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2013 and earlier-Subaru Outback Lease Questions

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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I think it's a fair price actually, especially since you're familiar with the previous owner! ;)
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    casalbordinocasalbordino Member Posts: 2
    Wayne, NJ Subaru Dealer -
    According to lease - gross capitalized cost $24,000. According to ALG, Subaru residual percentage is 50% = $12,000. Should residual be around $12,000 or so? Please advise.
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    britgeezerbritgeezer Member Posts: 95
    You can't compare the residual % of today to the one in your current lease.

    You accepted the higher residual price to help your monthly payments. The purchase price in your lease is what they will hang out for.

    You can offer them less but who knows.....
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    rabeekmanrabeekman Member Posts: 1
    hello, anyone know that lease factor and residual for a 36 month 12k mile a year lease. also anyone have a dealer suggestion in the michigan ohio area?
    thanks
    ryan
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    nickr1nickr1 Member Posts: 51
    I'm considering the Outback lease but the prices I see are very high for what it is. What am I am missing here, I thought this was an economy AWD, one of the cheapest made today, but $29,000 and over $400 a month for a lease, that seems outrageous for a car like this. When did Subarus and Outbacks become so expensive? Why are there no good incentives? Is this car really that hot, and really worth these prices?

    What's the lowest down and lowest monthly they are likely to give on the 2010 3.6R or 3.6R Limited? Thanks.
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Well, keep in mind the average new car is up near $30k (28 something last time I heard a NADA figure), and most of those don't have AWD, usually about a ~$2000 option.

    So the average AWD vehicle is probably priced in the 30s. And I think the Outback is nicer than average, especially a 3.6R Limited.

    With even the best residuals in the 50% range, you're talking about $13,500 depreciation in 3 years even at 55% residual. Divide that by 36 months and before we even factor interest or anything else, you're at $375 per month.

    Sure you can negotiate a bit, but add taxes and fees, and you're back up to $400. It actually sounds about right to me.

    The car is definitely hot. Both November and December sales were more than double the year prior.

    Consider a Forester, for 2 reasons:

    * prices are a bit lower to begin with
    * residuals are fantastic, up to 59-62%
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    nickr1nickr1 Member Posts: 51
    Okay, but really, in this economy this car sells well for $400 a month lease. really? I would pay $200 for it, that's it. Must be a lot of people still living on credit or willing to default on a lease. Sorry, imho, $400 a month for this car is crazy.
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    $199 leases are for stripped base models and often only happen with $4000 down when you read the fine print. And that's before 6% tax (or whatever your state has).

    I think you're expectations are way too...low, I guess.

    We are talking about a large, loaded, 6 cylinder, AWD, highly sought after vehicle.

    For $199 you can lease a small FWD noone wants, sure.

    I think they had a Forester lease for $259, but again, with a big down payment, and that's a 2.5X model with plastic wheel covers, no tinted windows, and cloth seats.
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    nickr1nickr1 Member Posts: 51
    Yeah, I know what $200 a month leases, nothing, and that's because when you pay the large down payment it's way over $200 a month. Leases have become a way for dealers to make huge profits on people who can't get loans or have no down payment for a loan or can't afford a loan which is always way higher per month than a lease. Yes, you own the car if you buy, but what's it worth after you pay off a 5 year loan?

    I was talking with a dealer about the Nav, just to talk, I would never buy one. I asked the price, he said $2,000, I said: how about $200, that's what a good Garmin costs, then I added: you people need to get real with your crazy prices. Of course, he doesn't own Subaru.

    Just let this economic downturn go on for a year or two or three more, then check back on the price of a Forrester and the Nav, I guarantee you it won't be what it is now.
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    OEM Navi is *grossly* overpriced, IMHO. For $2 grand or so most don't even have text-to-speed, and most come with outdated maps the day you buy them. Heck, the $230 updates Subaru sells will buy you a Garmin with more features, and half that amount buys you lifetime updates for it.

    Nissan is coming out with a $400 unit with a small screen, but it'll even include a backup cam. That will be game changing. The multi-thousand dollar Navi packages will soon include stuff like myFord Touch offers. I think we'll soon see much better values./buying

    Back to leasing...

    what's it worth after you pay off a 5 year loan?

    For a Subaru, a lot!

