Subaru B9 Tribeca (B9X)

c_hunter

Bob, yeah, they let us sit in it and poke/prod it all over. They had invite-only customer events at 4:30pm and 6:30 pm and allowed attendees to look over the vehicle before and after the event. I only sat in the front seat myself, but other folks were crawling all over the back (I learned a lot by watching other people crawl around back there and try out all the features).

 

Anybody getting those e-mails with invites / free tickets to the local auto shows to see the Tribeca, this is the same deal. Definitely worth checking out.

 

Craig

varmint

"You and others here are applying the word "ugly" as if it were a universal truth."

 

Find me a word that is universal.

 

If "ugly" is simply a matter of opinion, then it has no meaning to anyone other than the person who wrote it. Conversely, neither does the word beautiful. Yet, I've seen you use both.

 

Furthermore, I have yet to read anything on these forums, that is not somebody's opinion.

 

I agree with you that design is something that most do not understand at a conscious level. Most simply state, "I do/do not like it", and have no idea why. They often say something is ugly simply because it's unlike anything they've every seen before. I spent a few years thinking I might be an art teacher, so I can appreciate what you mean about design being another language. While I do not have a background in design, my experience also means I can back up my comments about styling.

subearu

This will the only thing I'll disagree with you on - the Ody isn't the best handling minivan (because it ain't so mini anymore is it ;p ) - the MPV is better handling....(ducks and runs....)

 

-Brian

sduford

But the Element is a ground breaking vehicle with a very high "cool" factor.

 

So while I agree the Element is ugly, I hardly think you can compare it to the B9 in this context.

 

Sly

rsholland

Craig, did you get any sense of how the others there felt about the vehicle? Did you talk to others about it? Or overhear others commenting on it? If so, good, bad, indifferent?

 

Bob

ateixeira

I got a price book and I'll post some competitors' prices soon. I really think people here don't realize how expensive these SUVs have gotten.

 

Even a Murano or Pacifica will not have any price advantage once equipped the same way as the Tribeca.

 

Craig - good to hear about your reaction. Mine wasn't so much love or hate, just that the grille is much smaller than I expected, and really not the big deal we've made of it.

 

The grille itself is just 12"x16". I don't like the chrome inserts but that can be fixed easily with a black mesh grille.

 

Ridgeline's styling cues are actually more radical, IMO. The tail gate doesn't meet up with the sides, and everything about it tries to boldly dress up a boring 3 box shape.

 

In other words, styling is tacked on, not built-in, like the Tribeca.

 

While I don't think it's ugly, just a little strange, perhaps. The inside is just disappointing, though. Bob said that's probably for pickup-style durability, but the Pilot looks much nicer.

 

-juice

ateixeira

I have yet to read anything on these forums, that is not somebody's opinion

 

Not true! We used a tape measure! )

 

Element ground breaking? I dunno. But it seats just 4 people and has a payload of 675 lbs. Doesn't sound like it can break much ground. LOL

 

Styling is the real reason for its popularity.

 

Touche.

njswamplands

You really do have to see it in person. Subarus for some reason, always look much better in person than they do in pictures.



 

so does subaru try to discourage pictures running in auto mags? lol

ateixeira

Richmond, already? I'm shocked about that. We flew that far to be just a couple of days ahead?

 

We're a couple of crazy dudes.

 

-juice

ateixeira

I dunno about the "see it in person" argument. I just think whatever reaction you had from photos you will think more mildly about it when you see it in person.

 

The grille just isn't that big a deal when you see the full picture.

 

-juice

njswamplands

it has to make a few like it enough to buy it.

 

wow even next to nyc i never refer to 50k buyers as 'a few'

varmint

Great pics! Thanks very much. It looks like there is more space behind the 3rd row than I initially thought (a good thing). Front row legroom looks very generous, though, with the seat pushed all the way back, the second row looks tight. Your pics of the dash give me a perspective I had not yet seen. The pics taken through the door highlights the shape of the dash in a way that other interior pics did not. It's kinda minivan-like, but I don't consider that a bad thing.

