Stories from the Sales Frontlines

sterlingdog

"I WAS taken advantage of, wasn't I?"

I don't think that you were. Most good trade-ins go for $2k or $3k more on the retail lot. You may remember that I thought that I was so smart getting $7k for the '03 Explorer. During my research, that was supposed to be the very top dollar for an XLT. Well, the dealer sold it two weeks later for $9.5K. It was the same story when I traded the '06 convertible for the '08 convertible. They retailed the '06 at about $3k more. I'm really not bothered by the fact that the dealer makes 2 or 3 grand profit. Also, they have to spend some money getting the car sold---advertising, detailing, etc. They may actually net 1 or 2 grand when all is said and done. They have to make some profit or they wouldn't stay in business. As for our SRX, I still feel that I got a great deal---top trade for the Explorer and excellent price for the SRX. In your case, you got a brand new vehicle fitted exactly the way you wanted. You also did well on your trade. IMHO, you smoked the dealer pretty darn well.

Richard

gogiboy

"I just drive it in a sedate fashion- no stop light Grand Prix, ..."

RB--

Doesn't that defeat some of the purpose of owning the speed3. I know that you take your cars to the track, but isn't the point of the "stealth" hatchbacks to mow down everything in sight?

When I drove the MS3 I was smitten, but in the end chickened out, because the regular M3 felt adequate (more than adequate coming from the Civic) and I just didn't think I'd be able to drive it sensibly as it was so much freaking fun on the test drive. I guess it's just knowing that you've got the HP and torque when you need it. Maybe for me it's the Dirty Harry axiom, "a man's got to know his limits."

Gogiboy

isellhondas

When I had a customer who thought we weren't paying enough for their trade in, I would always remind them that they could always sell it themselves.

Of course, they would lose their sales tax credit, face dealing with strokes and joyriders etc but the choice was theirs to make!

[Deleted User]

I thought about putting the Civic on Craigslist, but then I thought about that and the fact that Honda wouldn't let me sell it to a third party without buying out the lease first - so now I'm just trying to get the best trade I can for it

gogiboy

R--

I love the list--very thoughtful and accurate. I guess #7 (bicycle) best approximates me although I would not consider myself a health nut and the ongoing 105 to 110 degree days have really curtailed my two-wheeled commuting enthusiasm.

I "drive" my bicycles because they provide me with the "feel of the road (just like driver and his BMW). I just keep my fingers crossed that the car drivers don't nudge me into having an even greater feel for the road beyond the contact of two tires.

If your wife and urologist (and, presumably, hairdresser) won't divulge your inadequacies neither should we.

Gogiboy

puffin1

I have a 2010 VW Golf 2dr HB mint.8000miles never seen snow.2 sets of wheels both VW alloys and steel rims.Also, 2 sets of tires 16"s and 15"sSeat covers, moonroof ,plastic propel on hood, moonroof, multilevel heated seats driver @ passenger seats with lumbar,Bluetooth, 2.5L and a five speed.Doing 55 on pike I get 34mpg.I can throw it in 5th gear in my rural area doing 35mph and put on theCC and get 37mpg. Now, I want to trade for a Focus. The dealer offers me $14k.The Focus is 26k MSRP. I'll never buy American again.Also, I had to get a salesman to wait on me as no one was in the dealer ship . The sales people were drinking cofee at their desks,or engaged in coversations. You never know we are headed for a double dip recession.

isellhondas

So....what are you upset about?

What they offered you for your VW?

The price of the Focus?

The treatment you received?

Or all of the above?

26,000 for a Focus???

You seem to really love your VW and it only has 8000 miles on it, WHY would you want to get rid of it?

And, don't you be talking about double dip recessions!

nyccarguy

"Never seen snow." This means NOTHING to a dealer.

Why do you want to dump the car with only 8K miles anyway?

mac24

I have a 2010 VW Golf 2dr HB mint.8000miles never seen snow...........Now, I want to trade for a Focus. The dealer offers me $14k.The Focus is 26k MSRP. I'll never buy American again.

The Golf sounds marvellously equipped, and barely used too. What will the Focus give you that the VW is lacking (assumimg you could have got the deal you wanted)?

Also curious as to why a poor experience at one Ford dealership would preclude you from buying an American car ever again.

graphicguy

Puffin....just curious why you were in a Ford showroom if you decided you would never buy American, again?

fezo

Of course it's never seen snow! It's not old enough!

I'm a little puzzled by all of this as well.

I wouldn't mind a Golf (maybe every 30 years I could buy a VW) but not one with just 2 doors.

sterlingdog

I thought about you and Snake when I wrote #7. I admire both of you for exercising in such a fashion. Just look out for those careless drivers, and drink plenty of fluids in this heat. Oklahoma was so hot when we passed through your state. Your creeks and riverbeds were all dried up from the heat. Many of your small towns were dried up as well. It appeared as if Washington had about wiped your state off of the map in their infinite wisdom. It was a sad thing to see.