    I kept my Forester for 9 years, and still got back $5550 (paid $19.2k new).
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    CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Welcome ryan. Here's the information that you're looking for. Subaru's current lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2010 Outback 2.5 Limited with 12,000 miles per year are .00140 and 52%, respectively.

    Car_man
    Host
    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
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    scarmanscarman Member Posts: 2
    Looking to lease a 2010 Subaru Outback in NY (Westchester or Rockland area), but will travel up to 50/75 miles to find. Any one have good experience and can get me some prices on the 2.5i or premium. Also need money factor and residual for 12K and 15K per year. Thanks.
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    chuck68516chuck68516 Member Posts: 195
    You obviously don't know much at all about leasing. Leasing is not around for people who can't get credit to buy a car. In fact, the opposite is true. You have to have near perfect credit to qualify for the best lease rates just as with buying. The worse your credit is the worse your lease deal is. If you have terrible credit it will likely be more expensive to lease than to buy.

    Lease prices vary by manufacturer and model. If people are willing to pay $400 on an Outback 3.6R lease why would Subaru want to let anyone lease one for $200? It's simple supply and demand. The demand is high and supply is low. This isn't a Ford Focus. This is a new style CUV/SUV that won Motortrend SUV of the Year and numerous other awards.

    Also, you are saying in other posts that it makes no sense to lease a $29,000 Outback for $400, correct? Wrong. If you were to make a great deal with no money down except first payment you would be lucky to walk out with a 36 month lease for $400. However, to buy that exact same Outback on a 5 year loan at 2.9% and 7% sales tax your payment is well over $550. So by leasing you are saving $150 a month. $150 X 36 months of the lease = $5,400. Do you really think you are going to get $5,400 more than the Outback is worth vs what you still owe if you sold or traded it in after 3 years of your traditional 5 year loan?

    Leasing makes perfect financial sense to me. I currently am leasing a 2010 Ford Edge SEL AWD for $297 on a 27 month lease with no money down and also a 2009 Tribeca SE for 36 months $360 with nothing down. Both cars had a "selling price" of just over $28,000. So either way I am saving $200-$290 a month vs buying ON EACH VEHICLE ($400-$580 per month total). Does that make sense?
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    britgeezerbritgeezer Member Posts: 95
    A lease takes the actual selling price (you still need to negotiate) and a residual (they hope to sell in xx months price) price set by the supplier and many industry factors. Fudging the residual price to be higher was attractive a few years back, now its not, hence leases cost more.

    The difference PLUS the local taxes and State DMV fees get added as the amount to be financed.

    Depending on the interest rate and down payment and other "inception" fees its then simple math.

    Typically, leases work well for mid to high end price cars and especially those that hold value (they have higher % residual), typically they are not attractive for low cost cars or those that loose a large % in the first 3 years.

    I have both leased and financed, currently leasing a Subaru is not very attractive vs purchase at 2.9%, assuming you could find the vehicle you want.

    If you like to replace your car every 3 years, leasing can be an excellent deal, averaged over 5-6 years it probably costs more, but you get to experience the new car smell more often.

    For what its worth, I haven't leased a car I would like to keep in the last 10 years, so leasing worked for me, hopefully we will like the 3.6R Limited we ordered (to buy) many weeks ago - when we finally get it.
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    tonbobtonbob Member Posts: 5
    Here is dealer quote for 2010 Outback 2.5 Premium:
    Lease Quote:
    Sale Price on this vehicle is$25,698.00.
    M.S.R.P. for this vehicle is $27,355.00.

    36 months W/ 12K miles per year, $1,167 due at start which includes 1st mo pmnt and dealer fees & NO CASH CAP REDUCTION @ $350.61/mo plus tax

    Any thoughts, comparisons. Does this seem appropriate sale price and lease factor/residual applied. Anyone get better?
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    stoopystoopy Member Posts: 105
    Are certain states different in what has to be paid on a lease deal? I don't get why people are paying $1100 in "dealer fees." I always pay the first payment and leave. They never have asked me to pay anything else. I then have 30 days to register the vehicle at the DMV. Seems to be a waste of money to pay all the "dealer fees" even if it isn't cap cost reduction. It's still coming out of your pocket.

