I have leased vehicles for years, everything from Fords to Volvos to my last two, an FX35 and now a G35. I have to tell you, if you are considering leasing a G, buy it instead. You will love this car and want to own it, not be renting it. I hate the idea that in another year plus, I will have to give it back!!
Look at it this way. In 2 years your car will get its share of small dents, dings and will not look/feel new any more. NHV somewhat high even in a new G35 will become more noticeable and annoying when the car becomes 2 years old. The obsolete 5 speed (if you get an auto) tranny will become out of place in a near-luxury car. By that time the now upcoming G37 will be about to be replaced by a new G40 model. BMW 335/340 will have even stronger 330-340 hp engine. You'll be making more money and will be interested in 5-series or Infiniti M. You G35 will become an obsolete vehicle that you will have trouble trying to get rid of. Good news there will be some one who will HAVE to take it back, IFS. Leasing is great.
I have a 2006 Infiniti G35 4-door. I leased it in January 2006 for 42 months at 15K miles a year (52,500 total). Lease is up July 2009 and I probably won't have more than 35K miles on it at that time.
I do not want to keep the car long term, so I'm wondering if I would be able to: (a) Buy the car at the residual value stated in the lease (which I think is about $17K+ based on expected 52.5K miles) and then sell it for a profit, or (b) Use the fact that I'm way under mileage and that the retail value of the car if the dealership resold it is probably quite a bit higher than the lease-end purchase price as bargaining power to get money off a new lease.
Anyone had any experiences with this that they could share?
unfortunately, i suffered the consequences of past mistakes regarding my credit through a high MF, but never the less, i got it for under 600 a month which is what i was budgeting for. i'm 26 now so hopefully in 3 years, i'll get approved for tier 0/1 and get into the new g50 sedan (500HP) coming out in 2010.....my salesperson mentioned this and also mentioned it as a sedan, not coupe.....great thing is that i got the color i wanted, with the option i wanted (only moonroof no premium, extremely tough to find), for under invoice!
here's the deal (please note i'm in illinois where the tax is based on entire selling price of car which is noted in the cap cost)
g37 journey with only moonroof and trunk cargo net in liquid platinum msrp 37475 invoice 34457 selling price 33757 (700 under invoice) cap cost 36204.38 (includes 7.25% illinois tax on car) residual 60% mf 0.00405 (approved tier 4)
monthly payment: 589.73
due at signing: 1502.73 (1st months payment, bank fee, ert fee, doc fee, title/lic)
the dealer (lisle) and salesperson were so extremely friendly and courteous. i was in the dealership for about 25 min signing the papers, 10 min with the finance guy, and the rest of the couple hours was test driving, going over the car, and inspecting the car.
i'm upgrading from an impreza (not wrx) and all i can say is...vroom vroom. the power on this thing is amazing and i am absolutely loving it.
edit: thanks to everyone on this thread for great advice and great discussions overall.
Hi guys, Am a total newbie here and trying to absorb all the lease jargon. Had a quick question - the residual value seems to be a hot topic but if I dont intend to buy the car after the lease period ends, do I even need to worry about it? does it have any other implication?
Apologise if I'm repeating this question if it has already been raised. Appreciate any responses. thanks!
The residual has huge implications. A lease has two main factors, depreciation and interest. Depreciation is determined by taking the Cap Cost (what you are paying for the car) - Residual Value. So as you can see the higher the residual, the lower the payment.
2005 G35 Sedan 2007 G35 Sedan 2008 G37 Sedan 2010 G37 Coupe 2012 G37 Sedan 2014 Q50 RWD 2017 Q60 3.0t RWD 2018 QX60 RWD
I don' t intend to buy the car after the lease as well since many financial institutions and captive finance companies inflate their residual value to keep leases attractive (aka: subventing). But, as kingpcgeek stated the residual value is one of the key aspects to the leasing calculations.
I'd also add that many sales people have been trained to "sell" a monthly payment but if you don't know how they arrived at the number your positional power in terms of negotiation will diminish considerably. Plug numbers into online lease calculators or create your own spreadsheet and play with the numbers. You'll see how the residual value, cap cost, dealer fees, cap cost reduction (what you pay at the time of pickup) and money factor will impact the monthly payment.
For instance, when I first inquired about leasing a G37 Journey the first dealer wrote me back saying he would sell me one for $38383 but the monthly payments came out to $599 a month. I responded asking the dealer everything from the cap cost, all inception fees (dealer doc, tag, license, inspection acquisition, etc), MSRP, residual value and money factor. It turned out while the cap cost was low the dealer fees were extremely high (they were trying to recoup profit on the back-end) and the residual value was also not inline with what I was seeing on this board.
I just leased the G37 Journey with the premium and navigation packages from another dealer but ended up paying a higher cap cost ($39190) but almost no fees and the money factor and residual value were inline which made my monthly payments under $562 and saved me approximately $1443 in additional payments over the lease of the car (the number includes the acquisition fee and tax - I live in TX and have to pay in full upfront - into the car and only paid the first months payment at the time of signing).
So, as you can see there are many aspects of the lease calculation you'll need to consider.
Personally, when I wanted to lease the first time, I invested my time into understanding the lease calculation intimately...now days I find I have to talk to a F&I person since most salespeople (including managers) don't understand how to properly calculate leases...and really, it's not that hard!
I went to the dealership yesterday and was quoted a price of, so he says, $38,000 12,000 miles a year 36 months $1,000 down plus first month payment 7% sales tax in my state of NJ $498+ tax so thats equates to $532.86 a month
this is with no negotiation, is this a good deal? is the $38,000 correct for this monthly payment? and what do you think is a good price?
Thanks, kingpcgeek and madd66, for the info. I got it now. What matters to me is only the amount I need to pay monthly but knowing the residual and understanding the pitfalls can hep me in lowering my payments.
Looking fwd to reading more details on the leasing process before I begin my search for a new G35!!
What needs to matter most to you is how much are you paying for the car. Not what the monthly payment is. There is a reason that car salesman love buyers that are only concerned with a monthly payment.
You nor the dealer can control the residual and in most cases the money factor. So the only thing you can negotiate with a dealer is the price of the car.
