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Comments
I've included actual emails too.
The begining
Hi J,
I will be happy to sell you one at factory invoice. What are your other color choices?
------ ------------
Fleet / Internet Manager
Camelback VW Subaru
877-***-****
k sounds good... so I sent
I'm going to be in the next few hours to look at your 7p limted back with nav.
FYI
J
...and recieved
Please be sure and ask for me when you get here. I will try to be available but must let you know that I am pretty booked up with appointments today, but I can get one of my peers to assist you . The key is to ask for me, ---------- in Fleet Sales so that we can get you some fleet pricing!
So I grab a friend and drive 90 miles to the dealership to pick up the car
I go in i tell them I am working with ------- and want said car for the price we agreed on... invoice. They say ---------- is busy so they will help me. Sit around for over an hour as we do the credit stuff, approved ready to go.
Then he comes back with a price and some payments written down with a big marker, it is about 3400 over invoice, payments are a bargain at 690/mo lease.
I'm pretty nice about it, and say this must be a mistake the price should be invoice, and it looks like the money factor might be a little high can i see what the MF is. Sales person says he doesn't know what I'm talking about what is a MF he says (Thsi should have tipped me off). anyways he goes back to the glass room of financial people, etc...
Comes back with the SAME price, but lower payments 650/mo (Hell sign me up!) ha ha ha, I'm like i SAID incoice. he says well we can't do better then this price. I imidiatly get up and walk out, and he chases after.
I'm pretty pissed at this point, like I said I drove 90 miles for this? i know in my head I could play this back and forth game for a few hours and maybe get back near invoice but not without a lot of work on my part and a lot of games. but I don't want to do this, I had the price agreed on, and I'm really not interesting in wasting my time like that.
So on my way out I see the room a dudes that are messing with me on the other end and I throw up a middle finger their direction as I'm leaving the lot.
Then this guy comes running out yelling at me, gets in my face, fists clentched and viens popping out everywhere, spitting a little bit, swearing a lot. His secratary holds him back.
I scream back "....Invoice...scam....bait and switch....games...3400 over invoice....90 miles"
Anyways that was going no where and he obviously wanted me to leave, so I did. enough said. Except I thought I should drop and email to -------.
shortly after I send...
Hey -------- what's up?
I came in and had an excellent conversation with your owner, kind gentlemen, kind of soft spoken, but I found him to the point. Anyways I was wondering whatever happened to "I will be happy to sell you one at Factory Invoice"? Seems as though when I talked to sales they didn't want to go below $400 over MSRP. That seem highly unreasonable don't you think? I don't want to split hairs but there seems to be a slight $3400 difference between what you told me and what your dealership was willing to do.
J
almost a week later i hear back...
You have to schedule an appointment with me to get my pricing. I can sell you the car at the price I quoted. But you have to see me. I work by appointment only.
So aparently it is my fault they tried to mess with me, and you need to schedule an apointment NOT to get scammed. I wrote back
well a guy who claimed to be your owner threatened to kick my a-- in the parking lot so I think I'm going to pass.
then he writes...
Apparently, according to my staff there was an obscene gesture displayed on your part. Good thing it was the owner, if you had done that to me, I would have probably followed through!
Good luck on your search.
awesome, so aparently flipping out on customers you are trying to mess with is policy at Camelback Subaru and VW in Phoenix Arizona
step one - in the process is to wear you down by going back and forth for at LEAST 2 hrs.
step two - play the sympathy card .. below this final price I would be losing money! you dont want me to lose money.
step three - come-on are you going to walk for only $800! ... (umm yeah)
step 4 - you leave and they either call you back that day or the next day with pricing they couldn't offer when you were there because they (ahem) called around and got a better price for your trade in ... (insert some other excuse).
-----------------
So I think you were justified at flipping them the bird. and I think the owner over reacted to your gesture.
The thing I read that I think is the loop hole they used is this:
If you & the dealer was using the term FACTORY INVOICE - that was the problem.
Typically FACTORY INVOICE refers to the invoice on the window of the car which is full retail.
DEALER INVOICE - is what you thought they were offering - which is what the dealer pays the factory before they get their over-rides and other allowances.
They knew what you meant - but by playing along they got you in there in the hope of closing a sale.
It is like something SOA and other factories do. SOA was advertising very low interest rate of I think 1.9%. Sounds pretty good until you read the fine print where it states for that rate the loan term is limited to (I think it was) to 18 months.
Is it deceptive - not really. Do I like those tactics - not at all. But it gets people into the dealership.
Remember - do your your home and assume you will be lied to.
That said, clearly you didn't get treated right by anyone there. I'd say it's their fleet manager's fault for having you come in without an appointment. (My dealership is similar... gotta make an appointment w/that person, as no other salespeople are authorized to deal at those prices - though I imagine you could come pretty close. However, I don't think my dealership would try to get $400 over MSRP... I was treated very fairly when purchasing from others there in the past.) Sounds like what happened to you is an extreme case of what happens at most "old-school" dealers... they just don't really listen to what you're saying. And obviously verbal threats of physical violence aren't appropriate in any business situation. If there were other customers there, I wonder how they felt after witnessing this.
Try posting over in the forum "Subaru B9 Tribeca (B9X)" for "Karen in AZ". She's very smart about Subie research and am sure she could direct you to a quality dealer in the Phoenix area... probably the same one she purchased hers from!
Sorry 'bout your lousy experience.
That is +$1,273 from Edmund's invoice ($31,921)
and -$1,356 from dealer's MSRP ($34,550)
Payed the car cash (no lease or loan).
The car was on the Dealer's lot and was delivered to me promptly. Was a good buying experience, although I realize that perhaps I could have pushed the price lower according to some of the posts here...The Edmunds TMV price seems not accurate?