    I always tell the dealer to give me their best sale price and then tell them I am not paying any of their bullcrap fees like doc fee, etc. The only fee that is legit is the acquisition fee which you will never get out of paying.
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    my1stscoobydoomy1stscoobydoo Member Posts: 15
    @ Ateixeira - You said "I would pay $200 for it, that's it. Must be a lot of people still living on credit or willing to default on a lease. Sorry, imho, $400 a month for this car is crazy".

    You truly do not have a clue about leasing or the relationship between a car's MSRP and what it should cost you. You want the quick and dirty? Here it is. So easy a caveman could do it(sorry caveman)

    1. Take the MSRP x Residual rate= $Residual Value
    2. Subtract Resid Value from the negotiated sale price, that = the amount you are borrowing.
    3. Divide the amount borrowed by the term (I use 39mo) = base payment
    4. Take (MSRP + Residual Value)x money factor = finance charge
    5. Add # 3 and #4 and done you have your payment.

    For example I just leased (today) a '10 OB premium w/ CVT & AWP for 39 mo @ 12k miles.
    1. MSRP $26790x.51=$13,663
    2. $23266-$13663=$9603 (sale price of $23266 reflects a $700 below invoice deal plus additional money down in this case, INVOICE WAS $25,610)
    3. 9603/39= $246 per mo base
    4. (26790+13663)x.0015= $60 per mo interest
    5. BAM! - $306 per month base payment. (add MASS sales tax of .0625)
    6. FINAL PAYMENT W/ Tax = $327.

    Easy peasy, if you can't do this, you shouldn't lease a car b/c you will get screwed. Trust me, I was a sales manager for a dealership for 2 years and sold cars 3 years before that. Now I'm an accountant and I love to torture salesman!! What goes around comes around.

    So if any of you are looking for a good deal, you better look hard b/c up here in the NE, inventory is super low, they have not been able recover the inventory levels since cash for clunkers, but you should expect to pay anywhere from $100 over invoice to $700 below. (that $700 is holdback - whole different discussion). With just fees down and no additional cap cost reduction(down payment) you can expect to pay near $400 per month to lease this car. Good luck people!
    :shades:
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    You just misquoted me BIG TIME. And I'm the one who doesn't have a clue? :P

    It was nickr1 who said that:

    http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.ef9ddb4/259#MSG259

    I've been trying to convince him that $200/month is way too low.
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    my1stscoobydoomy1stscoobydoo Member Posts: 15
    Sorry bro, don't get your panties in a bunch, didn't mean to ruin your day
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Check out the smiley with the tongue sticking out...clearly you didn't. :shades:
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    my1stscoobydoomy1stscoobydoo Member Posts: 15
    Sorry man, its all good in the hood. I was just trying to be helpful and sarcastic at the same time. prob not a good mix. :)
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    No hard feelings, I basically reacted in a similar fashion, 200-what? :D

    There is a $259 lease on the Forester right now, IIRC, but it's with a couple of grand down.

    You might find a $199 lease on a compact car, like a Civic perhaps, but even then it'll be with some cash down and that's probably a low-end model (LX or VP).

    $200 on a loaded Outback ain't happening unless you put half the cost in your down payment.
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    nickc3nickc3 Member Posts: 17
    Decent deal? Outback Premium w. All Weather Package.

    Over the phone quote, so didn't get all the details....

    Its DMV only; First Month payment waived...

    $369/Month

    36 Months, 10k Miles ($15 more for 12K)

    I had another dealer offer $415 for same terms, but he is looking to beat this...I hate this nonsense.....THhe $369 seems decent, but still a little high for my taste.
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    my1stscoobydoomy1stscoobydoo Member Posts: 15
    Theres no way to really tell. In order for you to really know if you are getting a great deal you need to know what the "selling price" is in relation to the invoice on the car. The payments will end up however the math works out based on residuals and the money factor.

    I got my OB for what they call "net net" meaning they "sold" me the car for invoice less hold-back, which is the true dealer net cost. So its all relative.

