slow at all. Love that torque!
  • ruking1ruking1 Posts: 18,333
    Even after 125,000 miles, it still amazes me to pass V8's (heading UP) @ altitudes of 3,000 to 7,000 ft. !!!
  • jim314jim314 Posts: 491
    Engine power (hp pr kw) to weight ratio is what determines max acceleration whether on level ground or up a hill. The transmission can change torque, but not power.

    A Jetta TDI can pass a naturally aspirated V8 if the Jetta driver puts the pedal to the floor and the V8 driver doesn't care to contest the matter. Or if the V8 is powered car is relatively heavy.
  • bpeeblesbpeebles Posts: 4,085
    Yes, passing-performance of the TDI is impressive. In-fact, you could race from stoplight-to-stoplight with a TDI and STILL burn less fuel than any other car beside you.

    Are you really basing your vehicle-choice on this type of stastistic?

    Example, I *really* like the fact that VW automaticlly locks all the doors once you are moving. But my Subaru Baja does not do this and I end up driving around with the doors unlocked. Do I like the Subaru less than the VW.... no!

    I like the 56MPG of my TDI and the accellaration of the turbocharged subaru engine.

    The VW handles FAR better than Subaru : VW rides better than VW.

    VW radio and power-windows work with key turned off : Subaru does not do this.

    VW can lower/raise all windows FROM OUTSIDE CAR : Subaru does not do this

    Subaru has AWD and excells in the snow : VW is adequate in the snow with ESP, ADR and EDL.

    VW is more refined with featuers not found in other vehicles. This is one reason we have 3 VWs in the family.

    If Subaru offered the Baja as a Diesel, I would own one in a hearbeat... but they dont.

    Every vehicle has its up/down side and it is often difficult to make a choice when they are all considerd. Test drive what you want and chose what you personally like. Good Luck.
  • siberiasiberia Posts: 520
    I believe they must have gotten the math wrong. For example, if you look at the test sheet, and you compare the 50mph time with the 70mph time you get 5.1s, not the 6 seconds they claim.

    The passing interval measure includes transition time between steady speed and acceleration.
  • fgbraultfgbrault Posts: 1
    I think the Car & Driver numbers for the TDI are what they got in their test and not a mistake.

    Two thoughts. The TDI was tested with the automatic DSG transmission. I think when passing tests are done they are in auto mode with the transmission downshifting. When testing a car with a manual transmission they use top gear with no downshifting and the time is much, much slower than if they had tested an automatic.

    Also, the time from from one MPH to another MPH in the acceleration tests from a stop will be less. For example the differential from 50 to 70 MPH from the 0-50 and 0-70 tests will be less than for the 50-70 MPH passing test, even for a automatic, as you start from a steady 50MPH, rather than being already accelerating.

    I think on the passing times you should compare the TDI only with other tested cars that had automatic.
  • siberiasiberia Posts: 520
    Passing time is measured in the same gears through the interval (50 – 70) as the vehicle would be in during an all out acceleration run. It doesn’t matter whether it is a stick or an auto the downshift is made to the optimal gear. The difference in time is simply the transition time between steady speed and all out acceleration.

    Passing times have always been a measure of the quickest pass possible, else it would make no sense to do the measurement. If it's a stick or tiptronic you would gear down in anticipation of passing and punch it. Without a shiftable auto you would just punch it.

    The clock is started when the engine is throttled up. It takes time for the turbo and fuel system to ramp up, even a gasser w/o turbo. Extreme engines are built to have very little transition time - TDIs not so much. ;)
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