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Comments
AWD hardware.
On a Haldex, the system is NOT engaged most of the time, therefore slight difference in tire circumference will not damage anything in the long run.
As far as safety, 95% of drivers never push their cars to the limits where the difference between full time AWD and on-demand AWD would make an ounce of difference. Also, most Subarus don't have the VDC system, only the high end Outback VDC and Tribeca. So, if you do manage to lose control in a car with Haldex + DSTC, you have a better chance of getting back on track than with a Subaru without VDC.
One of the best cars in the snow is the Toyota RAV-4, according to many reviews over the years. Has a lot to do with foot-print, weight distribution, tires, and a slew of other factors, not just the AWD system. But, in general, Subarus are very good in snow and other inclement conditions, much better than most SUVs. I know, because I own one now and have owned Subarus in the past.
cluelesspa: only on the older AWD systems paired to automatic transmissions. Models with VDC (including the Tribeca) do not have such a fuse.
Let's stick to the Tribeca here, because it's on topic, and because otherwise we'd be talking about 4 different systems (at least).
Jeff: very good point, you're more likely to get stuck because you've high-center on a pile of packed snow than anything.
-juice
Well, first we (sad, but you need a the b.f. or male family member w/you on the lot if you're a car-buying gal) went to the Toyota dealer to check out the Highlander. Looked nice from the outside. Inside was not bad (though the *6* cupholders in the 2nd row and copious plastic were minor annoyances). Also didn't like the metal running board that was detached, jutting out from the body of this '06 model. Looked like an accident waiting to happen when I stepped out of the vehicle since I have very thin feet and ankles.
Test-drive was the deal-breaker for me. Spent the time both as a passenger and driver. The sales guy was blasting classical music and I had to ask him to turn it off. Glad I did, b/c then I realized that the ride was distinctly noisier than my Lexus '93 GS. I had the sensation (esp. when driving on the freeway) that there was poor insulation from the floor of the vehicle to the road - most noise seemed to come from below my feet (whether driving or sitting in 2nd row). I hated that sensation (maybe my GS just spoiled me too much). On the plus side, I can say that the brakes were responsive (I was worried about this based on previous posts) and the vehicle handled well.
Disappointed, we then set out for the Nissan dealer in this "auto mall" area of LA that we were in. But on the way we stopped at the Lexus dealership and took a look at the RX 330. I had driven it as a loaner when taking in the GS to the shop, and was beginning to think it might be worth the extra $ b/c the ride is good. Well now I have a huge thing for the RX330. So much so that I skipped the Murano test drive and called it a day. I couldn't see how the Murano could beat the 330 in quality.
Now I'm looking over the options on the 330. My question for any of you is: am I right in curtailing the search? Should I be looking at something else? I am concerned that the Pilot is too big for me, so I had already decided not to visit the Honda dealer.
thoughts are appreciated -
:confuse:
Curren
As a woman, if you take your b.f. to the dealer and tell the salesperson you want to look at a car, and the salesperson starts to talk to the b.f., that's a good sign that you should find the sales manager and get another salesperson. Or just walk.
As far as the RX300, well, you have to listen to your gut....
Steve, Host
-juice
The Highlanders, Muranos, Tribecas, Pilots, and other mid-priced SUVs are all pretty nice, but not in the same league as the 330. If you plan on keeping your new car for a long time, and you can afford the 330, then it's a no-brainer - go with the 330. You do not want to wind up with a car that will be annoying and frustrating for the next 10 years.
-juice
Remember when the Lexus LS debuted? It was priced in the mid 30s IIRC.
-juice
typo ?
-juice
It has been a while since I posted over in the Subaru forums. I have a 2000 Outback Wagon, and a third child on the way. I fear I am going to have to trade it for a larger back seat since I need to put 2 boosters and an infant carrier back there and it is not going to happen with the OB.
I have been looking at the Pilot and Highlander, any other suggestions for not more than 32K?
-Howard
Is this close enough to $32K for you?
http://www.subaru.com/shop/overview.jsp?model=B9_TRIBECA&trim=7-PASSENGER&command=overview- - - -
If you can live with the 5-passenger model:
http://www.subaru.com/shop/overview.jsp?model=B9_TRIBECA&trim=5-PASSENGER
Just trying to keep you in the Subaru family.
Bob
Keep the kid and trade the wagon instead!