2005 G35 Sedan 2007 G35 Sedan 2008 G37 Sedan 2010 G37 Coupe 2012 G37 Sedan 2014 Q50 RWD 2017 Q60 3.0t RWD 2018 QX60 RWD
I have been looking for a G37 lately and been doing a lot of research online and with salesmen. In California I have been able to get an invoice price or a couple of hundred above. If this is around invoice, it's about right. But negotiate hard, the 09's will be out soon and they need to rid of the 08's.
Hi everyone. Just joined today and had a question. I was quoted on a G37 Journey auto with sport, premium, and navigation package. I was told I needed to pay $569 month total tax included,for 60 months..??.. with $249 down plus the first month payment to cover tags title lic etc... I am in Texas and was told we get worked over for a 6.25% charge on top of the entire price of the vehicle..??? Any thoughts ? Should I walk away from this deal?? Please any advice.
Hi hbaz! Could you post the money factor, residual, quoted MSRP and cap cost (selling price of the car)? I just leased a G37 with everything you stated sans the sports pkg in the DFW area of TX. and yes, TX has an old (and outdated law) which requires tax to be collected upfront on the full cap cost of the vehicle.
Not to jump the gun, but this payment seems high since the lease term is 60 months. To help provide perspective my 39 month lease is around $562 (premium and nav - no sports pkg).
I've stated this in the past but many dealers will try to sell you a payment which, in the end, is what matters in terms of the financial aspect. However, understanding how the payment is calculated is key to understanding if you're getting a fair price in the current market.
Good rule of thumb is never to lease longer then the warranty. So in the case of an Infiniti you shouldn't lease longer then 48 months. But in reality the best payment will usually be at 36 or 39 months. At 60 months, with .9% financing available, and the fact you have to pay all of the sales tax in TX you might as well buy the car.
No where in your numbers do you mention the price of the car. We cannot tell you if you are getting hosed or not since you didn't mention it.
2005 G35 Sedan 2007 G35 Sedan 2008 G37 Sedan 2010 G37 Coupe 2012 G37 Sedan 2014 Q50 RWD 2017 Q60 3.0t RWD 2018 QX60 RWD
I am looking for the quote on my prevoius thread so I am sorry. I do however have a new quote from a dealer in AZ and it is as follows.
The The MSRP of the G37 journey sport, navigation, and premium packages according to a dealer in Arizona is $43,770.00. I think this is higher than what edmunds says the MSRP should be....Anyway he said they would sell the vehicle to me for $40,595.00. Based on that he said my down payment would be $1936.88 and payments would be $575.35 plus fees for a 39 month lease 15K a year. Is this a good deal???? Also I feel so confused with the whole Texas lease laws. If I get the car in AZ does that mean I have to pay another $3000 in fees when I try to register the car in Texas or is it already worked in the deal? OR is it the same as property tax that I pay every so often in the monthly payment??? Confused
Sorry to post again before the answer to my last question but I just got another quote and would appreciate feedback please.
I was given 2 different lease quotes on a 08 G37 sport, nav,and premium packages. I live in Texas by the way. My credit score is a little above 700.
The first was from a dealer in Texas. They said the MSRP was $44,280 & the selling price is $41,995
$612 month total 48 month lease 15K year $3000 down. They said the residual was obo 51% of price of vehicle??????
The other offer was from Arizona : MSRP $43,770 & selling price of $40,595.
$575.35 month plus fees 15K year $1936.88 Down.
Are either of these a good deal or not??? Also where does the whole Texas tax law for leasing come into place? Do I add the tax to the selling price of both vehicles or is it already in the monthly?? How do I calculate that? Sorry I don't understand. Is it 6.25%? Lastly is this why there is a big difference in the price from the Texas Dealer versus the Arizona 1. I was afraid to get the car in Arizona then be hit with a tax fee when I bring the car into Texas to get the car registered... or is that not how it works?
I leased a 2008 G37 Journey in June/2008 in NJ. G37 Journey w/Nav,Prem, Sport pkg. $1764 up front incl 1st mo,Reg($364), Doc fee 299, Bank fee $595. $499/mo. Came out about $400-500 under invoice. 39 mos/12K. You might be paying sl more for the add'l mileage, but at this date I'd think you could do as well or better on a 2008 model.
ajb723, what was the MSRP on yours and what was the selling price ?? Your monthly of $499 was that total or plus tax? Since they just give me there selling price all the time and it is close to the 09's , am I suppose to ask to see there invoice and just offer that price or how do you recommend the approach?
Let's see if we can simplify this so its more easily digestible. Leasing for the first time can be tricky since there's so many parts...so bear with me because this response will be somewhat long (but hopefully understandable).
First let's start with the dealer in Texas. If I understand correctly you're being quoted on a G37 Journey with sports, premium and nav package with 15K miles per year on a 48 month term (please correct me if I'm wrong). So using this premise let's look at the numbers.
MSRP - $44,280 Cap cost (selling price) - $41,995 Cap cost reduction (money down at the time of signing) - $3,000 Term (how long you're leasing) - 48 months Residual - 51% Money Factor - ?? Inception fees (tag, title, acquisition, license, dealer fees) - ?? Monthly payment $612
There are two things missing that we still need; the money factor and the inception fees. Inception fees usually have some profit baked in so its really important to obtain each fee up front with its corresponding cost. But foregoing the two missing elements I worked up a calculation using the inception fees I had to pay in the DFW area and made up a money factor which helped equal the quoted monthly payment (if anyone see any discrepancies please point them out...I don't want to give hbaz wrong information).
Gross cap cost $41,995.00 Inception fees $772.06 (this number includes license, title, inspection, acquisition, dealer doc fee). license $70.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above) title $35.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above) inspection $22.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above) acquisition $595.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above) dealer doc $50.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above) Tax rate 6.25% Tax $2,624.69 Cap cost reduction $3,000.00 Total net cap cost $42,391.75 MSRP $44,280.00 Residual percent 51.00% Residual Value $22,582.80 Term 48 Total depreciation $19,808.95 Monthly depreciation $412.69 Monthly Tax $54.68 (included in the monthly depreciation, itemized out to show) Total Monthly Depreciation $412.69
There are a couple of things I'd like to point out about this deal. The cap cost reduction is pretty hefty. You are being asked to put down about 7.2% of the selling price to make your monthly payments equal the $612 number. If you elect to not put down the $3000 then your payments will balloon to $683.87 (or there about). Many of us on this forum will caution against such a large cap cost reduction (the whole leasing strategy is about getting into a car with as little money down as possible - the main out of pocket expense should be your first months payment). Then there is the fact that unless your inception fees are out of this world, your money factor will probably be high (I adjusted up to make the $612 number). If I was doing this deal, I would have problems with these initial numbers.
