Honda Civic Real World MPG

ruking1

Yes to chime in here, UOA's @ Bobistheoilguy.com will probably tell a WAY different story. Those types of filters let way more (SI aka silicon, DIRT) in the intake systems and wind up with a greater contamination than if one stuck with oem air filters.

whitewolf

Shipo
That is exactly the reason I decided to try it for myself. Because these items are regarded as performance modifications they only list increased horsepower and performance ratings. I will admit that after putting them on I originally experienced lower mpg but that was because I was driving much more aggressively. But being an older driver I eventually returned to my original driving style and found a marked increase in fuel economy. Probably not enough to justify the costs unless I keep the car for 10+ years or gas goes to $4 a gal or more. I only commute 22 miles a day. But it does make the car a little more fun to drive.

Regards
Whitewolf

tiff_c

Probably not enough to justify the costs unless I keep the car for 10+ years or gas goes to $4 a gal or more.

Considering gas will be over $4 a gallon this summer I'd say you don't have long to wait.

ruking1

..."Debunking the K&N Myth - Why OEM is Better
For decades, the aftermarket hot rod, racing and tuning communities have relied on oiled-media filters to free up that extra few horsepower. In fact, it's often one of the FIRST modifications many automotive enthusiasts do to their car.
This report shows, with empirical data and sound reasoning, why OEM filters perform better in a variety of areas.

Special thanks to Arlen Spicer and all others involved in making this information available."....

link title

Actually if you google, there are a lot of articles out there. On all the vehicles that I have when I have researched the subject of oil air filter media 100% have focused on the same issues. Indeed on the Z06 Corvette, the issues were the so called "snow prophalacytic" which in this example was a plastic cover which some would say "severely" limited air flow. Two solution cost literally ZERO, which in effect removed the prophalytic 1. cut round holes in the offending cover- use the oem air filter 2. remove the cover and cable tie the oem air filter . Dyno's were run and in addition dyno's was run with oil filter media and NO filter. There was literally NO statistical correlation, once the prophalacytic was "removed". Longer term the UOA's will speak for themselves. Greater contamination with the oil air filter media.

kevman3

Just went over 10,000 miles on 2008 EX-L. Still getting steady 33MPH every tank driving 100 miles per day from Jersey shore into NYC. Mostly highway, though 15 minutes a day rolling into the tunnels. Loving the car.

kipk

>"Shipo and KipK you guys should really try some aftermarket products before you discourage their use. You have been around here for awhile and people do listen to you."

whitewolf,

I have been trying aftermarket products since my first car (39 Ford coupe) in 1956. Been involved with some type of "Performance" ever since then.

In days of carburetors, centrifical and vacumn advanced ignition timing, and so forth, there were indeed things that could be done to increase both performance and mileage.

With modern cars and the variable cam/valve timing, ignition timing, fuel delivery, while dealing with catalytic converters and the such; Times have Changed! Manufacturers spend seriously big bucks in their quest for both high mileage and performance. Their engineers spend all day, every working day, in an attempt to make things better and more appealing to the purchaser. They have the very latest equipment available to them.

The amounts as well as the timing of air flow into and exiting an engine are researched from every angle in controlled conditions. They are concerned with mileage, performance, and engine longevity.

Ever wonder why the performance models of various cars with the same displacement engines also have lower EPA ratings than their lower powered counterparts? There just are not any free lunches any more.

If a freerer flowing intake system would increase performance and fuel mileage while maintaining longevity and meeting EPA standards, you can bet the farm that Honda, Toyota and others would jump all over them. They are in the performance, mileage, and durability business. Occasionally, with all their experience, testing, and equipment they are able to actually improve both performance and mileage.
Wonder why a Ram intake and freerer flowing air filter are not in the mix?

We like to think that getting a bit more intake noise from the engine and a lot more noise from the exhaust is increasing performance. We have been told that it does, and it sounds like it does. I would love to see certified charts and grafts proving the horsepower and mileage gains, throughout the RPM range of a Ram intake vs a stock one. The amount of contaminates through a K&N type filter vs OEM would be great, along with its charts of gain. Show me that and I will be in line to get them. Performance is in my DNA. However, I'm no longer interested in gaining a few HP at red line while giving up mileage and longevity.

Gotta keep in mind that simply saying an engine produces 10 additional horse power can be very misleading. Is that 10 HP at redline? What happens in the rest of the RPM range. Do we normally drive the car at that extra HP range of RPM?

I've got a tackle box full of lures >"Guaranteed" , by the manufacturer, to catch more fish. They don't. A drawer full of kitchen knives that never get dull, they do! A government that says taking guns away from law abiding citizens reduces crime, it doesn't.