 

18-24 mpg is okay, but I was hoping that the lower power rating might have been accepted as a trade for better mpg. With VCM, it is expected that the Pilot will get 18-24.

 

Kinda disappointed in the pricing. It's not too high. I think it's fair, given everything that the Tribeca offers, but it's not the bargain price that I think Subaru will need to get people into the showroom.

rsholland

If "ugly" is simply a matter of opinion, then it has no meaning to anyone other than the person who wrote it. Conversely, neither does the word beautiful. Yet, I've seen you use both.

 

Yes, I have used both, and I'm aware that those words are emotion-charged, to those using them—and to those hearing them as well. What I'm commenting on is that you used the word "ugly" as if it were a matter of "fact," rather than opinion. Facts can be proven, and there can be no argument or debate about them. Opinions, on the other hand, can be argued and debated until the cows come home.

 

Bob

c_hunter

The great majority of folks find the Honda Element hideous, yet it was the #1 selling new import nameplate the first full year it was out.

  

Number ONE.



 

I got to spend a lot of time looking at the Element last night, and am really enamored with it. I have a feeling the handling/NVH is probably not for me, but the whole concept of the vehicle is cool, and the price of $21.5K (with part time 4WD and auto trans) is pretty damn good. I really like the roomy and rugged interior that would be great for projects, sports, kids, and pets. I want to go test drive one soon.

 

Craig

njswamplands

ateixeira

OK, so far we have the Pilot at around $36 plus if you could even get both Nav and DVD, and the Highlander at $39 grand or so. Let's look at some others.

 

MDX: $44,345 with nav and DVD

 

So if you want a Honda product with both, you'll spend $4-6 grand more. And even at a pessimistic $40k estimated price for the Tribeca, notice the Subaru splits the difference exactly in half.

 

X5 3.0i: $42,395

$3400 for Premium Package

$2500 for Sport Package (18" rims)

$750 for Cold Package

$600 for Rear Climate

$1275 for Automatic

$1800 Nav

 

Total is ... $52,720.

 

More than you thought, eh? That's a 3.0l model with no Xenons and no self-leveling suspension.

 

OK, it's a Bimmer, but look at the huge price gap.

 

-juice

varmint

So all comments on styling are off limits. Is that how this works? If it can't be "proven" I have to write IMHO in front of it?

 

Bob, you know I like and respect you, but this is a bit much. You're using semantics as a method for censorship.

c_hunter

I think the pics I shot were with the second row forward (to enhance third row room). You can slide the second row (an 8" fore/aft travel) to tailor the legroom as you want. As it was in the pics, it would be bearable for both rear rows. For 5-pax duty, you could slide the second seat all the way back for lots of legroom (and I would probably stow the third row for max cargo room).

 

I also think the pricing is fair since it overlaps with Outback pricing and offers more interior room. Like the Outback, it's not a real compellingly-low price, but it's fair.

 

Craig

ateixeira

18/24 was preliminary. The Product Manager went as far as telling me that was not correct - it will change for production. We'll see.

 

I cringe at the thought of a Rendezvous, but since you brought it up, let's price it out. I drove one a while back and it had me running to a minivan. Some call it Versacrap. No wonder GM bought Subaru. But I digress...

 

-juice

c_hunter

Let's face it, styling is highly subjective. It's all opinion. We should probably let everyone draw their own conclusion and express their own opinion and leave it at that.

 

Craig

rsholland

There's a lot I could say in response to that, but for the sake of this thread, I'll just bite my tongue and keep quiet.

 

Bob

ateixeira

Rendezvous AWD: $30,460

Ultra package: $8445

sunroof and Nav: $1900

DVD: $1295

 

Total is $42,100. So that just plain makes the Tribeca look like a bargain.

 

-juice

c_hunter

Craig, did you get any sense of how the others there felt about the vehicle? Did you talk to others about it? Or overhear others commenting on it? If so, good, bad, indifferent?