So why the disparity between the TX and AZ dealer? Well for one reason, the cap cost (selling price of the car) is lower from the AZ dealer. About $1,400 lower to be exact. To help put this in perspective, if you could get the TX dealer to match the AZ cap cost and keep everything else the same, your monthly payments would drop to $581.22. So as you can see, negotiating the cost of the car and the money factor are both significant factors when leasing. By the way, AZ cap cost is more inline with Edmunds TMV pricing.
All right, so let's take a look at the AZ dealer's offer. Again, there are some key elements missing (money factor, residual value - this was quoted from TX but AZ may be different, inception fees, etc.) so these calculations are just for show - once we get the numbers then we can take a more comprehensive look. Also, when buying from out of state my understanding is (and don't quote me on this I'm not a tax lawyer - thank goodness) the dealer will use your state's tax schedule. Meaning AZ will use TX tax rate so you won't have to pay double taxes but I'd double...no...triple check with someone who knows or IS a tax lawyer. Anyone who knows about this feel free to chime in.
Gross cap cost $40,595.00 Inception fees $772.06 license $70.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above) title $35.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above) inspection $22.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above) acquisition $595.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above) dealer doc $50.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above) Tax rate 6.25% Tax $2,537.19 Cap cost reduction $1,937.00 Total net cap cost $41,967.25 MSRP $43,770.00 Residual percent 51.00% Residual Value $22,322.70 Term 48 Total depreciation $19,644.55 Monthly depreciation $409.26 Monthly Tax $52.86 Total Monthly Depreciation $409.26
Keeping the inception fees the same as the TX calculations, the one thing I noticed is I adjusted the money factor down to achieve the $575 number. However I'm not too sure what the $1,937 is comprised of so I'd be weary of that number (the same goes for the $3,000 for the TX offer). As you can see, the money factor and cap cost (as well as the residual value) are key components to calculating the lease.
So to recap. 1. Try to get all the pertinent information so we, on this board, can help you make the best deal possible 2. Try to negotiate the cap cost down to a fair market price which will absolutely help lower the monthly payments (I'm speaking more towards the TX dealer). 3. Keep in mind the added cost of transporting the car from AZ to TX (if you decide to take the AZ deal). 4. Get everything in writing!!! In my youth, I was so proud of myself when I would finally get a "great" deal only to have my dreams shattered when the extra things or "mistakes" kept creeping up the price of the car.
Here's a template I use when I inquire about leasing. While most of the dealerships were petty open, all of them did not want to initially provide me the buy rate (what they buy the money factor at) and it took a couple of emails to get them to provide me all the inception fees. Using email is a good way to ensure you're getting all the necessary information and it also provides you a paper trail should there be any discrepancies. Plus, this wards off the dealer trying to "sell" you a payment.
You'll notice that I ask what financial institution they are using since different financial companies can/will have different residuals and money factors (captive finance arms like Infiniti Financial Services, usually have the best rates). Also I ask for their buy rate since this can be negotiated if you see they are padding it too much.
Feel free to cut and paste - I know it's pretty dry but you can always personalize the letter.
Hi, I am in the market to lease a ______ and would like to obtain the following information for a ___month lease with ___miles per year.
MSRP - Cap cost - Money factor offer rate – Money factor buy rate – Financial institution you’re using - Residual – All inception fees (license, tag, acquisition fee, dealer fees, inspection, etc.) with each fee line listed and its corresponding cost - Any and all incentives/rebates/dealer options –
Madd66, Thanks so much for all the info!!! So correct me if I am wrong but I could get the car in AZ and just tell them to charge me the 6.25% tax for Texas either on the monthly payments or pay it up front ..? Also the figures you calculated all seemed right on except for MY MISTAKE I AM SORRY, I didnt put in the quote that the AZ dealer was quoting me on a 39 month lease for those payments .. I also keep being told that because of the time of year that I could possibly go in and ask for the invoice price or even lower??? Is that the case or do you think they would point me to the door. If it is the case stupid question but how do you serve that type of offer up to the dealer. ?? P.S. Do you want to come and do the negotiating for me? HA HA J/K
Okay the 39 month term does change things (for instance I would expect your residual to be 60%)...and it also makes the TX deal look even worse!
The way I understand it, the dealer is just an agent for the financial institution. So you are making payments to the financial institution not the dealer. I know many people have bought and leased from dealers out of state so I know it's done...I just don't know 100% about the tax. So the long answer to a short question is yes...if there's no risk of double taxing. Actually there was a thread on here somewhere about someone leasing/buying in a different state.
As for negotiating to invoice or better, I would write to the dealer and say something to the effect "As you know, I am coming down to a decision on which dealership is going to earn my business and with that in mind, I would like to know what is the final best price you can offer me." And see what they say.
In my many illustrious years of negotiating both professionally and personally (ever negotiated with a 7 yr old...they are tough!), I've learned there are three stories to every deal. The one you tell your boss, the one you tell your spouse and the one you tell your friends at the bar. Okay, Chris Rock I'm not but the point being, I hear people telling you can get invoice or below but there are so many influential factors (dealer inventory position, time of month, salesperson, regional market conditions, moons aligning just right, etc.) that what worked on one deal may not work on another.
I'd love to negotiate on your behalf! In fact, I think there's a business model in there somewhere! Seriously, I'd be more than happy to review any information and if you'd like I can send you the spread sheet I use to play around with the numbers to see if you are getting a fair deal.
This payment sounds high. The 39 month lease should be a better lease and the extra miles should only be about a $13 a mo. difference from 12k year,and it sounds like you are paying the car down with some cap reduction. If 39 months is too short most or all car companies let you extend your lease up to 6 months at the same payment. If your lease factor (interest rate) is high than you can't really get around that. At this time of the year you can probably get the car down below invoice.
08 G37 Journey black on black sport, premium, navigation. Thanks so much to everyonein this forum for the help with the lease questions!! Big help so thanks again.
Hi pellepelle. I have seen Infiniti's new September lease program. You never mentioned what car you are looking for, so for now I will assume that you are interested in a 36 month lease of a base 2008 Infiniti G35 Sedan with 15,000 miles per year. Let me know if you want something different. Infiniti Financial Services' current buy rate lease money factor and residual value for the aforementioned vehicle are .00098 and 54%, respectively.
Car_man Host Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
Congratulations on getting your new car, hbaz. Thanks for taking the time to stop back and let everyone know how everything turned out. Don't forget to stop by the Dealer Ratings & Reviews section of Edmunds.com to share your thoughts on your recent dealer experience with everyone as well. Enjoy your new ride :shades: !
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I just placed an order for a 2008 G35 all wheel drive and want to make sure I got a good deal. It has premium, navigation, splash guards and wood. The MSRP is $40,680. They based the lease price on $38,100. My payments are $525 including tax a month. It is based on 12K miles for 39 months. Please advise
Is it possible to get a G35 near invoice and take an additional $3000 off (dealer incentive) and then lease the vehicle? Plus do they do 18K 36 months?
It really depends. What is included in the "lease price" of $38,100? Does it roll in the inception fees? title/license fees? cap reduction?
The best way to gauge a deal is to know what the actual selling price of the car is and comparing it to the invoice price per Edmunds TMV. So far, deals around invoice prior to any rebates or manufacturer to dealer incentives is a pretty good deal.
Infiniti Lease Programs – Effective September 2008
The lease programs displayed below are ONLY available through the manufacturer.
Special bank lease programs are available through LeaseCompare.com.
2008 Infiniti G35 Base Sedan – 24 Month – Residual 60% of MSRP – .00007 Base Rate 36 Month – Residual 54% of MSRP – .00098 Base Rate 48 Month – Residual 46% of MSRP – .00147 Base Rate 60 Month – Residual 40% of MSRP – .00200 Base Rate
2008 Infiniti G35 Journey Sedan – 24 Month – Residual 59% of MSRP – .00007 Base Rate 36 Month – Residual 54% of MSRP – .00098 Base Rate 48 Month – Residual 45% of MSRP – .00147 Base Rate 60 Month – Residual 39% of MSRP – .00200 Base Rate 2008 Infiniti G35 Sport Sedan – 24 Month – Residual 58% of MSRP – .00007 Base Rate 36 Month – Residual 53% of MSRP – .00098 Base Rate 48 Month – Residual 46% of MSRP – .00147 Base Rate 60 Month – Residual 40% of MSRP – .00200 Base Rate
2008 Infiniti G35 X Sedan – 24 Month – Residual 61% of MSRP – .00050 Base Rate 36 Month – Residual 55% of MSRP – .00114 Base Rate 48 Month – Residual 47% of MSRP – .00175 Base Rate 60 Month – Residual 41% of MSRP – .00224 Base Rate
2008 Infiniti G37 Coupe – 24 Month – Residual 70% of MSRP – .00179 Base Rate 36 Month – Residual 62% of MSRP – .00215 Base Rate 48 Month – Residual 53% of MSRP – .00194 Base Rate 60 Month – Residual 46% of MSRP – .00215 Base Rate
2008 Infiniti G37 Journey Coupe – 24 Month – Residual 67% of MSRP – .00179 Base Rate 36 Month – Residual 60% of MSRP – .00215 Base Rate 48 Month – Residual 51% of MSRP – .00194 Base Rate 60 Month – Residual 45% of MSRP – .00215 Base Rate
2008 Infiniti G37 Sport Coupe – 24 Month – Residual 68% of MSRP – .00179 Base Rate 36 Month – Residual 61% of MSRP – .00215 Base Rate 48 Month – Residual 52% of MSRP – .00194 Base Rate 60 Month – Residual 45% of MSRP – .00215 Base Rate
Residuals posted are for 15K miles/year. Add 2% to Residual for 12k mi/yr and 3% for 10k mi/yr on all terms
Use the following formula to calculate a lease payment:
(Cap Cost – Residual Value) / Term = Depreciation (Cap Cost + Residual Value) X Money Factor = Interest Depreciation + Interest = Base Monthly Payment
NOTE: These lease programs are provided by dealer partners of LeaseCompare.com and are for reference only. Rates may vary by region. Your dealer has the option of offering you a higher rate. To make sure you are getting the best lease, compare these rates through an independent leasing source such as LeaseCompare.com.
Visit Auto Lease Insider for great leasing info! __________________ -Tarry Shebesta, OCLC (Certified Lease Consultant)
I guess my decision to lease in August instead of September was a good one. With the change in the lease rates and the loss of the loyalty lease cash my payment would have been $26 a month higher in September.
2005 G35 Sedan 2007 G35 Sedan 2008 G37 Sedan 2010 G37 Coupe 2012 G37 Sedan 2014 Q50 RWD 2017 Q60 3.0t RWD 2018 QX60 RWD
I'm trying to work out a lease deal on a 08 G35X with the sport package.
Here's the info from the dealer:
"The best deal I have is a lease with 12k 39 month $2227.00 total due at signing $408.00+tax MSRP $36,189.90 Internet special price $34,046.00. Or, Based om the price of $34,046 @ 0.9% at 60 months = $596.00 with $2,000.00 due at signing. Or cash deal or using bank and credit union rates $31546.00."
Using the numbers shown on a post a few up, I came up with a lease payment without any money down on this car as $406.38. I have to clarify what additional costs for the purchase are not in the $34,046.00.
I think the price of $34,036 for the car is still a little high?
How do you handle the "money down"...on a lease is that just taken off the cap to figure out the lease payment?
Here's some additional info the dealer just provided:
Cap = 34046.63 bank fee = 595 total cap = 34641.63 cap reduction= 1095 net cap = 33546.63 residual 55% = 19835.75 total dep. = 13710.88
dep = 351.56 rent=72.07 sub total = 423.63 tax=28.81 monthy=452.44
cap reduction=1095 doc fee=398.50 tax = 101.56 lic fee=205.50 advance payment= 452.44 cash due on delivery = 2253.00
MSRP is actually $36,065 based on a 55% residual = $19,835.75 per your example. Selling price of the car is $34,046.63. Assuming your tax rate is 6.8% ($28.81/$423.63 = .068007).
I don't know what the money factor is for 39 months on a G35x, but in your example you said the rate = 1.350%, which translates into a money factor .0005625 (which seems awfully low).
Assuming all these numbers are correct, your payment should be $421.53 a month with NO cap reduction down. You would, however, have to pay up front the following:
doc fee= $398.50 tax = $101.56 - not sure why you're being taxed here again. lic fee= $205.50 first payment= $421.53 TOTAL $1,127.09
The yardstick to measure whether this is a good deal or not is to find out how far the agreed upon selling price is from invoice. Most people are getting their cars for around invoice give or take a few hundred dollars.
I got a quote today in Ann Arbor, MI for the following: 2008 G35x Sport and Premium. MSRP: $39130 Selling price: $400 over invoice I am told With $2000 TOTAL due at signing 24/12K monthly payment $482 (incl tax) 39/12K monthly payment $429 (incl tax)
This compares to August best deal I got for a 24/12 of $457.
Considering reduction in residuals for September, am I doing good or you think there more room here to manuever? Need a decision very soon...please advise
I think you can do better than $400 over invoice. What is the tax rate in Ann Arbor? Incidentally, I graduated from U of M in '94...GO BLUE!!! What other fees are being charged by the dealer?
It's important to get a detailed break down of every cent that you are being charged.
What residual are you being quoted? What money factor?
It's best to put down as little as possible (i.e. just license, title, first month)...roll everything else into the cap cost, if possible.
Ask the dealer for all these details and I can better assess if things are above board. Good luck!
55% on the 30/12 lease with a .00114 MF 62% on the 24/12 lease with a .0005 MF MI is a 6% tax rate. This is his offer to me, I have not aggressivley started negotiations yet. Hope that gives you a bit more info...Again his quoted lease payment is OTD, and incl. tax.
Hi there, new to this forum. Looking to lease an 08 g35 journey w or wo nav. Been emailing w a dealier (MILLER). I currently have an RSX, lease expiring 1/09 w 23K mi (12,6k mi/yr, 36 mos.) which I am also looking for them to take off my hands (3 payments left) Would love some input what I could expect to pay for a 36 mos lease, 12k mi/yr both base and nav models. Also, if you would suggest a particular dealer in SoCal. Thanks! Here is what they are telling me:
With $2000 drive offs and "eating up" your $800 lease, your payments on a sunroof car only will be $436.06 tax incl, on a car with Premium $459.74 tax incl
Comments
I do not want to keep the car long term, so I'm wondering if I would be able to:
(a) Buy the car at the residual value stated in the lease (which I think is about $17K+ based on expected 52.5K miles) and then sell it for a profit, or
(b) Use the fact that I'm way under mileage and that the retail value of the car if the dealership resold it is probably quite a bit higher than the lease-end purchase price as bargaining power to get money off a new lease.
Anyone had any experiences with this that they could share?
Thanks in advance.
DLagent
likewise with bmw on the 0.9%.... seems like they are hedging their bets in case they need to extend.
of course, the dealers are all saying it's over on the 2nd.
here's the deal (please note i'm in illinois where the tax is based on entire selling price of car which is noted in the cap cost)
g37 journey with only moonroof and trunk cargo net in liquid platinum
msrp 37475
invoice 34457
selling price 33757 (700 under invoice)
cap cost 36204.38 (includes 7.25% illinois tax on car)
residual 60%
mf 0.00405 (approved tier 4)
monthly payment: 589.73
due at signing: 1502.73 (1st months payment, bank fee, ert fee, doc fee, title/lic)
the dealer (lisle) and salesperson were so extremely friendly and courteous. i was in the dealership for about 25 min signing the papers, 10 min with the finance guy, and the rest of the couple hours was test driving, going over the car, and inspecting the car.
i'm upgrading from an impreza (not wrx) and all i can say is...vroom vroom. the power on this thing is amazing and i am absolutely loving it.
edit: thanks to everyone on this thread for great advice and great discussions overall.
Car_man
Host
Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
Am a total newbie here and trying to absorb all the lease jargon.
Had a quick question - the residual value seems to be a hot topic but if I dont intend to buy the car after the lease period ends, do I even need to worry about it? does it have any other implication?
Apologise if I'm repeating this question if it has already been raised. Appreciate any responses. thanks!
2005 G35 Sedan2007 G35 Sedan
2008 G37 Sedan
2010 G37 Coupe
2012 G37 Sedan
2014 Q50 RWD
2017 Q60 3.0t RWD
2018 QX60 RWD
I'd also add that many sales people have been trained to "sell" a monthly payment but if you don't know how they arrived at the number your positional power in terms of negotiation will diminish considerably. Plug numbers into online lease calculators or create your own spreadsheet and play with the numbers. You'll see how the residual value, cap cost, dealer fees, cap cost reduction (what you pay at the time of pickup) and money factor will impact the monthly payment.
For instance, when I first inquired about leasing a G37 Journey the first dealer wrote me back saying he would sell me one for $38383 but the monthly payments came out to $599 a month. I responded asking the dealer everything from the cap cost, all inception fees (dealer doc, tag, license, inspection acquisition, etc), MSRP, residual value and money factor. It turned out while the cap cost was low the dealer fees were extremely high (they were trying to recoup profit on the back-end) and the residual value was also not inline with what I was seeing on this board.
I just leased the G37 Journey with the premium and navigation packages from another dealer but ended up paying a higher cap cost ($39190) but almost no fees and the money factor and residual value were inline which made my monthly payments under $562 and saved me approximately $1443 in additional payments over the lease of the car (the number includes the acquisition fee and tax - I live in TX and have to pay in full upfront - into the car and only paid the first months payment at the time of signing).
So, as you can see there are many aspects of the lease calculation you'll need to consider.
Personally, when I wanted to lease the first time, I invested my time into understanding the lease calculation intimately...now days I find I have to talk to a F&I person since most salespeople (including managers) don't understand how to properly calculate leases...and really, it's not that hard!
