I suggest you don't contact the dealer again. The letter is obviously fake,
First off I don't think the letter is a fake. It is an actual legal (or quasi legal?) form intended to collect a debt. While it has no legal force it would be used to show that the delarship used reasonable means to collect the debt before going to court.
As for not contacting the dealership I would advise not doing that. Yes the dealership might be flexing some muscels and it may not go further, but they may decide to take it to court.
Every now and again someone where I work gets something like this (an attempt to collect a debt that they believe they do not owe) and ignores it. The company collecting goes to court and gets a judgement and we get a wage garnishment. Now the employee has to get a lawyer and go to court to fight it. They usually win but for a few payrolls we take money out of their check.
Personally I would unleash the dogs of war.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
BR....just curious how difficult it must be to sell SAABs. Not dissing the car, the brand, or the dealership. But, how do you specifically go about selling them?
They were afterthoughts during the GM bankruptcy. And now, it's reported they may go away entirely since Stryker is burning through a bunch of cash and annual negative cash flow, and there's no end in site.
What do you tell a prospective customer in light of all that when they walk into your dealership?
I would often have a client ask me to send a demand letter. It was NEVER hand-written. About 50% of the time the client wouldn't take any further action. This dealer sounds slimy; I'd follow Richard's advice.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
That's a very good question. I know I couldn't sell them.
I've never been any good at selling things I didn't believe in or feel comfortable with and that included a couple of brands of used cars our store sold.
I still think the high point for SAAB was the 99 and 900 Turbos. My wife also likes them, but there was no way we'd consider one while they were owned by GM.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
I don't want speak for Rover either (welcome back by the way!), but SAAB has a pretty deep tradition here in New England. Their US Headquarters used to be in Connecticut until GM moved it to Atlanta.
2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
thank you all for the suggestions.. I called the dealer today.. they are looking into it.. I went back to look at the paperwork its seems the dealer told the dmv the full price for the car and not the difference in NEW minus Trade-- thus causing the tax problem... the dealer pays the dmv directly and I only paid the difference so that is where the dealer is coming up with the loss.. I paid the correct amount of total taxes but due to dealer error they paid the dmv the incorrect amount and want me now to make up the difference. I guess it also does not help that the dealer and my DMV are in 2 different states.
I paid the correct amount of total taxes but due to dealer error they paid the dmv the incorrect amount and want me now to make up the difference.
Glad it worked out....they will be able to show they over paid and it was a mistake, and they should get reimbursed. They do sound a bit like idiots not figuring that out....afterall, that is what their business is. Too bad they didn't just request a discussion and made it sound like they were accusing you of ripping them off!
Thanks for keeping us informed. Lots of people come here asking for help and never tell us how it all turned out.
My brother has a 9-3 convertible. He's thinking of selling it in which case I'm thinking of buying. When I bought the 2008 BMW Cabriolet I tried a Saab convertible. It was the most fun I have had driving a car. Great feeling and excellent "feel of the road", great balance....it was designed right.
The problem for me was, it was only $5000 less than the BMW, but technologically it was years behind the bimmer. GM didn't have the money to bring it up to date, but that is part of the cars charm.
"Oh its easy, you just go for the emotional angle by tell them a SAAB story."
Snake--
That reminds me of a story my wife told me. I think she said that she was 7 or 8 at the time. I don't know how many Saabs were being sold in the mid-60s, but apparently enough that my wife at least had heard of the brand. Anyway, she was swimming around the local neighborhood pool in front of the numerous housewives who gathered to watch heir children burn off some energy when my wife starts yelling (as she's swimming) "I'm a speedy S-O-B, I'm a speedy S-O-B". Imagine her confusion when several of the ladies chastised her for her poor manners and vulgar language.
Of course we all know that it's the drivers and sellers of Saabs who are S-O-Bs.
You now have a leg to stand on. It was their mistake. They paid the extra money to the BMV based on their erroneous datum they provided on the price of the car.
