Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

fintail

Not many left like this And yes, the seller is a notoriously overpriced lot.

qbrozen

i like that '67 malibu. interior looks decent. looks like he did a good job under the hood (although i'd like to know the output). if no rust, seems like an easy project to finish (famous last words).

jlflemmons

How about we go for the simple, first? What does the air filter look like? If that is really grunged up, you can get issues with the injection. I think the O2 sensor is upstream of the converter, and to be honest, a lot of perfectly good O2s get tossed by parts swappers without finding the real problem. It can be really simple (plugs or wires) or it could be nasty (MAP sensor). If a good mechie doesn't see something obvious pretty quickly, I would say it is time to shoot the horse.

gsemike

That Benz looks great. With 88k, how much is it worth? 6 grand doesn't buy too much these days.

akangl

How about we go for the simple, first? What does the air filter look like? If that is really grunged up, you can get issues with the injection. I think the O2 sensor is upstream of the converter, and to be honest, a lot of perfectly good O2s get tossed by parts swappers without finding the real problem. It can be really simple (plugs or wires) or it could be nasty (MAP sensor). If a good mechie doesn't see something obvious pretty quickly, I would say it is time to shoot the horse

Ya know, I've never looked at the air filter, lol. How sad is that?

I might drop it by my mechanic to see if he can get to the bottom of it, he's a pretty good trouble shooter.

Got another call on it, guy wants to come by on Saturday to look at it. He's in an area where no IM is needed, so it would be fine the way it is. *sigh* I guess if someone wants it, then I'll let it go. I'm scared there is more than meets the eye with this car.

Like I said this is how good projects go bad! :sick:

Mr_Shiftright

You don't want a 190E 2.3....ever....free isn't cheap enough.

hpmctorque

Too bad the 190E 2.3 wasn't reliable, because Mercedes really got the styling and configuration right, in my opinion. I always liked this model, but at the same time am turned off by what I've learned about it's poor reliability. I guess the 2.6 is better.

How does the reliability of the 190 2.6 compare with the early ('94 and '95) C-Class 6-cylinder, and how much better is the 220 C-Class than the 190E 2.3?

qbrozen

the 2.6 ain't so hot either. apparently head gaskets are a common failure, and you don't want to know how to get the darned head off that thing. believe me, i tried.

lilengineerboy

I think the Alfa is one of the most beautiful cars ever made. I would just be worried about parts availability and pricing. I think it would be more interesting then doing a bug-eye or Midget restoration, but not as cool as a 100-6.

The 914 is a little too new, every year they put emissions equipment on that car, power went down more and more. Also the FI on that car wasn't bad when properly tuned, but the emissions stuff made life much more difficult. A '73 914 2.0 would be a better bet.

Mr_Shiftright

Alfa parts are no problem. The aftermarket is great; however, there may be a few little trim pieces, or large body panels, that would be a problem. But the nice thing about the Italians is that they'll make you whatever you want in metal--they are very good at that. They're also light years more modern than a Bug-Eye or 100-6--20 years ahead in technology.

914s are great little cars and a 2.0 is the one to have...as you say, earlier the better.

fintail

I've heard the normal W202s aren't too bad. I sure see a lot of higher mileage ones running around here, anyway. They are still kind of old-school, and not in a bad way - not complex. The C220 is a gutless wonder though.

hpmctorque

"The C220 is a gutless wonder..."

Yup, I drove one, and acceleration certainly wasn't what one would expect from a premium compact. The noise, vibration, and harshness from the engine was below Honda standards too, leading me to conclude that the straight six was worth the extra money. Had the head gasket failure issues, a major weakness of the 190E 2.3, been sorted out in the C-220, at least?

Mr_Shiftright

If I won a 2.3 in a charity raffle, I wouldn't even go to pick it up, I swear.

bumpy

grandma car, defined

who was it that was looking for one of these?

I kinda like this

um, no

resale value

cheap drifter

dogs and cats living together

if I were gonna get a moose-tong, it would be this one

gsemike

At least in the pics, that Mustang looks good for the dough

fintail

I am not sure, to be honest. I think the C280s are mechanically OK, save for letting a tranny go now and then. These cars eventually had the "lifetime" transmission fluid, which if not changed by 70-80K or so, often results in failure. C36s and C43s have this issue too.

fintail

I don't know what to say

Sad Euro

Fomoco Andre-mobile

gsemike

How can anyone pitch a car so far from original as a "classic". It is what it is. It's a driver but putting in a non-original engine killed any chance of it being desired as a classic.

justaveragejoe

That is the "New Classic" car. Kinda like the jumbo shrimp.

Mr_Shiftright

Instead by buying that poor beater of a 500SE you could just start shoveling money into a roaring wood stove and essentially achieve the same result--all in the comfort of your own home.

hpmctorque

"If I won a 2.3 in a charity raffle, I wouldn't even go to pick it up, I swear."

Wow, harsh words! It's the kind of statement I might reserve now for the Renault products that were sold in the U.S. in the '80s, under various badges. Were head gaskets failures the leading problem for the 190E 2.3, or am I missing something, shifty?

What's your opinion of the C Class in general, and the 220, C-230, and C-230 Kompressor in particular?

andre1969

The Malibu - if they did everything they say they did, how much money did they put into it? $1500? Hard to believe a well-kept car needed all that. Would be a nice car, if you like that kind of thing.

yeah, reading that list, it sounds like the car sat around for awhile and just deteriorated. It was probably babied while the original owner drove it, but then I'm guessing he gave up driving and jsut parked the car and it sat around until he passed on, which could have been years later.