I hope this helps!
$38,000
12,000 miles a year
36 months
$1,000 down plus first month payment
7% sales tax in my state of NJ
$498+ tax so thats equates to $532.86 a month
this is with no negotiation, is this a good deal? is the $38,000 correct for this monthly payment? and what do you think is a good price?
Thanx
What matters to me is only the amount I need to pay monthly but knowing the residual and understanding the pitfalls can hep me in lowering my payments.
Looking fwd to reading more details on the leasing process before I begin my search for a new G35!!
regards -
You nor the dealer can control the residual and in most cases the money factor. So the only thing you can negotiate with a dealer is the price of the car.
2005 G35 Sedan2007 G35 Sedan
2008 G37 Sedan
2010 G37 Coupe
2012 G37 Sedan
2014 Q50 RWD
2017 Q60 3.0t RWD
2018 QX60 RWD
Could you post the money factor, residual, quoted MSRP and cap cost (selling price of the car)? I just leased a G37 with everything you stated sans the sports pkg in the DFW area of TX. and yes, TX has an old (and outdated law) which requires tax to be collected upfront on the full cap cost of the vehicle.
Not to jump the gun, but this payment seems high since the lease term is 60 months. To help provide perspective my 39 month lease is around $562 (premium and nav - no sports pkg).
I've stated this in the past but many dealers will try to sell you a payment which, in the end, is what matters in terms of the financial aspect. However, understanding how the payment is calculated is key to understanding if you're getting a fair price in the current market.
No where in your numbers do you mention the price of the car. We cannot tell you if you are getting hosed or not since you didn't mention it.
2005 G35 Sedan2007 G35 Sedan
2008 G37 Sedan
2010 G37 Coupe
2012 G37 Sedan
2014 Q50 RWD
2017 Q60 3.0t RWD
2018 QX60 RWD
I am looking for the quote on my prevoius thread so I am sorry. I do however have a new quote from a dealer in AZ and it is as follows.
The The MSRP of the G37 journey sport, navigation, and premium packages according to a dealer in Arizona is $43,770.00. I think this is higher than what edmunds says the MSRP should be....Anyway he said they would sell the vehicle to me for $40,595.00. Based on that he said my down payment would be $1936.88 and payments would be $575.35 plus fees for a 39 month lease 15K a year. Is this a good deal???? Also I feel so confused with the whole Texas lease laws. If I get the car in AZ does that mean I have to pay another $3000 in fees when I try to register the car in Texas or is it already worked in the deal? OR is it the same as property tax that I pay every so often in the monthly payment???
Confused
Sorry to post again before the answer to my last question but I just got another quote and would appreciate feedback please.
I was given 2 different lease quotes on a 08 G37 sport, nav,and premium packages. I live in Texas by the way. My credit score is a little above 700.
The first was from a dealer in Texas. They said the MSRP was $44,280 & the selling price is $41,995
$612 month total 48 month lease 15K year $3000 down. They said the residual was obo 51% of price of vehicle??????
The other offer was from Arizona : MSRP $43,770 & selling price of $40,595.
$575.35 month plus fees 15K year $1936.88 Down.
Are either of these a good deal or not??? Also where does the whole Texas tax law for leasing come into place? Do I add the tax to the selling price of both vehicles or is it already in the monthly?? How do I calculate that? Sorry I don't understand. Is it 6.25%? Lastly is this why there is a big difference in the price from the Texas Dealer versus the Arizona 1. I was afraid to get the car in Arizona then be hit with a tax fee when I bring the car into Texas to get the car registered... or is that not how it works?
Please Help
Let's see if we can simplify this so its more easily digestible. Leasing for the first time can be tricky since there's so many parts...so bear with me because this response will be somewhat long (but hopefully understandable).
First let's start with the dealer in Texas. If I understand correctly you're being quoted on a G37 Journey with sports, premium and nav package with 15K miles per year on a 48 month term (please correct me if I'm wrong). So using this premise let's look at the numbers.
MSRP - $44,280
Cap cost (selling price) - $41,995
Cap cost reduction (money down at the time of signing) - $3,000
Term (how long you're leasing) - 48 months
Residual - 51%
Money Factor - ??
Inception fees (tag, title, acquisition, license, dealer fees) - ??
Monthly payment $612
There are two things missing that we still need; the money factor and the inception fees. Inception fees usually have some profit baked in so its really important to obtain each fee up front with its corresponding cost. But foregoing the two missing elements I worked up a calculation using the inception fees I had to pay in the DFW area and made up a money factor which helped equal the quoted monthly payment (if anyone see any discrepancies please point them out...I don't want to give hbaz wrong information).
Gross cap cost $41,995.00
Inception fees $772.06 (this number includes license, title, inspection, acquisition, dealer doc fee).
license $70.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above)
title $35.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above)
inspection $22.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above)
acquisition $595.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above)
dealer doc $50.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above)
Tax rate 6.25%
Tax $2,624.69
Cap cost reduction $3,000.00
Total net cap cost $42,391.75
MSRP $44,280.00
Residual percent 51.00%
Residual Value $22,582.80
Term 48
Total depreciation $19,808.95
Monthly depreciation $412.69
Monthly Tax $54.68 (included in the monthly depreciation, itemized out to show)
Total Monthly Depreciation $412.69
Finance Fee
Money Factor 0.00307
Effective APR 7.368
Total Rent Charge $199.47
Monthly payments $612.16
There are a couple of things I'd like to point out about this deal. The cap cost reduction is pretty hefty. You are being asked to put down about 7.2% of the selling price to make your monthly payments equal the $612 number. If you elect to not put down the $3000 then your payments will balloon to $683.87 (or there about). Many of us on this forum will caution against such a large cap cost reduction (the whole leasing strategy is about getting into a car with as little money down as possible - the main out of pocket expense should be your first months payment). Then there is the fact that unless your inception fees are out of this world, your money factor will probably be high (I adjusted up to make the $612 number). If I was doing this deal, I would have problems with these initial numbers.
