Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

fintail

Worse yet, I am sure it is the same transmission as my car, which means 2nd gear start. You must have to floor it to make it move. I suspect 0-60 in that 190D is 30 seconds or so.

Speaking of old diesels, this late run diesel ponton sounds and looks wonderful

stickguy

will a Hemi fit? That is my 1st answer to all power issues.

I imagine you could easily squeeze in a smallblock Chevy if you wanted a real sleeper!

andre1969

will a Hemi fit? That is my 1st answer to all power issues.

Well, if it'll fit in a PT Cruiser, you never know!

I imagine you could easily squeeze in a smallblock Chevy if you wanted a real sleeper!

I wonder which engine is physically smaller, a Ford 302 or a Chevy smallblock? I know they're both notably smaller than a Mopar smallblock. I think one reason that the Sunbeam Tiger went away was because when Mopar took them over, their 273/318 A-engine would not fit in there, while the Ford 289/302 block would.

One thing the Ford has going for it is light weight, around 500 lb. In comparison, the Chevy smallblock was a bit of a porker, around 575, although with modern technological advances, I guess newer crate engines are lighter. The Mopar smallblock, while physically larger, was only around 525 lb, 550 for the 360.

Mr_Shiftright

You got time? You got money? You got skill? Great! You can put any engine into any car. :P

Rule of Thumb: If you're buying a car with an engine malady, and you can't verify that malady prior to sale, then ASSUME THE WORST POSSIBLE OUTCOME when making your offer.

fintail

No doubt a small V8 would fit - I have seen 5.0 Ford engines in W123s, supposedly not too tough. I was thinking something that could even be mated to the existing transmission and cooling system without many issues.

texases

Just saw the episode on the Renault Alpine A310. Put 13,500 in, got 13,500 out (excluding labor). But it was great seeing them come up with a custom spanner to remove the wheel bearings.

bhill2

The problem with a V-8 transplant would be that the engine sound (or lack of it) would give the car away. Even a modern diesel would be too quiet. About the most powerful engine that I think could provide the right sonic ambience would be a turbocharged 3 liter from a 300SD or a '82+ 300D. Any other candidates? Of course, you could just put a speaker in the engine bay and feed it the sound of the 190D at idle. Once you are moving, the jig is up anyway.

fintail

An 80s era diesel can be made to be pretty loud, that might be a good bet. But, that won't win any races even as a turbo, it would just be easier to drive. If one is looking to be a freakshow sleeper drag racer, there's no real way to get that old sound.

stickguy

another interesting swap, and much easier to fit, is a 2.3l 4, or one of the kompressor engines. If the I6 fit, that should have plenty of room!

bhill2

Fact is, I could live with the performance of a 300 turbodiesel engine if it would fit. I like fintails and the 300 engine would make it useable on the freeway. I wonder if you could mate it up with the original 4-speed, and if it could take the greater output of the transplanted engine. I would want to swap out the rear end, I think. Didn't the 190D have a final drive ratio in the mid to high 4's?

fintail

A kompressor or the I6 out of a 300E would be decent - I know the latter puts out about 180hp, which would be fine in a ~3000lb car.

fintail

Anything to get 0-60 down around 15 secs or less is needed, and maybe make the car capable of freeway speeds. I suspect the transmissions were overbuilt enough to take a somewhat more powerful engine. A complete W123 turbodiesel powertrain swap might not be a huge job. The ratio in a diesel fintail must be high, contributing to its minimal high speed capability. My I6 fintail also has what must be a high ratio (don't know it off my head), it really buzzes along over 70 or so, but the engine doesn't mind.

xwesx

That's pretty much what I did with my truck. It had sat for 23 years but only had 29,000 miles on the clock. Well, what chance was there that I was going to have to put a lot of money into it to get it running? I thought the chance was fairly high, so I paid $500 for it (back in 1997).