I do kinda like those things, mainly because my first car was a 1980 Malibu coupe. The 4-door sedans still piss me off though, with their stationary rear door windows.

texases

Forgot about that - crusher time!

Mr_Shiftright

I don't really know anything about the C220s, but I know the 2.3s well...easily the worst car Mercedes ever made, or TIED for the worst, with the 219...a chronic valve-burner.

Let's see...bad cylinder head, bad climate control, emergency brake releasing whenever it wished, bad fuel injection, hilariously bad Becker Grand Prix radios. Do you really need to see Page Two?

Buy a 2.6 and be happy (...happier...)

fintail

My 126 had a Becker Grand Prix. It wasn't especially bad. It did say "electronic" on it, which seemed odd to me...I'd hope it's electronic.

isellhondas

I always thought those were "wannabee" cars especially the 2.3's. Those engines looked like they came out of an old Pinto.

But the owners could brag that they owned a Mercedes!

hpmctorque

That details the deficiencies better than I'd seen before, because the comments I'd seen mostly assumed that the reader knew the list of problem areas. Thanks.

Mr_Shiftright

They were exactly that---a cheapo Mercedes---and it really showed.

I mean, how many times has Mercedes completely pulled a model for two years and then re-introduced it with a new cylinder head and new fuel injection? That tells you something right there about the car.

Yes, Becker Grand Prix Electronic---that was the trouble-prone radio that they also discontinued when they yanked the 190E off the market. When it (the 190E 2.3) returned (in 1991?) it had a different radio in it.

fintail

I think that's right...in looking at 126s, I think 1991 was the year the Becker name was dropped from the radio, replaced with a "Mercedes-Benz" plate. Kinda looks like the same unit to me, though...maybe just the same face.

Mr_Shiftright

It's an Alpine actually...but I'm glad you didn't have trouble with your Becker...many people apparently did.

texases

Seems like just about everyone was not able to compete with the Asian electronics makers - this was the time when you started seeing made in Japan/Taiwan/Malasia/etc. on many old-line names. Any idea if/when Becker switched? I believe the l980 'Blaupunkt' I installed was made elsewhere, and I would have been better off with a Pioneer.

fintail

Ah, I didn't know that. And yeah, my car never had an issue...well, I think it ate a tape once, but that doesn't matter much, it was old.

My fintail has a Becker Europa, those seem to be good units, they even have some collectible value

Another Euro 126, this one not so sad

oregonboy

(the car is nicer than these pictures)

He must mean that it's not all out of focus. I had a car like that once. Try as I might, it was always blurry.

james

xwesx

Those are the worst, are they not?!

fintail

Ouch, my eyes

lokki

Wasn't 1978 the year they coined the phrase

"Nothing exceeds like excess?"

andre1969

The car itself wouldn't be so bad, but good Lord, I can't stand that color! It looks like a color that you'd buy appliances in, if you were remodeling your kitchen around 1977.

xwesx

Hahah. That's about right, too. Thanks for sharing, fintail. At least we were able to partake in your pain. :sick:

toomanyfumes

Were they still using the 460 V-8 in 1978? I thought they had gone to 400's by then. I want the biggest engine to go with my biggest car. :surprise:

qbrozen

ya just can't do these kinds of things, and expect someone else to want it. There's so much work I'd need to do to make it look normal that I might as well start with one that hasn't been worked on at all.

qbrozen

1953 chevy sedan

texases

Unless someone likes exactly what's in this one, it would be a lot easier to find another one. That whole flame thing has gotten kind of old. And what's with the gas tank? So much for putting anything in the bed.

gsemike

I like the pickup more than the sedan. The pickup needs a tailgate and bumper but otherwise looks OK. I could do without the fuel cell. Look at the air filter on the Chevy and the rust on the chrome on the front. That speaks to a real lack of attention to detail. It's probably a mess in person.

fintail

Interesting use of one of these

Mr_Shiftright

Looks like a tarted-up rust bucket from the photos.

I'd be very leery of this one.

justaveragejoe

Yeah, that's nice. He needs to add a few more gages though.

justaveragejoe

The bed looks like the wheel wells have been tubbed, too. Don't think I'd "buy it now". Apparently, some folks think different is good, stock is bad.

gsemike

The buy it now is steep on the truck but for maybe 5 or 6 grand, if that's your thing, why not. At least the front and the engine looks pretty good. Neither the sedan nor the truck will win any shows. I bet alot of young guys would like that truck because once it has a tailgate, you can throw gear back there and it oozes "attitude"

fintail

For the brave

Ahead of its time

andre1969

The 400 became standard in big Lincolns for 1977, but the 460 was still optional through 1978. IIRC, the 400 only came as a 2-bbl, while the 460 only offered a 4-bbl. I think the 460 had something like 215-225 hp right up through the end, while the 400 had maybe 175 in 1977, 166 in 1978, and 159 in 1979.

A buddy of mine has two '78 Mark V Diamond Jubilees, both with 460's. One has been built up and it actually pretty gutsy for something this massive. The other is bone stock though and, well, I guess the best way to describe its performance is "dignified".

I can't imagine what one of these must be like with the 400. Queen Mary-ish, maybe?