Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

ghulet

I think that's a Bel Air, for the record....probably not the worst old car you could have, reliability wise, if you can live with the lack of creature comforts and the six-cylinder. I imagine around town it'd be fine on most days.

Mr_Shiftright

944 --- I like these cars for their competence but they are maintenance-intensive vehicles, so my advice to people is to either buy the turbo model or just forget it. At least with the turbo you get a level of performance that makes the expenses seem worthwhile.

The 944 turbo is a real sleeper and an awesome car when driven properly.

ghulet

....I'm pretty sure was not imported to the U.S. until model year '86, so by default all the '83-85s are non-turbo. Easiest way to tell the turbo is the front end--their bumper is integrated into the front fascia more smoothly, with flush foglights below smaller, slit-type parking lights.

http://www.fastestlaps.com/photos/_Porsche_944_Turbo_220hp49420eb2d10eb.jpg

Turbos also have a lower air dam (?) below the rear bumper, whereas the NAs do not.

fintail

I think I remember that yeah...the turbo cars have a different front bumper, more flush as you say.

texases

What about the 924 turbo (that's what I was thinking of with the hood vents):

lemmer

924 Turbos are awful cars. On paper they are about as fast as a non-turbo 944 (if you can find a 924T in running condition). The engines are rough and cobby, they seem to break on a regular basis, and they cost a lot to fix.

qbrozen

Hmmm... it is an "e," but at least a 5-spd. And it does seem to be rather exceptional. But, still... $3400? Seems pretty excessive. What is it worth?

How many miles is too many for an LS400?

Too bad this is an auto. Still, I was tempted ... till I took at look at what the backseat in one of these looks like. Definitely not designed for a toddler seat and baby seat.

Wife says "so you want to essentially buy back your old car?? Well, hell, I always say its the best car I ever owned. And, just think, it only has 12k more miles than the one I sold and I can buy it for at least $2500 less than I got for mine.

Mr_Shiftright

85 BMW -- might be worth $2750 or so. Seems like a very nice car.

Nissan -- boring

LS400--- yeah, for 170K miles the car should be donation value---but they are a nice ride (although not terribly exciting) and they hold their value. I'm quite surprised that the interior isn't all chewed up. The leather on those early cars was not very durable for some reason. Possibly an exception car of this type might be considered with those high miles---but it's going to be expensive to repair.

ghulet

....I like that BMW, though (I don't know if you care, but) the '86 and later have ABS, that '85 will not. Looks very nice, though.

The Nissan, yeah not so great for a car seat, and the automatic would make it a no for me, for this particular car.

Those old LS are nice, though I'm guessing they're quite piggish, and I know they have lots of breakable doo-dads.

I did see a red, stick shift Focus LX in the Chicago area, looked pretty nice, for $2000. Doubt you wanna travel out here, though.

qbrozen

I actually emailed someone earlier today with a Focus LX 5spd with 90k miles with Eibach suspension, 17" wheels, and catback exhaust. Looked nice. $3k.

No response yet.

Shifty, glad to hear your number cause that's where I was (well, I rounded to $2800). I think I'm gonna email that seller now.

Thanks for that tip about the ABS. I didn't know that. And this needs to be a winter car, so its a concern.

ghulet

SAAB 900 Turbo 3-door stick:
http://chicago.craigslist.org/wcl/ctd/1409610274.html

98 Civic EX sedan stick (not crazy about the taillights, but still):
http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/cto/1408060142.html

Just kidding:
http://chicago.craigslist.org/nwc/ctd/1407839920.html

how 'bout a SAAB convertible (stick, turbo):
http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/ctd/1407252009.html

not for you, but kinda fun, and nice color:
http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/ctd/1403587990.html

maybe not the most exciting, but practical and it's a stick:
http://chicago.craigslist.org/nwc/ctd/1403278363.html

qbrozen

Craigs is hoppin all of a sudden. About a full page of listings popping up each hour, it seems.

Could do worse than a rebadged Toyota. Tough to find specs on this, though. Anybody know much about them? I'm mostly concerned with weight.

Now that's a great ad. Oddly enough, I kinda like the color. Could do without those wheels, though.