So why the disparity between the TX and AZ dealer? Well for one reason, the cap cost (selling price of the car) is lower from the AZ dealer. About $1,400 lower to be exact. To help put this in perspective, if you could get the TX dealer to match the AZ cap cost and keep everything else the same, your monthly payments would drop to $581.22. So as you can see, negotiating the cost of the car and the money factor are both significant factors when leasing. By the way, AZ cap cost is more inline with Edmunds TMV pricing.
All right, so let's take a look at the AZ dealer's offer. Again, there are some key elements missing (money factor, residual value - this was quoted from TX but AZ may be different, inception fees, etc.) so these calculations are just for show - once we get the numbers then we can take a more comprehensive look. Also, when buying from out of state my understanding is (and don't quote me on this I'm not a tax lawyer - thank goodness) the dealer will use your state's tax schedule. Meaning AZ will use TX tax rate so you won't have to pay double taxes but I'd double...no...triple check with someone who knows or IS a tax lawyer. Anyone who knows about this feel free to chime in.
Gross cap cost $40,595.00
Inception fees $772.06
license $70.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above)
title $35.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above)
inspection $22.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above)
acquisition $595.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above)
dealer doc $50.00 (itemized out, included in inception fee above)
Tax rate 6.25%
Tax $2,537.19
Cap cost reduction $1,937.00
Total net cap cost $41,967.25
MSRP $43,770.00
Residual percent 51.00%
Residual Value $22,322.70
Term 48
Total depreciation $19,644.55
Monthly depreciation $409.26
Monthly Tax $52.86
Total Monthly Depreciation $409.26
Finance Fee
Money Factor 0.00258
Effective APR 6.192
Total Rent Charge $165.87
Monthly payments $575.13
Keeping the inception fees the same as the TX calculations, the one thing I noticed is I adjusted the money factor down to achieve the $575 number. However I'm not too sure what the $1,937 is comprised of so I'd be weary of that number (the same goes for the $3,000 for the TX offer). As you can see, the money factor and cap cost (as well as the residual value) are key components to calculating the lease.
So to recap.
1. Try to get all the pertinent information so we, on this board, can help you make the best deal possible
2. Try to negotiate the cap cost down to a fair market price which will absolutely help lower the monthly payments (I'm speaking more towards the TX dealer).
3. Keep in mind the added cost of transporting the car from AZ to TX (if you decide to take the AZ deal).
4. Get everything in writing!!! In my youth, I was so proud of myself when I would finally get a "great" deal only to have my dreams shattered when the extra things or "mistakes" kept creeping up the price of the car.
I know this is long but I hope it helps!
Here's a template I use when I inquire about leasing. While most of the dealerships were petty open, all of them did not want to initially provide me the buy rate (what they buy the money factor at) and it took a couple of emails to get them to provide me all the inception fees. Using email is a good way to ensure you're getting all the necessary information and it also provides you a paper trail should there be any discrepancies. Plus, this wards off the dealer trying to "sell" you a payment.
You'll notice that I ask what financial institution they are using since different financial companies can/will have different residuals and money factors (captive finance arms like Infiniti Financial Services, usually have the best rates). Also I ask for their buy rate since this can be negotiated if you see they are padding it too much.
Feel free to cut and paste - I know it's pretty dry but you can always personalize the letter.
Hi, I am in the market to lease a ______ and would like to obtain the following information for a ___month lease with ___miles per year.
MSRP -
Cap cost -
Money factor offer rate –
Money factor buy rate –
Financial institution you’re using -
Residual –
All inception fees (license, tag, acquisition fee, dealer fees, inspection, etc.) with each fee line listed and its corresponding cost -
Any and all incentives/rebates/dealer options –
Sincerely,
_______________
The way I understand it, the dealer is just an agent for the financial institution. So you are making payments to the financial institution not the dealer. I know many people have bought and leased from dealers out of state so I know it's done...I just don't know 100% about the tax. So the long answer to a short question is yes...if there's no risk of double taxing. Actually there was a thread on here somewhere about someone leasing/buying in a different state.
As for negotiating to invoice or better, I would write to the dealer and say something to the effect "As you know, I am coming down to a decision on which dealership is going to earn my business and with that in mind, I would like to know what is the final best price you can offer me." And see what they say.
In my many illustrious years of negotiating both professionally and personally (ever negotiated with a 7 yr old...they are tough!), I've learned there are three stories to every deal. The one you tell your boss, the one you tell your spouse and the one you tell your friends at the bar. Okay, Chris Rock I'm not but the point being, I hear people telling you can get invoice or below but there are so many influential factors (dealer inventory position, time of month, salesperson, regional market conditions, moons aligning just right, etc.) that what worked on one deal may not work on another.
I'd love to negotiate on your behalf! In fact, I think there's a business model in there somewhere! Seriously, I'd be more than happy to review any information and if you'd like I can send you the spread sheet I use to play around with the numbers to see if you are getting a fair deal.
Good luck!
Car_man
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Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
Car_man
Host
Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
Thanks
Been answered many many times here. No.
2005 G35 Sedan2007 G35 Sedan
2008 G37 Sedan
2010 G37 Coupe
2012 G37 Sedan
2014 Q50 RWD
2017 Q60 3.0t RWD
2018 QX60 RWD
It really depends. What is included in the "lease price" of $38,100? Does it roll in the inception fees? title/license fees? cap reduction?
The best way to gauge a deal is to know what the actual selling price of the car is and comparing it to the invoice price per Edmunds TMV. So far, deals around invoice prior to any rebates or manufacturer to dealer incentives is a pretty good deal.
Infiniti Lease Programs – Effective September 2008
The lease programs displayed below are ONLY available through the manufacturer.
Special bank lease programs are available through LeaseCompare.com.