However, it may be that only you can ask the BMV to correct the mistake by providing the correct data from the dealer's papers. Also, you may be the only one to whom the BMV can make a refund of tax collected. That may be why that first letter said something about your contacting BMV...
I do know in Ohio, getting back taxes paid is a long, tedious process. But the public workers will be happy to tell you how to initiate the process.
I'm glad that you called the dealer. It's been my experience that it's usually best to go to the top when things get complicated. Hope it all works out for you.
"...they paid the dmv the incorrect amount and want me now to make up the difference..."
Are they high? They sure sound like they're smoking some good stuff!
Why is this even your problem? That's like me saying I was careless and lost my wallet so I want you to replace all the cash that was in in.
Tell them to drop dead and threaten to release the story to the press if they push it further. The last thing they want is proof of their stupidity spread across the airwaves. :mad:
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
"...Please send the money to me as soon as you can..."
LOL. I thought Richard was taking care of all your money problems. Besides, you'd have to help me locate the coffee cans in the yard and with my memory that might take a while.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
All this talk about used Saabs has got me thinking (usually a dangerous thing). How do really old Saabs hold up as compared to domestic or Japanese cars? I've seen a few mid 90s Saabs on Craigslist with 150K+ miles with some reasonable prices. This compares to similarly priced domestics with 100K or Japanese cars with 200K miles.
I wonder, given a similar price, what would be the better buy?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Thanks for keeping us informed. Lots of people come here asking for help and never tell us how it all turned out.
So true. We've had our share of hit and run posters ever since I've been here but I'm a relative newbie compared to some so I don't know the real history about this place. :sick:
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I'd say the dealer started off on the wrong foot if they wanted help.
The dealer did the wrong thing. It was just a mistake...a very stupid mistake but mistakes are made. They probably need the buyer to help them correct the situation.
The real mistake was in getting nasty about it. If they had called the buyer and explained what went wrong the buyer probably would have just helped them straighten the problem out....but when they send semi-legal letters demanding payment, the whole thing escalates.
I once learned a valuable lesson from a boss of mine. He said everyone makes mistakes, but if you correct it then it isn't a mistake any more. If the dealer just asked for help to fix a mistake, then it wouldn't have become a problem.
I once learned a valuable lesson from a boss of mine. He said everyone makes mistakes, but if you correct it then it isn't a mistake any more. If the dealer just asked for help to fix a mistake, then it wouldn't have become a problem.
Exactly!
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
"...Please send the money to me as soon as you can..."
LOL. I thought Richard was taking care of all your money problems. Besides, you'd have to help me locate the coffee cans in the yard and with my memory that might take a while.
I admit that I put that in there specifically to set you up for the spike.....
Well, that and to see if Richard popped in....
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
I have a Mazda 6, but it is the 6 cylinder "S" Grand Touring model. It is much nicer looking than the one in the picture you posted. I couldn't be happier.
It's faster and handles almost as well as the car I traded in; which was my BMW BTW.
This is the time when I usually begin the search for a new car. I've looked all over and haven't been able to find anything I like better.
Driver, I agree with you. A similar situation happened to my daughter. A local Toyota dealer made a mistake on the taxes on a deal she made with them. The finance guy called her 2 weeks later and advised her that she needed to pay them an additional $1000 in taxes. I checked with my lawyer, and, he advised us that legally the contract she made with them was binding, and, we didn't have to pay them anything. She felt bad about it however because they did make a mistake in her favor. We went to the dealership, and, they agreed that they couldn't make us pay for their mistake. However, my daughter volunteered to split the difference with them and gave them a check for $500. That satisfied everybody, and, we parted amicably.
However, my daughter volunteered to split the difference with them and gave them a check for $500.
What a nice honorable thing to do...especially when most people wouldn't give the dealer anything back. Your daughter was still ahead and the dealer wasn't out too much, probably didn't lose anything on the sale at that point.
Compromising really makes sense. Just a guess but I think it also shows your daughter is a really nice person that wouldn't take advantage of someone. She is the real winner because she has a great attitude to life.