As if I needed him to tell me its in Staten Island. I got yer 3rd pedal right here, buddy!

ghulet

St. John is an Indiana suburb of Chicago:

http://chicago.craigslist.org/nwi/cto/1408596871.html

qbrozen

hmmm... So the Civic has somewhere north of 150k. If I guess right, do I get a discount on the ridiculous price?

No vert for me. Not my thing.

ghulet

....but certainly interersting, and looks to be in good condition:

http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/ctd/1409834808.html

explorerx4

grey market gtr's

qbrozen

Ya know, I love when people says things like "odometer has 88,000 miles"

Soooo... what does the rest of the car have?

ghulet

....I was wondering if you caught that....also the beginning of the ad 'runs and drives' (notice it doesn't say 'well'); the non-turbo Audi 5000/100s are dogs (not that I can talk, I have an automatic 528e), which is too bad because they're really nice looking cars, and the interiors were top-notch at the time. I do like that he's done the brakes and some suspension work, but I've heard time and again what nightmares these cars are otherwise. Like I said, shame.

fintail

14.5 mpg out of a 4 cylinder. Nice.

That Audi would be an endless money pit.

ghulet

You mean the trip computer on the SAAB, right? LOL, we don't miss much here.

Gbrozen, what about an Infinity G20....a lil bigger and nicer than a Sentra, and you get the SE-R engine:

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=266016049&dealer_id=67769&car_- year=1996&rdm=1254879846887&model=G20&num_records=50&systime=&make2=&highlightFi- rstMakeModel=&start_year=1981&keywordsfyc=&keywordsrep=&engine=&certified=&body_- code=0&fuel=&awsp=false&search_type=both&distance=0&marketZipError=false&search_- lang=en&showZipError=y&make=INFIN&keywords_display=&color=&page_location=findaca- r%3A%3Aispsearchform&min_price=10&drive=&default_sort=priceDESC&seller_type=b&ma- x_mileage=&style_flag=1&sort_type=priceDESC&address=60651&advanced=y&end_year=20- 10&doors=&transmission=Manual&max_price=4000&cardist=13&standard=false

ghulet

:P

qbrozen

i'd love a g20!

pics aren't very good though. wanna go check it out for me? if it pans out i'll send ya a reverse birddog fee.

by the way, you can cut off link just after car id number.

D'OH! Wait a sec. I just plugged that into mapquest. 822 miles away. I think that's a bit excessive.

qbrozen

Now THIS is the one I'd really want. SO tempting. Don't think the wife will agree to $4k to a car with 150k on it, though.

Possibly a better bargain. But certainly not as much fun.

srs_49

$3400 for an '85 325 seems high to me, even though it looks to be in very good shape.

I only paid $2500 for my '87 325 back in 1999 (when the car was only 12 years old). Maybe I just got a steal.

lemmer

I bought a GS400 with 209K on it a few months back. I guess it could have a catastrophic failure at any point, but currently it is in perfect working order. It is still as tight as a drum and drives great. I try to go easy on it, but I have become addicted to having 300 hp on tap.

lokki

For some reason bad spelling really rings warning bells for me, especially in a car like an Audi - it just gives me the impression that maybe he didn't understand what he was getting into with buying an Audi, and maybe only did the maintenance that he was forced into in order to get to Taco Bell in time for his shift.....

5 spead manual transmition,

. excelent to get you to work and back.
Just replaced front shocks,compleat front breaks pads,rotors,calipers,rear braek pads,strong runer

I've sort of become resigned to "breaks" instead of "brakes" but at least misspell it the same way twice in the same sentence, OK?

Am I being too old and mean here? I was young and poor once, myself, but I could spell....

Mr_Shiftright

the Nissan isn't smog legal and probably *very* loud, so you'll have to do some tinkering right off.

jlflemmons

"Am I being too old and mean here? I was young and poor once, myself, but I could spell.... "

No, you are not. It is one thing to misspell a multi-syllable word rarely used, but the spelling in that ad is atrocious. If he couldn't spell any better than that, he should have found help.

Then again, if you can't spell, how do you know it's wrong??? :P

Mr_Shiftright

Ah, that supports Shiftright's "Ignorance is a Death Loop" theory, which is, briefly, that as people become more and more iggerant, the number of educated people who can teach them to become un-iggerant decreases, until the tipping point when there are more iggerant people than educated people---and that's called The Dark Ages.