In '96 I bought a new Dodge ram with the 360Cubic Inch V8. In '97 a close friend bough a new Ram with a 318 cubic inch V8. They felt about the same in everyday driving. Eventually, We just had to test them against each other. There was a safe place to do that. There was enough room to reach about 90mph before brakes became necessary We tried them 3 times. We left the line pretty much neck and neck and held positions the entire time. Twice I beat him by about 1/2 a truck length. Once he beat me about the same. So we figured it to be a wash. I had a bit more torque for towing, but he got a bit better mileage and for everyday driving there was no real difference in performance. He then spent about $300 in a "Cat Back" dual exhaust system with some type of free flow and great sounding. mufflers that were "Tuned" to the system. Of course, that meant another test.

Again 3 tries. This time by 60 mph I was ahead about 3 truck lengths. Near the finish line he began to gain, but I still beat him more that a full truck length, All 3 times. What we learned is that the exhaust apparently did give him some gain at high RPM but he lost considerable torque at lower RPM. Later he told me that when towing his boat the tranny shifted a lot more than it did with the stock exhaust. His truck still "Sounds" good. :shades:

Obviously you are happy with your purchases. And that is a good thing!

Kip

mattchew

I have found with smaller engine cars such as my 1.6 litter 2000 Civic Hatchback DX with 150,000 HARD miles that I can get between 26MPG and 47MPG all depending on how I drive. It takes some crazy driving to get as low as 26. I mean hitting 7000 rpm's most times accelerating or traveling at 100+ MPH. This car will go 115mph or so in forth gear(slows down in 5th with foot to floor), but it looks like a dark cloud in the rear view mirror. I have driven this thing hard and I think I likes it. But also it can get great gas mileage. It's best speed is about 40MPH in forth gear. I think if you never stopped slowed or climmed hills it would get over 50MPG at 40MPH. But going with the wind traveling about 55MPH for 450 boring miles I was able to get 47 MPG. When you are calculating use the same gas station for a while I even use the same pump if possible. I have found a Phillips 66 that if I get gas there I get much worse gas mileage. I think they are cheating you at the pump. I found another Phillips 66 that I get the best mileage from. Dont understand it completely. I check it by filling at the same station many times.

In order to get the highest mileage I use techniques like: Keeping tire pressure slightly high, Dusting out air filter with compressed air, cleaning spark plugs with wire brush and alcohol, keeping unneeded weight out of car, coasting down hill in N with 5 speed only, traffic light timing so I dont have to stop the car, Drafting be hind Semi's on the freeway(somewhat dangerous at close distances), buying gas in the morning so you get the most fuel, driving 55-60 instead of 75mph. I estimate that in my car Highway driving speeds and mileage as follows:

55MPH gets about 47MPG
60MPH gets about 45MPG
65MPH gets about 41MPG
70MPH gets about 36MPH
75MPH gets about 32MPH
80MPH gets about 31MPG
85MPH gets about 30MPG
90MPH gets about 28MPG
95-100MPH gets about 26MPG
Also A/C kills about 1-3 MPG

Taking it easy in town I have gotten 40MPG
an tearing the tires up I have gotten 28MPG

Sitting at Idle burned about 3.5 gallons in 5 and a half hours with A/C on. :shades:

shc37

I'm still on my first tank of gas so idk the mileage...but driving the highway today I noticed that I'm hitting 3000 RPMs going about 65-68MPH. Is that normal? Cause I don't recall being in a car that hit the RPMs like that on the highway especially. Was wondering as I was figuring out the mileage in my head and then saw how the RPMs were high and thus probably eating more gas.

targettuning

I would say that is normal since this is a fixed computation ( final axle ratio and transmission gear ratios,especially 5th, contribute to this RPM at those speeds). The 5 speed automatic runs considerably slower (RPM) at those speeds. We have an automatic and off the top of my head I would say it is turning around 1000 RPM slower at 65 mph....maybe more. I seem to recall 1900-1950 RPM.

drmbb

I have a 2007 EX/AT sedan. Mine sits right around 2200-2300 rpm at 70 mph on level pavement. The standard transmission is geared differently, and I would expect it would rev higher at the same cruise speed.

thegraduate

The Civic (2006-present) runs just under 1000RPM per 30 MPH, so at 65, it'd be between 2100 and 2200 RPM. Very low relative to the manual, and the main reason that the automatic gets better highway economy than the manual.

shc37

Thanks for the info everyone....I figured as much cause it's usually pretty short shifting for me driving around town and just from looking at the fuel economy numbers. Seemed like a 6th gear wouldn't have hurt...But I did want to double check anyways cause the only time I've seen a car hi 3000 RPM was in my parents Honda Passport when it was misfiring and gave the RPMs like a 500-600 jump. It is also my first car so I wanted to make sure I didn't destroy something already

ruking1

Last 5 tank full's average: 39.37 per gal. The majority of the miles are done during the 5 day/7 days commute slough.

