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Comments
They aren't, at least not as fast as you'd claim they are. And those numbers aren't based on an isolated case of you getting someone to pay too much for used car. That happens every day, but that's why we have research... to eliminate the abberations/average them out...
Buying low and selling high huh? Kinda odd to hear from someone who pays cash for a depreciating asset (liability), but hey, at least we know you aren't an accountant :P
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-Cj
The only thing is, our Scion rep seems to think the Fuse won't be out for at least 2 years... So who knows.
Personally, the 5-door looks almost identical to the 3, just with two extra doors. If you glance quickly without noticing the doors, they're practically indistinguishable. It would still be nice to have though
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-Cj
A sedan tC wouldn't be as cool as a Diesel Yaris though
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several have swapped out for another hyundai, a better model then before. it's by word of mouth. it's mostly a group of women that have gotten promoted over time.
This model will also be available as a Scion, but the source could not say which (xA, xD?). For the Scion distribution, it will have a 1.8L engine. For the European release, it will also be available with a Diesel and 4WD.
I even received the exact dimensions for 260L. They are not that different from the current xA's, except that it will be wider than xA by 30mm. And it is definitely not Ractis-based, as it is shorter (in terms of height) than the Ractis by full 10cm.
However, there was a design sketch that had been released by Toyota sometime ago that has long been rumored to be a future Scion. That sketch looks a lot like the Ractis. So maybe there would be two brand-new Scion models (not counting xB, which we already know about). This part of it is purely speculative at this point.
-Cj :P
Granted it'd need to be something with ridiculous torque and not predicated on gas mileage haha...
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145hp and 200lb ft of torque
26mpg city and 37mpg highway
for a diesel tC. Just needs a 5 speed auto with OD to keep revs lower on the highway. The current auto isn't doing it.
Still, sounds reasonable if priced between $15-$20k!
The yaris on OTOH will be much better as a hybrid than diesel. Diesel is better suited for heavier cars ex:F-350, H2(needs 1), E320, and touareg. A hybrid yaris should get 44mpg in the city and 37mpg on the highway.
Sound good?
-Cj
The Prius buyers these days find the gas mileage (45MPG in reality btw), just an added bonus. The majority are after the tax credit and environmental friendliness. I get almost 40 in the Yaris, and my Smug emissions are down 48%
A SMALL diesel would make sense in a car like the Yaris. It works just fine in Europe
But for now, especially for a hybrid Yaris (where's the box I can close?):
NO DEAL
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I was thinking about one of the features of the Prius that suposedly helop it get better mileage. That would be the vacuum storage flask for the coolant. The idea is all the coolant goes into the flask on shutdown so when you start the engine is "already warmed up". Well, riddle me this. How much coolant is there, 2 gallons? Thats 16 pounds. Thats 2400 btu assuming a delta t of 150 degrees. BUT the engine and transmission weight about what, 600-600 lbs? That would require 90,000 btu to raise in temperature 150 degrees. The numbers dont add up on this one it would seem.
My impression was that it is like a thermos flask that is being warmed all the time by the coolant. When you shut down, the coolant is at the same temperature as the flask. And the flask is empty while you are driving, so it's not like heat energy is being wasted keeping it warm.
Have I totally missed your point?
As for future prospects for diesel Yarii, my suspicion is that Toyota's hybrid investment is great enough that it will not also begin to offer small diesels. Now big diesels for trucks? Oh sure, and in fact I really hope they bring a 50-state diesel in for Tacoma as well.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I agree Toyota has the public flim flammed with the Prius. But also there are restrictive laws that make US diesels hard to do.
It's kinda a trade-off in my opinion. Diesels are dirtier (generally), but use less fuel. Less fuel usage saves the environment too doesn't it? Couple it with the fact that I don't save any $$$ having an ULEV-2 car (Yaris), and all I get in return is the sorta good-feeling of helping the planet (which could be worse, but I'd still rather just have the $$$ lol)...
I wonder if the EPA regulators/feds would take good-feelings instead of $$$ too... I think we should try it on their next paycheck :P
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Driving it like I normally would (no eggshell between the pedals for me lol), I STILL get 37 MPG or so (combined).
It's also a hoot to drive and gets a ton of attention anyway, despite not emitting Smug.
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Which makes more sense to you: (My guesstimates)
Diesel yaris with 90hp and 120lb ft of torque, 36mpg is the city and 48MPg on the highway priced between $15-$17k or a
Hybrid yaris with 115hp and 113lb ft of torque, 47mpg in the city and 37mpg on the highway priced between $16-$18k.
Its a pretty even bet here. IMO, a hybrid yaris makes more since to have. Its lightweight and small size should get it excellent mpgs with a little more power to boost.
Diesel is good on small vehicles but make more a difference on bigger vehicles. The yaris would suffer in hp too much to justify the torque boost. The hybrid should stop the motor and make a bigger difference. In a traffic jam, the hybrid would shut the engine off like all other toyota hybrids and get great MPG! Whereas a diesel would still be running and loosing fuels.