2008 Infiniti G35 Base Sedan –
24 Month – Residual 60% of MSRP – .00007 Base Rate
36 Month – Residual 54% of MSRP – .00098 Base Rate
48 Month – Residual 46% of MSRP – .00147 Base Rate
60 Month – Residual 40% of MSRP – .00200 Base Rate
2008 Infiniti G35 Journey Sedan –
24 Month – Residual 59% of MSRP – .00007 Base Rate
36 Month – Residual 54% of MSRP – .00098 Base Rate
48 Month – Residual 45% of MSRP – .00147 Base Rate
60 Month – Residual 39% of MSRP – .00200 Base Rate
2008 Infiniti G35 Sport Sedan –
24 Month – Residual 58% of MSRP – .00007 Base Rate
36 Month – Residual 53% of MSRP – .00098 Base Rate
48 Month – Residual 46% of MSRP – .00147 Base Rate
60 Month – Residual 40% of MSRP – .00200 Base Rate
2008 Infiniti G35 X Sedan –
24 Month – Residual 61% of MSRP – .00050 Base Rate
36 Month – Residual 55% of MSRP – .00114 Base Rate
48 Month – Residual 47% of MSRP – .00175 Base Rate
60 Month – Residual 41% of MSRP – .00224 Base Rate
2008 Infiniti G37 Coupe –
24 Month – Residual 70% of MSRP – .00179 Base Rate
36 Month – Residual 62% of MSRP – .00215 Base Rate
48 Month – Residual 53% of MSRP – .00194 Base Rate
60 Month – Residual 46% of MSRP – .00215 Base Rate
2008 Infiniti G37 Journey Coupe –
24 Month – Residual 67% of MSRP – .00179 Base Rate
36 Month – Residual 60% of MSRP – .00215 Base Rate
48 Month – Residual 51% of MSRP – .00194 Base Rate
60 Month – Residual 45% of MSRP – .00215 Base Rate
2008 Infiniti G37 Sport Coupe –
24 Month – Residual 68% of MSRP – .00179 Base Rate
36 Month – Residual 61% of MSRP – .00215 Base Rate
48 Month – Residual 52% of MSRP – .00194 Base Rate
60 Month – Residual 45% of MSRP – .00215 Base Rate
Residuals posted are for 15K miles/year. Add 2% to Residual for 12k mi/yr and 3% for 10k mi/yr on all terms
Use the following formula to calculate a lease payment:
(Cap Cost – Residual Value) / Term = Depreciation
(Cap Cost + Residual Value) X Money Factor = Interest
Depreciation + Interest = Base Monthly Payment
NOTE: These lease programs are provided by dealer partners of LeaseCompare.com and are for reference only. Rates may vary by region. Your dealer has the option of offering you a higher rate. To make sure you are getting the best lease, compare these rates through an independent leasing source such as LeaseCompare.com.
Visit Auto Lease Insider for great leasing info!
__________________
-Tarry Shebesta, OCLC (Certified Lease Consultant)
2005 G35 Sedan2007 G35 Sedan
2008 G37 Sedan
2010 G37 Coupe
2012 G37 Sedan
2014 Q50 RWD
2017 Q60 3.0t RWD
2018 QX60 RWD
Here's the info from the dealer:
"The best deal I have is a lease with 12k 39 month $2227.00 total due at signing $408.00+tax MSRP $36,189.90 Internet special price $34,046.00. Or, Based om the price of $34,046 @ 0.9% at 60 months = $596.00 with $2,000.00 due at signing. Or cash deal or using bank and credit union rates $31546.00."
Using the numbers shown on a post a few up, I came up with a lease payment without any money down on this car as $406.38. I have to clarify what additional costs for the purchase are not in the $34,046.00.
I think the price of $34,036 for the car is still a little high?
How do you handle the "money down"...on a lease is that just taken off the cap to figure out the lease payment?
Here's some additional info the dealer just provided:
Cap = 34046.63
bank fee = 595
total cap = 34641.63
cap reduction= 1095
net cap = 33546.63
residual 55% = 19835.75
total dep. = 13710.88
dep = 351.56
rent=72.07
sub total = 423.63
tax=28.81
monthy=452.44
cap reduction=1095
doc fee=398.50
tax = 101.56
lic fee=205.50
advance payment= 452.44
cash due on delivery = 2253.00
rate = 1.350
term=39
Any thoughts suggestions?
Thanks in advance!!!!
Here's what I see:
MSRP is actually $36,065 based on a 55% residual = $19,835.75 per your example. Selling price of the car is $34,046.63. Assuming your tax rate is 6.8% ($28.81/$423.63 = .068007).
I don't know what the money factor is for 39 months on a G35x, but in your example you said the rate = 1.350%, which translates into a money factor .0005625 (which seems awfully low).
Assuming all these numbers are correct, your payment should be $421.53 a month with NO cap reduction down. You would, however, have to pay up front the following:
doc fee= $398.50
tax = $101.56 - not sure why you're being taxed here again.
lic fee= $205.50
first payment= $421.53
TOTAL $1,127.09
The yardstick to measure whether this is a good deal or not is to find out how far the agreed upon selling price is from invoice. Most people are getting their cars for around invoice give or take a few hundred dollars.
PK1
2005 G35 Sedan2007 G35 Sedan
2008 G37 Sedan
2010 G37 Coupe
2012 G37 Sedan
2014 Q50 RWD
2017 Q60 3.0t RWD
2018 QX60 RWD
2008 G35x Sport and Premium.
MSRP: $39130
Selling price: $400 over invoice I am told
With $2000 TOTAL due at signing
24/12K monthly payment $482 (incl tax)
39/12K monthly payment $429 (incl tax)
This compares to August best deal I got for a 24/12 of $457.
Considering reduction in residuals for September, am I doing good or you think there more room here to manuever? Need a decision very soon...please advise
It's important to get a detailed break down of every cent that you are being charged.
What residual are you being quoted? What money factor?
It's best to put down as little as possible (i.e. just license, title, first month)...roll everything else into the cap cost, if possible.
Ask the dealer for all these details and I can better assess if things are above board. Good luck!
PK1
Here are some more details:
55% on the 30/12 lease with a .00114 MF
62% on the 24/12 lease with a .0005 MF
MI is a 6% tax rate. This is his offer to me, I have not aggressivley started negotiations yet.
Hope that gives you a bit more info...Again his quoted lease payment is OTD, and incl. tax.
MSRP $41,410
Selling price $38,324
Money factor .0019000
Residual value 60% or $24,855
39 month lease with 12k miles
$493.95
Update:
1000 under invoice...
$435.00
0 down.
NJ
With $2000 drive offs and "eating up" your $800 lease, your payments on a sunroof car only will be $436.06 tax incl, on a car with Premium $459.74 tax incl
Neither of these have nav, but would like