(range of fill from 9.186-10.47 gals) ( 38.39, 40.9, 38.94, 38.99, 39.63 mpg, tire pressure 35 psi F/R)

Geez winter is tough on mpg! :lemon: we can't wait till they sell the NON winter blends! (aka, 1-2 mpg better) :shades:

Just changed the air filter @ 61,000 miles (OEM recommended, 30,000 miles). The oem provided air filter with 4 miles on the clock was dirty, but not overly so. The clean side was literally dust less with even a white cloth (soapy water) wipe down.

kork13

So just to get back into the forum (I've been silent for a while...), my '07 Si and I have been averaging a solid 32.3 mpg in the 10800 miles I've had her (since brand new). I've tracked mpg pretty carefully, so I'm mostly confident in the accuracy...

I will say that if I'm just cruising down the highway at ~67-69 mph, I can easily get 35+ mpg. my last 2 tanks have been just that, and I've gotten 35.1 and 35.8 mpg (respectively). Not bad for an Si, considering the EPA range was estimated at 28-31.

Where I get hit for mpg is around town (stupid stoplights...), and anytime I decide to play for more than just a few seconds... hehehe if I'm driving aggressively with the engine (sticking well above 4k rpms), I can easily cut mpg down to 25 if I'd like to (normally don't, just for how expensive that would get...)

tiff_c

So just to get back into the forum (I've been silent for a while...), my '07 Si and I have been averaging a solid 32.3 mpg in the 10800 miles I've had her (since brand new). I've tracked mpg pretty carefully, so I'm mostly confident in the accuracy...

That's really good because my 2008 Si hasn't gotten better than 26mpg ever! I drive it pretty carefully and 70 mph on the highway. We don't have much city here so that's a minor issue.
I'd love to be getting 32mpg! Maybe once it's broken in and not using winter fuel.
Hopefully, since last 2 tanks with leadfoot lucy (my wife) driving it have gotten 18.? and 19.? mpg! :sick:
Oh and I use the same gas station and try for teh same pump each time. I think I will switch brands next fillup and see if it helps.

shc37

I just filled up and got 7.22 gallons. For about a 60/40 city/highway driving, I'm at 31 or 32 MPG. That's the range since the salesman reset the meter when he was showing me everything before handing over the keys, so it didn't account for any miles I went during a quick test drive, or any miles the porter might have driven when washing and gassing it up. I just subtracted from the official mileage number given on the paperwork to give myself the higher number when calculating.

'08 manual LX, btw

ruking1

When the car is new you have so many things going on that it is hard to really know what variables are at work. The average of the first 10,000 miles will give you a good baseline.

psdxoh

I drive pretty conservatively - moderate acceleration, coasting when I see a redlight ahead, and only going over 4,000 rpm when merging or passing. My driving is 75% highway & 25% urban and I calculate MPG at every fill-up. My MPG extremes have been 30 and 32, with the overall average at 31.6 over 2700 miles. I have not taken a trip so I don't know the highway mileage.

shc37

Definitely....I figure after some break-in it'll improve some. Also once I get the kinks out of my manual driving skills it should help :P First car I've driven stick in full-time. It's been faily painless since one of our other cars in the family is a stick, but I have had some stalls, and some extra throttle given sometimes as I work on finding the right combo of gas and clutch. But still, can't complain as I have already beat the EPA combined mileage estimates.

ruking1

Glad to hear that! There are a fair amount of folks (on this thread) that for whatever the reasons are less than happy with the mileage they are getting. Honda does pretty well between the spread of mpg between the stick and auto. It seems the manual is good for @ least 1 if not 2 mpg better.

ruking1

..."Last 5 tank full's average: 39.37 per gal. The majority of the miles are done during the 5 day/7 days commute slough. ...

Just changed the air filter 61,000 miles (OEM recommended, 30,000 miles). The oem provided air filter with 4 miles on the clock was dirty, but not overly so. The clean side was literally dust less with even a white cloth (soapy water) wipe down. "...

Average for app a 1000 miles trip to LA and back, after the oil change and 60k maintenance interval , was 39.67 mpg. LA is of course legendary for traffic jams.

oc2233

Hello all.

I just joined this site today and have been reading through some of these posts.
I have a 2007 Civic Coupe EX. It has only 3000 miles on it so far and i bought it new in august.