Turns out, I won that bet. I only put about $250 into it along with about two hours of work, and it was running like a top. Another $600 for new tires and I was good to go.

fintail

Several days of collected craigslist gleanings - I hope all the links remain active:

Andre-mobile

Period colors

Sad ending

Odd survivor

Never really became collectible

Nice 1970s Avalon

Euro SLC with period colors

Optimism will help

Once on every block, now seldom seen

Go broke in style

Far cry from an Outback

A different kind of bustle

Owners of these always aim for the stars

Stude lives on

Always was impressed by those seats, few of these on the road

Not seen much anymore

Nice looking W126

The slant to the speedometer numbers made me chuckle

Don't store your car outside

Finish this project

Cute tin can

Hard to believe these are over 30 years old

Yo Adrian

What a great ad

andre1969

That '77 Bonneville is a good looking car. Nice colors, and big engine. I wonder how low he'd go, money-wise.

The '83 Continental is nice, too. These were always my least favorite of the bustlebacks, but I'm finding that I like them more and more. I think part of it is that I see them less often than an Imperial or Seville. And, one thing in the Continental's favor is that it had fairly good drivetrains. The 302 V-8 was always decent, as far as I know. I guess some of the earlier 4-speed automatics could still be troublesome, and I've heard air suspensions could be problematic...and expensive. But in contrast, the '81-83 Imperial had finicky fuel injection, and the Seville, after 1980 at least, was stuck with either a V-8-6-4, Diesel, or aluminum 249.

tjc78

The earlier Continentals had Ford's CFI which absolutely was better than GM or Chryslers alternatives, but certainly not great. The problem with it is that today there aren't many people who understand it, and a few of the sensors are pretty expensive. Those 5.0s also had crappy timing sets and once they stretch the car will not run well.

toomanyfumes

When I was a teen I had a '68 Galaxie 2-door in those exact colors, tan with the white painted roof. I don't think I've seen another like it. Of course mine had lots of miles, rust and a saggy rear end, but it was fairly reliable and a decent performer with the 302 V-8.

fintail

I bet if you approached Bonneville guy with say $3800 in cash, you'd be driving away in it. I like the colors of that car, and it appears fairly loaded - I see power seat too.

Lincoln seems like a deal for $2K if it starts drives and stops. I also notice it has digital dash.

fintail

Cool - my first car was a 66 Galaxie, and my dad had a 68 Fairlane among his hobby cars when I was a teen (I remember similar steering wheel to that 68 Galaxie). I have no desire to rekindle the experience of my first car - it was a 390 that was very thirsty and cold blooded. Sharp looking car anyway, but most were for 66.

fintail

My own project car got a little upgrade today:









(pics show how the color looks in different light)

berri

So, is that minivan your daily driver - just kidding!

fintail

Some old sales material showing similar tires:





I was thinking they might be too wide, but if they are, it is marginal, maybe 1cm.

fintail

Funny thing - there were a few 5-6 year old kids getting out of that Odyssey when I drove by, and one remarked "that's so cool!". The tires are pretty ostentatious - you notice the car now.

berri

I think the nice thing about your car is that it is "distinctively" an MB, wide whitewalls or not. Not as obvious on some of the newer models until you get up close.

boomchek

There we go, now it looks like it rolled off the showroom floor yesterday.

tjc78

I like it, really sets off the classic look of the car.

qbrozen

I like the pink Rambler... but not for that money.

If the RX7 is as nice as claimed, its a bargain, IMHO.

lemko

NICE!!! :shades:

xwesx

Agreed. The wide whites look fantastic on it.

fintail

Thanks for the compliments, everybody. They do really set off the car, and make it look nicer than it is - something the car has always done well. An even better 10 footer, now. They are so stark white, I assume they will mellow a little with time.

I think the whitewall is maybe 1cm (say 1/4-1/3 inch) too wide, maybe intended for Pontons. Probably nobody but an expert would notice this, so I shouldn't sweat it. My car is also a 220SE, not a lowline 190D or something, so they fit in. Also, W111 fintails are 1959 cars, made for several years later but virtually unchanged. The tires fit that time period, they do have some blackwall - not all the way to the ground like earlier tires.

The tires on this link look similar to mine (pamphlet from 1959-60)

Some period images of wide whitewall fintails, from a book I bought in Germany:







And the cover of a DVD I bought at the MB Museum:



This claim still give me a smirk: