Stories from the Sales Frontlines

venture

We started looking for a new car for my wife. She’s hard to get an answer out of, but I think we were successful today. We went out looking at something she might like. It was around 28 degrees with a steady 20 mph wind blowing so getting her outside was a major accomplishment in itself.

She likes AWD and a SUV-like ride. She likes to sit a little high. She presently has a Forester which is too low for her liking. I don’t think she really liked it in the 3 ½ years she has driven it so we looked at all kinds of vehicles today. She occasionally said she missed the Santa Fe that she had previously.

We looked at the Hyundai Santa Fe and Tucson, The Mazda CX-7 and Tribute, the Ford Escape, the Honda CRV, and the new Forester.

She liked the Santa Fe (surprise), thought the Tucson was a little too small, hated the Tribute and Escape (too square – sorry Richard), thought the CX-7 was ugly, was very interested in the CRV, and really liked the new re-designed Forester which sits higher.

Her favorite color is green and our local Subaru dealer, where we bought her present Forester, happened to have 4 green ones in stock.

Since all our dealers are closed on Sundays here in PA, tomorrow the quest begins. First stop – Subaru. Alone!

I’m going to offer invoice and ask for KBB “Good” condition for her Forester. That should leave enough profit for the dealer if they are interested in making a deal. If not – Honda is next.

oldfarmer50

I hope all you folks on the east coast are enjoying the blizzard. People around here were complaining about the lack of snow and now they are crying that they can't get out of their driveways. Such a laugh. We don't even have a foot on the ground and they're in a panic.

I tell my kids one of my "When I was a boy" stories about how years ago my buddies and I shoveled 4 feet of snow out of a 200 foot driveway just so we could take dad's station wagon out for a joy ride in the snow. These young whipper-snappers don't know what snow is.

I was watching a TV commercial for a local dealer that must have been directed by Isell. The frightened customer and "the salesman of the year" were facing each other in a boxing ring. The customer's wife is in his corner shouting "if he gives you a hard time, bite his ear off!"

I wonder how many times Isell and the other sales people felt like they were in the ring. :sick:

driver100

Steve, I found the post Tidester made about whether you should let your car warm up or should you just start to drive off immediately. It was a heated discussion with most thinking it was better to let the car warm up first. You can see how he put such a complex question, into simple logical terms- I will miss his brilliance.
I reprinted it here so you don't have to look for it:

#38074 of 63128 Re: Probably not a good time.... [jmonroe] by tidester HOST
Jan 18, 2009 (1:34 am)
Replying to: jmonroe (Jan 17, 2009 10:12 pm)
one of the guys asked me if the laws of physics had changed

It always amazes me how few people I ever saw in all the physics courses I took (yes, that was my major) yet the world is overflowing with people who will invoke the great laws as if they had intimate knowledge of them. It's a great way to end a debate when you effectively end it with "Who are you to question high authority?"

While automotive designers and engineers are not physicists, they should certainly know better. Yes, you burn more fuel when the engine is under load but more combustion means more heating. Idling consumes less fuel and less combustion means less heating.

Your engine will heat up more quickly when you drive off (with minimal idling) because you're loading the engine. Invocation of "environmentalists" is misdirection and simply reveals the speaker's political inclinations. It is a physics issue and not a political one.

tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper

houdini1

I also keep car work receipts in my glove box along with various other things. About the only thing I have never had in there is a pair of gloves.

stever

Thanks Driver; that's classic. The question about whether the wind chill factor applies to inanimate objects comes up now and then. Tom often weighed in on that subject. Where else are you going to find someone posting about the law of thermodynamics and Newton's Law of Cooling as it applies to Chevy sheetmetal?

tidester, "Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy" #13816, 16 Jan 2004 4:06 pm

Karen_S

I spoke to Tom's wife yesterday and told her that his Edmunds friends and co-workers are missing him terribly and also about all the wonderful comments in this discussion. I don't know if she will post here, but she and Tom's son, Andrew, will be reading.

Here again is a link to Tom's Legacy page:

http://www.legacy.com/guestbook/postregister/guestbook.aspx?n=thomas-speziale&pi- d=147179723&page=2

crkyolfrt

You read my mind, as I was going to ask where that was, driver. I love info like that. To that discussion I would add (and I'm guessing Tidester did cover this) that 30 to 45 to 60 seconds invested in a slow heat producing idle does have its benefit on cold mornings cuz it allows the oil to circulate and get a coating on top of cam lobes etc (and in the tranny too) to help buffer the very thin film of oil that flowed off due to heat from previous warm shutdown allowing almost metal on metal before being exposed to the quicker heat producing loaded conditions of driving off.

Usually by the time you have put your seatbelt on, adjusted your mirrors and seat and HVAC etc, is ample preload time.

Many years ago when i had an auto tranny in one of my cars (ugh) I also lived in a rural quiet community and started it on cold mornings, after about a minute, slipped it into gear and let it naturally fast idle up the road a few minutes or until someone came up behind me, then i added in a bit more throttle to up road speed so I wasn't impeding their progress. Great way to warm a car and waste as little gas as possible, cuz you are actually getting somewhere as you gradually intro driving loads on the engine.

Ok, I'm off to find Tidester's posts on the law of thermodynamics and Newton's Law of Cooling. Better late than never..

driver100

Where else are you going to find someone posting about the law of thermodynamics and Newton's Law of Cooling as it applies to Chevy sheetmetal?

Brilliant once again, taking complex ideas and explaining them in as few words as needed To really appreciate that post, read the two before it to see why he wrote it.

I got to tell you another thing I loved about Tidester. When we got off topic, he had this great way of bringing the topic back on course. Here we started talking about Rolexes and watches, and as he did so often, got us gently back on track;

Message #59192 Rolex by tidester HOST Oct 04, 2010 (2:17 pm)
On the sales frontlines, is it ever acceptable for a salesperson to glance at his or her watch ... to a customer? What's your reaction to customers who keep looking at their watches. tidester, host SUVs and Smart Shopper

fezo

That watch post is a classic. Pure tidester,

jipster

Thanks for sharing that story steve. As Edmunds members, we pick up little tidbits of other members personal lives from time to time, which is helpful in understanding where that member is coming from. It is comforting in sharing what we knew of a good person to others, it helps with our loss and is a tribute to that person. Tidester was very good at creating a personal bond, not a trick, in dealing with posters. Like others have said, he had a way with words.

About the only time I noted just a hint of frustration from Tidester was in the "Are automobiles a major cause of clobal warming?" discussion. A few posters were becoming too emotional and making inappropriate personal comments to Tidester, as they could not compete with Tidesters vast knowledge of science and in particular the subject matter. Tidester did what he instructed we members to do, he stopped posting, which was unfortuante because he had a lot to give that discussion.

Steve or anybody else, I don't know if Tom ever revealed this information, but I've thought about it before, where does his username of "tidester" come from? Some interesting Tide detergent story... or maybe a fan of Alabama?

stever

I think it was more a matter of time - he cut back in the Global Warming discussion as he picked up more forum duties and teaching assignments. As people have noted, he didn't get flustered by posts but simply related the science (or lack thereof).

And no, not a Bama or detergent fan. I've lost the original correspondence where he gave me the outline, but it has to do with interstellar tides. He never gave me the full background behind that user name. It would have taken a few years to bring me up to speed on the math first, and I think he knew it would be a lost cause anyway.

mako1a

OK, I decided to come back to civilization and return to wearing a watch.

I bought this the day after Christmas and Amazon will deliver Friday.

It's called the Orange Mako. How bout that?

driver100

It's called the Orange Mako. How bout that?

Very nice looking watch...I hope you have some nice accessories to go with that fancy looking orange face.

It would go nicely with my new tennis shirt I just got........ (which is more orange than red)

fezo

If you can find an orange fezo order it and ship it to my house. Richard is good for it.

jmonroe

It would go nicely with my new tennis shirt I just got........ (which is more orange than red)

How many hours do you have to spend in self-defense classes before you build up enough nerve to wear a shirt like that? :P

jmonroe

tallman1

I was just catching up on posts I missed over Christmas and was shocked to hear of Tidester's passing. I certainly echo others' thoughts about his knowledge and talent at this job.

I miss Pat and now will have to adjust to the loss of Tidester... and that pales in comparison to what his family is going through.

venture

Replying to my own post, hmmm. Anyway - I called the saleslady and made an appointment. Offered invoice on the Forester and asked for KBB for the trade.

She countered with $300 over invoice and KBB on the trade. I caved! They made money and we saved money considering what it could have been.

They also gave 2 oil changes and a $100 gas card.

Pretty painless and the wife has a shiny new Forester sitting in the driveway waiting for her to get home tonight after work.

I was hoping for a better story, but everything went pretty smooth. :shades:

driver100

How many hours do you have to spend in self-defense classes before you build up enough nerve to wear a shirt like that?

It actually gives me a big advantage, the other players are blinded by my bright colors!

driver100

Pretty painless and the wife has a shiny new Forester

Very good venture...another new car sold on this post. I assume you got a green Forester?

I always liked those Foresters and the new design makes it even better. Do you need the AWD in your area? I understand the Suburu symetrical drive system is better than most. Any ideas about that?

fezo

I'm waiting for the "she says that's not what I wanted" post!.....

snakeweasel

I tell my kids one of my "When I was a boy" stories about how years ago

I remember one time we had to climb out a side window in the house because there was so much snow that a snow drift covered the entire front door. And there 6 steps up to the front door.

That was the snowstorm that my dad stayed at work for two days then took two days to get home.

nyccarguy

So sorry to hear of his untimely death. My deepest condolences to his grieving family.

nyccarguy

A few months back my Mom ordered a 2011 Porsche Cayenne. We were updt think ated via email from our sales guy when the truck was put together, when it was painted, when it was on the boat, & when it arrived here in the USA.

They want to get the Cayenne off their lot by the end of the year. My parents have to return my Mom's '08 328xi by Wednesday. As of Friday the truck wasn't on their lot. I'm sure it didn't get there today due to the blizzard we had. I don't think we'll be able to take delivery until after the 1st of the year.

Finance guy calls on Friday & tells us the rate. I told him I want to finance thru the dealership & chase gave me a rate of 3%. He says no problem & they willgladly match the rate.

This is so exciting! Our family's first PORSCHE!

Sandman6472

I'm basically retired now from the government...I had an on the job injury back in '05 & they finally let me go in October. I was lucky as today is my 30 year anniversary date. I've been using sick leave since then and will use up my annual leave. This morning I sent in the paperwork to change my official retirement date from 1/3/11 to 4/1/11 so I can use up all my annual. A better financial decision for us...we just decided this on Saturday.
So I'm retired but am still on the roles. My accident really screwed up my spine but I am enjoying this "semi retirement" and hopefully will find some part time work eventually as I'm only 56. I've worked with so many that never got to retire but luckily, I plan to enjoy mine!

The Sandman :sick: :shades:

jipster

.I caved! They made money and we saved money considering what it could have been.

Sounds llke a good deal. Way to go and congrats on the new wheels.

I was hoping for a better story,

Your luck is our loss.

roadburner

Finance guy calls on Friday & tells us the rate. I told him I want to finance thru the dealership & chase gave me a rate of 3%. He says no problem & they willgladly match the rate.

This is so exciting! Our family's first PORSCHE!

Congratulations! I'm still debating on whether to order a 1er; I did a bit more research and learned that I can have a 135i M Sport for $4350 more than an identically equipped 128i M Sport. I really want the added power but I'm also wary of owning another direct injection turbo. The other thing that gives me pause is the fact that I have to take delivery of the car within 60 days of 1/2/11 to get the 2.9% APR and the $1,500 rebate. If the car gets delayed I'm screwed.

venture

Yep, it's green.

They have a display at the dealership showing the various renditions of AWD systems and show how some are rear wheel drive and some are front wheel drive that are converted to AWD. Then they show how the Subaru system was built from the ground up.

I don't know. All I know is it gets her where she wants to go. We get a lot of snow at times, but it seems to come in bunches. So far this year, not much at all. We have had occasions where we got a few feet at a time and there's nothing to say we can't get a few feet a few days later, but that is rare.

I would hate to be a weatherman in central Pennsylvania.

venture

LOL. Good one.

I took her on Sunday to look at them to make sure. I've been down that road before, believe me. :surprise:

driver100

I have to take delivery of the car within 60 days of 1/2/11 to get the 2.9% APR and the $1,500 rebate. If the car gets delayed I'm screwed.

If you really want the car see if you can write that into the contract. You shouldn't be penalized if the delivery takes longer than normal time.

BMW is sticky about delivery dates though.

I like the smaller 1 Series, but I think there could be times when you would wish you would have got a 3 Series, the extra room and the handling....also more reliable.

driver100

I would hate to be a weatherman in central Pennsylvania.

Yes, I have seen really bad snow in Pennsylvania. Once (1970) I was stuck in about 2 feet of snow and the people who helped push me out said you should be used to this - since you are from Ontario. I said, Are you joking, I have never seen so much snow in all my life!

It is the same in the Toronto area of Southern Ontario, we get about 3 or 4 snow falls near 10 or 12 inches a winter, and the rest of the time it is clear, or very light snow 2 or 3 inches at most.

Suburus are a big seller for the retirement crowd. It is small enough, economical, reliable, very safe, and that AWD makes it very difficult to get stuck.

venture

"Suburus are a big seller for the retirement crowd."

I'm not going to tell her you said that. :surprise:

roadburner

I like the smaller 1 Series, but I think there could be times when you would wish you would have got a 3 Series, the extra room and the handling....also more reliable.

The 1 Series handles as well or better than the 3 Series; as for reliability, I believe the biggest factor is the engine -NA or turbo- you choose.

jmonroe

I was hoping for a better story, but everything went pretty smooth.

Congrats on your new ride and especially, like ‘fez’ warned, for not screwing up.

Having an AWD when it snows has to be comforting as long as you are sensible about it. I’m not saying you and your wife aren’t but it must be nice for those snow days. It would have been nice to have had AWD on the Genny but it wasn’t an option on that car so that ain’t my fault. That car is RWD only and is NOT good in the snow. I tried it out without snow tires with the deluge we got in the Burgh last February (total of around 30 inches). Being only RWD and bad OEM Dunlop’s, I finally caved and bought dedicated rims and had Nokian snow tires put on and while it is a lot better (it was downright horrible the way it came off the line) it is NOT a good car in the snow.

Let us know how it goes in the snow because you know it’s coming.

jmonroe

venture

Boy! Trying to post anything here has become a challenge. It's getting tiring typing everything twice or more.

Anywho - Yeah. I agree - "It's coming".

I had Michelin X-Ice on my BMW and that made a world of difference. Not AWD capable, but very good if careful.

We traded her 2007 Subaru so we have a pretty good idea of how it will be in the snow - hopefully this one will be as good. It sits higher so plowing shouldn't be a problem unless the roads are shut down.

I put Blizzaks on the 2007, but I'm going to see how this one does on the all-seasons before doing anything radical.

jmonroe

Boy! Trying to post anything here has become a challenge. It's getting tiring typing everything twice or more.

You are so right about that. It seems like every time you try to fix something with these programs, while you may fix ‘A’ you screw up ‘B. C, D, E…’. :mad:

I put Blizzaks on the 2007, but I'm going to see how this one does on the all-seasons before doing anything radical.

I went in to buy Blizzaks because I heard so many good things about them but everyone was sold out. As a last resort I went to the independent tire store I have dealt with for years figuring I’d go with Coopers but I asked him if he had Blizzaks just to satisfy myself that I tried. He didn’t have them either and then I said, “I guess I’ll have to go with your Cooper’s”, (thinking that anything is better than what is on the car now and I’ve had pretty good success with Cooper all-season tires over the years). “He said, “if you’re willing to pay for Blizzaks, I have a tire that I think is at least as good as them” (my eyes started to roll). He continues with, “ how about Nokian’s ?” My eyes stopped rolling and I said, “I didn’t think you carried them”. He said, “well, we do but I don’t have your size in this store right now but I will by tomorrow morning when we open if you want them” (this was about 4:30 when I stopped on my way home from work). I said, “I just ordered my rims from a junk yard in Virginia and they won’t be here that fast, but yeah, get them and I’ll drop off the rims when they come in”. Two days later they were on the car and just in time for another 4 inches of snow we got that day.

Like I said, the car is a lot better with them but nothing like your Subi with AWD.

jmonroe

exb0

Sandman, I don’t mean to get into your business, but why are you pushing out your retirement date? I thought that by law the employer is required to pay off the annual leave in one lump sum when you quit or retire. If you retire now, you can get your annual and start collecting retirement.