    The short answer? You need more detail, but $369 doesn't sound terrible
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    nickc3nickc3 Member Posts: 17
    They didn't share numbers, but I get the VIP program discuont which is supposedly Invoice - 2%. He said that works out to around 25K for the Premium + All Weather.
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    stoopystoopy Member Posts: 105
    With the high demand for Outbacks and relatively low supply and the fact that there are ZERO rebates, I find it hard to believe that ANY dealer would give you a selling price of invoice minus all hold back ("net net"). What would be in it for them? DId you trade a car that they shanked you on? Did you put down a heap of cash? Did they give you that price then add $750 in "dealer fees"? The cheapest I was offered by several HIGH volume dealers was $250 OVER invoice. That's about $1000 higher than you allegedly got. Do you work at the dealership? Is your dad the sales manager? This needs to be on the next episode of Mythbusters.

    Now I see in your post above you said:
    For example I just leased (today) a '10 OB premium w/ CVT & AWP for 39 mo 12k miles.
    1. MSRP $26790x.51=$13,663
    2. $23266-$13663=$9603 (sale price of $23266 reflects a $700 below invoice deal plus additional money down in this case, INVOICE WAS $25,610)
    3. 9603/39= $246 per mo base
    4. (26790+13663)x.0015= $60 per mo interest
    5. BAM! - $306 per month base payment. (add MASS sales tax of .0625)
    6. FINAL PAYMENT W/ Tax = $327.

    NOTE YOU SAID "PLUS ADDITIONAL MONEY DOWN" to get to $23,266. And you are wrong about the invoice price. A 2010 Outback PZEV Premium w/ All Weather Package MSRPs at $26,790 and carries an invoice price of $25,250. $24,714.20 would be the net net (invoice minus holdback). You can't count money down as part of your awesome deal. I could put $5,000 down on an Outback and come in here and tell everyone about my sweet $140 lease payment. Thanks for sharing.

    MYTH BUSTED.
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    wibadger71wibadger71 Member Posts: 5
    Car Man,

    Can you post the current residual and MF rates for a '10 Outback Premium for 36 mo, 10K miles? It would be with CVT and AWP, if that matters. Many thanks!
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    CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Here's the info that you're looking for, scarman. Subaru's current money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2010 Outback 2.5i with 15,000 miles per year are .00140 and 53%, respectively.

    The numbers for a '10 Outback 2.5i Premium are .00140 and 53%.

    I haven't checked what Subaru's low-mileage adder is for residual values in a while, but the last time that I looked it was 1% for 12k leases.

    Car_man
    Host
    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
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    CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Here you go, wibadger71. Subaru's current lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2010 Outback Premium with 10,000 miles per year are .00140 and 55%, respectively.

    Car_man
    Host
    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
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    my1stscoobydoomy1stscoobydoo Member Posts: 15
    Wow, you sure are smart. Lets get something straight - THAT MYTH IS CONFIRMED SUCKA! So if you want to call me a liar, well then read on. Seems like you are either jealous or you have no idea what you are talking about. Probably both. But you figured me right out. Let me just say that everything I said in my post is 100% true. I buy all my cars for net net and I'll tell you how. You need (1) a high volume dealer, no mom & pop shops (2) You need to negotiate either by phone or email (do not go to the showroom) (3) negotiate the deal on the very last day or weekend of the month. And lastly, you need to know each and every aspect of the deal or else you'll end up paying something stupid like "over invoice". I"ll bet you my brand new Outback that I got this car for net net ($700 below invoice). If you win, you can have my car & I'll make the payments, If I win vice versa. Lets see how smart you are now?

    I used to be in the business. I know how this stuff works, but thanks for your misinformed education. I'll try to answer each of your sarcastic questions.

    What would be in it for them? Easy VOLUME. They move the unit off the lot which means they don't pay interest or any other costs associated with carrying inventory. If you sell 100 cars in a month and you make profit on 80 of them and you break even on 15 and maybe take a loss on 5 you are still profitable but you have reduced a huge amount of costs, and lastly big dealers usually are incentivised on many other levels - one of which is a volume bonus....next

    DId you trade a car that they shanked you on? NO, They tried though, I shanked them. I got them to ACV the car at wholesale market value ($3500), but they tried like hell to give 1500 less than that and it didn't work.

    Did you put down a heap of cash? No cash, $0 dollars - NO MONEY OUT OF POCKET, JUST THE TRADE

    Did they give you that price then add $750 in "dealer fees"? NO, where do you come up with this stuff?