If you do decide to go outside the Subaru family, as a satisfied Highlander owner I can say the HL is a great vehicle; has a relatively large back seat and back seat area; I'd imagine it'll work for the kids even as they grow older. With aggressive negotiating you can get even a Limited HL for 32K before TTL from what I've been reading on the Prices Paid and Buying Experiences discussion; base HLs start at around 25K. Consider getting the third row seat option.
The Pilot is very good too; somewhat larger than the HL; check both out to see which appeals to you the most! Also consider the Honda Odyssey minivan if you haven't done so already. In any case bring the three child seats to the dealer to make sure they will all fit.
The Tribeca's 2nd row is wide and had a 40/20/40 split, so it feels like 3 individual seats. Try it out.
What I'd suggest is you take your child seats with you when you go shopping. See how they fit. You may not need a 3rd row.
Pilot is probably the widest in this group, but check it out, each child safety seat has a different fit so see what works.
Good luck.
-juice
Our older child has already moved into a booster seat, which uses the regular seat belts from the vehicle.
I think that by the time a 3rd child is born, the oldest is usually already in a booster (40 lbs is the weight).
So this might be OK. You could put the booster in the middle, because that child is also likely the most agile, and could get themselves seated, while the two young 'uns would need help so they'd be outboard where you can load them up.
I wish these offered built-in booster, I think only the Volvo XC90 does in this segment, and even then it's only one, in the middle seat. The Volvo V70 wagon offered two at one point. That would be ideal - two boosters on the outer seats and then the baby in the middle with LATCH to secure him/her.
-juice
I would try the Tribeca - but my wife is going to drive it and she does not like its looks. I will try to get her into one anyway to DRIVE it and check it out next time we are there for an oil change - I will have a captive audience.
Right now the oldest is in a Britax booster. When we get the new car in 4-6 months, the idea is to have the two oldest in the boosters, with the baby in the infant seat. I was hoping to get the boosters in the outboard positions, and the baby in the middle rear facing.
I will certainly bring all seats to the dealer to try the fit.
Britax rates one of their boosters at 33 lbs, and 38" height. Since my second child is at this point now, and can sit in her older sister's booster with knees bent properly, she will be fine in the booster in 5 months. Right now she rides in a Britax Husky, which is a HUGE seat intended to be used as a 5-point harness seat for a child from 33 to 100 pounds.
I will keep you posted. After I find the right vehicle, my next hurdle will be negociating - I have never been good at it, but I am determined to get a good deal this time!!!
-Howard
Steve, Host
Odd, because in profile they look similar. Go figure.
Good luck and let us know what you end up with.
-juice
(20/28 Ody, 19/27 Sienna) versus
18/24 2WD or 17/22 4WD Pilot (8-passenger),
19/25 2WD or 18/24 4WD Highlander (5-passengers only)
and power is plentiful, much more than your Outback Wagon. You can have an Odyssey EX with leather, heated seats, power sliding doors, roof rack, 6-Disc CD changer, Dual Automatic Climate Controls, Rear A/C, 244 horsepower, and split-fold magic seat for under $31k, within your limits! Please consider a van, at least drive one before your purchase!!!
-juice
That's better than the above SUVs, and much faster than all of them! If I didn't have a new car, I'd look at them, and I'm a Honda guy!
-juice
I am in Denver and its down to the wire tonight for a Highlander 3.3 V6 AWD 3rd Row vs. the Honda Pilot LX. I went in assuming that I would get the HL since we rented it a few times on business and loved it but, right now I am thinking the Pilot and the lowest trim LX has a ton of options and they are quoting me $27,045 which is pretty good in Denver. Toyota folks have been arrogant jerks and basically point me to the web site for the price and will not budge on anything and not really give any numbers to chew on.
I head to Toyota one last time tomorrow and if I get the same run-around, I will head across the street to Honda and get the Pilot. We have driven both and rides are good for each. We did dabble in the new bigger 2006 RAV4 2 days ago and found the ride to be too rough and still a bit tight.
Read Edmunds Vehicle overview for the HL vs. Pilot and my sense is that the Pilot is ahead by a nose. Only downside I can see is the Pilot is a bit more heavy and loses out in MPG by about 2
Jim
Steve, Host
I like the HL but unless you get a fantastic deal your timing is bad. When you sell it, it will seem older than it is.