Mazda 6, but it is the 6 cylinder "S" Grand Touring model. It is much nicer looking than the one in the picture you posted.
Yes, I checked out Mazda Grand Touring Model and got this picture. What a difference! It probably is never fair to show a car with snow tires on and show the car with snow around it....they never look as good.
I am still a fan of square cars, but they are harder to find. I have a 2008 BMW Cabriolet, but I actually prefer the look of the squarer 2006 models.
What a nice honorable thing to do...especially when most people wouldn't give the dealer anything back. Your daughter was still ahead and the dealer wasn't out too much, probably didn't lose anything on the sale at that point.
I agree that it was an honorable thing to do but Canadian math must be different than in the states. If she paid more from her purse than she originally agreed to pay, how was she still ahead? :confuse:
Depending on how the dealer approached the request for more money (and not the way ‘sween’s’ dealer did it), I MIGHT be willing to go back to the dealer to help straighten things out.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
If she paid more from her purse than she originally agreed to pay, how was she still ahead?
Canadian math would figure that since she didn't pay $1000 in taxes, because of the dealers mistake...........and she is a nice kind person who decides to reimburse the dealer $500, she is still ahead $500 due to the dealers error.
You could be right though if another dealer would hqave sold her the car for $1000 less than this dealer, and if the price seemed to be less because of them forgetting to add in the tax. In that case, I think she would have been right to keep the $1000s.
Sween....sounds like you threw the ball back into the dealer's cort. They need to get it squared away, not you.
SAAB's always seemed to be about a color or two short of a rainbow. Now that their demise is again a real possibility, selling them must take a unique skill set.
Speaking of square cars, I like them too. I really do not like a raked windshield.
One of my all time favorite SUV's from a looks standpoint is the now discontinued Isuzu Trooper. Nice and square with a lot of usable room. I think Honda or Lexus badged them under their name at one time.
"One of my all time favorite SUV's from a looks standpoint is the now discontinued Isuzu Trooper. Nice and square with a lot of usable room. I think Honda or Lexus badged them under their name at one time."
Houdini--
It was the Isuzu Rodeo that Honda re-badged as the Passport (boy, I bet the Honda corporate honchos regret that decision). It was always on CR's annual used cars to avoid list as well as the only Honda at the time "not recommended". Think of those poor saps who thought they were getting Honda reliability. The Passport was dumped sometime around the point where Honda started making their own SUVs. I'm sure that was a banner day for isell.
My brother owned perhaps the only Rodeo to make it to 150K miles. Well, there must have been a few others, but not many. It was a rough ride and yet it did have a copious amount of storage space. The interior gave new meaning to the term declasse. (sorry I can't put the accent over the two "E"s).
Yes, I checked out Mazda Grand Touring Model and got this picture.
That picture is of a Mazdaspeed 6- either 2006 or 2007. The wheels and hood bulge give it away. Same engine as the MS3 with a FWD biased AWD system. Their Achilles heel is the undersized rear diff, which breaks with some regularity if you drive the car like it's a high performance sports sedan(which it purports to be).
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
My favorite square SUV was the Ford Bronco---big engine, big storage area, big cabin space, and a clean, square design. I once turned down the chance to buy one that was emerald green with a light tan top and tan interior. I could kick myself for passing up that opportunity.
all time favorite SUV's from a looks standpoint is the now discontinued Isuzu Trooper.
Yes, I like the Trooper too! And I like the Bronco and Jeep Chrokees as well as early Jeep Cherokee Limiteds (1994). I liked these designs too, but at over $100,000 and not very good reviews, thought better of it. MB G Class.
Comments
First off I don't think the letter is a fake. It is an actual legal (or quasi legal?) form intended to collect a debt. While it has no legal force it would be used to show that the delarship used reasonable means to collect the debt before going to court.
As for not contacting the dealership I would advise not doing that. Yes the dealership might be flexing some muscels and it may not go further, but they may decide to take it to court.