    The cheapest I was offered by several HIGH volume dealers was $250 OVER invoice I know this isn't a question but it begs the comment "you suck at negotiating" sorry. I emailed one other dealer and right off the get go they were $150 below invoice. Also I live in New England, these cars are as common as a Dunkin Donuts, there is one on every corner.

    Do you work at the dealership? Is your dad the sales manager? No & No. I left the car business as a sales manager in 2003. I don't buy cars from my "car" friends because I can get a better deal by being a hard-[non-permissible content removed] from people I don't know. My dad was in the hotel business what was yours? A [non-permissible content removed] negotiator? The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

    YOU SAID "PLUS ADDITIONAL MONEY DOWN" to get to $23,266 You really are offended by my good deal huh? I traded a $3500 car, what do you not understand? There is equity there ok? You pay fees, 1st payment etc. I'm not saying my payment was the good deal, I was saying the price of $700 below invoice was the good deal and I was trying to show you how to calculate a lease on a calculator.

    So now that you may or may not understand things better, go back and read it again. Payment amount is no indication of a good deal based on your point of cash down, so don't go on my payment. For the first half of your post I actually thought you might know a thing or two, but when I read the rest - all bets were off. Oh and Invoice price can differ from region to region based on transportation fees and sometimes corporate advertising fees that get spread to the each invoice in that particular region but hey, I"m probably making this stuff up right? I'm mean I probably didn't READ THE INVOICE PRICE RIGHT OFF OF THE INVOICE HUH? No, why would I do that? Please man, send me some difficult questions would you?

    NO MYTH - I have all the paper work to back up my post - all you have is pent up angst and some sort of wired notion that someone like me would come in here and spend 20 minutes on a post full of lies? My post was simply a small contribution to this forum to help you guys understand all the aspects and really how cheap you can buy the car. So if you want o get all huffy puffy over that... go right ahead. ;)
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    my1stscoobydoomy1stscoobydoo Member Posts: 15
    dealer hold back is invoice less 3% - so I'd say 2% below invoice is a very fair deal for you. Based on inventory levels up here in the North East I would even pay invoice if I had to, the cars are just very scarce. Good luck - oh and make sure you get ALL the numbers before you sign anything
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    dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,188
    edited February 2010
    Well, trade is just like money down, isn't it? Unless the car was owned by your neighbor or it was a gift from Santa Claus that counts as money down in my book. The fact that it was in form of barter, not legal tender doesn't change it. Therefore, if you add $3.5K to whatever your out-of-pocket numbers are (I don't know and frankly don't care, just picked up end of this nice exchange), is it still super-below-invoice-I-can't-believe-it-you-suckas-can't-touch-me-and-I'm-gonna--- rub-it-in-your-noses-like-I-just-won-a-ten-million-lotto-jackpot deal?

    No reason to get combative, anyway. The guy wasn't trying to rain on your parade, just get your numbers straight. There are plenty of people claiming they got a car five grand under invoice and there was cash in the glove compartment, but after brief examination they "forget" to add it was a price without any fees and trade price was already deducted (like it doesn't count) and they bought extended warranty with boat load of mop&glo stuff.

    BTW, those dealer fees are real - in many states (like mine) it is common place to pay $600-800 "fee" (called documentation, delivery, whatever) on top of the price (that's why "price" often appears to be lower than it really is). Plus, the leases tend to have another one (called origination fee) charged by bank on top of whatever else (those go between $200 and $800). And that is even before the tax man and DMV take their cut.

    Either way, enjoy your wheels. The fact you are happy is most important one.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    There's a local Ford dealer that advertises low prices and then puts in fine print: with $3000 cash or trade.

    Duh, the price is $3000 higher than listed! Before fees, freight, and taxes, even.
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    dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,188
    Here in Tampa, pretty much all Chrysler dealers do that and many more other brands. I find that kind of advertising insulting, but it must be working. I heard a few people office saying "I paid X for my car", then when I ask them for details they suddenly add there was a multithousand trade.

    Math skills are so bad in this country it's not even funny - especially when it comes to money. Then of course it is bankers/dealers/salesman fault. Of course. :sick:

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

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    albert72albert72 Member Posts: 200
    So to be clear, what you are saying is that you negotiated the value of your trade in car at $3500 and that the sales price of your new vehicle was reduced by this amount, correct?