I don't have to worry about my hairdresser---nothing left to cut.

Richard

sterlingdog

Come on now. Your first post here sounds as bad as mine did a few years ago. Just calm down and explain yourself. (1) Why are you giving up such a nice VW with low miles and only a year old? (2) What made you decide on a Focus? (3) Why are you upset that a dealership was busy? Be glad that they are. (4) Why make a blanket statement that you'll never buy American again based on one experience?

The guys here are happy to help you if need be. You're just not giving them enough information to form an opinion. Come back and tell us what is going on in your "car life".

Richard

sterlingdog

"...they could always sell it themselves."

Great response to your complainers. I sold one car myself. Never again. Dealing with the "crazies" and getting my money from the buyer taught me a lesson. I finally had to go to her employer at the bank to get help recovering my money. Like an idiot, I allowed her to make four payments. After the first payment, it all went down hill. :sick:

Richard

driver100

Well, IMHO the answer here is simple. Buy or lease a new 535 and then keep the convertible for the nice days (or when you feel old)

Simple for you to say. Buy another expensive car and leave one of them out on the driveway. My wife has the same rules as someone else around here, NO cars are to be left in the driveway. We don't want to partk the $30k car on the driveway and keep all the useless junk in our garage, though I guess it would look better than leaving the useless junk in the driveway :P

oldfarmer50

"...I sold one car myself. Never again. Dealing with the "crazies" and getting my money from the buyer taught me a lesson..."

Sounds like you met up with some northern transplants. Your genteel southern sensibilities couldn't understand such "crazy" behavior from those "damn yankees". :P

Since I usually run my vehicles into rust piles I typically don't sell my old cars. When I have in the past (pre-Craigslist) I would put an ad in Want Ad Digest figuring that anyone who would pay for a copy was a serious buyer. Never had any trouble with the buyers, they either paid what I wanted or I wished them well. Maybe I was just crazier than they were and they knew it. :surprise:

The few things I've sold on Craigslist makes me want to try a car or two. When you have your car out in front of your house it's difficult to blow off the flakes by telling them "it's already sold" but on CL you can get rid of anyone you don't feel right about. :mad:

That would include anyone with a sob story or who wanted to make payments.

oldfarmer50

"...I guess it would look better than leaving the useless junk in the driveway..."

Why? I do both. The other day a neighbor who does construction tried to drop off some old siding because my son had so much junk laying around that the guy thought he was in the scrap business. :sick:

explorerx4

Back from delivering my daughter to her job in Georgia.
Had a Corolla rental to drive to the airport in Columbia, SC.
It's a 90's car still being sold today.
She called up after the first day of training.
Drove 5 series Touring, Mini Countryman, and 335 convertible.
Still 5 others to try out.

sterlingdog

"Sounds like you met up with some northern transplants."

Not really. We have our own breed of "crazies" and dead beats.

I can certainly see the advantage of using somethng like CL rather than having to deal with people on your front lawn.

Richard

stickguy

on vacation (jersey shore) with wifes family. oldest sister limps in with her 1999 Odyssey (158K, though she thought it had 145 or so. not a car person!).

on the NY thruway, CEL and TCS lights come on, and van starts "chugging" (her words, so some sort of bucking/surging). stopped at a rest area, and of course, no one can help her. so, she continues on, and it seems to work OK, but CEL still on. I drove it here, and it seemed OK.

coerced her into taking it into the local Honda dealer, thinking it could be the tranny, and she has a 300 mile drive home. Started laying the ground work that if they talk new tranny, we talk replacement here instead!r

coded out as "oil pressure interruption/failure" (again her translation), but they said it seemed OK, and reset code. IOW, they had no clue and sent her on her way.

This, I have never heard of, but it just sounds bad, and like something that will happen again. Hopefully she at least makes it home.

oldfarmer50

"...oil pressure interruption/failure..."

Yikes! Having blown up a few engines in my time I can't imagine that if she really lost oil pressure she could have made it from anywhere in NY to the Jersey shore. What's a TCS light? The symptoms sound more like a fuel flow problem. (But what do I know, right?)

Is this your relative from the Amsterdam area? I don't know any good garages in that area but I could reccommend a few indie shops near Albany.

oldfarmer50

I know used car prices are going to the moon but is this car worth it?

http://albany.craigslist.org/cto/2506847866.html

explorerx4

Richard,
Believe it or not there are probably more red necks in CT than NC, percentage wise. :surprise:
So what engine does that bad boy have in it? 5.0 V8 or 3.5 Ecoboost V6?

explorerx4

My daughter and I drove our 04 Escape from CT to GA over Tuesday and Wednesday.
It hit 90k early into the trip.
Despite temps in the high 90's the A/C worked great and we hit 25 mpg for the first time ever for a tank of gas (gotta love I-95 NC/SC straight and fairly flat).
Odometer measured 2% under over a 100 mile run.

fezo

Where are you and which Honda dealer? You could be right around the corner....

fezo

You let someone make payments? Oy! No wonder you soured on the experience!