Every now and again someone where I work gets something like this (an attempt to collect a debt that they believe they do not owe) and ignores it. The company collecting goes to court and gets a judgement and we get a wage garnishment. Now the employee has to get a lawyer and go to court to fight it. They usually win but for a few payrolls we take money out of their check.
Personally I would unleash the dogs of war.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
They were afterthoughts during the GM bankruptcy. And now, it's reported they may go away entirely since Stryker is burning through a bunch of cash and annual negative cash flow, and there's no end in site.
What do you tell a prospective customer in light of all that when they walk into your dealership?
Oh its easy, you just go for the emotional angle by tell them a SAAB story. :shades:
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
I've never been any good at selling things I didn't believe in or feel comfortable with and that included a couple of brands of used cars our store sold.
I wouldn't make it as an Amway person either!
Super comfortable seats and an array of adjustments to make
the driver feel like the car was built just for him/her.
My cousin is a big wheel with a bank and has one. She likes it a lot.
2013 Mustang GT, 2001 GMC Yukon Denali
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
My brother has a 9-3 convertible. He's thinking of selling it in which case I'm thinking of buying.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Their US Headquarters used to be in Connecticut until GM moved it to Atlanta.
MS
Tell them to go pound sand...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Glad it worked out....they will be able to show they over paid and it was a mistake, and they should get reimbursed. They do sound a bit like idiots not figuring that out....afterall, that is what their business is. Too bad they didn't just request a discussion and made it sound like they were accusing you of ripping them off!
Thanks for keeping us informed. Lots of people come here asking for help and never tell us how it all turned out.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
The problem for me was, it was only $5000 less than the BMW, but technologically it was years behind the bimmer. GM didn't have the money to bring it up to date, but that is part of the cars charm.
A used one at a good price would be a blast!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Snake--
That reminds me of a story my wife told me. I think she said that she was 7 or 8 at the time. I don't know how many Saabs were being sold in the mid-60s, but apparently enough that my wife at least had heard of the brand. Anyway, she was swimming around the local neighborhood pool in front of the numerous housewives who gathered to watch heir children burn off some energy when my wife starts yelling (as she's swimming) "I'm a speedy S-O-B, I'm a speedy S-O-B". Imagine her confusion when several of the ladies chastised her for her poor manners and vulgar language.
Of course we all know that it's the drivers and sellers of Saabs who are S-O-Bs.
Gogiboy.
However, it may be that only you can ask the BMV to correct the mistake by providing the correct data from the dealer's papers. Also, you may be the only one to whom the BMV can make a refund of tax collected. That may be why that first letter said something about your contacting BMV...
I do know in Ohio, getting back taxes paid is a long, tedious process. But the public workers will be happy to tell you how to initiate the process.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Great point imid. That's why they might want sweendog to straighten out the situation. In that case, it would be nice to work with them.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Richard
Are they high? They sure sound like they're smoking some good stuff!
Why is this even your problem? That's like me saying I was careless and lost my wallet so I want you to replace all the cash that was in in.
Tell them to drop dead and threaten to release the story to the press if they push it further. The last thing they want is proof of their stupidity spread across the airwaves. :mad:
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Last tummer, I watched her run up a flight of stairs.
Oy!
driver - right you are on new Saabs. Used Saabs are another story. Cheap.
LOL. I thought Richard was taking care of all your money problems. Besides, you'd have to help me locate the coffee cans in the yard and with my memory that might take a while.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I wonder, given a similar price, what would be the better buy?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
So true. We've had our share of hit and run posters ever since I've been here but I'm a relative newbie compared to some so I don't know the real history about this place. :sick:
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
I'd say the dealer started off on the wrong foot if they wanted help.
Maybe 'sween' otta grind out a few oil changes for his help. That is, if he's even willing to help, now.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
The dealer did the wrong thing. It was just a mistake...a very stupid mistake but mistakes are made. They probably need the buyer to help them correct the situation.
The real mistake was in getting nasty about it. If they had called the buyer and explained what went wrong the buyer probably would have just helped them straighten the problem out....but when they send semi-legal letters demanding payment, the whole thing escalates.