Basically, Hybrids are great city cars and diesels are great touring (for lack of a better word) car. Now IF & ONLY IF toyota can make a DIESEL HYBRID....
-Cj :surprise:
The Yaris, according to the latest Toyota insider magazine, IS the closest thing to a Prius without hybrid doo-dads (the 1.5L engine I suppose being the biggest similarity).
If they WERE to add Synergy Drive to a Yaris, it would pretty much be a Prius
So I'd imagine the costs would be pretty close too, unfortunately...
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PS: I'm glad I have my 12.5K$ Yaris! :P
LOL :P
Nothing wrong with paying the couple hundred bucks in profit... Especially to get a car that's hard to find.
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Thank you for your cooperation. And now back to focusing our discussion on the Toyota Yaris...
Looking at the UK Yaris site, real world, the Diesel would run $1818 (adjusted to USD) more than a similar sized petrol. Not so sure they can do a hybrid for that. Plus you do get added complicated technology with hybrid..and a battery that eventually wears.
I've seen different figures, but the diesel mileage looks to be high 40s or low to mid 50s (adjusted) for combined driving.
http://uk.cars.yahoo.com/car-reviews/car-and-driving/toyota-yaris-d-4d-range-100- - 3286.html
Looks pretty dang good to me, I wish they would bring it here.
In the UK a diesel Yaris runs +1818 USD, though it doesnt seem to be available on all trims.
Unfortunately we're just going to have to live with 38MPG averages for now
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The corolla has more hp and space than a yaris so it isn't all that bad for a 5 year old model...
-Cj :P
The problem is, as I think we discussed earlier, it's extremely dated (grandmamobile). Nothing wrong with that I suppose, but it needs a facelift BAD (more than just the S package lol).
If it was more aesthetically pleasing to me, I would have gladly bought one. But if Toyota's recent track record is any indicator of what the 2008 Corolla will be like, I may have to get one of those
In the meantime, the Yaris isn't exactly something you'd expect to be parked outside a bingo hall
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Maybe when the NEW Fit comes out (Keep in mind how old the current-gen car actually is)... as I think Toyota may be holding the TS to help subdue a bit of the excitement when it does. IF it does, I don't expect we'd see it for more than a few years though, especially with the impending Scion/Corolla redesigns (say what you want about Toyota, but they are excellent at not stepping on their own product line's toes).
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Another thing to consider (as I sold one today for this very reason), is that a lot of Prius buyer's motivations go: 1)Environmental 2)Tax Credit/HOV Advantages 3) Trendy-ness and LAST 4)Gas Mileage. At least here, and that makes me wonder why it's not the same in Europe...
A lot of Prius buyers find the gas-mileage as just an added bonus. It's sad when you consider that a lot of Focus's sold in California are P-ZEV also lol... but the Prius is still viewed as "cleaner".
Toyota did a nice job of cornering the market here on hybrid technology, and so it's almost become apples to oranges comparing hybrids to diesels.
The non-buying segment looks at the real world mileage (of the Prius) and sees that you can do a lot better, at least financially speaking, elsewhere. But it's not just about the gas mileage to the real Prius buyers.
Don't rule out the Hollywood factor either... that's definitely boosted sales for us
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Even a diesel,however,has problems with payback. In 1980 I had a choice between a $4600 Subaru Hatchback or a $7500 VW Rabbit Diesel. I chose the Subaru bewcause I realized I would never recover the money spent on the Rabbit.
I would argue the ECHO (and its successor the Yaris) is the most cost effective fuel efficient car on the market today.(it aint even close actually) When you factor in its brilliant ergometric design and Toyota reliability, it becomes a slam dunk. The only fly in the ointment is the increased size and weight of the Yaris over the ECHO. Its not much of a factor at this point, but if it keeps up theyll make a Honda Civiv out of it.
My impression is that Prius is a bit larger than yaris and corolla so it comes into competition with the Camry as a family vehicle. Those who need to fill the back seat time to time. I've ridden in one of theirs and it seemed similar in size to another family members Camry. In that realm it is not so much more expensive. *no need to thank us for keeping Toyota motors afloat.
Funny about diesel perceptions..here is a quote from the Yaris UK site:
"Toyota's advanced diesel-engine technology delivers the best of both worlds - the lively responsive power you expect from a petrol engine but with the superior fuel economy and emissions of a diesel"
Those who actually do the math, realize that the Prius is a horrible financial decision if gas mileage is the primary concern. Of course, if you sell it within 3 years like MOST people do with cars these days, the resale is pretty darn incredible, and you get most of your $$$ back anyway.
As long as people continue to pay over MSRP for them, I'll let them think whatever they want though :P
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LOL
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I wonder... is the ECHO roomier inside than the Yaris?
The Echo had a high greenhouse with tons of visibility - the Yaris is much more cleanly styled and proportioned than the Echo was, but it is harder to see out of.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I could not agree with you more. My wife and I dropped the Yaris for various reasons, but one thing my wife complained about greatly was that peek-a-boo sense you get when you are in the driver's seat.