The dealer which I recommend is CitySide Subaru, Belmont, MA.
Comments on the deal appreciated, thanks
There is ONE dealer in Pittsburgh downtown that wouldn't budge from $1200 over Invoice. I said OK bye :P and went to another dealer.
Jerry
Jerry
Edmund's invoice is off for at least the NE. The sales guy was very happy to sell to me at invoice so the 'invoice' price is padded like a bra.
7 pass LTD, DVD+NAV, rear bumper cover, compass mirror, roof rack, rubber mats
$1100@signing which includes all taxes, fees + first mo. lease payment, $502 for 36 mo., $494 for 39 mo. -- 12K miles. Good lease deal?
-juice
In Wisconsin I'm paying 496.00 per month - 36 months zero down - 12k per year + 90.00 for title & plates.
I have 7 pass: nav, hitch, dimming mirror, shock sensor, F & R bumper guards, puddle light, winter mats, cargo net
ok price. not close to $500 over invoice though. I suggest Get financing before going to the dealer.
Does anyone know how much a 45K mile maintenance costs?
Would you mind telling me exactly what you paid? I'm looking at the 5passLTD too.
I have a true dealer cost of $30,219. including the xtras I want: Protection Group I, Aero Xbar, Puddle Lites, Auto-dim mirror/compass & hood protector. This price also includes a $625. dest fee and less a 3% holdback. I did not take into effect any xtra costs for this region. I live in the W. Springfield area. I'd appreciate a quick response if you could. I am looking seriously at the B9 'beca. I did go to Bertera but they wouldn't bite with a 3% profit over invoice. (not yet anyway) I offered $31,126.00. THANK YOU,
ilovelabs
I just read your post again.. so you offered them basically INVOICE from what Edmunds list as dealer Invoice with dest fees?
All my options were at invoice. So you really offered below their cost. Bertera also has a high processing fee ( about $150 after sticker ) that is really profit. So if you offer close to invoice $100 - $150 I believe they will take it.
Send me an e-mail if you would like, I would be happy to give you a call to discuss. My profile is on the board (don't know why everyone doesn't do this , or at least indicate their hometown. Mine has been up since 1999 and I have never had a problem.)
$31,800 + or- a little would be a great deal IMHO.
Jerry
Iam looking to get a 7pas limited with DVD , NAV, tow, pdle, roof rack 39 mo . I noticed that you are in NJ. I am located in the NW NJ. Any dealer recomendations? If I may ask which dealer offered you the above deal? What price should I be looking to get?
Thanks.
My husband and I have been been following your posts about Bertera, we live near Albany NY so not that far away.
A local dealer has offered us $31,457 on a 5 passenger Ltd with the single option of cross bars. From what you're writing to Ilovelabs, this sounds like a pretty good price. We haven't begun to negotiate down from this price. It's the first offer they've made and so far all our communications have been via email.
As an aside, this negotiating over email is so much more pleasant than going in to see the dealer. Initially we met with our local dealer who does the work on our '98 Legacy. Twice he kept us waiting for over half an hour, both times asked us to fill out some bogus forms (name, address, preferred color, options). The first time (end of July) he said the cars were going for over MSRP. The second time, early August, he called and offered us the 5 passenger Ltd for $34K, then dropped to $32.
Thanks for your advice.
Silver 2006 B9 Tribeca LTD 5 Passenger. It has rear bumper moldings, puddle lights, auto dimming mirror with compass, cargo net and a bumper cover in addition to the standard equipment of the B9 Tribeca LTD. The pricing includes us adding the crossbars to the vehicle. The MSRP is $33691, your Internet Price is $31956 including discounts and incentives. Sales tax and DMV fees are additional. Any other Dealer or port installed options would be additional.
It has more bells and whistles than we were looking for, but from what I've read the puddle lights are "cool" and my husband likes the auto dimming mirror. Of course it's also $500 more than the base model we initially asked about.
Next hurdle: lease negotiations and trade in value for our old car.
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Jerry
Jerry
A tribeca with evry conceivable option has an MRSP of about $39,000
If your # is correct - they were trying to get almost $4K over over retail not $400 over invioce.
Trying to make space in the head to store things like, who has the Mr. Clean Auto wash filter/detergent on sale and who sells the K&N filter for the B9.etc
how much and which dealer did you find the warranty for?
I'm planning to do the IMBA VIP when I am eligible (in about 5 monthes), and would like to know more about how you got the warranty discount. How much is it after the discount and what is the coverage?
I have been a member of the Subaru boards since 1999 and have seen very little in the way of "rediculous information" some miss guided perhaps but most of us are capable of using information as we see fit.
I would rather take information from my fellow consumers than someone with the attitude that if the dealer is happy you should be happy. Of course they are happy to move a car off their lot ... even if it is not the one you really wanted, you will be stuck wilth a color you didn't like or with stuff you didn't really want and will live with for 3 or 4 years (or more), but that's OK because they are happy ... beside they probably won't be around the next time you are ready to purchase a new car.
Friends if you do your home work, deceide exactly what you want and shop at least 3 dealers, make a fair offer they will get you exactly what you want. It could take up to 6 weeks if they can not loacate one at another dealer, but the wait will be worth it . I doubt if you will pay any more than if the identical car was on the lot.
Read the information from your fellow consumers on the Tribecca Boards you will learn alot about the tactics the dealer will use to maximize profit keep in mind with the holdback and admin fees the dealership is going to make at least $1000 on every Tribecca sold, profit is fine but don't let them get rich off of you!
Anyone know where the "nations leading Tribecca dealer is located"?
Jerry
No that would be Naawood....
Let's get back to talking about Tribeca pricing, please.
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