I once learned a valuable lesson from a boss of mine. He said everyone makes mistakes, but if you correct it then it isn't a mistake any more. If the dealer just asked for help to fix a mistake, then it wouldn't have become a problem.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Exactly!
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
LOL. I thought Richard was taking care of all your money problems. Besides, you'd have to help me locate the coffee cans in the yard and with my memory that might take a while.
I admit that I put that in there specifically to set you up for the spike.....
Well, that and to see if Richard popped in....
It's faster and handles almost as well as the car I traded in; which was my BMW BTW.
This is the time when I usually begin the search for a new car. I've looked all over and haven't been able to find anything I like better.
2025 Forester Limited, 2024 Subaru Legacy Sport
Regards:
Oldbearcat
What a nice honorable thing to do...especially when most people wouldn't give the dealer anything back. Your daughter was still ahead and the dealer wasn't out too much, probably didn't lose anything on the sale at that point.
Compromising really makes sense. Just a guess but I think it also shows your daughter is a really nice person that wouldn't take advantage of someone. She is the real winner because she has a great attitude to life.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Yes, I checked out Mazda Grand Touring Model and got this picture. What a difference! It probably is never fair to show a car with snow tires on and show the car with snow around it....they never look as good.
I am still a fan of square cars, but they are harder to find. I have a 2008 BMW Cabriolet, but I actually prefer the look of the squarer 2006 models.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I agree that it was an honorable thing to do but Canadian math must be different than in the states. If she paid more from her purse than she originally agreed to pay, how was she still ahead? :confuse:
Depending on how the dealer approached the request for more money (and not the way ‘sween’s’ dealer did it), I MIGHT be willing to go back to the dealer to help straighten things out.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Canadian math would figure that since she didn't pay $1000 in taxes, because of the dealers mistake...........and she is a nice kind person who decides to reimburse the dealer $500, she is still ahead $500 due to the dealers error.
You could be right though if another dealer would hqave sold her the car for $1000 less than this dealer, and if the price seemed to be less because of them forgetting to add in the tax. In that case, I think she would have been right to keep the $1000s.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
2002 9-5 Saab Turbo
2013 Mustang GT, 2001 GMC Yukon Denali
SAAB's always seemed to be about a color or two short of a rainbow. Now that their demise is again a real possibility, selling them must take a unique skill set.
One of my all time favorite SUV's from a looks standpoint is the now discontinued Isuzu Trooper. Nice and square with a lot of usable room. I think Honda or Lexus badged them under their name at one time.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
Houdini--
It was the Isuzu Rodeo that Honda re-badged as the Passport (boy, I bet the Honda corporate honchos regret that decision). It was always on CR's annual used cars to avoid list as well as the only Honda at the time "not recommended". Think of those poor saps who thought they were getting Honda reliability. The Passport was dumped sometime around the point where Honda started making their own SUVs. I'm sure that was a banner day for isell.
My brother owned perhaps the only Rodeo to make it to 150K miles. Well, there must have been a few others, but not many. It was a rough ride and yet it did have a copious amount of storage space. The interior gave new meaning to the term declasse. (sorry I can't put the accent over the two "E"s).
Gogiboy
Those just weren't good cars and even when well maintained the engines would get tired way before their time.
I don't know what Honda was thinking.
That picture is of a Mazdaspeed 6- either 2006 or 2007. The wheels and hood bulge give it away. Same engine as the MS3 with a FWD biased AWD system. Their Achilles heel is the undersized rear diff, which breaks with some regularity if you drive the car like it's a high performance sports sedan(which it purports to be).
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Richard
Richard
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
Yes, I like the Trooper too! And I like the Bronco and Jeep Chrokees as well as early Jeep Cherokee Limiteds (1994). I liked these designs too, but at over $100,000 and not very good reviews, thought better of it. MB G Class.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I like the Trooper too, and always liked the off centre rear doors. I like the earlier models...about 1993.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250