Ive been monitoring my mpg at each fill-up and it has yet to even see the 30mpg that it claims to get in the city, let alone highway. I am usually getting between 25-28mpg. My ration is probably around 60%city/40%highway.

Anyone else run into this problem? I am not an aggressive driver, i gradually accelerate from a stop, and on the highway I am usually around 70mph. Just wondering why im not receiving the mileage i should be per gallon. Any ideas?

Thanks you

ruking1

As a point of departure, you might want back up to msg # 1416, the (now) 690+ owners Civic mpg survey.

..."I am usually getting between 25-28mpg"...

oc2233

Thanks for the tip!

I see that others do get the same mileage as I am now. I'm thinking I may just need to get some more miles on it and get it broken in.

ras314

I noticed new break in related posts, so will add mine. Over winter I saw little change in mpg (after mobile 1 oil change) but noticable increase in torque by 7000 or so miles. Weather now warmer and maybe a 1/2 % or better mpg is showing at 10,000 miles or more. My overall is creeping towards 43 mpg, probably 95 % hwy with good bit of 55 mph. civic 5 speed coupe. Btw, not much mileage in winter cause it gets stuck in driveway. lol

kork13

I do a few things that boost my mpg more than most... First, i drive with my tires just a bit over-inflated, at 35 psi rather than the 33 recommended. Also, i drive quite conservatively, normally keeping the RPMs between 2.5k-3.1k. Since I live in the foothills of the Rockies, I'm able to take advantage of the hills, and do alot of coasting--essentially free miles for the mpg calculation.

I'll also agree that over time, the longer i've had my car the better the mpg have been... probably an improvement of about 1-2 mpg in the average since I first bought her.

ruking1

So what is the mpg that you have boosted it to?

jcanavera

Currently averaging between 32-34 mpg

ruking1

Cool!!

35 psi is NOT "over inflated". My owners manual basically says 35 psi is the recommendation for so called high speed operation.

They of course (boiler plate) do not recommend going over the speed limits.

kork13

Yea, that's what I've actually been seeing... I can't really venture to guess what it would be if I kept my tires at 33, drove with the RPMs a little higher, and didn't coast like I do... best guess, I might lose 2-3 mpg...

Though I think what really helps me the most is keeping my speed down... at 68 mph cruising, I get ~35 mpg. Today I drove some friends back from the airport going ~65, and got 36 mpg. When I go 70-75 or so, it drops to 30-32. So I think speed is probably the biggest player for me. The limit is 75 mph here in CO, but people don't really mind me going slower as long as I stay in the right lane.

but in any case, doing what i've been doing works really well for me. I'm economical when I want to be, and when I want to play, that option is very wide open to me -- which I frequently take advantage of...

kork13

odd.. my manual, and in the door-jam, it calls for 33 psi.

ruking1

You also might want to cover for the greater audience the operating conditions in CO (altitudes) . Frankly, I am not sure if they still do high altitude blends of RUG to PUG. I have filled a PUG and D2 vehicle of late (in CO) but did not pay any attention to the blending issue.

ruking1

No, it is not odd at all. My D/S door jam says 30 psi. However in the context of better mpg, PSI is a variable. Generally in the "correct" range, higher psi tends to yield better mpg.

Of course one can pick and chose what variables to pay attention to or ignore for a host of reasons. One can employ ZERO to all techniques. This thread is a good place for discussion.

kork13

I don't know any specifics about it, but if it's any response to what you're asking, all of the stations around here are required to have a fuel blend with a higher level of ethanol. I believe the standard blend is 10% ethanol, whereas here in CO it's mandated to be at least 15% -- some stations are as high as 18-20%. I think it's the same between regular, mid, and premium grades of fuel.

I'm not sure what that does for the fuel, engine, environment, etc. though... Is that what you were referencing about high-altitude fuel blends?

ruking1

What makes your stated mpg more significant; is over all @ altitude, (normally aspirated engines: to which Civic's ARE) performance (mpg among others) is zapped and pollution is greater. (@ other than sea level) (to which this things are measured)

chillipepper1

I have an 07 LX sedan/auto trans with just over 10,000 miles on it. For the first 3000 miles with air conditioning on, I averaged between 31 and 35 MPG (34avg).
I then increased the tire pressure to 35 psi and the weather permitted me to run without AC and have averaged 37 MPG for the last 7000 miles. Some of this gain is the tire pressure, but a lot is due to not running the AC. My driving is 80% highway commute. I live in Dallas, so the highway miles include a lot of stop and go. I generally drive between 40MPH and 60 MPH and never go over 65 MPH. I think all of you that get less than 30 mpg either are driving a lot of city miles or drive with a heavy foot.