Also, how did you manage to collect three month worth of annual? I thought the government only lets you accrue 240 hours before “use or lose” kicks in.

oldfarmer50

"...Once (1970) I was stuck in about 2 feet of snow..."

I remember that storm. I was running bald snow tires on my Plymouth at the time. Driving was very interesting as I recall.

jmonroe

On Sunday I tried one of those “touchlesss” car washes and it was pretty good for what I wanted it to do; get the salt off the car.

It was so bad that Mrs. j said, “how can you let that car get so bad? You, the one that cleans it all the time”. She was right, I was thinking about pulling it into the garage and getting a couple buckets of warm water and cleaning it but when I talked to both of my sons and nephew when we got together over at my brothers place on Christmas they all said, “hey cheapo, why would you even think of doing that” (they all use the “touchless” jobs in the winter to get the salt off). I never even thought of that, so I bit. I didn’t go for the deluxe wax/dry and all of the up sells they offered (I wasn’t about to have some junk wax sprayed on the windshield) but for 8 bucks it ain’t bad.

Do you guys do this too?

jmonroe

ray80

Cheapo is my middle name, so if its needed and I think it can go for a while without getting messed up again I use the self-service (wand) thing for about 4 bucks.

crkyolfrt

You plan to track it right? Now I haven't driven their turbo, but as a general rule, NA makes a better track car. Of course BMW maybe has much tech, a very small and quick to spool turbo and extremely well controlled lag. But if they don't, then the NA will make the drive out of corners (and all the track basically) a lot more tractable.

crkyolfrt

If she has become used to the Blizzaks (or any true winter tire with the soft rubber and numerous tiny siping) then tell her to take it easy and leave lots of following room and corner slower also. All seasons were never an issue for 'go' on AWD's. But they are still no better for cornering or braking. It would be a drag if she went a bit wide on a corner some day in deep slop and crashed the brand new Sube.

crkyolfrt

Was it a drive-thru touchless, or one where you park the car and hold the single wand yourself?

Very smart to not go the waxed route. I have never understood why anyone keep opting to have their windshield contaminated with wax. And PAY for it no less! :sick:

driver100

Suburus are a big seller for the retirement crowd."
I'm not going to tell her you said that.

Probably a good idea. I said that because I was reading a funny article about a retired couple who were planning to buy a new car. They considered a Suburu but too many of their newly retired friends had already bought Suburus....they wanted something different.

That's what made me say it!

stickguy

there is a touchless very close to my house. Great deal, the basic wash (no rainex, polish, etc.) is only $3, so just as cheap as a DIY bay.

does a good job getting the heavy crud off, but always leaves some residue, but you can sponge that off in the garage.

usually has a huge line, so I end up in the self service bay anyway. does as good or better a job, plus you can get underneath better.

if it hits 40 though, I just do it in the driveway.

jimbres

They considered a Suburu but too many of their newly retired friends had already bought Suburus....they wanted something different.

Just curious: is "Suburu" the Canadian spelling of "Subaru"? (Here's a link to the brand's U.S. site so you can see how we Yanks spell it.)

tjc78

it is NOT a good car in the snow.

I still have the OEM Dunlops on my Genesis and with the snow we got the other day it was parked. Thank God we have my GF's Elantra which is a great little car in the snow.

tjc78

if it hits 40 though, I just do it in the driveway.

Its looking like mid-upper 40s this weekend. All three in the fleet will be getting a wash. I hate automatic car-washes! The only vehicle I don't mind putting through one in my 99 S10, as it has its share of battle scars already.

venture

We've had that conversation. Now we have to see how it goes.

jmonroe

Was it a drive-thru touchless, or one where you park the car and hold the single wand yourself?

Yes, it was the drive-thru type. It’s a fairly new place (not more than a year old) and not that far from me. Almost have to pass it all the time so it is very convenient. The bad part is that it will probably gobble up a few of my winter time allowance bucks now. I might even have to go without lunch just to keep the Genny looking pretty during the winter. :mad:

jmonroe

canadiantoyota

To Tom's wife, son (Andrew), co-workers and Edmunds friends,

May God grant you peace and comfort at this time. May you rest assured that our thoughts and prayers are with you. May you find strength and comfort in your memories of Tom.

Blessings and peace,

Randy