I've sold a bunch of cars myself - cash, thank you - but not in quite a while now. Like oldfarmer now I keep them so long that bu the time they are done you can pretty much sweep them up.....

roadburner

Doesn't that defeat some of the purpose of owning the speed3. I know that you take your cars to the track, but isn't the point of the "stealth" hatchbacks to mow down everything in sight?

Gojiboy-

I guess the best way to explain it is that -unlike when I first bought the car- I choose my adversaries with more care- with an eye towards the maximum humiliation of my chosen victim. For example, tonight I thought a guy in a 2010 Mustang GT was wanting to play; I was locked and loaded but he turned off on a side street...

driver100

Drove 5 series Touring, Mini Countryman, and 335 convertible.

I gotta here the reviews you have for those cars....and the Corolla.
Can't wait to read those.
What kind of job did your daughter get again...sounds like she should be paying them for all this fun.

driver100

I know used car prices are going to the moon but is this car worth it?

Price seems high considering the damage, but maybe offer him $1000 and see if he will go for it!

explorerx4

I only saw the BMW fleet on the car carrier as they were being delivered.
google 'bmw resort tour' for more info. That will get you in the ballpark.
In a previous post, I did mention the Corolla, but it's not worth repeating.

driver100

google 'bmw resort tour'

Is it the Ritz Carlton? What a cool idea, stay at the resort and drive a BMW for 3 hours.

The BMW Resort Driving Tour
August 7 – September 10, 2011

BMW and The Ritz-Carlton have teamed up to create an enhanced experience – The BMW Resort Driving Tour. While here, our registered hotel guests will have the opportunity to drive the latest models from BMW around Georgia’s Lake Country. Vehicles can be taken out for up to 3 hours during the day and 5 hours at night.

Sounds like fun! What a great idea!

stickguy

TCS is the traction control light. And I wish I had been able to talk to the service guy. sounded odd to me too (the explanation she relayed, who knows what they actually said!). But I agree, losing oil pressure sounds bad, but I suppose it could have been fuel flow.

anyway, it was something that caused a scary condition, and they did not do anything to resolve the problem, so they must not have been pointed to a specific part.

OF, yes she is from Amsterdam. They do have a family mechanic up there, but no idea how good he would be with something complicated. She usually went to Schectady Honda (now in Scotia I believe) but it sounds like they were mostly bumbling boobs ripping her off!

Fezo, not your honda dealer. She took it to Avalon Honda.

explorerx4

Yes, that's it. It's a beautiful area, too.
The tour moves onto Charlotte after that.

tjc78

Yesterday I sold my Genesis. Anyone reading my posts knows I hated it. A local chain of dealers specializing in lease returns (stick, fezo and q probably know the place) took it off my hands. It was a painless transaction. They got a pretty much perfect two year old car and I got rid of it, while cashing out a few bucks.

The current plan is to do a few repairs on my 99 s10 and drive that until maybe after Christmas and then figure out what to replace it with.

jmonroe

IMHO, you smoked the dealer pretty darn well.

No more than he wanted to be smoked.

When two reasonable sides sit down to sell/buy it comes down to knowledge. I knew his car was worth the asking price and he knew the same about mine. In the end he wanted my car more than I wanted his.

jmonroe

graphicguy

tjc.....well, the good news is you got out of a car you didn't like. What's on your short list?

I know it would probably take an act of Congress to get you into another Hyundai, but the local dealers around me are getting very aggressive on their newest models (namely the Sonata and Elantra). I had one golfing buddy who just bought a new Sonata Limited straight out for $2K off MSRP (not the way I would have negotiated, but....).

Nice car!

I got a mailer from one of the Hyundai dealers near me offering $500 off any in stock Elantra (doesn't sound like that good of a deal). But, it was one of those shot-gun mailings that also stated they'd give big bucks for anything I could push, pull or tow onto their lot......

I really did like my buddy's Sonata! Be a really nice 2nd car. But, as isellhondas has mentioned, I'd probably get one that's a year old because of the steep depreciation on them.

I wonder what they'd give me for a well used (but good running), 8 year old Elantra, with a manual trans, and 130K miles on it? Maybe I'll push, pull (no need for a tow) it in to see how serious they are.

mako1a

I hear ya tjc. Sometimes you dislike a car because you feel you paid too much. Sometimes it just isn't your cup-o-tea. I even got rid of one because it was too perfect and I didn't want to be the first to mar the perfection.