    Thanks
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    my1stscoobydoomy1stscoobydoo Member Posts: 15
    Sorry man, but I think you need to go back and get all the details. You got me all wrong.
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    my1stscoobydoomy1stscoobydoo Member Posts: 15
    What I was saying was I negotiated the price of the car to $700 below invoice. Whenever you trade a car in it will either reduce the price you pay or will act as cap cost reduction on a lease (extra money down to reduce the amount financed).

    I'm really confused as to how all my information has been so grossly misunderstood. :(
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    my1stscoobydoomy1stscoobydoo Member Posts: 15
    I'll be honest here, I'm a little frustrated. I don't know how many times I can say this or how many different ways I can say it. The trade or cash or equity or whatever you would like to call it is totally irrelevant to the price of the car. All I was trying to say was 1) How to calculate a lease and 2) That I bought my car for net and you can too.

    I TOTALLY AGREE WITH THOSE OF YOU WHO ARE SAYING THE TRADE IS CASH DOWN AND THAT IS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE PRICE OF THE CAR.

    Let me just say it ONE MORE TIME so we are clear. I fully understand that putting cash down on a car does NOT constitute a good deal. I was a sales manager of a car dealership, I understand how that works. I really, really do.

    I've read complaints about poor math skills but it appears thats not the only problem here, looks like we need to brush up on reading comprehension and etiquette too (my self included, not calling any one out here).

    I'm also a little disappointed that I joined this forum to gain and share information and really all I got are a comments that indicate that my posts were misinterpreted and I basically have been called a stupid liar (no in so many words).

    You all may be better off on your own here ;)
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    albert72albert72 Member Posts: 200
    What he is saying is that his $3500 trade was applied to the price of the vehicle. Basically, he got drilled.

    But since he is a quant, perhaps he can go trade distressed debt at GS and make a cool 8 figure income. Then he can go to the Bentley board and won't have to interact with us double digit IQ folk.
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    my1stscoobydoomy1stscoobydoo Member Posts: 15
    Well, you got me, I am a bit of a quant, actually a CPA but whats the difference right?

    I'm not quite sure why putting equity down on a purchase to reduce the amount financed equate to being drilled? I negotiated the price to net, then put a trade down to cover the up front fees and the rest went to cap cost reduction to reduce the payment..not rocket surgery. Still not quite sure where the disconnect is.

    Have you or the other guy that yelled at me get one of these cars yet? What did you pay?

    Anyway, I truly apologize if I mislead anyone in my original post, it wasn't my intent. Good luck in you car leasing/buying affairs. Feel free to contact me privately if I can help out in anyway. Who knows we both might learn something.

    ..and I certainly would not be driving a Subaru if I was pulling in 8 figures. I'd have a 1997 Porsche 993 Turbo among other toys
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    petergriffinpetergriffin Member Posts: 5
    It is YOU who does not understand what YOU are saying.

    The dealer simply moves money from one catagory to another. He may tell you he is giving you a sale price of $700 BELOW invoice but is actually just taking money from your trade and applying it to that. How much of your "down" went to making up for the supposed $700 UNDER invoice selling price? The only TRUE way to figure out if you got a good deal is to not put equity down in the first place. Likewise you can't count your final payment including sales tax because some states are less than 5% and some are 10%.

    I will sell you my laptop for $1 if you put down $1499 but don't tell people you bought it for $1.
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    my1stscoobydoomy1stscoobydoo Member Posts: 15
    I negotiated the price of the car separately. I negotiated the trade AFTER we reached the price on the car. So in essence, its just as if I negotiated the price of the car THEN put cash down.

    You have to leave the trade out of the deal until you agree on a price, thats exactly what we did. Then I spent 3 days fighting with them on the value of my trade because they WANTED to hose me on my trade. I'm not stupid enough to walk into a dealer and tell them right up front that I'm trading a car. THAT IS THE #1 DUMBEST THING YOU COULD EVER DO IN A CAR DEAL. I loved it when people offered me their trades on a silver platter like that. That is how you get screwed which is what you are trying to say happened to me, not the case.

    Like I said before, If I mislead anyone by not including enough detail in my post then I apologize. I'll break it down for in another way.