This applies to spelling, not to cars, where it is impossible to teach us anything about common sense.

qbrozen

Damn, that's funny, Shifty.

On the Spec V, I don't have a problem tinkering right off the bat. Heck, bought a 2009 Mazda5 and started tinkering right off the bat. Its inevitable with me.

Problem with the Spec V is that i ran a carfax and found it had an accident very early in life (about 5k miles). No details are given other than it was hit in the rear. I've emailed the seller asking if he knows anything about the accident, which involved the first owner. No response yet.

OK... this is where I'm at right this moment and looking for opinions. I've got 3 possibilities, all with positives and negatives.

'00 Ford Focus LX sedan 5spd, 90k miles, private seller. $3k asking.
+ Eibach suspension, 2 sets of wheels, supposedly well cared for, T-belt at 80k, clutch at 70k, wheel
bearings a couple of weeks ago. Good for all weather. 4 doors.
- Its a Ford. Unloved car with poor resale.

'02 Sentra GXE 5spd, 111k miles, dealer. $3k asking.
+ Its a Nissan. Good for all weather. 4 doors.
- $3k at a dealer makes me suspect something is very wrong.

'85 325E 5-spd, 153k miles, private. $3400 asking.
+ Its an E30. CHEAP insurance with Hagerty.
- Might be too slow in stock form. Not equipped for all weather. 2 doors.

The practical side says Focus, right? Or wrong?

andre1969

I have a bad habit of spelling the word "Galaxy" the wrong way, which can be a bit embarrassing since I work for NASA! It's just instinct for me to spell it "Galaxie", mostly because of the car, but I think partly because when I was a kid, Kings Dominion used to have a roller coaster called the "Galaxie".

stickguy

interesting mix. I like the BMW, and it sounds like it could be nice with 1 owner and all that work done. But, for your criteria, not a good idea. Heck, might as well just use your wifes convertible and the Z!

The Escotr could be nice, but I always worry about how it was abused, sinc emost people that do that kind of mods to a chapr car are probably young, and abusive. If it was a fancy car like the BMW< then it could be more money than brains, but you are at least mechanically inclined, so can get a feel for it.

One thing, for me, the Escort is wildly uncomfortable. But generally solid, sound transportation.

THe Sentra, if clean, could be a winner. It is the iles, and base level, holding down the price (that, and the stick). Probably a much better car, and a safer bet, than the Ford.

Keep in mind that neither one wil have side bags or ABS.

I shold s=look at that BMW. I could use a toy! sell my accord, and keep the TL for DD duty.

stickguy

You look at any contours? Generally much nice than an Escort, and a little bigger, and they tend to be cheap. Pretty good MPG with the 2.0l and a stick too. Just seem to be much "more" car than an escort. Also possible to find ABS, but mostly on the V6.

I had a 1995 Mystique 6cyl 5 speed. That was a nice driving car, and quite quick. Also had a 1998 Contour 4 cyl AT. That was a dog. They also seemed to decontent quite a bit. Just felt cheaper, but it was also a lower level car (cloth no leather, etc.).

qbrozen

Not sure if you are calling it an Escort on purpose. (?)
I've been lead to believe the Focus is worlds ahead of what the Escort was.

Of note, it seems the Focus is quite a bit larger inside than the Sentra. Several more inches of rear leg room and 1.5 inches more up front. Also a bigger trunk and longer wheelbase. Sentra has a bit of an edge in the engine power department, though.

stickguy

Better stop drinking before noon... (j/k about that. no need to stop!)

Yeah, the Focus is a better car if you like the seats. 1st gen was probably nicer too, if the bugs were worked out!

My neighbor's kid has a focus (don't know what year) with a few mods (sterro, taillights, nothing radical) that actually look real nice.

Probably comparable to a sentra, but more fun to drive.

Hey, over on SS there is now a '93 240 listed. 5 speed, nice wheels, looks OK. and just 220K on it!

all for the low, low price of 5-6K! Talk about insane.

qbrozen

I saw that one. Was about to comment to the poster, but resisted.

michaellno

Having owned a Focus ('03 ZX5 w/ manual transmission), my question is - does the LX have the same 130HP engine? I can't remember if Ford put the 110HP lump (that was in the Escort - had one of those, too) into the Focus as well.