 

There were several middle-aged couples there, and I learned that they were Outback and Forester owners. They loved the Tribeca! Many people were commenting that it was a lot roomier than their current Subaru, which was my reaction too. I didn't hear anyone commenting on the styling, yay or nay, so it seems to be a non-issue among they pool of Subaru owners I interacted with on the show floor (unlike our forum here!). It was very obvious to me that Subaru has a lot of brand loyalty and this appeared give the Tribeca an instant acceptance for the most part, with the new features and size being incentives to actually buy one.

 

Overall, I think it was a good reception for the vehicle and I learned a lot by watching other people in action.

 

Craig

ateixeira

So far we have:

 

Pilot $36k (aftermarket DVD)

HL $39k

Rendezvous Ultra $42k

MDX $44k

X5 3.0 $53k

 

So far Tribeca would likely be the 2nd cheapest.

 

-juice

njswamplands

we have seen the '05 legacy to drop to invoice quickly and would expect to trifecta to also.

 

what are edmunds real market prices thingee say about those config'd item you listed?

sweet_subie

exactly, this is what will make Tribeca a true lux bargain

 

I bet more than 50% of critics here will own one soon

sduford

Wow, sweet-subie, you sure are sold on this car!

 

I fail to see how having to heavily discount these cars after a few months is good for Subaru or will make it a success.

 

That sounds to me like the way GM does business.

 

Sly

rsholland

There were several middle-aged couples there, and I learned that they were Outback and Forester owners. They loved the Tribeca! Many people were commenting that it was a lot roomier than their current Subaru, which was my reaction too. I didn't hear anyone commenting on the styling, yay or nay, so it seems to be a non-issue among they pool of Subaru owners I interacted with on the show floor (unlike our forum here!).

 

Good to hear that Craig, and I suspected that would be the case.

 

Bob

crashton6

I fail to see how having to heavily discount these cars after a few months is good for Subaru or will make it a success.

 

You are right about this ^, but it seems to me that all automakers are having to discount quite heavily to sell any cars. It's a buyers market right now. IMHO ;-)

 

While the outside has started to grow on me the inside looks like the bridge of the starship Enterprise IMHO. Well it does have a star map on the grille doesn't it? The inside will probably grow on me too. What won't grow on me is the driving experience. IMHO it's not going to run or handle anything like an Outback, especially an XT.

 

Chuck

rsholland

What won't grow on me is the driving experience. IMHO it's not going to run or handle anything like an Outback, especially an XT.

 

Hard to say; while it is taller, it is also wider, and has nice wide 255/55x18 tires and 8" wide rims. I don't think it will be as quick, simply because it's roughly 600 pounds heavier.

 

Bob

rsholland

http://www.boxer6.com/photochops/tribajasd.jpg

 

This image has been revised from the one I posted earlier. Wheelbase has been extended to ~118" and the rear track increased ~ 6" so that 4' wide paneling could lay flat on the bed floor. Now it more closely matches the dimensions of the Honda Ridgeline.

 

Bob

imagesandwords

Loves the look of her 2k OB Ltd. but thought the Tribeca has ugly. When I asked for more specifics.....she said it was all wrong, like it was trying to hard. I dont think its too bad.

 

As far as MSRP:

A loaded (EVERYTHING) 2005 Rendezvous Ultra will have an MSRP of $42k, however, it actually sells for $35-36k in St. Louis. Even at that price they dont fly off lots. Its the same story with the 2005 Chrysler Pacifica Limited that loaded with everything. MSRP is probably in the $42k range but you can find them $36-37k. Even the loaded V6 Highlander can be had for around $36-37k. I can see why too; no V8, low tow ratings, etc. I suspect a loaded Tribeca will also sell in that same range, perhaps $36-37k based on its content. Certainly not $40k. At least not for very long.

rsholland

lists the Tribeca as one of the 12 most significant new models of the Detroit show.

 

http://automobilemag.com/auto_shows/naias_2005/0500_naias_12_prod- uction/index.html

 

Bob

sweet_subie

Good point. The reason there are big discounts is because the lux cars have become unaffordable, in the 40s. A6 is in the 50k range, go figure !

sweet_subie

Automobile mag is falling in love with Sub products,

 

they ranked WRX as car of the year a few years ago.