    MSRP was $26,790. Invoice was $25,610, then hold back is $768 so the net cost on the car is $24842. I paid $24,900. We went back and forth for 2 days before we agreed on that price. THEN I pulled the trade out and we fought hard about that for a few days. They really wanted to give only $2K for the trade to try and make up for the new car price, but in the end, I got what wanted. They used the equity in the trade for all the up front fees (just like cash), then the remaining equity went as cash down on the lease to reduce the payment (just like cash). IF I HAD NOT USED THE EQUITY FOR ADDITIONAL CASH DOWN, THEY WOULD HAVE CUT ME A CHECK BACK. We did it all the time when I was in the biz. Someone would trade a $10K car on a lease but only want to put $2k down, we'd cut them a check for the $8K no problem.

    Does this make any more sense now? Because if it doesn't, I don't know what to tell you other than I'd love to sell you a car.

    I guess selling 100's of cars as a former sales manger still doesn't qualify me to understand how to BUY a car does it? But what do I know right? you guys know it all.
    Its a shame that so much critical communication gets lost when people communicate via email, forums blogs etc. This never would have happened if we had spoken in person.

    Next...

    :P
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    stoopystoopy Member Posts: 105
    edited February 2010
    So let me clarify this, you got a Subaru Outback, one of the most popular selling vehicles of 2010, for $24,842? The dealer made $58. Yeah, that clears everything up.

    Just a few questions:
    1. How does the dealer pay the rent, electricity, employee salaries, employee benefits, other utilities when they are making $58 on a deal?
    2. How does the salesman make a living when he gets $6 commission from selling you a car?
    3. Did a spaceship land before or after you closed this deal? Either way would leave as much credibility to your story.
    4. As I stated before, did they give it to you for $24842 then add $750 in dealer fees?
    5. ACTUAL invoice is $25,250 NOT the $25,610 you are claiming so really they made $127.80 over net not the $58 over net you are saying. Hold back is not $768 it is ACTUALLY $535.80. Where are you getting your numbers?

    If you expect anyone to believe your story please post the name of the dealer and salesman that gave you this deal and also scan the actual original copy of your lease agreement and email it to me. It just doesn't make any sense that everyone else is lucky to get invoice pricing and you paid $58 over actual dealer cost on a vehicle that has no rebates and is in very limited supply.
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    kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 241,527
    Thanks!

    Edmunds Price Checker
    Edmunds Lease Calculator
    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

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    kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 241,527
    Anyone need a definition for "moving on"?

    Thanks!

    Edmunds Price Checker
    Edmunds Lease Calculator
    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

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    kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 241,527
    ...posts have been deleted..

    Edmunds Price Checker
    Edmunds Lease Calculator
    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

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    gerry2gerry2 Member Posts: 9
    Looking for residual value and money factors on 2010 Outback Limited 2.5i w/CVT for 36 mos. 12,000 & 15,000 miles per year.

    Thanks!!
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    club619club619 Member Posts: 122
    Looking at a 2010 Outback 3.6 Limited with Nav/moonroof. Curious what the residuals and MF's were here. Looking at 12k and 15k miles/year. I'm new to Subaru, so don't know what lease terms they offer, but assume they have something less than 3 years. If so I'd like those figures, also for 36, 39, & 48.

    If there is a way for me to look these up, I'll gladly do the legwork...

    Also, I've heard of Subaru discounts through Costco & IMBA...anyone know of any other good ones?
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    CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi gerry2. Here's the information that you're looking for. Subaru's current lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2010 Outback Limited 2.5i w/CVT and 15,000 miles per year are .00155 and 52%, respectively.

    Car_man
    Host
    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
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    CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hello club619. Here's the information that you're interested in on this car's lease program. Subaru's March lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2010 Outback 3.6 Limited with navigation, moonroof, and 15,000 miles per year are .00140 and 52%, respectively.

    The numbers for an otherwise identical 39 month lease are .00150 and 50%. The numbers for a 42 month lease are .00165 and 48%.

    You definitely don't want to lease this car for 48 months. Subaru isn't providing support on four year leases right now.

    I believe that its residual values for leases with only 12,000 miles per year are 1% higher.

    Car_man
    Host
    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
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