Of the list of 3 above, I'd say the Focus .. the maintenance work was done and it's got the fewest miles. Yes, resale is lousy, but, c'mon - is that what really drives you on this decision? Resale value on a $3-5K car?

Plus, there are all sorts of sites where you can update the Focus. I really wish I'd kept ours.

xwesx

Yeah, but $2500 back then is worth $5000 now!

jrosasmc

By "SS," you mean Swedespeed, I presume? Where is that '93 240 located? I may be interested, as I've been looking for another clean older Volvo for a while.

If it's the 5-speed, it likely has the M47 transmission. My old '84 DL coupe had the M46 (4-speed plus overdrive).

stickguy

That's the place. and it is an M47 5 speed.

The car is in, IIRC, N. VA (outside DC).

wander over there and look in the marketplace, in the RWD cars for sale section.

Mr_Shiftright

I'd vote for the Focus, too. Cheap to fix, sorta kinda fun maybe, and you can always sell it to someone.

qbrozen

well, it ain't 130hp.

boomchek

I like the older GSs.. There are very few for sale in my area though. I guess people hang onto them for a long time.

british_rover

My vote goes to the Focus. When I was possibly changing jobs 18 months ago and would lose my demo I was looking for a four door SVT Focus to be my new DD.

Hard to find but a good buy then as you could still get them CPO from Ford and get 1.9 or .9 financing for 24 months I think. Rather use Ford's money then my own.

They even had the same transmission as my MCS.

Years ago I worked on a 92 or 93 Lexus LS400. First started working on it when it had around 50,000 miles so just out of warranty. Guy always did full synthetic in the engine, trans and rear diff. Never needed anything but fluid changes and brakes/tires but man was it dull to drive. Last time I worked on it was a little before I moved up here and we replaced the gear oil in the rear diff plus the trans fluid. The car had 298,000 miles on it.

He had been doing 7,500 mile oil changes with synthetic and 100,000 mile diff and trans fluid changes also with synthetic since 20,000 or so miles.

That gear oil looked like new maybe two shades darker then brand new fluid tops and no grit at all.

qbrozen

Thanks for the votes, guys. I'm trying to set up an appt to view it now. Seller is not the quickest to respond.

Not sure I posted it before, so here it is.

Mr_Shiftright

That short shifter could be a nuisance and again, the exhaust system should be tested for its level of obnoxiousness at highway speeds.

michaellno

well, it ain't 130hp.

After reviewing the ad, the only performance mod that would impact the HP is the exhaust.

But, it does look well cared for. You might be able to get a small deduct for the new 17" tires it will need. I'm guessing that the original "steal" wheels are either 14" or 15".

Dang, now I really miss mine.

There are a few of the 5-door SVT's here in town. I liked those quite a bit, too.

andre1969

Couple things to keep in mind...

In 2000, the Focus did have the weak little 110 hp engine that came out of the old Escort. Now it may not be bad with a 5-speed, or if it had performance mods done to it, but bone-stock, it's not that good of a performer.

Also, the 2000 Focus gave the 1980 Citation a run for its money when it comes to "most recalled car in history". Depending on how you measure it (amount of recalls, or amount of cars recalled, or percentage of cars sold affected by recalls) it actually beat the Citation.

The Focus was pretty troublesome its first couple years out, but I guess if all the recalls had been done, and it's been taken care of, it might not be a bad car.

stickguy

Gonna knock the kids baby teeth out on the crappy NJ roads with that thing! Doesn't look like much suspension travel.

One thing that makes me wonder is when you see someone pour a ton of money into a car, then immediately sell it, especially for less then they probably put into it. Why? Good for you if it is because the CC bill came, bad if they made a mess of it and are looking to cut and run!

but, not too far away, so certainly worth taking a ride to check it out.

you can also take it to tuner night at the local Mcdonalds, and be the only dude there with a couple of car seats.

qbrozen

sure. of course. although you'd probably be surprised at just how obnoxious my 300Z is with its new exhaust. MUCH louder than I was going for, but I ain't paying for another muffler right now. Besides, I haven't had the chance to "show" it off yet at the autoX. ;b