-juice
These are all fine vechicles and each has it's strength's and flaws. For me if I'm going to get 4WD or AWD I want something that is capable in that area. HL, Pilot and Subaru's are known to be better than average. Murano unfortunately suffers in that area, although excels in others. But overall it's too pricey. The Highlander unfortunately has what I call a fatal flaw. My left knee hits the door in such a way that my knee cap ends up being the point of contact. This is annoying even on short trips, so scratch that. B-9 looks like an Edsel backed into a Murano at high speed and then was beaten badly with the ugly stick. Also no roof rails, only cross bars which lack versatility for kayak/bike. Pilot has lots of room but I hate the headrest which is just plain not comfortable. Also looks like a box on wheels.
I'm still kicking these vehicles around on my short list but I've also added the Toyota 4Runner. Even though it is a truck body and not a cross-over which I assume is the focus of the others vehicles. But it really is my favorite of them all. It has the best 4WD system by far, plenty of passenger room and comfort, looks really cool (certainly more manly than B-9 or HL - which can be important when you are going through a mid-life crisis like I am), and did I say looks really cool - oh yeah I did. Also handles really well in all road conditions. The only draw back is the mpgs. But you can get one easily under 30K and even get a limited under 35K.
Well I certainly have more obsessing to do.
tx
- Jeffer
Other than that suggestion, maybe just wait for the new Highlander or see if the rumor that Subaru's revising the B9's nose comes true. *shrug*
Good luck!
So the OB is definitely a contender, only problem is that it's a little tight for me. When I first heard about th B-9 I had my hopes up, and my fingers crossed, that it would be the answer to all my prayers. But alas someone uncaged that ugly stick and gave it a beatin' to my utter dismay. Looks are not everything but they do count.
As far as the OB it is still on the list and the '05/'06's seem to be roomier than previous years. I will be test driving one (or more) soon, along with the 4runner which I've already driven 3x's.
I had a bad experience with a turbo Mustang once and I don't know if I can get over that so if I do go with the OB it would be the 3.0 or maybe, just maybe the 2.4 if my frugal sense kicks in.
OTOH I could get a decent 4Runner for the same price as a high-end OB or B-9 so that makes it a very tough choice. My wallet still hurts a little though from those $3.59/gallon last fall. I currently get combined 22mpg (rated 20/28 for my Maxima).Then again maybe waiting for something new on the horizon might be the smart thing to do. In any case I think more testing is in order.
Thanks for the recommendations ;-)
Jeffer
tx
jeffer
Not sure how much bigger the newer ones are inside, but they seem less puffy-looking in the interior (& exterior), which helps you feel like you've got more space, I think. Plus the design is much cleaner, which also helps it feel more open.
Hmm... checked some numbers. Overall size on the new models is about an inch longer, wider and taller, plus an inch more ground clearance. Cargo room is slightly smaller (but supposedly more usefully shaped) and passenger room is slightly larger. The 6-cyl's mileage is 19/26... pretty close to your Maxima. Not bad for adding the extra weight of a wagon plus AWD.
Glad to see Outback's on your list - it's at least worth a look. Gotta figure out if you want rugged offroad capability (4Runner) or better everyday handling with occasional rough-road capability (Outback).
To throw another option out there, there's the new Toyota FJ Cruiser coming soon, too. Based on your list, maybe not refined enough for what you're looking for, though. Too rugged/sporty?
I like the HL but unless you get a fantastic deal your timing is bad. When you sell it, it will seem older than it is.
jimyuko though I value ateixeira's opinions my take is get the car you like, don't worry whether it's a "lame duck" compared with the RAV4 or anything else (unless if you really like the RAV4 in which case get a RAV4!!).
As a proud owner of an '01 HL I and many others on the HL forums can attest that the HL is a car people fall in love with! Follow your heart.
Also please be aware that while edmunds says the HL will be redesigned in 2007 Motor Trend says it will be redesigned in 2008, so it's not clear when the HL will be redesigned IMO.
Get a Chase Subaru Master Card, and you get 3% back in Subaru Bucks, and the cool thing is you can use those to buy accessories. I've accumulated $600 so far, which is more than enough for both of the racks you express interest in.
OE fitment for the racks is a beautiful thing.
-juice
It's pretty plain looking, I'm surprised it can even provoke such emotions in you that you'd call it ugly.
-juice
-juice
-juice
Seems like FORD should sell the Kubang...
Drive it home, park it in your garage, then...
KUBANG!
It bursts into flames...
Sorry, now back to your regularly scheduled programming.