Shake it off. In a week or so it will be just a memory. I sold one and put the bucks (over 25k) in the household account. Wife went through it like Diamond Jim Brady. No car, No bucks. Won't do that again.

jayrider

$500 off any Elantra in stock !!!! [dealer add-ons extra]

driver100

The tour moves onto Charlotte after that.

Ooooow, maybe Richard could make a weekend trip there and try out a bimmer. That Gran Turismo should hold all his antiques and other stuff, but I find them to be kind of ugly.

If there was a Grand Marquis or Lincoln Town Car weekend stay over I would go and try them out! :shades:

driver100

Yesterday I sold my Genesis. Anyone reading my posts knows I hated it

I knew you weren't that thrilled with the Genesis that much, but I didn't expect you to actually dump it so quickly. What were the key points that made you give up on it? Also, is there a short list of new possibilities, what will you be looking for next time, what can we learn from your experience?
I mean, you bought the car for certain reasons, how can we protect ourselves from doing the same thing and buying a car we won't be happy with?

I am considering that 535 at some point...maybe when the market recovers or IF the market recovers, but I don't want to regret giving up a convertible and thinking I should have held on to this car longer.

graphicguy

Shake it off. In a week or so it will be just a memory. I sold one and put the bucks (over 25k) in the household account. Wife went through it like Diamond Jim Brady. No car, No bucks. Won't do that again.

Mako.....boy I remember those days......LOL!

jmonroe

I am considering that 535 at some point...maybe when the market recovers or IF the market recovers, but I don't want to regret giving up a convertible and thinking I should have held on to this car longer.

Why are you trying to torture yourself? Going in you're not sure about it, so I can tell you right now, you're NOT going to be satisfied.

jmonroe

tjc78

I know it would probably take an act of Congress to get you into another Hyundai,

I really don't have any ill will toward Hyundai. The Genesis is/was just not for me. I now know that I am not a sporty sedan type of person. I want a smooth pillow soft ride and the Genesis just does not deliver that.

I like the new Sonata alot and if a 6cyl option was available I wouldn't hesitiate giving it a look, but it is on the smaller side for me.

As for the short list. The Avalon is certainly at the top, I know what I am getting there. The test drive list would be the Buick LaCrosse, Taurus (non-SHO), Volvo S80 (thanks, Stick) and possibly once it arrives the new Azera which when I test drove in 06 was pretty nice (Avalon clone IMHO)

Two more options would be a one/two year old Town Car or DTS.

Driver, the best thing I can say about avoiding a mistake is to take an extended test drive on the roads you drive everyday. That was my mistake. I drove the Genesis at least three times before I bought and thought I could get used to it, because I really liked everything else about the car.

I dumped the car, because I was able to do it with really no financial penalties. I cashed out a few bucks and never had any money invested in it other than monthly payments. I did the math and it cost me a little over 12K to drive 27 months. Not cheap, but I am sure people have taken bigger beatings.

tjc78

Shake it off. In a week or so it will be just a memory

Yep, I am not the first one to make a mistake buying a car and won't be last. Too bad about your bank account after selling your car... time to change the PIN on the ATM card!

fezo

So much for my shot at buying your used Genny.... Sounds like I'd like that car way more than you did.

gogiboy

There was a funny segment on Car talk today surrounding the most dangerous drivers listed by profession. Don't ask me where they got their statistics or whether they are accurate, but I remember the top three worst (most distracted) drivers:

1. Students (now I wouldn't exactly call it a profession, but...). I know Richard will concur with me on this one. And those of you with kids are likely to understand if only because of your increased insurance rates.

2. Doctors

3. Lawyers

4. Architects?

Best drivers (least distracted):

1. Farmers. So I'm guessing that old or retired farmers must be the top of the heap. Hope that fact is reflected in our oldfarmer's insurance rates.

Gogiboy

tjc78

Sounds like I'd like that car way more than you did.

I am certainly in the minority. Most people love it. My entire family/friends are all stunned I dumped it. My Mother said "you sold that beautiful car?"

You didn't want the Genny anyway... you have Richard's convertible to look forward to. :P

puffin1

no one at the dealer ship was doing anything .I was the only customer. I wanted a Focus for the 40mpg factor
Also, for the multilink suspension.
However, your'e right the golf comes with more standard up grades than a Focus.
I'm upset that all the salesmen were sitting on their butts and no one got off their [non-permissible content removed].

oldfarmer50

"...She took it to Avalon Honda..."

Well, there's her problem right there. How would you expect a Honda dealer named after a Toyota to know what they were doing? :P

oldfarmer50

"...Wife went through it like Diamond Jim Brady..."

After reading that I went upstairs and kissed my (frugal) wife.