This year it was Legacy

Plus, their reviews on other subes are all positive

jamesn1

Im a Team Leader at the Subaru factory that builds the Legacy, Outback, Baja, and the new Tribeca. Its really exciting to see all the positive responses about the B9. We have put in alot of hours in the past year to make the B9 the best we could. I hope we continue to get many positive responses.

subearu

Wow, does SOA know you're posting here? ;-)

 

Anything you can share with us about building the Tribeca?

 

-Brian

njswamplands

jeffmc

if I post twice in a row...

rsholland

Most people who hated the look of the new B9 in photos, once they have actually seen it, have come away feeling much better about it. It really does look better in person.

Bob

sweet_subie

Jamesn1, are you really from SoA ?

 

I just test drove an OB XT which is awesome !!!! The biggest laugh i got out the visit, was the sales manager said the Ground clearance on the XT is about 7 inches, i almost fell off & started laughing. All the XT ads claim 8.7 inches which is more than 27 suvs. this sales manager doesn't know this ?

 

But he did have some good info,

1. fire-extinguishing material under hood.

2. you can put hand on the windows & close the door, the fingers won't hurt.

3. explained to me what happens in a crash, how the things fall under the driver, passenger etc

jeffmc

the 1000th post!!! Yippee!

jeffmc

Doh!

sweet_subie

http://www.iii.co.uk/shares/?type=news&articleid=5168202&- - action=article

  

"The key to the success of our mid-term sales goal now depends on our all-new B9 Tribeca, which falls into the class of middle-to-premium SUVs (sport utility vehicles), as we plan to take advantage of continued expansion of this segment," Takenaka said.

jamesn1

I work for Subaru of Indiana Automotive, not SOA. I actually build the vehicles and work on the Pilot Team. I can post on here now that its been officially announced. We are still building pilot units now. I can tell you that it runs down the same line in body shop that the legacy and the outbacks do. It is wicked cool, I wish that I could post pics of it, but alas, that is not allowed.

jon_in_ct

jamesn1 wrote:

We are still building pilot units now.

I noticed an article in Sunday's Journal and Courier at http://www.lafayettejc.com/news20050116/200501160local_business11- - - - - 05851670.shtml

where SIA Executive VP Tom Easterday was quoted as saying:

We haven't really pinned down the day, but right now we are already in pre-pilot production -- we're in the second stage.

So, according to jamesn1, Tribeca production is a little farther ahead than Mr. Easterday thinks.

jeffmc

"Fukui also confirmed the next iteration of the Honda Pilot will be introduced in the fall as a 2006 model. The Pilot will feature the automaker's recently introduced variable cylinder management system, which deactivates three of the six cylinders to boost fuel economy. The system is offered now in the Odyssey minivan and the Accord Hybrid."

 

Quote pulled from the Edmunds story posted Saturday regarding the 2006 Civic. http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Articles/articleId=104395#

 

So much for any Tribeca fuel economy advantage over this competitor. Wonder what the design'll be and if they'll also use Acura's new SH-AWD? This could be a vehicle with equal AWD capability (correct me if I'm wrong about the performance of SH-AWD) and superior economy in a larger package. Presumably Pilot will receive a dose of style, too. So that would leave Subie with what advantage... only better handling? Hmm. Subaru'd better bring those other powerplants in to play soon, I think.

rsholland

Welcome aboard and thanks for your comments! Stick around, I think you will find this to be a good group—even if all don't agree on the Tribeca.

 

I for one look forward to any inside, behind-the-scenes commentary on your part.

 

Bob

rsholland

This is the original shorter version, but from the rear.

 

http://www.boxer6.com/photochops/tribajasdrear.jpg

 

Bob

rsholland

Best production cars

 

http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp?articleId=3856

 

Worst booth design

 

http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp?articleId=3857

 

Detroit show gallery

 

http://gallery.dealerrater.com/gallery/shows.asp?manu=&cat=&a- mp;thisPage=1&galleryId=14