shc37

So my second tank, I'm up to 33 MPG. That was a definite surprise because I did not push the transmission into 5th gear as often and I also let the engine rev a little more as I was getting past the initial break-in period of keeping revs low. Pretty happy as my fillup was still under $27 for close to two weeks of driving!

dwjones

I have a 2008 Honda Civic EX-L automatic. So far, a bit over 2,000 miles. Here's what I have experienced for gas milage;

Worst tank: 19.6 MPG
Best tank: 44.3 MPG
Average: 34.7 MPG

Generally, I've been averaging 28-29 MPG in city driving, which is suburban driving for me. On the highway, I can get 42-43 MPG if I set the cruise control at 65 MPH. At 75 MPH I get 37-38 MPG.

hammer00

I bought my LX a couple months ago. I have around 1500 miles on it. The first tank I got around 29 MPG with 60/40 hwy/city driving and using the cruise control between 65-70 mph. It was cold, below freezing most of the time and I had to use my defrost. Now I'm driving a little more aggressive, still babying it though, and after 4 tanks of gas or so I'm getting 30.6 combined. The temp is still kinda cold, I live on the Canadian Border. Also I use 10% ethanol gas which is up to $3.39 per gallon. So, its breaking in, the weather is a little warmer, and I think if I bought the non-ethanol gas and I drove straight HWY, I might see 35 mpg. It seems like I can drive 375 miles on a tank then I need to get gas. A co-worker says she can fill up and drive 510 miles on her '06 civic coupe. Not sure if I believe her, do you?

ruking1

It would depend what 510 miles on fills means. So for example on 13.2 gals Civic fuel tank capacity (using .2 gal left in tank) , that is 39.23 mpg. Some folks also like to play the fill it to it overflows then stop game. Me... first click off and I am good to go.

The last fill we did on a 2004 (approaching 62,000 miles) was 39.9 mpg, @ 10.9 or 435 miles. This would translate to 519 miles (13 gal with 13.2 gal capacit) . My take is when the fuel lamp is lit, ya best be looking to fuel. But even I have to admit part of this is " the game". Funny how the ones who probably know and care the least about cars are the ones who takes the greatest chances of running out of fuel. Today not only is running out of fuel dangerous, but it can cost you more due to potentially failed parts.

kipk

>"...Funny how the ones who probably know and care the least about cars are the ones who takes the greatest chances of running out of fuel. Today not only is running out of fuel dangerous, but it can cost you more due to potentially failed parts"

I agree! A car is going to get a given MPG, whether we wait until it is running on fumes, or gas up with a couple of gallons, or more, still in the tank.

Kip

diane20

Do you have any thoughts on why the 19.6? I am looking at buying a Civic, but am concerned about the low gas mileage. My 2005 Civic gets 38 MPG city driving only. I know I won't get that, but I am concerned about getting 25 MPG or less.

dwjones

The 19.6 was a fill-up of less than a full tank (necessary because of a planned trip) and it was all city driving. An anomaly, I think. I just filled up again under similar circumstances and got 26.2 MPG. From my experience, 25+ MPG for suburban driving is easierly attainable. 28-29 is probably more realistic. 43 MPG on the highway at 65 MPH is realistic as well, as I have duplicated this 3 times.

aravind99

Hi,
I bought my LX last saturday.
What kind of gas I have to fill? Is it regular unleaded?, Thanks

ruking1

RUG. All the best with your new machine.

It is best however to take the time to both go over the oem owner's manual and spend some time understanding how your car is physically laid out-especially under the hood for at least the minimum stuff : like, battery, brake, windshield washer, oil, coolant, power steering, auto/manual trans- FLUIDS. etc., etc.

brw115

I have owned my 2007 EX for about thirteen months now- and have about 24,000 miles , driving mostly Interstate Highway. No matter how careful I drive or how careless I drive, this car gets 34 MPG. This is a very consistent average both in Winter and Summer Driving.

shc37

Continuing my documentation of my MPG progression.....up to 35.5 MPG the last tank. Was excited that I filled up the tank for $28 even with gas up to like $3.30

shc37

Just documenting for myself since the thread has died a bit....but yesterday filled up and got 36.12 MPG. Surprising too since my hockey season ended and there's less highway driving.

evped

First tank on my new Civic EX Sedan automatic was exactly 38mpg. Mostly highway below 70mph. Very happy.

will26

Filled up yesterday and got 34. It keeps going up as it gets warmer out. I was hovering around 28-30 all winter.
Question. How often do you guys change the air filter? I saw today on Good Morning America that you should change it at every oil change. They said it improves gas milage by 15%.